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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. |
Ah Trump brought back the "There are places in Paris where they are so radicalized the police wont go there"
When asked "where in Paris?" Naturally, he had no idea...
The same proportion of Trump supporters who would vote for him as an Independent also happen to be birthers (~60%).
Either the establishment holds their nose and rallies behind Cruz (lol) or Trump wins. He's absolutely crushing Rubio in Florida, and if you can't even lead in your home state (where you are a sitting senator) you have 0 chance at winning the nomination.
EDIT: On December 09 2015 06:40 Rassy wrote:Off course this is the case,did people realy take trumps comments literally? You have to see it from his perspective.
Trump has a global audience. He is going to be a star in ISIS recruitment propaganda. He's probably their favorite politician. There's good reason for why Obama (and GW Bush for that matter) were measured in their rhetoric (even if the right can't seem to understand why anymore).
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Does he hold no responsibility for the segments of the population that will take him literally, assuming that this is the strategy he is using, for riling them up and making the rhetoric so extreme?
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There is a reason why Florida is called penis of the US, and it's not just the shape.
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On December 09 2015 06:49 GreenHorizons wrote:
Either the establishment holds their nose and rallies behind Cruz (lol) or Trump wins. He's absolutely crushing Rubio in Florida, and if you can't even lead in your home state (where you are a sitting senator) you have 0 chance at winning the nomination.
Well, Rubio certainly didn't help his case with the "I hate my current job" sentiment.
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On December 09 2015 06:49 Kickstart wrote:
Does he hold no responsibility for the segments of the population that will take him literally, assuming that this is the strategy he is using, for riling them up and making the rhetoric so extreme?
He is totally responsible, even he and some others don't believe that people can be influenced by words.
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Although the fact anyone can support Trump is terrifying, I have to say that I find quite amusing the way Republicans have been committed to seppuku all their chances in the last years. Since the emergence of the Tea Party, it seems the GOP is the hostage of a bunch of absolute nutters that have no consideration for facts and reality. People like Paul Ryan, who seems to have designed his economics view on the compulsive reading of Atlas Shrugged would have been rightfully considered to be a fraud with no political future twenty years ago.
I'm quite happy with the state of things. It doesn't seem that the madness of Republicans is pulling the Democrats to the right as it happens in Europe, and as long as they keep displaying such a show, they have no chance to win the White House. The Democrats could put a goat against Trump or Carson and win easily at this stage.
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On December 08 2015 22:54 oneofthem wrote:Show nested quote +On December 08 2015 12:28 Bigtony wrote:On December 08 2015 12:14 oneofthem wrote:On December 08 2015 09:06 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:The World Trade Organization (WTO) ruled Monday that Canada and Mexico can slap more than $1 billion in tariffs on U.S. goods in retaliation for meat labeling rules it says discriminated against Mexican and Canadian livestock.
At issue were U.S. labels on packaged steaks and other cuts of meat that say where the animals were born, raised and slaughtered.
The WTO has previously found that the so-called "country of origin" labeling law put Canadian and Mexican livestock at a disadvantage. It ruled Monday that Canada could impose $780 million in retaliatory tariffs and Mexico could impose $228 million.
"We are disappointed with this decision and its potential impact on trade among vital North American partners," said Tim Reif, general counsel for the Office of the U.S. Trade Representative.
The labels are supported by some U.S. ranchers and by consumer groups. They are opposed by meatpackers who say they require costly paperwork.
The WTO's decision shifts responsibility to Congress, which is considering working a repeal of the labeling law into a massive year-end spending bill.
Senate Agriculture Chairman Pat Roberts, R-Kansas, said Monday that he will look for "all legislative opportunities" to repeal the labeling law. "We must prevent retaliation, and we must do it now before these sanctions take effect," Roberts said. Source get rekt farm lobby hahaha More like get rekt consumers. Why shouldn't meat be labeled by country of origin? I want to know if my beef is american or foreign, especially if any of the processing is taking place in China. are you for real? as long as the meat is objectively the same, labeling is simply protectionism using ridiculous 'consumer' bias.
What does it mean for meat from two different cows to be "objectively the same"?
