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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51485 Posts
 GESC GESC/Thailand Minor/2018/Group StageStreamsFormat
Teams!![[image loading]](/staff/Julmust/lr_threads/team_logos/234x90/secret_white.png) ![[image loading]](/staff/Julmust/lr_threads/team_logos/234x90/eg.png) ![[image loading]](/staff/Julmust/lr_threads/team_logos/234x90/fnatic.png) ![[image loading]](/staff/Julmust/lr_threads/team_logos/234x90/Team_VGJ.png) ![[image loading]](/staff/tehh4ck3r/team_logos/keen_gaming.png) ![[image loading]](/staff/tehh4ck3r/team_logos/alpha_red.png) ![[image loading]](/staff/tehh4ck3r/team_logos/tft.png) ![[image loading]](/staff/Julmust/lr_threads/team_logos/234x90/sg.png) Fixtures & ResultsSaturday, May 12 7:30am GMT (GMT+00:00) ![[image loading]](/staff/tehh4ck3r/team_logos/vgj_storm.png) Saturday, May 12 11:00am GMT (GMT+00:00) ![[image loading]](/staff/Nixer/other/tba_white.png) ![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/9lCCMFa.jpg) CSS: FO-nTTaX Awesomeness: Panda Banner: GESC | ||
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51485 Posts
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OmniEulogy
Canada6592 Posts
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plasmidghost
Belgium16168 Posts
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arghyad1
India243 Posts
But the real test for Fnatic would be ESL as they need to be atleast second there to be in the contention for TI invite. There is still a very low probability of all 3 SEA giants (Mineski, TNC and Fnatic) making it to TI through invites. :-D Congrats to Secret for being the 3rd team to ensure TI8 invite. Keen can be hopeful as Secret might be a bit complacent today after their invite just got secured yesterday. Edit : The poll lists 'Vici Gaming Storm'. LOL. Nice mix of NA and CN... :-). | ||
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MetalMercury
United States1161 Posts
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CosmicSpiral
United States15275 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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babysimba
10466 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 13:46 babysimba wrote: How does this viper do so much damage in every fight without any items rofl Doesn't die, so he does a lot of slow AoE damage. Same reason Radiance does work. | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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Gamble28
Germany107 Posts
On May 12 2018 14:32 Taf the Ghost wrote: Xyclopz has gotten a lot better in his English casting over the years. true but his voice is still annoying :/ | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 14:47 Sloke wrote: hot damn, keen is actually showing up. let's see if secret wakes up to not give g2 away Doom is too hard to counter, and Keen pulled out the Doom + Bane against EG to win as well. You ban the Doom and they're a lot weaker. | ||
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maximrobi
Hungary347 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
It's a good adaptation to where the Meta has gone. | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 14:57 maximrobi wrote: They had no catch for the 2 mobile cores (Lycan and Puck), plus their own cores had no farm... They drafted to counter Doom, but Doom + Bane prevents most of those counters from working. It's a good bit of "anti-counter pick synergy". Puck + Brew just meant they could run around killing secret while they're disabled. | ||
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 15:16 Sloke wrote: keen trying to abuse the strong meta heroes. lesh, doom and PL all feel very strong atm What you have to do. Secret will outskill Keen if they just went 1 vs 1, so you have to leverage as much advantage as you can. | ||
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plasmidghost
Belgium16168 Posts
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Vertical
Indonesia4317 Posts
On May 12 2018 15:16 Sloke wrote: keen trying to abuse the strong meta heroes. lesh, doom and PL all feel very strong atm as if those hero aren't available for secret to pick the real question is why did secret allow them to have 2 of their signature hero. doom and PL. | ||
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nVme
952 Posts
they could win this tourney | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 15:27 Vertical wrote: as if those hero aren't available for secret to pick the real question is why did secret allow them to have 2 of their signature hero. doom and PL. I really hate when good captains get really stubborn on this type of stuff. You ban the Doom, not the Bane. | ||
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babysimba
10466 Posts
Well on serious note, KG players are very talented and can be tier 1 if they fix their mid late game, hopefully through the help of a coach or some divine intervention. Winning TI is not an impossibility no matter how small the chance is. | ||
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
On May 12 2018 15:27 Vertical wrote: as if those hero aren't available for secret to pick the real question is why did secret allow them to have 2 of their signature hero. doom and PL. true, I guess the puppey stubbornness shows again. | ||
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nVme
952 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 15:37 babysimba wrote: CHINESE TI YEAR. Well on serious note, KG players are very talented and can be tier 1 if they fix their mid late game, hopefully through the help of a coach or some divine intervention. Winning TI is not an impossibility no matter how small the chance is. I don't think they'll get out of the Chinese qualifiers. I also don't expect Fnatic to be as stubborn about drafting against them. Oddly enough, Keen is playing in the way the RTZ-based EG figured out how to play with ppd as captain. They have a carry farming while the other 3-4 heroes go and gank. Farming on 3 cores doesn't work against this, which is why Keen died to Doom twice against Secret. Secret drafted into the one thing Keen does well and they're getting punished for it. | ||
