• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 18:32
CEST 00:32
KST 07:32
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S RO8 Preview: herO, Zoun, Bunny, Classic2Code S RO8 Preview: Rogue, GuMiho, Solar, Maru3BGE Stara Zagora 2025: Info & Preview27Code S RO12 Preview: GuMiho, Bunny, SHIN, ByuN3The Memories We Share - Facing the Final(?) GSL47
Community News
BGE Stara Zagora 2025 - Replay Pack2Weekly Cups (June 2-8): herO doubles down1[BSL20] ProLeague: Bracket Stage & Dates9GSL Ro4 and Finals moved to Sunday June 15th13Weekly Cups (May 27-June 1): ByuN goes back-to-back0
StarCraft 2
General
Jim claims he and Firefly were involved in match-fixing The SCII GOAT: A statistical Evaluation Code S RO8 Preview: herO, Zoun, Bunny, Classic DreamHack Dallas 2025 - Official Replay Pack BGE Stara Zagora 2025 - Replay Pack
Tourneys
[GSL 2025] Code S:Season 2 - RO8 - Group A RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series SOOPer7s Showmatches 2025 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond)
Strategy
[G] Darkgrid Layout Simple Questions Simple Answers [G] PvT Cheese: 13 Gate Proxy Robo
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 477 Slow and Steady Mutation # 476 Charnel House Mutation # 475 Hard Target Mutation # 474 Futile Resistance
Brood War
General
BGH auto balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion FlaSh Witnesses SCV Pull Off the Impossible vs Shu StarCraft & BroodWar Campaign Speedrun Quest Will foreigners ever be able to challenge Koreans?
Tourneys
[ASL19] Grand Finals [BSL20] GosuLeague RO16 - Tue & Wed 20:00+CET NA Team League 6/8/2025 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
I am doing this better than progamers do. [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Beyond All Reason Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile What do you want from future RTS games?
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Wizard Hilton Cybertech Crypto Recovery: Proven Re
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine UK Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Vape Nation Thread
Fan Clubs
Maru Fan Club Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Korean Music Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
A Better Routine For Progame…
TrAiDoS
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
I was completely wrong ab…
jameswatts
Need Your Help/Advice
Glider
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 27747 users

[OSL] Ro16 Day 2 - Page 60

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 58 59 60
Xiphos
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Canada7507 Posts
July 31 2010 02:07 GMT
#1181
On July 31 2010 10:58 dtnmang wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 31 2010 10:27 SilverSkyLark wrote:
So Flash turtled to win? What's so new about that?
His kill score was triple that of Zero's.



That just proves that ZerO was throwing away his units to Flash' turtle instead of utilizing those resourced more carefully?
2014 - ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ Raise your bows brood warriors! ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ
Holgerius
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Sweden16951 Posts
July 31 2010 05:04 GMT
#1182
On July 31 2010 10:57 okum wrote:
Any interviews? :C

Ya, me want too. There has been so few Flash interviews recently.

Pretty please? <3
I believe in the almighty Grötslev! -- I am never serious and you should never believe a thing I say. Including the previous sentence.
Samurai-
Profile Joined May 2008
Slovenia2035 Posts
July 31 2010 11:44 GMT
#1183
yeah, interview from this and todays MSL please
One ring, to rule them all!
sung_moon
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States10110 Posts
July 31 2010 13:45 GMT
#1184
sea is just on fucking FIRE
Forever Young
DemiSe
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
883 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-07-31 13:55:20
July 31 2010 13:54 GMT
#1185
+ Show Spoiler +
On July 30 2010 20:59 Tyrio wrote:
[image loading]

Haha, epic picture.
Flash - ZerO game was pretty good. I'd recommend it!
Let's See Who's Stronger, Your Tricks, Or My Skills.
Wings
Profile Joined January 2010
United States999 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-07-31 14:01:06
July 31 2010 13:59 GMT
#1186
this is so stupid. everyone is hating on flash for "imba" or "lame turtling". Well if it was so damn imba/easy, WHY DONT ALL TERRANS WIN THIS WAY ALL THE TIME??? Why the hell does any Zerg (COUGH JD GOLDEN MOUSE COUGH) EVER win, if terran can just play like this???

