• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 01:19
CEST 07:19
KST 14:19
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL20] Ro24 Preview Pt1: Runway112v2 & SC: Evo Complete: Weekend Double Feature3Team Liquid Map Contest #21 - Presented by Monster Energy9uThermal's 2v2 Tour: $15,000 Main Event18Serral wins EWC 202549
Community News
Weekly Cups (Aug 11-17): MaxPax triples again!10Weekly Cups (Aug 4-10): MaxPax wins a triple6SC2's Safe House 2 - October 18 & 195Weekly Cups (Jul 28-Aug 3): herO doubles up6LiuLi Cup - August 2025 Tournaments7
StarCraft 2
General
Maestros of the Game RSL Revival patreon money discussion thread 2v2 & SC: Evo Complete: Weekend Double Feature Playing 1v1 for Cash? (Read before comment) Weekly Cups (Aug 11-17): MaxPax triples again!
Tourneys
$5,100+ SEL Season 2 Championship (SC: Evo) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series LiuLi Cup - August 2025 Tournaments SEL Masters #5 - Korea vs Russia (SC Evo)
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 487 Think Fast Mutation # 486 Watch the Skies Mutation # 485 Death from Below Mutation # 484 Magnetic Pull
Brood War
General
Flash Announces (and Retracts) Hiatus From ASL BW General Discussion ASL 20 HYPE VIDEO! New season has just come in ladder [ASL20] Ro24 Preview Pt1: Runway
Tourneys
[ASL20] Ro24 Group B [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL20] Ro24 Group A BWCL Season 63 Announcement
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Fighting Spirit mining rates [G] Mineral Boosting Muta micro map competition
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Total Annihilation Server - TAForever Beyond All Reason [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok)
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Gtx660 graphics card replacement Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale The Automated Ban List
Blogs
The Biochemical Cost of Gami…
TrAiDoS
[Girl blog} My fema…
artosisisthebest
Sharpening the Filtration…
frozenclaw
ASL S20 English Commentary…
namkraft
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1627 users

Smash Bros. Melee General Discussion - Page 84

Forum Index > General Games
Post a Reply
Prev 1 82 83 84 85 86 188 Next
We have created an irc channel (#tl-smash on Quakenet) for people to find others to play with on Dolphin or just to chat about Smash. Feel free to join!
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
May 09 2014 03:02 GMT
#1661
My problem with Capped's post is that people that are new to the game shouldn't be pleaded with to try fringe characters just for the sake of the viewer. The person playing should be able to play whoever the want for whatever reason they want. If that means they want to main Fox and try to be the best that's perfectly valid. No reason to shame someone for playing a strong character.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
GranDGranT
Profile Joined April 2011
Sri Lanka2141 Posts
May 09 2014 03:13 GMT
#1662
Its my option be able to shame people
All Dota 2 casters are bad at their job
Xeofreestyler
Profile Blog Joined June 2005
Belgium6771 Posts
May 09 2014 03:17 GMT
#1663
Well I don't agree in putting people off playing marth/falco/fox either, but if someone wants to main another char they should have the ability to do so too.
Graphics
Count9
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
China10928 Posts
May 09 2014 03:20 GMT
#1664
On May 09 2014 12:02 onlywonderboy wrote:
My problem with Capped's post is that people that are new to the game shouldn't be pleaded with to try fringe characters just for the sake of the viewer. The person playing should be able to play whoever the want for whatever reason they want. If that means they want to main Fox and try to be the best that's perfectly valid. No reason to shame someone for playing a strong character.

Plus people who go "well I would've won with fox" are way more fucking annoying. Not to mention beating on random space animals make locals really easy. Play w/e you want; if you see mango's fox and want to be like that go for it. If you want to shoot jabs across the stage w/e, part of the game. Spacies are hella fun to play and there's no excuse and bitching, it's a win win for everyone.
rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
May 09 2014 03:53 GMT
#1665
except puff players

jk i play her sometimes
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
Kyuukyuu
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Canada6263 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-05-09 04:23:29
May 09 2014 04:21 GMT
#1666
On May 09 2014 11:47 Xeofreestyler wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 09 2014 06:20 Kyuukyuu wrote:
On May 09 2014 05:53 Capped wrote:
To all new smashers.

If you are seriously playing smash, attending events and practicing like a blue assed fly, please for the love of god don't main fox/falco/marth, show some originallity, show some inspiration.

You, yes YOU can revitalize and revolutionize SSBM with your amazing non-S class character!

Make the spectators happy! Get outside the box! Be different!


This is really bad advice


Why? Not everyone who plays aims to be #1.

There's plenty of chars outside of the S tier who are viable enough.


Starting off playing a non-top-tier is a good way to be a bad player. We aren't talking about #1 here, we're talking about your average guy who makes it out of pools in regionals sometimes. If you want to even be marginally decent at the game one day it's just not a good idea.

