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On September 18 2012 22:07 stephenrau wrote:Yeah that's my biggest problem.. I care way too much about what other people think. I should take a lesson from Stephano, someone much younger than myself  And since I edited into my last post - "His form especially with 100k on the line in China in November will probably be the best it will ever be.. who knows what will happen next year especially with HotS" (not to mention the EG curse). This is probably the best time for him to go far in GSL. Oh well, even if he crushes KESPA face at MLGs there will always be something.. You can never win against stupidity. My point against these haters/doubters is that I agree that foreigners completely suck in comparison to Koreans, but Stephano is the exception, and a major one at that. But these people are either completely uninformed or unable to objectively analyze gameplay.
Or trying to piss people off, because that is what a lot of idiots do on the web. And you're playing their game.
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Yeah well I'm also a huge Kobe Bryant fan so I know how that goes. From my tiny post count, I can tell you that I've never posted on the internet (not once in years of reading NBA forums) but this recent Stephano success has got me excited, what with all the tourneys coming up. And me having so much free time lately to watch tons of Starcraft, I feel like I know so much about the scene.
I actually enjoy the Reddit voting system and thought this guy knew some stuff but was in other ways completely incorrect. So I didn't phrase my argument correctly and wasted tons of time. Lesson learned hopefully. On NBA forums, they have an ignore feature which I make generous use of, but unfortunately despite my bitching about it, TL doesn't have ignore, so I bear it (#1 person to ignore is xrap___) I even spent hours trying to make code to add my own ignore feature to TL lol.
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@stephenrau I upped some of your comments ^^.
I'm sure stephano is top 5. Besides Oz and Seed as protoss and Drg,revival and maybe Symbol. I don't see who can beat him.
He lost a few to Violet but he showed he can beat him as well. I don't see a single terran that could beat him. Not even Taeja or MvP. Maybe MMA but his slump is too great at this moment I think.
MKP is slumping as well of late. Meanwhile Stephano is on fire and he even improves his ZvZ.
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Thanks, going to  soon. On the reddit thing I wasn't necessarily saying that Stephano is top 5 or even close. He may be but there's no concrete evidence to prove it, it's just the nature of SC2 at the moment and the volatilty etc.. DRG->MKP->Taeja "best player in the world etc" hype.
My own opinions are best zergs atm are: DRG, Leenock (based on amazing MLG, I thought he was playing awful in GSL for most of the year), Life, and Stephano. With Kespa Roro looking real good and unknown. (The other Kespa zergs are looking awesome mechanically, but without fail they all suck at ZvP, Effort especially) The reason I put Stephano ahead of Symbol is I feel Symbol's ZvP is just too weak compared to Stephano's, and Curious has improved alot it seems, but he's still just a solid unspectacular player, we'll see.
For terran, Taeja is certainly at his level and MVP as well (not considering just the headsup matchup with Stephano, but as overall players advancing in a tournament). Protoss it's amazing that no one is a favorite against him despite what the idiots may say, and I really respect Squirtle and Creator not to mention Seed.
So that's 9 players plus MC.
EDIT: This Oz thing is a joke. It was a complete fluke and even if by some amazingly bizarre reason Stephano could not beat Oz, Oz could never be counted on to do better than Stephano in any tourney. As evidenced by his 0-2 (1-4 maps) performance at the last MLG and all the crushing losses in GSL for his greedy play.
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On September 18 2012 23:48 stephenrau wrote:Thanks, going to soon. On the reddit thing I wasn't necessarily saying that Stephano is top 5 or even close. He may be but there's no concrete evidence to prove it, it's just the nature of SC2 at the moment and the volatilty etc.. DRG->MKP->Taeja "best player in the world etc" hype. My own opinions are best zergs atm are: DRG, Leenock (based on amazing MLG, I thought he was playing awful in GSL for most of the year), Life, and Stephano. With Kespa Roro looking real good and unknown. (The other Kespa zergs are looking awesome mechanically, but without fail they all suck at ZvP, Effort especially) The reason I put Stephano ahead of Symbol is I feel Symbol's ZvP is just too weak compared to Stephano's, and Curious has improved alot it seems, but he's still just a solid unspectacular player, we'll see. For terran, Taeja is certainly at his level and MVP as well. Protoss it's amazing that no one is a favorite against him despite what the idiots may say, and I really respect Squirtle and Creator not to mention Seed.
