EPTASL seeking submissions of new maps for season 4 - Page 6
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Bakuryu
Germany1065 Posts
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Flameling
United States413 Posts
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Endymion
United States3701 Posts
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JungleTerrain
Chile799 Posts
By the way, the map is experimental so we still have to see how matchups actually pan out. I've theorycrafted a lot during the making of the map but who knows. And... Why did they put an old picture of the map? That is not 1.2 (which I still need to change). | ||
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Freakling
Germany1534 Posts
If you ask me they should just use both Uzi Sara and Salamander. It's still a while till ASL4 starts, enough time for players to prepare two maps. And voting for one or the other is like voting for whether you want something to eat or a drink for dinner... One is a pretty standard 4p macro map, the other an experimental 3p map. Bot are are needed and complement each other. No reason to chose between them. Crossing Field I just don't like conceptually. Loki, Nemesis, God's Garden, Central Plains: Maps with a super safe backdoor nat (and a front door one on top of that) have turned out to be macro snore fests time and time again. I think neither of those maps has produced particularly nice games, or good balance for that matter, I don't see why this new iteration should be an exception... | ||
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[sc1f]eonzerg
Belgium7215 Posts
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Bakuryu
Germany1065 Posts
On July 11 2017 07:10 Freakling wrote: Crossing Field I just don't like conceptually. Loki, Nemesis, God's Garden, Central Plains: Maps with a super safe backdoor nat (and a front door one on top of that) have turned out to be macro snore fests time and time again. I think neither of those maps has produced particularly nice games, or good balance for that matter, I don't see why this new iteration should be an exception... imo the problem with that concept isnt the concept itself, but more what there is left with the map. gods garden and central plains basically have 0 interaction with the whole middle of the map. "gaining territory" doesnt really translate into anything. you either secure another main base, or you dont, as that translates into free 3-4 base, and there is no other choice to take different bases. this is pretty binary without many options on the map, hence boring. just comparing it to outsider, yes you can still secure 2 bases and 2 mineral only bases when you take another main, but as you are giving up that map control, your enemy can take the mineral only bases in the middle, opening up more variation. nemesis only goal is to contain your enemy at his tiny ramp, because this wins you the game 99%, unless you are very bad at defending drops. again there is nothing else to do on this map, middle is just a single open field, all bases are only accessable through a tiny ramp/island. as a 2 player map, loki is different, because apart from the free 3 base start economy, there is no other free 3 base to take, so you have to play the map. you are using different ramps/chokes to secure more territory in order to get more bases. so i think crossing field will be a fun map, because you still have to use all the ramps/chokes on the map to secure another base. | ||
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JungleTerrain
Chile799 Posts
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TT1
Canada10104 Posts
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JungleTerrain
Chile799 Posts
On July 11 2017 13:53 TT1 wrote: Can you even wall off your nat as protoss on Crossing Field? Didn't seem like it from watching Larva's vod. That's like map making 101.. giving protoss a wall-able nat vs zerg. It looks like hydra busts will be strong there since they can get a nice concave as a result of the wide choke. I think the reasoning behind this is because of the backdoor expansion. Therefore the front expansion has more "risk" involved. | ||
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TT1
Canada10104 Posts
On July 11 2017 14:39 JungleTerrain wrote: It looks like hydra busts will be strong there since they can get a nice concave as a result of the wide choke. I think the reasoning behind this is because of the backdoor expansion. Therefore the front expansion has more "risk" involved. EDIT: oh shit i missed the backdoor expo, my bad. i thought the 3rd base was actually the nat, my mistake  | ||
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Freakling
Germany1534 Posts
On July 11 2017 11:18 Bakuryu wrote: imo the problem with that concept isnt the concept itself, but more what there is left with the map. gods garden and central plains basically have 0 interaction with the whole middle of the map. "gaining territory" doesnt really translate into anything. you either secure another main base, or you dont, as that translates into free 3-4 base, and there is no other choice to take different bases. this is pretty binary without many options on the map, hence boring. just comparing it to outsider, yes you can still secure 2 bases and 2 mineral only bases when you take another main, but as you are giving up that map control, your enemy can take the mineral only bases in the middle, opening up more variation. nemesis only goal is to contain your enemy at his tiny ramp, because this wins you the game 99%, unless you are very bad at defending drops. again there is nothing else to do on this map, middle is just a single open field, all bases are only accessable through a tiny ramp/island. as a 2 player map, loki is different, because apart from the free 3 base start economy, there is no other free 3 base to take, so you have to play the map. you are using different ramps/chokes to secure more territory in order to get more bases. so i think crossing field will be a fun map, because you still have to use all the ramps/chokes on the map to secure another base. Okay, some good points there. And I actually rather like Colosseum and and Katrina, which also have have safe backdoor nats. But both also have nice open main front doors, which opens up more room (literally) for counter-play. On the other hand, God's Garden and Central Plains at least offer players some nice cliffs to drop-harass the backdoor. Crossing Field currently hasn't even got a muta cliff/ovi spot there. On the other hand, the front door looks hard to secure early on in PvZ. So I would expect Lurker contains on the small ramp to be strong. I guess I'd need to see in practice how it actually pans out. | ||
Xxio
Canada5565 Posts
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onlystar
United States971 Posts
On July 12 2017 00:23 Xxio wrote: Congrats JungleTerrain!! of course impressive effort JungleTerrain!! hope the foreign & korean community picks the map up aswell | ||
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chrisolo
Germany2614 Posts
Btw, this should be the first time ever that a foreign map could potentially be used in a korean event or am I wrong? | ||
thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
Really awesome that you've made it this far in the process. Hope the map makes it to the big show, but even if it doesn't I'm in awe at what you've accomplished already. | ||
BigFan
TLADT24920 Posts
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GTR
51706 Posts
On July 12 2017 07:15 chrisolo wrote: Congratz bro! Very well deserved! Our foreigner mapmakers make so many awesome maps and yet they do not get the attention they should get, because they aren't used in korean leagues. So happy for you JungleTerrain! Let's hope it gets through the popularity vote. Btw, this should be the first time ever that a foreign map could potentially be used in a korean event or am I wrong? Technically, the first foreign non-Blizzard map used in a Korean event was Cloud Kingdom in SC2 - but for BW/SC:R, yes. | ||
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Vivi57
United States6599 Posts
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phosphorylation
United States2935 Posts
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