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let all the trolling posts aside (most of which i found funny even a famous progamer's post)
i really hope these trolling posts do not cause more damage to an already bad situation. that would be my concern. i hate to make such a generalized statement on korean society but yeah i hope no one commits suicide out of shame or anything. i hope it just doesn't get worse.
the kid needs to be assured everything is fine...particularly his family and friends. this situation is completely not his fault and shold not be labeled as anythin besides a kid that was trying to be a progamer.
i'm afraid most for gundam....i hate to be liberal but i wonder why in societies its not ok to be gay. chris rock said it best that in a few years we may look back on our discrimination against homosexuals the same way we look back at racial prejudice 30-40 years ago. seems downright silly to me.
but what he did was wrong...and messed up. but if he grew up in a more accepting open society such a situation would have never arisen.
thats my ramble.
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Korea (South)1897 Posts
On October 26 2010 15:41 Zona wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2010 00:59 MightyAtom wrote:
So the fact that this kid comes out and says it, the way Korean society works is, this kid has to be telling the truth, you just can't lie or exaggerate something like in Korea society, its so damaging and a no win situation on both sides, you can only say it if 100% its true; and why he says it in public post or whatever, I don't know except that I think he says it because, its not so much the molestation that is an issue (not that it isn't a major issue that starts it all), but it is simply a cry of desperation because he realizes that he just totally fucked up his life by joining this team and dropping out of high school (although I am sure his reaction was in a trauma/panic state); and so, he posts about it because his entire life seems to have no further options.
Now his life does have some options, we all know that, and he will be able to recover if he is mentally strong enough, but if the allegations were false, there would have been massive outrage and bashing from the weRRe clan, not people quiting. In Korea, it is a criminal offense to slander in public with the sentencing being jail, no shit, if you slander and have no grounds, even if you are an anonymous poster, the Korean federal cyber police will track you down, throw you in court and charge your ass. So it is extremely serious and you don't think that some of the people quiting may not have been molested as well and are really quitting because they don't want to have to address this question and just rather give an excuse they don't want to be associated with being gay? So there's no chance the allegations are false? Wow...
pretty much from a cultural stand point
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On October 24 2010 06:37 unbal3 wrote:
@ICanFlyLow I feel like that is out of line. The big issue here is NOT gundamwerra's sexuality, whether he is G/B/T/Q/Confused whatever. What is wrong here is the fact that he allegedly molested a minor.
1st time i read the OP, i thought the clan vice-leader made advances to some girl in the team. Then i got it.
The fact here is that added to him molesting a minor, even if the boy wasn't under 18 and this thing would have been just an advance/refuse deal, this would at least be unethical.
The same reason why a boss shouldn't screw his secretary or other employees. It's called conflict of interest.
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On October 26 2010 16:47 MightyAtom wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2010 15:41 Zona wrote:On October 26 2010 00:59 MightyAtom wrote:
So the fact that this kid comes out and says it, the way Korean society works is, this kid has to be telling the truth, you just can't lie or exaggerate something like in Korea society, its so damaging and a no win situation on both sides, you can only say it if 100% its true; and why he says it in public post or whatever, I don't know except that I think he says it because, its not so much the molestation that is an issue (not that it isn't a major issue that starts it all), but it is simply a cry of desperation because he realizes that he just totally fucked up his life by joining this team and dropping out of high school (although I am sure his reaction was in a trauma/panic state); and so, he posts about it because his entire life seems to have no further options.
Now his life does have some options, we all know that, and he will be able to recover if he is mentally strong enough, but if the allegations were false, there would have been massive outrage and bashing from the weRRe clan, not people quiting. In Korea, it is a criminal offense to slander in public with the sentencing being jail, no shit, if you slander and have no grounds, even if you are an anonymous poster, the Korean federal cyber police will track you down, throw you in court and charge your ass. So it is extremely serious and you don't think that some of the people quiting may not have been molested as well and are really quitting because they don't want to have to address this question and just rather give an excuse they don't want to be associated with being gay? So there's no chance the allegations are false? Wow... pretty much from a cultural stand point
mind you, japan also has extremely strict slander laws and internet police for the same reason that korea has them, and making false allegations with your true identity is seriously risky.
at the same time, the conviction rate in japan is nearly 100% -- so it's easily abused.
there are middle/high schoolers in japan that expose themselves and then demand money to keep their mouths shut.
i doubt the situation is as bad in korea, but it's probably worth noting that 15 year olds do lie, be they of whatever culture.
from experience i know that they tend to totally throw sexual stories out of proportion. they often just don't think about the consequences, and they feel guilty about it later when it's too late.
i do agree that being that this is korea it's slightly less likely that he's lying, but i wouldn't rule it out entirely just yet. we're extrapolating from a few blog posts, after all.
this is the kind of rumor that drives people in korea and japan to suicide -- especially if it turns out that it happens to be false.
