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C-A foreigner tournament: CrispyCup

Forum Index > BW General
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B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-20 16:48:53
September 17 2016 18:43 GMT
#1
Hello everyone,

I've been thinking about hosting a small tournament for a long time now but I primarily lack experience regarding the organisation of one.

I would appreciate any help.

I'm planning on using this site http://challonge.com/ for the bracket and where people have to upload their games.

Here are some of the tournament specifics I had planned:

- single or double elimination tournament.

- maximally 32 players

- on a sunday evening 18:00 CEST

- prize money would be around 30 95€ (transferred through paypal to the winner and runner-up in a 70/30 ratio)

- possibility of casting a selection of the games and streaming them on teamliquid?

- Possibly no koreans allowed (if so, sorry LastScan)

I wanted to create a banner as well in case I can make this a regular occurrence. This is what I've created myself, but as you can see it's clearly not professional looking.

[image loading]


edit: Some additional request for information.

1) Please give me some map suggestions (preferably foreigner maps, also check out my suggestions a few comments down). Since I'm not familiar with map making or older maps, try to include some comments related to balance as I don't want to pick any maps that are extremely in favor of a particular race.

After I've got a good pool of maps, I'll put up a poll and let the player base express their preferred choices, which I will take into account during the final selection process.

2) Is there a standard set of rules and guidelines for a tournament?
Such as 1. If your opponent doesn't show within 30 minutes of the planned match, he effectively surrenders.
2. If an opponent decides to drop out for any reason, his previous opponent may take his place.
3. No excessive spam or badmouthing other players in game.
4. If a player drops within the first 2 minutes of a game, the situation will assessed and if both opponents are judged to have an equal chance to win, a regame is made.
5. No hacking, cheating, streamcheating,... allowed.
6...


edit2:

On September 18 2016 11:03 B-royal wrote:
I previously said I would take suggestions in regards to maps and if you find an absolute gem, I will definitely consider it. However, I realize now I already have quite a few maps to choose from so I think the next step is to listen to the potential players.

Here are some polls about which map you would like to see/play during the CrispyCup.

Poll: Which "standard" 4-player map would you like to see in the CrispyCup?

(Vote): Luna (the final)
(Vote): Icarus
(Vote): Avlon
(Vote): Heartbeat
(Vote): Everflow



Map images + Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

[image loading]

[image loading]

[image loading]

[image loading]



Poll: Which "nonstandard" maps would you like to see?

(Vote): Vårens Töväder
(Vote): Silvery waves
(Vote): Quintessence
(Vote): Battle Royal
(Vote): Overwatch (iCCup version)
(Vote): other (please specify in thread)



Map images + Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

[image loading]

[image loading]

[image loading]

[image loading]



edit3: To summarize:

I think I will start by taking the winning map from both polls. Then I will add 2 standard maps again suggested/chosen by the players, and finally one mystery map from both polls that I would love to see/deserves a chance.


edit4: Update, great news!

Toastus has offered to add 20€ to the prize pool putting the total at 50€!

edit5: Update, extra thanks to DiMiaN for making this lovely banner!! Looks fantastic and much more professional

[image loading]

edit6:

Update: More awesome news.

Atom[Bomb] has offered to add 45€ to the prize pool!




new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
outscar
Profile Joined September 2014
2832 Posts
September 17 2016 18:46 GMT
#2
Great banner and idea! Which maps are you gonna try? It will be nice to see foreign ones.
sunbeams are never made like me...
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
September 17 2016 18:49 GMT
#3
Nice idea outscar. I hadn't thought about any specific maps but the suggestion of using foreign ones really appeals to me. I encourage all foreign map makers to either send some of their favourite maps to me by PM or highlight them in this thread!
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
[sc1f]eonzerg
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Belgium6609 Posts
September 17 2016 19:04 GMT
#4
foreign overwatch
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
September 17 2016 20:45 GMT
#5
I'm currently going over the maps in Liquipedia to see if I can find some interesting ones myself.

Out of curiosity, what would be the opinion about using >4 player maps?

