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On March 02 2009 00:57 Oystein wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2009 00:26 eXigent. wrote:
Personally, there is something I wanna know, and address.
What is the difference between vsing an opponent at B+ rank that you 100% know you can beat every game, and take 6 easy wins off of him....as opposed to taking 6 freewins off of another account. Would they both not be credited as cheating? If you know 100% you are going to win those 6 games, and you play them is that not the same as taking 6 guaranteed freewins?
it just seems like a really murky situation to be talking about. If you fail to see the difference I am at loss of words...
thats a horrible cop out and you know it. How is what you just said a decent rebuttal at my statement. I was asking a genuine question, and would prefer an actual answer rather than a single sentence trying to free you of response.
Now seriously, tell me what the difference is between taking 6 guaranteed free wins from someone you know you can beat without losing a single game, and taking 6 freewins from another account. The results are the same, a guaranteed 6 wins, which leads to the question...how is 1 much worse than the other? From an ethical point of view.
Yes, 1 is against the iccup rules, but ethically, whats different?
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Stylish: I just wanted to say that your VODs have been a huge help to me, so thanks a lot for making them. I hope you'll make more in the future. Keep up the good work!
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currently recorded some 2port games but 2port really allowes alot of mistakes. i wanna get a game where i play as good as possible vs some good player
ill update when i know more.
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On March 02 2009 02:25 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
currently recorded some 2port games but 2port really allowes alot of mistakes.
You tell me about it T.T
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On March 02 2009 01:41 eXigent. wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2009 00:57 Oystein wrote:On March 02 2009 00:26 eXigent. wrote:
Personally, there is something I wanna know, and address.
What is the difference between vsing an opponent at B+ rank that you 100% know you can beat every game, and take 6 easy wins off of him....as opposed to taking 6 freewins off of another account. Would they both not be credited as cheating? If you know 100% you are going to win those 6 games, and you play them is that not the same as taking 6 guaranteed freewins?
it just seems like a really murky situation to be talking about. If you fail to see the difference I am at loss of words... thats a horrible cop out and you know it. How is what you just said a decent rebuttal at my statement. I was asking a genuine question, and would prefer an actual answer rather than a single sentence trying to free you of response. Now seriously, tell me what the difference is between taking 6 guaranteed free wins from someone you know you can beat without losing a single game, and taking 6 freewins from another account. The results are the same, a guaranteed 6 wins, which leads to the question...how is 1 much worse than the other? From an ethical point of view. Yes, 1 is against the iccup rules, but ethically, whats different?
I can't believe you are serious?
Are you just trolling this thread?
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On March 02 2009 01:41 eXigent. wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2009 00:57 Oystein wrote:On March 02 2009 00:26 eXigent. wrote:
Personally, there is something I wanna know, and address.
What is the difference between vsing an opponent at B+ rank that you 100% know you can beat every game, and take 6 easy wins off of him....as opposed to taking 6 freewins off of another account. Would they both not be credited as cheating? If you know 100% you are going to win those 6 games, and you play them is that not the same as taking 6 guaranteed freewins?
it just seems like a really murky situation to be talking about. If you fail to see the difference I am at loss of words... thats a horrible cop out and you know it. How is what you just said a decent rebuttal at my statement. I was asking a genuine question, and would prefer an actual answer rather than a single sentence trying to free you of response. Now seriously, tell me what the difference is between taking 6 guaranteed free wins from someone you know you can beat without losing a single game, and taking 6 freewins from another account. The results are the same, a guaranteed 6 wins, which leads to the question...how is 1 much worse than the other? From an ethical point of view. Yes, 1 is against the iccup rules, but ethically, whats different?
The thing is, when someone reaches B+, they're good. The chances of finding a B+ player that you can beat 6 times in a row is very hard unless they aren't actually B+. And if they aren't actually B+, they wouldn't be playing pub would they now.
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Haha I wish I were B+. You know, I just don't understand what the big deal is. Is the difference between B+ and A- really that big? Seriously! I never heard Stylish say anything to show off his rank before this "scandal". Never in his VODs did he say anything like, or even along the lines of: "Hey, I'm A- so you should listen to what I have to say" or "I'm so gosu, look at my iccup rank - did you notice it's A-?" To begin with, why do people feel the need to constantly check his iccup rank? Aren't his VODs enough? Do you feel the need to check his rank in order to justify his skill?
