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On August 15 2009 01:57 Krigstar wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2009 01:38 Ideas wrote:On August 15 2009 01:27 Hot_Bid wrote:On August 14 2009 21:02 damenmofa wrote:On August 14 2009 20:53 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:On August 14 2009 20:52 d_so wrote:On August 14 2009 20:50 Tinithor wrote:On August 14 2009 20:48 pr0t0ss wrote:
LJD play is beautifull
it's like a classic music, like a symphony
he deserved everyone of his wins
what can fantasy do? some bunker cheese?
MSL mean much less than OSL after all
this OSL became Jaedong's coronation for the bownja, best of the best of the best al times, etc. title I just do NOT understand how people can be SO BIASED to one side or the other! I really cant! Jaedong failed in Proleague Grand Finals, Fantasy failed in OSL Semi Finals, who the fuck are YOU to judge who is better? u need to calm down. simiple fact is that, for whatever reason, OSL championships are worth the most for an individual player. Winning a few games in Proleague is commendable but doesn't hold the same clout as an OSL championship actually thats more our perspective than theirs. proleague grand final is the single most important event to every progamer thats the most overgeneralizing assumption I have ever read. You cant even speak korean but certainly you know what is most important to every progamer... Proleague matters the most because players spend the most time practicing for it. Even Jaedong said he barely practiced for MSL quarters against Canata because he was practicing for PL. If you ask any progamer would they rather win an OSL or the Proleague Finals Ace Match, it's pretty easy choice -- they'd pick PL. Just think about it, one of these happens once a year instead of 4 times, and you're playing with all these other people counting on you. Just because you arbitrarily believe that OSL is better doesn't make it true. Am I the only one who thinks JD didn't really mean it when he said PL is most important? I mean I dunno about you guys but if I were JD I would focus WAY more on my own leagues than the team league. I have a suspicion that he just said that (practices almost solely for PL) to try to scare CJ/make himself look good. Do we (as foreigners who only read translated articles/interviews and don't really know what it's like to be a progamer) know for SURE that most players prioritize PL over individual leagues? While it's true the PL finals are far less frequent, there's not nearly as much glory in it as in winning an individual league, even GOM! I kind of agree with this. If someone asks you if you practise for your own personal tournament or the finals of the "once a year team-league" of course you are going to respond the team league. Saying anything else is social suicide. So to depend on official interviews or statements in this case is almost worthless in my mind. Obviously it depend on how deep you are in both tournaments. If you are in the OSL final and have a mid-season pro-league game the day after obviously no sane pro-gamer gives any amount of time to the pro-league game. And vice versa I guess (even though worthless games rarely occur in MSL or OSL)... In the end, generally I think both managers, coaches, sponsors and players prefer a player to win an individual league if the choice has to be either or. Also SKT without Fantasy is way better than Oz without Jaedong... So letting Fantasy rest from pro-league practise is no doubt an easier choice than letting Jaedong rest. It's certainly not set in stone how the teams work this out in my opinion.
No, no, no, no. The Proleague is the most popular SC league in Korea. Furthermore, the team wins a lot more and gets a lot more recognition by winning the Proleague. A player winning an individual league gets the glory, not the team, and only part of his tournament winnings go to the team.
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On August 15 2009 02:10 Stratos_speAr wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2009 01:57 Krigstar wrote:On August 15 2009 01:38 Ideas wrote:On August 15 2009 01:27 Hot_Bid wrote:On August 14 2009 21:02 damenmofa wrote:On August 14 2009 20:53 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:On August 14 2009 20:52 d_so wrote:On August 14 2009 20:50 Tinithor wrote:On August 14 2009 20:48 pr0t0ss wrote:
LJD play is beautifull
it's like a classic music, like a symphony
he deserved everyone of his wins
what can fantasy do? some bunker cheese?
