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General Discussion - Page 159

Forum Index > Dota 2 General
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IRC chatter should remain in IRC - http://webchat.quakenet.org/?channels=tl.dota2

Posts that relate to topics with their own thread, such as in News, Tournaments or Strategy should go in those threads.
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-28 22:05:04
February 28 2012 22:04 GMT
#3161
On February 29 2012 06:56 Kipsate wrote:
I dislike the fact that BH pretty much needs good midgame(good ganks/kills) in order to transition into a good carry, he is also fairly squishy I feel and has no real survivability outside of his regular stealth and 20% track speed(which admittedly is fast but its not a real escape). If he gets a few good ganks, he can snowball VERY fast(and provide gold for his supports, which is not to be underestimated at all) but I feel like he is a bit unreliable.

The main thing about Bounty Hunter is that you just have to be patient. You really just need one good opportunity to find your tempo, and from there just keep control of the game. Even in a hard lane, where you get almost no CS, you just need those early levels, and to slowly be able to work towards Boots/Janggo/Wand--and just be calm knowing that you just need to have a good eye for opportunities. Buy small items as you can and slowly build up your fighting power.


Starting from ~45 minutes is an FPVOD of YYF's Bounty Hunter (commentated by 2009 in Chinese as well). His early game is pretty rough--he doesn't hit level 6 until about 10 minutes. But the defining characteristic of his play is his patience. He doesn't rush to force things to happen--he just cleans up some gold and XP where he can and bides his time, siezing opportunities slowly where he can.

When it comes to teamfights, Track is just a monstrously strong skill for building the gold differential. You can 3-for-3 evenly with the other team, and so long as you have a good eye and Track targets before they die, your team can come out ~2k gold ahead from Track assist gold.
Moderator
Kipsate
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Netherlands45349 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-28 22:09:16
February 28 2012 22:08 GMT
#3162
Yeah Janggo on BH is a really good item, well on any hero really, I also like medallion on him.
WriterXiao8~~
igotmyown
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States4291 Posts
February 28 2012 22:12 GMT
#3163
On February 29 2012 06:53 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 28 2012 22:23 rabidch wrote:
panda vs dk, first big chinese game with 6.73 changes. axe and treant in picks/bans , quite funny

games are over.


+ Show Spoiler +
wont talk much about it but here's the streams, in usual terrible chinese quality, from gg.net
http://media.17173.com/dota/g1/live.shtml (chinese ppva)

russian restreams
http://www.own3d.tv/Blond
http://www.twitch.tv/avatarofme

Picks game 1 were so weird...

Lycan, DK, and ES not banned or picked. DK let Panda get CK+Bat as 2nd pick, and then took Axe in the first round of picks.

EDIT: Lycan, Bat, and CK get through bans game 2 as well. Hmm...


Teams tend to be very afraid of new heroes until they figure out how to play against them. The imbalance you know as opposed to the imbalance you don't.
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-28 22:17:15
February 28 2012 22:17 GMT
#3164
On February 29 2012 07:12 igotmyown wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 29 2012 06:53 TheYango wrote:
On February 28 2012 22:23 rabidch wrote:
panda vs dk, first big chinese game with 6.73 changes. axe and treant in picks/bans , quite funny

games are over.


+ Show Spoiler +
wont talk much about it but here's the streams, in usual terrible chinese quality, from gg.net
http://media.17173.com/dota/g1/live.shtml (chinese ppva)

russian restreams
http://www.own3d.tv/Blond
http://www.twitch.tv/avatarofme

Picks game 1 were so weird...

Lycan, DK, and ES not banned or picked. DK let Panda get CK+Bat as 2nd pick, and then took Axe in the first round of picks.

EDIT: Lycan, Bat, and CK get through bans game 2 as well. Hmm...


Teams tend to be very afraid of new heroes until they figure out how to play against them. The imbalance you know as opposed to the imbalance you don't.

The bans weren't any new or drastically changed heroes though. They're heroes Panda knows DK is good at playing (and vice versa)--it's just they chose not to ban Bat/CK/Lycan.
Moderator
rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-28 22:25:47
February 28 2012 22:25 GMT
#3165
On February 29 2012 07:17 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 29 2012 07:12 igotmyown wrote:
On February 29 2012 06:53 TheYango wrote:
On February 28 2012 22:23 rabidch wrote:
panda vs dk, first big chinese game with 6.73 changes. axe and treant in picks/bans , quite funny

games are over.


+ Show Spoiler +
wont talk much about it but here's the streams, in usual terrible chinese quality, from gg.net
http://media.17173.com/dota/g1/live.shtml (chinese ppva)

russian restreams
http://www.own3d.tv/Blond
http://www.twitch.tv/avatarofme

Picks game 1 were so weird...

Lycan, DK, and ES not banned or picked. DK let Panda get CK+Bat as 2nd pick, and then took Axe in the first round of picks.

EDIT: Lycan, Bat, and CK get through bans game 2 as well. Hmm...


Teams tend to be very afraid of new heroes until they figure out how to play against them. The imbalance you know as opposed to the imbalance you don't.

The bans weren't any new or drastically changed heroes though. They're heroes Panda knows DK is good at playing (and vice versa)--it's just they chose not to ban Bat/CK/Lycan.

they're experimenting with new lane setups. warlock/axe seems to be the new transition meta with axe (not to mention very good neutralization of a dark seer lane and ultimates in game 1), Panda didnt play so well in game 1 with rosh choke and game 2 with that awful start.
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
flamewheel
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
FREEAGLELAND26782 Posts
February 29 2012 00:41 GMT
#3166
Drums on Bounty Hunger is so great. With Phase, Drums, and Track you can outspeed a sprinting Slardar or a Windwalking Clinkz.
Writerdamn, i was two days from retirement
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
February 29 2012 00:43 GMT
#3167
On February 29 2012 09:41 flamewheel wrote:
Drums on Bounty Hunger is so great. With Phase, Drums, and Track you can outspeed a sprinting Slardar or a Windwalking Clinkz.