IMO Stephano's International Elo confirmed long ago he was a top 5 zerg. His Elo has been #1 overall for a good portion of 2012 and was, and will be once WCS results are added to the data base,, #1 overall in vP and vT, which is truly ridiculous. Even though he's repeatedly stumbled in zvz, Symbol just called him a top 3 zerg. He's won the most money this year and has just beaten up on just about every one who's not a zerg. This isn't mathematics so if people are looking for indisputable proof of anything related to how good someone is at SCII they'll have to look elsewhere. Nevertheless, it's extremely easy to build a case for Stephano being top 5 in the world. The more interesting question is whether he's the best zerg in the world. Given his weakness in zvz you won't reach a consensus on that point but his other matchups are so extraordinarily strong and Korean zergs, at the moment, are collectively so uninspiring (other than Life and some of the KESPA players), that it doesn't seem to me to be that big of a stretch.
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+ Show Spoiler +On September 18 2012 23:48 stephenrau wrote:Thanks, going to soon. On the reddit thing I wasn't necessarily saying that Stephano is top 5 or even close. He may be but there's no concrete evidence to prove it, it's just the nature of SC2 at the moment and the volatilty etc.. DRG->MKP->Taeja "best player in the world etc" hype. My own opinions are best zergs atm are: DRG, Leenock (based on amazing MLG, I thought he was playing awful in GSL for most of the year), Life, and Stephano. With Kespa Roro looking real good and unknown. (The other Kespa zergs are looking awesome mechanically, but without fail they all suck at ZvP, Effort especially) The reason I put Stephano ahead of Symbol is I feel Symbol's ZvP is just too weak compared to Stephano's, and Curious has improved alot it seems, but he's still just a solid unspectacular player, we'll see. For terran, Taeja is certainly at his level and MVP as well (not considering just the headsup matchup with Stephano, but as overall players advancing in a tournament). Protoss it's amazing that no one is a favorite against him despite what the idiots may say, and I really respect Squirtle and Creator not to mention Seed. So that's 9 players plus MC. EDIT: This Oz thing is a joke. It was a complete fluke and even if by some amazingly bizarre reason Stephano could not beat Oz, Oz could never be counted on to do better than Stephano in any tourney. As evidenced by his 0-2 (1-4 maps) performance at the last MLG and all the crushing losses in GSL for his greedy play.
II don't agree with Leenock you haven't seen anything from Leenock from a long time(Yes he won MLG but you know winning MLG got a lot to do with luck of the bracket). His ZvP is horrible every time I watch him. Leenock is good but he is simply to inconsistent compared to Stephano. Last MLG where Stephano placed 9th place was Stephano worst placement in 6 months. And if you remember last MLG again Leenock placed like 25th place or something.
Stephano either wins the tournament or get like top 5
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Maybe I'm just dreaming but imagine he takes down Dreamhack Valencia this weekend. Or more importantly WCS World. The SC2 internet would explode. I think it was at Dreamhack Summer this year which Mana took down, where I heard a truly inspiring quote. Mr.Bitter during a cast said something along the lines of Stephano telling him "I'm going to go to Korea" (compete in the GSL?) and "I'm going to become the best in the world". With all his natural talent, we Stephano fans believe he can do it.
I've never ever heard anything else remotely similar from Stephano (facebook, twitter, interviews, etc.) so I hope he really said it and does everything he can to follow through.