Look at the dedicated low-tier (which I will classify as below Falcon/Doc) mains today. Almost all of the good ones worth mentioning? Started off as top tier players. Why? Because learning a top tier helps you learn the competitive metagame. Top tiers are top tiers because of all their strengths. They all have combo/punish games, solid edgeguard options, recovery mixups, approaches/antiapproaches, decent neutral game options, etc. etc. etc. that the lower tiers do not have. When you play as a top tier, against a top tier, you are forced to consider all of these options, all of the time. This helps you to become a better smash player. You become able to recognize sequences and situations and adapt to them with the options you have.

Where is this different from being a dedicated low-tier main from the start? Low tiers don't have all these options. They are often gimped in one way or another, usually by having a terrible recovery or horrible neutral game. A new player starting out with one of them learns not to be a better player, but to rely on gimmicks and matchup unfamiliarity to win matches. In the short term this works out okay - plenty of terrible Foxes out there to beat up on with your glorious Ness djc uair combos. But your improvement will be much slower.

Look at Hungrybox's Ness. Armada's Young Link. Mango's Mario. M2K's... everything. Because they understand the game and their options so well, they're able to compete at a high level despite not being dedicated mains. If you watch their games, they don't go for silly gimmicks and overall weirdness to win. They just play a strong neutral game, punish well, edgeguard well. Axe began as a Falco player. So did Abate. Hell, Leffen began as a Yoshi main and switched because he knew he was winning solely on matchup jank, and wanted to be able to improve faster.

Get good. Then play your non-top-tier of choice. Don't go the hipster route right off the bat.

Disclaimer: This doesn't apply if you just don't want to be good, at all. Obviously.
hariooo
Profile Joined October 2013
Canada2830 Posts
May 09 2014 07:31 GMT
#1667
m2k's tier list is so salty.
Xeofreestyler
Profile Blog Joined June 2005
Belgium6771 Posts
May 09 2014 08:43 GMT
#1668
On May 09 2014 13:21 Kyuukyuu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 09 2014 11:47 Xeofreestyler wrote:
On May 09 2014 06:20 Kyuukyuu wrote:
On May 09 2014 05:53 Capped wrote:
To all new smashers.

If you are seriously playing smash, attending events and practicing like a blue assed fly, please for the love of god don't main fox/falco/marth, show some originallity, show some inspiration.

You, yes YOU can revitalize and revolutionize SSBM with your amazing non-S class character!

Make the spectators happy! Get outside the box! Be different!


This is really bad advice


Why? Not everyone who plays aims to be #1.

There's plenty of chars outside of the S tier who are viable enough.


Starting off playing a non-top-tier is a good way to be a bad player. We aren't talking about #1 here, we're talking about your average guy who makes it out of pools in regionals sometimes. If you want to even be marginally decent at the game one day it's just not a good idea.

Look at the dedicated low-tier (which I will classify as below Falcon/Doc) mains today. Almost all of the good ones worth mentioning? Started off as top tier players. Why? Because learning a top tier helps you learn the competitive metagame. Top tiers are top tiers because of all their strengths. They all have combo/punish games, solid edgeguard options, recovery mixups, approaches/antiapproaches, decent neutral game options, etc. etc. etc. that the lower tiers do not have. When you play as a top tier, against a top tier, you are forced to consider all of these options, all of the time. This helps you to become a better smash player. You become able to recognize sequences and situations and adapt to them with the options you have.

Where is this different from being a dedicated low-tier main from the start? Low tiers don't have all these options. They are often gimped in one way or another, usually by having a terrible recovery or horrible neutral game. A new player starting out with one of them learns not to be a better player, but to rely on gimmicks and matchup unfamiliarity to win matches. In the short term this works out okay - plenty of terrible Foxes out there to beat up on with your glorious Ness djc uair combos. But your improvement will be much slower.

Look at Hungrybox's Ness. Armada's Young Link. Mango's Mario. M2K's... everything. Because they understand the game and their options so well, they're able to compete at a high level despite not being dedicated mains. If you watch their games, they don't go for silly gimmicks and overall weirdness to win. They just play a strong neutral game, punish well, edgeguard well. Axe began as a Falco player. So did Abate. Hell, Leffen began as a Yoshi main and switched because he knew he was winning solely on matchup jank, and wanted to be able to improve faster.

Get good. Then play your non-top-tier of choice. Don't go the hipster route right off the bat.

Disclaimer: This doesn't apply if you just don't want to be good, at all. Obviously.


