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dl2agon
United States473 Posts
On August 14 2009 10:14 nayumi wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2009 07:30 Eeevil wrote:
(1) It's a good question if JD is slumping or not. We'll know the answer in a few hours.
(2) Hope the Dong is sleeping well. (1) Actually losing a couple of semis and a final doesn't necessarily mean a progamer is slumping. Slump is only appropriate to address a player who is losing a lot of games consecutively. So the answer to that question can only be known next season. As far as this season is concerned, Jaedong has been a beast since Day 1 but he just didn't have a happy ending (that is if he's losing to Fantasy today). (2) I'm sure he was not. Someone seriously needs to slap this boy in the face telling him that cutting up a huge amount of sleep doesn't help winning at all. Of course before important games he might want to sleep a couple of hours less to prepare better. I don't blame him for that, because we all do it. But he has been cutting his sleep since the beginning of this season for fuck's sake. Now it's already too late to tell him to get some sleep, because there's only semi (and final) left and it's virtually impossible for one to sleep peacefully before such games. Coaches and managers should really plan their members' sleeping schedule better. If the players insist then just fucking kill off those hamsters and there goes the power.
Agreed. Quit throwing the word slump around. Its like all the morons using the word epic everywhere.
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On August 14 2009 06:25 Zinfandel wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2009 05:47 mog87 wrote:On August 14 2009 05:31 Tekin wrote:
Could this be a sign that JD is on a slump? no I hope you're joking. It's obvious that The Dong is in a slump. He got kicked out of Gom TV, lost the proleague finals for his team, and just got kicked out of the MSL. He is in a slump because he was the favorite to win Gom and the MSL, and people were expecting him to beat Hyuk and at least get to the Super Ace Match and win it for Oz. Anyone who thinks The Dong is not in a slump (as of right now; it can turn around if he wins the OSL) is in denial.
Lol @ people thinking any progamer actually ever cared about GOM... Practicing for GOM is jokingly considered cheating among progamers, the only progamer who admitted practicing was Iris but he was going to face a teammate so it wasn't that big of a deal.
And also lol @ all the slumping Jaedong posts and posters...
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On August 14 2009 11:21 r33k wrote:
Lol @ people thinking any progamer actually ever cared about GOM... Practicing for GOM is jokingly considered cheating among progamers, the only progamer who admitted practicing was Iris but he was going to face a teammate so it wasn't that big of a deal.
iirc, what Effort was ragging Iris about was practicing for GOM semis instead of/as well as the Proleague semis, and all indications seem to be that most are considering PL the biggest progaming stage right now. I don't think it was so much a case of "nobody cares" as it's a lesser priority. I'm expecting Iris to lose the GOM final just on the basis that he has MSL semis to practice for as well.
GOM doesn't have the prestige of the OSL or even the MSL, but I'm pretty sure people care somewhat, at least because of that paycheck.
On the other hand, if you want a tournament that evidently no one cares about, there's this thing called the Masters going on...
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On August 14 2009 09:15 ArvickHero wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2009 08:36 d(O.o)a wrote:On August 14 2009 07:33 Jayme wrote:On August 14 2009 07:13 Avidkeystamper wrote:On August 14 2009 07:11 dl2agon wrote:On August 14 2009 06:57 Shikyo wrote:
Now Oz should do their thing and trade Jaedong off because he's not winning everything. If he gets traded, at least he'll be on a better team than Oz. Lol, I hope you're kidding. What are the chances that Jaedong will "slump" forever? That's the whole point. He gets out of his "slump" when he leaves Oz unless he goes to SKT You mean KT, where careers go die.
No... I mean SKT home of the failzergs.
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Lol @ people thinking any progamer actually ever cared about GOM... Practicing for GOM is jokingly considered cheating among progamers, the only progamer who admitted practicing was Iris but he was going to face a teammate so it wasn't that big of a deal.
And also lol @ all the slumping Jaedong posts and posters...