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On September 19 2012 00:21 Benjamin99 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On September 18 2012 23:48 stephenrau wrote:Thanks, going to soon. On the reddit thing I wasn't necessarily saying that Stephano is top 5 or even close. He may be but there's no concrete evidence to prove it, it's just the nature of SC2 at the moment and the volatilty etc.. DRG->MKP->Taeja "best player in the world etc" hype. My own opinions are best zergs atm are: DRG, Leenock (based on amazing MLG, I thought he was playing awful in GSL for most of the year), Life, and Stephano. With Kespa Roro looking real good and unknown. (The other Kespa zergs are looking awesome mechanically, but without fail they all suck at ZvP, Effort especially) The reason I put Stephano ahead of Symbol is I feel Symbol's ZvP is just too weak compared to Stephano's, and Curious has improved alot it seems, but he's still just a solid unspectacular player, we'll see. For terran, Taeja is certainly at his level and MVP as well (not considering just the headsup matchup with Stephano, but as overall players advancing in a tournament). Protoss it's amazing that no one is a favorite against him despite what the idiots may say, and I really respect Squirtle and Creator not to mention Seed. So that's 9 players plus MC. EDIT: This Oz thing is a joke. It was a complete fluke and even if by some amazingly bizarre reason Stephano could not beat Oz, Oz could never be counted on to do better than Stephano in any tourney. As evidenced by his 0-2 (1-4 maps) performance at the last MLG and all the crushing losses in GSL for his greedy play. II don't agree with Leenock you haven't seen anything from Leenock from a long time(Yes he won MLG but you know winning MLG got a lot to do with luck of the bracket). His ZvP is horrible every time I watch him. Leenock is good but he is simply to inconsistent compared to Stephano. Last MLG where Stephano placed 9th place was Stephano worst placement in 6 months. And if you remember last MLG again Leenock placed like 25th place or something. Stephano either wins the tournament or get like top 5
Winning a MLG is still impressive...and he won two of them.. 
I would say Leenock, DRG and Stephano are the top 3 zergs right now. Curious, Life and Symbol are not that far away in skill imo, but are way behind in terms of accomplishments and playing your best when it matters most is one of the most important skills for progamers. (And yeah, Stephano is pretty good at doing that.)
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On September 19 2012 00:21 Benjamin99 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On September 18 2012 23:48 stephenrau wrote:Thanks, going to soon. On the reddit thing I wasn't necessarily saying that Stephano is top 5 or even close. He may be but there's no concrete evidence to prove it, it's just the nature of SC2 at the moment and the volatilty etc.. DRG->MKP->Taeja "best player in the world etc" hype. My own opinions are best zergs atm are: DRG, Leenock (based on amazing MLG, I thought he was playing awful in GSL for most of the year), Life, and Stephano. With Kespa Roro looking real good and unknown. (The other Kespa zergs are looking awesome mechanically, but without fail they all suck at ZvP, Effort especially) The reason I put Stephano ahead of Symbol is I feel Symbol's ZvP is just too weak compared to Stephano's, and Curious has improved alot it seems, but he's still just a solid unspectacular player, we'll see. For terran, Taeja is certainly at his level and MVP as well (not considering just the headsup matchup with Stephano, but as overall players advancing in a tournament). Protoss it's amazing that no one is a favorite against him despite what the idiots may say, and I really respect Squirtle and Creator not to mention Seed. So that's 9 players plus MC. EDIT: This Oz thing is a joke. It was a complete fluke and even if by some amazingly bizarre reason Stephano could not beat Oz, Oz could never be counted on to do better than Stephano in any tourney. As evidenced by his 0-2 (1-4 maps) performance at the last MLG and all the crushing losses in GSL for his greedy play. II don't agree with Leenock you haven't seen anything from Leenock from a long time(Yes he won MLG but you know winning MLG got a lot to do with luck of the bracket). His ZvP is horrible every time I watch him. Leenock is good but he is simply to inconsistent compared to Stephano. Last MLG where Stephano placed 9th place was Stephano worst placement in 6 months. And if you remember last MLG again Leenock placed like 25th place or something. Stephano either wins the tournament or get like top 5
Yeah I was never big on Leenocks ZvP. I always thought it was quite bad but maybe it works better @ MLGs where there's less preparation for him. I have to however give him HUGE credit for winning two MLGs from the 1st round of the open bracket. A full year apart at that. If Stephano did that (and it would be insanely difficult for any zerg to accomplish) the hype would be ridiculous.
