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[MSL Finals] Jaedong vs fOrGG - Page 58

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
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Zed03
Profile Joined July 2008
Canada112 Posts
July 28 2008 17:34 GMT
#1141
This might be a stupid question, but, in all 3 games it seemed like Guardians would have been an excellent choice. Plenty of cliffs to hide them on and pick off tanks and marines...

Any reason why Jaedong didn't use them?
jello_biafra
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
United Kingdom6641 Posts
July 28 2008 17:42 GMT
#1142
Guardians are pretty expensive, aren't all THAT useful against large numbers of marines with upgrades, and get raped by irradiate. Also he could easily make some wraiths quickly which would also spell GG for the guards.
The road to hell is paved with good intentions | aka Probert[PaiN] @ iccup / godlikeparagon @ twitch | my BW stream: http://www.teamliquid.net/video/streams/jello_biafra
Warrior Madness
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Canada3791 Posts
July 28 2008 18:22 GMT
#1143
I would've liked to see JD try out that 2hatch fast 3rd build he used against Hwaisin. It seems like JD resorted to standard builds which forgg had perfectly timed builds to counter with. I also thought that JD had trouble keeping up with forgg's macro. In game 2 I thought JD was inching ahead, his mutas didn't do much but at least they took out 2 control groups of marines and kept his 3rd in tact. He threw it away when he engaged those M&Ms in the middle with just his lurkers. He could've waited for more lings or he could've pulled back and just turtled around his sunkens to wait for his reinforcements and defilers to pop out. But I get the feeling that JD thought that if he was even a little defensive forgg would create a terran ball so large he could've just walked over JD's nat and expo.
The Past: Yellow, Julyzerg, Chojja, Savior, GGplay -- The Present: Luxury, Jae- The Future: -Dong, maGma, Zero, Effort, Hoejja, hyvaa, by.hero, calm, Action ---> SC2 (Ret?? Kolll Idra!! SEN, Cool, ZergBong, Leenock)
Kyuki
Profile Joined February 2008
Sweden1867 Posts
July 28 2008 21:04 GMT
#1144
Is there a translation somewhere for the interviews on stage (from both forgg and jaedong) after the games were done and ForGG had won?
Mada Mada Dane
3nickma
Profile Joined November 2007
Denmark1510 Posts
July 28 2008 22:06 GMT
#1145
JAEDONG THREW THOSE GAMES TO HIS TEAMMATE!
L E E J A E D O N G ! <3
EGMachine
Profile Blog Joined February 2006
United States1643 Posts
July 28 2008 22:10 GMT
#1146
TT poor jaedong, hope he dosent pull a savior now
I'm like, the coolest
Avidkeystamper
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
United States8556 Posts
July 29 2008 02:46 GMT
#1147
No way, people thought before that he was slumping, but he pulled back and showed them! Besides, we all knew Jaedong's ZvT was a little suspect compared to his other MUs.
Jaedong
Dazed.
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Canada3301 Posts
July 29 2008 03:44 GMT
#1148
On July 29 2008 07:06 3nickma wrote:
JAEDONG THREW THOSE GAMES TO HIS TEAMMATE!
Are you serious...?
Never say Die! ||| Fight you? No, I want to kill you.
MCMcEmcee
Profile Joined April 2008
United States1609 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-07-29 04:40:04
July 29 2008 04:39 GMT
#1149
On July 29 2008 11:46 xenero wrote:
No way, people thought before that he was slumping, but he pulled back and showed them! Besides, we all knew Jaedong's ZvT was a little suspect compared to his other MUs.


His ZvT was the best in the pro-gaming scene up until this season (and this season? What other Zergs have done as well vT this season?). The only thing suspect is his ZvT on these heavily T-favored maps, and even then he beat Hwasin (though I guess it could be argued that Hwasin lost to Jaedong).
[iHs]MCMcEmcee@UFO | のヮの
bubblegumbo
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Taiwan1296 Posts
July 29 2008 04:55 GMT
#1150
so Terran favored maps = zerg slump ?
"I honestly think that whoever invented toilet paper is a genius. For man to survive, they need toilet paper!"- Nal_rA
Atrioc
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States1865 Posts
July 29 2008 05:51 GMT
#1151
I think that fOrGG is better than Flash at TvZ, HOWEVER the upcoming GOM TV finals will be the real state of the union regarding Jaedong's ZvT, because the maps in this final were fucking ridicolously bad for Zerg. Athena was the only decent one and it didnt even get played.

