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Think twice before hitting post; this thread will be moderated for idiocy and useless posts. Consider this a warning. |
On May 02 2012 02:17 Clairissa wrote: “I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.”
Nice little quote who planted here, but as clarification that has to do with government censorship which has absolutely nothing to do with this subject. No one thinks the government should be involved. Everyone here (should) believes Destiny has the right to say whatever he wants.
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On May 02 2012 02:23 danson wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 02:19 PeZuY wrote:On May 02 2012 02:18 danson wrote:On May 02 2012 02:12 Destiny wrote:On May 02 2012 02:00 intrigue wrote: guys, i'd like to let you know that i've suffered a bit in my life. that means i know what the world is like. i also never make mistakes, because, as i've mentioned, i've been through some hardship. this qualifies me to make sweeping social critiques that spans way beyond any of our lifetimes. fuck the empty media! Seriously? Who is this faggot? I thought the colored name or w/e meant he was a mod or some shit? How fucking mad are you right now, bro? Seriously? Grow up man. No one likes this shit and I am hoping the mods throw a 90 day on you like they did Idra, would love to see less of you for a while. That doesnt solve anything since he doesnt write to TL so often : ) it would get him off the featured list I don't see it working either, Destiny has large fan base. Fans that get mailed when stream are online, which I get. If you really, REALLY have an issue, maybe go to own3d?
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I think the real issue here is what started this. You. Specifically, you being terrible started this. So being terrible at something gives enough excuse to be the victim of being called a racial/ethnic slur?
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
Perhaps a bit of analysis that is missing should be laid out.. emailing sponsors is an act of attrition. This time around, maybe there isn't much damage. Maybe it doesn't really effect how they work within SC2. But if we make this a force of habit, if we do this each time we are upset.. it grows and becomes a huge issue. We need to stop doing this because we are toying with shit we don't see and we are messing with massively important companies.
There are other ways of protesting issues. Mail the team, post on the forums, tweet, actively stop watching functions.. etc etc.. be responsible. We don't need to throw shit at the top of the pyramid hoping it will trickle down and hit the guys on the bottom. Throw shit at the guys doing it! Go to those responsible directly: the team!
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On May 02 2012 02:20 Dreycor wrote:Show nested quote +I am not trying to prove that. Your post was advocating free speech, and this entire thread is basically all about that; both Destiny and the community all have the right to express themselves.
The community (or whoever is voicing displeasure) is arguing they are displeased and disrespected by his language. They don't have to prove anything, because that is a fact. They feel that way.
He shouldn't be punished legally because it is not a law, but he can be punished in other ways such as contacting sponsors or social ostracization. Along with the right to speak comes the right to be criticized. You're right, he can be punished. just like i can punish a man who i believe has done wrong. so if i believe a man has done wrong i can punish him? well why do we even bother with a legal system. i'm going to get a gun 'cos i feel like punishing some of the wrong do-ers here. And while i'm at it i'm going to punish a lot of other people too. You cannot punish someone because you feel that they should be punishedis it justice these (you) people are after? or vengeance?
No you cannot punish him because it would be illegal to do so with a gun.
Destiny is knowingly firing verbal bullets and he's intelligent enough to know he's doing so, he just (rightfully) believes he has the right to say what he wants.
The people being shot at by these verbal bullets are merely firing back in the same manner.
I agreed with your initial post about his right to speech -- it's just that the right of speech flows both ways. His critics are rightfully allowed to say what they want about Destiny to whoever they want also. If it affects him negatively he really only has himself to blame.
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On May 02 2012 02:22 Destiny wrote: Using the word faggot is just encapsulating decades/centuries of what a bundle of sticks is in one small, representative term. The term is understood to be used for that intent and to represent that by the general public. Your use of it is of absolutely no utility except for the fact that it is viewed as a term for a bundle of sticks, so you use it in anger. If the word had other utility, such as the word "stick-bundle," for example, then you'd have a point. But the only reason these words exist in the vernacular is as describing a pile of sticks. You perpetuate that by continually and purposefully using it.
Wow. This is just... Wait, let me quote you again:
I don't even know how to start tearing apart the idiocy of this statement.
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On May 02 2012 02:27 iNcontroL wrote: Perhaps a bit of analysis that is missing should be laid out.. emailing sponsors is an act of attrition. This time around, maybe there isn't much damage. Maybe it doesn't really effect how they work within SC2. But if we make this a force of habit, if we do this each time we are upset.. it grows and becomes a huge issue. We need to stop doing this because we are toying with shit we don't see and we are messing with massively important companies.
