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[B]On April 18 2007 12:41 bine wrote: People were telling him that not all Christians follow every word of the Bible, and he responded with quotes from it.
How can you consider yourself a Christian if you don't follow what the Bible says? The definition of a Christian is believing in the teachings of Jesus Christ, so we have to at least believe those parts of the Bible, otherwise you aren't believing what he says. Now people are thinking well Jesus didn't write the any of the Bible, and there is only a first hand account of what he says written in the New Testament. To believe in Christ is what makes you Christian, Christ said that the all of the old books of the Bible were valid so just through Christ's words you have to heed the Old Testament and the New Testament.
If you believe in a god fine, if you believe in a god like the Christian God, fine. Just don't misrepresent Christianity and say that you can do anything you want, whenever you want. Your not following the Word of God, and if your not following Jesus' teachings then by definition you aren't a Christian.
A man that says I mess my life up daily, I gamble when I'm not supposed to, have sex without marriage when I'm not supposed to, and get drunk when I'm not supposed to, but I just can't follow God even when I try is a Christian. Anyone that disregards parts of the Bible to fit their lifestyles doesn't even have the right to call themselves a Christian.
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On April 18 2007 13:27 Never Post wrote:
If the Bible simply records the ideals of a society, where's it's credibility as divine scripture?
Creation account? Jesus Christ? The prophets? Abraham.. Moses..?
The bible records a lot of things. Among them, the rules for a particular society, in this case that being the Hebrew cultural, and their laws for religious cleanliness.
How does that in anyway discredit it's claim of divine revelation?
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Great work XelNaga. Keep it up. =)
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[QUOTE]
[QUOTE]On April 18 2007 13:22 XelNaga wrote:
[QUOTE]On April 18 2007 13:11 TheOvermind77 wrote:
Here is an example of what I mean by not taking the Bible literally...or 'ignoring' some parts.
Leviticus 15: 28-30
"'When she is cleansed from her discharge, she must count off seven days, and after that she will be ceremonially clean. 29 On the eighth day she must take two doves or two young pigeons and bring them to the priest at the entrance to the Tent of Meeting. 30 The priest is to sacrifice one for a sin offering and the other for a burnt offering. In this way he will make atonement for her before the Lord for the uncleanness of her discharge."
Do you practice that? Should we practice that?[/QUOTE]
That's also what you would be calling taking out of context. That was hygiene law for the Hebrews when they were in the desert. There was a lot of sickness and disease concern at the time, and so there you go, this is a solution for it.
When you say you're taking the bible literally, there is also the assumption that you know the context of the bible and do we need to apply Hebrew religious laws to our society today? No, because 1) We aren't Hebrew and 2) It's out of context.
[/QUOTE]
you know thats my attitude towards the "don't sleep with foreign wifes" part, it was a small society and everyone knew everyone else, so that would make problems. nowadays i see it as outdated 
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[B]On April 18 2007 13:26 Never Post wrote: So you're saying that Hebrews in poor living conditions should kills birds or they'll be unclean? Frankly, that sounds absolutely stupid.
Your forgetting biblical history though. Why did they sacrifice animals at that time? To cover up their sins. When Christ died on the cross there was no longer a need to sacrifice animals so people in Christianity stopped doing it as soon as they got this message from Christ. The practice of sacrificing animals was stopped by Jesus' teaching.
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On April 18 2007 13:34 Annor[BbG] wrote:Show nested quote +[B]On April 18 2007 13:26 Never Post wrote: So you're saying that Hebrews in poor living conditions should kills birds or they'll be unclean? Frankly, that sounds absolutely stupid. Your forgetting biblical history though. Why did they sacrifice animals at that time? To cover up their sins.
i must have missed the part on how this would cover up my sins. im gonna go hunt for stray cats, brb.
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On April 18 2007 13:36 j0ehoe wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2007 13:34 Annor[BbG] wrote:[B]On April 18 2007 13:26 Never Post wrote: So you're saying that Hebrews in poor living conditions should kills birds or they'll be unclean? Frankly, that sounds absolutely stupid. Your forgetting biblical history though. Why did they sacrifice animals at that time? To cover up their sins. i must have missed the part on how this would cover up my sins. im gonna go hunt for stray cats, brb.
Yeah you also missed the other half of my paragraph, must be your genetic make up to half ass everything.
