This needs to be cleared up, because I cant stand reading all of the misinformed posts in the numerous other threads.
Naniwa did not earn a Code S spot from MLG Providence. GOM was going to give him one of the two foreigner spots.
Based on Naniwa's behaviour at the Blizzard cup, they chose to not give him that spot, and instead, give it to someone else.
I think this is a very fair reaction, seeing as how he acted inappropriately. GOM was going to give him a gift, Naniwa ofended them, they decided they would no longer give him that gift.
Please people, whether you agree or disagree with Naniwas actions, at least understand what you are arguing over. This will save a lot of headaches in the multitude of other threads related to this issue.
I'm assuming this is because MLG Providence didn't have any invited Koreans, which was the "trade" for GSL seeds, and the MLG-GSL exchange program was only for 2011 anyways and any Providence seeds would've been for 2012.
The effect is the same though. He had a Code S invite then lost it.
A list of quotes from MLG and some fansites that all say that Naniwa EARNED his code S spot. Calling it a gift is like calling the prize money of a tournament a gift.
On December 15 2011 01:19 pallad wrote: Its same thing to me.. They annunce he got spot , then they take it back ( what i like btw , little off topic )
huh? they announced this? where
edit: this says otherwise
"NaNiwa는 애초에 코드S 시드가 아니었습니다. '만약 어제 그런 행동이 없었다면 시드를 줄 수 있었을지도 모른다'가 맞습니다. 많은 분들이 MLG프로비던스에서 코드S 시드가 나온 것으로 알고 계시지만 없었습니다." says "naniwa was never a code s seed. 'if he hadnt done that he might have gotten the seed' is right. a lot of people think MLG providence produced code s seed but that wasnt the case"
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
Clearly there was confusion, and I dont think slasher is lying in his twitter. So we can now focus the debate around the new facts that have been revealed.
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
Hi, the point i dont get is why didnt he ot the Code S Spot from Providence?
i always thought top2 receive code s... and he lost to leenock in the Finals.. Leenok is code s already!? and just got a backup spot if he fails to qualify trough the last season ... right? So why didnt naniwa got the second Code s spot via mlg?
maybe my memory messes me up .. but just asking..
i am a HUUUUGE idra fan.. but i dont like the idea that the gracken took Naniwas spot.....
and does someone knows if Sen or Idra is the replacement for the Code S Blizzcon spot they took away from naniwa ?
neeeeed official Infos regarding which invite goes to which plyer and why.....
This is a load BS, because how has Stephano not got a code S spot? he was in the blizzard cup and has done a lot better than Naniwa, Idra and Sen in the last few months. Does Stephano even want a code S spot?
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
This should've been the OP, not the current misguided one. Obviously they revoked his spot, not just decided to "not give him a gift"
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
"At MLG Columbus, the Top 3 non-Korean finishers will each be placed into GSL Code A. At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows:
Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status."
heres how life is. if you act like a dick karmas going to come back at you
Lets look at it this way. currently GSL is the SC2 channel in Korea. All the koreans watch this so they can get their fill for SC2 GSL/GOMtv is a Business Naniwa is a pawn in the business. Naniwas job is to give SC2 games because he is a PRO, that is why he is THERE Naniwa DID NOT fulfill his job. You cannot call that a game of sending probes. Please dont say this is even a legitimate strategy, thats just some technical bullcrock. Would you even do it on ladder? GSL was like well **** you, you dont make our business look good peace
Ultimately he dropped the following four games, and despite not being crowned champion, Naniwa has presented one of the most captivating weeks imaginable, both in and out of the game. In the last week, Naniwa has rage quit of of a GSL match, flown half-way around the world, defeated the two most successful Korean Starcraft 2 players back-to-back, sparked a rivalry with Nestea, been the center of controversy in a rematch against Nestea, let a National Championship slip through his fingers and earned a seat in Code S.
Over the last few months, Naniwa has been training hard over in Korea to take his game to the next level, and his hard work appeared to pay off in Providence. The 2nd Place finish was good enough to earn him a Code S spot, so keep an eye on this MLG Champion as he goes toe-to-toe with the world's best during the offseason.
Naniwa, however, stayed focused on his goal. Amidst swirls of tabloid drama and misguided quotes, Naniwa kept his concentration on the task at hand. When his turn to enter the bracket finally rolled around, the Swedish Protoss defeated Nestea for the second time that weekend, and followed the feat with wins over Huk and DongRaeGu. In the end Naniwa failed to seal the deal as he lost four straight games against Leenock in the Grand Finals, but appeared to be a man with a renewed determination and a refined playstyle. With the pedigree Naniwa displayed over the weekend, it's hard not to be excited about Naniwa's 2012 prospects in Code S and at Major League Gaming Events.
At MLG Columbus, the Top 3 non-Korean finishers will each be placed into GSL Code A. At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, within the Top 3, regardless of country of origin, who does not already have Code S status. Code S status will not be awarded if all of the players placing 1st-3rd already have Code S Status. Code A status will be awarded to the next three highest placing non-Korean players. If Code S status is awarded to a Korean player, or not awarded at all, Code A status also will be awarded to the 4th highest placing non-Korean player.
Naniwa was able to secure a huge victory and guarantee at least a Top 3 finish in Providence. That placement will gives him a chance to secure Code S and continues the run of world class players that Naniwa has defeated over the course of the championship weekend in Providence.
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
Clearly there was confusion, and I dont think slasher is lying in his twitter. So we can now focus the debate around the new facts that have been revealed.
The first quote doesnt even state the reasons for why it was given. I would tend to assume Slasher is right in this case since he isn't stating an opinion(which I tend to disagree with from him ) and he would be someone who would know whether it is given or earned.
"After starting the weekend with wins over the two best players in the world, MVP and Nestea, to win the MLG Global Over the last few months, Naniwa has been training hard over in Korea to take his game to the next level, and his hard work appeared to pay off in Providence. The 2nd Place finish was good enough to earn him a Code S spot, so keep an eye on this MLG Champion as he goes toe-to-toe with the world's best during the offseason."
I dont understand what motivation Slasher would have to lie about this. I am fairly confidant he would know more about the status of the exchange program than the conspiracy theorists in this thread.
I undertstand that there are questions to clear up, and not everything is cut and dry, but to say you know more about it than the guy that works with MLG, and that he is lying, is a bit ridiculous of a response.
On December 15 2011 01:24 Project Psycho wrote: This is a load BS, because how has Stephano not got a code S spot? he was in the blizzard cup and has done a lot better than Naniwa, Idra and Sen in the last few months. Does Stephano even want a code S spot?
I agree, Stephano should have the code S spot since IdrA would have been in the up/downs anyway. I guess they think that since he's living in the SlayerS house now and will be staying here for quite a while that they might just give it to him and not to some foreigner who is just going to leave next season. Still bullshit, but it's the only answer I can come up with...
Ultimately he dropped the following four games, and despite not being crowned champion, Naniwa has presented one of the most captivating weeks imaginable, both in and out of the game. In the last week, Naniwa has rage quit of of a GSL match, flown half-way around the world, defeated the two most successful Korean Starcraft 2 players back-to-back, sparked a rivalry with Nestea, been the center of controversy in a rematch against Nestea, let a National Championship slip through his fingers and earned a seat in Code S.
Over the last few months, Naniwa has been training hard over in Korea to take his game to the next level, and his hard work appeared to pay off in Providence. The 2nd Place finish was good enough to earn him a Code S spot, so keep an eye on this MLG Champion as he goes toe-to-toe with the world's best during the offseason.
Naniwa, however, stayed focused on his goal. Amidst swirls of tabloid drama and misguided quotes, Naniwa kept his concentration on the task at hand. When his turn to enter the bracket finally rolled around, the Swedish Protoss defeated Nestea for the second time that weekend, and followed the feat with wins over Huk and DongRaeGu. In the end Naniwa failed to seal the deal as he lost four straight games against Leenock in the Grand Finals, but appeared to be a man with a renewed determination and a refined playstyle. With the pedigree Naniwa displayed over the weekend, it's hard not to be excited about Naniwa's 2012 prospects in Code S and at Major League Gaming Events.
At MLG Columbus, the Top 3 non-Korean finishers will each be placed into GSL Code A. At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, within the Top 3, regardless of country of origin, who does not already have Code S status. Code S status will not be awarded if all of the players placing 1st-3rd already have Code S Status. Code A status will be awarded to the next three highest placing non-Korean players. If Code S status is awarded to a Korean player, or not awarded at all, Code A status also will be awarded to the 4th highest placing non-Korean player.
Naniwa was able to secure a huge victory and guarantee at least a Top 3 finish in Providence. That placement will gives him a chance to secure Code S and continues the run of world class players that Naniwa has defeated over the course of the championship weekend in Providence.
He still earned it, whether it was a "prize" from MLG or not. They don't just give code S slots to anyone. Revoking it after giving it is the same, regardless of how he got it.
Could someone provide some source that existed BEFORE the incident and clearly states that GSL can CHOOSE whether or not to award a code S spot to the highest ranked non-code S player of MLG?
I think it's good starting this thread, to talk about the particular rule, regardless of our opinion about what naniwa did. So, if someone has good knowledge of the rules and where to find them, I am sure he will be able to provide what I am asking. Thanks in advance.
On December 15 2011 01:25 IOvEggY wrote: heres how life is. if you act like a dick karmas going to come back at you
Lets look at it this way. currently GSL is the SC2 channel in Korea. All the koreans watch this so they can get their fill for SC2 GSL/GOMtv is a Business Naniwa is a pawn in the business. Naniwas job is to give SC2 games because he is a PRO, that is why he is THERE Naniwa DID NOT fulfill his job. You cannot call that a game of sending probes. Please dont say this is even a legitimate strategy, thats just some technical bullcrock. Would you even do it on ladder? GSL was like well **** you, you dont make our business look good peace
/Endofthisnaniwa
Being a pro does not mean that. Being pro is you making money because you play the game.