There are other ways of protesting issues. Mail the team, post on the forums, tweet, actively stop watching functions.. etc etc.. be responsible. We don't need to throw shit at the top of the pyramid hoping it will trickle down and hit the guys on the bottom. Throw shit at the guys doing it! Go to those responsible directly: the team! yea but the team wont do a shit, time to email razer
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You guys are all lil faggits for thinking destiny is racist. If i could email your sponsors (parents) and tell them that you are faggits i would.
enjoy moderating my post while i go smoke ab owl
User was banned for this post.
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On May 02 2012 02:28 andReslic wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 02:27 iNcontroL wrote: Perhaps a bit of analysis that is missing should be laid out.. emailing sponsors is an act of attrition. This time around, maybe there isn't much damage. Maybe it doesn't really effect how they work within SC2. But if we make this a force of habit, if we do this each time we are upset.. it grows and becomes a huge issue. We need to stop doing this because we are toying with shit we don't see and we are messing with massively important companies.
There are other ways of protesting issues. Mail the team, post on the forums, tweet, actively stop watching functions.. etc etc.. be responsible. We don't need to throw shit at the top of the pyramid hoping it will trickle down and hit the guys on the bottom. Throw shit at the guys doing it! Go to those responsible directly: the team! yea but the team wont do a shit, time to email razer what makes you think they wont do anything?
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On May 02 2012 02:25 Mikey wrote: ? pretty sure he left complexity because they had problems with how he represented himself on his stream. quantic doesn't care. pointless thread.
Quantic is myopic then, there's no way to escape the pitchforks.
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On May 02 2012 02:20 Let it Raine wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 22:16 WardenSC wrote:I was playing vs QuanticDestiny a few hours ago where he was calling me a "gook" and a bunch of offensive words. Now I understand that one may get frustrated if he/she loses in a game (I've been there myself). I also understand that it is his stream and he may say that he can do whatever the hell he wants in his stream. However, he stands now as a "community figure" who has the reach to influence thousands of viewers daily and can skew the public's view of sc2 community in an extremely negative direction. Isn't it reasonable to expect a level of professionalism from a player that plays on a professional team? I just don't think spurting out racial slurs left and right in front of a large audience is why Quantic sponsors Destiny to market their team. As a note, I don't think QuanticDestiny is a true racist. However, I do believe that ignorance towards his excessive use of racial slurs would eventually lead to tolerance within the community and that would be a very dangerous outcome. I think the real issue here is what started this. You. Specifically, you being terrible started this. I want destiny to make a topic calling out the issue of cheesing players and how being garbage is a tolerated thing in this community. Imagine, for a second, if you didn't cheese destiny. All of a sudden, there's no racial slur being thrown around! All of a sudden you can't make this awful topic! Why is this? Because cheesing is a form of insult to most players. Even if you win, knowing that you could potentially lose to some awful player doing a skill less build is angering to most of the people who play this game. Bad players winning games by doing skill less strategies is the biggest problem this game has and is the cause for so many people hating this game. I dream of a world where I don't have to deal with skill less players doing skill less builds while still having a decent chance at beating me. I dream of a world where cheesers don't act surprised or offended when someone bms them for being complete garbage. I dream of a lactose intolerant world. P.S. I particularly enjoyed that screenshot. 1 base @ 15 minutes, proxy 2 port (you're known for it), the interrupting KOREAN gg despite you being an english speaker, and destiny not being korean.... not to mention while he's clearly about to bm you for being on one base for 15 minutes. It's like you WANTED this to happen, just so you could post this god awful thread. You should be banned from this forum for being such a faggot.
Wait...are you trying to say that using cheese strats in Starcraft 2 is worse than using racial slurs?
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This really is incredible. I can't believe the thin-skinned nature of this society.
Do you call your local rap station and complain about the language used in their songs? How about movie producers? No, you don't. You rather ride this shallow populist wave and take actions which could ruin the legitimacy of E-Sports. Do I agree with everything Destiny says? No. I do however support his right to say it. If you do not like his stream, then don't watch it! Get that big Political Correctness dildo out your ass and grow some balls. Man you e-warriors and slacktivist are annoying. Send an email and save the world! I still find it funny that a forum with a large majority young white boys are getting all up in arms about the word gook and nigger. If you are asian or black, feel free to voice your opinion since you are the ones who are potentially offended. Everyone else STFU.
Thank you for providing me countless hours of entertainment Destiny. Been you fan for awhile, and will continue to do so. I will personally write to Razer and Quantic and voice my support.
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Stop paying attention to this 'person' please. Thank you.