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On April 18 2007 12:13 TheOvermind77 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2007 11:56 ZaplinG wrote:
dinosaur bones and the ancestry of humans is far from not being true.
where did the bones come from? i suppose someone planted billions of them all over the world in an effort to disrupt christianity? Oh crap, evolution debate! My quick thoughts before I duck out: Evolution happened. I'm pretty sure God is smart enough to be able to engineer something like that. I am a Christian...but, unlike Xelnaga, I am not a Biblical literalist...there are many denominations and beliefs, etc. I admire him for being so adamant in his beliefs, and he is surely expressing true faith. I have several problems with taking the Bible literally....here are some of them, in brief form: 1. The Bible, while written by those who supposively are writing the Word of God, still were humans. Humans have flaws. We have no way in distinguishing what was written by the Human and what was written 'directly' from God. Evidence of human 'bias' in the Bible is slightly more evident than one might believe...comparing the Old Testament with the New Testament shows a major shift in the way that God is viewed. This, in my opinion, is due to the common beliefs of the time written...a more unforgiving God versus a more merciful God (it isn't exactly that way, but that is a basic summary). While many things in the Bible might be written with Holy inspiration, the hand was still that of a human. 2. In alignment with the above statement, many traditions/practices in the Bible reflect not those of God but those of the culture at that time. For example, the whole conundrum with menstruation and cleansing yourself...in my opinion those aren't the Words of God. 3. If you knew everything in the world....you were God...then how could you explain to humans the process of DNA replication? The motion of the heavens? You can't. So, what do you do? You tell a fable of sorts (think Jesus and his fables that he used to teach lessons)...a story that helps people understand the concept but doesn't necessarily reflect the actual occurence (in my opinion this is what happened to Adam and Eve...I therefore believe in evolution (O GOD THE FLAMING IS COMING ><)). 4. You cannot solve every conflict or event in the world using the Bible...it simply isn't comprehensive enough. No book could be. There will always be gray areas...places where people have to interpret. The Bible has guidelines but not explanations for every event that you will encounter in your life. So sum it up...I respect the Bible and take it as a guideline for how to live my life, but only loosely. I am not a Biblical literalist. But I do believe in God and Jesus Christ. That is the one thing that makes the the same as all of you other Christians :D
More ppl should read this one.
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On April 18 2007 13:34 Annor[BbG] wrote:Show nested quote +[B]On April 18 2007 13:26 Never Post wrote: So you're saying that Hebrews in poor living conditions should kills birds or they'll be unclean? Frankly, that sounds absolutely stupid. Your forgetting biblical history though. Why did they sacrifice animals at that time? To cover up their sins. When Christ died on the cross there was no longer a need to sacrifice animals so people in Christianity stopped doing it as soon as they got this message from Christ. The practice of sacrificing animals was stopped by Jesus' teaching.
And the rules for selling your daughter into slavery? How about those?
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On April 18 2007 13:22 XelNaga wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2007 13:11 TheOvermind77 wrote:
Here is an example of what I mean by not taking the Bible literally...or 'ignoring' some parts.
Leviticus 15: 28-30
"'When she is cleansed from her discharge, she must count off seven days, and after that she will be ceremonially clean. 29 On the eighth day she must take two doves or two young pigeons and bring them to the priest at the entrance to the Tent of Meeting. 30 The priest is to sacrifice one for a sin offering and the other for a burnt offering. In this way he will make atonement for her before the Lord for the uncleanness of her discharge."
Do you practice that? Should we practice that? That's also what you would be calling taking out of context. That was hygiene law for the Hebrews when they were in the desert. There was a lot of sickness and disease concern at the time, and so there you go, this is a solution for it. When you say you're taking the bible literally, there is also the assumption that you know the context of the bible and do we need to apply Hebrew religious laws to our society today? No, because 1) We aren't Hebrew and 2) It's out of context. No, just inaccurate.
They aren't simple 'Hebrew' Laws. They are, if taken literally, directly from God. Verse one of Leviticus is
1: And the LORD called unto Moses, and spake unto him out of the tabernacle of the congregation, saying...
And the rules follow after that. Those of Jewish faith actually follow many of these laws.
So how can you say this is out of context or just 'Hebrew' laws if it says, in the Bible, that God spoke these through Moses?
This is why I cannot be a Biblical literalist. I do NOT believe that all of these rules are meant to be taken word for word, or that all of the rules were actually God's direct commandments.
What's your take on this issue?
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On April 18 2007 13:39 Mindcrime wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2007 13:34 Annor[BbG] wrote:[B]On April 18 2007 13:26 Never Post wrote: So you're saying that Hebrews in poor living conditions should kills birds or they'll be unclean? Frankly, that sounds absolutely stupid. Your forgetting biblical history though. Why did they sacrifice animals at that time? To cover up their sins. When Christ died on the cross there was no longer a need to sacrifice animals so people in Christianity stopped doing it as soon as they got this message from Christ. The practice of sacrificing animals was stopped by Jesus' teaching. And the rules for selling your daughter into slavery? How about those?
Give me the chapter. Its hard to respond to something when I'm not sure which verse you mean.