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nVme
952 Posts
On May 12 2018 15:40 Sloke wrote: true, I guess the puppey stubbornness shows again. midone needs to threaten to leave and straight up tell puppey to not be stubborn lol it cost them a lot of games, and i don't think i've ever seen puppey win a game thinking he can beat signature heroes | ||
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nVme
952 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 15:42 nVme wrote: midone needs to threaten to leave and straight up tell puppey to not be stubborn lol it cost them a lot of games, and i don't think i've ever seen puppey win a game thinking he can beat signature heroes Secret won with Doom in 1 game. Lose to Doom + Bane in Game 2. Ban Bane in game 3. Losing Game 3. Apparently the logic of "just ban Doom if you aren't taking it" is too much. All good captains do this. I think it's a lack of a coach inspecting the previous game while it's happening to figure out why certain things worked. | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
Keen has players with a bright future, but they're doing a T2 Special tournament. | ||
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Day_Walker
104 Posts
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babysimba
10466 Posts
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maximrobi
Hungary347 Posts
On May 12 2018 16:02 babysimba wrote: Puppy is ready to smash someone's head Maybe he should smash his own head. I mean first ban INVOKER instead the DOOM who just destroyed you? Be serious... | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 16:02 babysimba wrote: Puppy is ready to smash someone's head It's his own fault. Bans are always on the drafter, and their strategy was farming until mid-game against a team that spends from min 7 to min 25 trying to gank the entire time with deep wards. Whoever they face in the finals is going to ban Doom or take it themselves, then Keen is going to be back to their T2 state. | ||
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maximrobi
Hungary347 Posts
On May 12 2018 16:05 Taf the Ghost wrote: It's his own fault. Bans are always on the drafter, and their strategy was farming until mid-game against a team that spends from min 7 to min 25 trying to gank the entire time with deep wards. Whoever they face in the finals is going to ban Doom or take it themselves, then Keen is going to be back to their T2 state. Plus he did really poorly with warding. Keen were running around and they have not a single ward on the map to see their rotations, movements, runes or ANYTHING at all. While Keen was blocking camps, getting vision on stacks and information about Alch all the time. | ||
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550
418 Posts
of course not gonna discredit KG / LGD / FTM, but maybe its slightly because of DOOM? very sad that Secret lost, really wanted them on grand finalsg | ||
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goody153
44127 Posts
Its gonna be fnatic vs keen ? Assuming if it goes as expected | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 16:10 maximrobi wrote: Plus he did really poorly with warding. Keen were running around and they have not a single ward on the map to see their rotations, movements, runes or ANYTHING at all. While Keen was blocking camps, getting vision on stacks and information about Alch all the time. Keen is playing like a slightly more farm-y version of the old MVP.Phoenix roster. The point of the ganking is to activate their core, so they're really just an aggressive single-core drafting team. Which is why Doom works so well. Though don't take credit away from Dark. Guy has been good pretty much every game I've seen him in the last few months. He's got a really bright future. Everyone else, eh, I've been pretty unimpressed. I brought up MVP.P because there were a few LANs they looked like the best team in the world for a few matches, then they dropped off the face of the earth for weeks. | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 16:18 goody153 wrote: Keen beat secret ? Lmao CN qualifiers is gonna be so fun Its gonna be fnatic vs keen ? Assuming if it goes as expected VGJ.Storm might be able to beat Fnatic if they do something like they did against Optic in the Super Major qualifiers. They've had time to game-plan and they really need it, though Storm has played enough in the new patch that Fnatic should be able to remove Sneyking from his meta heroes, which probably means Storm crumbles. | ||
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turpentine
1624 Posts
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Vertical
Indonesia4317 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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550
418 Posts
then there will be VGJT LFY and KG contending for 2 spots i definitely prefer VGJT n LFY as burnt as VGJT looked, i think its due to them attending all tournaments for 6 months nonstop all over the world, and LFY r definitely very fun to watch with inflame n monet just being very young kids winning TI millions made them go, rly wanna see em back, but their 3 remaining players looked not solid | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 16:49 550 wrote: pretty high chance VGJT is gonna kicked down to Qualifiers due to remaining 2 majors then there will be VGJT LFY and KG contending for 2 spots i definitely prefer VGJT n LFY as burnt as VGJT looked, i think its due to them attending all tournaments for 6 months nonstop all over the world, and LFY r definitely very fun to watch with inflame n monet just being very young kids winning TI millions made them go, rly wanna see em back, but their 3 remaining players looked not solid Honestly, VGJ.T is likely to keep that spot. They're going to back into a TI invite because Slacks' drawing skills. | ||