EDIT:
And why do you always come down on the side of producers when it comes to information asymmetries? Source is always linked to quality. Amazon for example has so much garbage-tier shit parading as the real deal and its often impossible to know what it is before you buy. Obfuscating the source just further fetishizes the commodity market, and in the age of big data, further reduces the possibility of consumer surplus, since sellers know everything about buyers and buyers know nothing about sellers.
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On December 09 2015 07:31 IgnE wrote:Show nested quote +On December 08 2015 22:54 oneofthem wrote:On December 08 2015 12:28 Bigtony wrote:On December 08 2015 12:14 oneofthem wrote:On December 08 2015 09:06 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:The World Trade Organization (WTO) ruled Monday that Canada and Mexico can slap more than $1 billion in tariffs on U.S. goods in retaliation for meat labeling rules it says discriminated against Mexican and Canadian livestock.
At issue were U.S. labels on packaged steaks and other cuts of meat that say where the animals were born, raised and slaughtered.
The WTO has previously found that the so-called "country of origin" labeling law put Canadian and Mexican livestock at a disadvantage. It ruled Monday that Canada could impose $780 million in retaliatory tariffs and Mexico could impose $228 million.
"We are disappointed with this decision and its potential impact on trade among vital North American partners," said Tim Reif, general counsel for the Office of the U.S. Trade Representative.
The labels are supported by some U.S. ranchers and by consumer groups. They are opposed by meatpackers who say they require costly paperwork.
The WTO's decision shifts responsibility to Congress, which is considering working a repeal of the labeling law into a massive year-end spending bill.
Senate Agriculture Chairman Pat Roberts, R-Kansas, said Monday that he will look for "all legislative opportunities" to repeal the labeling law. "We must prevent retaliation, and we must do it now before these sanctions take effect," Roberts said. Source get rekt farm lobby hahaha More like get rekt consumers. Why shouldn't meat be labeled by country of origin? I want to know if my beef is american or foreign, especially if any of the processing is taking place in China. are you for real? as long as the meat is objectively the same, labeling is simply protectionism using ridiculous 'consumer' bias. What does it mean for meat from two different cows to be "objectively the same"?
We had this thing between the US and EU with food and how people in the EU want stuff that's genetically modified to be labeled and people said that's bullshit because there's no difference.
What's the difference that makes labeling beef from Canada cool but at the same time makes labeling GM not cool?
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On December 09 2015 07:09 Biff The Understudy wrote:
Although the fact anyone can support Trump is terrifying, I have to say that I find quite amusing the way Republicans have been committed to seppuku all their chances in the last years. Since the emergence of the Tea Party, it seems the GOP is the hostage of a bunch of absolute nutters that have no consideration for facts and reality. People like Paul Ryan, who seems to have designed his economics view on the compulsive reading of Atlas Shrugged would have been rightfully considered to be a fraud with no political future twenty years ago.
I'm quite happy with the state of things. It doesn't seem that the madness of Republicans is pulling the Democrats to the right as it happens in Europe, and as long as they keep displaying such a show, they have no chance to win the White House. The Democrats could put a goat against Trump or Carson and win easily at this stage.
The problem is the same "nutters" are going to be able to control the House for the foreseeable future, as well as many state legislatures.
At the state and local level, the GOP is pretty dominant.
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On December 09 2015 07:36 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2015 07:31 IgnE wrote:On December 08 2015 22:54 oneofthem wrote:On December 08 2015 12:28 Bigtony wrote:On December 08 2015 12:14 oneofthem wrote:On December 08 2015 09:06 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:The World Trade Organization (WTO) ruled Monday that Canada and Mexico can slap more than $1 billion in tariffs on U.S. goods in retaliation for meat labeling rules it says discriminated against Mexican and Canadian livestock.
At issue were U.S. labels on packaged steaks and other cuts of meat that say where the animals were born, raised and slaughtered.
The WTO has previously found that the so-called "country of origin" labeling law put Canadian and Mexican livestock at a disadvantage. It ruled Monday that Canada could impose $780 million in retaliatory tariffs and Mexico could impose $228 million.
"We are disappointed with this decision and its potential impact on trade among vital North American partners," said Tim Reif, general counsel for the Office of the U.S. Trade Representative.
The labels are supported by some U.S. ranchers and by consumer groups. They are opposed by meatpackers who say they require costly paperwork.