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On April 18 2007 13:30 XelNaga wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2007 13:27 Never Post wrote:
If the Bible simply records the ideals of a society, where's it's credibility as divine scripture? Creation account? Jesus Christ? The prophets? Abraham.. Moses..? The bible records a lot of things. Among them, the rules for a particular society, in this case that being the Hebrew cultural, and their laws for religious cleanliness. How does that in anyway discredit it's claim of divine revelation?
Because no matter how you look at it, what they said was just wrong . Pointless stupidity can not be inspired by 'divine revelation'. If this part wasn't 'divine' then why should the rest of it be immune from the same judgement.
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On April 18 2007 13:38 Annor[BbG] wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2007 13:36 j0ehoe wrote:On April 18 2007 13:34 Annor[BbG] wrote:[B]On April 18 2007 13:26 Never Post wrote: So you're saying that Hebrews in poor living conditions should kills birds or they'll be unclean? Frankly, that sounds absolutely stupid. Your forgetting biblical history though. Why did they sacrifice animals at that time? To cover up their sins. i must have missed the part on how this would cover up my sins. im gonna go hunt for stray cats, brb. Yeah you also missed the other half of my paragraph, must be your genetic make up to half ass everything.
nah god made me like that lolz
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On April 18 2007 13:41 TheOvermind77 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2007 13:22 XelNaga wrote:On April 18 2007 13:11 TheOvermind77 wrote:
Here is an example of what I mean by not taking the Bible literally...or 'ignoring' some parts.
Leviticus 15: 28-30
"'When she is cleansed from her discharge, she must count off seven days, and after that she will be ceremonially clean. 29 On the eighth day she must take two doves or two young pigeons and bring them to the priest at the entrance to the Tent of Meeting. 30 The priest is to sacrifice one for a sin offering and the other for a burnt offering. In this way he will make atonement for her before the Lord for the uncleanness of her discharge."
Do you practice that? Should we practice that? That's also what you would be calling taking out of context. That was hygiene law for the Hebrews when they were in the desert. There was a lot of sickness and disease concern at the time, and so there you go, this is a solution for it. When you say you're taking the bible literally, there is also the assumption that you know the context of the bible and do we need to apply Hebrew religious laws to our society today? No, because 1) We aren't Hebrew and 2) It's out of context. On April 18 2007 12:45 bine wrote:Radio carbon dating  Tool of the devil No, just inaccurate. They aren't simple 'Hebrew' Laws. They are, if taken literally, directly from God. Verse one of Leviticus is 1: And the LORD called unto Moses, and spake unto him out of the tabernacle of the congregation, saying...And the rules follow after that. Those of Jewish faith actually follow many of these laws. So how can you say this is out of context or just 'Hebrew' laws if it says, in the Bible, that God spoke these through Moses? This is why I cannot be a Biblical literalist. I do NOT believe that all of these rules are meant to be taken word for word, or that all of the rules were actually God's direct commandments. What's your take on this issue?
So when Jesus said that the Old Testament was accurate, he was actually lying?
On April 18 2007 13:46 j0ehoe wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2007 13:38 Annor[BbG] wrote:On April 18 2007 13:36 j0ehoe wrote:On April 18 2007 13:34 Annor[BbG] wrote:[B]On April 18 2007 13:26 Never Post wrote: So you're saying that Hebrews in poor living conditions should kills birds or they'll be unclean? Frankly, that sounds absolutely stupid. Your forgetting biblical history though. Why did they sacrifice animals at that time? To cover up their sins. i must have missed the part on how this would cover up my sins. im gonna go hunt for stray cats, brb. Yeah you also missed the other half of my paragraph, must be your genetic make up to half ass everything. nah god made me like that lolz
lol
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On April 18 2007 13:43 Annor[BbG] wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2007 13:39 Mindcrime wrote:On April 18 2007 13:34 Annor[BbG] wrote:[B]On April 18 2007 13:26 Never Post wrote: So you're saying that Hebrews in poor living conditions should kills birds or they'll be unclean? Frankly, that sounds absolutely stupid. Your forgetting biblical history though. Why did they sacrifice animals at that time? To cover up their sins. When Christ died on the cross there was no longer a need to sacrifice animals so people in Christianity stopped doing it as soon as they got this message from Christ. The practice of sacrificing animals was stopped by Jesus' teaching. And the rules for selling your daughter into slavery? How about those? Give me the chapter. Its hard to respond to something when I'm not sure which verse you mean.
When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl's owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter. If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife. If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21: 7-11 NLT)
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On April 18 2007 13:39 Mindcrime wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2007 13:34 Annor[BbG] wrote:On April 18 2007 13:26 Never Post wrote: So you're saying that Hebrews in poor living conditions should kills birds or they'll be unclean? Frankly, that sounds absolutely stupid. Your forgetting biblical history though. Why did they sacrifice animals at that time? To cover up their sins. When Christ died on the cross there was no longer a need to sacrifice animals so people in Christianity stopped doing it as soon as they got this message from Christ. The practice of sacrificing animals was stopped by Jesus' teaching. And the rules for selling your daughter into slavery? How about those?
