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On May 13 2011 07:57 gn0m wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 07:52 travis wrote:On May 13 2011 07:49 gen.Sun wrote:On May 13 2011 07:47 travis wrote:On May 13 2011 07:44 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:42 travis wrote:On May 13 2011 07:40 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:36 sermokala wrote:
Its stuff like this is why I hate all the stuff that keeps coming out of the BW diehards. Why can't they Support SC2 and not just shit on it every single chance they get.
Just so my point is clear We have Not one but TWO $50k leagues that are primarily america based and The scene is growing every single month. And yet the top community site must have an article on the front page saying how the entire world of sc2 is a farce and all the storylines that we've really been happy about is just total shit and we're all failures that have no hope against 300 people that don't speak English and have nothing at all for use to even care about if we're not extreme fanboys that love watching a game that looks like total shit compared to every other game.
TLDR: reaction: But everyone come back and watch the TSL3 Finals this weekend which is going to be total shit beacuse no one whos not asian and plays BW is total shit. What kind of message does this send? Its one mans view.. and it is an awesome article that adresses an interesting point. He should not voice his opinion? O_O I just don't understand why it's in News. I guess there's not really another place to put it? And imo, such opinionated articles are the most interesting pieces of news possible  Any other piece like this I have read has been a blog, and if it's a good one(which this one is), then it's spotlighted. When I look at the news archive, every single article I go through contains elements that are actually news(reports on recent events). This piece does not. The news is that there's a new Final Edit. That's how final edits have always been. Ah, i looked back at the history over the last 3 months and found another one, ty. Well I still disagree with this article representing the homepage of the site (no offense intrigue I thought it was a good article). But at least there is a disclaimer so that everyone understands it isn't TL's "official opinions" on sc2 or something. The very first sentence of the OP: Note: This is an editorial. The opinions expressed by this article do not reflect the official position of TeamLiquid.net or its staff (other than intrigue).
yeah bro, i just said that 
u must have misread what I said
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On May 13 2011 07:57 billyX333 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 07:55 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 07:49 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:45 Omoplata wrote:On May 13 2011 07:37 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:31 Miefer wrote:On May 13 2011 07:30 Beyonder wrote:
Replying to the 'offtopic' posts: SC2 fanbase is just a lot younger. BW has had the same players for so many years, it's only natural that the BW community was more mature and in general had more 'quality'. But quality is a dreadful word for that, I think maturity is a better word. But for SC2 to grow, the younger and more quantitative fanbase is needed oh so much. So in a way it is a double edged sword.
Apparently the SC2 community is not developed enough to take such awesome (and opinionated!) posts. I honestly do not see why people take it so personal. Be happy that someone has a different opinion than you and learn from it. It does not harm you one bit. Or at least, it should not. i think talking down to sc2 players isnt mature or showing quality at all... I think that him eloquently writing down his (backed up!) view is actually very mature. Dialogue is the adult way. Taking offense to anothers opinion on the other hand... Is being passive-aggressive also the adult way? You can't be offended by opinions? You aren't offended by people that think black people are inferior? Or that women are inferior? Or any one of a multitude of things that are, and should be offensive to rational-minded people? If someone is offended by something they aren't an adult? Really? Calling SC2 competition a farce is condescending, and that should be offensive to anyone that competes in SC2. MC? Hahaha, Broodwar scrub. What a farce. Nestea? Broodwar scrub. Total farce. Fruitdealer? Yet another scrub. Yet another farce. Cherry-picking statistics doesn't validate condescension. have you ever read a sports article in your entire life? and ffs drop the fucking comparison to racism and sexism. sports writers always call out athletes for being scrubs. thats why we read I have never in my life read a sports article on the front page of a sport's biggest website arguing that the sport in question was a farce. Have you ever seen a Sports Illustrated with a cover story of "The Top 20 Reasons Football is For Retards?" OP may make a good argument, but it's needless inflammatory and condescending. hello fellow american. have you ever read an article about american soccer or listened to jim rome talk about soccer obviously not
On the FIFA site? Teamliquid isn't some guy, or even a big e-sports site. It's the BW/SC2 website.
Granted, a large part of the reason Team Liquid is so big is because pro gamers post here, and we just ran a front-page article calling them a bunch of lazy pussies whose games are only good for comedy, so I hope they have thick skins.
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On May 13 2011 07:56 sermokala wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 07:43 DarkMatter_ wrote:
I'm starting to think this entire thread would be a lot less bitter if the OP didn't include that "SC2 competition is a farce" statement. I do think that was an unjustifiably harsh statement to make about the SC2 proscene even if I agree with most of what he said. This It would be a strong point to say that 90% of the problems people have with one another is caused not about what they say but how they say it.
