|
United States10774 Posts
On January 24 2005 12:42 SchOOl_VicTIm wrote:Copied from the blizzard site: "Dark Swarm
Cost: 100
Range: 9
Dark Swarm appears on the battlefield as an orange smoke cloud. The cloud encompasses a 6x6 matrix area. Units within the cloud take no damage from ranged attacks. Only units with melee, splash, or special weaponry are able to affect a unit underneath a Dark Swarm. Note that the Swarm will only protect units, and any buildings in the cloud are still vulnerable to attack by ranged weapons.
Since all airborne units possess ranged attacks, Dark Swarm is a particularly effective tool against an attack from the air when you place Hydralisks under the cloud. When used as part of an attack or defense on the ground, care must be taken to prevent enemy units from also using the Dark Swarm as protection. The Dark Swarm can also protect enemy units from the ranged attacks of your own Hydralisks, Mutalisks, and Guardians. Position your own ground forces to block the path of the enemy troops into your protective cloud.
The following units are able to damage units underneath a Dark Swarm with their normal attacks:
Protoss: Probes, Reavers, Dark Templar, Zealots, Archons
Terrans: SCVs, Firebats, Siege Tanks in Siege Mode
Zerg: Drones, Zerglings, Lurkers, Ultralisk, Broodlings, Infested Terrans
Many special abilities are also completely unaffected by the presence of a Dark Swarm including: Yamato Cannons, Spider Mines, Irradiate, EMP Shockwave, Psionic Storm, Maelstrom, Feedback, Plague, Ensnare, and Spawn Broodling. "So, this says that Tanks in Siege Mode are supposed to be able to harm units underneath the swarm. But wtf??  I would swear that from my experience from replays and my games, tanks shooting lurkers that are underneath the swarm make no damage to them... am I being so wrong or something??
Splash Damage, so if there is only one lurker it wouldnt get harmed
|
cyric, if u target one burrowed lurker under swarm with a sieged tank => 0 damage
one non burrowed hydra under swarm => 25 or so damage
the splash that does affect a burrowed unit is of a much smaller scale(i believe the animation has to actually hit the burrowed unit, and then it does 100% of its damage, while non burrowed units are affected from the 50% and 25% splash range too)
under a swarm the tank hit simply misses, if it hits a zergling on the head while missing the lurker actually being targeted it will deal 100% of its damage, meaning the direct hit from a siege blast does its ordinary damage on swarmed units the animation hits
actually i think all of the tank's siege damage is considered splash, might be wrong tho
|
dont workers not work under swarm?
i thought they were considered to be ranged damage.
maybe scv?
|
ya all workers dont work under swarm
|
lol i think its about the 10th thread on this matter isnt it 
|
blizzard should fix the 40 dmg when lurker die 
that realy not fair for terran user
|
On January 24 2005 14:52 maleorderbride wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2005 12:45 Slaughter)BiO wrote:
The Splash dmg from the Seige tank shots is what hits them however a burrowed unit will take no splash dmg. I think thats right anyway ;x Did we not JUST spend about 2 weeks on this subject 2 months ago? OBVIOUSLY burrowed units can take splash damage regardless of swarm. (think archon+lot standing on top of a lurker with no detection) However, the radius is small from tanks and has to be on a unit practically standing ONTOP of the burrowed lurk. I think everyone knows the rest... If anyone wants 10 pages of crap then just search for this exact topic.
What happens if you try to kill a burrowed lurk with the archon+lot move under a dark swarm?
|
On January 24 2005 16:07 XaI)CyRiC wrote:
This thread is full of so much misinformation it's ridiculous. Usually strat threads have a lot of posts where people have no idea what they're talking about, but this one has almost a 99% idiot saturation. I may not be a human encyclopedia of SC/BW and it's mechanics, but I do know that there's a lot of BS in the posts above.
From what I understand, have seen evidence of, and have read before, is the folllowing. The splash damage from a tank does damage to units in a swarm, burrowed or not. Anyone who thinks that splash damage doesnt effect burrowed units is an idiot and must pay no attention to the game when they're playing. The reason lurkers sometimes take damage under a swarm and sometimes don't is because a direct hit from a siege blast does no damage to swarmed units. The splash occurs in a circle around the actual point where the shot hits, meaning only units adjacent to the actual hit will be hurt when under a swarm. It has NOTHING to do with the fact that it's burrowed or not.
What this means is that if u have multiple lurkers spaced out under a swarm, none will die to tank fire. BUT if the lurks are clumped (not on top of each other, but just adjacent to one another) a siege blast will damage those lurkers which are next to the one actually targetted by the shot and you will eventually kill them. Another way that lurks die to tank fire under a swarm is when you have other units running around in the swarm that attract tank fire near the lurkers and the splash radius reaches them that way. Again, it has NOTHING to do with burrowing.
