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On December 25 2012 10:08 ohampatu wrote:Show nested quote +On December 25 2012 09:28 Dodgin wrote:On December 25 2012 08:10 Fearest wrote:
I just want to say I kind of regret paying 5 dollars for these type of casting. Very poor, low quality, and even those that offer free castings (youtube channels) are 10 times better. Either you guys do it properly, or apologize and we can watch the Korean streams (you can keep the 5 bucks).
You have to follow the Apple model of doing things, quality first, and money magically comes second. That decision has nothing to do with TL, they were given the rights and had them taken away only a week later. IEG and Kespa hired the current casters and they are on location. is there a source for that? from what im seeing, it looks like eg-tl entered into it way before they themselves seem prepared, everybody here is complaining about the new casters, but they were ripping tl-eg (and bitter and tb) a new one, there was alot of negative backlash it seemed, it wouldn't surprise me if kespa backed out due to some of those reasons its unfortunate, tl-eg could have made a great broadcast if kespa focused on the foreign scenes production better
If you follow the Proleague this week, you will see that it's true. Also, there's Whiplash's blog about him being hired by IEG/KesPA and was flown to Korea to cast too.
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On December 25 2012 08:37 dabom88 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 25 2012 08:32 aike wrote:On December 25 2012 08:31 dabom88 wrote:
Looks like I was smart in holding off paying until Proleague had time to prove itself. This is the stuff more of you guys should learn in order to avoid buyer's remorse. it's $5. If you have buyers remorse for $5 I feel sorry for you. Not everyone wants to spend 5 dollars supporting a bad product. Everything is relative to the quality of the product in the customer's eyes. Just because something is $5 doesn't mean everyone wants to throw away 5 dollars. Just because you could buy someone's autograph for $.01 doesn't mean that $.01 is worth spending on it to everyone. More people really should have just spent more time watching the free vods and seeing how Proleague went and see if its English stream was as mediocre as OSL's. Then they could have avoided paying for a product they didn't think was as good as they expected.
Yeah, people are really going to spend their time researching to see if it's worth paying $5 for 8 months.
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So who's casting at the minute and who's in charge of who's casting atm? I watched the Khan -EGTL game and have been busy since. Has something changed since then?
On December 25 2012 10:17 Masq wrote:
whos SNM
Supernovamaniac - A nice fella who does a lot of twitch feed translating of Koreans and often helps out korean players when they move to English speaking teams.
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Im happy to pay $5 for an 8 month of what will become the best league of StarCraft 2 in the world, I dont like the current casting either, but what the hell Im paying to watch and apreciate the awesome games not to apreciate the casting, I do my own conclusions of the game, they can do better, but still $5 is the cheapest price on the scene for 8 moth of top sc2 action imo.
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I don't feel like the low price is an excuse for the level of commentary. I would like to see SNM be used as a translator but I feel like the casters need to be both articulate and exciting. The quality of the games is actually very nice but I find myself muting most of the time.
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On December 25 2012 08:30 aike wrote:Show nested quote +On December 25 2012 08:10 Fearest wrote:
I just want to say I kind of regret paying 5 dollars for these type of casting. Very poor, low quality, and even those that offer free castings (youtube channels) are 10 times better. Either you guys do it properly, or apologize and we can watch the Korean streams (you can keep the 5 bucks).
You have to follow the Apple model of doing things, quality first, and money magically comes second. So I guess this is the best we can get. Which is horrible :\ SNM needs to learn to enunciate before he learns to cast. And this is the fking PROLEAGUE. Should have superb casting from knowledgeable people.
YES, YES, a billion times YES.
Feels like I wasted $5 (yes it's not much, but still...) on some rather poor casting. Half the time I just cringe at their awful casting and mute the damn thing. I'd rather have Moletrap back(old moletrap from GOMTV even - yes it's that bad for me). Their in game knowledge can be improved over time, but their actual skills as casters is amateurish at best.
I'd probably get some hate for this but I personally don't like how SNM just talks, it's like Frodan but much worse as it sounds like a person chewing gum while talking. Doesn't help that at times they can completely flub up simple things like map directions, or say wrong player names/team names, and a bunch of other minor things that just adds up to a very grating experience for me to listen to. Whiplash seems to be trying and imo at least for a professional caster play-by-play standpoint he actually carries SNM. SNM should just function as a translator type figure and not a caster, but that's my opinion.