If being a pro meant show good games before everything, heall, you could bann half of the proscene.
On December 15 2011 01:24 Project Psycho wrote: This is a load BS, because how has Stephano not got a code S spot? he was in the blizzard cup and has done a lot better than Naniwa, Idra and Sen in the last few months. Does Stephano even want a code S spot?
I agree, Stephano should have the code S spot since IdrA would have been in the up/downs anyway. I guess they think that since he's living in the SlayerS house now and will be staying here for quite a while that they might just give it to him and not to some foreigner who is just going to leave next season. Still bullshit, but it's the only answer I can come up with...
Stephano has said he has no interest in GSL... why would they give him a spot...
On December 15 2011 01:24 Project Psycho wrote: This is a load BS, because how has Stephano not got a code S spot? he was in the blizzard cup and has done a lot better than Naniwa, Idra and Sen in the last few months. Does Stephano even want a code S spot?
I agree, Stephano should have the code S spot since IdrA would have been in the up/downs anyway. I guess they think that since he's living in the SlayerS house now and will be staying here for quite a while that they might just give it to him and not to some foreigner who is just going to leave next season. Still bullshit, but it's the only answer I can come up with...
Stephano has said he has no interest in GSL... why would they give him a spot...
On December 15 2011 01:28 Focuspants wrote: I dont understand what motivation Slasher would have to lie about this. I am fairly confidant he would know more about the status of the exchange program than the conspiracy theorists in this thread.
I undertstand that there are questions to clear up, and not everything is cut and dry, but to say you know more about it than the guy that works with MLG, and that he is lying, is a bit ridiculous of a response.
Conspiracy theorists? There are multiple articles linked in this very thread all saying Naniwa earned the spot. Of course this was BEFORE GSL decided to take it away. Funny how shit changes that way right?
On December 15 2011 01:26 Alvar wrote: What does Slasher have to do with this? He probably just missunderstood it himself?
So you are assuming that the posters here have more knowledge than Slasher why? Because it supports your views. Believe Slasher until proven otherwise by a credible source.
Whoever is lying or being disingenuous, at the end of the day it's the same thing anyway. He was going to get a Code S spot. Now GOM has taken that away.
On December 15 2011 01:29 Sergio1992 wrote: I still don't undestand what Naniwa did.
I'm pretty sure if you just close your eyes and click on a random thread on the left side of the website, you will most likely find all the info you need. If not, try it again!
On December 15 2011 01:29 Tanag wrote: He still earned it, whether it was a "prize" from MLG or not. They don't just give code S slots to anyone. Revoking it after giving it is the same, regardless of how he got it.
No it is not the same. A spot earned at an outside tournament being revoked is surrounded by a myriad of issues. Having a spot that was GOING TO BE gifted to you, not give given to you, is very different.
Ultimately he dropped the following four games, and despite not being crowned champion, Naniwa has presented one of the most captivating weeks imaginable, both in and out of the game. In the last week, Naniwa has rage quit of of a GSL match, flown half-way around the world, defeated the two most successful Korean Starcraft 2 players back-to-back, sparked a rivalry with Nestea, been the center of controversy in a rematch against Nestea, let a National Championship slip through his fingers and earned a seat in Code S.
Over the last few months, Naniwa has been training hard over in Korea to take his game to the next level, and his hard work appeared to pay off in Providence. The 2nd Place finish was good enough to earn him a Code S spot, so keep an eye on this MLG Champion as he goes toe-to-toe with the world's best during the offseason.
Naniwa, however, stayed focused on his goal. Amidst swirls of tabloid drama and misguided quotes, Naniwa kept his concentration on the task at hand. When his turn to enter the bracket finally rolled around, the Swedish Protoss defeated Nestea for the second time that weekend, and followed the feat with wins over Huk and DongRaeGu. In the end Naniwa failed to seal the deal as he lost four straight games against Leenock in the Grand Finals, but appeared to be a man with a renewed determination and a refined playstyle. With the pedigree Naniwa displayed over the weekend, it's hard not to be excited about Naniwa's 2012 prospects in Code S and at Major League Gaming Events.
At MLG Columbus, the Top 3 non-Korean finishers will each be placed into GSL Code A. At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, within the Top 3, regardless of country of origin, who does not already have Code S status. Code S status will not be awarded if all of the players placing 1st-3rd already have Code S Status. Code A status will be awarded to the next three highest placing non-Korean players. If Code S status is awarded to a Korean player, or not awarded at all, Code A status also will be awarded to the 4th highest placing non-Korean player.
Naniwa was able to secure a huge victory and guarantee at least a Top 3 finish in Providence. That placement will gives him a chance to secure Code S and continues the run of world class players that Naniwa has defeated over the course of the championship weekend in Providence.
On December 15 2011 01:26 Alvar wrote: What does Slasher have to do with this? He probably just missunderstood it himself?
So you are assuming that the posters here have more knowledge than Slasher why? Because it supports your views. Believe Slasher until proven otherwise by a credible source.
On December 15 2011 01:25 IOvEggY wrote: heres how life is. if you act like a dick karmas going to come back at you
Lets look at it this way. currently GSL is the SC2 channel in Korea. All the koreans watch this so they can get their fill for SC2 GSL/GOMtv is a Business Naniwa is a pawn in the business. Naniwas job is to give SC2 games because he is a PRO, that is why he is THERE Naniwa DID NOT fulfill his job. You cannot call that a game of sending probes. Please dont say this is even a legitimate strategy, thats just some technical bullcrock. Would you even do it on ladder? GSL was like well **** you, you dont make our business look good peace
/Endofthisnaniwa
Being a pro does not mean that. Being pro is you making money because you play the game.
If being a pro meant show good games before everything, heall, you could bann half of the proscene.
Yes it does. He didnt even give a game. He sent his probes.
"EARNED" is a vague term if you actually think about it for two seconds. Did he earn it because he got 2nd and the league exchange program kicked in or did he earn it because he performed well, GOM knew he was in Korea, GOM knew he was a top foreigner, and GOM made the same decision they did with Idra/Sen.
Seriously. Wait for fricking facts before calling Slasher a liar.
On December 15 2011 01:29 Sergio1992 wrote: I still don't undestand what Naniwa did.
I'm pretty sure if you just close your eyes and click on a random thread on the left side of the website, you will most likely find all the info you need. If not, try it again!
On December 15 2011 01:26 Alvar wrote: What does Slasher have to do with this? He probably just missunderstood it himself?
So you are assuming that the posters here have more knowledge than Slasher why? Because it supports your views. Believe Slasher until proven otherwise by a credible source.
My views? you do not even know my views, I have no idea one way or the other, but all the evidence before Slashers twitter(?) says that Naniwa recieved the seed from providence, even statements from MLG.
Even the original statement from GOM said there was a seed from every pro circuit this year.
On December 15 2011 01:25 IOvEggY wrote: heres how life is. if you act like a dick karmas going to come back at you
Lets look at it this way. currently GSL is the SC2 channel in Korea. All the koreans watch this so they can get their fill for SC2 GSL/GOMtv is a Business Naniwa is a pawn in the business. Naniwas job is to give SC2 games because he is a PRO, that is why he is THERE Naniwa DID NOT fulfill his job. You cannot call that a game of sending probes. Please dont say this is even a legitimate strategy, thats just some technical bullcrock. Would you even do it on ladder? GSL was like well **** you, you dont make our business look good peace
/Endofthisnaniwa
Being a pro does not mean that. Being pro is you making money because you play the game.
If being a pro meant show good games before everything, heall, you could bann half of the proscene.
Yes it does. He didnt even give a game. He sent his probes.
There was a countdown and there was a "gg". There was a game. Not a very good one or one he wanted to win but, he played the game. No different than when zergs go on tilt and 6 pool just to get the match over with as soon as possible. People are just giving shit to Naniwa because he probe rushed instead of canon rushed. Naniwa's only mistake was not pretending good enough which has never been his forte.
He did win the spot, according to every resource I've read. I've never even heard of the blizzcup seeds being given out for MLG performances before, I had always heard code s.
On December 15 2011 01:34 RPR_Tempest wrote: Yeah, bullshit.
MLG gives Code S to the highest placing non Code S player. Why would this MLG all of a sudden not count?
cause it wasnt part of the exchange program? GSL didnt send any players to providence.
Please, would you be so kind to provide a link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following?
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status."
On December 15 2011 01:26 Alvar wrote: What does Slasher have to do with this? He probably just missunderstood it himself?
So you are assuming that the posters here have more knowledge than Slasher why? Because it supports your views. Believe Slasher until proven otherwise by a credible source.
My views? you do not even know my views, I have no idea one way or the other, but all the evidence before Slashers twitter(?) says that Naniwa recieved the seed from providence, even statements from MLG.
Even the original statement from GOM said there was a seed from every pro circuit this year.
Others have posted that Gom didnt send Koreans. That in itself could be the very reason this exhcnage didnt exist for this tournament.
On December 15 2011 01:34 RPR_Tempest wrote: Yeah, bullshit.
MLG gives Code S to the highest placing non Code S player. Why would this MLG all of a sudden not count?
cause it wasnt part of the exchange program? GSL didnt send any players to providence.
Please, would you be so kind to provide a link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following?
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status."
As soon as you link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following.
"MLG will invite four Korean pro players to each Pro Circuit Live Competition."
On December 15 2011 01:34 RPR_Tempest wrote: Yeah, bullshit.
MLG gives Code S to the highest placing non Code S player. Why would this MLG all of a sudden not count?
cause it wasnt part of the exchange program? GSL didnt send any players to providence.
Please, would you be so kind to provide a link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following?
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status."
Can you give a link from a CREDIBLE source commenting directly on this matter in the present and not the past, not using MLG sites from the PAST which have had misleading info on them before, that contradicts what Slasher said?