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On October 25 2010 22:58 Originalien wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2010 22:53 kojinshugi wrote:On October 25 2010 22:49 Originalien wrote:
Gay people should fucking clue on to the fact that u come onto a straight person in such a manner, OF ANY AGE you are liable to get ur head punched in. Im not saying this is gay bashing, im saying , CONFIRM they are gay before making a move on them So do you confirm that women are straight before making a move on them? If not, it's perfectly fine for them to punch your head in? EXACTLY - YES IT IS FINE for a women to punch me in the head if i try and unbutton her pants without even asking. There is a process to getting to the point of taking of a womens pants, and it generally involves speaking to them 1st, Finding out if they like u 2nd, Kissing Them to see if they like you on that level 3rd, Then INVITING THEM to your house or what ever 4th. See there is quite a few steps to getting into anyones pants..... YES i do confirm there sexual oriention via CONVERSATION with set women before trying anything with them, its called CHATTING THEM UP
But you weren't saying gay men should ask if they're allowed to put their hands in the other person's pants, you were saying they need to confirm sexual orientation. You said "gays should damn well confirm they are gay before making a move".
This is a case of an adult sexually abusing a minor. Your loud all-caps ranting may seem like a suitable justification to make absurdly homophobic comments, but it's not. Equating gays with pedophiles and rapists is repugnant. Demanding that gays follow special orientation-confirming rules lest they insult straight people is also repugnant.
If you want to say that putting your hands in someone's pants without their consent is bad, then say that without the caveats.
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On October 26 2010 18:54 dump wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2010 16:47 MightyAtom wrote:On October 26 2010 15:41 Zona wrote:On October 26 2010 00:59 MightyAtom wrote:
So the fact that this kid comes out and says it, the way Korean society works is, this kid has to be telling the truth, you just can't lie or exaggerate something like in Korea society, its so damaging and a no win situation on both sides, you can only say it if 100% its true; and why he says it in public post or whatever, I don't know except that I think he says it because, its not so much the molestation that is an issue (not that it isn't a major issue that starts it all), but it is simply a cry of desperation because he realizes that he just totally fucked up his life by joining this team and dropping out of high school (although I am sure his reaction was in a trauma/panic state); and so, he posts about it because his entire life seems to have no further options.
Now his life does have some options, we all know that, and he will be able to recover if he is mentally strong enough, but if the allegations were false, there would have been massive outrage and bashing from the weRRe clan, not people quiting. In Korea, it is a criminal offense to slander in public with the sentencing being jail, no shit, if you slander and have no grounds, even if you are an anonymous poster, the Korean federal cyber police will track you down, throw you in court and charge your ass. So it is extremely serious and you don't think that some of the people quiting may not have been molested as well and are really quitting because they don't want to have to address this question and just rather give an excuse they don't want to be associated with being gay? So there's no chance the allegations are false? Wow... pretty much from a cultural stand point mind you, japan also has extremely strict slander laws and internet police for the same reason that korea has them, and making false allegations with your true identity is seriously risky. at the same time, the conviction rate in japan is nearly 100% -- so it's easily abused. there are middle/high schoolers in japan that expose themselves and then demand money to keep their mouths shut. i doubt the situation is as bad in korea, but it's probably worth noting that 15 year olds do lie, be they of whatever culture. from experience i know that they tend to totally throw sexual stories out of proportion. they often just don't think about the consequences, and they feel guilty about it later when it's too late. i do agree that being that this is korea it's slightly less likely that he's lying, but i wouldn't rule it out entirely just yet. we're extrapolating from a few blog posts, after all. this is the kind of rumor that drives people in korea and japan to suicide -- especially if it turns out that it happens to be false.
It has to be true , I dont think WeRRa would dispand due to some unconfirmed rumours.
