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Smash Bros. Melee General Discussion - Page 84

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We have created an irc channel (#tl-smash on Quakenet) for people to find others to play with on Dolphin or just to chat about Smash. Feel free to join!
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
May 09 2014 03:02 GMT
#1661
My problem with Capped's post is that people that are new to the game shouldn't be pleaded with to try fringe characters just for the sake of the viewer. The person playing should be able to play whoever the want for whatever reason they want. If that means they want to main Fox and try to be the best that's perfectly valid. No reason to shame someone for playing a strong character.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
GranDGranT
Profile Joined April 2011
Sri Lanka2141 Posts
May 09 2014 03:13 GMT
#1662
Its my option be able to shame people
All Dota 2 casters are bad at their job
Xeofreestyler
Profile Blog Joined June 2005
Belgium6773 Posts
May 09 2014 03:17 GMT
#1663
Well I don't agree in putting people off playing marth/falco/fox either, but if someone wants to main another char they should have the ability to do so too.
Graphics
Count9
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
China10928 Posts
May 09 2014 03:20 GMT
#1664
On May 09 2014 12:02 onlywonderboy wrote:
My problem with Capped's post is that people that are new to the game shouldn't be pleaded with to try fringe characters just for the sake of the viewer. The person playing should be able to play whoever the want for whatever reason they want. If that means they want to main Fox and try to be the best that's perfectly valid. No reason to shame someone for playing a strong character.

Plus people who go "well I would've won with fox" are way more fucking annoying. Not to mention beating on random space animals make locals really easy. Play w/e you want; if you see mango's fox and want to be like that go for it. If you want to shoot jabs across the stage w/e, part of the game. Spacies are hella fun to play and there's no excuse and bitching, it's a win win for everyone.
rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
May 09 2014 03:53 GMT
#1665
except puff players

jk i play her sometimes
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
Kyuukyuu
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Canada6263 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-05-09 04:23:29
May 09 2014 04:21 GMT
#1666
On May 09 2014 11:47 Xeofreestyler wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 09 2014 06:20 Kyuukyuu wrote:
On May 09 2014 05:53 Capped wrote:
To all new smashers.

If you are seriously playing smash, attending events and practicing like a blue assed fly, please for the love of god don't main fox/falco/marth, show some originallity, show some inspiration.

You, yes YOU can revitalize and revolutionize SSBM with your amazing non-S class character!

Make the spectators happy! Get outside the box! Be different!


This is really bad advice


Why? Not everyone who plays aims to be #1.

There's plenty of chars outside of the S tier who are viable enough.


Starting off playing a non-top-tier is a good way to be a bad player. We aren't talking about #1 here, we're talking about your average guy who makes it out of pools in regionals sometimes. If you want to even be marginally decent at the game one day it's just not a good idea.

Look at the dedicated low-tier (which I will classify as below Falcon/Doc) mains today. Almost all of the good ones worth mentioning? Started off as top tier players. Why? Because learning a top tier helps you learn the competitive metagame. Top tiers are top tiers because of all their strengths. They all have combo/punish games, solid edgeguard options, recovery mixups, approaches/antiapproaches, decent neutral game options, etc. etc. etc. that the lower tiers do not have. When you play as a top tier, against a top tier, you are forced to consider all of these options, all of the time. This helps you to become a better smash player. You become able to recognize sequences and situations and adapt to them with the options you have.

Where is this different from being a dedicated low-tier main from the start? Low tiers don't have all these options. They are often gimped in one way or another, usually by having a terrible recovery or horrible neutral game. A new player starting out with one of them learns not to be a better player, but to rely on gimmicks and matchup unfamiliarity to win matches. In the short term this works out okay - plenty of terrible Foxes out there to beat up on with your glorious Ness djc uair combos. But your improvement will be much slower.

Look at Hungrybox's Ness. Armada's Young Link. Mango's Mario. M2K's... everything. Because they understand the game and their options so well, they're able to compete at a high level despite not being dedicated mains. If you watch their games, they don't go for silly gimmicks and overall weirdness to win. They just play a strong neutral game, punish well, edgeguard well. Axe began as a Falco player. So did Abate. Hell, Leffen began as a Yoshi main and switched because he knew he was winning solely on matchup jank, and wanted to be able to improve faster.

Get good. Then play your non-top-tier of choice. Don't go the hipster route right off the bat.

Disclaimer: This doesn't apply if you just don't want to be good, at all. Obviously.
hariooo
Profile Joined October 2013
Canada2830 Posts
May 09 2014 07:31 GMT
#1667
m2k's tier list is so salty.
Xeofreestyler
Profile Blog Joined June 2005
Belgium6773 Posts
May 09 2014 08:43 GMT
#1668
On May 09 2014 13:21 Kyuukyuu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 09 2014 11:47 Xeofreestyler wrote:
On May 09 2014 06:20 Kyuukyuu wrote:
On May 09 2014 05:53 Capped wrote:
To all new smashers.

If you are seriously playing smash, attending events and practicing like a blue assed fly, please for the love of god don't main fox/falco/marth, show some originallity, show some inspiration.