Even if what the OP states if true (whitch seems to be debateable), this doesn't change anything in my opinion. It's actually pretty sad how this situation has made everyone involved look like assholes. Naniwa should'nt have doon that, i meen he could have just made a proxy 2-gate all in and everyone would be happy. GOM also comes off like assholes when they makes a lot of big talk about professionalism and then states officially that Naniwa is an amateur price pool hunter, witch is pretty damn unprofessional. The punishment is way to harsh, to not give him the price money for this turnament, plus a strong warning, would have been the reasonable thing to do.
The fact of the matter is, GSL didnt send players to Providence, and Slasher is saying that Providence wasnt involved in the exchange program. Clearly there was a lack of clarity on this issue, which is now being brought out due to this situation.
You are left with 2 options:
1) Believe the MLG employee, and the fact they say it wasnt prat of the exchange program, coupled with the fact that the GSL didnt send any representatives to the event.
or
2) Believe a bunch of annonymous forum posters, who are using articles, that are likely wrong because of the lack of clairty with the exchange program.
I choose to go with the information from the people directly involved with the companies responsible for the exchange program, rather than people looking at it from the outside.
On December 15 2011 01:26 Alvar wrote: What does Slasher have to do with this? He probably just missunderstood it himself?
So you are assuming that the posters here have more knowledge than Slasher why? Because it supports your views. Believe Slasher until proven otherwise by a credible source.
My views? you do not even know my views, I have no idea one way or the other, but all the evidence before Slashers twitter(?) says that Naniwa recieved the seed from providence, even statements from MLG.
Even the original statement from GOM said there was a seed from every pro circuit this year.
Others have posted that Gom didnt send Koreans. That in itself could be the very reason this exhcnage didnt exist for this tournament.
You might be right about this, but you are probably just guessing. I see no reason to go with only slashers twitter as evidence over all the other statements made before.
GOM might have changed their minds. I do feel the communication between MLG and GOM seem to have been horrible for all those statements to be made without any response from GOM or correction from GOM.
On December 15 2011 01:34 RPR_Tempest wrote: Yeah, bullshit.
MLG gives Code S to the highest placing non Code S player. Why would this MLG all of a sudden not count?
cause it wasnt part of the exchange program? GSL didnt send any players to providence.
Please, would you be so kind to provide a link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following?
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status."
As soon as you link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following.
"MLG will invite four Korean pro players to each Pro Circuit Live Competition."
I agree both are violations of the rules. Why would I try to find such a link? I also find it odd they didn't invite. So, sure, I see your point.
Now, back to the code S spot matter. Is there a rule that says Providence is an exception?
On December 15 2011 01:26 Alvar wrote: What does Slasher have to do with this? He probably just missunderstood it himself?
So you are assuming that the posters here have more knowledge than Slasher why? Because it supports your views. Believe Slasher until proven otherwise by a credible source.
My views? you do not even know my views, I have no idea one way or the other, but all the evidence before Slashers twitter(?) says that Naniwa recieved the seed from providence, even statements from MLG.
Even the original statement from GOM said there was a seed from every pro circuit this year.
Others have posted that Gom didnt send Koreans. That in itself could be the very reason this exhcnage didnt exist for this tournament.
You might be right about this, but you are probably just guessing. I see no reason to go with only slashers twitter as evidence over all the other statements made before.
GOM might have changed their minds. I do feel the communication between MLG and GOM seem to have been horrible for all those statements to be made without any response from GOM or correction from GOM.
Slasher works for MLG and although he doesn't represent them he has a heck of a lot more knowledge about their "goings on" than you, me, or anyone else posting in this thread. Until someone contradicts him from MLG or GOM I would suggest that listening to the most credible source of information is wisest.
On December 15 2011 01:34 RPR_Tempest wrote: Yeah, bullshit.
MLG gives Code S to the highest placing non Code S player. Why would this MLG all of a sudden not count?
cause it wasnt part of the exchange program? GSL didnt send any players to providence.
Please, would you be so kind to provide a link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following?
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status."
As soon as you link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following.
"MLG will invite four Korean pro players to each Pro Circuit Live Competition."
I agree both are violations of the rules. Why would I try to find such a link? I also find it odd they didn't invite. So, sure, I see your point.
Now, back to the code S spot matter. Is there a rule that says Providence is an exception?
The exchange program ended in 2011 and doesn't apply to 2012.
On December 15 2011 01:34 RPR_Tempest wrote: Yeah, bullshit.
MLG gives Code S to the highest placing non Code S player. Why would this MLG all of a sudden not count?
cause it wasnt part of the exchange program? GSL didnt send any players to providence.
Please, would you be so kind to provide a link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following?
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status."
Can you give a link from a CREDIBLE source commenting directly on this matter in the present and not the past, not using MLG sites from the PAST which have had misleading info on them before, that contradicts what Slasher said?
But rules are decided before, right?
Is it correct to adapt the rules to our liking because they proved insufficient to cover cases we didn't foresee when we made the rules?
On December 15 2011 01:42 Focuspants wrote: The fact of the matter is, GSL didnt send players to Providence, and Slasher is saying that Providence wasnt involved in the exchange program. Clearly there was a lack of clarity on this issue, which is now being brought out due to this situation.
You are left with 2 options:
1) Believe the MLG employee, and the fact they say it wasnt prat of the exchange program, coupled with the fact that the GSL didnt send any representatives to the event.
or
2) Believe a bunch of annonymous forum posters, who are using articles, that are likely wrong because of the lack of clairty with the exchange program.
I choose to go with the information from the people directly involved with the companies responsible for the exchange program, rather than people looking at it from the outside.
Haha, Open you eyes. Anyone with a brain can actually see whats going on here. This hole incident is is starting to become so laughable
The annonymous forum posters as you call them are just linking statement and articles from MLG own site GomTV own site and reliable and well known news site.
On December 15 2011 01:34 RPR_Tempest wrote: Yeah, bullshit.
MLG gives Code S to the highest placing non Code S player. Why would this MLG all of a sudden not count?
cause it wasnt part of the exchange program? GSL didnt send any players to providence.
Please, would you be so kind to provide a link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following?
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status."
As soon as you link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following.
"MLG will invite four Korean pro players to each Pro Circuit Live Competition."
I agree both are violations of the rules. Why would I try to find such a link? I also find it odd they didn't invite. So, sure, I see your point.
Now, back to the code S spot matter. Is there a rule that says Providence is an exception?
The exchange program ended in 2011 and doesn't apply to 2012.
because providence happened in 2012 ....right?
and it just so happens that MLG wrote 5 different articles on Naniwa winning a code S spot but nobody noticed the mistake......i dont know..
Could have done it in several different ways, but what they chose to do was appropriate imho.
Also, since it was already announced he would give it, to me - it was as 'real' as any other code S spots.
If you want to focus on 'earned' then only those going through the qualifiers in korea into code A into code S are 'earning' their spot (in addition to those already in the tournament of course).
On December 15 2011 01:34 RPR_Tempest wrote: Yeah, bullshit.
MLG gives Code S to the highest placing non Code S player. Why would this MLG all of a sudden not count?
cause it wasnt part of the exchange program? GSL didnt send any players to providence.
Please, would you be so kind to provide a link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following?
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status."
As soon as you link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following.
"MLG will invite four Korean pro players to each Pro Circuit Live Competition."
I agree both are violations of the rules. Why would I try to find such a link? I also find it odd they didn't invite. So, sure, I see your point.
Now, back to the code S spot matter. Is there a rule that says Providence is an exception?
The exchange program ended in 2011 and doesn't apply to 2012.
They decided to invite Naniwa and then they pulled the invite even when Naniwa didnt break any other rules than some stupid code of honor. They dont have any grounds to pull his invite.
On December 15 2011 01:34 RPR_Tempest wrote: Yeah, bullshit.
MLG gives Code S to the highest placing non Code S player. Why would this MLG all of a sudden not count?
cause it wasnt part of the exchange program? GSL didnt send any players to providence.
Please, would you be so kind to provide a link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following?
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status."
As soon as you link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following.
"MLG will invite four Korean pro players to each Pro Circuit Live Competition."
I agree both are violations of the rules. Why would I try to find such a link? I also find it odd they didn't invite. So, sure, I see your point.
Now, back to the code S spot matter. Is there a rule that says Providence is an exception?
Again, why are you asking for a rule that says Providence is an exception?
On December 15 2011 01:34 RPR_Tempest wrote: Yeah, bullshit.
MLG gives Code S to the highest placing non Code S player. Why would this MLG all of a sudden not count?
cause it wasnt part of the exchange program? GSL didnt send any players to providence.
Please, would you be so kind to provide a link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following?
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status."
As soon as you link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following.
"MLG will invite four Korean pro players to each Pro Circuit Live Competition."
I agree both are violations of the rules. Why would I try to find such a link? I also find it odd they didn't invite. So, sure, I see your point.
Now, back to the code S spot matter. Is there a rule that says Providence is an exception?
The exchange program ended in 2011 and doesn't apply to 2012.
because providence happened in 2012 ....right?
GSL January takes place in 2011... Right?
But the rule says that all 2011 MLG events will provide code S spots to for the next GSL. It does not say anything about WHEN the next GSL will take place.
On December 15 2011 01:34 RPR_Tempest wrote: Yeah, bullshit.
MLG gives Code S to the highest placing non Code S player. Why would this MLG all of a sudden not count?
cause it wasnt part of the exchange program? GSL didnt send any players to providence.
Please, would you be so kind to provide a link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following?
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status."
As soon as you link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following.
"MLG will invite four Korean pro players to each Pro Circuit Live Competition."
I agree both are violations of the rules. Why would I try to find such a link? I also find it odd they didn't invite. So, sure, I see your point.
Now, back to the code S spot matter. Is there a rule that says Providence is an exception?
The exchange program ended in 2011 and doesn't apply to 2012.
because providence happened in 2012 ....right?
GSL January takes place in 2011... Right?