Yeah this is my problem too. I agree with his point that Flash, Jaedong etc. would do well if they switched (I can't wait for it to happen), but all his negativaty towards the SC2 scene and calling the competition (thus every player, tournament etc.) a farce is unnecessary to get his point across.
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On May 13 2011 07:57 billyX333 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 07:55 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 07:49 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:45 Omoplata wrote:On May 13 2011 07:37 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:31 Miefer wrote:On May 13 2011 07:30 Beyonder wrote:
Replying to the 'offtopic' posts: SC2 fanbase is just a lot younger. BW has had the same players for so many years, it's only natural that the BW community was more mature and in general had more 'quality'. But quality is a dreadful word for that, I think maturity is a better word. But for SC2 to grow, the younger and more quantitative fanbase is needed oh so much. So in a way it is a double edged sword.
Apparently the SC2 community is not developed enough to take such awesome (and opinionated!) posts. I honestly do not see why people take it so personal. Be happy that someone has a different opinion than you and learn from it. It does not harm you one bit. Or at least, it should not. i think talking down to sc2 players isnt mature or showing quality at all... I think that him eloquently writing down his (backed up!) view is actually very mature. Dialogue is the adult way. Taking offense to anothers opinion on the other hand... Is being passive-aggressive also the adult way? You can't be offended by opinions? You aren't offended by people that think black people are inferior? Or that women are inferior? Or any one of a multitude of things that are, and should be offensive to rational-minded people? If someone is offended by something they aren't an adult? Really? Calling SC2 competition a farce is condescending, and that should be offensive to anyone that competes in SC2. MC? Hahaha, Broodwar scrub. What a farce. Nestea? Broodwar scrub. Total farce. Fruitdealer? Yet another scrub. Yet another farce. Cherry-picking statistics doesn't validate condescension. have you ever read a sports article in your entire life? and ffs drop the fucking comparison to racism and sexism. sports writers always call out athletes for being scrubs. thats why we read I have never in my life read a sports article on the front page of a sport's biggest website arguing that the sport in question was a farce. Have you ever seen a Sports Illustrated with a cover story of "The Top 20 Reasons Football is For Retards?" OP may make a good argument, but it's needless inflammatory and condescending. hello fellow american. have you ever read an article about american soccer or listened to jim rome talk about soccer obviously not
Yes, and Jim Rome is an arrogant blowhard. And no, I have never seen an article on, say, ESPN proclaiming American Soccer to be a farce.
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this is great insight to the current sc2 competitive scene and a great editorial. thanks.
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Beyonder
Netherlands15103 Posts
On May 13 2011 08:00 Ribbon wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 07:57 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:55 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 07:49 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:45 Omoplata wrote:On May 13 2011 07:37 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:31 Miefer wrote:On May 13 2011 07:30 Beyonder wrote:
Replying to the 'offtopic' posts: SC2 fanbase is just a lot younger. BW has had the same players for so many years, it's only natural that the BW community was more mature and in general had more 'quality'. But quality is a dreadful word for that, I think maturity is a better word. But for SC2 to grow, the younger and more quantitative fanbase is needed oh so much. So in a way it is a double edged sword.
Apparently the SC2 community is not developed enough to take such awesome (and opinionated!) posts. I honestly do not see why people take it so personal. Be happy that someone has a different opinion than you and learn from it. It does not harm you one bit. Or at least, it should not. i think talking down to sc2 players isnt mature or showing quality at all... I think that him eloquently writing down his (backed up!) view is actually very mature. Dialogue is the adult way. Taking offense to anothers opinion on the other hand... Is being passive-aggressive also the adult way? You can't be offended by opinions? You aren't offended by people that think black people are inferior? Or that women are inferior? Or any one of a multitude of things that are, and should be offensive to rational-minded people? If someone is offended by something they aren't an adult? Really? Calling SC2 competition a farce is condescending, and that should be offensive to anyone that competes in SC2. MC? Hahaha, Broodwar scrub. What a farce. Nestea? Broodwar scrub. Total farce. Fruitdealer? Yet another scrub. Yet another farce. Cherry-picking statistics doesn't validate condescension. have you ever read a sports article in your entire life? and ffs drop the fucking comparison to racism and sexism. sports writers always call out athletes for being scrubs. thats why we read I have never in my life read a sports article on the front page of a sport's biggest website arguing that the sport in question was a farce. Have you ever seen a Sports Illustrated with a cover story of "The Top 20 Reasons Football is For Retards?" OP may make a good argument, but it's needless inflammatory and condescending. hello fellow american. have you ever read an article about american soccer or listened to jim rome talk about soccer obviously not On the FIFA site? Teamliquid isn't some guy, or even a big e-sports site. It's the BW/SC2 website. Granted, a large part of the reason Team Liquid is so big is because pro gamers post here, and we just ran a front-page article calling them a bunch of lazy pussies whose games are only good for comedy, so I hope they have thick skins.