I played a game a while back where I used a single swarm + 7 lurkers to break a terrans choke (comprising of two bunkers, a turret and three tanks). As my lurkers approached their target, they took damage from a volley of seige fire. Once burrowed, they stop taking ANY damage at all. One of my lurkers had just 2hp left, and despite the constant barrage of tank fire, it slowly regained health. Next, while staying under the swarm, I unburrowed the two lurkers farthest from the choke and moved them up, all the while remaining underneath the swarm. The tanks fired, and ONLY those two lurks took damage. Once burrowed, they were immune again.
Since it was seven lurkers under a single swarm, they were pretty clumped up.
I dont know the mystery behind the mechanics of dark swarm, but I hope this helps in further elucidation.
Maybe the key is that unburrowed units dont take damage under swarm?
|
probes can't hit under swarm, i realized it when twisted killed my island with 4 zerglings + 1 defiler
|
I hope this post will clear everything up about D swarm and burrowed units, i post it as a FAQ format.
k gandalf, lets think about it...
Q 1 -what exactly does a d swarm protect you against?
any unit under dark swarm only take splash damage and melee but take no missile damage, right? that means a marine(missile dmg) no matter what, will not harm anything under a swarm, while a spidermine(splash), a firebat(splash) or archon(splash) zealot(melee) will.
Q 2 -what kind of damage does a tank dealt?
tank do both missile and splash damage. A tank fires, and the unit been hit take full missile damage, while all the units around it with in a small radius, take some splash damage.
Q 3 -why is zergling under swarm damaged by tanks?
units under darkswarm take splash damage from tank but not the missile damage. which means, if two lings standing side by side, and a tank fires at ling A, ling A will not take damage because it is missile, while ling B will take damage because it is splash.
Q 4 -what will happen if a tank fire at two closely burrowed units?
burrowed units do not radiate splash damage from tanks. So if the ling A and ling B are burrowed side by side with no swarm on them, tank fires at ling A, it will die while ling B take no damage from the splash because no splash is radiated from ling A.
Q 5 -why is burrowed lurk underswarm unharmed by tanks?
two burrowed lings under swarm, tank fires at ling A and ling B is close by, because ling A is under swarm, it does not take missile damage, and because ling A is burrowed, it does not radiate splash dmg, so neither is harmed
Q 6 -so how do you kill a burrowed lurker with tank?
move a super duper medic with D matrix on it as a bait, move medic right on top of the lurker under a swarm. Focus fire all your tanks at the medic. Medic will radiate splash damage because she is above ground, and the burrowed lurker will take the splash damage because D swarm does not protect them from it. as a result, your medic dies with a lurker, how lovely...
hope that helps.
cheers 
Edit, question #5 is bang out of order, after i saw a replay, burrowed units DO radiate splash, so if two lings burrowed side by side, one tank hit will dmg both.
So question #6 is wrong too, lurkers burrowed sidebyside underswarm WILL take splash dmg, ur right cyric.
thx to the replay(who ever did it  )
|
United States4471 Posts
Hmm, if evidence is showing that I'm wrong about the relevance of burrowing to damage from siege splash then I guess I'm wrong. I'm not one to argue with facts
However this still doesn't change the fact that people really need to know what they're talking about before posting in the Strat forum, which sadly is something that's lacking quite a bit.
|
er someone poke exaclibur_z and get him in this thread. Im pretty sure that burrowing doesnt affect splash damage directly.
I think Cyric's points were all correct. Suprisingly, evan seems to be correct too 
|
United States4471 Posts
Ahh, so I was partially correct with only the part about burrowed units not radiating splash damage missing. This makes sense as if you run in unburrowed units amongst burrowed lurkers under a swarm, they lurkers DO die from time to time. I feel better now
|
On January 24 2005 23:29 XaI)CyRiC wrote:Ahh, so I was partially correct with only the part about burrowed units not radiating splash damage missing. This makes sense as if you run in unburrowed units amongst burrowed lurkers under a swarm, they lurkers DO die from time to time. I feel better now
yes, the burrowed ones will get damaged as the unburrowed lurker can be classified as "the running around unit"
edit: yay, my first compliment in TL.net from that reaver dude, so affectionate 
|
On January 24 2005 22:11 XaI)CyRiC wrote:Hmm, if evidence is showing that I'm wrong about the relevance of burrowing to damage from siege splash then I guess I'm wrong. I'm not one to argue with facts However this still doesn't change the fact that people really need to know what they're talking about before posting in the Strat forum, which sadly is something that's lacking quite a bit.
well you did posted without knowing what you were talking about didnt you?
|
It does no 100% dmg just a little like 20% and whit 5 tanks at one lurker ...
|
evanthebouncy made it all clear... thats it... no more arguements...
|
evan said something useful????
he's like Forrest Gump
|
United States4471 Posts
|
Sweden33719 Posts
On January 24 2005 13:34 TheGoliath wrote:
a unit under dark swarm takes splash damage
since tanks give out a shit load of splash damage, its basically the same as tanks being able to hit units under swarm
BUT
burrow zerg units don't take splash damage
this is why lurkers under swarm are so good.
HOWEVER, if you have an unburrowed unit ON TOP of a burrowed unit, the splash will hit the burrowed unit!!!!! MADNESS :D!
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