As for maps, here are some that I personally find good looking and interesting (not all foreigner maps):

- Vårens Töväder

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


- Silvery waves

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


- Everflow

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


- Avalon

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


- Heartbeat

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


- Quintessence

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


- Battle Royal

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
outscar
Profile Joined September 2014
2832 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-17 21:50:00
September 17 2016 21:41 GMT
#6
Nice choices. Everflow reminds me Tornado. Silvery Waves is gorgeous map, sad it didn't make into SSL back then. I didn't see many games on Heartbeat even if it included on mappack so it's nice to see you picked it. Quintessence seems decent, don't remember it. We already saw how things goes on Avalon at KSL, 1base terran crushing 4base zerg at finals. I don't really like Battle Royal but it's up for your taste.

You can also visit BWMN for additional maps, of course most of them never used in leagues http://www.panschk.de/mappage/newsscript/viewnews.php
sunbeams are never made like me...
art_of_turtle
Profile Blog Joined September 2012
United States1187 Posts
September 17 2016 22:34 GMT
#7
C-A meaning Ranks C to rank A or is it a pseudonym for Canada?
Flash should fear Sacsri
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
September 17 2016 22:42 GMT
#8
C-A iccup ranks :D
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
Glioburd
Profile Joined April 2008
France1911 Posts
September 17 2016 22:53 GMT
#9
Nice initiative Crispy ! I'll try to be in
"You should hate loosing, but you should never fear defeat." NaDa.
Peeano
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Netherlands5066 Posts
September 17 2016 23:05 GMT
#10
foreigner overwatch

I get that you have a soft spot for Battle Royal, but I don't think it's a viable map as pretty much any other map would be better.
FBH #1!
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-17 23:25:12
September 17 2016 23:20 GMT
#11
On September 18 2016 08:05 Peeano wrote:
foreigner overwatch

I get that you have a soft spot for Battle Royal, but I don't think it's a viable map as pretty much any other map would be better.


Funnily enough I hadn't seen the connection between my name and the map. My name actually just includes the first letter of my first name and the word royal, it also has no connection to the song by lorde

Finally, to make myself a bit more clear. The maps I suggested are not decided on, I'm very much open to discussion and other suggestions. I actually read a bit more about the map Battle Royal and it seems that it is highly in favour of zerg? If this is the case, I will drop it unless players would be excited to play on it.

edit: It also seems there are 3 overwatch maps in circulation as far as I can tell. The ASL overwatch, the overwatch by Latias and the overwatch map currently in the map pool.

Eonzerg which version did you suggest? The version by Latias or the one in the iCCup mappack?
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
Peeano
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Netherlands5066 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-17 23:26:20
September 17 2016 23:24 GMT
#12
Maybe a 5 player map could be interesting. Haven't seen it used in 1v1 before.
I like love seeing nonstandard maps, but to please the players maybe 1 or 2 standard maps wouldn't hurt. Please no FS/CB!

I'd watch a stream. Maybe Cats_Paw/Cele/Eonzerg/FlashFTW/BisuDagger are interested in casting.(Sorry whoever active caster I'm forgetting).
FBH #1!
GeckoXp
Profile Blog Joined June 2013
Germany2016 Posts
September 17 2016 23:39 GMT
#13
On September 18 2016 03:43 B-royal wrote:
2) Is there a standard set of rules and guidelines for a tournament?



On August 22 2014 02:25 GeckoXp wrote:
General Advice

+ Show Spoiler +

1. Regardless of what you do, remember that the current foreign scene is anything but professional. Understand it like I mean it. Nobody is going to play for the glory of eSports, nor do we need a super serious business plan, we deal with anything. Remember that you should do this for fun, not to promote your own ego, a new company or anything else. If you don't, there's a huge chance you stumble and fall right away. This isn't meant as downside, but as glimpse of hope for you – it doesn't matter what your experience is, if you already have a name or not, people will most likely appreciate your effort.