Jaedong himself said in an interview BEFORE the finals that he thought it looked like it would be an easy win for fOrGG because he had many days where he could win at all on these maps.

Writerman what
bubblegumbo
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Taiwan1296 Posts
July 30 2008 05:17 GMT
#1152
On July 29 2008 02:34 Zed03 wrote:
This might be a stupid question, but, in all 3 games it seemed like Guardians would have been an excellent choice. Plenty of cliffs to hide them on and pick off tanks and marines...

Any reason why Jaedong didn't use them?


ForGG had 2 starports in the first game, he would've been able to counter guardians really fast with wraiths if he needed to. but instead he massed Science vessels really fast, and those irradiates also counters zerg air really well.
"I honestly think that whoever invented toilet paper is a genius. For man to survive, they need toilet paper!"- Nal_rA
Sigrun
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
United States1655 Posts
July 30 2008 05:23 GMT
#1153
On July 29 2008 14:51 Atrioc wrote:
Jaedong himself said in an interview BEFORE the finals that he thought it looked like it would be an easy win for fOrGG because he had many days where he could win at all on these maps.



Is there a link to said interview? And any other interview regarding the finals?
Graphics
Ilikestarcraft
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Korea (South)17734 Posts
July 30 2008 05:24 GMT
#1154
On July 28 2008 08:54 TheFoReveRwaR wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2008 18:58 thedeadhaji wrote:
On July 26 2008 18:57 EvilTeletubby wrote:
I agree haji, July/oov was just... wow...

But anyways, I had high hopes for this series after game 1 then I don't know what happened.


I was talking with QI, and he dropped the line "Seems 3 gas hive is outdated"
I think Forgg has upped the ante for zergs.
Then again he's the only one doing it his way.

Hwasin's doing it his way.

we'll see what zergs figure out agianst the 3rd gas deny / timing before hive style terrans.

They just need to go back to playing the way savior did in his prime. 3 hatch muta + early ups and speedlings--> 3rd gas-- late hive with a huge amount of lurkers --> finish with ultra/defiler. Oh, and fucking amazing flanks + positing

The difference is they need to add a +1 range attack upgrade. The way terran is playing now , as you mentioned, is designed around moving out with the maximum number of the ideal mix of units just before hive arrives. This often involves moving out as soon as 2/1 upgrades finish, or at least 1/1. As I'm sure you know this makes lurkers 33% less effective as they take 3 shots(hitting at once) instead of 2(again hitting at once) to kill a marine.

The final game is a good example of why. If you plan to defend with lurkers in midgame the +1 range seems almost necessary given the level of top terran pros these days. You could see in the footage several situations where 2 lurker shots hit a clump of marines and they all lived. In a game like bw every marine counts It's definitely worth the 175/100 (or 225[50 for the drone]/100 or 100/100[youll need an evo anyway] depending on how you want to look at it)


I thought people stopped playing heavy lurk with late hive because terran timing and macro got so good that they killed zergs before hive so they had to get fast defilers.
ils
"Nana is a goddess. Or at very least, Nana is my goddess." - KazeHydra
Dazed.
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Canada3301 Posts
July 30 2008 05:26 GMT
#1155
the tlpd is still not updated with forgg's win
Never say Die! ||| Fight you? No, I want to kill you.
tKd_
Profile Joined February 2005
United States2916 Posts
July 30 2008 12:20 GMT
#1156
On July 28 2008 13:38 cujo2k wrote:
All of a sudden sAviOr losing 0-2 to Forgg doesn't look so bad does it? lol. I remember so many people flaming sAviOr for losing to forgg..funny how it turned out


YES.YES.YES!. means savior was doing good
Tropics
Profile Joined August 2007
United Kingdom1132 Posts
July 30 2008 12:32 GMT
#1157
Those games savior lost to forgg were absurd though. He had massive leads in both of them and he just let him right back into it.
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