|
On September 07 2012 05:51 Zandar wrote:Show nested quote +On September 06 2012 19:46 FXOBoSs wrote:
FXO already advised Crane on what he was getting into in a friendly manner.
At this point, it is entirely crane/any agent he may have's responsibility. Please do not assume that if I have not stopped this it is my fault. I cannot control the decisions of other people.
Thanks for understanding. I can't imagine anyone blaming FXO for this tbh. If crank has an agent he should leave him too though, not beying able to filter out scum like Blight for your players, is an incapable agent.
i think you didn't read the thread properly - he didn't sign any of those players except for crane - he tried to .. and was abv. not succesful..
i guess the post you quoted just says that FXO helped to get in contact with crane to clear the situation up a bit (in the proper language for him and not just by random people from the interwebz)
|
On September 07 2012 05:04 Xeris wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2012 04:55 ToXSiK wrote:On September 07 2012 04:48 Xeris wrote:
It's not impossible to fund a team yourself... I've funded LighT out of my own pocket for the past 9 months and I've given everyone on the team everything I promised.
As long as you can manage your funds properly, it's not outlandish to run a team from your own pocket.
Hey Xeris, I don't know if this was directed at me, but I wanted to reply. If this guy had a legitimate history financially (Like you do with LighT-eSports), I would have zero problem accepting the fact that a single individual has money and is supporting his/her own personal team, sponsors or not. But when you look at his history, the amount of scams he's been involved in, I wanted to start asking him some financial questions about how he is going to support the team. He just dodged all of my questions and finally gets to "Well, I fund the team myself and I'm not really employed" (His wording was something like this, I can pull the quote from skype if you guys would like) I 100% agree someone with a job (Or just some money!) can fully support an esport team, but with BlackFoger, I wanted facts from him. I wanted to know What have you changed since x, y, and z scams that I should trust you? Every post I read about you consistent on you not coming through to your players financially, what has changed and why should I trust you now?. When he couldn't muster up a feasable response to this, I had to decline his offer. Oh ya for sure... obviously my players trusted me enough going into this and thus far there have been no problems :D I also make all my money stripping at nights, but that's another story. Regardless, I was kinda just making a general comment about it being possible to fund a team yourself. I'm not rich independently, nor do I make a ton of money, but I can manage this because I'm careful and don't waste money on dumb stuff :D! I don't really know Blight and can't comment about its history at all, was just making general comments. I will say that anyone paying stuff out of their pocket expecting to get reimbursed when they don't really know/trust the source is incredibly stupid.
Yea i remember a while back his pitch was that you pay out of pocket and then he'll reimburse you which from other people i knew who did that never got reimbursed by him. Dunno if its still that way or not but it takes a lot for a person to shake off their own history
|
after reading the last twelve pages...
can't we just ban blackforger? even if he has made some miraculous change, this guy's history is enough to make anything he says mired in a pile of shit.
I had to deal with scams involving gaming "organizations" when I was playing call of duty, it's a deceitful business, and it screwed me out of a fair amount of money back in the day. The worst part is these "organizations" damage the growth of esports.
|
So where is this announcement? I hope he really does give a good one cause he needs it after all he has done to the players and the communitys.
|
On September 07 2012 06:14 SilSol wrote:
So where is this announcement? I hope he really does give a good one cause he needs it after all he has done to the players and the communitys.
He did say couple days. Maybe he's currently "in-gauging" in writing that announcement, or with coming up excuses for every person he's screwed over?
|
Crane should just cut contact with this dude and move on if he just found about about this dude. Who cares if he signed a contract? It's not like this dude is going to pony up thousands of dollars to fight a legal war in Korea when he's known for not even being able to pay any of the former players he "signed" or even be able to pay $20 dollar CEVO fee's for his teams.
if it came down to it and shit got real (which there's a 99.9999999999% chance it wont seeing as how the kid is a joke) im sure Crane's 'contract' can be voided almost instantly due to it being written by a fucking teenager instead of any sort of qualified lawyer or even someone knowledgeable in law/contract drafting.
To whoever got in contact with Crane: Reassure him the person he signed with is a fraud and that nothing will occur by cutting communication with this guy. He has every right to do so and should not feel guilty, ashamed or scared of reprocussions. From the sound of it he seems more afraid than anything to back out of a contract he signed since he believes hes actually dealing with a legitimate company/team.
|
On September 07 2012 06:10 renaissanceMAN wrote:
after reading the last twelve pages...
can't we just ban blackforger? even if he has made some miraculous change, this guy's history is enough to make anything he says mired in a pile of shit.