2. Know your limits. There are few people with enough time to do everything on their own. The larger your event will be, the more help you will need. Accept help where it is offered, also accept that your helpers will have limits as well. It's not unlikely you will suffer periods of demotivation – know that before you start. Be sure you can follow through with your plans. Hence, rather start small and slowly work your way up, than trying to do a monstrous plan right away.

Related: If you ask for help, remember that you should be approaching your helpers with respect. They will sacrifice their free time. Being impolite is a no-go and will get you nowhere. At the same time, some of the helpers (me included) have a huge ego. Even if you're disappointed, or not satisfied, try to not spread stupid rumors in the open or try to heat up a giant discussion. I can guarantee you: nobody but you will be interested. Argueing in the internet is stupid. It will also only help you to burn bridges. Ask yourself if you want to go down in flames or have the opportunity to try again. If you're really, really mad, switch out your computer and go for a walk before you do it again. E.g., if you get into rage about one person, don't copy that behaviour on an entire portal like Defiler, ICCup or Teamliquid. Hence, keep your cool and try again later or don't contact them and let it be for a while.


Futhermore: Most organizers miss one thing – that they're the leader. It's often a trap for both sides – helpers and organizers – to be just a little too polite. The second someone wants to help, explain IN DETAILS what you expect and WHEN to expect it. If you have writers, tell them everything they need to know: Results, links to replays/VODs, who they can ask for an interview. Set dates. It's rather hard to define a line, but being clear of your expectations helps. If nobody knows what to do because of overly polite conversations, it's rather likely you'll end up not doing a thing and everyone gets slightly disappointed. Don't be that organizer, be the ruler. A generous god. Also, always thank for the work you got.


3. The general consens as of late is that you need certain requirements before doing anything. This assumption is only partially true. You have to know exactly what you want to do, this much is correct. However, you do not need a super serious CSS-styled post as front page news on Teamliquid with three translations on broodwar.de, netwars.pl and reps.ru to make it work, nor do you need a trailer, banners and the best commentator. Start with the core and accept that the details are just details.
      Note: In my opinion a cast isn't that important. Do never skip an event because a caster is missing. Most players can stream anyways. Commentators are the least interesting thing in your planning, especially since they're so hard to get. Your first and foremost task should be to serve the players, not the consumers!


4. Following up, be sure you deliver your message – the design needs to be crystal clear; this means, that any announce HAS to feature this information:
  • Button for Registration
  • Date and Time (with time zone like CET)
  • format (e.g. 16 DE Tournament)



5. Don't just copy and paste things you seen Teamliquid or the Koreans do. Ask yourself it makes sense to host a ladder stage, group stage and whatnot, if a small open grid on Defiler would do the trick as well. Keep it simple. At the same time, don't try to force new inventions. There's a reason 16 SE Grids are filled on ICCup within ten minutes, whereas the satellite ISL 3 mode was a huge failure in terms of quality and quantitiy.
      In case you plan really big, I suggest you also read: Tournament Design by Itsjustatank – very good thoughts on simple things, things which make a difference.


6. Post Tournament Analysis: This is something everyone does, knowing or not. Do not meassure the 'success' of your event by the responses you get from random people not participating. Sadly, in nowadays net culture the consume-only effect is big – meaning people enjoy your contribution, but will not tell you they did. Keep your head up high and don't selectively ignore the good responses you get. Vice versa, if you read this out of pure interest, don't ever forget to write a simply thanks for the tour if you liked it – it makes a large difference.

7. Time: Try to find out how much time you will need to host a tournament (e.g. by asking other hosts). Realize that more than seven hours is too much for most players. This is somewhat of an arbitrary line, but it works.

8. Scheduling: Schedule your tournament in a way it does not clash with any other event. This is easier said than done, because everyone wants the spots on Friday – Sunday nights, when everyone has time. Preferably Sundays.


9. Always give announcements one week before the event starts. This is a good rule of thumb. Last Minute tournaments work only so-so, depending on your reputation and your ability to reach a bigger audience on your own.


