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![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/IbFmy9k.jpg)
Demian SE
version 2.0
- Map Description (translate)
The Bird fightsits way out of the egg. The egg is the world. Who would be born must first destroy a world
- Hermann Hesse 「Demian」
Created by LatiAs
Presented by AfreecaTV
- Compare with previous version(1.02) (gif)
+ Show Spoiler +
Download link :
My blog
BWMN
- ASL Official Map
(2)Benzene_1.1
(3)Demian SE_2.0
(4)Circuit Breakers_1.0
(4)Eye of the Storm_1.1
* 'Eye of the storm' is updated(1.0 → 1.1). [I did...]
Fixed 5'o clock's mineral problem.
Download : http://blog.naver.com/kangkuyol/220871856822
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Gratz! Finally they spotted you and started using your maps again. This looks really good replace for Destination.
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ALLEYCAT BLUES50790 Posts
how does it feel to have your map picked again, especially after how we pretty much gave up hope this time last year
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I like that the minerals for the spawns are now more balanced but I feel like it's going to be so awkward to macro out of 11 o'clock...
Definitely like the fixes to the inner ramps for the high ground thirds, though. Congrats!
@outscar: Why would it replace Destination? This is also a 3 player map and not a 2 player map. I don't understand.
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I am really bad at BW do please correct me if this is wrong:
At the 1'o clock platform looks like it's possible to attack (atleast behind the minerals) both adjacent bases with tanks on it, whilst I'm not sure if the same is possible for 5'/9' clock.
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On November 28 2016 13:39 byj wrote:
I am really bad at BW do please correct me if this is wrong:
At the 1'o clock platform looks like it's possible to attack (atleast behind the minerals) both adjacent bases with tanks on it, whilst I'm not sure if the same is possible for 5'/9' clock.
I haven't play-tested it, but to my eye it seems like that should not be possible. The distance is too great, even for the seemingly infinite reach of the dreaded Arclite Cannon.
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Chile2356 Posts
i liked this map, only problem that i had with it is that felt very terran favored on TvP, now with the changes looks a little better. the fact that they changed the ramp on high ground 3rd, and made these expos a little more vulnerables, plus the changes to the middle terrain making it easier to manouver is going to create explosives games, instead of the super turtly abuse of bridges+ walls style that terrans played here, also the the wall behind natural expoes made it really easy for terrans to contain with timing pushes, good to see they made it a little fatter, really good changes to the overall balance of the map imo.
edit: i didn't know this was called demian because of the book, nice to know that one of my favorite authors is making his legacy even in BW.
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This is great. Congratulations.
Potential balance complaints aside, I hope players and hosts will actually know how to appreciate that they have a quality product in their hands this time.
I should also point out that you did a nice job with the resources. Everything seems to mine almost perfectly, so that alone is major step forward in quality, compared to the maps of Rose.of.Dream et al.
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this map was horror horrable abuse of mutas vs bio (ground units stuck on terrain , no vision on air units just a clusterfuk)
that aside its a beautifully made map but i fear it will not balance
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Demian is my name, named after the book also :D
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Congratulations on having your map in the ASL! Very exciting and I'm glad that the Korean scene is willing to start branching off a little from the same old maps.
As a player I can only echo Jealous' sentiments that 11' oclock is going to suck for macro/base layout because the ramp is at top but most of the production space is going to be towards the bottom of the base.
However I believe progamers will come up with superior layouts to overcome this, so I'm looking forward to seeing what they do with your map!
Edit: Also going to be tough learning to split for top and bottom mineral formations again >_>
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On November 28 2016 13:08 Jealous wrote:
@outscar: Why would it replace Destination? This is also a 3 player map and not a 2 player map. I don't understand.
Didn't notice that Destination was replaced by Benzene. Seems like EOTS bit less macro oriented FS, CB standart macro map, Demian which I don't know how it will play and Benzene is match point.
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On November 28 2016 21:42 DarkNetHunter wrote:As a player I can only echo Jealous' sentiments that 11' oclock is going to suck for macro/base layout because the ramp is at top but most of the production space is going to be towards the bottom of the base.
However I believe progamers will come up with superior layouts to overcome this, so I'm looking forward to seeing what they do with your map! The ramp could be flipped around to face the other way, but I don't think this will be a real issue. The mains are overall pretty big, there should be enough space in the area near the ramp to fit enough macro buildings to get at least to the mid game.
Edit: Also going to be tough learning to split for top and bottom mineral formations again >_> That's probably the better trade off, compared to the imbalances of exposed mineral lines. There is a neat workaround to alter the spawn position of the initial workers to be on top (or anywhere else) of the town hall. I think this should be implemented on the top position, because otherwise the workers spawn far away from the mineral and the town hall gets in the way, so splits are very awkward and noticeably slower than usual.
I find splits to bottom to be generally unproblematic, as long as the four closest patches are still visible on the starting screen (which here they are).
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Yeah, pro's play half of their time on Hunters which include all type of splits so splitting should be cakewalk. Going to watch again KSL to see how it played out 1st. Ha, Mind is again on group with hero, maybe he will bunker rush him again.
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cool beans, thx for the info.
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The old thin winding paths into the 3rds were cute but this is better now. Also, you can wall off the low ground expansion easier now as there are propellers at the choke (fun fact; CAS has zero of these doodads). I still dont like the tankable nats, and its actually even more powerful now, particularly at teal. But overall I still really like this map and Im much more excited to see games on it than Benzene for example (tvz what are they thinking, and Flash is set to play Terror on it hahaha).