The WTO's decision shifts responsibility to Congress, which is considering working a repeal of the labeling law into a massive year-end spending bill.
Senate Agriculture Chairman Pat Roberts, R-Kansas, said Monday that he will look for "all legislative opportunities" to repeal the labeling law. "We must prevent retaliation, and we must do it now before these sanctions take effect," Roberts said. Source get rekt farm lobby hahaha More like get rekt consumers. Why shouldn't meat be labeled by country of origin? I want to know if my beef is american or foreign, especially if any of the processing is taking place in China. are you for real? as long as the meat is objectively the same, labeling is simply protectionism using ridiculous 'consumer' bias. What does it mean for meat from two different cows to be "objectively the same"? We had this thing between the US and EU with food and how people in the EU want stuff that's genetically modified to be labeled and people said that's bullshit because there's no difference. What's the difference that makes labeling beef from Canada cool but at the same time makes labeling GM not cool?
I think if the people want GM labeling they should have it.
Markets are increasingly just places where the producers (sharks) take the consumers (guppies) for as much as they possibly can, leveraging greater information, obfuscation about source and manufacturing conditions, and the power of ever larger corporate structures with the additional resources that implies.
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On December 09 2015 07:31 IgnE wrote:Show nested quote +On December 08 2015 22:54 oneofthem wrote:On December 08 2015 12:28 Bigtony wrote:On December 08 2015 12:14 oneofthem wrote:On December 08 2015 09:06 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:The World Trade Organization (WTO) ruled Monday that Canada and Mexico can slap more than $1 billion in tariffs on U.S. goods in retaliation for meat labeling rules it says discriminated against Mexican and Canadian livestock.
At issue were U.S. labels on packaged steaks and other cuts of meat that say where the animals were born, raised and slaughtered.
The WTO has previously found that the so-called "country of origin" labeling law put Canadian and Mexican livestock at a disadvantage. It ruled Monday that Canada could impose $780 million in retaliatory tariffs and Mexico could impose $228 million.
"We are disappointed with this decision and its potential impact on trade among vital North American partners," said Tim Reif, general counsel for the Office of the U.S. Trade Representative.
The labels are supported by some U.S. ranchers and by consumer groups. They are opposed by meatpackers who say they require costly paperwork.
The WTO's decision shifts responsibility to Congress, which is considering working a repeal of the labeling law into a massive year-end spending bill.
Senate Agriculture Chairman Pat Roberts, R-Kansas, said Monday that he will look for "all legislative opportunities" to repeal the labeling law. "We must prevent retaliation, and we must do it now before these sanctions take effect," Roberts said. Source get rekt farm lobby hahaha More like get rekt consumers. Why shouldn't meat be labeled by country of origin? I want to know if my beef is american or foreign, especially if any of the processing is taking place in China. are you for real? as long as the meat is objectively the same, labeling is simply protectionism using ridiculous 'consumer' bias. What does it mean for meat from two different cows to be "objectively the same"?
"Objectively" is the new "literally". Rob Lowe's newest TV show will feature it heavily.
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On December 09 2015 07:09 Biff The Understudy wrote:
Although the fact anyone can support Trump is terrifying, I have to say that I find quite amusing the way Republicans have been committed to seppuku all their chances in the last years. Since the emergence of the Tea Party, it seems the GOP is the hostage of a bunch of absolute nutters that have no consideration for facts and reality. People like Paul Ryan, who seems to have designed his economics view on the compulsive reading of Atlas Shrugged would have been rightfully considered to be a fraud with no political future twenty years ago.
I'm quite happy with the state of things. It doesn't seem that the madness of Republicans is pulling the Democrats to the right as it happens in Europe, and as long as they keep displaying such a show, they have no chance to win the White House. The Democrats could put a goat against Trump or Carson and win easily at this stage.
20 years ago New Gringrich became speaker of the House. The Contract with America won big nationwide before the Tea Party. If Ryan's budget and understanding of economics is fraud, then fraud was winning 20 years ago.
Europe's so far to the left compared to us that it'd take quite a bit of dragging to see parity with America. Immigration policy and ever increasing violence might just do it for their established moderate right.
