EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 3440
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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please. In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. | ||
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kwizach
3658 Posts
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GreenHorizons
United States23209 Posts
On March 24 2016 02:32 Soularion wrote: Okay, I think we have the same overall opinion but you don't quite understand. What point are you making? What I got from your post is the following. - Bernie is very, very behind. (Understood, and not contradictory to any of my points because this is the context they're made in.) - Bernie 'lost' the day. (Agreed- if you look at the point of my post, it's that he won about ~55% of the delegates this week when the general thought is that he had to win ~58% from March 16 until after California in order to secure the nomination. Although he did well relative to the polls it still wasn't quite what he wanted as he continued to fall short, albeit not in a big enough way that he's in major danger of being eliminated before NY). - Bernie did not have a good week. (Agreed, although I'd say he had an above average week. It's just that the 'average' here is bad, so it fell into a mediocre-meh week instead of something he actually needed. A point I made in my post is that if he would've won Arizona that would've been a gigantic and important win for him and made this week immensely huge- which I believe is supported by facts as he would've been something like ~10 points above his target depending on how hard of a victory, plus the momentum from outperforming polls so hard.) - Long lines being pinned on Hillary. (Entirely agreed, that's what my post was based on, I just found the situation's suspicion to be worthy of investigation no matter who benefits because that's what democracy is.) So, what point are you trying to make? Because the points I've consistently made is that today and the general state of the election over March points to Bernie continuing to be around where he should be although not quite *good* until NY, at which point if he wins he's in a good spot going forward with a ton of momentum and if he loses sizeably he's dead in the water. Of course NY is a very likely loss for him, which isn't something I've ever denied. I honestly don't understand why people are acting as if AZ's delegates are settled. They haven't counted ~21% of the vote (the Primary day vote). On March 24 2016 02:40 kwizach wrote: I just felt that your tone was much more optimistic than the situation warranted :-) Even barely winning NY would not be sufficient for Sanders, since his original target actually has him at 125 delegates out of 247. He needs to do better than that. With regards to the lines, I think the main reason is that counties wanted to cut costs. It should obviously not have happened, though. It's ridiculous to have to wait in line that long. You know it was a Republican county that cut the polling places from 400+ in 08 to 60 in 16? It's fine to let the standard anti-republican voter suppression outrage go. You do't have to hedge by trying to rationalize it as "money saving". The point was voter suppression clear and simple. | ||
Soularion
Canada2764 Posts
On March 24 2016 02:40 kwizach wrote: I just felt that your tone was much more optimistic than the situation warranted :-) Even barely winning NY would not be sufficient for Sanders, since his original target actually has him at 125 delegates out of 247. He needs to do better than that. With regards to the lines, I think the main reason is that counties wanted to cut costs. It should obviously not have happened, though. It's ridiculous to have to wait in line that long. It's just that things such as the lack of exit polls make it a lot more fishy than it probably is. As for optimism, well, that's fair! I suppose I've just seen Sanders generally stick to where he should be according to 538 while losing/winning a lot harder in demographically favorable/unfavorable states than they've predicted, which is a pretty good sign considering the polls had today looking a /lot/ worse for him. Imaging if he had won Utah by 10 points and lost Arizona by 30. The race would pretty much be over. On March 24 2016 02:42 GreenHorizons wrote: I honestly don't understand why people are acting as if AZ's delegates are settled. They haven't counted ~21% of the vote (the Primary day vote). The AZ situation is super weird and as such I'm just gonna go with the status quo for now because it's pretty obvious to see the implications if it ends up that it leans more towards Clinton or Sanders. | ||
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oneofthem
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On March 24 2016 02:31 ticklishmusic wrote: The ACA already mandates a medical loss ratio for insurers though-- 85% for large group and 80% for small group. Personally, I think we've done a good job on the payor side and now we need to work on the provider/ pharma/ device side. i dont think it is that easily separable. lack of market discipline on the supply side is in large part due to consumers being captive. doctors and hospitals have very little skin in cost reduction but they are the actual hands on the spigots. the va system has lower cost because the cost issue is more of an institutional concern there. of course it is not perfect but the overall design is clearly better. | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15673 Posts
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
FLINT, Mich. (AP) — The state of Michigan is "fundamentally accountable" for Flint's lead-contaminated water crisis because of decisions made by its environmental regulators and state-appointed emergency managers who controlled the city, an investigatory task force concluded Wednesday. The panel, appointed by Gov. Rick Snyder to review the disaster, said in a withering report that what happened in Flint is "a story of government failure, intransigence, unpreparedness, delay, inaction, and environmental injustice." "One of the biggest lessons we hope to impart in our report is the need for government leaders to listen to their constituents; in Flint that didn't happen," said Chris Kolb, co-chairman of the Flint Water Advisory Task Force. Flint's 2014 switch in drinking water sources led the supply to become contaminated when lead leached from old pipes into some homes. While the investigators primarily blamed the state Department of Environmental Quality for the disaster — it initially did so in preliminary findings that led the agency's director to resign in December — it also faulted a host of other government offices and officials for contributing to the fiasco or delaying action to fix it. Those include the Michigan Department of Health and Human Services, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency, the Genesee County Health Department, the city of Flint and financial managers that Snyder named to run the city of nearly 100,000 people. The five-member task force interviewed 66 people during its months-long investigation and made a number of recommendations, including considering alternatives to the emergency manager system. Source | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States23209 Posts