MSL mean much less than OSL after all
this OSL became Jaedong's coronation for the bownja, best of the best of the best al times, etc. title I just do NOT understand how people can be SO BIASED to one side or the other! I really cant! Jaedong failed in Proleague Grand Finals, Fantasy failed in OSL Semi Finals, who the fuck are YOU to judge who is better? u need to calm down. simiple fact is that, for whatever reason, OSL championships are worth the most for an individual player. Winning a few games in Proleague is commendable but doesn't hold the same clout as an OSL championship actually thats more our perspective than theirs. proleague grand final is the single most important event to every progamer thats the most overgeneralizing assumption I have ever read. You cant even speak korean but certainly you know what is most important to every progamer... Proleague matters the most because players spend the most time practicing for it. Even Jaedong said he barely practiced for MSL quarters against Canata because he was practicing for PL. If you ask any progamer would they rather win an OSL or the Proleague Finals Ace Match, it's pretty easy choice -- they'd pick PL. Just think about it, one of these happens once a year instead of 4 times, and you're playing with all these other people counting on you. Just because you arbitrarily believe that OSL is better doesn't make it true. Am I the only one who thinks JD didn't really mean it when he said PL is most important? I mean I dunno about you guys but if I were JD I would focus WAY more on my own leagues than the team league. I have a suspicion that he just said that (practices almost solely for PL) to try to scare CJ/make himself look good. Do we (as foreigners who only read translated articles/interviews and don't really know what it's like to be a progamer) know for SURE that most players prioritize PL over individual leagues? While it's true the PL finals are far less frequent, there's not nearly as much glory in it as in winning an individual league, even GOM! I kind of agree with this. If someone asks you if you practise for your own personal tournament or the finals of the "once a year team-league" of course you are going to respond the team league. Saying anything else is social suicide. So to depend on official interviews or statements in this case is almost worthless in my mind. Obviously it depend on how deep you are in both tournaments. If you are in the OSL final and have a mid-season pro-league game the day after obviously no sane pro-gamer gives any amount of time to the pro-league game. And vice versa I guess (even though worthless games rarely occur in MSL or OSL)... In the end, generally I think both managers, coaches, sponsors and players prefer a player to win an individual league if the choice has to be either or. Also SKT without Fantasy is way better than Oz without Jaedong... So letting Fantasy rest from pro-league practise is no doubt an easier choice than letting Jaedong rest. It's certainly not set in stone how the teams work this out in my opinion. No, no, no, no. The Proleague is the most popular SC league in Korea. Furthermore, the team wins a lot more and gets a lot more recognition by winning the Proleague. A player winning an individual league gets the glory, not the team, and only part of his tournament winnings go to the team.
Ah, yes you are right, I worded it silly. I mean that if you let Fantasy skip pro-league practise his team still has a chance. If he only practises for pro-league he has close to zero chance of winning his individual league. This is why I don't think it is set in stone in Jaedongs case. If you let Jaedong play for his individual league only, his team is almost certainly doomed, but most other teams are not one-man teams like this. That's what I mean when I say that Jaedong's and Oz's cases are different from other teams.
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ah missed the whole thing, can't wait for youtube vods!
I miss the write up on matches like these, there hasn't been many lately.
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I hope JD doesn't blow it in the finals. His ZvZ has been looking very very mortal lately =(
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DAaaamn it
Must... watch... games...
Is there any way to watch the vods already?? aren't up on youtube yet...
someone recorded it with livestream.com or something?
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Jon747 just uploaded the first one on youtube about 30 minutes ago, so I guess the rest are incoming.
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Haha, fucking awesome. About time JD silenced the T1 fanboys.
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United States17042 Posts
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On August 15 2009 01:27 Hot_Bid wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2009 21:02 damenmofa wrote:On August 14 2009 20:53 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:On August 14 2009 20:52 d_so wrote:On August 14 2009 20:50 Tinithor wrote:On August 14 2009 20:48 pr0t0ss wrote:
LJD play is beautifull
it's like a classic music, like a symphony
he deserved everyone of his wins
what can fantasy do? some bunker cheese?
MSL mean much less than OSL after all
this OSL became Jaedong's coronation for the bownja, best of the best of the best al times, etc. title I just do NOT understand how people can be SO BIASED to one side or the other! I really cant! Jaedong failed in Proleague Grand Finals, Fantasy failed in OSL Semi Finals, who the fuck are YOU to judge who is better? u need to calm down. simiple fact is that, for whatever reason, OSL championships are worth the most for an individual player. Winning a few games in Proleague is commendable but doesn't hold the same clout as an OSL championship actually thats more our perspective than theirs. proleague grand final is the single most important event to every progamer thats the most overgeneralizing assumption I have ever read. You cant even speak korean but certainly you know what is most important to every progamer... Proleague matters the most because players spend the most time practicing for it. Even Jaedong said he barely practiced for MSL quarters against Canata because he was practicing for PL. If you ask any progamer would they rather win an OSL or the Proleague Finals Ace Match, it's pretty easy choice -- they'd pick PL. Just think about it, one of these happens once a year instead of 4 times, and you're playing with all these other people counting on you. Just because you arbitrarily believe that OSL is better doesn't make it true.
very true.
but Golden mouse > proleague??
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On August 15 2009 02:40 ziggymondais wrote:
Jon747 just uploaded the first one on youtube about 30 minutes ago, so I guess the rest are incoming.
3rd one is up but not the second what?
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Watching them now on Jon747 
Gona be epic!
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Russian Federation405 Posts
Who is Boxer? He’s winner of 2 OSL (and only he’s only one who wins them back to back up today).