People that say this make me annoyed because they sound so fucking stupid. Not only does the GSL have BY FAR the biggest prize pool, you win a trip to Blizzcon by doing well in the tournament. The players definitely care about it, even if they have higher priorities (like the PL, which is the most important league in Korea).
Agreed. Quit throwing the word slump around. Its like all the morons using the word epic everywhere.
So how many games does he have to lose before he's considered in a slump? He was knocked out of the GSL by Effort, he's dropped games to the likes of Orion and Hyuk, he was handily owned twice by Fantasy, he was knocked out of the MSL by Calm....I mean really, does he have to lose 100 games in a row before people realize what's going on? The guy's slipping. He's tired, overworked, not sleeping enough. It's perfectly reasonable to say slump.
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Has anyone realized how in this series, overpool, early ling pressure, fast +1 atk works against any other BO?
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shit...
edit: well I guess I shouldn't look to badly upon this loss. This just increased Iris' chance of winning greatly. JD is like the only person I can think of that can deal with all the weird play a Terran throws at them. Go Iris!
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On August 14 2009 13:30 Avidkeystamper wrote:
Has anyone realized how in this series, overpool, early ling pressure, fast +1 atk works against any other BO?
Don't forget hiding troop count. It makes your opponent have to play guessing games almost.
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On August 14 2009 05:40 mog87 wrote:
God...if kwanro or calm win the msl, this is the worst starleague season ever. Go Berserker claim your destiny slay kwanro and then feast upon calm.
whats wrong with calm winning the msl?
its not like Bo5 vs effort and jaedong is easy (probably the 2 best zvz'ers, and calm beat them both)
dont use the 12 hatch excuse, its effort's fault
calm's road to the finals:
group: 2-0 (beat sea and zero)
Ro16: calm 2-0 forgg
Ro8: calm 3-0 effort
Ro4: calm 3-1 jaedong
if calm plays iris in the finals, and wins(also if loses), then its far from "the worst starleague season ever"
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Denmark9110 Posts
On August 14 2009 19:55 Presony-Boy wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2009 05:40 mog87 wrote:
God...if kwanro or calm win the msl, this is the worst starleague season ever. Go Berserker claim your destiny slay kwanro and then feast upon calm. whats wrong with calm winning the msl? its not like Bo5 vs effort and jaedong is easy (probably the 2 best zvz'ers, and calm beat them both) dont use the 12 hatch excuse, its effort's fault calm's road to the finals: group: 2-0 (beat sea and zero) Ro16: calm 2-0 forgg Ro8: calm 3-0 effort Ro4: calm 3-1 jaedong if calm plays iris in the finals, and wins(also if loses), then its far from "the worst starleague season ever"
Just curious, what was the worst star league season ever then ? (not saying this one is bad, was awesome in my opinion)
When Luxury won MSL? When July won OSL in 2008?
Enlighten me 
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Valhalla18444 Posts
On August 14 2009 19:55 Presony-Boy wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2009 05:40 mog87 wrote:
God...if kwanro or calm win the msl, this is the worst starleague season ever. Go Berserker claim your destiny slay kwanro and then feast upon calm. whats wrong with calm winning the msl? its not like Bo5 vs effort and jaedong is easy (probably the 2 best zvz'ers, and calm beat them both) dont use the 12 hatch excuse, its effort's fault calm's road to the finals: group: 2-0 (beat sea and zero) Ro16: calm 2-0 forgg Ro8: calm 3-0 effort Ro4: calm 3-1 jaedong if calm plays iris in the finals, and wins(also if loses), then its far from "the worst starleague season ever"
all of calm's games have been entertaining and he's dominated them all
guy doesnt really get the spotlight cuz LOL ITS CLAM (even i ignore clam) but he's playing great starcraft right now and his games have been badass. so far, this has been a really cool MSL, especially paired with mo'fuckin iris in the semifinal
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On August 14 2009 13:35 kNyTTyM wrote:
edit: well I guess I shouldn't look to badly upon this loss. This just increased Iris' chance of winning greatly. JD is like the only person I can think of that can deal with all the weird play a Terran throws at them. Go Iris!
