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All book discussion in this thread is now allowed. |
A few thoughts:
1. Glad that Bronn's alive to make more jokes; he's probably my third favorite character in the show after Ramsay and Tyrion. But the poisoning and then magic recovery was a bit stupid. I guess she stripped to make the blood go faster and spread the poison to where it needs to go, but what was the whole point anyway? For a guy to tell her she's pretty? Is this how they pick up guys in Dorne? If there's no bigger point to that plotline revealed later on, I don't see why it's in the show.
2. Glad to see Olenna's not invincible when it comes to wit. The High Sparrow really knows how to hold his own with the Tyrell matriarch. Reminds me a bit of the Joker, part of what makes him so fearsome is that he doesn't really care for all the usual motives - money, power, etc. He just follows his moral code.
3. Overall I felt like I was rooting for the Sparrow, in spite of the Faith Militant basically turning King's Landing into a religious police state. Olenna was trying to corrupt him, Sparrow takes the path of the people and could do a good job of turning the commoners against the nobility. Cersei went from ice queen who will go to any length to protect her kids to full cuntmode before and as the Sparrow arrests her for incest. And of course Tywin's words come back to us as she's repeatedly screaming "I am the queen!"
4. Buggery is a funny word.
5. The Faith Militant itself might not be so big - how many common people are going to carve stars into their heads and hunt down their neighbors? - but they'll probably enjoy public support. The nobles and royalty are all fighting and leading commoners to die in endless wars, so instead of bowing to the crown(s) and its enforcers (the nobles), they now turn to the gods and their enforcers (the Faith Militant). We all saw the commoners calling Tommen a bastard, now with Cersei on trial they'll have confirmation and proof to go after Tommen and put someone else into power.
6. I wonder what people think of Tommen as a ruler. He's calm to the point of being indecisive, but do people think he's another Joffrey, or has he done anything to make him stand out as something else?
7. Does Shireen have to die? I mean, Stannis and Gendry came out pretty much the same way they came in, I don't see why Stannis won't just get Shireen to give a bit of blood or soul or whatever the Lord of Light demands, and then they can get on with their holy war. Besides, if Shireen dies, great we've got Stannis on the throne, but who is supposed to take power when he dies? We're out of Baratheons. Does he have a kid with Melisandre? A non-shadowy one? Does he marry Sansa and/or Margaery and become husband number four? Scrap the Sand Snake scene and use the time to explain the rationale behind all of this blood magic stuff.
Also 8. Would've been hilarious to see the pyre burn and Aemon lying there naked and immune to the effects of the fire due to his Targaryen blood.
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I am basically just watching GOT to wait for Sillicon Valley
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On May 25 2015 13:17 karazax wrote:
Yes it's reasonable to assume they have more strength than shown in the show. Though if they were powerful enough to oppose both the Lannisters and Tyrell armies in open warfare you have to wonder why they needed the King's permission to arm themselves? I did like that they at least presented hostages as a reasonable excuse not to just go kill them all. Tommen could at least repeal the royal decree allowing them to arm them selves. They might ignore the decree, but at least then they are criminals who are breaking the law if he acts.
Still annoying that the word of a squire and male prostitute was taken over the queen or heir to High Garden when squires would regularly see their knights dress and undress in the line of duty.
It is hard to arm yourself when you are banned from doing so. To do so is to make yourself an outlaw and most commoners fear punishment from their well-armed lords. There would likely be a lot of opposition from within the church as well. I mean... the punishment is death and there's a social stigma against treason on top of that.
It is hard to disarm someone once armed. Particularly if there is a lot of them. Generally you have to go to war to do that. If the Faith Militant's army really isn't that big, it would at least be a pretty bad PR disaster to disarm them because they arrested your mom and wife. A lot of people would take that as proof of guilt right there, and could lead to riots as well.
The Sparrows treat the testimony of squires and Queens equally. Keep in mind that there's yet to be a trial, so first no one's been found guilty because of one squire's testimony And second they may have other evidence that has yet to be revealed.
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On May 25 2015 13:25 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
if Shireen dies, great we've got Stannis on the throne, but who is supposed to take power when he dies? We're out of Baratheons...