We are a news site, we are not blizzard. The top news sites have covered such topics, of course.
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On May 13 2011 07:58 Beyonder wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 07:55 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 07:49 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:45 Omoplata wrote:On May 13 2011 07:37 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:31 Miefer wrote:On May 13 2011 07:30 Beyonder wrote:
Replying to the 'offtopic' posts: SC2 fanbase is just a lot younger. BW has had the same players for so many years, it's only natural that the BW community was more mature and in general had more 'quality'. But quality is a dreadful word for that, I think maturity is a better word. But for SC2 to grow, the younger and more quantitative fanbase is needed oh so much. So in a way it is a double edged sword.
Apparently the SC2 community is not developed enough to take such awesome (and opinionated!) posts. I honestly do not see why people take it so personal. Be happy that someone has a different opinion than you and learn from it. It does not harm you one bit. Or at least, it should not. i think talking down to sc2 players isnt mature or showing quality at all... I think that him eloquently writing down his (backed up!) view is actually very mature. Dialogue is the adult way. Taking offense to anothers opinion on the other hand... Is being passive-aggressive also the adult way? You can't be offended by opinions? You aren't offended by people that think black people are inferior? Or that women are inferior? Or any one of a multitude of things that are, and should be offensive to rational-minded people? If someone is offended by something they aren't an adult? Really? Calling SC2 competition a farce is condescending, and that should be offensive to anyone that competes in SC2. MC? Hahaha, Broodwar scrub. What a farce. Nestea? Broodwar scrub. Total farce. Fruitdealer? Yet another scrub. Yet another farce. Cherry-picking statistics doesn't validate condescension. have you ever read a sports article in your entire life? and ffs drop the fucking comparison to racism and sexism. sports writers always call out athletes for being scrubs. thats why we read I have never in my life read a sports article on the front page of a sport's biggest website arguing that the sport in question was a farce. Have you ever seen a Sports Illustrated with a cover story of "The Top 20 Reasons Football is For Retards?" OP may make a good argument, but it's needless inflammatory and condescending. Yes I've seen various of similar articles. In cycling for example after all the scandals. Or soccer and the defensive games that have been developed by prominent teams which basically ruined sports (e.g., the competition in Italy). The list goes on.
Not the same at all. Scandals hurt the credibility of a sport. That's not the same as saying, "This sport sucks, the competition is such a joke."
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Thought the reference to Artosis' hype was a little odd. I remember watching the end of GSL S2 when Nestea won the final game and Artosis chose that time to remind everyone he was a "mediocre" BW player. And I just thought "Uh...sure, but is this really the time?"
Anyway. Yeah, if the world's best RTS players playing in the world's most developed RTS culture switched over to a young RTS, they'd win. I don't mind this article being here, it's entertaining and it is worth informing or reminding people that SC2 is pretty undeveloped. But it's hardly shocking.
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Beyonder
Netherlands15103 Posts
On May 13 2011 08:02 Omoplata wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 07:58 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:55 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 07:49 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:45 Omoplata wrote:On May 13 2011 07:37 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:31 Miefer wrote:On May 13 2011 07:30 Beyonder wrote:
Replying to the 'offtopic' posts: SC2 fanbase is just a lot younger. BW has had the same players for so many years, it's only natural that the BW community was more mature and in general had more 'quality'. But quality is a dreadful word for that, I think maturity is a better word. But for SC2 to grow, the younger and more quantitative fanbase is needed oh so much. So in a way it is a double edged sword.
Apparently the SC2 community is not developed enough to take such awesome (and opinionated!) posts. I honestly do not see why people take it so personal. Be happy that someone has a different opinion than you and learn from it. It does not harm you one bit. Or at least, it should not. i think talking down to sc2 players isnt mature or showing quality at all... I think that him eloquently writing down his (backed up!) view is actually very mature. Dialogue is the adult way. Taking offense to anothers opinion on the other hand... Is being passive-aggressive also the adult way? You can't be offended by opinions? You aren't offended by people that think black people are inferior? Or that women are inferior? Or any one of a multitude of things that are, and should be offensive to rational-minded people? If someone is offended by something they aren't an adult? Really? Calling SC2 competition a farce is condescending, and that should be offensive to anyone that competes in SC2. MC? Hahaha, Broodwar scrub. What a farce. Nestea? Broodwar scrub. Total farce. Fruitdealer? Yet another scrub. Yet another farce. Cherry-picking statistics doesn't validate condescension. have you ever read a sports article in your entire life? and ffs drop the fucking comparison to racism and sexism. sports writers always call out athletes for being scrubs. thats why we read I have never in my life read a sports article on the front page of a sport's biggest website arguing that the sport in question was a farce. Have you ever seen a Sports Illustrated with a cover story of "The Top 20 Reasons Football is For Retards?" OP may make a good argument, but it's needless inflammatory and condescending. Yes I've seen various of similar articles. In cycling for example after all the scandals. Or soccer and the defensive games that have been developed by prominent teams which basically ruined sports (e.g., the competition in Italy). The list goes on. Not the same at all. Scandals hurt the credibility of a sport. That's not the same as saying, "This sport sucks, the competition is such a joke."