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On May 02 2012 02:12 Destiny wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 02:00 intrigue wrote: guys, i'd like to let you know that i've suffered a bit in my life. that means i know what the world is like. i also never make mistakes, because, as i've mentioned, i've been through some hardship. this qualifies me to make sweeping social critiques that spans way beyond any of our lifetimes. fuck the empty media! Seriously? Who is this faggot? I thought the colored name or w/e meant he was a mod or some shit? How fucking mad are you right now, bro?
The real question is how mad are you? And how mad will you be by the day's end?
You should take a break from this thread as you are obviously infatuated by it (you posted a reply before the admin could even post that the thread was unlocked). Your' responses are clearly making you lose popularity which, by the sounds of it, are your only means of income at the moment.
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On May 02 2012 02:29 PassiveAce wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 02:28 andReslic wrote:On May 02 2012 02:27 iNcontroL wrote: Perhaps a bit of analysis that is missing should be laid out.. emailing sponsors is an act of attrition. This time around, maybe there isn't much damage. Maybe it doesn't really effect how they work within SC2. But if we make this a force of habit, if we do this each time we are upset.. it grows and becomes a huge issue. We need to stop doing this because we are toying with shit we don't see and we are messing with massively important companies.
There are other ways of protesting issues. Mail the team, post on the forums, tweet, actively stop watching functions.. etc etc.. be responsible. We don't need to throw shit at the top of the pyramid hoping it will trickle down and hit the guys on the bottom. Throw shit at the guys doing it! Go to those responsible directly: the team! yea but the team wont do a shit, time to email razer what makes you think they wont do anything?
they did not do anything about it since they picked him up
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On May 02 2012 02:26 -_- wrote:Show nested quote +On May 02 2012 02:10 iNcontroL wrote:On May 02 2012 02:04 aristarchus wrote:On May 02 2012 01:52 iNcontroL wrote: mailing sponsors instead of the team is so completely fucked up and horrible.
mail the SHIT out of quantic. If they don't do anything or say anything for a few weeks.. make threads, tweet, write more letters to quantic.. but by no means at all should you mail sponsors with things like that.
Razer sponsors a lot more than just destiny or even quantic.. by one man's error you are potentially making it worse for a LOT of people.
Even if you disagree with what I said you could probably agree that quantic deserves a chance to respond before you start emailing sponsors.
Debating whether we should be emailing sponsors is sort of moot at this point. You're right - it's dumb (and I say this as someone who really thinks we should have no tolerance for this stuff). But it's going to happen. In society at large, anyone who sponsors someone who spouts racial slurs constantly gets angry email. The only way to avoid this is to keep the community so small and marginal as to have a whole different social norm than the rest of society, and I don't think any of us want that. So sponsors will get emailed. Knowing this, we should be talking about as a community not how to make sure that racial slurs don't lead to sponsor emails, but how to stop the racial slurs. And really, it's sort of stupid to say "give Quantic a chance to respond". With Orb, it was at least conceivable that EG didn't know about the fact that he still said stuff like this. Destiny is famous for it. Quantic knows perfectly well he says this stuff, and they've known it for months. It's not like this should take them by surprise or they had no chance to act first. No it isn't moot.. people hear reasons not to do things and sometimes don't do things they otherwise would. And no the "give quantic a chance" thing isn't dumb. It's the most reasonable response to this situation. yes Quantic knew that Destiny was an opinionated and sometimes controversial player but they also knew he was an intelligent human being who could be reasoned with. Just because Destiny has said some fringe shit in the past doesn't mean he should be untouchable by a team or that once a team does grab him you (the community) now have a free license to act as drastic as you like because WELL DESTINY IS PRONE TO DO STUFF. Come on man? You are literally arguing in defense of being a mob of pitchfork people trying to do the most damage possible. I am arguing for people to go through proper channels and protect that which we love. Get really tired when people assume "you are hurting esports" isn't a real possibility. A lot of you are either very young or incredibly under educated on esports to think we are untouchable. Entire fucking communities have died. Leagues have collapsed and sponsors have walked away never to come back. This shit does happen. Why flirt with it? I think emailing sponsors is silly, but reading your post I'm not sure you regularly watch Destiny's stream. He use racial and homophobic slurs daily. And if Quantic pays the slightest modicum of attention to him, they know this. So, if a person does feel strongly about Destiny's language, they probably also disagree with Quantic's tacit encouragement. As for Destiny, I'd tell him he's idiot, but he's not. One the one hand, there's no reason to use racial slurs. Even if society does arbitrarily discriminate as to what words are acceptable, none of the words being censored are all that useful. If I can't call someone a gook after losing a computer game, what's lost? So, why should Destiny fight for something worthless? Well, it's part of who he is, and why people find him interesting. In fact, defending himself stridently is part of that too. Now, I doubt he's some conniving PT Barnum, but on some level I'd wager he recognizes "Destiny being Destiny" is a good thing for Destiny.