You, yes YOU can revitalize and revolutionize SSBM with your amazing non-S class character!

Make the spectators happy! Get outside the box! Be different!


This is really bad advice


Why? Not everyone who plays aims to be #1.

There's plenty of chars outside of the S tier who are viable enough.


Starting off playing a non-top-tier is a good way to be a bad player. We aren't talking about #1 here, we're talking about your average guy who makes it out of pools in regionals sometimes. If you want to even be marginally decent at the game one day it's just not a good idea.

Look at the dedicated low-tier (which I will classify as below Falcon/Doc) mains today. Almost all of the good ones worth mentioning? Started off as top tier players. Why? Because learning a top tier helps you learn the competitive metagame. Top tiers are top tiers because of all their strengths. They all have combo/punish games, solid edgeguard options, recovery mixups, approaches/antiapproaches, decent neutral game options, etc. etc. etc. that the lower tiers do not have. When you play as a top tier, against a top tier, you are forced to consider all of these options, all of the time. This helps you to become a better smash player. You become able to recognize sequences and situations and adapt to them with the options you have.

Where is this different from being a dedicated low-tier main from the start? Low tiers don't have all these options. They are often gimped in one way or another, usually by having a terrible recovery or horrible neutral game. A new player starting out with one of them learns not to be a better player, but to rely on gimmicks and matchup unfamiliarity to win matches. In the short term this works out okay - plenty of terrible Foxes out there to beat up on with your glorious Ness djc uair combos. But your improvement will be much slower.

Look at Hungrybox's Ness. Armada's Young Link. Mango's Mario. M2K's... everything. Because they understand the game and their options so well, they're able to compete at a high level despite not being dedicated mains. If you watch their games, they don't go for silly gimmicks and overall weirdness to win. They just play a strong neutral game, punish well, edgeguard well. Axe began as a Falco player. So did Abate. Hell, Leffen began as a Yoshi main and switched because he knew he was winning solely on matchup jank, and wanted to be able to improve faster.

Get good. Then play your non-top-tier of choice. Don't go the hipster route right off the bat.

Disclaimer: This doesn't apply if you just don't want to be good, at all. Obviously.


Good points. I actually play Falco/Ness for that exact reason. Gotta switch gears sometimes.
Graphics
Moobla
Profile Joined May 2011
United States186 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-05-09 09:30:27
May 09 2014 09:29 GMT
#1669
A code was just released that allows you to practice against CPU's with random DI and random teching: http://smashboards.com/threads/gecko-code-cpu-random-teching-and-di.354786/

As a Falcon main I am super duper excited.
"If you aren't attacking, you are probably losing." -QXC
]343[
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States10328 Posts
May 09 2014 09:32 GMT
#1670
On May 09 2014 16:31 hariooo wrote:
m2k's tier list is so salty.


it's so... m2k
Writer
Xeofreestyler
Profile Blog Joined June 2005
Belgium6773 Posts
May 09 2014 11:24 GMT
#1671
Hahah m2k as a commentator is so bad. He just rags on how the players suck.
Graphics
ffadicted
Profile Joined January 2011
United States3545 Posts
May 09 2014 13:43 GMT
#1672
Everyone should just main Jiggs imo, we can create a new meta together
SooYoung-Noona!
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
May 09 2014 15:24 GMT
#1673
I'm just sad M2K doesn't play Mewtwo much if at all :[
Spazer
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Canada8032 Posts
May 09 2014 15:54 GMT
#1674
He plays mewtwo a lot! In PM...
Liquipedia
TMG26
Profile Joined July 2012
Portugal2017 Posts
May 09 2014 16:52 GMT
#1675
How popular is PM?
Supporter of the situational Blink Dagger on Storm.
]343[
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States10328 Posts
May 09 2014 16:55 GMT
#1676
On May 10 2014 01:52 TMG26 wrote:
How popular is PM?


it's getting pretty big now... basically everywhere but California seems to have similar sized (well, at least ~70% as big) PM tourneys as Melee tourneys
Writer
Count9
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
China10928 Posts
May 09 2014 19:21 GMT
#1677
It's huge in midwest. They always joke about they can't win at melee so everyone went pm.
Spazer
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Canada8032 Posts
May 09 2014 19:50 GMT
#1678
Smash@Xanadu hosts weekly smash tourneys in MD/VA, and PM has basically supplanted brawl there. PM also always has more entrants at this specific event since it draws from both the melee and brawl players. Obviously this is only one example, but the point is that PM has found a pretty comfortable place in the smash community for the time being.
Liquipedia
126Q;A1
Profile Joined February 2011
Sweden517 Posts
May 09 2014 21:29 GMT
#1679
Kelly Ong Xiao Wei ‏@kellymilkies 6m
WELCOME @EG_PPMD to @EvilGeniuses - time for another one to #BleedBlue
#Smash #ssbm

Pretty cool :D
jaedong: "I play Counter-Strike and that is the only game I like to follow [...] my favorite team is WeMade FOX but I also like SK and fnatic."
Spazer
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Canada8032 Posts
May 09 2014 22:31 GMT
#1680
So the rumours were true after all.
Liquipedia
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