This whole controversy occurred precisely because the community puts way too much importance on iccup rank. If it weren't for people constantly checking other people's ranks to justify skill, there would be no inclination to achieve a high rank solely for flaunting purposes. Sure, it wasn't honest of Stylish to abuse to an ultimately worthless rank, but we must also acknowledge that our overall attitude and perception of rank perpetuates and engenders these types of controversies.
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On March 02 2009 01:41 eXigent. wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2009 00:57 Oystein wrote:On March 02 2009 00:26 eXigent. wrote:
Personally, there is something I wanna know, and address.
What is the difference between vsing an opponent at B+ rank that you 100% know you can beat every game, and take 6 easy wins off of him....as opposed to taking 6 freewins off of another account. Would they both not be credited as cheating? If you know 100% you are going to win those 6 games, and you play them is that not the same as taking 6 guaranteed freewins?
it just seems like a really murky situation to be talking about. If you fail to see the difference I am at loss of words... thats a horrible cop out and you know it. How is what you just said a decent rebuttal at my statement. I was asking a genuine question, and would prefer an actual answer rather than a single sentence trying to free you of response. Now seriously, tell me what the difference is between taking 6 guaranteed free wins from someone you know you can beat without losing a single game, and taking 6 freewins from another account. The results are the same, a guaranteed 6 wins, which leads to the question...how is 1 much worse than the other? From an ethical point of view. Yes, 1 is against the iccup rules, but ethically, whats different?
Because theres still a chance you will lose
You might make a mistake, build order luck ,etc
On March 01 2009 22:15 dhe95 wrote:
It doesn't matter because A- or B+, he's still better than most of us here.
So is dino and ls -_-
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except...they maphacked and map rigged...dude learn the difference things arent black and white. Maphacking and map rigging directly affect the chances for your opponent to beat you, every single time for every individual opponent. He still played every other game fair and square, and wasnt cheating anyone out of points by rigging his matches against them.
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On March 02 2009 01:41 eXigent. wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2009 00:57 Oystein wrote:On March 02 2009 00:26 eXigent. wrote:
Personally, there is something I wanna know, and address.
What is the difference between vsing an opponent at B+ rank that you 100% know you can beat every game, and take 6 easy wins off of him....as opposed to taking 6 freewins off of another account. Would they both not be credited as cheating? If you know 100% you are going to win those 6 games, and you play them is that not the same as taking 6 guaranteed freewins?
it just seems like a really murky situation to be talking about. If you fail to see the difference I am at loss of words... thats a horrible cop out and you know it. How is what you just said a decent rebuttal at my statement. I was asking a genuine question, and would prefer an actual answer rather than a single sentence trying to free you of response. Now seriously, tell me what the difference is between taking 6 guaranteed free wins from someone you know you can beat without losing a single game, and taking 6 freewins from another account. The results are the same, a guaranteed 6 wins, which leads to the question...how is 1 much worse than the other? From an ethical point of view. Yes, 1 is against the iccup rules, but ethically, whats different?
Are you retarded.... ?
You virtually said being better than someone is cheating.........
But il explain it for you since you obviously lack some serious understanding.
1. There are no games of starcraft you are 100% sure to win, and if the difference in skill is so large between the 2 players, like a Progamer vs a D player (that its close to 100%), it won`t matter who you play at that rank because you will win 95%++ of your games anyway, and whatever games you play at that given rank is just something you have to do to get to your real rank level so regardless of who you play you will almost certainly win.
2. At the level you suggested B+ everyone can can take games from even Flash, Jaedong or Bisu. Sure it won`t happen often, but freak occurrences WILL happen if they play enough games.
3. Whoever you are so much better than that you actually will have close to a 100% chance of winning vs (tho this will virtually never happen at the rank you suggested) should use the opportunity to learn more than he would if he played people of similar skill. And to play someone more than 1game both players have to accept to play a regame, so the losing part goes willingly into it even tho he knows he will most likely lose (atleast after a few games)
The main point is, as long as you play a game vs someone you CAN lose, even if its not likely... Whereas if you get freewins you CAN`T lose....
And if you play at a level where you can be such a huge favorite over someone (over the D level, since the worst people won`t get above that) it doesn't really matter who you play vs at that level since you will most likely destroy them anyway.