You have clearly never heard of sAviOr (well, okay, he's not that shiny right now), Yarnc, Luxury (well, before he sucked), or Effort. Or, for that matter, Calm, who first really impressed me with an absolute destruction of UpMagic in the Winners League.
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United States22883 Posts
Calm played pretty well. I just feel bad for Jaedong right now. He looks so damn tired. I gotta think Storyteller's diagnosis of overpracticing is coming into effect for him.
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Wow, this season Zerg of domination is even lamer than the "Golden Age of Protoss" with all Protoss ClubDay MSL semifinals and finals.
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On August 14 2009 13:30 Avidkeystamper wrote:
Has anyone realized how in this series, overpool, early ling pressure, fast +1 atk works against any other BO?
Calm didn't go overpool on Outsider, nor did he do early ling pressure, and he had an immense advantage after Jaedong's 9pool failed to do any significant damage to him. Then in the game on Heartbreak Ridge, Calm went 9pool against Jaedong's 13pool and won.
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Well, it's not strictly overpool, but a quick pool build. I'm pretty sure Calm went for an overpool on Outsider, since JD went 9 pool and they were slightly earlier than Calm's lings. He might've gone for 9 on HBR.
I guess my point would be that any 12 pool or higher looks extremely beatable with overpool or 9 pool now.
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United States11390 Posts
On August 15 2009 09:56 Avidkeystamper wrote:
Well, it's not strictly overpool, but a quick pool build. I'm pretty sure Calm went for an overpool on Outsider, since JD went 9 pool and they were slightly earlier than Calm's lings. He might've gone for 9 on HBR.
I guess my point would be that any 12 pool or higher looks extremely beatable with overpool or 9 pool now.
It was overgas on Outsider. Heartbreak Ridge was 9pool Speed which does amazing against 12pool expand builds.
Y SO DEJA VU AVID? 
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On August 15 2009 10:04 Harem wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2009 09:56 Avidkeystamper wrote:
Well, it's not strictly overpool, but a quick pool build. I'm pretty sure Calm went for an overpool on Outsider, since JD went 9 pool and they were slightly earlier than Calm's lings. He might've gone for 9 on HBR.
I guess my point would be that any 12 pool or higher looks extremely beatable with overpool or 9 pool now. It was overgas on Outsider. Heartbreak Ridge was 9pool Speed which does amazing against 12pool expand builds. Y SO DEJA VU AVID?
OMGZ. Let's just leave it at <10 pool, k?
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No, calm went overgas on Outsider and overgas is really different from overpool in how the build works out and what the builds aim to do.
Nal_Ra has been saying for a really long while now in a lot of the ZvZ games he commentated on about how 12pool just isn't really a good build anymore, and there were stats some guy did on ZvZ on Medusa that showed that 9pool was beating 12pool more than the other way around which put a really big dent on the traditional theory of 12pool > 9pool. Of course some of these things differ depending on the map being played, but regardless, some of these ideas has been known for a while now, and so with this in mind, Calm didn't really bring anything drastically new to the table except for the quick +1 attack he did in the last two games and simply just confirmed some of the new theoretical ideas that have been brought up in ZvZ in recent times.
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United States11390 Posts
On August 15 2009 10:07 Avidkeystamper wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2009 10:04 Harem wrote:On August 15 2009 09:56 Avidkeystamper wrote:
Well, it's not strictly overpool, but a quick pool build. I'm pretty sure Calm went for an overpool on Outsider, since JD went 9 pool and they were slightly earlier than Calm's lings. He might've gone for 9 on HBR.
I guess my point would be that any 12 pool or higher looks extremely beatable with overpool or 9 pool now. It was overgas on Outsider. Heartbreak Ridge was 9pool Speed which does amazing against 12pool expand builds. Y SO DEJA VU AVID? OMGZ. Let's just leave it at <10 pool, k?
Overgas makes pool at 11 though. ;(
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EPT
