• Log InLog In
• Register

Fighting spirit sim city [3,6,9,12]

Post a Reply

B-royal Belgium1330 Posts August 29 2016 02:09 GMT #1 Proposed sim cities for 2nd naturals (close-by 3rds) on Fighting Spirit Introduction       I've experimented with some building placements lately primarily to help deal with strong (early) zealot attacks. I think we all are familiar with great sim cities for naturals (and thirds) but since there's a certain trend (especially in professional BW) to get close-by thirds, I think we should take a more detailed look at effective building placements for these positions. I've watched a lot of games of Hero, Zero and Effort but I don't really see them abusing great sim cities at these locations. I think they prefer simple lay-outs that restrict their own units from moving as little as possible. 12 o'clock 3 o'clock 6 o'clock 9 o'clock For 12 o'clock: Picture 1: Showcasing a proposed sim city at the 12 o'clock location to help deal with strong zealot attacks. This sim city requires both an evolution chamber and a hydralisk den to be effective (1). I understand you generally don't want a second evolution chamber this soon but it isn't that expensive, if you're really alert you can even place it only when it is required (analogous to placing an evolution chamber in front of a sunken line against early marine attacks). You probably have noticed that there's a third hatchery in this sim city. This hatchery allows you to get a full wall-off at this base if combined with a sunken behind the extractor (explained in the next paragraph). The third hatchery connects to the cliff preventing zealots from going underneath it. There's only a passage in between both hatcheries now, which can be blocked off by morphing an egg (2). Picture 2: By placing a third hatchery, you create a narrow pathway that can be obstructed by morphing a larva into an egg. Zealots have a second way they can enter this base. One pathway is beneath the hatchery next to the ramp as mentioned before. The other is to the right of the evolution chamber and extractor. This latter pathway can be obstructed by placing a sunken behind the extractor (3). However, the creep from any of your hatcheries does not reach this far. So you'll have to build an additional sunken close to the extractor for this to work. Picture 3: Zealots can pass through a second pathway to the right of the evolution chamber and extractor. This can be obstructed by placing a sunken behind the extractor. NOTE: This isn't the same base lay-out as the first picture. So as explained in the text you will need an additional sunken to extend the creep. However, don't build a sunken in the position that's pictured here, this will cause a mining-gas bug. Instead I propose to build a sunken below the rightmost mineral patch as this will interfere with gas mining the least. The lay-out pictured here will be explained next! Picture 4: Alternative lay-out. Hatchery is placed one hex to the bottom making it touch the cliff, and the hydralisk den one hex to the left. This lay-out looks almost identical but it functions differently. The hatchery is instead placed one hex to the bottom, which means there's no passage underneath it. However, zealots can now pass through the gap between the hatchery and the hydralisk den (4). This one can not be blocked off with an egg! In this case you can build a sunken directly next to the evolution chamber, there should not be a risk of a gas-mining issue now. For 3 o'clock: Picture 5: Simple lay-out using a single evolution chamber and hatchery to create a single narrow pathway below the evolution chamber. By placing the hatchery one hex to the right of the cliff you can place an evolution chamber in such a manner that there's a single narrow passage. Zealots and hydralisks can still pass. Additionally you can place a hydralisk den to the right of the evolution chamber (not pictured). In this case there is a gap between the hydralisk den and evolution chamber, which can easily be blocked off by a single hydralisk. The benefit of this is he won't be able to use psionic storm as easily from the low ground to force you to retreat. Finally, you can again extend the wall by placing a sunken between the bottom-most mineral patch and the extractor [Walling off intensifies] (6). Picture 6: Extended wall. Note that the hydralisk den and evolution chamber in this case are switched, which provides a full wall-off for both zealots and unfortunately also hydralisks. The above lay-out can be adjusted slightly to create one obstructable opening to the left of the hatchery (7). This allows both zealots and hydralisks to pass. You can do this by placing the hatchery one more hex to the top and right and then adjoining the hydralisk den and next the evolution chamber. Picture 7: Adjusted lay-out to allow for one opening to the left of the hatchery but with a "full" wall-off otherwise. You can again morph an egg to block off this one passageway. For 6 o'clock: Picture 8: Simple lay-out to create a single pathway that can be blocked by morphing an egg. You can achieve a good sim city by placing your hatchery one hex below the ramp, and with its left side touching the cliff. The evolution chamber then fits right between the hatchery and the top cliff. There's only a single passage for hydralisks and zealots that can be blocked off by morphing an egg (8). Picture 9: Different lay-out using only hydralisk den and evolution chamber. In this case zealots and hydralisks can pass. Picture 10: Different lay-out using only hydralisk den and evolution chamber. In this case there's a full wall-off for both zealots and hydralisks. Picture 11: Different lay-out using hatchery and hydralisk den. This allows only hydralisks to pass! Also no risk of eggs blocking passage, which is the case if you reverse the building placement. For 9 o'clock: Picture 12: Showcasing a proposed sim city at the 9 o'clock location to help deal with strong zealot attacks. By building your hatchery and evolution chamber in this manner, zealots only have a single entrance into your base, which is in between both buildings (12-13). Surprisingly, zealots are unable to go through the passageway above the extractor. Since there's only one entrance for zealots, it is very easy to block it off with either units or in this case a morphing egg (14). This type of sim city is very strong against early zealot attacks and zealot heavy mid games. Picture 13: Only one passage for zealots. The pictured sunken can only be attacked by 1 zealot from the outside and helps deal with the occasional gas-mining bug. Picture 14: By using the larva trick (select a larva and another unit and press stop), you can block off the entrance by morphing it into a unit. Alternatively, you can put down a hydralisk den in place of an evolution chamber (15). This means that only hydralisks will be able to pass through. Zealots are completely blocked. In my opinion this is the superior option but I can imagine two situations where you may want to have an evolution chamber instead: You started the game with 3 hatch hydralisk pressure and have already built a hydralisk den in your main. You don't want your hydralisk den to get sniped. Picture 15: Placing down a hydralisk den instead of an evolution chamber allows passage only to hydralisks. Downsides to both sim cities include having buildings close to the edges, meaning dragoons (with range) can attack them and gas-mining workers occasionally bugging out (can be rectified by building a sunken in the pictured location) (13). This opening is also too small for lurkers to pass. Finally, if you want to use this building placement, I advise you to only do so in case of [7,1] or [7,11] spawns. Otherwise there's a high chance the zealot heavy attack can attack this position from below after your opponent decides not to attack your natural. This could have bad consequences by limiting mobility of your own units instead of your opponent's, like being trapped in a cage with a rabid dog. Sorry for some continuity problems, I started with the final part first.