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The Contract with America is when the Republicans went back to the well of pandering to "family values" and social issues. They do this every time they lose ground in the last 30 years, they aren't sure they can make it with small government arguments. So they tap the demographic that is super concerned about big government. If some of those people happen to be super homophobic and a little racist, its all fine. Its not effective for taking the oval office, but they don't seem to mind.
The rise of the tea party was them digging DEEP into that demographic and empowering a selection of the population that literally loath government in any form. Not the best long term plan, building your base based on a loathing of the political process. And also promising them things that can't be delivered on, like repealing the ACA.
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United States44440 Posts
On December 09 2015 07:55 Danglars wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2015 07:09 Biff The Understudy wrote:
Although the fact anyone can support Trump is terrifying, I have to say that I find quite amusing the way Republicans have been committed to seppuku all their chances in the last years. Since the emergence of the Tea Party, it seems the GOP is the hostage of a bunch of absolute nutters that have no consideration for facts and reality. People like Paul Ryan, who seems to have designed his economics view on the compulsive reading of Atlas Shrugged would have been rightfully considered to be a fraud with no political future twenty years ago.
I'm quite happy with the state of things. It doesn't seem that the madness of Republicans is pulling the Democrats to the right as it happens in Europe, and as long as they keep displaying such a show, they have no chance to win the White House. The Democrats could put a goat against Trump or Carson and win easily at this stage. 20 years ago New Gringrich became speaker of the House. The Contract with America won big nationwide before the Tea Party. If Ryan's budget and understanding of economics is fraud, then fraud was winning 20 years ago. Europe's so far to the left compared to us that it'd take quite a bit of dragging to see parity with America. Immigration policy and ever increasing violence might just do it for their established moderate right.
The UK at least has been moving steadily right for a while since the 70s.
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If Trump revealed this is all a joke/piece of performance art and released a documentary of it, would there be a better title than "My Struggle"?
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On December 09 2015 09:13 TheTenthDoc wrote:
If Trump revealed this is all a joke/piece of performance art and released a documentary of it, would there be a better title than "My Struggle"?
Probably whatever that translation is in German.
+ Show Spoiler +
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On December 09 2015 07:31 IgnE wrote:Show nested quote +On December 08 2015 22:54 oneofthem wrote:On December 08 2015 12:28 Bigtony wrote:On December 08 2015 12:14 oneofthem wrote:On December 08 2015 09:06 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:The World Trade Organization (WTO) ruled Monday that Canada and Mexico can slap more than $1 billion in tariffs on U.S. goods in retaliation for meat labeling rules it says discriminated against Mexican and Canadian livestock.
At issue were U.S. labels on packaged steaks and other cuts of meat that say where the animals were born, raised and slaughtered.
The WTO has previously found that the so-called "country of origin" labeling law put Canadian and Mexican livestock at a disadvantage. It ruled Monday that Canada could impose $780 million in retaliatory tariffs and Mexico could impose $228 million.
"We are disappointed with this decision and its potential impact on trade among vital North American partners," said Tim Reif, general counsel for the Office of the U.S. Trade Representative.
The labels are supported by some U.S. ranchers and by consumer groups. They are opposed by meatpackers who say they require costly paperwork.
The WTO's decision shifts responsibility to Congress, which is considering working a repeal of the labeling law into a massive year-end spending bill.
Senate Agriculture Chairman Pat Roberts, R-Kansas, said Monday that he will look for "all legislative opportunities" to repeal the labeling law. "We must prevent retaliation, and we must do it now before these sanctions take effect," Roberts said. Source get rekt farm lobby hahaha More like get rekt consumers. Why shouldn't meat be labeled by country of origin? I want to know if my beef is american or foreign, especially if any of the processing is taking place in China. are you for real? as long as the meat is objectively the same, labeling is simply protectionism using ridiculous 'consumer' bias. What does it mean for meat from two different cows to be "objectively the same"? EDIT: And why do you always come down on the side of producers when it comes to information asymmetries? Source is always linked to quality. Amazon for example has so much garbage-tier shit parading as the real deal and its often impossible to know what it is before you buy. Obfuscating the source just further fetishizes the commodity market, and in the age of big data, further reduces the possibility of consumer surplus, since sellers know everything about buyers and buyers know nothing about sellers.