I had to deal with scams involving gaming "organizations" when I was playing call of duty, it's a deceitful business, and it screwed me out of a fair amount of money back in the day. The worst part is these "organizations" damage the growth of esports.
if he was banned he could just sign people and we wouldnt know
at least this way we can tell them after the fact o:
|
On September 07 2012 06:16 hunts wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2012 06:14 SilSol wrote:
So where is this announcement? I hope he really does give a good one cause he needs it after all he has done to the players and the communitys. He did say couple days. Maybe he's currently "in-gauging" in writing that announcement, or with coming up excuses for every person he's screwed over?
I have been sick with a fever, been writing it right now going through each persons post on TL to answer them all.
|
How about we hold a Webinar where everyone can step in and ask questions? I'll host it.
|
I want someone to skype call him and record everything and see what kind of a person he really is. See what he has to say about everything and now trying to destroy the careers of starcraft 2 players.
|
On September 07 2012 05:27 howLiN wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2012 03:23 EagleShade wrote:
Ok.. even if there is a terrible history perhaps Blight and/or Blackfoger changed....
Oh.. wait. If they really wanted to change, or even had a BRAIN in their SKULL, they would have done what any smart organization does when they screw up. CHANGE THEIR NAME.
Really Blackfoger? You screw teams and players (as this evidence is pretty condemning and from multiple sources) and don't even change your handle, the teams name, or the business' name?
LOL That alone tells you what kind of "organization" (if there is one) this is. You even suck at scamming people. Changing your name/contact info is like rule #1 in scamming! I was thinking about this too lol.
Maybe he just like the humor in that a team with the name Blight destroys everything it touches.
|
On September 07 2012 06:30 Blackfoger wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2012 06:16 hunts wrote:On September 07 2012 06:14 SilSol wrote:
So where is this announcement? I hope he really does give a good one cause he needs it after all he has done to the players and the communitys. He did say couple days. Maybe he's currently "in-gauging" in writing that announcement, or with coming up excuses for every person he's screwed over? I have been sick with a fever, been writing it right now going through each persons post on TL to answer them all.
Addressing EVERYONE's comment sounds really stupid, why don't you just make an overall statement regarding the accusations that have been on you recently ?
|
On September 06 2012 20:22 lastshadow wrote:
Crane is not of legal age until January 1st 2013 to sign contracts without the consent of his parents. He also can not agree to "fully understanding the terms and conditions" which should be labled (in S.Korea jurisdictional law) if the contract is in English without a Korean translation also being on the contract.
does that mean crane can still get out of this?
|
|
|
On September 07 2012 04:50 Xeris wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2012 04:47 LuckoftheIrish wrote:On September 07 2012 03:13 Sent. wrote:On September 07 2012 03:01 HornyHerring wrote:On September 07 2012 02:59 Sent. wrote:
Can someone explain me how exactly is that guy making profits from scamming players (if he really does that)? The contract says that he takes their tournament wins to 'manage' for the players. He promises paying for flights, accomodation etc. and never does that. There's a lot of reading in this thread with examples and cases you might wanna read on. I didn't ask about what he isn't doing. I'm asking how is it profitable to scam average pro or semi-pro players. I read some posts in this thread and I understand the problem. I just wonder how doing something like this can pay off. Well, I'm going to OJ Simpson the fuck out of this. If I were going to be an eSports scammer in the Blight mold, here's what I'd do. I'd promise a team or player travel expenses in exchange for tagging. My goal here is to get them to pay most or all of their expenses themselves; if I need to make small payments to facilitate this, then I'd do that. But generally I'm going to be offering money in the high hundreds of dollars to the thousands of dollars, both in salary and travel coverage depending on what I want to get out of them. Then I'm going to claim difficulties procuring the money, getting the team or player to cover their own travel to the event. I need to have a good relationship with them at this point, so they still participate in the event with my tag. After the event is over and they start asking awkward questions like 'when are we getting our money' I basically bail on them. I turn around and approach sponsors with the team's results - 'Hey, you should become a sponsor of xXx Gaming Club! xXxGC has big plans! Our team placed in the top 8 at YYY LAN, ahead of major teams like ZZZ Gaming! Our player 'Player01' is working to start streaming with a webcam and commentary on this service. He's going to have an overlay which will advertise your product to everyone who watches, and he'll talk about your product in the community! A partnership with us will be awesome for your organization!' - essentially the way a legitimate team would. I'm going to take the money they give me personally and either sell any goods I get - peripherals or hardware or whatever - to increase my takehome or use them as inducements for the next team or player I approach. If sponsors start asking awkward questions I'm going to bounce around as much as I can, running as many teams and players as possible through the system. Hopefully, that'll keep the sponsors continuing to pay me as long as they don't really pay attention to what's going on. I'd need to use multiple communities and keep bouncing around between them so I don't get too infamous. Anyway. I wouldn't be surprised at all if that's what blackfoger was doing. If I were going to try to make a living scamming pro gamers - and to my knowledge, at the height of blackfoger's involvement with Dota, CSS and TF2 he was living with his parents, so it ain't a great living - that's how I'd do it. No pro would pay out of their own pocket to go places, let alone a Korean like Crane. If anyone even agreed to do that they're completely moronic and just as bad as the guy scamming them. While I think Crane shouldn't have signed with Blight, I also think people are way over exaggerating when they say "Crane is going to get fucked over." Worst case scenario, they don't send him to any events and he's in Korea doing the same stuff he normally would do. If they send him to an event, that's great. If they promise him a salary and don't pay, well it sucks but then he can just leave the team.