They notice something is wrong with the sport and they are not afraid to adress it. I get what you mean, but it is not that far off. I think it is incredibly awesome that TL throws this out there and I hope that someone gets inspired and writes a counter article which we can learn more from. People take stuff so serious these days.. :o
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On May 13 2011 07:59 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 07:57 gn0m wrote:On May 13 2011 07:52 travis wrote:On May 13 2011 07:49 gen.Sun wrote:On May 13 2011 07:47 travis wrote:On May 13 2011 07:44 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:42 travis wrote:On May 13 2011 07:40 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:36 sermokala wrote:
Its stuff like this is why I hate all the stuff that keeps coming out of the BW diehards. Why can't they Support SC2 and not just shit on it every single chance they get.
Just so my point is clear We have Not one but TWO $50k leagues that are primarily america based and The scene is growing every single month. And yet the top community site must have an article on the front page saying how the entire world of sc2 is a farce and all the storylines that we've really been happy about is just total shit and we're all failures that have no hope against 300 people that don't speak English and have nothing at all for use to even care about if we're not extreme fanboys that love watching a game that looks like total shit compared to every other game.
TLDR: reaction: But everyone come back and watch the TSL3 Finals this weekend which is going to be total shit beacuse no one whos not asian and plays BW is total shit. What kind of message does this send? Its one mans view.. and it is an awesome article that adresses an interesting point. He should not voice his opinion? O_O I just don't understand why it's in News. I guess there's not really another place to put it? And imo, such opinionated articles are the most interesting pieces of news possible Any other piece like this I have read has been a blog, and if it's a good one(which this one is), then it's spotlighted. When I look at the news archive, every single article I go through contains elements that are actually news(reports on recent events). This piece does not. The news is that there's a new Final Edit. That's how final edits have always been. Ah, i looked back at the history over the last 3 months and found another one, ty. Well I still disagree with this article representing the homepage of the site (no offense intrigue I thought it was a good article). But at least there is a disclaimer so that everyone understands it isn't TL's "official opinions" on sc2 or something. The very first sentence of the OP: Note: This is an editorial. The opinions expressed by this article do not reflect the official position of TeamLiquid.net or its staff (other than intrigue). yeah bro, i just said that u must have misread what I said
Sorry, you are absolutely right. Its getting late in Sweden
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On May 13 2011 08:01 Beyonder wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 08:00 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 07:57 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:55 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 07:49 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:45 Omoplata wrote:On May 13 2011 07:37 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:31 Miefer wrote:On May 13 2011 07:30 Beyonder wrote:
Replying to the 'offtopic' posts: SC2 fanbase is just a lot younger. BW has had the same players for so many years, it's only natural that the BW community was more mature and in general had more 'quality'. But quality is a dreadful word for that, I think maturity is a better word. But for SC2 to grow, the younger and more quantitative fanbase is needed oh so much. So in a way it is a double edged sword.
Apparently the SC2 community is not developed enough to take such awesome (and opinionated!) posts. I honestly do not see why people take it so personal. Be happy that someone has a different opinion than you and learn from it. It does not harm you one bit. Or at least, it should not. i think talking down to sc2 players isnt mature or showing quality at all... I think that him eloquently writing down his (backed up!) view is actually very mature. Dialogue is the adult way. Taking offense to anothers opinion on the other hand... Is being passive-aggressive also the adult way? You can't be offended by opinions? You aren't offended by people that think black people are inferior? Or that women are inferior? Or any one of a multitude of things that are, and should be offensive to rational-minded people? If someone is offended by something they aren't an adult? Really? Calling SC2 competition a farce is condescending, and that should be offensive to anyone that competes in SC2. MC? Hahaha, Broodwar scrub. What a farce. Nestea? Broodwar scrub. Total farce. Fruitdealer? Yet another scrub. Yet another farce. Cherry-picking statistics doesn't validate condescension. have you ever read a sports article in your entire life? and ffs drop the fucking comparison to racism and sexism. sports writers always call out athletes for being scrubs. thats why we read I have never in my life read a sports article on the front page of a sport's biggest website arguing that the sport in question was a farce. Have you ever seen a Sports Illustrated with a cover story of "The Top 20 Reasons Football is For Retards?" OP may make a good argument, but it's needless inflammatory and condescending. hello fellow american. have you ever read an article about american soccer or listened to jim rome talk about soccer obviously not On the FIFA site? Teamliquid isn't some guy, or even a big e-sports site. It's the BW/SC2 website. Granted, a large part of the reason Team Liquid is so big is because pro gamers post here, and we just ran a front-page article calling them a bunch of lazy pussies whose games are only good for comedy, so I hope they have thick skins. We are a news site, we are not blizzard. The top news sites have covered such topics, of course.