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status."
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus,"
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition"
"every 2011 Pro Circuit"
GSL jan is not a pro circuit.
P.S.
On December 15 2011 01:44 MLG_Adam wrote:
Slasher works for MLG in our video department. He is NOT a representative of the League. Any opinion or discussion from Slasher is solely opinion based.
On December 15 2011 01:42 Focuspants wrote: The fact of the matter is, GSL didnt send players to Providence, and Slasher is saying that Providence wasnt involved in the exchange program. Clearly there was a lack of clarity on this issue, which is now being brought out due to this situation.
You are left with 2 options:
1) Believe the MLG employee, and the fact they say it wasnt prat of the exchange program, coupled with the fact that the GSL didnt send any representatives to the event.
or
2) Believe a bunch of annonymous forum posters, who are using articles, that are likely wrong because of the lack of clairty with the exchange program.
I choose to go with the information from the people directly involved with the companies responsible for the exchange program, rather than people looking at it from the outside.
Haha, Open you eyes. Anyone with a brain can actually see whats going on here. This hole incident is is starting to become so laughable
The annonymous forum posters as you call them are just linking statement and articles from MLG own site GomTV own site and reliable and well known news site.
Come on man lol
Perhaps instead of jumping to conclusions about who has half a brain you should wait for everything to come out... yah.. thats not as fun I guess.
Ok so here is some logic for you. If you view information released by MLG as being reliable, then Slasher's (an MLG employee) twitter post can be seen as credible. The most recent information, is likely the most accurate, as they are dealing with this situation.
You cant claim a source to be reliable, and then claim it isnt relaible when it disagrees with your opinion. The likely answer, is that there was a misunderstanding about Providence amongst the community, because they didnt make it commonly known, that it was no longer part of the exchange program.
I have a brain, and I dont need you coming in here and trying to insult me, when you have made 3 or 4 similar posts in the multiple threads where you spell "whole", hole.
I am here to show what MLG has to say about the matter, and you question my intelligence, because I post a direct source to one of its employees messages to the community.
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
There was no exchange program at Providence. No Koreans outside hte Top 16 were given seeds into the Winner's Bracket. Please check your facts before you post stuff like htis.
On December 15 2011 01:34 RPR_Tempest wrote: Yeah, bullshit.
MLG gives Code S to the highest placing non Code S player. Why would this MLG all of a sudden not count?
cause it wasnt part of the exchange program? GSL didnt send any players to providence.
Please, would you be so kind to provide a link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following?
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status."
As soon as you link with a rule that clearly says Providence is an exception to the following.
"MLG will invite four Korean pro players to each Pro Circuit Live Competition."
I agree both are violations of the rules. Why would I try to find such a link? I also find it odd they didn't invite. So, sure, I see your point.
Now, back to the code S spot matter. Is there a rule that says Providence is an exception?
Again, why are you asking for a rule that says Providence is an exception?
Because, if by the rules it is not an exception, then it automatically rewards the highest placed, non-code S finisher a code S spot (unless all top 3 finishers are already code S). Which means that Naniwa did earn the spot and it was taken away from him. Maybe for good reason, but I am trying to focus on this delicate point, because I don't like the fact that suddenly both organizations are trying to convince us that he didn't earn it through a standard procedure.
On December 15 2011 01:25 IOvEggY wrote: heres how life is. if you act like a dick karmas going to come back at you
Lets look at it this way. currently GSL is the SC2 channel in Korea. All the koreans watch this so they can get their fill for SC2 GSL/GOMtv is a Business Naniwa is a pawn in the business. Naniwas job is to give SC2 games because he is a PRO, that is why he is THERE Naniwa DID NOT fulfill his job. You cannot call that a game of sending probes. Please dont say this is even a legitimate strategy, thats just some technical bullcrock. Would you even do it on ladder? GSL was like well **** you, you dont make our business look good peace
/Endofthisnaniwa
Haha wow... the player resentment. So players are just "pawns" to you? fuck off please.
You are making this to a organizers vs players discussion, and i have no idea why you would not side with the players. This is a business for naniwa just as much as it is for gomtv, it doesn't make them justified in whatever actions they chose to take.
No one is saying it is a legitimate strategy, they're saying the game didn't matter. So, if the game didn't matter, that means that... The. Game. Didn't. Matter. He did however play the game, and therefore fulfill his job. He had to play all the games, so he did, and he didn't break any rules. Yea it was a stupid thing to do, but what he did doesn't matter since the game didn't matter.....
How does this change anything? Are people arguing he wouldn't have gotten the Code S spot even if this hadn't happened? I think that's a fairly small chance unless gom was completely oblivious to what most people (including MLG's own news writers) was thinking.
On December 15 2011 01:47 Daimai wrote: This doesn't matter.
They decided to invite Naniwa and then they pulled the invite even when Naniwa didnt break any other rules than some stupid code of honor. They dont have any grounds to pull his invite.
Sure it does. He didn't earned his spot like many of you guys were arguing for. Gom decided that he was no longer worthy which is up to them. They didn't take away anything from him unlike the first misunderstood case.
On December 15 2011 01:49 OopsOopsBaby wrote: makes sense now. there was no exchange program in providence due to the tournament structure.
Hahaha, Yea belive that.
I really want to belive that also. But I just cant. Just as I cant belive in the santa clause or aliens.
Well, to be fair, there were no GSL exchange program at Providence. No outside Koreans were seeded in the top sixteen or given free rides to Providence.
On December 15 2011 01:42 Focuspants wrote: The fact of the matter is, GSL didnt send players to Providence, and Slasher is saying that Providence wasnt involved in the exchange program. Clearly there was a lack of clarity on this issue, which is now being brought out due to this situation.
You are left with 2 options:
1) Believe the MLG employee, and the fact they say it wasnt prat of the exchange program, coupled with the fact that the GSL didnt send any representatives to the event.
or
2) Believe a bunch of annonymous forum posters, who are using articles, that are likely wrong because of the lack of clairty with the exchange program.
I choose to go with the information from the people directly involved with the companies responsible for the exchange program, rather than people looking at it from the outside.
Haha, Open you eyes. Anyone with a brain can actually see whats going on here. This hole incident is is starting to become so laughable
The annonymous forum posters as you call them are just linking statement and articles from MLG own site GomTV own site and reliable and well known news site.
Come on man lol
Perhaps instead of jumping to conclusions about who has half a brain you should wait for everything to come out... yah.. thats not as fun I guess.
On December 15 2011 01:26 Alvar wrote: What does Slasher have to do with this? He probably just missunderstood it himself?
So you are assuming that the posters here have more knowledge than Slasher why? Because it supports your views. Believe Slasher until proven otherwise by a credible source.
My views? you do not even know my views, I have no idea one way or the other, but all the evidence before Slashers twitter(?) says that Naniwa recieved the seed from providence, even statements from MLG.
Even the original statement from GOM said there was a seed from every pro circuit this year.
Others have posted that Gom didnt send Koreans. That in itself could be the very reason this exhcnage didnt exist for this tournament.
You might be right about this, but you are probably just guessing. I see no reason to go with only slashers twitter as evidence over all the other statements made before.
GOM might have changed their minds. I do feel the communication between MLG and GOM seem to have been horrible for all those statements to be made without any response from GOM or correction from GOM.
Slasher works for MLG and although he doesn't represent them he has a heck of a lot more knowledge about their "goings on" than you, me, or anyone else posting in this thread. Until someone contradicts him from MLG or GOM I would suggest that listening to the most credible source of information is wisest.
Well, as soon as someone else collaborates this I'm all aboard that this is how it is. I see no reason why it couldnt be equally plausible that Slasher missunderstood something though, considering the information that was available before contradicts him somewhat.
Still would make the communication between them laughable for allowing all those press releases to be released before.
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
There was no exchange program at Providence. No Koreans outside hte Top 16 were given seeds into the Winner's Bracket. Please check your facts before you post stuff like htis.
So why is MLG Adam basically saying, that Slasher has no idea, what is actually going on?
I mean, if Slasher was right, then why bother to post at all...it doesn't make sense.
On December 15 2011 01:16 Focuspants wrote: This needs to be cleared up, because I cant stand reading all of the misinformed posts in the numerous other threads.
Naniwa did not earn a Code S spot from MLG Providence. GOM was going to give him one of the two foreigner spots.
Based on Naniwa's behaviour at the Blizzard cup, they chose to not give him that spot, and instead, give it to someone else.
I think this is a very fair reaction, seeing as how he acted inappropriately. GOM was going to give him a gift, Naniwa ofended them, they decided they would no longer give him that gift.
Please people, whether you agree or disagree with Naniwas actions, at least understand what you are arguing over. This will save a lot of headaches in the multitude of other threads related to this issue.
You're using Slasher to defend your statement? Isn't he notorious for lying?
I'm not saying you're wrong, and I'd also argue that offering Naniwa a Code S spot (and then taking it away) is pretty much the same as winning a Code S spot (and then taking it away) as far as the end result and GOMtv's behavior goes... but yeah.
On December 15 2011 01:52 nam nam wrote: How does this change anything? Are people arguing he wouldn't have gotten the Code S spot even if this hadn't happened? I think that's a fairly small chance unless gom was completely oblivious to what most people (including MLG's own news writers) was thinking.
The point is that they didn't take away an earned slot in the tournament, they took away an intended invite. The player failed to live up to the standards they would want of an invite, so they invited someone else.
It is a rather large difference in my opinion, regardless of which side of the argument you're on.
On December 15 2011 01:52 nam nam wrote: How does this change anything? Are people arguing he wouldn't have gotten the Code S spot even if this hadn't happened? I think that's a fairly small chance unless gom was completely oblivious to what most people (including MLG's own news writers) was thinking.
The point is that they didn't take away an earned slot in the tournament, they took away an intended invite. The player failed to live up to the standards they would want of an invite, so they invited someone else.