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On September 19 2012 00:39 stephenrau wrote:Show nested quote +On September 19 2012 00:21 Benjamin99 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On September 18 2012 23:48 stephenrau wrote:Thanks, going to soon. On the reddit thing I wasn't necessarily saying that Stephano is top 5 or even close. He may be but there's no concrete evidence to prove it, it's just the nature of SC2 at the moment and the volatilty etc.. DRG->MKP->Taeja "best player in the world etc" hype. My own opinions are best zergs atm are: DRG, Leenock (based on amazing MLG, I thought he was playing awful in GSL for most of the year), Life, and Stephano. With Kespa Roro looking real good and unknown. (The other Kespa zergs are looking awesome mechanically, but without fail they all suck at ZvP, Effort especially) The reason I put Stephano ahead of Symbol is I feel Symbol's ZvP is just too weak compared to Stephano's, and Curious has improved alot it seems, but he's still just a solid unspectacular player, we'll see. For terran, Taeja is certainly at his level and MVP as well (not considering just the headsup matchup with Stephano, but as overall players advancing in a tournament). Protoss it's amazing that no one is a favorite against him despite what the idiots may say, and I really respect Squirtle and Creator not to mention Seed. So that's 9 players plus MC. EDIT: This Oz thing is a joke. It was a complete fluke and even if by some amazingly bizarre reason Stephano could not beat Oz, Oz could never be counted on to do better than Stephano in any tourney. As evidenced by his 0-2 (1-4 maps) performance at the last MLG and all the crushing losses in GSL for his greedy play. II don't agree with Leenock you haven't seen anything from Leenock from a long time(Yes he won MLG but you know winning MLG got a lot to do with luck of the bracket). His ZvP is horrible every time I watch him. Leenock is good but he is simply to inconsistent compared to Stephano. Last MLG where Stephano placed 9th place was Stephano worst placement in 6 months. And if you remember last MLG again Leenock placed like 25th place or something. Stephano either wins the tournament or get like top 5 Yeah I was never big on Leenocks ZvP. I always thought it was quite bad but maybe it works better @ MLGs where there's less preparation for him. I have to however give him HUGE credit for winning two MLGs from the 1st round of the open bracket. A full year apart at that. If Stephano did that (and it would be insanely difficult for any zerg to accomplish) the hype would be ridiculous.
Yea, you make a good point Leenock is incredible good. I just think he is way to inconsistent but it could be his age how old is he now 16/17?
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Leenock is 17.
But age doesn't seem to matter that much for Koreans. I mean Creator is freaking 15 and is like the best protoss in the world right now. :D
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On September 19 2012 00:31 stephenrau wrote:
Maybe I'm just dreaming but imagine he takes down Dreamhack Valencia this weekend. Or more importantly WCS World. The SC2 internet would explode. I think it was at Dreamhack Summer this year which Mana took down, where I heard a truly inspiring quote. Mr.Bitter during a cast said something along the lines of Stephano telling him "I'm going to go to Korea" (compete in the GSL?) and "I'm going to become the best in the world". With all his natural talent, we Stephano fans believe he can do it.
I've never ever heard anything else remotely similar from Stephano (facebook, twitter, interviews, etc.) so I hope he really said it and does everything he can to follow through.
Just so you guys don't miss this  , can anyone confirm this or give exact details? Maybe I am Stephano fanboy #1 ahead of Jaedong.
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I don't think he will get nr.1 at Valencia DH. Depends how he fares against Violet.
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On September 19 2012 00:46 stephenrau wrote:Show nested quote +On September 19 2012 00:31 stephenrau wrote:
Maybe I'm just dreaming but imagine he takes down Dreamhack Valencia this weekend. Or more importantly WCS World. The SC2 internet would explode. I think it was at Dreamhack Summer this year which Mana took down, where I heard a truly inspiring quote. Mr.Bitter during a cast said something along the lines of Stephano telling him "I'm going to go to Korea" (compete in the GSL?) and "I'm going to become the best in the world". With all his natural talent, we Stephano fans believe he can do it.