biryusky 70 Posts August 29 2016 16:56 GMT #2 Holy shit, this is gold. Thank you

kogeT Poland2023 Posts August 31 2016 14:48 GMT #3 All fine, but if you use both evolution chamber and hydralisk den for building a wall you're leaving your natural expansion exposed and will get killed by mass zealots. Also it's a little bit annoying to make a "full wall" as you'll have problems using that path with hydra/ling (and lurkers won't be able to go through it)

B-royal Belgium1330 Posts August 31 2016 15:37 GMT #4 What do you mean? I actually mention that you'll just have to invest in a second evolution chamber as necessary. The only position that requires this is the 12 o'clock position and luckily in this case an evolution chamber will block perfectly at your natural location (to the right and bottom of both hatcheries). I never advocated for a full wall. It's more a thing that could be useful in emergency situations, which is why I decided to include them. Lings will never have an issue with leaving the bases, even if there's a full wall-off. Hydralisks will have issues if you use a full wall-off and can have issues if you use the variants with egg-blocking, but it's no certainty since you'll often have to use the larva trick to get them in a blocking position. The most obvious downsides to any of these building placements are: - if it blocks zealots, it blocks drones. You'll have to take care of managing drones a bit more if you decide to take your 4th in extension of the third (for example 9 o'clock => 11 o'clock). - Ultralisks, defilers and lurkers can't leave these bases. If this bothers you in the endgame, you can always destroy an evolution chamber (if it isn't researching anything) or the hydralisk den to open up space again. They're really inexpensive anyway. - Dragoons will be able to camp from below the cliff. But that's the case with naturals too unless you manage to get in a defensive position behind the bridges (sunkens + lurkers). Besides, now dragoons actually have a significant chance to miss on each attack. - ... Something that I forgot to discuss but would still be interesting to is the reason why so many zergs choose close-by thirds in the first place. I have the impression that it is used: - against 1 gate openings and cross-position games. - with the intent of being very aggressive in mid game with hydralisks (oftencombined with drop and lurkers) - to be more safe against the zealot/corsair heavy mid games of protoss.

trutaCz Poland686 Posts September 01 2016 04:10 GMT #5 You need to remember that 3,6,9,12 have two entrances so if a protoss really wants to attack he will find a way. The other thing is that as a zerg versus protoss you take 3,6,9,12 as your 3rd because u want to be more agressive than passive and also 1gate is very popular now so closer 3rd is better option. Also if u dont want to play passive and be more active at the map you dont want these very tight walls because your hydralisks will move slower. Tight wall is very tricky and can cause awful situations as the game goes on and for emergency situations you can still use drone stack against zealots In general i believe there are more disadvantages than advantages of very tight walls, but they are still a good option in SOME scenarios.

LUCKY_NOOB Bulgaria1339 Posts September 01 2016 13:30 GMT #6 I love pictures!

Please log in or register to reply.