It is a rather large difference in my opinion, regardless of which side of the argument you're on.
I thought this point is rather easy to understand but so many people can't see the difference.
On December 15 2011 01:42 Focuspants wrote: The fact of the matter is, GSL didnt send players to Providence, and Slasher is saying that Providence wasnt involved in the exchange program. Clearly there was a lack of clarity on this issue, which is now being brought out due to this situation.
You are left with 2 options:
1) Believe the MLG employee, and the fact they say it wasnt prat of the exchange program, coupled with the fact that the GSL didnt send any representatives to the event.
or
2) Believe a bunch of annonymous forum posters, who are using articles, that are likely wrong because of the lack of clairty with the exchange program.
I choose to go with the information from the people directly involved with the companies responsible for the exchange program, rather than people looking at it from the outside.
Haha, Open you eyes. Anyone with a brain can actually see whats going on here. This hole incident is is starting to become so laughable
The annonymous forum posters as you call them are just linking statement and articles from MLG own site GomTV own site and reliable and well known news site.
Come on man lol
Perhaps instead of jumping to conclusions about who has half a brain you should wait for everything to come out... yah.. thats not as fun I guess.
Follow the money buddy all I got to say
People like you have nothing of substance to say, and drag down the general quality of threads. Please do some research, post something intelligent, at least say something funny to entertain us. Blindly arguing something because its what you 'believe' gets us nowhere. This incident in the grand scheme of things is very small. Why would the biggest SC2 organization in the east, and the biggest one in the west, risk their integrity, over some stupid drama surrounding 1 player?
Especially when it would be as easy as askign any of the players involved in the exchange program whether it existed or not? This event isnt worthy of a conspiracy, and you really need to relax.
ok, so GOMTV isen't just the devil stealing his code s spot. Instead they are pointing out someone else from the group of deserving foreigners?. hmm seems alot more logical than some of the other posts. i guess thats okay, and naniwa will have to think twice before he dronerushes again... if the "rules" really don't allow litterally EVERY strategy. i mean, it was not his intention of being badmannered as many (koreans) have seen it as.
we all should know by now Koreans have morals and respect as very high values, so if we do something my fellow citizen would just laugh at, and they respond harshly, we should not be surprised at all, doing so is just stupid...
Can this thread be closed? Its based on Slasher's opinions who isn't even an MLG representative but rather works for their video department. Its misleading and most likely false (based on the multiple articles +kennigit in the other thread)
On December 15 2011 01:44 MLG_Adam wrote:
Slasher works for MLG in our video department. He is NOT a representative of the League. Any opinion or discussion from Slasher is solely opinion based.
They should just have said it straight away like it is:
"At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, if we like him, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status"
On December 15 2011 01:26 Alvar wrote: What does Slasher have to do with this? He probably just missunderstood it himself?
So you are assuming that the posters here have more knowledge than Slasher why? Because it supports your views. Believe Slasher until proven otherwise by a credible source.
My views? you do not even know my views, I have no idea one way or the other, but all the evidence before Slashers twitter(?) says that Naniwa recieved the seed from providence, even statements from MLG.
Even the original statement from GOM said there was a seed from every pro circuit this year.
Others have posted that Gom didnt send Koreans. That in itself could be the very reason this exhcnage didnt exist for this tournament.
You might be right about this, but you are probably just guessing. I see no reason to go with only slashers twitter as evidence over all the other statements made before.
GOM might have changed their minds. I do feel the communication between MLG and GOM seem to have been horrible for all those statements to be made without any response from GOM or correction from GOM.
Slasher works for MLG and although he doesn't represent them he has a heck of a lot more knowledge about their "goings on" than you, me, or anyone else posting in this thread. Until someone contradicts him from MLG or GOM I would suggest that listening to the most credible source of information is wisest.
Well, as soon as someone else collaborates this I'm all aboard that this is how it is. I see no reason why it couldnt be equally plausible that Slasher missunderstood something though, considering the information that was available before contradicts him somewhat.
Still would make the communication between them laughable for allowing all those press releases to be released before.
I agree with that. However I will choose to currently lend more plausability to Slasher than to "HappyChris" or anyone else posting here until such time as an actual MLG head says he is wrong.
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
There was no exchange program at Providence. No Koreans outside hte Top 16 were given seeds into the Winner's Bracket. Please check your facts before you post stuff like htis.
lol, the facts are in the links I posted, please check them yourself.
It's so tragic that people don't realize that this is just a way for Gom to try to make this look less of a punishment than it is. First off, the result is still the same so I don't understand how it is any less of a punishment because of this. Second, why would they announce this as an afterthought? They even announced in a live broadcast that they are revoking Naniwas Code S spot. If he didn't have that spot in the first place, then why even make an announcement about it.
I'm losing more and more respect for Gomtv for every thing they do.
On December 15 2011 01:58 labbe wrote: It's so tragic that people don't realize that this is just a way for Gom to try to make this look less of a punishment than it is. First off, the result is still the same so I don't understand how it is any less of a punishment because of this. Second, why would they announce this as an afterthought? They even announced in a live broadcast that they are revoking Naniwas Code S spot. If he didn't have that spot in the first place, then why even make an announcement about it.
I'm losing more and more respect for Gomtv for every thing they do.
Your first point is a mere speculation with no evidence. First the result may be the same, but it makes the punishment less harsh if Naniwa didn't have the spot in the first place and was just a candidate so it is a lesser punishment. Second they announced it so that players don't fuck around in their league anymore to set a precedent.
Also, what many people aren't taking into account, GSL's format changed AFTER this exchange program was set in place. On GOM's little chart for their new layout it has 2 seeds set in place. It's safe to assume one was going to go to Naniwa for his performance at MLG, but then it got revoked. Along with that, Providence did have a different format than a regular MLG with no invited Korean's. Maybe MLG made a poor assumption off poor communication? I don't know, just tossing some other things out there that might help clear up this mess.
On December 15 2011 01:52 nam nam wrote: How does this change anything? Are people arguing he wouldn't have gotten the Code S spot even if this hadn't happened? I think that's a fairly small chance unless gom was completely oblivious to what most people (including MLG's own news writers) was thinking.
The point is that they didn't take away an earned slot in the tournament, they took away an intended invite. The player failed to live up to the standards they would want of an invite, so they invited someone else.
It is a rather large difference in my opinion, regardless of which side of the argument you're on.
Ah, I see the difference. I think that's called being an Indian Giver (racism not intended). Giving a gift and then taking it back.
I would have thought that GOM would have wanted the best players in their tournament, not caring about how good-mannered they are... but I guess that's just something I disagree with them on. It's their tournament. Although, of course, they've allowed people in the past to play in the GSL who implement plenty of BM inside the game and out. Rituals, ceremonies, mannered units and structures, etc. Naniwa isn't unique.
On December 15 2011 01:50 Focuspants wrote: Ok so here is some logic for you. If you view information released by MLG as being reliable, then Slasher's (an MLG employee) twitter post can be seen as credible. The most recent information, is likely the most accurate, as they are dealing with this situation.
You cant claim a source to be reliable, and then claim it isnt relaible when it disagrees with your opinion. The likely answer, is that there was a misunderstanding about Providence amongst the community, because they didnt make it commonly known, that it was no longer part of the exchange program.
I have a brain, and I dont need you coming in here and trying to insult me, when you have made 3 or 4 similar posts in the multiple threads where you spell "whole", hole.
I am here to show what MLG has to say about the matter, and you question my intelligence, because I post a direct source to one of its employees messages to the community.
Please have a little more class.
I am sorry some people do that. As I said before, that is a good thread because it focuses on this particular issue. Let's leave our naniwa opinions out of it.
On your first paragraphs, though, I disagree. Obviously, a source is not reliable when it releases contradicting information. But it's not correct that the information released later is more accurate. Rules cannot be secret and revealed to the parties involved after the events are finished. Rules are always known in advance. That's why, in my opinion, any information ABOUT THE RULES, released for the first time today, is irrelevant. To believe that, I am sorry, but I REQUIRE a source that existed before the event.
I think this is at least reasonable. Everybody should make a conscious and continuous effort to preserve good faith between parties of the community, simple viewers included. And today's attempt to suddenly inform us about a rule that they just forgot to include in the rulebook in the first place, does not help towards that in my opinion.
On December 15 2011 01:58 labbe wrote: It's so tragic that people don't realize that this is just a way for Gom to try to make this look less of a punishment than it is. First off, the result is still the same so I don't understand how it is any less of a punishment because of this. Second, why would they announce this as an afterthought? They even announced in a live broadcast that they are revoking Naniwas Code S spot. If he didn't have that spot in the first place, then why even make an announcement about it.
I'm losing more and more respect for Gomtv for every thing they do.
Seriously they were better off just straight up saying that they just wanted to punish him and stripped him of the Code S spot. This mumbo jumbo of him now not earning it at MLG but having been "invited" is just straight up cowardice.
On December 15 2011 01:52 nam nam wrote: How does this change anything? Are people arguing he wouldn't have gotten the Code S spot even if this hadn't happened? I think that's a fairly small chance unless gom was completely oblivious to what most people (including MLG's own news writers) was thinking.
The point is that they didn't take away an earned slot in the tournament, they took away an intended invite. The player failed to live up to the standards they would want of an invite, so they invited someone else.
It is a rather large difference in my opinion, regardless of which side of the argument you're on.
Ah, I see the difference. I think that's called being an Indian Giver (racism not intended). Giving a gift and then taking it back.
I would have thought that GOM would have wanted the best players in their tournament, not caring about how good-mannered they are... but I guess that's just something I disagree with them on. It's their tournament. Although, of course, they've allowed people in the past to play in the GSL who implement plenty of BM inside the game and out. Rituals, ceremonies, mannered units and structures, etc. Naniwa isn't unique.