I do watch his stream and I am aware of how he talks. But this is the 2nd time the community has made thread(s) talking about how it upsets them. It isn't like each time he says "faggot" we get a new batch of people advocating emailing sponsors/teams etc.. this time around it is getting attention from people that A. don't watch his stream or B. do, but didn't care until now
Threads make this kind of stuff "official" because it draws in more people who will actively do something than a few occurrences on a daily stream will ever instigate.
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On May 02 2012 02:20 Let it Raine wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 22:16 WardenSC wrote:I was playing vs QuanticDestiny a few hours ago where he was calling me a "gook" and a bunch of offensive words. Now I understand that one may get frustrated if he/she loses in a game (I've been there myself). I also understand that it is his stream and he may say that he can do whatever the hell he wants in his stream. However, he stands now as a "community figure" who has the reach to influence thousands of viewers daily and can skew the public's view of sc2 community in an extremely negative direction. Isn't it reasonable to expect a level of professionalism from a player that plays on a professional team? I just don't think spurting out racial slurs left and right in front of a large audience is why Quantic sponsors Destiny to market their team. As a note, I don't think QuanticDestiny is a true racist. However, I do believe that ignorance towards his excessive use of racial slurs would eventually lead to tolerance within the community and that would be a very dangerous outcome. I think the real issue here is what started this. You. Specifically, you being terrible started this. I want destiny to make a topic calling out the issue of cheesing players and how being garbage is a tolerated thing in this community. Imagine, for a second, if you didn't cheese destiny. All of a sudden, there's no racial slur being thrown around! All of a sudden you can't make this awful topic! Why is this? Because cheesing is a form of insult to most players. Even if you win, knowing that you could potentially lose to some awful player doing a skill less build is angering to most of the people who play this game. Bad players winning games by doing skill less strategies is the biggest problem this game has and is the cause for so many people hating this game. I dream of a world where I don't have to deal with skill less players doing skill less builds while still having a decent chance at beating me. I dream of a world where cheesers don't act surprised or offended when someone bms them for being complete garbage. I dream of a lactose intolerant world. P.S. I particularly enjoyed that screenshot. 1 base @ 15 minutes, proxy 2 port (you're known for it), the interrupting KOREAN gg despite you being an english speaker, and destiny not being korean.... not to mention while he's clearly about to bm you for being on one base for 15 minutes. It's like you WANTED this to happen, just so you could post this god awful thread. You should be banned from this forum for being such a faggot.
I understand what you are getting at, but you can't realistically think this will ever happen. He isn't a relavent player. And as (I hope) destiny becomes more and more relavent, he will stop wasting his time on this shit. Just leave and continue like nothing happened. There will ALWAYS be cheesers. That is what they are. They don't have to be good (obviously) but they can still bring out the worst in people that want to. If he has to vent, I have no problem with that. At this point, the people on his stream know what they are getting into, he can speak his mind to them, he doesn't ever have to type something that can be screenshotted and put out so easily.
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There is in fact a double standard of offensive language. Destiny built himself on it, we probably can't take it away from him now.
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Why does everyone say that because Quantic hasn't thrown Destiny out yet it is okay to email the sponsors? Have you tried contacting Quantic about this or do you just assume that tons of other people have been contacting them about this for a long time? You could just as easily say that since the sponsors haven't reacted yet they obviously do not care about racial slurs being associated with their brand, but of course that would be silly. Maybe Quantic did not think everyone was so upset about this as suddenly everyone is.
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I hope people hit up the sponsors till this e-sports bubble dies. Seriously, this bloated community is full of people who either can't grow a thick skin or who can't grow up enough to learn acceptable human interaction.
Destiny: Grow up. I thought I was done with all this tough guy stuff in high school. If you can't live in an adult world where you need to take responsibility for the thing that you say, then you fully deserve any repercussions you receive at the end of this whole fiasco.
Destiny-Haters: Grow a thicker skin. Go out in the world and learn how to deal with assholes. They exist, and if you act like this every time you meet one you probably won't last long. Get out of your little bubble and learn to accept the fact that not everyone is going to be as politically correct as you want them to be.
I've never seen so much shit flung over a non-issue. I love StarCraft, but this thread is downright disgusting.
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