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On March 31 2017 00:45 Dante08 wrote:
I've been try to offrace playing ZvT recently and been having problems dealing with 1 base FE into goliaths. How do you deal with it effectively as Zerg? Mutas dont do much vs goliaths and once they reach big numbers hydras start melting as well.
I struggle with this myself versus good players but here are some things that I've concluded:
- Your initial 11 mutalisks need to do damage, either taking out some goliaths or taking out SCVs. HOWEVER you need to realize how important these 11 mutalisks will be at stopping his attack. Do NOT waste them/lose more than a few.
- Get +1 flyer carapace as soon as you identify this strategy.
- Try to confirm he has 5 factories with only a single machine shop.
- I think you have 3 options now. Either you mass mutalisks or you remain at ~11 mutalisks and mass hydralisks/zerglings instead.
I am not sure myself on which is the best for which occasion.
- If you're going for hydralisks, get the speed and range upgrade. Add a round or two of drones after the mutalisks spawn, add a 5th hatchery and possibly an evo chamber for +1 attack depending on how strong your eco is, but then start pumping hydras or you will not have enough to beat his push.
If he pushes, the mutalisks are there to soak up damage while the hydras take out the goliaths.
- Now the problem is that if you overprepare for his push and he decides to not move out, your economy has taken a big hit while he can just wait for some tanks and then move out.
- This is why i will often attack myself to trade units if he doesn't move out before he gets any or more than a couple of tanks.
- Another option would be to just mass mutalisks on 3 geysers and stop his push this way. You'll probably need some sunkens to buy time. This one is quite difficult to execute because it's hard to tell when you can actually engage his army. And because his range is so long, you will take a lot of damage while retreating/engaging.
- Final option is to all-in with zerglings and mutalisks. You want to do this before his goliath production really kicks in...
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Norway28642 Posts
it's map dependent, but I love super strong backstabs. Like he leaves his base with iunno 20 goliath 4 tanks and you have your 11 mutas and 20 hydras and if you engage with that army you might very well just die. But instead you wait until he's halfway through the map, then go allout on his natural; his reinforcing units just aren't gonna cut it against a big, committed backstab, so he either has to go back, in which case you basically trade your hydras for economic damage and time while saving your mutas, or he commits to the attack, in which case you let your natural fall, focus on saving your main and third while massing up more mutas (his army won't reinforce, if you get to 20 mutas you can engage head on).
Goliaths are pretty slow at clearing out bases and really slow to get back to their own main, and just 1 cycle of terran production isn't gonna do shit to stop a 11 muta 20 hydra stab. Now, if he just goes at you then you're certainly gonna be in a stressful situation, but mass muta vs mech is one scenario where a basetrade favors you, not him. you can pick off stray units, you regenerate, you're much more mobile. This is much easier to pull off on say, cross position Jade, than bottom right vs bottom left on FS.
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What do you do if you go 9 pool (on fighting spirit) and the terran opened up with 2 rax?
You need to preserve the lings so you can't do any damage and since you don't have speed, it's hard to keep him contained. Next up, you can't tell whether he's getting a CC or adding tech (academy) and extra barracks...
Should I get gas asap, stay on 2 bases with 2 hatch, lair first? And then just add a ton of sunkens in case he went for additional barracks/academy instead of a cc? I think that hits before mutas are out (in a 2 hatch build)..
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what are some good control group settings as protoss? coming from sc2 dunno how to group all my stuff in the most optimal way
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lol you guys r good at confusing ppl
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Which would be the least ping-reliant race?
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Hi I am trying to learn Brood War and have decided to play Zerg for now. I am having trouble staying safe against bio pushes while also teching and having a decent economy.
I found a build order which is a 3hatch expand into mutalisks which are used with sunkens to protect your natural and delay pushes against your third base while you get lurker tech up.
Is there a viable build that skips the mutas and goes straight into lurker tech?
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I legit never use Mutalisks as Zerg in any match-up and I'm the poster boy for success with the race.
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On April 03 2017 02:01 SCC-Faust wrote:
I legit never use Mutalisks as Zerg in any match-up and I'm the poster boy for success with the race.
that's pretty cool -.-
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United States11390 Posts
On April 03 2017 02:01 SCC-Faust wrote:
I legit never use Mutalisks as Zerg in any match-up and I'm the poster boy for success with the race.
www.dictionary.com
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Sometimes I feel like no one on this forum respects me.
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I almost lost to a retard on the PTR last night because i couldn't keep my army together lategame
What's the standard tvz hotkey setup? I don't remember what I used when I was still playing and I tried to have like... marines on 1-2, medics/vessels on 3, tanks on 4, 5rax 7fac 8 port 90 comsat, but then I had 100 supply of shit and it was just awful. Please help thx.
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Simple solution, you have to expand your army hotkeys in the later stage of the game, only use one hotkey to get to your macro area, 9 and 0 for scans. Or use a location hotkey for your macro area. Then you can use 1-4/5 for medic & marines and go with the rest for special units like tank/vessel/dropship. Having your Factory/Starport near the barracks obviously helps macroing in this case.
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Is it better to do like vessel on 1, tank on 2, then mnm on 3 and up? This way I can just add hotkeys as I need them instead of trying to hotkey around the special units groups
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+ Show Spoiler +
In this game of effort vs light in the recent ASL, light did a 5 factory goliath build (it's at 2h 25min into the vod).
I'm unsure about some of the details.
1. Which upgrades have priority after charon boosters, in general? Siege mode > spider mine / ion thrusters?
I think light went for siege mode > ion thrusters > spider mines
2. I don't think Light got an academy at all during the game and thus no comsat stations. What if effort had build some lurkers? Would he just respond with an academy? Or would he wait until he gets his first vessel out?
3. You remain at one factory with a machine shop, which will be dedicated to tank production?
4. You only get irradiate when you can afford it (either by securing third gas, or because you produced a couple of cycles of vultures)?
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On April 04 2017 04:21 rauk wrote:
Is it better to do like vessel on 1, tank on 2, then mnm on 3 and up? This way I can just add hotkeys as I need them instead of trying to hotkey around the special units groups
Sure, I don't see a reason against it, then you don't even have to use 1a which is usually harder to perform than for the rest. Well, maybe 7a is harder not sure. Personally I couldn't do it because the habit for me is too strong to assign control groups for m&m first. One disadvantage that comes to mind is, that you will send vessels and tanks first in front of the army when you move everything with 1a2a3a so they might get sniped easier.
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The biggest problem with vessels on 1, or tanks, is that usually you already have stuff on 1 by the time these units come. It's better in a vaccum but in a real game it's situational.
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On April 04 2017 10:52 B-royal wrote:
2. I don't think Light got an academy at all during the game and thus no comsat stations. What if effort had build some lurkers? Would he just respond with an academy? Or would he wait until he gets his first vessel out?
4. You only get irradiate when you can afford it (either by securing third gas, or because you produced a couple of cycles of vultures)?
2-> I think it wouldn't be efficient to use 100+50+150+225=525 gas just for detection, so comsats would be better ( considering Light's build with mass factories not intending to get starport for a long time).
Generally vessel/irradiate only makes sense if you are going for late game (aka turtle mech), these mid game push builds get mostly tank/goliath, while if you play defensively you don't need as many due to defensive advantage+turrets.
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EPT