Naniwa is actually unique in his intention. Rituals, ceremonies, mannered units and structures are playful banters meant for entertainment. And no the gift was not finalize since Naniwa was only a candidate and he fucked it up with his action. Why would you invite someone like that to your tournament.
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
There was no exchange program at Providence. No Koreans outside hte Top 16 were given seeds into the Winner's Bracket. Please check your facts before you post stuff like htis.
lol, the facts are in the links I posted, please check them yourself.
I did... Like I said. There was no exchange program.... Need I say more?
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
There was no exchange program at Providence. No Koreans outside hte Top 16 were given seeds into the Winner's Bracket. Please check your facts before you post stuff like htis.
lol, the facts are in the links I posted, please check them yourself.
So called 'facts' amounts to nothing if you actually read them.
On December 15 2011 01:58 labbe wrote: It's so tragic that people don't realize that this is just a way for Gom to try to make this look less of a punishment than it is. First off, the result is still the same so I don't understand how it is any less of a punishment because of this. Second, why would they announce this as an afterthought? They even announced in a live broadcast that they are revoking Naniwas Code S spot. If he didn't have that spot in the first place, then why even make an announcement about it.
I'm losing more and more respect for Gomtv for every thing they do.
use your freaking head. they announced it to set a precedent, and also because it was widely known or assumed that naniwa was getting the spot. and no, this invite vs won changes a lot of aspects especially about the reasoning and moral behind this decision. if it was indeed won (MLG had the code S spot for the winner set in a contract or something with GSL), then the decision to revoke the spot should be traced back to a rule (for it to be logical; gsl or mlg can technically get sued if there was no rule saying a player's code S spot can be revoked due to what naniwa did, although gomtv seemed to already categorize it into an existing rule). If it was an invite, they can revoke the code S spot even if there was no rule if they deemed it appropriate. The end result might be the same but the complications are very different.
I guess this is alright..Still..The game itself didn't matter. He didn't think it mattered. It didn't matter. Whatever. Would've liked to see the match though ; /
On December 15 2011 01:56 MLG_Lee wrote: Folks, we're just becoming aware of the decision from GSL. We don't have all the facts yet and are investigating.
Please stay tuned. Thanks,
Lee
So there seems to be at least some confusion at MLG about this.
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
There was no exchange program at Providence. No Koreans outside hte Top 16 were given seeds into the Winner's Bracket. Please check your facts before you post stuff like htis.
lol, the facts are in the links I posted, please check them yourself.
I did... Like I said. There was no exchange program.... Need I say more?
so OBVIOUSLY providence is part of the exchange program. Sure, no Koreans were sent because the tournament structure does not allow for it, but GSL seeds were still given.
I was merely stating that he quoted a soource as reliable, and then quoted the same source as unreliable. I agree that at the end of the day, there is a possibility that Slasher COULD be wrong. However, im trying to show that this is another angle, which sheds a whole different light on the situation, and that the recent facts from people actually involved (first hand) in the situation, it isnt just a matter of GOM taking a way an invite earned at a different tournament.
On December 15 2011 01:56 Hydrox911 wrote: There were/are posts all over MLG about how Naniwas run did indeed EARN him a spot in Code S. Look them up.
And new information shows that those posts may be wrong. We just gotta wait to see more official posts.
But if they were wrong why did GOM not say anything before now? they for sure knew about them if they care to read english forums.
Possible misunderstanding due to language barrier? Not like MLG was clear about this either if they are finding more information instead of an affirmative stand.
Ultimately he dropped the following four games, and despite not being crowned champion, Naniwa has presented one of the most captivating weeks imaginable, both in and out of the game. In the last week, Naniwa has rage quit of of a GSL match, flown half-way around the world, defeated the two most successful Korean Starcraft 2 players back-to-back, sparked a rivalry with Nestea, been the center of controversy in a rematch against Nestea, let a National Championship slip through his fingers and earned a seat in Code S.
Over the last few months, Naniwa has been training hard over in Korea to take his game to the next level, and his hard work appeared to pay off in Providence. The 2nd Place finish was good enough to earn him a Code S spot, so keep an eye on this MLG Champion as he goes toe-to-toe with the world's best during the offseason.
Naniwa, however, stayed focused on his goal. Amidst swirls of tabloid drama and misguided quotes, Naniwa kept his concentration on the task at hand. When his turn to enter the bracket finally rolled around, the Swedish Protoss defeated Nestea for the second time that weekend, and followed the feat with wins over Huk and DongRaeGu. In the end Naniwa failed to seal the deal as he lost four straight games against Leenock in the Grand Finals, but appeared to be a man with a renewed determination and a refined playstyle. With the pedigree Naniwa displayed over the weekend,it's hard not to be excited about Naniwa's 2012 prospects in Code S and at Major League Gaming Events.
Pro Circuit Players Competing in the GSL At MLG Columbus, the Top 3 non-Korean finishers will each be placed into GSL Code A. At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, within the Top 3, regardless of country of origin, who does not already have Code S status. Code S status will not be awarded if all of the players placing 1st-3rd already have Code S Status. Code A status will be awarded to the next three highest placing non-Korean players. If Code S status is awarded to a Korean player, or not awarded at all, Code A status also will be awarded to the 4th highest placing non-Korean player.
Naniwa was able to secure a huge victory and guarantee at least a Top 3 finish in Providence. That placement will gives him a chance to secure Code S and continues the run of world class players that Naniwa has defeated over the course of the championship weekend in Providence.
So by insisting on defending their honor GOM is not only arguably treating Naniwa unfairly but also hurting the integrity of the MLG/GOM partnership?
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
There was no exchange program at Providence. No Koreans outside hte Top 16 were given seeds into the Winner's Bracket. Please check your facts before you post stuff like htis.
lol, the facts are in the links I posted, please check them yourself.
I did... Like I said. There was no exchange program.... Need I say more?
so OBVIOUSLY providence is part of the exchange program. Sure, no Koreans were sent because the tournament structure does not allow for it, but GSL seeds were still given.
TLPD makes mistakes too, MLG still doesn't know what is going on and GSL is giving zero statements so far.
On December 15 2011 02:04 Monasou wrote: I guess this is alright..Still..The game itself didn't matter. He didn't think it mattered. It didn't matter. Whatever. Would've liked to see the match though ; /
Thats why the match mattered. Because you wanted to see it. At the end of the day, we pay for Naniwa to play, and we wanted to see the game. As a pro, he owes it to you, me, and everyone else to play.
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
There was no exchange program at Providence. No Koreans outside hte Top 16 were given seeds into the Winner's Bracket. Please check your facts before you post stuff like htis.
lol, the facts are in the links I posted, please check them yourself.
I did... Like I said. There was no exchange program.... Need I say more?
so OBVIOUSLY providence is part of the exchange program. Sure, no Koreans were sent because the tournament structure does not allow for it, but GSL seeds were still given.
you clearly dont understand what exchange means. there were no players from korea seeded into any spot at providence, hence no exchange... im done with this not worth arguing over i have more important things to do
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
There was no exchange program at Providence. No Koreans outside hte Top 16 were given seeds into the Winner's Bracket. Please check your facts before you post stuff like htis.
lol, the facts are in the links I posted, please check them yourself.
I did... Like I said. There was no exchange program.... Need I say more?
so OBVIOUSLY providence is part of the exchange program. Sure, no Koreans were sent because the tournament structure does not allow for it, but GSL seeds were still given.
TLPD makes mistakes too, MLG still doesn't know what is going on and GSL is giving zero statements so far.
Just wait and see
Sure, I just think it's silly that people are telling me to "check my facts" if what I did is try to post the facts :< It's not like they have better facts.
Ultimately he dropped the following four games, and despite not being crowned champion, Naniwa has presented one of the most captivating weeks imaginable, both in and out of the game. In the last week, Naniwa has rage quit of of a GSL match, flown half-way around the world, defeated the two most successful Korean Starcraft 2 players back-to-back, sparked a rivalry with Nestea, been the center of controversy in a rematch against Nestea, let a National Championship slip through his fingers and earned a seat in Code S.
Over the last few months, Naniwa has been training hard over in Korea to take his game to the next level, and his hard work appeared to pay off in Providence. The 2nd Place finish was good enough to earn him a Code S spot, so keep an eye on this MLG Champion as he goes toe-to-toe with the world's best during the offseason.
Naniwa, however, stayed focused on his goal. Amidst swirls of tabloid drama and misguided quotes, Naniwa kept his concentration on the task at hand. When his turn to enter the bracket finally rolled around, the Swedish Protoss defeated Nestea for the second time that weekend, and followed the feat with wins over Huk and DongRaeGu. In the end Naniwa failed to seal the deal as he lost four straight games against Leenock in the Grand Finals, but appeared to be a man with a renewed determination and a refined playstyle. With the pedigree Naniwa displayed over the weekend,it's hard not to be excited about Naniwa's 2012 prospects in Code S and at Major League Gaming Events.
Pro Circuit Players Competing in the GSL At MLG Columbus, the Top 3 non-Korean finishers will each be placed into GSL Code A. At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, within the Top 3, regardless of country of origin, who does not already have Code S status. Code S status will not be awarded if all of the players placing 1st-3rd already have Code S Status. Code A status will be awarded to the next three highest placing non-Korean players. If Code S status is awarded to a Korean player, or not awarded at all, Code A status also will be awarded to the 4th highest placing non-Korean player.
Naniwa was able to secure a huge victory and guarantee at least a Top 3 finish in Providence. That placement will gives him a chance to secure Code S and continues the run of world class players that Naniwa has defeated over the course of the championship weekend in Providence.
So by insisting on defending their honor GOM is not only arguably treating Naniwa unfairly but also hurting the integrity of the MLG/GOM partnership?
On December 15 2011 02:04 Monasou wrote: I guess this is alright..Still..The game itself didn't matter. He didn't think it mattered. It didn't matter. Whatever. Would've liked to see the match though ; /
Thats why the match mattered. Because you wanted to see it. At the end of the day, we pay for Naniwa to play, and we wanted to see the game. As a pro, he owes it to you, me, and everyone else to play.