I will stop complaining if you link me to an official news post in the last ten years on this site saying Brood War sucks, or even sucked at that particular time compared to some point in the past. Bonus points if it insults every single player and calls the scene a farce or some similar language.
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On May 13 2011 07:47 Beyonder wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 07:45 Omoplata wrote:On May 13 2011 07:37 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:31 Miefer wrote:On May 13 2011 07:30 Beyonder wrote:
Replying to the 'offtopic' posts: SC2 fanbase is just a lot younger. BW has had the same players for so many years, it's only natural that the BW community was more mature and in general had more 'quality'. But quality is a dreadful word for that, I think maturity is a better word. But for SC2 to grow, the younger and more quantitative fanbase is needed oh so much. So in a way it is a double edged sword.
Apparently the SC2 community is not developed enough to take such awesome (and opinionated!) posts. I honestly do not see why people take it so personal. Be happy that someone has a different opinion than you and learn from it. It does not harm you one bit. Or at least, it should not. i think talking down to sc2 players isnt mature or showing quality at all... I think that him eloquently writing down his (backed up!) view is actually very mature. Dialogue is the adult way. Taking offense to anothers opinion on the other hand... Is being passive-aggressive also the adult way? You can't be offended by opinions? You aren't offended by people that think black people are inferior? Or that women are inferior? Or any one of a multitude of things that are, and should be offensive to rational-minded people? If someone is offended by something they aren't an adult? Really? Calling SC2 competition a farce is condescending, and that should be offensive to anyone that competes in SC2. MC? Hahaha, Broodwar scrub. What a farce. Nestea? Broodwar scrub. Total farce. Fruitdealer? Yet another scrub. Yet another farce. Cherry-picking statistics doesn't validate condescension. So what, one person has that opinion and he decided to write it out. No I would not get offended; I would be interested. Why does this person feel that way? Imagine a life where we all had the same views. Now wouldn't that be boring.
Normally someone's opinion wouldn't be posted on the frontpage of the community's go-to site. No-one cares what Intrigue thinks, it's the fact that TL staff apparently finds such an incendiary article newsworthy. There isn't actually any news in it, nor is there any purpose to it, it's just an opinionated person's brainfart, which would be just fine if it had been placed in blogs, where it belongs.
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Vatican City State2594 Posts
On May 13 2011 07:07 mitthrawn wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 06:54 Murderotica wrote:On May 12 2011 15:21 mitthrawn wrote:
The writer of this article must be a huge bitter SC:BW vet. :D It's lovely how much better the new SC2-fans are at TeamLiquid are than us bitter SC:BW vets, that they get to judge this article like the above poster without ever having contributed ANYTHING to this website. The amount of people coming out and bashing the OP and defending their precious SC2 while making ignorant claims about BW is disgusting. Guess what, the 'above poster' played SC (yes the original!) online (as well as SC:BW) and he also finds your post pretty hilarious. You, dear sir, shouldn't judge a poster just from the 'joining date' of his account. And now, dear sir, continue being a bitter vet.
I said that THEY (SC2 fans) get to judge this article (LIKE THE ABOVE POSTER). I never said you were just an SC2 fan and I never bothered looking at your post date. Now, dear sir, stop trying to be snide with your overused quips.
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Great editorial.
Its good to see articles that look at things objectively and snap people back into reality.
Addresing issues like this in the open can only make the scene stronger in the end.
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On May 13 2011 08:06 Ribbon wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 08:01 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 08:00 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 07:57 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:55 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 07:49 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:45 Omoplata wrote:On May 13 2011 07:37 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:31 Miefer wrote:On May 13 2011 07:30 Beyonder wrote:
Replying to the 'offtopic' posts: SC2 fanbase is just a lot younger. BW has had the same players for so many years, it's only natural that the BW community was more mature and in general had more 'quality'. But quality is a dreadful word for that, I think maturity is a better word. But for SC2 to grow, the younger and more quantitative fanbase is needed oh so much. So in a way it is a double edged sword.
