EPTClearly you don't want to discuss but to impose your vision. Why should I talk to you?
[Hero] Nyx Assassin - Page 4
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Verrou
France193 Posts
Clearly you don't want to discuss but to impose your vision. Why should I talk to you? | ||
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hariooo
Canada2830 Posts
Anyway Glimmer cape over force staff? At least for now people really underrate the MR. Seems a more reliable save | ||
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Fencar
United States2694 Posts
Vs Skywrath mage or something maybe it works. But force still works really really well against that hero, maybe vs a Lion or something idk. | ||
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hariooo
Canada2830 Posts
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RebirthOfLeGenD
USA5860 Posts
On May 11 2015 05:06 Bacillus wrote: Completely out of theorycrafting, do you think there are situational cases where you'd want to go midas on nyx in some games? Nyx isn't exactly a good farming hero, but both Aghs and OctCore seem pretty decent uses for extra gold floating around. Basically can you skip some of the utility items you sometimes build, remain relevant while midasing around and then spend the extra gold to keep yourself strong late game? Sure why not. Levels are amazing on nyx and his farming sucks. If you are offlaning think of him as something similar to a phoenix. I'd imagine its situational though. I wouldn't go it every game, but if I find myself with a huge sum of money after a team fight like 1500 I will probably buy the recipe for midas, if I end up jumping from like 1k to 2.3k I'd think if my teams needs my blink initiation this moment, or if I can get a midas and delay my blink by 5 minutes. | ||
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RebirthOfLeGenD
USA5860 Posts
On May 11 2015 12:37 hariooo wrote: buying aghs does not prevent you from buy oct core afterwards. it's not relevant we're talking about late-game scythe vs oct core you're expecting people to buy into the premise that people think butterfly is ever viable on nyx to support the argument that oct core is similarly useless. you're comparing the usefulness of butterfly on a hero that never autoattacks to the usefulness of having 3 active skills that can control fights up 33% more often. either you're really bad or you think the rest of the thread is bad enough to humour that stupid comparison The Oct core is retarded on nyx. Blink hex into impale is 6 seconds of disable. Getting a sheep lets you kill the enemy carry before they can bkb respond because it has a 0 cast point. And get off his bfly comparison. He was simply saying that he thinks its about as useful as bfly for a bit of hyperbole to illustrate that he thinks its vastly inferior to sheep, which he is right about. On May 12 2015 06:45 Fencar wrote: Well vs an Ursa you're not going to be saved by glimmer, or save teammates, so I think force seems more reliable vs melee carries at least, other than maybe PL. Vs Skywrath mage or something maybe it works. But force still works really really well against that hero, maybe vs a Lion or something idk. Glimmer is great to save because most cores aren't carrying around dust, and it stresses the support. Yeah, glimmer won't save you IF the ursa can see you, but that's a big if. On May 12 2015 05:36 hariooo wrote: "Octarine has its uses on Nyx like Butterfly has its uses on Nyx." Butterfly has literally zero uses on Nyx. Therefore the above statement implies that Octarine has zero uses. If you intended a different meaning then it just means your English isn't great. He's an agi hero, you get to right click people and get more survivability. It just doesn't work the way you usually play nyx, but if you felt like building him like an agi carry I'm sure he would carry about as hard as a venge can, in a sub optimal, but possible way. | ||
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DucK-
Singapore11447 Posts
How can anyone defend butterfly on nyx. DPS nyx? There is no reason to attempt DPS nyx unless you're trolling. Even if my team desperately need a carry, I would never go that route. | ||
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Aquanim
Australia2849 Posts
Octcore I could conceivably build but it would be in the same super-situational bucket as stuff like linkens, lotus, bloodstone (for the team heal on death and lower respawn), abyssal (if I really, really badly needed bkb-piercing disable), diffusal (for omni/warlock or something), necrobook or AC for push, etc. I see next to no circumstances in which I would prefer octcore to hex, and very few nyx games in which I would accumulate another 5k gold and not have something better to do with it. (EDIT: I don't claim all of the above items are of anything like equal value, or even that they're all better in general than octcore. I don't even claim they're all viable, I don't see myself going Assault Cuirass Nyx any time soon.) Even if you get off another stun, another burn or two, etc. which you wouldn't have got otherwise in a long fight, many fights are decided by who gets blown up in the first few moments and a sheep is far better in that circumstance. | ||
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hariooo
Canada2830 Posts
But if you're facing a Medusa and your own core is a Luna or something with no mobility to follow up, I'm not sure why you would take that 6 second disable, maybe 3 of which will actually facilitate damage, over a 3s Mana Burn which is insane support dps against a stacked Medusa. And lol you're going to suggest Nyx can carry as hard as Venge? She has a ranged attack, a steroid, -armor, and a pseudo blink. Congrats on a worse comparison than OctCore Butterfly. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
The only use I can see for Butterfly is that if you went Dagon5 EBlade, it's probably the best way to add EBlade damage while rolling in an auxiliary lategame stat (Evasion)--and that's still largely a joke usage because getting an item to add EBlade damage over one that actually does something is only for when you're really ahead. Making any sort of DPS transition on Nyx is just playing around. On May 12 2015 06:35 hariooo wrote: Glimmer cape over force staff? At least for now people really underrate the MR. Seems a more reliable save The biggest issue with Glimmer is that until quite late, Nyx's mana is really tight, especially if you really want to make full use of Mana Burn's low CD (it's somewhat more sustainable if you're in a Carapace-second game). 130 mana is really hard to use without running out of mana. Also, IIRC you can Force Staff yourself while burrowed to reposition without leaving burrow--at least I don't recall that being fixed yet. | ||