You said it yourself - Gendry.
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On May 25 2015 13:45 saddaromma wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2015 13:25 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
if Shireen dies, great we've got Stannis on the throne, but who is supposed to take power when he dies? We're out of Baratheons... You said it yourself - Gendry.
It's also the person I believe Littlefinger was talking about to Olenna and who he might be hoping can take over once the Sparrows & Lannisters are destroying each other.
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Tommen isn't exactly popular as a bastard, how could Gendry do any better with his approval rating?
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On May 25 2015 13:53 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
Tommen isn't exactly popular as a bastard, how could Gendry do any better with his approval rating?
Tommen is abomination - a product of incest. its like 10x worse than bastard.
On May 25 2015 13:48 Zooper31 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2015 13:45 saddaromma wrote:On May 25 2015 13:25 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
if Shireen dies, great we've got Stannis on the throne, but who is supposed to take power when he dies? We're out of Baratheons... You said it yourself - Gendry. It's also the person I believe Littlefinger was talking about to Olenna and who he might be hoping can take over once the Sparrows & Lannisters are destroying each other.
He was referring to Lancel.
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On May 25 2015 13:55 saddaromma wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2015 13:53 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
Tommen isn't exactly popular as a bastard, how could Gendry do any better with his approval rating? Tommen is abomination - a product of incest. its like 10x worse than bastard. Show nested quote +On May 25 2015 13:48 Zooper31 wrote:On May 25 2015 13:45 saddaromma wrote:On May 25 2015 13:25 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
if Shireen dies, great we've got Stannis on the throne, but who is supposed to take power when he dies? We're out of Baratheons... You said it yourself - Gendry. It's also the person I believe Littlefinger was talking about to Olenna and who he might be hoping can take over once the Sparrows & Lannisters are destroying each other. He was referring to Lancel.
Idk, why would Littlefinger be talking with the Sparrows after what they did to him. They are religious fanatics who hate what he does, even before they pillaged his place they wouldn't associate with him imo. I still think he was talking about Gendry since he knows the Sparrows are going to catch onto Cersei like they did and they are going to need someone to reign since they killed Joffrey.
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On May 25 2015 13:55 saddaromma wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2015 13:53 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
Tommen isn't exactly popular as a bastard, how could Gendry do any better with his approval rating? Tommen is abomination - a product of incest. its like 10x worse than bastard. Show nested quote +On May 25 2015 13:48 Zooper31 wrote:On May 25 2015 13:45 saddaromma wrote:On May 25 2015 13:25 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
if Shireen dies, great we've got Stannis on the throne, but who is supposed to take power when he dies? We're out of Baratheons... You said it yourself - Gendry. It's also the person I believe Littlefinger was talking about to Olenna and who he might be hoping can take over once the Sparrows & Lannisters are destroying each other. He was referring to Lancel.
Gendry would still be a product of lust though, I don't imagine he'll have any religious support unless the whole town goes over to the Lord of Light or something. And that'll piss a lot of people off too.
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Lf was talking about Lancel, but which one was the gift that He gave to Cersei, the male prostitute? I dont remember
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On May 25 2015 14:01 Zooper31 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2015 13:55 saddaromma wrote:On May 25 2015 13:53 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
Tommen isn't exactly popular as a bastard, how could Gendry do any better with his approval rating? Tommen is abomination - a product of incest. its like 10x worse than bastard. On May 25 2015 13:48 Zooper31 wrote:On May 25 2015 13:45 saddaromma wrote:On May 25 2015 13:25 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
if Shireen dies, great we've got Stannis on the throne, but who is supposed to take power when he dies? We're out of Baratheons... You said it yourself - Gendry. It's also the person I believe Littlefinger was talking about to Olenna and who he might be hoping can take over once the Sparrows & Lannisters are destroying each other. He was referring to Lancel. Idk, why would Littlefinger be talking with the Sparrows after what they did to him. They are religious fanatics who hate what he does, even before they pillaged his place they wouldn't associate with him imo. I still think he was talking about Gendry since he knows the Sparrows are going to catch onto Cersei like they did and they are going to need someone to reign since they killed Joffrey.