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On October 26 2010 19:05 Kleinmuuhg wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2010 18:54 dump wrote:On October 26 2010 16:47 MightyAtom wrote:On October 26 2010 15:41 Zona wrote:On October 26 2010 00:59 MightyAtom wrote:
So the fact that this kid comes out and says it, the way Korean society works is, this kid has to be telling the truth, you just can't lie or exaggerate something like in Korea society, its so damaging and a no win situation on both sides, you can only say it if 100% its true; and why he says it in public post or whatever, I don't know except that I think he says it because, its not so much the molestation that is an issue (not that it isn't a major issue that starts it all), but it is simply a cry of desperation because he realizes that he just totally fucked up his life by joining this team and dropping out of high school (although I am sure his reaction was in a trauma/panic state); and so, he posts about it because his entire life seems to have no further options.
Now his life does have some options, we all know that, and he will be able to recover if he is mentally strong enough, but if the allegations were false, there would have been massive outrage and bashing from the weRRe clan, not people quiting. In Korea, it is a criminal offense to slander in public with the sentencing being jail, no shit, if you slander and have no grounds, even if you are an anonymous poster, the Korean federal cyber police will track you down, throw you in court and charge your ass. So it is extremely serious and you don't think that some of the people quiting may not have been molested as well and are really quitting because they don't want to have to address this question and just rather give an excuse they don't want to be associated with being gay? So there's no chance the allegations are false? Wow... pretty much from a cultural stand point mind you, japan also has extremely strict slander laws and internet police for the same reason that korea has them, and making false allegations with your true identity is seriously risky. at the same time, the conviction rate in japan is nearly 100% -- so it's easily abused. there are middle/high schoolers in japan that expose themselves and then demand money to keep their mouths shut. i doubt the situation is as bad in korea, but it's probably worth noting that 15 year olds do lie, be they of whatever culture. from experience i know that they tend to totally throw sexual stories out of proportion. they often just don't think about the consequences, and they feel guilty about it later when it's too late. i do agree that being that this is korea it's slightly less likely that he's lying, but i wouldn't rule it out entirely just yet. we're extrapolating from a few blog posts, after all. this is the kind of rumor that drives people in korea and japan to suicide -- especially if it turns out that it happens to be false. It has to be true , I dont think WeRRa would dispand due to some unconfirmed rumours.
i'm just speculating, but they might have agreed that it's the safest thing to do for the sake of the other members. they're public figures, after all.
i'm willing to bet that if they hadn't disbanded yet, we'd have trolls talking about how every member of werra is a paedophile.
seriously sucks, but it was probably the best move regardless of how much of the allegation is true.
forming or joining another starcraft team is at least marginally easier than shaking prejudism on the internet.
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For anyone who was interested in my 'gay is the new black' comment, some people really helped highlight it here.
1. Because we probably will look back in 20-30 years and go, wtf was all the gay prejudice about.
2. Because gay people have suffered all kinds of persecution (including lynching and brutal murder, i.e. Broke Back Mountain to drop that little bomb, doubt you've seen it mate) from haters, the government, the police, the army etc, similar to the old black issue.
3. Because 'black' is a fashionable colour, and suggests that gay is now popular or fashionable i.e. Queer eye and big brother house inmates, positive gay characters in dramas and movies etc...
Thusly, gay is the new black!
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Please go back to doing benzo's and listening to techno and worrying about whether your father will accept your life decisions now because your views and ideals are completely self absorbed " Gay is the new black " ......
When did u have to sit on the back of the bus??? When did u get lynched???
Am i surprised that you are self absorbed and want attention no...... Do you embaress other gay people by adhering to stereotypes. YES.
What does this get on the temporary ban-o-meter?
I don't know what benzo's are, I'm into DnB and alt rock like Florence and the Machine, just cos gay is the new black doesnt mean im completely self absorbed  . And that last bit said in wrong spelling and bad grammar that gays are self absorbed and want attention, and that gay stereotypes are embarrassing. Kids like you are the worst part of high school, self righteous uninformed opinionated nublet.
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man i was more shocked when i read that the 32year old manager lived with his mom i mean wtf?
has this been confirmed? I am not convinced as far as it has not been confirmed.
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On October 26 2010 20:44 Mawi wrote:
man i was more shocked when i read that the 32year old manager lived with his mom i mean wtf?
has this been confirmed? I am not convinced as far as it has not been confirmed.