Apparently the SC2 community is not developed enough to take such awesome (and opinionated!) posts. I honestly do not see why people take it so personal. Be happy that someone has a different opinion than you and learn from it. It does not harm you one bit. Or at least, it should not. i think talking down to sc2 players isnt mature or showing quality at all... I think that him eloquently writing down his (backed up!) view is actually very mature. Dialogue is the adult way. Taking offense to anothers opinion on the other hand... Is being passive-aggressive also the adult way? You can't be offended by opinions? You aren't offended by people that think black people are inferior? Or that women are inferior? Or any one of a multitude of things that are, and should be offensive to rational-minded people? If someone is offended by something they aren't an adult? Really? Calling SC2 competition a farce is condescending, and that should be offensive to anyone that competes in SC2. MC? Hahaha, Broodwar scrub. What a farce. Nestea? Broodwar scrub. Total farce. Fruitdealer? Yet another scrub. Yet another farce. Cherry-picking statistics doesn't validate condescension. have you ever read a sports article in your entire life? and ffs drop the fucking comparison to racism and sexism. sports writers always call out athletes for being scrubs. thats why we read I have never in my life read a sports article on the front page of a sport's biggest website arguing that the sport in question was a farce. Have you ever seen a Sports Illustrated with a cover story of "The Top 20 Reasons Football is For Retards?" OP may make a good argument, but it's needless inflammatory and condescending. hello fellow american. have you ever read an article about american soccer or listened to jim rome talk about soccer obviously not On the FIFA site? Teamliquid isn't some guy, or even a big e-sports site. It's the BW/SC2 website. Granted, a large part of the reason Team Liquid is so big is because pro gamers post here, and we just ran a front-page article calling them a bunch of lazy pussies whose games are only good for comedy, so I hope they have thick skins. We are a news site, we are not blizzard. The top news sites have covered such topics, of course. I will stop complaining if you link me to an official news post in the last ten years on this site saying Brood War sucks, or even sucked at that particular time compared to some point in the past. Bonus points if it insults every single player and calls the scene a farce or some similar language.
wtf. every post you've made is based around a huge exaggeration or a bad analogy. this article didnt say sc2 sucks...
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I mean, this is all fine and dandy but whats the point of even bringing this up.
I can tell you that as a person that absolutely does not care about BW, how does this even matter?
I enjoy watching SC2 games because I enjoy watching the game itself and some of the personalities on the scene at the moment.
I say kudos to the pioneers of sc2.
I mean, how many people here honestly still come for BW? Something like 10% of the actual site?
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On May 13 2011 08:04 Beyonder wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 08:02 Omoplata wrote:On May 13 2011 07:58 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:55 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 07:49 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:45 Omoplata wrote:On May 13 2011 07:37 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:31 Miefer wrote:On May 13 2011 07:30 Beyonder wrote:
Replying to the 'offtopic' posts: SC2 fanbase is just a lot younger. BW has had the same players for so many years, it's only natural that the BW community was more mature and in general had more 'quality'. But quality is a dreadful word for that, I think maturity is a better word. But for SC2 to grow, the younger and more quantitative fanbase is needed oh so much. So in a way it is a double edged sword.
Apparently the SC2 community is not developed enough to take such awesome (and opinionated!) posts. I honestly do not see why people take it so personal. Be happy that someone has a different opinion than you and learn from it. It does not harm you one bit. Or at least, it should not. i think talking down to sc2 players isnt mature or showing quality at all... I think that him eloquently writing down his (backed up!) view is actually very mature. Dialogue is the adult way. Taking offense to anothers opinion on the other hand... Is being passive-aggressive also the adult way? You can't be offended by opinions? You aren't offended by people that think black people are inferior? Or that women are inferior? Or any one of a multitude of things that are, and should be offensive to rational-minded people? If someone is offended by something they aren't an adult? Really? Calling SC2 competition a farce is condescending, and that should be offensive to anyone that competes in SC2. MC? Hahaha, Broodwar scrub. What a farce. Nestea? Broodwar scrub. Total farce. Fruitdealer? Yet another scrub. Yet another farce. Cherry-picking statistics doesn't validate condescension. have you ever read a sports article in your entire life? and ffs drop the fucking comparison to racism and sexism. sports writers always call out athletes for being scrubs. thats why we read I have never in my life read a sports article on the front page of a sport's biggest website arguing that the sport in question was a farce. Have you ever seen a Sports Illustrated with a cover story of "The Top 20 Reasons Football is For Retards?" OP may make a good argument, but it's needless inflammatory and condescending. Yes I've seen various of similar articles. In cycling for example after all the scandals. Or soccer and the defensive games that have been developed by prominent teams which basically ruined sports (e.g., the competition in Italy). The list goes on. Not the same at all. Scandals hurt the credibility of a sport. That's not the same as saying, "This sport sucks, the competition is such a joke." They notice something is wrong with the sport and they are not afraid to adress it. I get what you mean, but it is not that far off. I think it is incredibly awesome that TL throws this out there and I hope that someone gets inspired and writes a counter article which we can learn more from. People take stuff so serious these days.. :o
Yes, but in one case you have something provably and factually wrong. In the other, you have someone taking their own biased perception and using it to take a metaphorical dump on the talents of those involved.