10. Related: Try to spread the word. See the Resources spoiler for places you can advertise in order to reach the biggest base of players!






How To: Rules

+ Show Spoiler +

Now for some real important advice: Writing a set of rules.

In almost all cases, no special rules are needed or required. Especially small tournaments can live completely without them. However, a few very general things you should definitely do or avoid:


1. The target audience is most likely not from a country with English as first language. Hence, the rules should be written in a way everyone can understand them. For example, surrendering IP nobody understands (especially since it's a rape of the English language). Avoid difficult phrasings. Don't worry if it is kindergarten English.


2. The more important your tournament is, the more the problem arises that players will find loopholes in your set of rules. This will magically happen, you definitely have to live with it. Partially because of what is written under Point 1, partially because people are sometimes idiots. Consequently add a Right of Admission clause – meaning you (and your helpers) can do any ruling. Stress this out, make this your rule #1.
      This sounds as if you are a dictator, but it makes it clear you're not going to argue over long; trust me it will help you out a ton. You will also realize VERY soon your set of rules will be incomplete – e.g. when someone indeed flames the shit out of a player.


3. Disconnects needs to have a ruling as well. ALL rules I know state that a disconnect means a win if one player has an advantage. This is bullshit and almost all leagues I played in, worked with or for do ignore this ruling, because they have the right of admission. Make it so that a disconnect in reality means the game has to be replayed; only grant a win if the situation is more than clear, e.g. if someone has 12 expansions, while the other player has only one worker and a burning CC left. Do not even try to judge the situation, both players will protest. Even if one player is behind by two expansions, has 50 supply less – he still can come back. The underlying logic will be: if he was good enough to have taken the lead in the disc game, he will have the skill to do it again.


4. Walk Overs: Make two times for walk overs; usually 15-30 minutes for the first round (opening round), 5-15 minutes for walk overs during a tour. However, I recommend doing the yoda/DRaW approach for actually granting walk overs. In most grids you can only give the walk overs, but not take them back. It sucks to throw out one player at minute 15, to see him coming into the channel 10 secons later. Just sit out the situation. As long as the player to receive the walk over has no opponent yet, he will not receive the walk over. If his opponent shows up, let them play.



5. Flamers: Flamers will appear sooner or later as well. It's up to you how you handle the situation. Please note that I'm argueably the most draconic admin in ICCup's history past 2010. I don't make any compromises, but act according to the 'quid pro quo' logic. Anyhow, you should treat with care here. Your job is to de-escalate the situation. This usually has for steps:



  • Remind the players to keep their cool and don't do anything
  • Kick the flamer and remind him again it'll end badly if he does it again
  • Ban the flamer and the situation is over; if it is not, then
  • Blacklist the flamer and don't bother with him again


The same logic should apply to anything you do in reality – try to find a solution, offer alternatives, only ban/grant walkovers if nothing else works.




Resources

+ Show Spoiler [Grids] +


Grids can be hosted on the following pages:

Defiler.ru – Anyone is allowed to. Contact yoda (See point 1). Works fine, also allows you to have the replays done.

ICCup – Same as for Defiler; however does not feature DE grids and might need help of an admin

Binary Beast – Free afaik, offers grids as well




+ Show Spoiler [Group Stages] +


Dang. There is nothing for you – there is literally no page really helping you out here. You have to do that manually and it will cost you some nerves. I suggest making an Excel page or, the better solution, use the Google Drive functions. This looks the nicest with the least work required.

You can also try to use Liquipedia – there are tons of people willing to help you out and doing updates for you if you ask nicely. Go to Liquipedia IRC Channel #Liquipedia at Quake.net. I promise you, all people there are super nice.




+ Show Spoiler [Advertisment] +


You will want to advertise your event. Sure thing, it's easy, here are some pages you can use:

Teamliquid – obviously. You'Re already here. Just make a thread and maybe ask some mod if it is enough to get a community news. Also, don't forget to use the Calendar Submission button!