By "outspeed" you mean both of you are running at 522 MS?
Moderator
Durak
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
Canada3685 Posts
February 29 2012 00:56 GMT
#3168
On February 29 2012 09:41 flamewheel wrote:
Drums on Bounty Hunger is so great. With Phase, Drums, and Track you can outspeed a sprinting Slardar or a Windwalking Clinkz.

Or you man up and go treads, armlet, and medallion.
flamewheel
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
FREEAGLELAND26782 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-29 01:02:01
February 29 2012 01:00 GMT
#3169
No, I do not.

Slardar and Clinkz with Power Treads both move at 360 movespeed. With the 44% bonus from Sprint/Windwalk that's 518. Bounty Hunter with Phase Boots moves at a base of 375, and the bonuses from Track, Drums, and Phase add up to 41%, which puts you over 522 (actually 528.75). So when I say outspeed, I literally mean outspeed.

Edit: wrong percentages for Slardar. Sprint level 4 is 40%, which means for a speed of 504. Same point stands.
Writerdamn, i was two days from retirement
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
February 29 2012 01:05 GMT
#3170
On February 29 2012 10:00 flamewheel wrote:
No, I do not.

Slardar and Clinkz with Power Treads both move at 360 movespeed. With the 44% bonus from Sprint/Windwalk that's 518. Bounty Hunter with Phase Boots moves at a base of 375, and the bonuses from Track, Drums, and Phase add up to 41%, which puts you over 522 (actually 528.75). So when I say outspeed, I literally mean outspeed.

Edit: wrong percentages for Slardar. Sprint level 4 is 40%, which means for a speed of 504. Same point stands.

Both of those hit the cap of 522 if they (or anyone in their immediate vicinity) has the Janggo aura.

Plus, don't people get Treads on BH anyway?
Moderator
flamewheel
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
FREEAGLELAND26782 Posts
February 29 2012 01:09 GMT
#3171
Treads are more common, yes. I'm just simply pointing out the ludicrous speed bonuses you can get as Bounty Hunter. Watching Bulba scrim a few weeks ago as BH was simply hilarious--never get caught, ever.
Writerdamn, i was two days from retirement
Kznn
Profile Joined March 2011
Brazil9072 Posts
February 29 2012 01:15 GMT
#3172
phase is great on BH
good point, fw. will try that build latter tonight.
Durak
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
Canada3685 Posts
February 29 2012 01:20 GMT
#3173
Max movement speed is gay enough, let alone with invisiblity and true vision of your enemy.
Nevuk
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States16280 Posts
February 29 2012 01:24 GMT
#3174
Is steam down?
Meta
Profile Blog Joined June 2003
United States6228 Posts
February 29 2012 01:30 GMT
#3175
Down for me.
good vibes only
Kznn
Profile Joined March 2011
Brazil9072 Posts
February 29 2012 01:44 GMT
#3176
yup
eluv
Profile Joined August 2010
United States1251 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-02-29 05:44:41
February 29 2012 05:43 GMT
#3177
So I'm sure a lot of you saw the Na'Vi "Troll" CM build that Ars-Art did, where he got sange in a few competitive games, and even + Show Spoiler +
went up to SnY vs EG when they had a large lead. Now going up to SnY was probably over the top, but there are many good arguments for why the Sange makes sense.
With that in mind, I was wondering about the possibility of going up to Heaven's Halberd once you've got the Sange.

It still makes sense for all the reasons the Sange does in terms of adding a lot of tankiness to generally squishy supports, and it adds a pretty solid disable. Obviously it's not a sheepstick, but it has the great benefit of having, on average, much cheaper pieces, and as mentioned before giving a lot of HP, in addition to the evasion.
"Yes I fucked my way to the GSL partnership" - Sundance
LAN-f34r
Profile Joined December 2010
New Zealand2099 Posts
February 29 2012 06:20 GMT
#3178
That was what I thought the sange was for when i saw those games, until i realised it was tourny version and it wasn't in yet :S
The only barrier to truth is the presumption that you already have it. It's through our pane (pain) we window (win though).
5-s
Profile Joined June 2010
United States1674 Posts
February 29 2012 07:02 GMT
#3179
On February 29 2012 14:43 eluv wrote:
So I'm sure a lot of you saw the Na'Vi "Troll" CM build that Ars-Art did, where he got sange in a few competitive games, and even + Show Spoiler +
went up to SnY vs EG when they had a large lead. Now going up to SnY was probably over the top, but there are many good arguments for why the Sange makes sense.
With that in mind, I was wondering about the possibility of going up to Heaven's Halberd once you've got the Sange.

It still makes sense for all the reasons the Sange does in terms of adding a lot of tankiness to generally squishy supports, and it adds a pretty solid disable. Obviously it's not a sheepstick, but it has the great benefit of having, on average, much cheaper pieces, and as mentioned before giving a lot of HP, in addition to the evasion.

Like you said, it's a troll item. BKB counters it, and pretty much every other item is more cost effective for survivability for supports.
I liked Dota before it was Mainstream.
flamewheel
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
FREEAGLELAND26782 Posts
February 29 2012 07:21 GMT
#3180
Wait I don't ever get SnY but why do some people say it goes through BKB then?
Writerdamn, i was two days from retirement
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