Vertical ramp at the 3rd looks a bit weird. These are just my first impressions from looking at the picture only.
LatiAs, you should put in hallucinated objects to make workers spawn closer to the minerals at red main. Sent you a PM.
@XenOsky- you keep saying 'they' but the map was made by one person (the creator of the thread). You are talking directly to him!
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I didn't play this map yet, but my general feedback from the image.
12 o'clock natural's right side wall is too long. 1 o'clock expansion is too hard to take from the look compare to 5 and 9, and 1 o'clock expansion's top side gap shouldn't be exist(in order to be fair compare to 5 and 9 expansions).
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Can you pack all the ASL Season 2 maps into one file and provide the download link for us?
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On November 29 2016 09:44 CardinalAllin wrote:
The old thin winding paths into the 3rds were cute but this is better now. Also, you can wall off the low ground expansion easier now as there are propellers at the choke (fun fact; CAS has zero of these doodads). I still dont like the tankable nats, and its actually even more powerful now, particularly at teal. But overall I still really like this map and Im much more excited to see games on it than Benzene for example (tvz what are they thinking, and Flash is set to play Terror on it hahaha).
Vertical ramp at the 3rd looks a bit weird. These are just my first impressions from looking at the picture only.
LatiAs, you should put in hallucinated objects to make workers spawn closer to the minerals at red main. Sent you a PM.
@XenOsky- you keep saying 'they' but the map was made by one person (the creator of the thread). You are talking directly to him!
I got your feedback(11'o starting with 4 workers at top), however I can't fix map now because of two reason....
1. It is already released. Final ver. I can't recall it. sry. Too late...
2. However, of course I already think about your opinion, before I uploaded. But pros are familiar to starting with 4 workers at bottom, not top. As I mentioned earlier, they are conservative. I can't force them something unfamiliar.
And sry about my poor English skill... I cant translate change log well. Plz refer to gif file which i upload.
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51582 Posts
I can translate the change log to English if there is enough demand for it.
+ Show Spoiler [Korean] + - 스타팅 자원배치 수정 (뮤탈 게릴라 유불리 최소화)
- 앞마당 자원배치 수정 (포격 유불리 최소화)
- 앞마당 - 언덕 멀티 간 길목 확장
- 언덕 멀티 크기 축소 및 위치 조정
- 지상 멀티 입막 파일런 3개 → 2개로 조정
- 모든 멀티 자원배치 수정
- 7시 다리 위치 조정
- 센터 벽 지형 수정
- 3시 본진 벽 지형 포격 수정
- 11시 앞마당 심시티 조정
- 기타 지형 및 장식물 수정
- 중립 동물 삭제
- 트리거 텍스트 출력 수정
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I can translate:
+ Show Spoiler +
- Fixing placement of starting resources (minimizing mutal guerrilla)
- Modification of the layout of the front yard resources (minimization of bombardment)
- Front yard - Hill extension
- Scale and position hill multi-size
- Adjusted to three ground multi-filing pylons → 2
- Modify all multi-resource batches
- 7 o'clock position adjustment
- Modify the center wall topography
- Fixed 3 o'clock original wall terrain shelling
- SimCity coordination at 11 o'clock front yard
- Other terrain and decorative fixes
- Neutral canter
- Modify trigger text output
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On November 28 2016 14:04 Jealous wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2016 13:39 byj wrote:
I am really bad at BW do please correct me if this is wrong:
At the 1'o clock platform looks like it's possible to attack (atleast behind the minerals) both adjacent bases with tanks on it, whilst I'm not sure if the same is possible for 5'/9' clock. I haven't play-tested it, but to my eye it seems like that should not be possible. The distance is too great, even for the seemingly infinite reach of the dreaded Arclite Cannon.
Tested it now, you're right, it is way too far away. The only thing I managed to get is ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/c19EPsc.png)
, which was barely in range.
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On November 29 2016 09:47 LaStScan wrote:12 o'clock natural's right side wall is too long. 1 o'clock expansion is too hard to take from the look compare to 5 and 9, and 1 o'clock expansion's top side gap shouldn't be exist(in order to be fair compare to 5 and 9 expansions). It is just one of those compromises one has to take with 3 player maps, or you'd have to stretch things outunreasonably, which results in uneven ground distances, which is even worse. Look at the thirds on Aztec, for example, as a comaprison.
On November 29 2016 11:57 LatiAs wrote:
I got your feedback(11'o starting with 4 workers at top), however I can't fix map now because of two reason....
1. It is already released. Final ver. I can't recall it. sry. Too late...
2. However, of course I already think about your opinion, before I uploaded. But pros are familiar to starting with 4 workers at bottom, not top. As I mentioned earlier, they are conservative. I can't force them something unfamiliar.
And sry about my poor English skill... I cant translate change log well. Plz refer to gif file which i upload.
I'd just ask them to give it a chance, try it out a few times; maybe make a fixed-spawn training version of the map for that.
Realistically the trade-off here is between having to learn a new split (which I assume they'd do anyway, as all mineral formations all somewhat different) or being behind a second or two in their build order from the very start. I know how I would chose.
The only difficulty I ever experienced with splitting from the top is that workers are actually so quickly at the minerals that I cannot split them all proeperly before the first start mining (but I am not a 400 apm pro, either...)
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51582 Posts
new mineral formations in the mains (11 and 7) look awful - sad that asl caved in 
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/qf8VI5V.gif)