I've never ever heard anything else remotely similar from Stephano (facebook, twitter, interviews, etc.) so I hope he really said it and does everything he can to follow through. Just so you guys don't miss this , can anyone confirm this or give exact details? Maybe I am Stephano fanboy #1 ahead of Jaedong.
Yes. I remember this aswell. Mr.Bitter said Stephano told him that.
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Stephano will definitely be a contender for Dreamhack, especially as Nerchio or Scarlett are no longer attending. We will have to see what happens though.
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I didn't like it. I thought there was too much theoretical speculation on Stephano's thought processes and the article was way too long. It would have been better for the author to maybe interview Stephano about his in game mental state and then ask him whether the author's theories were accurate.
I imagine the TL thread will be inundated with BW fans raging at any comparisons with Bisu.
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On September 19 2012 02:12 revel8 wrote:I didn't like it. I thought there was too much theoretical speculation on Stephano's thought processes and the article was way too long. It would have been better for the author to maybe interview Stephano about his in game mental state and then ask him whether the author's theories were accurate. I imagine the TL thread will be inundated with BW fans raging at any comparisons with Bisu.
Hmm, I thought it was a very good attempt at analysing Stephano mindset. If the writer is correct or not that's impossible to prove and I frankly I don't even think Stephano know anything about his own mindset. How many times haven't interviewers asked Stephano how he does it. And Stephano always give some strange answer that doesn't explain anything.
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I don't want to be overly critical of the article ^^ as the author clearly spent a lot of time writing it. However he could have been much more concise and simply said that Stephano seemingly maintains his calm under pressure, doesn't really get intimidated by his opponents and does not seemingly suffer from emotional swings as a result of winning or losing the previous game.
Obviously Stephano is psychologically strong and this plays part of his success, but he is also excellent at decision making, unit control and analysing an opponents strategy based on limited information. He also is exceptional at managing the actual battles part in SC2 games. Choosing when and where to engage, unit composition, importance and choice of upgrades, importance of flanks, prioritising targets during the actual battle, micro-management of units during the fighting etc.
His battle management is really superb. I rewatched the vods of his series against Lucifron, and in the first game on (Cloud Kingdom) Stephano won every single battle during the game. Lucifron got a lot of success with harrassing drone lines but he lost every single actual battle against Stephano's army in Cloud Kingdom. In the third game Stephano won all the battles except one which he was forced to disengage from when his 4th base was attacked. It was his battle management that won him that series.
The article doesn't really mention anything about his unit control or battle management. It is in essence stating Stephano is an a calm mental zone, but goes on in far too much superfluous descriptions of this.
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On September 19 2012 02:45 revel8 wrote:
I don't want to be overly critical of the article ^^ as the author clearly spent a lot of time writing it. However he could have been much more concise and simply said that Stephano seemingly maintains his calm under pressure, doesn't really get intimidated by his opponents and does not seemingly suffer from emotional swings as a result of winning or losing the previous game.
Obviously Stephano is psychologically strong and this plays part of his success, but he is also excellent at decision making, unit control and analysing an opponents strategy based on limited information. He also is exceptional at managing the actual battles part in SC2 games. Choosing when and where to engage, unit composition, importance and choice of upgrades, importance of flanks, prioritising targets during the actual battle, micro-management of units during the fighting etc.
His battle management is really superb. I rewatched the vods of his series against Lucifron, and in the first game on (Cloud Kingdom) Stephano won every single battle during the game. Lucifron got a lot of success with harrassing drone lines but he lost every single actual battle against Stephano's army in Cloud Kingdom. In the third game Stephano won all the battles except one which he was forced to disengage from when his 4th base was attacked. It was his battle management that won him that series.
The article doesn't really mention anything about his unit control or battle management. It is in essence stating Stephano is an a calm mental zone, but goes on in far too much superfluous descriptions of this.
You make a valid point but I think his unit control or battle management deserve his own essay:D. The writer clearly wanted to analyse other aspects of a "sportsman". An X-factor that most of the time is overlooked. Ofcourse you right there is more to Stephano then just his mindset but I think it actually do got a huge impact and I think the writer did a good job trying to analyse just that.
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EPT