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I have a couple of friends on B+ that I usually win against, I could have asked them to play me 3 games each and I'd be A-(however i didn't coz thats pretty low since it will affect their effort to achieve their rank, when i play them i create melee not one on one), then everything would have been fine and none would have reacted like this, the whole thing is so silly. Imo you're being way too overdramatic about it. I obviously dont have the same serious oppinion on these matters as some of you.
However I have not personally offended or hurt anyone, so please dont personally offend me. I might not get respect among some people for doing something completely harmless that took me 1 hour but it saddens me that it somehow outweights all the work I've put into doing my vods. Uploading, compiling, commentating, making BO's playing alot of games until i get a good one, writing builds uploading reps etc, it takes me countless of hours and then I do one thing and I've already stated my intentions wether you believe it or not and suddenly im this unrespectable person. It makes me sad really.
There is a new update going on as we speak.
Im currently uploading TvZ 2Port Bo-VOD and TvZ 8Rax Mech Bo-VOD. Reason why i made buildordervods first is that then I dont have to explain everything in the in-game-VODs that will come soon, and also that iccup is down so I havent been able to record any more games so i thought it would be a good time to play some singleplayer. They will be up in aprox 30 minutes. Enjoy.
- TvZ 8Rax Mech Bo-VOD is uploaded
- TvZ 2Port Wraith Bo-VOD is uploaded
Enjoy!
/Stylish
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On March 03 2009 02:44 AnOth3rDAy wrote:I have a couple of friends on B+ that I usually win against, I could have asked them to play me 3 games each and I'd be A-(however i didn't coz thats pretty low since it will affect their effort to achieve their rank, when i play them i create melee not one on one), then everything would have been fine and none would have reacted like this, the whole thing is so silly. Imo you're being way too overdramatic about it. I obviously dont have the same serious oppinion on these matters than some of you. However I have not personally offended or hurt anyone, so please dont personally offend me. I might not get respect among some people for doing something completely harmless that took me 1 hour but it saddens me that it somehow outweights all the work I've put into doing my vods. Uploading, compiling, commentating, making BO's playing alot of games until i get a good one, writing builds uploading reps etc, it takes me countless of hours and then I do one thing and I've already stated my intentions wether you believe it or not and suddenly im this unrespectable person. It makes me sad really. There is a new update going on as we speak. Im currently uploading TvZ 2Port Bo-VOD and TvZ 8Rax Mech Bo-VOD. Reason why i made buildordervods first is that then I dont have to explain everything in the in-game-VODs that will come soon, and also that iccup is down so I havent been able to record any more games so i thought it would be a good time to play some singleplayer. They will be up in aprox 30 minutes. Enjoy. - TvZ 8Rax Mech Bo-VOD is uploaded
i will update the op when ive eaten dinner, you can find the first VOD here: TvZ 8Rax Mech Bothe second one is uploading but its taking like 30 minutes. /Stylish
Cheers! skål och mutta!
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Lol i just listened to the 8rax mech vod. I have no idea what happens at 0:21 it sounds really funny though^^
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quistion about this 8rax into mech bo:you have to keep making vulture if zerg going for hydra?and mine up everywhere and take an expansion,right?If the zerg goin muta you stop making vult and start making goliaths then take an expansion and add factories afeter your natural expo is finished?Also quistion can you make your rax in middle of the map?i *think**** you can use similar bo for tvt?i believe i saw it once you can go vult rush with mines and you can counter wraith with goliaths?correct me if im wrong.
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On March 03 2009 01:36 Oystein wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2009 01:41 eXigent. wrote:On March 02 2009 00:57 Oystein wrote:On March 02 2009 00:26 eXigent. wrote:
Personally, there is something I wanna know, and address.
What is the difference between vsing an opponent at B+ rank that you 100% know you can beat every game, and take 6 easy wins off of him....as opposed to taking 6 freewins off of another account. Would they both not be credited as cheating? If you know 100% you are going to win those 6 games, and you play them is that not the same as taking 6 guaranteed freewins?