Strange, I would argue the opposite. "Fetishizing the commodity market" as you put it would decrease, not increase market power of domestic sellers. This may not matter in terms of effective competition if the meat processing industry is already sufficiently deconcentrated, but I don't really know how it is in the US. Here in Brazil, at least, it's relatively concentrated (in meat processing, not so much in production), so producers would love a bit of free product differentiation if Brazil wasn't a net exporter.
Edit: though to be honest I don't know what "consumer surplus" actually means in marxist economic theory so maybe we're talking about different things.
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On December 09 2015 09:19 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2015 09:13 TheTenthDoc wrote:
If Trump revealed this is all a joke/piece of performance art and released a documentary of it, would there be a better title than "My Struggle"? Probably whatever that translation is in German. + Show Spoiler +
I think my people have that trademarked.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On December 09 2015 07:31 IgnE wrote:Show nested quote +On December 08 2015 22:54 oneofthem wrote:On December 08 2015 12:28 Bigtony wrote:On December 08 2015 12:14 oneofthem wrote:On December 08 2015 09:06 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:The World Trade Organization (WTO) ruled Monday that Canada and Mexico can slap more than $1 billion in tariffs on U.S. goods in retaliation for meat labeling rules it says discriminated against Mexican and Canadian livestock.
At issue were U.S. labels on packaged steaks and other cuts of meat that say where the animals were born, raised and slaughtered.
The WTO has previously found that the so-called "country of origin" labeling law put Canadian and Mexican livestock at a disadvantage. It ruled Monday that Canada could impose $780 million in retaliatory tariffs and Mexico could impose $228 million.
"We are disappointed with this decision and its potential impact on trade among vital North American partners," said Tim Reif, general counsel for the Office of the U.S. Trade Representative.
The labels are supported by some U.S. ranchers and by consumer groups. They are opposed by meatpackers who say they require costly paperwork.
The WTO's decision shifts responsibility to Congress, which is considering working a repeal of the labeling law into a massive year-end spending bill.
Senate Agriculture Chairman Pat Roberts, R-Kansas, said Monday that he will look for "all legislative opportunities" to repeal the labeling law. "We must prevent retaliation, and we must do it now before these sanctions take effect," Roberts said. Source get rekt farm lobby hahaha More like get rekt consumers. Why shouldn't meat be labeled by country of origin? I want to know if my beef is american or foreign, especially if any of the processing is taking place in China. are you for real? as long as the meat is objectively the same, labeling is simply protectionism using ridiculous 'consumer' bias. What does it mean for meat from two different cows to be "objectively the same"? EDIT: And why do you always come down on the side of producers when it comes to information asymmetries? Source is always linked to quality. Amazon for example has so much garbage-tier shit parading as the real deal and its often impossible to know what it is before you buy. Obfuscating the source just further fetishizes the commodity market, and in the age of big data, further reduces the possibility of consumer surplus, since sellers know everything about buyers and buyers know nothing about sellers.
this is ridiculous. if the quality is different then your technical standards should be able to distinguish the meats from each other.
it's not about information it is about being able to command market power through biases.
here we have a marxist standing up for one of the most oppressive industries in international trade, rekting them third worlders with subsidies and regulation.
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The FBI plans to overhaul its system for counting the number of deaths caused by police in the US, according to federal officials, and will begin releasing information about deadly encounters involving the use of Tasers and other force, in addition to fatal shootings.
Responding to months of sharp criticism over its existing program for reporting fatal shootings by police officers, the bureau is to unveil a new system that will publish a wider range of data, resembling that currently collected by an ongoing Guardian investigation.
Stephen Fischer, a senior official in the FBI’s criminal justice information services division in West Virginia, said it had “identified a need for more robust and complete information about encounters between law enforcement officers and citizens that result in a use of force”.
Officials said statisticians were intending to count deadly incidents involving physical force, Tasers and blunt weapons used by officers as well as firearms, and that they planned to begin gradually publishing some more information about fatal incidents as soon as 2016.
The bureau has for several years published an annual total of fatal shootings by police officers that are termed “justifiable homicides”. The country’s 18,000 law enforcement agencies, however, are under no obligation to report any killings by their officers.
The Guardian disclosed in October that only 224 departments reported a killing last year. The FBI’s total number of deaths has ranged from 397 to 461 since 2009.
Source
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EPT