Zero was playing extremely aggressively, and Flash adopted to it perfectly by turtling. I guess all you whiners saw was just turtling turtling turtling. As a terran, I saw the freaking god of defense against an opponent who was incredibly aggressive and incredibly strong. Virtually NO Terran in the WORLD can do what Flash did there, against such perfect swarms / drops by Zero.

And what's all this BS about Zero "switching to guardians"?? What, really, because the "dark swarm + guardian" combo is just so excellent, isn't it? You waste so many resources going for defilers and lings, then you just somehow automatically switch to guards?? You need TIME. Zero did not have any. He needed to stop Flash from getting 1oclock at ALL costs, and that was literally just a matter of seconds, had he not constantly been bombing Flash's troops. A guardian switch would have eaten up resources/time/supply, none of which Zero had to spare in such a tight match.

A muta switch may have been more viable, but considering how many freaking turrets there were on the map (did someone say 108?) and the fact that irradiate was already researched and vessels were in the air, PLUS the fact that upgrades were OBVIOUSLY not done for air (this argument applies to the guardian switch theory), Zero would have been an idiot to change at that point in the game.

What did Zero do wrong? IMO it wasn't any one decisive mistake, it was a collection of smaller ones. Constantly attacking only one side of the fortress, when his army was mobile and he maybe should have tested other areas, even those with lots of turrets, because often those are the places with the least ground troops; a major drop there with swarms might have been the distraction Zero needed to buy time for 1-oclock.

What else? Lurkers? Flash didn't have that many vessels flying around, and making lurkers just pisses off a terran by constantly forcing him to scan and adding to his multitasking problems. IMO Zero should have tried.

Basically, this game was on a knife's edge, and Flash pulled it through with unbelievable strategy, macro, and positioning. What the hell can you guys ask for?? You blame this guy for playing defensive and turtling as if he's been doing it his entire life, which is obviously untrue, he was the m&m monster last year. Sure, progamers like to entertain, but at a certain time (major individual leagues), they don't give a shiit anymore. For players like JD, Flash... first thing is to WIN.
The probability of Kim Carrier getting all those predictions wrong is similar to the probability Flash loses a TvT. Kim Carrier MUST BE a genius. His only big mistake... STORK.
L0thar
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
987 Posts
July 31 2010 14:38 GMT
#1187
On July 31 2010 22:59 Wings wrote:
this is so stupid. everyone is hating on flash for "imba" or "lame turtling". Well if it was so damn imba/easy, WHY DONT ALL TERRANS WIN THIS WAY ALL THE TIME??? Why the hell does any Zerg (COUGH JD GOLDEN MOUSE COUGH) EVER win, if terran can just play like this???


What can you do, haters gonna hate. I bet they would be hating on him even if he solved world hunger lol.

+ Show Spoiler +
I can even picture it...fucking imba terran, the hunger played much better, keeping his expos in third world countries saturated for so long and attacking at multiple fronts. Flash just turtled in west europe and north america and spammed food!

Eh, maybe I should get more sleep...
hacpee
Profile Joined November 2007
United States752 Posts
July 31 2010 15:21 GMT
#1188
Mech terran is always gay if you don't have the right unit mix.
revy
Profile Joined September 2009
United States1524 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-07-31 15:36:46
July 31 2010 15:34 GMT
#1189
I just watched the Flash Zero game and my god was that amazing.

Nobody should be criticizing Zero this game, I've never seen someone trade almost on even levels with Terran Mech which has reached critical mass. Those pushes by Zero were beautifully executed.

To the people commenting that Zero was too focused on top right, well sure he was, that expo decided the game. If Zero held onto it Flash would have lost, if Flash took it he won for sure. Plus you have to look at it this way, when terran mech is setup with turrets+depots+mines+everything you need to send in a full wave just to get rid of all of the buildings/mines. Had Zero sent a big assault north, cleared out all that stuff then sent a big assault south he would have lost that wave without really hurting Flash's unit count. Plus he would have ceded that 1 o'clock expo MUCH earlier.