Naniwa owes nothing to you. You didn't pay him, you paid GomTV to entertain you. If GomTV makes bad rules that encourage players to not play their best, be mad at GomTV not Naniwa. Afterall you are paying GomTV.
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
There was no exchange program at Providence. No Koreans outside hte Top 16 were given seeds into the Winner's Bracket. Please check your facts before you post stuff like htis.
lol, the facts are in the links I posted, please check them yourself.
I did... Like I said. There was no exchange program.... Need I say more?
so OBVIOUSLY providence is part of the exchange program. Sure, no Koreans were sent because the tournament structure does not allow for it, but GSL seeds were still given.
TLPD makes mistakes too, MLG still doesn't know what is going on and GSL is giving zero statements so far.
Just wait and see
Sure, I just think it's silly that people are telling me to "check my facts" if what I did is try to post the facts :< It's not like they have better facts.
the fact is that gsl made no announcement of them sending over koreans to play in mlg providence. no exchange program took place. why would gsl be obligated to hand out a code s spot.
I wish people would wait until Sundance came out and said his stuff because this conspiracy crap is stupid. And that is all it is up until someone credible truly shows their knowledge. As of now it just seems to me it is an "us versus them" mentality and that GOM must be lying.
On December 15 2011 02:04 Monasou wrote: I guess this is alright..Still..The game itself didn't matter. He didn't think it mattered. It didn't matter. Whatever. Would've liked to see the match though ; /
Thats why the match mattered. Because you wanted to see it. At the end of the day, we pay for Naniwa to play, and we wanted to see the game. As a pro, he owes it to you, me, and everyone else to play.
Naniwa owes nothing to you. You didn't pay him, you paid GomTV to entertain you. If GomTV makes bad rules that encourage players to not play their best, be mad at GomTV not Naniwa. Afterall you are paying GomTV.
Where does the money come from to pay him? Sponsors and US THE VIEWER. Do sponsors put money into tournaments nobody watches? Nope. Extremely naive if you think he owes the community nothing.
On December 15 2011 02:04 Monasou wrote: I guess this is alright..Still..The game itself didn't matter. He didn't think it mattered. It didn't matter. Whatever. Would've liked to see the match though ; /
Thats why the match mattered. Because you wanted to see it. At the end of the day, we pay for Naniwa to play, and we wanted to see the game. As a pro, he owes it to you, me, and everyone else to play.
Naniwa owes nothing to you. You didn't pay him, you paid GomTV to entertain you. If GomTV makes bad rules that encourage players to not play their best, be mad at GomTV not Naniwa. Afterall you are paying GomTV.
The point is that other players would have not done the same. We don't feel entitle to his entertaining us but he is entitle to a level of professionalism to GOM, other players, and himself.
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
There was no exchange program at Providence. No Koreans outside hte Top 16 were given seeds into the Winner's Bracket. Please check your facts before you post stuff like htis.
lol, the facts are in the links I posted, please check them yourself.
I did... Like I said. There was no exchange program.... Need I say more?
so OBVIOUSLY providence is part of the exchange program. Sure, no Koreans were sent because the tournament structure does not allow for it, but GSL seeds were still given.
TLPD makes mistakes too, MLG still doesn't know what is going on and GSL is giving zero statements so far.
Just wait and see
Sure, I just think it's silly that people are telling me to "check my facts" if what I did is try to post the facts :< It's not like they have better facts.
the fact is that gsl made no announcement of them sending over koreans to play in mlg providence. no exchange program took place. why would gsl be obligated to hand out a code s spot.
Possibly because every notable Korean was already going anyway? Providence had the biggest Korean player attendance of all the pro circuits, by quite a margin.
Again, you have no better facts than me. At least I was trying to come up with some sources. This whole thread is based on 1 tweet by Slasher, and a real MLG admin was quick to point out that Slasher knows nothing.
On December 15 2011 01:57 skyrunner wrote: It's called indian giving...
but i guess people are okay with it.
omg.... the posts get"better" and better.... really dude?
great post, great argument. really shut me down there. youtube comments belong on youtube, not on a forum made for discussion.
Also, i have no idea why people would be trusting slaher rofl... how many times has he been spreading misinformation or just been flat out wrong... hilarious. Of course he has to vioce his opinion here haha
On December 15 2011 00:59 Derez wrote: Can the thread title be renamed?
Seeing how Slasher (MLG representative and all) has stated that Nani wasn't actually awarded a code S slot for his providence performance, a more accurate title would be 'GomTV decides not to invite Naniwa to Code S January'.
Is GOM trying to save face or did all this people got it wrong?
Ultimately he dropped the following four games, and despite not being crowned champion, Naniwa has presented one of the most captivating weeks imaginable, both in and out of the game. In the last week, Naniwa has rage quit of of a GSL match, flown half-way around the world, defeated the two most successful Korean Starcraft 2 players back-to-back, sparked a rivalry with Nestea, been the center of controversy in a rematch against Nestea, let a National Championship slip through his fingers and earned a seat in Code S.
Over the last few months, Naniwa has been training hard over in Korea to take his game to the next level, and his hard work appeared to pay off in Providence. The 2nd Place finish was good enough to earn him a Code S spot, so keep an eye on this MLG Champion as he goes toe-to-toe with the world's best during the offseason.
Naniwa, however, stayed focused on his goal. Amidst swirls of tabloid drama and misguided quotes, Naniwa kept his concentration on the task at hand. When his turn to enter the bracket finally rolled around, the Swedish Protoss defeated Nestea for the second time that weekend, and followed the feat with wins over Huk and DongRaeGu. In the end Naniwa failed to seal the deal as he lost four straight games against Leenock in the Grand Finals, but appeared to be a man with a renewed determination and a refined playstyle. With the pedigree Naniwa displayed over the weekend, it's hard not to be excited about Naniwa's 2012 prospects in Code S and at Major League Gaming Events.
At MLG Columbus, the Top 3 non-Korean finishers will each be placed into GSL Code A. At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, within the Top 3, regardless of country of origin, who does not already have Code S status. Code S status will not be awarded if all of the players placing 1st-3rd already have Code S Status. Code A status will be awarded to the next three highest placing non-Korean players. If Code S status is awarded to a Korean player, or not awarded at all, Code A status also will be awarded to the 4th highest placing non-Korean player.
Naniwa was able to secure a huge victory and guarantee at least a Top 3 finish in Providence. That placement will gives him a chance to secure Code S and continues the run of world class players that Naniwa has defeated over the course of the championship weekend in Providence.
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
There was no exchange program at Providence. No Koreans outside hte Top 16 were given seeds into the Winner's Bracket. Please check your facts before you post stuff like htis.
lol, the facts are in the links I posted, please check them yourself.
I did... Like I said. There was no exchange program.... Need I say more?
so OBVIOUSLY providence is part of the exchange program. Sure, no Koreans were sent because the tournament structure does not allow for it, but GSL seeds were still given.
you clearly dont understand what exchange means. there were no players from korea seeded into any spot at providence, hence no exchange... im done with this not worth arguing over i have more important things to do
You don't see a problem in GOM only making the information public that naniwa had in fact, contrary to wideheld belief (which seems to include naniwa and his team..), not qualified for code S, until a day after the Nestea match and after publicly stating by twitter that "NaNiwa is baned 2012 GSL codeS Season#1 Seed. so, GamaniaSen is coming! #GSL #SC2"?
I think you need a lot of goodwill on GOMs behalf to come to any other conclusion than that GOM is trying to make a controversial decision seem less so.
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
There was no exchange program at Providence. No Koreans outside hte Top 16 were given seeds into the Winner's Bracket. Please check your facts before you post stuff like htis.
lol, the facts are in the links I posted, please check them yourself.
I did... Like I said. There was no exchange program.... Need I say more?
so OBVIOUSLY providence is part of the exchange program. Sure, no Koreans were sent because the tournament structure does not allow for it, but GSL seeds were still given.
TLPD makes mistakes too, MLG still doesn't know what is going on and GSL is giving zero statements so far.
Just wait and see
Sure, I just think it's silly that people are telling me to "check my facts" if what I did is try to post the facts :< It's not like they have better facts.
the fact is that gsl made no announcement of them sending over koreans to play in mlg providence. no exchange program took place. why would gsl be obligated to hand out a code s spot.
Possibly because every notable Korean was already going anyway? Providence had the biggest Korean player attendance of all the pro circuits, by quite a margin.
Again, you have no better facts than me. At least I was trying to come up with some sources. This whole thread is based on 1 tweet by Slasher, and a real MLG admin was quick to point out that Slasher knows nothing.
Go look at the MLG Providence liquipedia page. Does it say anywhere on there that GSL sent over koreans to be SEEDED into the Winner's Bracket that were not already there? No. That is all.
On December 15 2011 01:16 Focuspants wrote: This needs to be cleared up, because I cant stand reading all of the misinformed posts in the numerous other threads.
Naniwa did not earn a Code S spot from MLG Providence. GOM was going to give him one of the two foreigner spots.
Based on Naniwa's behaviour at the Blizzard cup, they chose to not give him that spot, and instead, give it to someone else.
I think this is a very fair reaction, seeing as how he acted inappropriately. GOM was going to give him a gift, Naniwa ofended them, they decided they would no longer give him that gift.
Please people, whether you agree or disagree with Naniwas actions, at least understand what you are arguing over. This will save a lot of headaches in the multitude of other threads related to this issue.
"Naniwa did not earn a Code S spot from MLG Providence. GOM was going to give him one of the two foreigner spots."
He was going to get one, now he don't... how is that not losing a spot? Even if it was not via MLG, he is still losing a spot. GOMTV told him before Blizzard Cup that he was going to Code S... and he don't anymore. That's losing a spot in my book.