[B]On April 18 2007 13:48 Mindcrime wrote: Show nested quote +On April 18 2007 13:43 Annor[BbG] wrote:On April 18 2007 13:39 Mindcrime wrote:On April 18 2007 13:34 Annor[BbG] wrote:[B]On April 18 2007 13:26 Never Post wrote: So you're saying that Hebrews in poor living conditions should kills birds or they'll be unclean? Frankly, that sounds absolutely stupid. Your forgetting biblical history though. Why did they sacrifice animals at that time? To cover up their sins. When Christ died on the cross there was no longer a need to sacrifice animals so people in Christianity stopped doing it as soon as they got this message from Christ. The practice of sacrificing animals was stopped by Jesus' teaching. And the rules for selling your daughter into slavery? How about those? Give me the chapter. Its hard to respond to something when I'm not sure which verse you mean. When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl's owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter. If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife. If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21: 7-11 NLT)
New Living Translation? lol
That's talking about arranged marriages. I live in the USA I don't really have a stance on arranged marriages.
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On April 18 2007 13:54 Annor[BbG] wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2007 13:39 Mindcrime wrote:On April 18 2007 13:34 Annor[BbG] wrote:[B]On April 18 2007 13:26 Never Post wrote: So you're saying that Hebrews in poor living conditions should kills birds or they'll be unclean? Frankly, that sounds absolutely stupid. Your forgetting biblical history though. Why did they sacrifice animals at that time? To cover up their sins. When Christ died on the cross there was no longer a need to sacrifice animals so people in Christianity stopped doing it as soon as they got this message from Christ. The practice of sacrificing animals was stopped by Jesus' teaching. And the rules for selling your daughter into slavery? How about those? New Living Translation? lol That's talking about arranged marriages. I live in the USA I don't really have a stance on arranged marriages.
If by "arranged marriage" you mean "sex slavery" then yes, yes it is.
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On April 18 2007 13:44 Never Post wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2007 13:30 XelNaga wrote:On April 18 2007 13:27 Never Post wrote:
If the Bible simply records the ideals of a society, where's it's credibility as divine scripture? Creation account? Jesus Christ? The prophets? Abraham.. Moses..? The bible records a lot of things. Among them, the rules for a particular society, in this case that being the Hebrew cultural, and their laws for religious cleanliness. How does that in anyway discredit it's claim of divine revelation? Because no matter how you look at it, what they said was just wrong . Pointless stupidity can not be inspired by 'divine revelation'. If this part wasn't 'divine' then why should the rest of it be immune from the same judgement.
Why do you say its "just wrong"?
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On April 18 2007 13:57 littleboy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2007 13:44 Never Post wrote:On April 18 2007 13:30 XelNaga wrote:On April 18 2007 13:27 Never Post wrote:
If the Bible simply records the ideals of a society, where's it's credibility as divine scripture? Creation account? Jesus Christ? The prophets? Abraham.. Moses..? The bible records a lot of things. Among them, the rules for a particular society, in this case that being the Hebrew cultural, and their laws for religious cleanliness. How does that in anyway discredit it's claim of divine revelation? Because no matter how you look at it, what they said was just wrong . Pointless stupidity can not be inspired by 'divine revelation'. If this part wasn't 'divine' then why should the rest of it be immune from the same judgement. Why do you say its "just wrong"?
The idea that sacrifice is a requirement to be cleansed (since someone did mention it was a hygiene-related thing).
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On April 18 2007 13:55 Mindcrime wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2007 13:54 Annor[BbG] wrote:On April 18 2007 13:39 Mindcrime wrote:On April 18 2007 13:34 Annor[BbG] wrote:[B]On April 18 2007 13:26 Never Post wrote: So you're saying that Hebrews in poor living conditions should kills birds or they'll be unclean? Frankly, that sounds absolutely stupid. Your forgetting biblical history though. Why did they sacrifice animals at that time? To cover up their sins. When Christ died on the cross there was no longer a need to sacrifice animals so people in Christianity stopped doing it as soon as they got this message from Christ. The practice of sacrificing animals was stopped by Jesus' teaching. And the rules for selling your daughter into slavery? How about those? New Living Translation? lol That's talking about arranged marriages. I live in the USA I don't really have a stance on arranged marriages. If by "arranged marriage" you mean "sex slavery" then yes, yes it is.
How is it sex slavery? Exodus 21 10 If he marries another woman, he must not deprive the first one of her food, clothing and MARTIAL RIGHTS. Making things up to suit your inability to read doesn't make them true =/ By inability to read, I mean the fact that I had to requote a verse that you gave me and highlight a portion of it.
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EPT