Had he posed his argument differently and not been so dismissive and condescending it would have been one thing, but he didn't.
It's like trying to have an argument with a theist, as an atheist, and saying, "God is stupid and a you're an idiot for believing that he exists." That's not how you go about provoking good, interesting dialog.
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On May 13 2011 08:04 Beyonder wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 08:02 Omoplata wrote:On May 13 2011 07:58 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:55 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 07:49 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:45 Omoplata wrote:On May 13 2011 07:37 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:31 Miefer wrote:On May 13 2011 07:30 Beyonder wrote:
Replying to the 'offtopic' posts: SC2 fanbase is just a lot younger. BW has had the same players for so many years, it's only natural that the BW community was more mature and in general had more 'quality'. But quality is a dreadful word for that, I think maturity is a better word. But for SC2 to grow, the younger and more quantitative fanbase is needed oh so much. So in a way it is a double edged sword.
Apparently the SC2 community is not developed enough to take such awesome (and opinionated!) posts. I honestly do not see why people take it so personal. Be happy that someone has a different opinion than you and learn from it. It does not harm you one bit. Or at least, it should not. i think talking down to sc2 players isnt mature or showing quality at all... I think that him eloquently writing down his (backed up!) view is actually very mature. Dialogue is the adult way. Taking offense to anothers opinion on the other hand... Is being passive-aggressive also the adult way? You can't be offended by opinions? You aren't offended by people that think black people are inferior? Or that women are inferior? Or any one of a multitude of things that are, and should be offensive to rational-minded people? If someone is offended by something they aren't an adult? Really? Calling SC2 competition a farce is condescending, and that should be offensive to anyone that competes in SC2. MC? Hahaha, Broodwar scrub. What a farce. Nestea? Broodwar scrub. Total farce. Fruitdealer? Yet another scrub. Yet another farce. Cherry-picking statistics doesn't validate condescension. have you ever read a sports article in your entire life? and ffs drop the fucking comparison to racism and sexism. sports writers always call out athletes for being scrubs. thats why we read I have never in my life read a sports article on the front page of a sport's biggest website arguing that the sport in question was a farce. Have you ever seen a Sports Illustrated with a cover story of "The Top 20 Reasons Football is For Retards?" OP may make a good argument, but it's needless inflammatory and condescending. Yes I've seen various of similar articles. In cycling for example after all the scandals. Or soccer and the defensive games that have been developed by prominent teams which basically ruined sports (e.g., the competition in Italy). The list goes on. Not the same at all. Scandals hurt the credibility of a sport. That's not the same as saying, "This sport sucks, the competition is such a joke." They notice something is wrong with the sport and they are not afraid to adress it. I get what you mean, but it is not that far off. I think it is incredibly awesome that TL throws this out there and I hope that someone gets inspired and writes a counter article which we can learn more from. People take stuff so serious these days.. :o
If we didn't take SC seriously we wouldn't be here.
Has TL ever run a front page article about how much of a farce BW is and how it's top players are actually pretty bad?
When the TSL1-2 was running did TL run front page articles talking about how much of a sham it was because the best players weren't in it?
Did TL ever run a front page article attacking the foreign BW scene because of how painfully dull its games were due to the lack of the top players?
The OP went out of his way to make this inflammatory and to try to talk down to SC2 fans and got put on the front page for it, I guess it's because I'm new here but I really don't see how slagging the scene the majority of the users of the site follow is incredibly awesome.
