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[[Starlight]]
United States1578 Posts
On March 14 2016 12:11 WinterViewbot420 wrote: Most of this thread is. I regret making this. I'm so sorry. Don't be. A great many of the non-balance suggestions, and even a few of the balance ones, have been good. The problem is that players aren't game designers, so the 'good-to-crap' ratio on balance suggestions is bound to be kinda bad. | ||
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castleeMg
Canada786 Posts
make scout 200 mineral and same gas cost?? idk i just wanna use scouts sometimes  eliminate that stupid bug where you target an enemy with your unit (mostly goons and sometimes marines) and it freezes the attacking unit completely, i feel like im being punished for trying to micro correctly D: remove vultures from the game :DD jk but seriously | ||
FlaShFTW
United States10391 Posts
On March 14 2016 04:19 Liquid`Drone wrote: balance wise, anything beyond buffing ghost hp would have bad consequences. queens and DA's are already great units, just that they are slightly niche in when to be applied. But there's nothing wrong with that. Scout mostly sucks, but boosting it in pretty much any way aside from giving extra sight range, could also make some early scout cheeses (like scout into 3 gate dragoon, already a strong pvz cheese) become really powerful. What this patch MUST fix is: port forward issue What it ideally takes care of: colors bugging out optional stuff: bnet server with matchmaking, fixing hacks, make replay watching better, 'HD'/widescreen support what it must NOT involve itself in balance or interface honestly pretty much this. because some of the server issues and crap, nothing else really should be changed. | ||
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lolcookie
Australia17 Posts
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/brood-war/92971-mining-rates-for-each-patch-python | ||
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Scarbo
294 Posts
On March 14 2016 14:47 lolcookie wrote: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/brood-war/92971-mining-rates-for-each-patch-python They don't but the game is already balanced despite this. Changing it would possibly break this, and the only benefit I can think of is to please a few OCD users. | ||
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shin ken
Germany612 Posts
Besides, this is still Broodwar. The game where you can utterly crush your opponent with mass scouts because the skill difference can be so high. I've seen that countless times. If you want to play scouts just search for a D/D- player and have fun. | ||
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mca64Launcher_
Poland629 Posts
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Esp1noza
Russian Federation481 Posts
2. Matchmaking. 3. Fix issues with new OS. 4. Widescreen support. 5. Maybe FULL HD support. | ||
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WinterViewbot420
345 Posts
On March 14 2016 15:31 Esp1noza wrote: 1. Network protocol. 2. Matchmaking. 3. Fix issues with new OS. 4. Widescreen support. 5. Maybe FULL HD support. I am totes with you on #1. StarCraft's network management is pure garbage. | ||
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shin ken
Germany612 Posts
What I think is possible: Modern OS compatability and color fix Some network improvements Semi-official support of 3rd party servers What would be a stretch but still not out of this world: Improved hack detection official window mode In-game upscaling of 640x480 to some resolutions (= 2x/3x mode) Maybe nice optional artwork instead of black borders on non-4:3 displays What would be probably way too much to ask for but who knows: skill based auto-matchmaking Bnet Launcher integration | ||
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_Animus_
Bulgaria1064 Posts
1. Make workers not go to the nearest base by air but by ground when distant mine. 2. Make BW unit AI actually recognize if path is blocked, by neutral or other building to avoid stupid unit loops around the blocked exits. 3. Make scouts less pricy or build faster. 4. Make goons smarter. 5. Make Guardians/Reavers not suicide into defensive structures range. | ||
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[[Starlight]]
United States1578 Posts
On March 14 2016 15:21 shin ken wrote: Has any BW pro in the last 15 years complained that they want better scouts? Or better DTs? No, they didn't complain about scouts, they just never ever used 'em, except once in a blue moon to troll someone.  And wtf on DTs? Most everyone agrees they're a good unit, they're often used in pro and amateur games alike. Not every unit needs to be equal esp. when every race has their fair share underused or situational units and it actually balances out that way (you know, Broodwar balance - the kind of balance no RTS developer ever achieved again prior or after Broodwar, just don't touch it!) Even BroodWar wasn't BroodWar when it was first released. Every balance patch improved it, until it became the BW we know and love today. If balance had stayed as it was as of BW 1.00, it would've been a disaster. So, I don't fear change. I just want it to be competent and no more than what's necessary. Like I already said in the other thread: don't think widescreen or high resolution can be done in a patch without rewriting major parts of the game I would be incredibly surprised if the updated BW wasn't eventually both widescreen and HD. Sorry man, no one uses 15" standard-def CRTs anymore. Not that they weren't kind of cool back in the day. | ||
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Scarbo
294 Posts
On March 14 2016 17:09 [[Starlight]] wrote: No, they didn't complain about scouts, they just never ever used 'em, except once in a blue moon to troll someone. And wtf on DTs? Most everyone agrees they're a good unit, they're often used in pro and amateur games alike. Even BroodWar wasn't BroodWar when it was first released. Every balance patch improved it, until it became the BW we know and love today. If balance had stayed as it was as of BW 1.00, it would've been a disaster. So, I don't fear change. I just want it to be competent and no more than what's necessary. If the goal is to make every unit useful then removing all the useless ones is a better solution since it is guaranteed to achieve the objective. Some units are just there for flavor, accept it and move on, not to mention how many custom maps would break if a unit was to be changed. | ||
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[[Starlight]]
United States1578 Posts
