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On June 30 2013 22:37 Kipsate wrote:
Consider that the Chinese have CEDC, a place where the best players in the goddamn world play their pubs
Did you just draw conclusions out of an All-star fucking tournament where teams do not actually participate with their full roster? I am sorry but that is a bit ridicilous.
And you still haven't answered the question whether Korea will stomp 80-90% of the games in S3 championships, against iG, OMG and WE? Are you serious? Entus just roster shuffled too.
Games between top players are never fully stomps. Even in SC 2 this is the case - ie Flash didn't stomp Stephano and I don't think he's going to just because the mechanics of the game won't let him. There is a skill ceiling in the early game in a lot of these games, a ceiling that is within the reach of every top player, and therefore won't allow one region to simply destroy another. However, the later the game goes, the greater the effect skill has, and when it comes to win rate, I do think Koreans are going to stomp through S3. The teams you brought up won't be able to stop them.
In case I'm wrong about S3, and you're correct, then I'm going to have to go back to the drawing board about what makes a region successful in eSports. But in case I'm correct, then that furthers what I've said.
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Netherlands45349 Posts
You still haven't answered why do you think Koreans will stomp China based around their actual play because looking at how they play right now it seems very unlikely. Isn't the best measure of how good a region is by their......play?
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On June 30 2013 22:50 Kipsate wrote:
You still haven't answered why do you think Koreans will stomp China based around their actual play because looking at how they play right now it seems very unlikely. Isn't the best measure of how good a region is by their......play?
Because it isn't easy to see differences in skill between regions when they're only playing against each other. A lot of mistakes in these games are forced and not visible to viewers.
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Netherlands45349 Posts
But people still do draw conclusions about it, that is why Asia is seen as the stronger region in general in Dota and at TI2 it did turn out that way too. NA LCS is seen as the weakest LCS by far, but they almost never if ever play other regions. Yet people can still confidently say that NA LCS is the worst out of all regions. Why is that then?
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On June 30 2013 22:54 Kipsate wrote:
But people still do draw conclusions about it, that is why Asia is seen as the stronger region in general in Dota and at TI2 it did turn out that way too.
I don't know why you think this because a lot of people wrote Asia off in TI 2 because they played pretty terrible in those online matches we saw before TI 2. Then they came and stomped.
Same with people writing off the West in G-1, then Alliance went and stomped.
It just isn't easy to see how well the regions match up from their internal games alone, barring obvious mistakes and bad play. A lot of the difference comes down to decision making, positioning, etc. which the average viewer isn't able to see.
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its ok, azarkon is just remembering the conclusions he drew before ti2 and is overcompensating
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Netherlands45349 Posts
They wrote them off based on Online matches with 400 ping-.-, anyone drawing conclusions from that is just not thinking well enough(did anyone really think CLG were going to be the TI2 champions)?. Asia will once again be the favourite going into TI3 with the exception of Alliance/Na'vi, yet the scenes rarely if ever meet. They do so because people look at the teams that play and how they play and in China iG/OMG/WE look at similair levels as the Korean teams(with Koreans having an edge).
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Korea (South)11232 Posts
China is the second strongest region in LoL. Korea is right now the best but the chinese teams improved a lot in particular teams which were not known (OMG). In my opinion China will be a good enemy for Korea in LoL in the future. Since they play alot on the korean server and scrim each other sometimes.
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Sanya12364 Posts
On June 30 2013 22:59 Kupon3ss wrote:
its ok, azarkon is just remembering the conclusions he drew before ti2 and is overcompensating
At least he's learning. It's cute.
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On June 30 2013 23:00 Kipsate wrote:
They wrote them off based on Online matches with 400 ping-.-, anyone drawing conclusions from that is just not thinking well enough. Asia will once again be the favourite going into TI3 with the exception of Alliance/Na'vi, yet the scenes rarely if ever meet. They do so because people look at the teams that play and how they play and in China iG/OMG/WE look at similair levels as the Korean teams(with Koreans having a slight edge).
All they need is a slight edge. I think in SC 2 their edge isn't that big, yet it is enough to give them a 80%+ win rate in tournaments.
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Netherlands45349 Posts
Koreans have a slight edge in SC2 and not a big edge but its slight enough to give them 80% winrate
Oke Azarkon I give up, I can't argue with that flawless logic.
On June 30 2013 23:07 evilfatsh1t wrote:
strong derailing of the thread i must say. as for the results, not surprised. in the end the top 3 prizes will be split between fxo,eot and birdgang, with birdgang being the 1st place winners. calling it now
back on topic, birdgang is an awesome name.
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strong derailing of the thread i must say. as for the results, not surprised. in the end the top 3 prizes will be split between fxo,eot and birdgang, with birdgang being the 1st place winners. calling it now
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Sanya12364 Posts
I think FXOpen going to Ti3 as spectators.