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Whats going on here? I even watched some games that had no Commentary at all. I paid the 5$ to be able to watch the VODs. And the casting so far was pretty OK, the only terrible casting was when EG/TL produced. Supernovamanic and the other guy do a pretty good job and its definitly only getting better.
People who argue the 5$ are not worth it are just stupidly retarded.
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On December 25 2012 11:07 INCHymn wrote:
I don't feel like the low price is an excuse for the level of commentary. I would like to see SNM be used as a translator but I feel like the casters need to be both articulate and exciting. The quality of the games is actually very nice but I find myself muting most of the time.
Seems pretty high level commentary for me. Better than most European tournament casters. They are very natural and sincere, English is perfect, and obviously they are friends too.
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It's their first few days on the job and people are really going "I can't believe I wasted $5 on this"? Really?
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On December 25 2012 10:16 GolemMadness wrote:Show nested quote +On December 25 2012 08:37 dabom88 wrote:On December 25 2012 08:32 aike wrote:On December 25 2012 08:31 dabom88 wrote:
Looks like I was smart in holding off paying until Proleague had time to prove itself. This is the stuff more of you guys should learn in order to avoid buyer's remorse. it's $5. If you have buyers remorse for $5 I feel sorry for you. Not everyone wants to spend 5 dollars supporting a bad product. Everything is relative to the quality of the product in the customer's eyes. Just because something is $5 doesn't mean everyone wants to throw away 5 dollars. Just because you could buy someone's autograph for $.01 doesn't mean that $.01 is worth spending on it to everyone. More people really should have just spent more time watching the free vods and seeing how Proleague went and see if its English stream was as mediocre as OSL's. Then they could have avoided paying for a product they didn't think was as good as they expected. Yeah, people are really going to spend their time researching to see if it's worth paying $5 for 8 months.
Not very hard to research. Vods were free for the first few weeks. Not to mention the Live stream is on at a time that's inconvenient for a lot of the world anyway. Don't impulse buy, consumers being smart buyers is the only way to improve the product.
On December 25 2012 11:20 Slackzftw wrote:
People who argue the 5$ are not worth it are just stupidly retarded.
Yeah, labeling anyone who doesn't disagree with you as being "stupidly retarded" is clearly the best way to contribute to the discussion.
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On December 25 2012 11:31 GolemMadness wrote:
It's their first few days on the job and people are really going "I can't believe I wasted $5 on this"? Really?
Haha, seriously.
I think I'm the only one actually sick of hearing the same casters, the same jokes, and the same faked excitement that comes from games that aren't really that exciting just for the sake of being excited. I'm glad to see new people at least trying when there's NO ONE ELSE who can go to korea to do this.
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I don't mind the 4.99 regardless of who is casting. The only problem i have with this is that proleague is legendary for anyone who followed back to the broodwar days. I don't mind these guys as casters but I can't agree that its acceptable to have this level of commentary for PROLEAGUE. This would be fine for a minor event and then they work their way up. However, for basically both of them to start off on one of the biggest stages for fans dating back to broodwar its really a big let down esp from when we started with TB/Mrbitter who may not be the best casters but know how to get hyped up at the right moments.
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Guys, the whole cost argument isn't productive. It doesn't matter HOW much it costs, or doesn't cost, or if it's free or whatever.
Proleague is a premiere tournament and it should be represented by premiere casters.
I follow SC2 closely and I have NEVER heard of SNM or Whiplash before.
They're certainly not as bad as a lot of twitch chatters are claiming they are, BUT, they are NOT up to the quality that I would expect out of EG-TL production, and certainly not indicative of Proleague.
If Proleague wants to be THE BEST league they need to have THE BEST casters.
Edit: When I heard EG would be handling the casting I was hoping for Incontrol. I don't know why he's not in Korea with the rest of his team, seems like a great opportunity to cement himself as a leading caster as well. Incontrol has the BW history AND the SC2 knowledge.