If it was book, I'd be guessing. But since its show, where everything needs to be straightforward, its highly like he was talking about Lancel. Plotline points exactly to that:
- Littlefinger meets Lancel on day of arrival.
- Olenna tries to speak to Cercei and High sparrow about her grandchildren. Nothing works out.
- Littlefinger meets Olenna and promises someone.
- Cersei is put in cells by Lancel.
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On May 25 2015 13:25 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
Also 8. Would've been hilarious to see the pyre burn and Aemon lying there naked and immune to the effects of the fire due to his Targaryen blood.
Daenerys will die, get resurrected by a white walker, and become an invincible zombie.
gg no re
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On May 25 2015 12:57 JonnyBNoHo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2015 12:04 zeratul_jf wrote:On May 25 2015 11:33 karazax wrote:
I didn't think the Dorne story line could get any worse and I was wrong. That was laugh out loud terrible with Bronn and the Sand Snake stripping in prison. I agree... i mean I couldnt take this episode seriously at all, same with Cersei going to see the high sparrow... this dude now runs the show with what? 10 militia??? like im pretty sure no one would care if the king kill them and then put another religion in place? I mean why is there multiple religions in king's landing?!??! Through out history everytime religions met there was a fight i would expect the same thing to happen here, that everyone would be forced to followed the King's religion.. Anyhow this show has started to become a comedy for me, and i didnt know till now that the writers were the ones who did "its always sunny in philli" No wonder that without the books they are just running this into a comedic show. I also hate the fact about how Jora and Tyrion meet the queen???? like seriously if a warrior runs out of their cage they are allowed to roam free and kill everyone?? I wouldn't assume that the faith militant only has 10 militiamen. We haven't been told their numbers outright but we can assume a few things from dialogue in this episode alone. Tommen talks about bringing in the military to rescue Margaery. Since King's Landing has the Gold Cloaks and the Kingsguard present, we can assume that the High Sparrow is strong enough to oppose those forces, which is very significant. The High Sparrow himself talks bout having a numerical advantage while talking to the Queen of Thorns. Highgarden and the Tyrells are well known to be one of the wealthiest house in a wealthy, populous kingdom. Using the threat of numerical superiority against her, should give you some pause as to his strength.
It's really doubtful that his numbers are enough to win anything. Even if he has the numbers, his soldiers won't be as well-trained as any kind of real fighting force. The High Sparrow's comments to Olenna allude to the fact that the common people would probably side with the Faith over a bunch of nobles that know nothing about the common life.
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On May 25 2015 12:57 JonnyBNoHo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2015 12:04 zeratul_jf wrote:On May 25 2015 11:33 karazax wrote:
I didn't think the Dorne story line could get any worse and I was wrong. That was laugh out loud terrible with Bronn and the Sand Snake stripping in prison. I agree... i mean I couldnt take this episode seriously at all, same with Cersei going to see the high sparrow... this dude now runs the show with what? 10 militia??? like im pretty sure no one would care if the king kill them and then put another religion in place? I mean why is there multiple religions in king's landing?!??! Through out history everytime religions met there was a fight i would expect the same thing to happen here, that everyone would be forced to followed the King's religion.. Anyhow this show has started to become a comedy for me, and i didnt know till now that the writers were the ones who did "its always sunny in philli" No wonder that without the books they are just running this into a comedic show. I also hate the fact about how Jora and Tyrion meet the queen???? like seriously if a warrior runs out of their cage they are allowed to roam free and kill everyone?? I wouldn't assume that the faith militant only has 10 militiamen. We haven't been told their numbers outright but we can assume a few things from dialogue in this episode alone. Tommen talks about bringing in the military to rescue Margaery. Since King's Landing has the Gold Cloaks and the Kingsguard present, we can assume that the High Sparrow is strong enough to oppose those forces, which is very significant. The High Sparrow himself talks bout having a numerical advantage while talking to the Queen of Thorns. Highgarden and the Tyrells are well known to be one of the wealthiest house in a wealthy, populous kingdom. Using the threat of numerical superiority against her, should give you some pause as to his strength.