I don't know what could have been done to win this for Zero. Had he gone guardians Flash would have switched his unit mix to gols+vessels. His turret forests would have bought him ample time to beat a guard switch. Lurkers weren't the right answer either I don't think, Lurkers get cut up badly by tanks and they aren't melee so you dont get the extra dps from terran splashing himself. Zero couldn't have just sat back on his hands, he needed to push Flash because otherwise mech just slow pushes to victory, anyone remember Flash v Kwanro where Flash just slow pushed/cliffed to victory?

This was a beautiful game, I understand why people rage about it but thats just silly in my mind. Only Flash can play this way, and this illustrates one of Flash's greatest abilities, his many different play styles. He can Turtle (this game) he can be hyper aggressive (his October->January TvZ style // his December -> May TvP style). I do hope Flash has shaken out of his little mini slump but I suppose we will only know when we see him TvT.

Good games.
SubtleArt
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
2710 Posts
July 31 2010 15:44 GMT
#1190
The best Terran to ever play the game beats an above average zerg who's slightly overrated and we're calling mech imbalance. Are you guys fucking serious? Just enjoy the games, if you can't do that without being pissed about imbalance theres no reason to watch now is there.
Morrow on ZvP: "I'm not very confident in general vs Protoss because of the imbalance (Yes its imbalanced, get over it)."
p14c
Profile Joined May 2010
Vatican City State431 Posts
July 31 2010 15:56 GMT
#1191
Zero tried to beat Flash at macro! Bad, bad idea! Jaedong tried the same and look what happened. As a zerg you need to punish that greedy 14cc like Effort did. Anyway I like how Flash wall-in and 14cc-ed only after he scouted the 12th hatchery from Zero.
Game Over, Man! Game Over!
dukethegold
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Canada5645 Posts
July 31 2010 19:40 GMT
#1192
Just watched Jaedong v.s. Sea. That game reminded me of one of July's games when he tried to win against Terran with nothing but muta...and lost in the end.

Like, seriously, Jaedong BARELY pulled off this pure muta build against Mong and now he tried against Sea.
Lebesgue
Profile Joined October 2008
4542 Posts
July 31 2010 20:52 GMT
#1193
On July 31 2010 20:44 Samurai- wrote:
yeah, interview from this and todays MSL please


I second this. Please please please
moopie
Profile Joined July 2009
12605 Posts
July 31 2010 21:00 GMT
#1194
On July 31 2010 14:04 Holgerius wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 31 2010 10:57 okum wrote:
Any interviews? :C

Ya, me want too. There has been so few Flash interviews recently.

Pretty please? <3

Nobody did the last KT PL round 5 interview either. Translators hate on KT.
I'm going to sleep, let me get some of that carpet.
hacpee
Profile Joined November 2007
United States752 Posts
July 31 2010 21:05 GMT
#1195
Zero needed to go plague much quicker. Plague with guardians and hydra is very good vs mech.
Ideas
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
United States8082 Posts
July 31 2010 21:11 GMT
#1196
i really hope flash didnt just make Polaris rhapsody into destination TvZ 2.0 lol
Free Palestine
Elroi
Profile Joined August 2009
Sweden5588 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-07-31 23:11:13
July 31 2010 23:04 GMT
#1197
On July 31 2010 08:51 infinity2k9 wrote:
I don't get why people think Jaedong is 'trying to send a message'. He's just trying to win the game, and he gets ahead of himself its pretty clear.


People think that because if he only had a group of lings with his mutas (he built the grand total of 6 lings in the game) he would have won easily. It can only be some kind of statement to try to win with pure muta.