I'm under the impression that many people in Korea don't move out but live in the same house from generation to generation.
It used to be like that in Europe too. Firstborn son gets the land/farm, daughters are married off to others.
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I really don't get why they disbanded, things like this happen often in various sports / clubs / teams etc. If proven guilty the offenders are dismissed (as well as being dealt with by the law) and the team carries on.
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Shocked, I asked him, "what are you doing?"
He answered, "Your fly was open, and I was afraid you would think I had opened it. So I was trying to zip it back up. Go back to sleep."
So I lied back down for about 10 minutes, then asked him if he was gay.
LOLOLOLOLOLOL
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I find it angering to think that all the hard work that these guys (Cella especially since i <3 his stream) put into their clan is now ruined because of one messed up MF'er.
Sad to hear, I hope they all can find their way back to good teams.
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On October 26 2010 20:48 kojinshugi wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2010 20:44 Mawi wrote:
man i was more shocked when i read that the 32year old manager lived with his mom i mean wtf?
has this been confirmed? I am not convinced as far as it has not been confirmed. I'm under the impression that many people in Korea don't move out but live in the same house from generation to generation. It used to be like that in Europe too. Firstborn son gets the land/farm, daughters are married off to others.
Still like that in many parts of India as well, it's not all that uncommon. Other cultures are often very different from your own, people.
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People saying that Gundam should die or they would kill him themselves are in my eyes about as bad a human being as he is. Actually worse. I hope that is just emotions running rampant.
This is not a rape which is a hundred times worse. This is a crime though and it is definitely serious.
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I've been in Clan WeRa before (the channel) Gundam.werra was like 2 people above me. I feel violated already.
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On October 26 2010 19:34 Eddie.Aus wrote:
For anyone who was interested in my 'gay is the new black' comment, some people really helped highlight it here.
1. Because we probably will look back in 20-30 years and go, wtf was all the gay prejudice about.
2. Because gay people have suffered all kinds of persecution (including lynching and brutal murder, i.e. Broke Back Mountain to drop that little bomb, doubt you've seen it mate) from haters, the government, the police, the army etc, similar to the old black issue.
3. Because 'black' is a fashionable colour, and suggests that gay is now popular or fashionable i.e. Queer eye and big brother house inmates, positive gay characters in dramas and movies etc...
Thusly, gay is the new black!
Please do not bring up fiction to emphasize a very real point that requires absolutely no fictional backup. There are plenty of real life examples of gays being brutally killed, like Matthew Shepherd.
And I totally lol'd at number 3.
And I actually thought that in the eastern countries like china, japan, and korea, they were more accepting about homosexuality. So personally I was confused as to why Gundam denied it. I guess I'm just wrong, then.
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On October 27 2010 05:54 DoubleReed wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2010 19:34 Eddie.Aus wrote:
For anyone who was interested in my 'gay is the new black' comment, some people really helped highlight it here.
1. Because we probably will look back in 20-30 years and go, wtf was all the gay prejudice about.
2. Because gay people have suffered all kinds of persecution (including lynching and brutal murder, i.e. Broke Back Mountain to drop that little bomb, doubt you've seen it mate) from haters, the government, the police, the army etc, similar to the old black issue.
3. Because 'black' is a fashionable colour, and suggests that gay is now popular or fashionable i.e. Queer eye and big brother house inmates, positive gay characters in dramas and movies etc...
Thusly, gay is the new black! Please do not bring up fiction to emphasize a very real point that requires absolutely no fictional backup. There are plenty of real life examples of gays being brutally killed, like Matthew Shepherd. And I totally lol'd at number 3. And I actually thought that in the eastern countries like china, japan, and korea, they were more accepting about homosexuality. So personally I was confused as to why Gundam denied it. I guess I'm just wrong, then.
gays tend to get treated with juvenile amusement in japan, like a freak show. you have gay celebrities on tv exaggerating their gayness and probably misrepresenting the actual gay community.
there were times in the past when a guy would often have a brotherly/gay relationship with a younger guy, and it was regarded as completely normal -- much like in ancient rome. it's definitely not that way now.
meanwhile i've had korean friends make strange claims like that there are no gays in korea because there is no korean word for gay. so there's definitely at least some stigma against gays in korea as well.
is gundam denying the allegations entirely, or is he just denying that he's gay?
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EPT