A few ESEA LANs ago, Blackfoger sent 3 teams to ESEA LAN (some of which had to pay their own way with promise of reimbursement) and ended up leaving them high and dry with all of the hotel bills for them to pay. His credit card was bounced and he refused to pay forthwith. The hotel threatened to call the cops on all 3 teams if they did not come up with the funds somehow. Fortunately, Craig "Torbull" Levine was there (owner of ESEA) and temporarily covered the players for the hotel rooms and required they pay ESEA back once arriving back home. And before anyone questions this story, I witnessed this first hand. I was also at the LAN managing the two CheckSix teams we had at the LAN as well.
So there are worse things that can happen, and if there is anyone that will find a way to enable those circumstances for their players it is Blackfoger.
|
Sorry to Crane, he's been duped 
|
I skimmed that post, Blackfoger. And while everything was poorly written (seriously, if you have staff like you say, hire a fucking PR guy or something. Maybe just someone who understands syntax and can spell proficiently. That might help), the thing that really made me laugh was this:
I do not remember at all nor do we have our records about the Dota squad, consisting of Demon, Fear, Merlini, Puppey and Kuroky. I do think we mismanaged that entire situation and didn’t deliver on salaries when they were do that’s all I can recall. We never asked them to front anything.
You don't remember anything, and yet you think you mismanaged it. Fascinating. Are you also suggesting that all of them are liars and that they're out to get you for no reason? Seems unlikely to me bud.
Honestly, that response is a whole lot of nothing. Nobody said you had anything to do with AZK, it was simply suggesting that the way in which you operate might be similar. You make a lot of claims that simply have no structure or support, and you never give us a reason to believe in what you say.
So really, I'ma stick with thinking that you're trying to scam a few more players. Which is pretty shitty of you.
|
On September 07 2012 07:17 Zennith wrote:I skimmed that post, Blackfoger. And while everything was poorly written (seriously, if you have staff like you say, hire a fucking PR guy or something. Maybe just someone who understands syntax and can spell proficiently. That might help), the thing that really made me laugh was this: Show nested quote +I do not remember at all nor do we have our records about the Dota squad, consisting of Demon, Fear, Merlini, Puppey and Kuroky. I do think we mismanaged that entire situation and didn’t deliver on salaries when they were do that’s all I can recall. We never asked them to front anything. You don't remember anything, and yet you think you mismanaged it. Fascinating. Are you also suggesting that all of them are liars and that they're out to get you for no reason? Seems unlikely to me bud. Honestly, that response is a whole lot of nothing. Nobody said you had anything to do with AZK, it was simply suggesting that the way in which you operate might be similar. You make a lot of claims that simply have no structure or support, and you never give us a reason to believe in what you say. So really, I'ma stick with thinking that you're trying to scam a few more players. Which is pretty shitty of you.
First 3 pages someone mentioned AZK I was replying to that. As far as the DOTA squad I am just writing what I remember was nearly 4-5 years ago and we don't have records that far back. As far as claims many of it can be backed up by the paypal logs as well as the players themselves can tell you, such as zomblerz.
|
|
|
Would you address why you've done what you've done? What did you gain from not fulfilling promises and bringing a bad name and reputation onto yourself? What was the point?
Notice the questioning was past tense. I just want to know what was going through your mind at the time.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