it just seems like a really murky situation to be talking about. If you fail to see the difference I am at loss of words... thats a horrible cop out and you know it. How is what you just said a decent rebuttal at my statement. I was asking a genuine question, and would prefer an actual answer rather than a single sentence trying to free you of response. Now seriously, tell me what the difference is between taking 6 guaranteed free wins from someone you know you can beat without losing a single game, and taking 6 freewins from another account. The results are the same, a guaranteed 6 wins, which leads to the question...how is 1 much worse than the other? From an ethical point of view. Yes, 1 is against the iccup rules, but ethically, whats different? Are you retarded.... ? You virtually said being better than someone is cheating......... But il explain it for you since you obviously lack some serious understanding. 1. There are no games of starcraft you are 100% sure to win, and if the difference in skill is so large between the 2 players, like a Progamer vs a D player (that its close to 100%), it won`t matter who you play at that rank because you will win 95%++ of your games anyway, and whatever games you play at that given rank is just something you have to do to get to your real rank level so regardless of who you play you will almost certainly win. 2. At the level you suggested B+ everyone can can take games from even Flash, Jaedong or Bisu. Sure it won`t happen often, but freak occurrences WILL happen if they play enough games. 3. Whoever you are so much better than that you actually will have close to a 100% chance of winning vs (tho this will virtually never happen at the rank you suggested) should use the opportunity to learn more than he would if he played people of similar skill. And to play someone more than 1game both players have to accept to play a regame, so the losing part goes willingly into it even tho he knows he will most likely lose (atleast after a few games) The main point is, as long as you play a game vs someone you CAN lose, even if its not likely... Whereas if you get freewins you CAN`T lose.... And if you play at a level where you can be such a huge favorite over someone (over the D level, since the worst people won`t get above that) it doesn't really matter who you play vs at that level since you will most likely destroy them anyway.
Personally I think you are wrong about alot of what you said there. There are cases where 1 player will win 100% against another player, even at the B ranks. You are sort of blindly assuming that everyone at that level is similar. However, you see TONS of matchlists where people 6-0 someone or 7-0 someone at that rank. That only goes to strengthen my point. You are basically throwing out information that is somewhat wrong.
Flash wont lose to B+ random players. What I mean is, im not talking about the random B+ player with 70-20 stats who *MIGHT* be able to take 1 game off of someone like flash. I am talking about the 600-600 B+ player that both you and me know WILL NOT EVER take a game off of someone like flash. This same concept is applied to anyone for that matter.
For example, stylish knows 100% that he can take freewins from player A. Both are similar rank, yet he knows for certain that by not playing some 70-20 korean, but instead playing Player A he knows he will win his games and get to A-.
How is that ETHICALLY (lets remember this word, as this is what im asking....not if its against iccup rules) different from taking 6 freewins? How is dodging the players you know will beat you, and playing the players you know for sure 100% that you will beat any different?
BOTH ARE DOING THE SAME THING. In each case, you are abusing the fact that you will not lose these games, and are artificially inflating your record. WHICH IS JUST THE SAME AS DOING IT WITH A FRIEND.
Your arguement is that no one can win 100% against another opponent, so it leaves probable room for losing. That arguement is flawed depending on who you are speaking of as an opponent. Flash will never lose to a low tier B rank player who struggles to maintain his rating. Especially if its only 5-6 games played. Your "freak" occurances are soo rare and slim that I bet you would need to play games in the hundreds just to see it happen. Thats like basically saying that you, oystien, in a b07 "could" take a game from Flash. I call that bullshit. I don't care if you think it's possible...it's just NOT going to happen. Using that idea, im sure stylish could pick out a bunch of players at the B ranking, and know in his mind they are guaranteed wins. That makes your argument flawed.
FYI as a side note. I was asking a genuine question, and twice you have insulted me personally. If all you plan on doing is throwing insults towards me, then just refrain from posting please, as really that's not getting either of us anywhere.
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On March 03 2009 03:41 ZzZzAnG wrote:
quistion about this 8rax into mech bo:you have to keep making vulture if zerg going for hydra?and mine up everywhere and take an expansion,right?If the zerg goin muta you stop making vult and start making goliaths then take an expansion and add factories afeter your natural expo is finished?Also quistion can you make your rax in middle of the map?i *think**** you can use similar bo for tvt?i believe i saw it once you can go vult rush with mines and you can counter wraith with goliaths?correct me if im wrong.
Keep making vults if they go hydra and lay mines all over the path between your bases but also get tanks with siege asap, after that you want to be pumping tank/gol in case he transitions to mutas so always be sure to upgrade goliath range. If they're going fast muta then you want to get gols out with range asap, make ebay as well for a few turrets and float your rax and ebay over a couple of them so they can't be targetted and you can get vision over any cliff.