Who is NaDa? He’s winner of 3 OSL and 3 MSL.
Who is July? He’s the first Zerg who has 3 OSL wins.
Who is iloveoove?.. sAviOr?.. Bisu?.. etc, etc, etc… All of them are winners of individual leagues. Because Starcraft is first of all the competition of individuals.
Proleague is most important event for sponsors, KeSPA, and broadcasting companies, not for players.
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On August 15 2009 03:02 nonduc wrote:
Who is Boxer? He’s winner of 2 OSL (and only he’s only one who wins them back to back up today).
Who is NaDa? He’s winner of 3 OSL and 3 MSL.
Who is July? He’s the first Zerg who has 3 OSL wins.
Who is iloveoove?.. sAviOr?.. Bisu?.. etc, etc, etc… All of them are winners of individual leagues. Because Starcraft is first of all the competition of individuals.
Proleague is most important event for sponsors, KeSPA, and broadcasting companies, not for players.
That's who they are to us foreigners. Maybe someone who has spent time in Korea could comment on this, but it seems possible that things are viewed differently over there. The MSL and OSL get so much more coverage here than pro-leagues. Each SL game gets English commentary from several people, while it's very difficult to find commentated PL games. If you could sit down with your buddies and watch live casted english PL games every week, you might have a different experience of things.
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On August 15 2009 03:02 nonduc wrote:
Who is Boxer? He’s winner of 2 OSL (and only he’s only one who wins them back to back up today).
Who is NaDa? He’s winner of 3 OSL and 3 MSL.
Who is July? He’s the first Zerg who has 3 OSL wins.
Who is iloveoove?.. sAviOr?.. Bisu?.. etc, etc, etc… All of them are winners of individual leagues. Because Starcraft is first of all the competition of individuals.
Proleague is most important event for sponsors, KeSPA, and broadcasting companies, not for players.
I agree with this. When people discuss who is the best player of time they don't rave and rant about PL, it's pretty much all about OSL.
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On August 15 2009 02:42 fnaticNoname wrote:
Haha, fucking awesome. About time JD silenced the T1 fanboys.
We're obviously not going to cheer when Fantasy loses... so when the hell DO we cheer for him? Nothing wrong with being a fanboy
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On August 15 2009 03:08 Orbifold wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2009 03:02 nonduc wrote:
Who is Boxer? He’s winner of 2 OSL (and only he’s only one who wins them back to back up today).
Who is NaDa? He’s winner of 3 OSL and 3 MSL.
Who is July? He’s the first Zerg who has 3 OSL wins.
Who is iloveoove?.. sAviOr?.. Bisu?.. etc, etc, etc… All of them are winners of individual leagues. Because Starcraft is first of all the competition of individuals.
Proleague is most important event for sponsors, KeSPA, and broadcasting companies, not for players. That's who they are to us foreigners. Maybe someone who has spent time in Korea could comment on this, but it seems possible that things are viewed differently over there. The MSL and OSL get so much more coverage here than pro-leagues. Each SL game gets English commentary from several people, while it's very difficult to find commentated PL games. If you could sit down with your buddies and watch live casted english PL games every week, you might have a different experience of things.
Not only that, players CLEARLY STATE that they practice more for the Proleague. Furthermore, a lot of those players aren't known for their PL greatness because they weren't great in the PL - it's a team effort, so one man can't do it all. That being said, Boxer and Oov are known just as much for MAKING SK Telecom than they are for their individual awesomeness. Hell, Boxer is probably known even more for his contributions to the industry and his team than his individual wins.
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Wow that first game was quite good, can't wait to watch rest!
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Russian Federation405 Posts
On August 15 2009 03:15 Stratos_speAr wrote:Hell, Boxer is probably known even more for his contributions to the industry and his team than his individual wins. LOL
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On August 15 2009 01:35 Holgerius wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2009 01:31 Mortality wrote:
LOL. JD best of the best all time? I still don't see him as the best Zerg of all time, let alone the best player ever. When the fuck has JD gold grand slammed, huh?
He's good amazingly good, but a lot of people seem tob e riding his cock lately. He's anything but invincible. If he wins this OSL I will without any doubt call him the best Zerg ever, and he would be a serious candidate for ''Best SC-player of all time'' as well.
Best all time? Hello, have you forgotten NaDa here? 3 time OSL champ / 3 time MSL champ mean nothing to you? Not to mention all the other tournaments he won (KTF Premier League, GhemTV SL, ITV League, OGN Masters League...).
Oh sure, these days the PL schedules of players like JD are incredibly hectic, but can you really put a man down for winning THREE starleagues in the same season? That's what NaDa did. It would be like winning OSL/MSL and GOM all in the same season.
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EPT