Good points. I actually play Falco/Ness for that exact reason. Gotta switch gears sometimes.
Graphics
Moobla
Profile Joined May 2011
United States186 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-05-09 09:30:27
May 09 2014 09:29 GMT
#1669
A code was just released that allows you to practice against CPU's with random DI and random teching: http://smashboards.com/threads/gecko-code-cpu-random-teching-and-di.354786/

As a Falcon main I am super duper excited.
"If you aren't attacking, you are probably losing." -QXC
]343[
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States10328 Posts
May 09 2014 09:32 GMT
#1670
On May 09 2014 16:31 hariooo wrote:
m2k's tier list is so salty.


it's so... m2k
Writer
Xeofreestyler
Profile Blog Joined June 2005
Belgium6771 Posts
May 09 2014 11:24 GMT
#1671
Hahah m2k as a commentator is so bad. He just rags on how the players suck.
Graphics
ffadicted
Profile Joined January 2011
United States3545 Posts
May 09 2014 13:43 GMT
#1672
Everyone should just main Jiggs imo, we can create a new meta together
SooYoung-Noona!
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
May 09 2014 15:24 GMT
#1673
I'm just sad M2K doesn't play Mewtwo much if at all :[
Spazer
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Canada8031 Posts
May 09 2014 15:54 GMT
#1674
He plays mewtwo a lot! In PM...
Liquipedia
TMG26
Profile Joined July 2012
Portugal2017 Posts
May 09 2014 16:52 GMT
#1675
How popular is PM?
Supporter of the situational Blink Dagger on Storm.
]343[
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States10328 Posts
May 09 2014 16:55 GMT
#1676
On May 10 2014 01:52 TMG26 wrote:
How popular is PM?


it's getting pretty big now... basically everywhere but California seems to have similar sized (well, at least ~70% as big) PM tourneys as Melee tourneys
Writer
Count9
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
China10928 Posts
May 09 2014 19:21 GMT
#1677
It's huge in midwest. They always joke about they can't win at melee so everyone went pm.
Spazer
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Canada8031 Posts
May 09 2014 19:50 GMT
#1678
Smash@Xanadu hosts weekly smash tourneys in MD/VA, and PM has basically supplanted brawl there. PM also always has more entrants at this specific event since it draws from both the melee and brawl players. Obviously this is only one example, but the point is that PM has found a pretty comfortable place in the smash community for the time being.
Liquipedia
126Q;A1
Profile Joined February 2011
Sweden517 Posts
May 09 2014 21:29 GMT
#1679
Kelly Ong Xiao Wei ‏@kellymilkies 6m
WELCOME @EG_PPMD to @EvilGeniuses - time for another one to #BleedBlue
#Smash #ssbm

Pretty cool :D
jaedong: "I play Counter-Strike and that is the only game I like to follow [...] my favorite team is WeMade FOX but I also like SK and fnatic."
Spazer
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Canada8031 Posts
May 09 2014 22:31 GMT
#1680
So the rumours were true after all.
Liquipedia
Prev 1 82 83 84 85 86 188 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
PiGosaur Monday
00:00
#45
davetesta16
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft: Brood War
actioN 360
ggaemo 289
Tasteless 226
PianO 184
Leta 107
Bale 94
Backho 45
Shine 24
Icarus 9
League of Legends
febbydoto3
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K706
Coldzera 105
Other Games
summit1g8581
C9.Mang0400
ViBE170
Trikslyr34
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1178
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH297
• practicex 39
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• Diggity6
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
League of Legends
• Rush1765
• Stunt350
Counter-Strike
• Shiphtur285
Upcoming Events
Afreeca Starleague
4h 41m
Mini vs TBD
Soma vs sSak
WardiTV Summer Champion…
5h 41m
Clem vs goblin
ByuN vs SHIN
Online Event
18h 41m
The PondCast
1d 4h
WardiTV Summer Champion…
1d 5h
Zoun vs Bunny
herO vs Solar
Replay Cast
1d 18h
LiuLi Cup
2 days
BSL Team Wars
2 days
Team Hawk vs Team Dewalt
Korean StarCraft League
2 days
CranKy Ducklings
3 days
[ Show More ]
SC Evo League
3 days
WardiTV Summer Champion…
3 days
Classic vs Percival
Spirit vs NightMare
[BSL 2025] Weekly
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
SC Evo League
4 days
BSL Team Wars
4 days
Team Bonyth vs Team Sziky
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
Queen vs HyuN
EffOrt vs Calm
Wardi Open
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Afreeca Starleague
6 days
Rush vs TBD
Jaedong vs Mong
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Jiahua Invitational
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
HCC Europe

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Qualifiers
ASL Season 20
CSL Season 18: Qualifier 1
SEL Season 2 Championship
WardiTV Summer 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025

Upcoming

CSLAN 3
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
LASL Season 20
BSL Season 21
BSL 21 Team A
Chzzk MurlocKing SC1 vs SC2 Cup #2
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
EC S1
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters Fall
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
Roobet Cup 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.