On March 14 2016 17:18 Scarbo wrote: If the goal is to make every unit useful then removing all the useless ones is a better solution since it is guaranteed to achieve the objective. That's pretty extreme. That's like saying, back in SC 1.00, "Zerg are overpowered, let's just remove that race, make it a 2-race game." Blizzard didn't do that. They fixed Zerg instead, and the other two races relative to Zerg. Can't imagine why one would think removing useless/seldom-used units altogether would be preferable to giving them minor buffs, unless one is just terrified of absolutely any change at all, no matter how small. | ||
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shin ken
Germany612 Posts
On March 14 2016 17:09 [[Starlight]] wrote: No, they didn't complain about scouts, they just never ever used 'em, except once in a blue moon to troll someone. so what? Even BroodWar wasn't BroodWar when it was first released. Every balance patch improved it, until it became the BW we know and love today. If balance had stayed as it was as of BW 1.00, it would've been a disaster. Yes, and the last balance patch was from 2001. That's quasi post-release. The entirety of televised Broodwar and then some has been played with the same balance and there have been no problems that couldn't be fixed with new maps. Why change it now? I would be incredibly surprised if the updated BW wasn't both widescreen and HD. Sorry man, no one uses 15" standard-def CRTs anymore. Be prepared to be very disappointed then. Just a hint: The latest Diablo 2 patch from last week doesn't include HD and widescreen either. What everybody uses is not relevant. If that's the only thing that matters, Nintendo should also patch Smash Brothers Melee to work on modern HD-TVs. | ||
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Scarbo
294 Posts
On March 14 2016 17:34 [[Starlight]] wrote: That's pretty extreme. That's like saying, back in SC 1.00, "Zerg are overpowered, let's just remove that race, make it a 2-race game." Blizzard didn't do that. They fixed Zerg instead, and the other two races relative to Zerg. Can't imagine why one would think removing useless/seldom-used units altogether would be preferable to giving them minor buffs, unless one is just terrified of absolutely any change at all, no matter how small. What I'm saying is that the assumption that every unit needs to be useful in 1v1 competitive, which is where a lot of the arguments in here come from, is bollocks. There's nothing wrong with having things for flavor. Imagine if Valve decided to balance every weapon in CSGO to be useful at pro level? Game would stop being CS and become something else. People running around with shotguns and LMGs. I don't think breaking a lot of custom maps and possibly messing up the balance of 1v1 is worth the risk of changing anything. Is it possible? Sure. Odds of any player or Blizz dev to get it right? I'd say winning the lottery is more likely. | ||
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[[Starlight]]
United States1578 Posts
So, what if you actually want to use scouts in a competitive game, and have them actually do something? What if you like to have more strategic options in your gameplay? What if you just plain think scouts are frikin' cool? Even BroodWar wasn't BroodWar when it was first released. Every balance patch improved it, until it became the BW we know and love today. If balance had stayed as it was as of BW 1.00, it would've been a disaster. Yes, and the last balance patch was from 2001. That's quasi post-release. The entirety of televised Broodwar and then some has been played with the same balance and there have been no problems that couldn't be fixed with new maps. Why change it now? Why not, if you can improve upon it a bit? The meta has changed a lot since 1.08 got released, and in ways that the designers couldn't possibly foresee back then. I would be incredibly surprised if the updated BW wasn't both widescreen and HD. Sorry man, no one uses 15" standard-def CRTs anymore. Be prepared to be very disappointed then. Just a hint: The latest Diablo 2 patch from last week doesn't include HD and widescreen either. Yup, but Bliz has left the door open for further improvements to Diablo 2: ...Blizzard says it's working on improvements to the game's "cheat-detection and hack-prevention capabilities" and hints at more improvements to come. "There is still a large Diablo II community around the world, and we thank you for continuing to play and slay with us," Blizzard writes. "This journey starts by making Diablo II run on modern platforms, but it does not end there. See you in Sanctuary, adventurers." http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2016/03/16-years-later-blizzard-is-still-patching-diablo-ii/ | ||
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[[Starlight]]
United States1578 Posts
On March 14 2016 18:00 Scarbo wrote: What I'm saying is that the assumption that every unit needs to be useful in 1v1 competitive, which is where a lot of the arguments in here come from, is bollocks. There's nothing wrong with having things for flavor. Imagine if Valve decided to balance every weapon in CSGO to be useful at pro level? Game would stop being CS and become something else. People running around with shotguns and LMGs. I don't think breaking a lot of custom maps and possibly messing up the balance of 1v1 is worth the risk of changing anything. Is it possible? Sure. Odds of any player or Blizz dev to get it right? I'd say winning the lottery is more likely. When I think of a game having units 'just for flavor', I think of something like Total Annihilation, which eventually had hundreds of units, many of which did the same thing, more or less, or were just minor variations on a theme. I don't think Blizzard did that with SC, everything was supposed to have a purpose. Which is why it's such a deep and rich game, even though there's only 13-14 units per race, even after the expansion. No BS units just for the sake of having units, nothing frivolous or unnecessary, no fat. I think that was the intent, though it hasn't been fully realized (yet?). Also, if you look at BW balance patches over time, the overwhelming majority of the changes were GOOD ones. There were close to 100 balance changes total over the four balance patches, and I can think of only a couple or three that were probably mistakes. The BW balance change track record is really good, actually. My worry would be that they wouldn't consult with any of the folks that were responsible for BW, but rather trusted it entirely to the SC2 designer guys. If so... THEN you can panic. And I will join you. | ||
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lestye
United States4208 Posts
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HaN-
France1920 Posts
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