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Thetwinmasters
3578 Posts
On May 12 2015 23:13 TheYango wrote: The better comparison is Broodmother, who is also a melee Agi hero that has equally poor Agi growth and lack of engagement skills beyond invisibility. However, Broodmother has Insatiable Hunter to back up her lategame DPS ability as well as a powerful manfighting passive and VASTLY better farming ability--and her physical damage lategame is STILL highly suspect in comparison to specialized item selection toward other goals. The only use I can see for Butterfly is that if you went Dagon5 EBlade, it's probably the best way to add EBlade damage while rolling in an auxiliary lategame stat (Evasion)--and that's still largely a joke usage because getting an item to add EBlade damage over one that actually does something is only for when you're really ahead. Making any sort of DPS transition on Nyx is just playing around. The biggest issue with Glimmer is that until quite late, Nyx's mana is really tight, especially if you really want to make full use of Mana Burn's low CD (it's somewhat more sustainable if you're in a Carapace-second game). 130 mana is really hard to use without running out of mana. Also, IIRC you can Force Staff yourself while burrowed to reposition without leaving burrow--at least I don't recall that being fixed yet. Nyx burrow is considered a ensnare so being able to force staff is correct | ||
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Aquanim
Australia2849 Posts
On May 12 2015 22:45 hariooo wrote: Of course the decision is made between burst and sustain... I'm not saying buy Oct Core against Weaver/Storm/whatever. But if you're facing a Medusa and your own core is a Luna or something with no mobility to follow up, I'm not sure why you would take that 6 second disable, maybe 3 of which will actually facilitate damage, over a 3s Mana Burn which is insane support dps against a stacked Medusa. ... Like I said, in a very specific situation (in this case, where sustain is all that matters) maybe I'd consider it. On the other hand, I'm not sure how as a Nyx Assassin I'm going to consistently stay in range of a many-slotted Medusa, and I still get a 4s Mana Burn even if I don't buy Octcore. I think I'd still be going sheep first for the supports or other cores in most situations. (I'm sure there's some combination of supports and cores where sheep won't help me against them as well... but that's starting to become a really narrow use case.) | ||
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hariooo
Canada2830 Posts
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ViZe
United States1513 Posts
The main thing is that you can use it to set up your stun, like on Jakiro, sf or Lina. It's really not that hard to dodge the nyx's stun if there is no setup - you just see where the nyx is facing when he starts the animation and juke away from that line. And unlike on those heroes nyx has an inbuilt deterrent from people disrupting the combo in spiked carapace. This also takes away that trade off you have to make when you're vendetta'd - either the damage or the stun. You can just hit the vendetta - Euls, and then stun every time. The mana regen is also pretty nice on the hero. Nyx generally has a hard time farming because he does not want to show on the map but also does not have the mana to use impale in the jungle. This makes using impale to farm a bit more doable. Euls also has good synergy with blink and there are the other cool things that you can do with the item I also think that there is a pretty significant amount of untapped potential with the aghs upgrade. Euls can be used to set up a burrow into the carapace, for example. Force staff also works on the burrowed nyx so in really clowny situations you can burrow and be force staffed into the enemy team for an aoe carapace stun. The regen while burrowed makes the hero surprisingly tanky so just focusing him while carapace is down is not as simple as it may seem I think this hero, if people can find a way to lane it that actually works, can be pretty good, especially against the current cast of popular heroes with latent aoe abilities like gyro, Lesh, and ember. He also does pretty well against Lina because he can always just tank her stun with carapace. Overall i think the old style of Dagon etc is pretty gimmicky and utility builds with blink/Euls/force/aghs/hex are very effective Any thoughts? | ||
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DucK-
Singapore11447 Posts
Personally I don't see a need for eul to setup stun, because both vendetta and blink are pretty reliable in landing your stun. | ||
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wxyLkz
210 Posts
but to land the stun I don't see it really that necessary | ||
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Orome
Switzerland11984 Posts
On September 07 2015 11:07 DucK- wrote: Dagon builds are best in pubs though, since you can feed of the squishy heroes. However what's important is that you don't neglect your blink. I've see many upgrade their Dagon so much and become useless once enemy groups up or sentry everywhere. Personally I don't see a need for eul to setup stun, because both vendetta and blink are pretty reliable in landing your stun. blink aghs is actually pretty good in pubs too because noone has a clue on what to do against it | ||
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evanthebouncy!
United States12796 Posts
On September 08 2015 10:20 Orome wrote: blink aghs is actually pretty good in pubs too because noone has a clue on what to do against it can you blink after you burrow?! | ||
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Orome
Switzerland11984 Posts
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evanthebouncy!
United States12796 Posts
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