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On May 13 2011 08:08 billyX333 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 08:06 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 08:01 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 08:00 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 07:57 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:55 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 07:49 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:45 Omoplata wrote:On May 13 2011 07:37 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:31 Miefer wrote:
[quote]
i think talking down to sc2 players isnt mature or showing quality at all... I think that him eloquently writing down his (backed up!) view is actually very mature. Dialogue is the adult way. Taking offense to anothers opinion on the other hand... Is being passive-aggressive also the adult way? You can't be offended by opinions? You aren't offended by people that think black people are inferior? Or that women are inferior? Or any one of a multitude of things that are, and should be offensive to rational-minded people? If someone is offended by something they aren't an adult? Really? Calling SC2 competition a farce is condescending, and that should be offensive to anyone that competes in SC2. MC? Hahaha, Broodwar scrub. What a farce. Nestea? Broodwar scrub. Total farce. Fruitdealer? Yet another scrub. Yet another farce. Cherry-picking statistics doesn't validate condescension. have you ever read a sports article in your entire life? and ffs drop the fucking comparison to racism and sexism. sports writers always call out athletes for being scrubs. thats why we read I have never in my life read a sports article on the front page of a sport's biggest website arguing that the sport in question was a farce. Have you ever seen a Sports Illustrated with a cover story of "The Top 20 Reasons Football is For Retards?" OP may make a good argument, but it's needless inflammatory and condescending. hello fellow american. have you ever read an article about american soccer or listened to jim rome talk about soccer obviously not On the FIFA site? Teamliquid isn't some guy, or even a big e-sports site. It's the BW/SC2 website. Granted, a large part of the reason Team Liquid is so big is because pro gamers post here, and we just ran a front-page article calling them a bunch of lazy pussies whose games are only good for comedy, so I hope they have thick skins. We are a news site, we are not blizzard. The top news sites have covered such topics, of course. I will stop complaining if you link me to an official news post in the last ten years on this site saying Brood War sucks, or even sucked at that particular time compared to some point in the past. Bonus points if it insults every single player and calls the scene a farce or some similar language. wtf. every post you've made is based around a huge exaggeration or a bad analogy. this article didnt say sc2 sucks...
Is it a big leap between saying it's a joke and saying it sucks? Not really.
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Beyonder
Netherlands15103 Posts
On May 13 2011 08:06 Ribbon wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 08:01 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 08:00 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 07:57 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:55 Ribbon wrote:On May 13 2011 07:49 billyX333 wrote:On May 13 2011 07:45 Omoplata wrote:On May 13 2011 07:37 Beyonder wrote:On May 13 2011 07:31 Miefer wrote:On May 13 2011 07:30 Beyonder wrote:
Replying to the 'offtopic' posts: SC2 fanbase is just a lot younger. BW has had the same players for so many years, it's only natural that the BW community was more mature and in general had more 'quality'. But quality is a dreadful word for that, I think maturity is a better word. But for SC2 to grow, the younger and more quantitative fanbase is needed oh so much. So in a way it is a double edged sword.
Apparently the SC2 community is not developed enough to take such awesome (and opinionated!) posts. I honestly do not see why people take it so personal. Be happy that someone has a different opinion than you and learn from it. It does not harm you one bit. Or at least, it should not. i think talking down to sc2 players isnt mature or showing quality at all... I think that him eloquently writing down his (backed up!) view is actually very mature. Dialogue is the adult way. Taking offense to anothers opinion on the other hand... Is being passive-aggressive also the adult way? You can't be offended by opinions? You aren't offended by people that think black people are inferior? Or that women are inferior? Or any one of a multitude of things that are, and should be offensive to rational-minded people? If someone is offended by something they aren't an adult? Really? Calling SC2 competition a farce is condescending, and that should be offensive to anyone that competes in SC2. MC? Hahaha, Broodwar scrub. What a farce. Nestea? Broodwar scrub. Total farce. Fruitdealer? Yet another scrub. Yet another farce. Cherry-picking statistics doesn't validate condescension. have you ever read a sports article in your entire life? and ffs drop the fucking comparison to racism and sexism. sports writers always call out athletes for being scrubs. thats why we read I have never in my life read a sports article on the front page of a sport's biggest website arguing that the sport in question was a farce. Have you ever seen a Sports Illustrated with a cover story of "The Top 20 Reasons Football is For Retards?" OP may make a good argument, but it's needless inflammatory and condescending. hello fellow american. have you ever read an article about american soccer or listened to jim rome talk about soccer obviously not On the FIFA site? Teamliquid isn't some guy, or even a big e-sports site. It's the BW/SC2 website. Granted, a large part of the reason Team Liquid is so big is because pro gamers post here, and we just ran a front-page article calling them a bunch of lazy pussies whose games are only good for comedy, so I hope they have thick skins. We are a news site, we are not blizzard. The top news sites have covered such topics, of course. I will stop complaining if you link me to an official news post in the last ten years on this site saying Brood War sucks, or even sucked at that particular time compared to some point in the past. Bonus points if it insults every single player and calls the scene a farce or some similar language.
We had nothing to compare it to, or at least no other game. There has never been a similar game to BW. I'm sure that you can find some critical stuff if you look well though. TL has never been afraid to say what deserves to be said.
Anyways, night time. Hope people can (learn to) appreciate another opinion. There's nothing scary about it.
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EPT