And now look at the bottom about Providence. You see any invited koreans? It looks more like MLG code S extortion ^^ Jokes aside. Providence wasn't a regular MLG they didn't have pools so they didn't invite koreans. No koreans = no code S spot. I believe this is how GOM saw that. Also Providence affects 2012 season and the exchange program was for year 2011. I think MLG as well as ESV are suppose to be negotiating a deal for the next year with GOM.
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
There was no exchange program at Providence. No Koreans outside hte Top 16 were given seeds into the Winner's Bracket. Please check your facts before you post stuff like htis.
lol, the facts are in the links I posted, please check them yourself.
I did... Like I said. There was no exchange program.... Need I say more?
so OBVIOUSLY providence is part of the exchange program. Sure, no Koreans were sent because the tournament structure does not allow for it, but GSL seeds were still given.
TLPD makes mistakes too, MLG still doesn't know what is going on and GSL is giving zero statements so far.
Just wait and see
Sure, I just think it's silly that people are telling me to "check my facts" if what I did is try to post the facts :< It's not like they have better facts.
the fact is that gsl made no announcement of them sending over koreans to play in mlg providence. no exchange program took place. why would gsl be obligated to hand out a code s spot.
Possibly because every notable Korean was already going anyway? Providence had the biggest Korean player attendance of all the pro circuits, by quite a margin.
Again, you have no better facts than me. At least I was trying to come up with some sources. This whole thread is based on 1 tweet by Slasher, and a real MLG admin was quick to point out that Slasher knows nothing.
Go look at the MLG Providence liquipedia page. Does it say anywhere on there that GSL sent over koreans to be SEEDED into the Winner's Bracket that were not already there? No. That is all.
Does it say anywhere on the GSL-MLG exchange page that the code S seed will not be given if no Koreans are seeded? No. That is all.
Ok this is just too much. I'm not watching GSL ever again because this is simply retarded. Why did nobody mention that Naniwas actually didn't win the Code S spot till now? Quite suspicious. Secondly citing that rule as a prove is beyond stupid because that cant apply to anything even to Idra not GG-ing. I don't like Naniwa at all mainly because his past in WC3 and the fact that he said that Grubby would be a mediocre player if he haven't played orc. But this is about the Korean culture. I got pissed about players tweeting hate on Naniwa. I saw no players tweets about CoCa and what he did was far worse. So please dear Koreans if your culture is based on rules so much could you try to follow them first?
and: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GSL-MLG_Exchange_Program "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows: Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status. "
There was no exchange program at Providence. No Koreans outside hte Top 16 were given seeds into the Winner's Bracket. Please check your facts before you post stuff like htis.
lol, the facts are in the links I posted, please check them yourself.
I did... Like I said. There was no exchange program.... Need I say more?
so OBVIOUSLY providence is part of the exchange program. Sure, no Koreans were sent because the tournament structure does not allow for it, but GSL seeds were still given.
TLPD makes mistakes too, MLG still doesn't know what is going on and GSL is giving zero statements so far.
Just wait and see
Sure, I just think it's silly that people are telling me to "check my facts" if what I did is try to post the facts :< It's not like they have better facts.
the fact is that gsl made no announcement of them sending over koreans to play in mlg providence. no exchange program took place. why would gsl be obligated to hand out a code s spot.
Yep GSL doesnt exist. Starcraft doesnt exist. Nobody anounced that it is in fact real. It is all in our heads.
Well, i can see why thy would give IdrA a code S spot, considering he forfeited his previous code S spot when he left Korea. Sen, I'm not sure--he did make it to the round of 32 in a GSL, but... Yeah, I think Naniwa blew it, if they were just considering him for a spot, and actually hadn't rewarded him for the spot with a #2 Providence finish... which was the fact echoed by many of the informed people at the event itself.
Since IdrA will now not be involved in the Up & Downs, will they give Nani a seed there? that seems a more appropriate response--they're even giving DeMuslim a shot (I understand it's based upon past agreements with MLG, for his high-ish finish, what, top 10 or something?), and a #2 Providence finish is quite impressive, considering the caliber of players he beat in that tourney.
On December 15 2011 01:16 Focuspants wrote: This needs to be cleared up, because I cant stand reading all of the misinformed posts in the numerous other threads.
Naniwa did not earn a Code S spot from MLG Providence. GOM was going to give him one of the two foreigner spots.
Based on Naniwa's behaviour at the Blizzard cup, they chose to not give him that spot, and instead, give it to someone else.
I think this is a very fair reaction, seeing as how he acted inappropriately. GOM was going to give him a gift, Naniwa ofended them, they decided they would no longer give him that gift.
Please people, whether you agree or disagree with Naniwas actions, at least understand what you are arguing over. This will save a lot of headaches in the multitude of other threads related to this issue.
"Naniwa did not earn a Code S spot from MLG Providence. GOM was going to give him one of the two foreigner spots."
He was going to get one, now he don't... how is that not losing a spot? Even if it was not via MLG, he is still losing a spot. GOMTV told him before Blizzard Cup that he was going to Code S... and he don't anymore. That's losing a spot in my book.
Its much different, if it is a gift from GOM, and they no longer believe he represents them well, they have every right to not give it to him, and give it to whoever they see fit. If Naniwa earned the spot by winning it at another tournament, the issue is much different, and much mroe difficult to resolve. Isnt that obvious? I dont see how people dont see the difference between the two.
On December 15 2011 01:24 Project Psycho wrote: This is a load BS, because how has Stephano not got a code S spot? he was in the blizzard cup and has done a lot better than Naniwa, Idra and Sen in the last few months. Does Stephano even want a code S spot?
If you did a little research, you'd find stephano has said he doesnt want to live in korea...sooo...thats probably why
Naniwa got his code s spot, then later gom chooses to take it back. How can it be any other way? That's what you're supposed to make the argument for. "really dude" is not an argument.
On December 15 2011 01:16 Focuspants wrote: This needs to be cleared up, because I cant stand reading all of the misinformed posts in the numerous other threads.
Naniwa did not earn a Code S spot from MLG Providence. GOM was going to give him one of the two foreigner spots.
Based on Naniwa's behaviour at the Blizzard cup, they chose to not give him that spot, and instead, give it to someone else.
I think this is a very fair reaction, seeing as how he acted inappropriately. GOM was going to give him a gift, Naniwa ofended them, they decided they would no longer give him that gift.
Please people, whether you agree or disagree with Naniwas actions, at least understand what you are arguing over. This will save a lot of headaches in the multitude of other threads related to this issue.
"Naniwa did not earn a Code S spot from MLG Providence. GOM was going to give him one of the two foreigner spots."
He was going to get one, now he don't... how is that not losing a spot? Even if it was not via MLG, he is still losing a spot. GOMTV told him before Blizzard Cup that he was going to Code S... and he don't anymore. That's losing a spot in my book.
Its much different, if it is a gift from GOM, and they no longer believe he represents them well, they have every right to not give it to him, and give it to whoever they see fit. If Naniwa earned the spot by winning it at another tournament, the issue is much different, and much mroe difficult to resolve. Isnt that obvious? I dont see how people dont see the difference between the two.
You don't see a problem in GOM only making the information public that naniwa had in fact, contrary to wideheld belief (which seems to include naniwa and his team..), not qualified for code S, until a day after the Nestea match and after publicly stating by twitter that "NaNiwa is baned 2012 GSL codeS Season#1 Seed. so, GamaniaSen is coming! #GSL #SC2"?
I think you need a lot of goodwill on GOMs behalf to come to any other conclusion than that GOM is trying to make a controversial decision seem less so.
On December 15 2011 01:24 Project Psycho wrote: This is a load BS, because how has Stephano not got a code S spot? he was in the blizzard cup and has done a lot better than Naniwa, Idra and Sen in the last few months. Does Stephano even want a code S spot?
If you did a little research, you'd find stephano has said he doesnt want to live in korea...sooo...thats probably why
No it is because GOM are evil. Stephano stated he didn't want to participate in GSL. Clearly that is GOM's fault.
On December 15 2011 01:16 Focuspants wrote: This needs to be cleared up, because I cant stand reading all of the misinformed posts in the numerous other threads.
Naniwa did not earn a Code S spot from MLG Providence. GOM was going to give him one of the two foreigner spots.
Based on Naniwa's behaviour at the Blizzard cup, they chose to not give him that spot, and instead, give it to someone else.
I think this is a very fair reaction, seeing as how he acted inappropriately. GOM was going to give him a gift, Naniwa ofended them, they decided they would no longer give him that gift.
Please people, whether you agree or disagree with Naniwas actions, at least understand what you are arguing over. This will save a lot of headaches in the multitude of other threads related to this issue.
"Naniwa did not earn a Code S spot from MLG Providence. GOM was going to give him one of the two foreigner spots."
He was going to get one, now he don't... how is that not losing a spot? Even if it was not via MLG, he is still losing a spot. GOMTV told him before Blizzard Cup that he was going to Code S... and he don't anymore. That's losing a spot in my book.
Its much different, if it is a gift from GOM, and they no longer believe he represents them well, they have every right to not give it to him, and give it to whoever they see fit. If Naniwa earned the spot by winning it at another tournament, the issue is much different, and much mroe difficult to resolve. Isnt that obvious? I dont see how people dont see the difference between the two.
You don't see a problem in GOM only making the information public that naniwa had in fact, contrary to wideheld belief (which seems to include naniwa and his team..), not qualified for code S, until a day after the Nestea match and after publicly stating by twitter that "NaNiwa is baned 2012 GSL codeS Season#1 Seed. so, GamaniaSen is coming! #GSL #SC2"?
I think you need a lot of goodwill on GOMs behalf to come to any other conclusion than that GOM is trying to make a controversial decision seem less so.
They didnt have a reason to come out and say it, because nobody was asking any questions, and they likely assumed that everyone knew what was going on. How do you know there is a problem before it surfaces?
EPT
) and he would be someone who would know whether it is given or earned.