On another topic. I don't think most people think that mech turtle is easy to pull of (even though it is slightly imba on the right maps. Noone can do it as Flash anyway.) What most people complain about is that it is lame. That is two different things. It's just gay to see a terran never leave his base during a 40 min game, but instead just build the base all the way to the opponent and then wait until he is out of resources.
"To all eSports fans, I want to be remembered as a progamer who can make something out of nothing, and someone who always does his best. I think that is the right way of living, and I'm always doing my best to follow that." - Jaedong. /watch?v=jfghAzJqAp0
dtnmang
Profile Joined April 2010
Vietnam752 Posts
August 01 2010 03:11 GMT
#1198
On August 01 2010 06:00 moopie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 31 2010 14:04 Holgerius wrote:
On July 31 2010 10:57 okum wrote:
Any interviews? :C

Ya, me want too. There has been so few Flash interviews recently.

Pretty please? <3

Nobody did the last KT PL round 5 interview either. Translators hate on KT.
Haters gonna hate
KT Roflster - the lulziest team of Proleague.
Highways
Profile Joined July 2005
Australia6103 Posts
August 01 2010 03:29 GMT
#1199
Terran imba...

Can win from pretty much any position.
#1 Terran hater
Hautamaki
Profile Blog Joined December 2003
Canada1311 Posts
August 01 2010 08:34 GMT
#1200
Eh I thought the Flash game and Flash's strategy was pretty cool to watch actually =p

I think Zero's only mistake was attacking without maxing supply first. He almost broke through Flash's line with the first couple of attacks but ran out of units at the last second. Also he fought the first 1 or 2 major battles without ultras iirc. Of course, it would be easy to say that if he had waited too long for ultras or max supply, Flash's army would have been even bigger or Flash would have attacked sooner and killed him. Which basically goes to show that Flash out-played/out-timed Zero. If Zero were the better player, he'd have had better timing on his macro to make sure that he maxed and finished teching sooner to make sure that he had enough of the right units at the right time to break that push. It's not like it would be theoretically impossible for him to do so considering that Flash had his army spread over the entire diagonal axis of the map and hadn't done any attacks except for minor vulture raids up until that point. Zero had all the time and opportunity in the world to make sure that he'd be ready to attack with 200/200 fully teched when the time came; he just got out-timed and felt as though he was forced to attack at 160 without ultras.
True learning is not the memorization of knowledge; it is the internalization of patterns.
Prev 1 58 59 60
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 1h 29m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
UpATreeSC 162
ForJumy 66
EnDerr 6
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 10764
Calm 2356
Rain 1206
Artosis 433
Mini 425
Soulkey 78
Aegong 35
TY 27
Dota 2
Dendi2204
capcasts100
NeuroSwarm70
PGG 48
Counter-Strike
flusha577
Stewie2K268
Foxcn235
Super Smash Bros
AZ_Axe28
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor170
Other Games
tarik_tv14361
summit1g7869
Grubby3291
shahzam1376
FrodaN1017
mouzStarbuck257
ViBE174
Maynarde48
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream4810
Other Games
BasetradeTV137
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH117
• RyuSc2 48
• davetesta40
• IndyKCrew
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• intothetv
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota21830
League of Legends
• Doublelift4130
• TFBlade1400
Counter-Strike
• Shiphtur302
Other Games
• imaqtpie1074
Upcoming Events
Online Event
1h 29m
Replay Cast
3h 29m
GSL Code S
10h 59m
herO vs Zoun
Classic vs Bunny
The PondCast
11h 29m
Replay Cast
1d 1h
WardiTV Invitational
1d 12h
OSC
1d 14h
Korean StarCraft League
2 days
SOOP
2 days
sOs vs Percival
CranKy Ducklings
2 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
Cheesadelphia
2 days
CSO Cup
2 days
GSL Code S
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Wardi Open
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
Cure vs Percival
ByuN vs Spirit
RSL Revival
6 days
herO vs sOs
Zoun vs Clem
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Season 17: Qualifier 2
BGE Stara Zagora 2025
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
NPSL S3
Rose Open S1
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
2025 GSL S2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025
PGL Bucharest 2025
BLAST Open Spring 2025

Upcoming

Copa Latinoamericana 4
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
SEL Season 2 Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
HSC XXVII
Championship of Russia 2025
Murky Cup #2
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.