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On December 25 2012 11:50 LimeNade wrote:
I don't mind the 4.99 regardless of who is casting. The only problem i have with this is that proleague is legendary for anyone who followed back to the broodwar days. I don't mind these guys as casters but I can't agree that its acceptable to have this level of commentary for PROLEAGUE. This would be fine for a minor event and then they work their way up. However, for basically both of them to start off on one of the biggest stages for fans dating back to broodwar its really a big let down esp from when we started with TB/Mrbitter who may not be the best casters but know how to get hyped up at the right moments.
Now, this is a good argument. We surely hope some famous casters can cast proleague. But they don't want to go to Korea and stay there for a whole year, because they are already famous, and paid good salary to do it at home, why bother to come to an Asian country with completely different culture with probably less pay. This is not like 2 years ago anymore, there are plenty of Euro and american tournaments going on, they have plenty of stuff to do outside of Korea.
So they can only hire people already in Korea or non-famous casters outside of Korea.
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I already subscribed to the twitch channel that has been broadcasting the proleague so far.
Do I have to pay again? I don't think I could do that.
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On December 25 2012 11:35 dabom88 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 25 2012 10:16 GolemMadness wrote:On December 25 2012 08:37 dabom88 wrote:On December 25 2012 08:32 aike wrote:On December 25 2012 08:31 dabom88 wrote:
Looks like I was smart in holding off paying until Proleague had time to prove itself. This is the stuff more of you guys should learn in order to avoid buyer's remorse. it's $5. If you have buyers remorse for $5 I feel sorry for you. Not everyone wants to spend 5 dollars supporting a bad product. Everything is relative to the quality of the product in the customer's eyes. Just because something is $5 doesn't mean everyone wants to throw away 5 dollars. Just because you could buy someone's autograph for $.01 doesn't mean that $.01 is worth spending on it to everyone. More people really should have just spent more time watching the free vods and seeing how Proleague went and see if its English stream was as mediocre as OSL's. Then they could have avoided paying for a product they didn't think was as good as they expected. Yeah, people are really going to spend their time researching to see if it's worth paying $5 for 8 months. Not very hard to research. Vods were free for the first few weeks. Not to mention the Live stream is on at a time that's inconvenient for a lot of the world anyway. Don't impulse buy, consumers being smart buyers is the only way to improve the product. Show nested quote +On December 25 2012 11:20 Slackzftw wrote:
People who argue the 5$ are not worth it are just stupidly retarded. Yeah, labeling anyone who doesn't disagree with you as being "stupidly retarded" is clearly the best way to contribute to the discussion.
The fact that VoDs were free before is irrelevant. The casters were different.
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There aren't enough people trying to cast. Imagine if only like 25 people were trying to play SC 2. How many would really be playing at a high level? It's all relative. And, after hearing SSM and Whiplash, it has only confirmed how little of a difference it makes to me. Not going to get caught up in "relatively good" until there's a big enough difference between casters. If sayle isn't going to cast, there could be no audio or they could select whomever is willing to go to Korea, and it would make too little of a difference for me to care. I'm more concerned with the game itself being lame. HotS can't happen fast enough.
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On December 25 2012 11:54 EvanC wrote:
Guys, the whole cost argument isn't productive. It doesn't matter HOW much it costs, or doesn't cost, or if it's free or whatever.
Proleague is a premiere tournament and it should be represented by premiere casters.
I follow SC2 closely and I have NEVER heard of SNM or Whiplash before.
They're certainly not as bad as a lot of twitch chatters are claiming they are, BUT, they are NOT up to the quality that I would expect out of EG-TL production, and certainly not indicative of Proleague.
If Proleague wants to be THE BEST league they need to have THE BEST casters.
Edit: When I heard EG would be handling the casting I was hoping for Incontrol. I don't know why he's not in Korea with the rest of his team, seems like a great opportunity to cement himself as a leading caster as well. Incontrol has the BW history AND the SC2 knowledge.
I agree it should have the best casters but a lot of the better casters have said they got offered and turned it down, pro league is a very long tournament (8 months) and in Korea which doesn't make it very attractive to many top casters who can do multiple tournaments in that time (especially with HOTS).
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Proleague is a premiere tournament and it should be represented by premiere casters.
WRONG! Its only a premiere tourney for the BW-Nerds. Its only just another sc2-tourney until it has proven anything in SC2.
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EPT