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On June 30 2013 23:05 Kipsate wrote:
Koreans have a slight edge in SC2 and not a big edge
Oke Azarkon I give up, I can't argue with that flawless logic.
SC 2 is an easier game than BW, and the West is better in it. Koreans therefore need their best players to take Western tournaments, and not B teamers which was the case in BW. A Western tournament that doesn't involve the best of Korea is fully capable of going to the West. Hell, even their best players are capable of being upset - ie Life by Snute. You have to admit that the West is a lot better in SC 2 than it was in BW, in the same way that the West is a lot better in Dota 2 than it was in Dota 1.
However, all you need is a small edge to come out ahead in the bulk of games - a better decision here, a faster reaction there, etc. It doesn't take a lot for a small difference in skill to compound in these sorts of games where advantages early game are cascaded down the process. Thus, even though Koreans don't have a huge edge in SC 2, their results remain lopsided - 95+% of MLGs have been taken by Koreans, and so on so forth.
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Sanya12364 Posts
On June 30 2013 23:12 Azarkon wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2013 23:05 Kipsate wrote:
Koreans have a slight edge in SC2 and not a big edge
Oke Azarkon I give up, I can't argue with that flawless logic. SC 2 is an easier game than BW, and the West is better in it. Koreans therefore need their best players to take Western tournaments, and not B teamers which was the case in BW. A Western tournament that doesn't involve the best of Korea is fully capable of going to the West. Hell, even their best players are capable of being upset - ie Life by Snute. You have to admit that the West is a lot better in SC 2 than it was in BW, in the same way that the West is a lot better in Dota 2 than it was in Dota 1. However, all you need is a small edge to come out ahead in the bulk of games - a better decision here, a faster reaction there, etc. It doesn't take a lot for a small difference in skill to compound in these sorts of games where advantages early game are cascaded down the process. Thus, even though Koreans don't have a huge edge in SC 2, their results remain lopsided - 95+% of MLGs have been taken by Koreans, and so on so forth.
Clearly LoL has the same skill ceiling as SC2 AND China and Taipei skill gap is just like Korea - EU in SC2.
Clearly fully substantiated.
Very cute, Kipsate!! Must not question Azarkon logic!!!
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On June 30 2013 23:26 TanGeng wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2013 23:12 Azarkon wrote:On June 30 2013 23:05 Kipsate wrote:
Koreans have a slight edge in SC2 and not a big edge
Oke Azarkon I give up, I can't argue with that flawless logic. SC 2 is an easier game than BW, and the West is better in it. Koreans therefore need their best players to take Western tournaments, and not B teamers which was the case in BW. A Western tournament that doesn't involve the best of Korea is fully capable of going to the West. Hell, even their best players are capable of being upset - ie Life by Snute. You have to admit that the West is a lot better in SC 2 than it was in BW, in the same way that the West is a lot better in Dota 2 than it was in Dota 1. However, all you need is a small edge to come out ahead in the bulk of games - a better decision here, a faster reaction there, etc. It doesn't take a lot for a small difference in skill to compound in these sorts of games where advantages early game are cascaded down the process. Thus, even though Koreans don't have a huge edge in SC 2, their results remain lopsided - 95+% of MLGs have been taken by Koreans, and so on so forth. Clearly LoL has the same skill ceiling as SC2 AND China and Taipei skill gap is just like Korea - EU in SC2. Clearly fully substantiated. Very cute, Kipsate!! Must not question Azarkon logic!!!
Nothing's ever fully substantiated when it comes to calling the future. Yet what's the use of calling things after they happen?
But let's stop derailing this thread.
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Sanya12364 Posts
On June 30 2013 23:30 Azarkon wrote:
Nothing's ever fully substantiated when it comes to calling the future. Yet what's the use of calling things after they happen?
But let's stop derailing this thread.
Very nice, Azarkon!
Good dodge!
Excellent on the fly thinking!
Azarkon #1
Also Azarkon clearly #savingstrats
Super next level.
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On June 30 2013 23:37 TanGeng wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2013 23:30 Azarkon wrote:
Nothing's ever fully substantiated when it comes to calling the future. Yet what's the use of calling things after they happen?
But let's stop derailing this thread. Very nice, Azarkon! Good dodge! Excellent on the fly thinking! Azarkon #1 Also Azarkon clearly #savingstrats Super next level.
Sarcasm doesn't suit you, just sayin'. 
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United Kingdom24425 Posts
Is every thread about the Nexon league going to be like this?
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There's no content at the moment so what else are you going to talk about other than how Korea is going to do vs. the rest of the world in Dota?
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EPT