On March 24 2016 02:58 Mohdoo wrote: I think people are dismissing the issues with AZ too lightheartedly. It's a pretty massive decrease in polling areas. I don't think it can be said that they assumed voter turnout would be equally decreased. The right finding ways to complicate voting is nothing new. I find Hillary's silence on it quite troubling. F**k that guy. Human scum. Quite a few scummy cretins involved with that man made disaster. | ||
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oneofthem
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
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GreenHorizons
United States23209 Posts
On March 24 2016 03:02 oneofthem wrote: it is an issue but sandernistas seem to think it is also a hillary conspiracy. these states obviously try to suppress new voters given demographic change. No we don't. But Hillbots like to try to marginalize the issue by trying to write it off as a tin foil party. AZ is just so fubar they are finally taking a bit of notice. EDIT: For example, heavily Latinx/Hispanic areas were some of the hardest hit by the poll closings. At least one location with long lines in a majority Latinx community didn't have a single Spanish speaking poll worker. That Hillary and co isn't more concerned about that is problematic. But it doesn't mean we're saying it's all a conspiracy of an all powerful Hillary. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On March 24 2016 03:02 oneofthem wrote: it is an issue but sandernistas seem to think it is also a hillary conspiracy. these states obviously try to suppress new voters given demographic change. I think you're grossly misattributing the perspective on the problem. The vast majority of Sanders supporters I've seen are decrying the fact that it's happening at all, not going "You ran into the problem too...oh you're a Hillary supporter, lol sucks". It is a reasonable assumption that Sanders would be more heavily affected by this problem than Hillary was - he has more Independent support, anecdotal evidence suggests that a lot of voters' affiliations were not properly changed. However, there are also plenty of reports of long-time Democrats being switched to Independent without their knowledge - this is a group that has a higher likelihood of voting for Hillary. Just because the glut of people affected seem to be people you disagree with does not mean that this problem isn't ubiquitous and disgusting. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
On March 24 2016 02:31 ticklishmusic wrote: The ACA already mandates a medical loss ratio for insurers though-- 85% for large group and 80% for small group. Personally, I think we've done a good job on the payor side and now we need to work on the provider/ pharma/ device side. Eh, the ACA does very little on the cost side. Most insurers had MLRs around or higher than that anyways (how do you think they got the number?). Its a program designed to be the camel's nose in the tent so they can go after hospitals and doctors under the guise of reducing costs to the federal government, which is really where the cost difference between the US and EU is: how much we pay medical professionals. | ||
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
On March 24 2016 02:07 oneofthem wrote: for your lack of reading ability? im talking about international taxation. no nation state can tax international capital on its own, even the u.s. it requires cooperative structure by eu and us mostly. tpp is going to help with regulation arbitrage. it will bring environmental and labor rights into places that do not recognize them. TPP is going to help international capital be more international. If the international taxation regimes are so important to advancing your policy goals you would want to have them as part of the TPP. Otherwise the result is that you've made the problem worse and can't push through your global government tax plans later. TPP threatens EU's long term economic prospects but EU is going to be happy to cooperatively tamper down capital flight? Are you envisioning some kind of blackmail scenario? The US playing EU off of its TPP trade partners? TPP is a vain attempt to keep the good times rolling for as long as possible by the governing liberals. It's a dice throw that consolidates and insulates international capital from democratic forces at home. | ||
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m4ini
4215 Posts
On March 24 2016 01:51 Sermokala wrote: A German is probably the last person who should be making a joke about genocide. And that from an american. The irony. | ||
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Sermokala
United States13909 Posts
They were almost all dead by the time manifest destiny became the hip thing. | ||
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puerk
Germany855 Posts
On March 24 2016 04:45 Sermokala wrote: The native American genocide can hardly be credited to America when it was the European countries that colonized it and brought the plagues, pigs, and horses. It's not America's fault there weren't as many domesticatable animals in North America. They were almost all dead by the time manifest destiny became the hip thing. you can't have it both ways: either it was a genocide and you profited of it, or it was bad luck. neither version makes anything about my german citicenship degrade that joke. | ||
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Naracs_Duc
746 Posts
On March 24 2016 04:50 puerk wrote: you can't have it both ways: either it was a genocide and you profited of it, or it was bad luck. neither version makes anything about my german citicenship degrade that joke. He's saying Germany's to blame for native americans also  #feelthefreedom | ||
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Simberto
Germany11498 Posts
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Mohdoo
United States15673 Posts
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KwarK
United States42596 Posts
On March 24 2016 04:45 Sermokala wrote: The native American genocide can hardly be credited to America when it was the European countries that colonized it and brought the plagues, pigs, and horses. It's not America's fault there weren't as many domesticatable animals in North America. They were almost all dead by the time manifest destiny became the hip thing. It probably was their fault. There were plenty of large animals that could have been domesticated in North America that were wiped out in the exponential growth of human populations in the continent. There is a theory that animals in Eurasia and Africa evolved alongside humans and therefore learned a healthy fear of humans but that large animals in the Americas did not know to run and were made extinct before they learned. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
The Cow, Pig, Horse, etc were probably all extremely savage at one point (there are Tales of great warriors slaying Aurochs and Boars as if its an amazing feat), and its likely the "wild" populations of those are not wild at all, but 10, 20, 30%+ "domesticated" because of escaped animals interbreeding with wild populations. Wolves and wild dogs of today have this en masse. There is a book that like bases its entire premise of history about the "domesticatability" of animals, and this is like the most leap-of-faith portion of it (aside from its other bs). Why do we compare horses to zebras and cows to bison when its pretty clear that cows and horses escape all the time (often as the result of a raid by another civilization). | ||
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