You can make your rax in the middle of the map but I wouldn't recommend it because if the Z goes 9 pool speedlings then you're going to have a hell of a time getting marines back to your base in time to defend.
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Zzzang, jello biafra pretty much covered your questions. However when facing mutalisks you should still produce alot of vultures. He will almost never do 3hatch muta after the rush and the followup so what we're talking about here is 2hatch muta. remember he will only get max 6 mutalisks out. 1 turret and 2 goliaths with range is enough to defend if you use some scvs for repair. So you will need 1 turret at your factories and 1-2 turrets at your mineral line + 2 or max 4 goliaths at the time his first mutalisks arrive at your base. Once they are in your base harassing you ofcourse u shall only make goliaths. At the same time as his muta pops, sneak more vults in his main, force him to be defensive. If you already have vultures inside his main before he makes his mutalisks, snipe the larvas. This will hurt him alot, if his spire finnishes and he can only make 3 muta it is gg.
If he makes hydras keep making vultures, but stop production once you feel that he cannot break the mines in time and make a CC. After that keep making some vultures and then add another 2 factories. Thats when you should switch to tanks and goliaths. Now if you dont have anymore vults roamin in his base make sure to add an academy pretty early aswell to find out if he's switching to mutalisks. If your rax is still alive outside his base, float it to his main when you have placed 3rd and 4th factory.
Hope this answers your questions. Alot more will be explained in the in-game vods. They will probably be much longer aswell.
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wow thnx alot!i also like the new feature you will add to this! :D
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On March 03 2009 03:47 eXigent. wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2009 01:36 Oystein wrote:On March 02 2009 01:41 eXigent. wrote:On March 02 2009 00:57 Oystein wrote:On March 02 2009 00:26 eXigent. wrote:
Personally, there is something I wanna know, and address.
What is the difference between vsing an opponent at B+ rank that you 100% know you can beat every game, and take 6 easy wins off of him....as opposed to taking 6 freewins off of another account. Would they both not be credited as cheating? If you know 100% you are going to win those 6 games, and you play them is that not the same as taking 6 guaranteed freewins?
it just seems like a really murky situation to be talking about. If you fail to see the difference I am at loss of words... thats a horrible cop out and you know it. How is what you just said a decent rebuttal at my statement. I was asking a genuine question, and would prefer an actual answer rather than a single sentence trying to free you of response. Now seriously, tell me what the difference is between taking 6 guaranteed free wins from someone you know you can beat without losing a single game, and taking 6 freewins from another account. The results are the same, a guaranteed 6 wins, which leads to the question...how is 1 much worse than the other? From an ethical point of view. Yes, 1 is against the iccup rules, but ethically, whats different? Are you retarded.... ? You virtually said being better than someone is cheating......... But il explain it for you since you obviously lack some serious understanding. 1. There are no games of starcraft you are 100% sure to win, and if the difference in skill is so large between the 2 players, like a Progamer vs a D player (that its close to 100%), it won`t matter who you play at that rank because you will win 95%++ of your games anyway, and whatever games you play at that given rank is just something you have to do to get to your real rank level so regardless of who you play you will almost certainly win. 2. At the level you suggested B+ everyone can can take games from even Flash, Jaedong or Bisu. Sure it won`t happen often, but freak occurrences WILL happen if they play enough games. 3. Whoever you are so much better than that you actually will have close to a 100% chance of winning vs (tho this will virtually never happen at the rank you suggested) should use the opportunity to learn more than he would if he played people of similar skill. And to play someone more than 1game both players have to accept to play a regame, so the losing part goes willingly into it even tho he knows he will most likely lose (atleast after a few games) The main point is, as long as you play a game vs someone you CAN lose, even if its not likely... Whereas if you get freewins you CAN`T lose.... And if you play at a level where you can be such a huge favorite over someone (over the D level, since the worst people won`t get above that) it doesn't really matter who you play vs at that level since you will most likely destroy them anyway. Personally I think you are wrong about alot of what you said there. There are cases where 1 player will win 100% against another player, even at the B ranks. You are sort of blindly assuming that everyone at that level is similar. However, you see TONS of matchlists where people 6-0 someone or 7-0 someone at that rank. That only goes to strengthen my point. You are basically throwing out information that is somewhat wrong. Flash wont lose to B+ random players. What I mean is, im not talking about the random