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Chillander
219 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 17:09 Chillander wrote: Haha oh man, we might actually get that KG vs VG US finals Don't underestimate VGJ.Storm's ability to throw, though they're against an EE team. | ||
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
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babysimba
10466 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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babysimba
10466 Posts
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
On May 12 2018 17:17 babysimba wrote: Well I don't think there are many ways to come back against a DP dusa lineup. It is way too stable to throw. All dusa needs to seal this game is an aghs against CK ult if CK gets too fat. LOL too fat, he isn't getting past the armlet. :D | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
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550
418 Posts
SeemsGood | ||
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arghyad1
India243 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
As for game 1, I'm glad VGJ.Storm came in with a good plan. I also just realized how much of NA Dota drafts around ppd's general strategy, lol. | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
On May 12 2018 17:50 Taf the Ghost wrote: Fnatic bans Sneyking and suddenly their game is a lot easier. Sneyking was Beastmaster last game, was 1-7 and pretty much irrelevant compared to everyone else on VGJ's team. KOTL had more farm than him, and with how badly Fnatic got outdrafted, VGJ could've won 4v5 at that point. | ||
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Geisterkarle
Germany3257 Posts
// ah, was DJ not pie! | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 18:02 Ramiz1989 wrote: Sneyking was Beastmaster last game, was 1-7 and pretty much irrelevant compared to everyone else on VGJ's team. KOTL had more farm than him, and with how badly Fnatic got outdrafted, VGJ could've won 4v5 at that point. VGJ.Storm, in this lineup, actually plays around Sneyking's initiation. KOTL was simply given farm priority. | ||
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
On May 12 2018 18:06 Taf the Ghost wrote: VGJ.Storm, in this lineup, actually plays around Sneyking's initiation. KOTL was simply given farm priority. But there was no initiation, Beastmaster was farming Necronomicon level 2 and split pushing, hence the reason he had 1-7, and they won the game in other lanes, they completely destroyed Fnatic without Sneyking, and Fnatic's lineup only stood a chance in the early-mid game. | ||
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arghyad1
India243 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 18:18 arghyad1 wrote: VGJ.Storm on the verge of 2-0 vs Fnatic. That supp duo of rubik n bh; zero damage. Fnatic lost laning phase because of that n now Reso is a beast. Morph is also one of Reso's signature heroes. | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
VGJ.Storm has a real chance to win this LAN. | ||
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nojok
France15845 Posts
I hope they'll calm down with the patches before TI, give the pros at least one and a half month without a patch before TI. | ||
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550
418 Posts
im gonna bet this is about Meta tho keen just didnt face Wisp/KotL/Furion/Veno yet its a deathball-ish patch where first few engagements can decide very skewed results, with very difficult comebacks i liked back and forth dota the most, and... i think tihs is the most Deathballish patch without too much of 322 chance.. not saying VGJS will win over Keen, but what i think will happen is the first 15 mins will define the whole game very much... still standing by my opinion that MORPH is ridiculous, WISP also extremely OP to teams that know how to play them, i think that IO has the best winrate for teams that knows how to play it like the very best winrate | ||
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arghyad1
India243 Posts
I would honestly love to blame this on the patch release, but after watching the teams play, the losses just came coz the favorites got outplayed in areas that hardly involved any new mechanics (atleast EG & Fnatic, didn't watch Secret series). Overconfidence may be. | ||
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MrCon
France29748 Posts
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goody153
44127 Posts
Now this is a minor | ||
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
On May 12 2018 18:35 arghyad1 wrote: VGJ.Storm vs Keen in the finals of an 8 team tournament that had EG, Secret and Fnatic. :-O I would honestly love to blame this on the patch release, but after watching the teams play, the losses just came coz the favorites got outplayed in areas that hardly involved any new mechanics (atleast EG & Fnatic, didn't watch Secret series). Overconfidence may be. Indeed. People can say whatever they want, but all the teams that have lost just played worse than the team they were facing. | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 18:49 Ramiz1989 wrote: Indeed. People can say whatever they want, but all the teams that have lost just played worse than the team they were facing. https://www.google.com/maps/place/Bangkok International Trade & Exhibition Centre/@13.6717354,100.6098758,14.75z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x30e2a00e14cd4c93:0xfa656177eddbb2b1!8m2!3d13.669908!4d100.610031 I'm rolling with, "they were all probably out partying too much". | ||