The issue isn't the number of militants the sparrows have, but the number of supporters. The general populace believes they're doing a really good thing, so if the King tries to shut them down, they're have a riot on their hands.
In terms of military strength they wouldn't stand a chance. I mean it's a bunch of guys in cloth carrying clubs vs heavily armed soldiers.
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Well that was a satisfying ending. Pretty sure Cercei hopes she didn't put the Sparrow in power now.
So happy Bronn isn't dead, was really scared for a moment there. Stannis the Mannis having trouble in the snow doesn't bode well for him. Fighting in snow against an army that is used to snow is a huge disadvantage. Hope he still wins though.
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so is mace tyrell gona meet the iron bank guys yet? whatever happened to him, he sorta just drifted off. He is gona be like 'oh shit' when he comes back.
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Seven episodes in and still no Hodor?
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On May 25 2015 17:00 lord_nibbler wrote:
Seven episodes in and still no Hodor?
Nodor 
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On May 25 2015 13:17 karazax wrote:
Yes it's reasonable to assume they have more strength than shown in the show. Though if they were powerful enough to oppose both the Lannisters and Tyrell armies in open warfare you have to wonder why they needed the King's permission to arm themselves? I did like that they at least presented hostages as a reasonable excuse not to just go kill them all. Tommen could at least repeal the royal decree allowing them to arm them selves. They might ignore the decree, but at least then they are criminals who are breaking the law if he acts.
Still annoying that the word of a squire and male prostitute was taken over the queen or heir to High Garden when squires would regularly see their knights dress and undress in the line of duty.
Its kind of his fault for reacting like an idiot when the squire mentioned the birthmark. There are tons of rational and logical ways that such a thing could come up as a funny aside that you could use to pass it off as nothing and instead he charges at him.
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On May 25 2015 14:19 saddaromma wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2015 14:01 Zooper31 wrote:On May 25 2015 13:55 saddaromma wrote:On May 25 2015 13:53 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
Tommen isn't exactly popular as a bastard, how could Gendry do any better with his approval rating? Tommen is abomination - a product of incest. its like 10x worse than bastard. On May 25 2015 13:48 Zooper31 wrote:On May 25 2015 13:45 saddaromma wrote:On May 25 2015 13:25 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
if Shireen dies, great we've got Stannis on the throne, but who is supposed to take power when he dies? We're out of Baratheons... You said it yourself - Gendry. It's also the person I believe Littlefinger was talking about to Olenna and who he might be hoping can take over once the Sparrows & Lannisters are destroying each other. He was referring to Lancel. Idk, why would Littlefinger be talking with the Sparrows after what they did to him. They are religious fanatics who hate what he does, even before they pillaged his place they wouldn't associate with him imo. I still think he was talking about Gendry since he knows the Sparrows are going to catch onto Cersei like they did and they are going to need someone to reign since they killed Joffrey. If it was book, I'd be guessing. But since its show, where everything needs to be straightforward, its highly like he was talking about Lancel. Plotline points exactly to that: - Littlefinger meets Lancel on day of arrival. - Olenna tries to speak to Cercei and High sparrow about her grandchildren. Nothing works out. - Littlefinger meets Olenna and promises someone. - Cersei is put in cells by Lancel.
My impression was that Littlefinger was talking about Loras "squire" Olyvar, since the guy was also working for Littelfinger, running his brothel. Right now, he's the only resaon Loras and Margaery are arrested. If Olenna could get him to reverse his testimony (or even get him to do a complete U-turn by claiming Cersei somehow forced him to invent his relationship with Loras in the first place), this would be exactly what she needs. After all, why did Olyvar confess at all? Was it just fear?
Yes, Littlefinger could've been talking about Lancel. Then again, I'm not sure the Lancel/Cersei incest (which btw wouldnt be punishable in most countries, but I guess from Lancels comments we learn that it is a crime in westeros) was an open secret, but it's ofc still possible he learned about it anyway. Could Littlefinger just go to Lancel and tell him to confess? Again possible, but it also could have backfired, if the High Sparrow wasnt as pure and instead a political ally, reporting to Cersei instead of arresting her. Which I think Olenna at least considered to be a possibility.
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EPT