B+ player with 70-20 stats who *MIGHT* be able to take 1 game off of someone like flash. I am talking about the 600-600 B+ player that both you and me know WILL NOT EVER take a game off of someone like flash. This same concept is applied to anyone for that matter. For example, stylish knows 100% that he can take freewins from player A. Both are similar rank, yet he knows for certain that by not playing some 70-20 korean, but instead playing player A that he will win his games and get to A-. How is that ETHICALLY (lets remember this word, as this is what im asking....not if its against iccup rules) different from taking 6 freewins? How is dodging the players you know will beat you, and playing the players you know for sure 100% that you will beat any different? BOTH ARE DOING THE SAME THING. In each case, you are abusing the fact that you will not lose these games, and are artificially inflating your record. WHICH IS JUST THE SAME AS DOING IT WITH A FRIEND. Your arguement is that no one can win 100% against another opponent, so it leaves probable room for losing. That arguement is flawed depending on who you are speaking of as an opponent. Flash will never lose to a low tier B rank player who struggles to maintain his rating. Especially if its only 5-6 games played. Your "freak" occurances are soo rare and slim that I bet you would need to play games in the hundreds just to see it happen. Thats like basically saying that you, oystien, in a b07 "could" take a game from Flash. I call that bullshit. I don't care if you think it's possible...it's just NOT going to happen. Using that idea, im sure stylish could pick out a bunch of players at the B ranking, and know in his mind they are guaranteed wins. That makes your argument flawed. FYI as a side note. I was asking a genuine question, and twice you have insulted me personally. If all you plan on doing is throwing insults towards me, then just refrain from posting please, as really that's not getting either of us anywhere.
Why are you using such ridiculous absolutes???
So if I had lost 0-7 in stead of 1-6 vs horror and ace like I did this season, would you call it abuse?
You say my arguments are flawed but people will win 6-7 games in a row even without someone being 100% chance of winning... People can have bad days, unlucky BO`s, get frustrated and play bad after the first few losses. There is a million different things that can make someone win 6-7 games vs someone without them being able to sustain anywhere close to a 100% winrate vs them longrun. If say Flash beat me 7-0 at the B rank, what difference would it be if he had 7-0 7 different people he would stomp just as easily as me? If you are able to win 100% vs someone as you suggested (that won`t ever happen, unless you are playing way below your real level) you will be able to beat pretty much most people at that rank easily, because you DO NOT BELONG at that rank hence your argument is useless.
Do you really think Stylish will win 100 of 100 games vs anyone at B+? Then all I can say is lol...
You are under the insane assumption that you can win 100% vs someone and lose 100% vs someone at the same rank. Every game you play you CAN lose, when you are abusing you CAN`T I don`t understand how you fail to realize this.........
If its ethically correct to play lots of games vs someone you are better than? That sort of depends, like I said if its at low ranks (compared to your real rank) where you will win regardless NO it don`t matter. Example, Flash raping the shit out of some poor B+ foreigner because he will plow through B+ regardless. If its a way to get up to a higher rank than your real skill level is by doing this all the time I still don`t think its a crime to do (but its borderline unethical), if you feel the need to do this to boost your ego that is up to you, but you better be prepared to get slammed with it if you ever mentioned your ICcup rank as a reference to your skill. Not to mention the amount of time you will spend cherry picking your opponents is punishment enough for anyone who wants to "abuse" in that way + your wasting your time playing vs people you are superior to.
Had Stylish beaten 2 weaker player in 7 consecutive games it would not have been abuse because he CAN lose those games (and its a fair chance he will lose 1 or more of them even tho you are under the insane assumption that he would win EVERY game vs lots of B+ players) but people would still have questions about his real skill, and rightfully so, if they had looked over his gamelist. Because it would not show how he does vs good B+ and A- players, only that hes able to get up in rank to boost his ego via bashing worse players. + You seem to forget that people actually regame these people when they are losing, most of the time they are sure they have a chance to win the game, or they use the chance as a great learning experience playing vs someone way better and its sort of impolite to refuse regames vs someone you have played more than 1 game unless you have a reason. In the end people are able to play the ladder the way they want to (within the rules), if they want to waste time bashing worse players just to boost their ego that is up to them, but they will face the consequences if they ever go bragging about it.
Being better than someone is not a crime, cheating is.
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thank you, always wondered how you follow up 2port wraith
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EPT