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 19:36 Ramiz1989 wrote: I mean it could be the truth really. But people have to realize that teams can have a bad day or bad game. I mean Virtus.Pro lost to FlyToMoon just a week ago, not to take anything away from FTM they actually play amazing dota when in their comfort zone, but if people told me that FTM is going to beat VP with 2-0 score I would say that chances of that happening are quite low. FTM tossed out their best Dota against VP while also setting the meta. Those types of tournaments happen. Here, we have 3 DPC teams with several players not quite on point and wonky drafts over multiple teams. Either the Meta shifted massively or everyone was partying too hard. I favor the partying angle, though it's not impossible it's just a meta shift weekend. | ||
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nothingmuch
448 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
Look at that, VGJ.Storm first ban Doom, haha. | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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Wineandbread
United States2065 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
We're digging deep for the funny stats. | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
On May 12 2018 21:04 Taf the Ghost wrote: VGJ.Storm seems to have found the right bans against Keen. This could end up 3-0 Storm. Finals are Bo3 afaik, and to me this looks over already. KG have no good answers to Morph and Visage supported by Abaddon. | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 21:18 Ramiz1989 wrote: Finals are Bo3 afaik, and to me this looks over already. KG have no good answers to Morph and Visage supported by Abaddon. Good point on the Bo3. Yeah, Storm is just going to out carry this to a LAN victory. Keen's ability to activate their carry's hero pool is limited because he has a limited pool. | ||
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Furikawari
France2522 Posts
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550
418 Posts
is this the 2 previous patches maturing (after optic showed us) | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On May 12 2018 21:33 550 wrote: does all the patch clouds us from the menace that Visage n Morph is is this the 2 previous patches maturing (after optic showed us) Morph was winning as a first phase at the recent Major, and Visage is only limited because only a few can play it. | ||
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Furikawari
France2522 Posts
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Spicy_Curry
United States10573 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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BlazingGlory
Bulgaria854 Posts
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OmniEulogy
Canada6592 Posts
 Happy for them and for Keen making the finals as well. | ||
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550
418 Posts
On May 12 2018 20:35 nojok wrote: Those kind of games are the worst, it's over 20 minutes before the throne falls but it takes ages to play out. we'll see if this continues to be the trend much less back n forth games is what i see.. a few weeks ago i rly loved watching that SEA patch LUL but i duno. | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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arghyad1
India243 Posts
Now, if EG beats big teams in last 2 majors and still loses out on invite, I think NA has made a pretty big statement to get 3 Qualification spots for TI just based on their recent performance leading up to the event (Considering Optic also miss invite). Also, hoping for VGJ.Storm vs OG at ESL. It will be fun to watch. | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
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550
418 Posts
most lineups run out of damage very easily against these heroes.. visage.. morph with a spare salve/urn charge (morphing to 1 str and healing) teams need to abuse this things more it makes for certain, almost guaranteed wins LGD also won their morph game.. miracle was 51+ something / 0 on morph before their meeting LGD doom + losing early game | ||
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plasmidghost
Belgium16168 Posts
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maze.
Germany1392 Posts
For those who haven't seen it, MSS on how he became a pro gamer from the Frankfurt Major. www.youtube.com | ||
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Kelefei2016
Papua New Guinea504 Posts
Liquid VP Mineski LGD were not in the event. Fnatic juz a merely tier 1-2 team in SEA Keen Gaming is like tier ... in China Dota Secret performance recently is worse than tier 2 team. | ||
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Vertical
Indonesia4317 Posts
On May 13 2018 13:35 Kelefei2016 wrote: This is juz a tier 2 event. Liquid VP Mineski LGD were not in the event. Fnatic juz a merely tier 1-2 team in SEA Keen Gaming is like tier ... in China Dota Secret performance recently is worse than tier 2 team. which means NA is a solid area with handful of tier 2 team right now, hence justifying more spots for them, but not yet direct invite. merge SA with NA and we're all set. SA spot could one of the non-EG-NA team or FTM / Na'Vi or some other randomly performing Chinese team. I don't feel TNC deserve any special treatment, they achieve nothing besides some upsets. | ||
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