Defiler – Create an account; Log-In; Top left, the + Symbol – Create Thread. Do it. Post in English. Done.


http://www.reddit.com/r/broodwar/ and http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft → create account, link to your Teamliquid topic, submit.


soon: tutorial for netwars.pl (need help here!), reps.ru, broodwar.de



http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/brood-war/465340-event-organizer-resource-thread
[sc1f]eonzerg
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Belgium6609 Posts
September 17 2016 23:47 GMT
#14
yeah if cats want we can do it

overwatch from the iccup ladder aka foreigner overwatch.is a bit sad this one wasnt played in the ASL instead of that bad copy of Grand Line(overwatch)
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
September 17 2016 23:49 GMT
#15
Thanks GeckoXp, just what I needed.
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
EsportsJohn
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4883 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-18 00:44:57
September 17 2016 23:55 GMT
#16
I'm not very useful in terms of playing or planning, but I've got plenty of time to kill if you need an admin to help organize the players/casters and collect scores. I did admin work for the SC2 LRSL a few years ago, so I'm pretty comfortable with that sort of thing.

EDIT: I can also write a ruleset if you need help. I wrote a set of rules back in the day for an SC2 team league we were discussing among the guys at TL Strategy.
StrategyAllyssa Grey <3<3
LML
Profile Blog Joined March 2007
Germany1768 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-18 00:37:22
September 18 2016 00:36 GMT
#17
regarding the maps it's probably a better idea to use maps that the players have played on.
With every new map or map that nobody has played in years there is the problem of having to learn walls, strategies, etc., which can be very time consuming. A lot of time that you cannot expect from players for a small tournament in this scene. If you want decent and fair matches, you should stick to something known.

Regarding rules: you may look at rules from old tours, here are the basic rules I've used several years ago:
+ Show Spoiler +
The usual rules.
The loser of a match reports his loss here on this page. The report loss button will appear right where the "Register"-button is placed.

- If any of the games should be shoutcasted via Internet radio or such, neither one of the teams are allowed to listen to the shoutcast.
- If this game should to be shoutcasted, both teams have to agree on this.
- Observers are allowed in the game if both players agree to it. The administrator of the tournament is always allowed to observe a game.

WALKOVERS
A walkover will be given if your opponent has not shown up within 15 minutes of the tournament start.

You may leave your computer for a very short while when you are in the middle of the tournament to go to the bathroom or something similar. But be careful, if it takes too long (more than ten minutes or so) you may face a disqualification when you get back. Do not leave the computer during a game! Your opponent is not forced to keep the game paused if you pause it.

LAG
-If you are having lag problems in a match you may try another server or hamachi for that match. You must inform an admin before doing so however.
-If the lag problems are unsolvable an admin will try to determine which one of the players has the problem. If it cannot be determined, there will be a coinflip as a last resort.
-If you have continuous problems in the tournament you will be kicked out of it. It's your responsibility to ensure that your internet is working fine at the given time.

DISCONNECTIONS
- If the disconnection occurs within 3 minutes of the beginning of a game, the match should be restarted.
- If the disconnection occurs after 3 minutes, the players can agree to restart the match. If one of the competitors claims that they had a huge advantage and was going to win, the administrator will take a look at the replay and give his decision. The decision of the administrator is absolute and cannot be overruled. If the decision is that a rematch should be played and a player refuses to play it - he loses instantly.

BUGS AND TRICKS
Allowed
- Lurker hold
- Observer hold on turrets.

Prohibited
- Ally mines
- Sliding CC
- SCV / Dropship bug causing the game to crash
- Any hack or exploit that's normally considered cheating
LML
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-18 01:11:55
September 18 2016 01:00 GMT
#18
On September 18 2016 08:55 SC2John wrote:
I'm not very useful in terms of playing or planning, but I've got plenty of time to kill if you need an admin to help organize the players/casters and collect scores. I did admin work for the SC2 LRSL a few years ago, so I'm pretty comfortable with that sort of thing.

EDIT: I can also write a ruleset if you need help. I wrote a set of rules back in the day for an SC2 team league we were discussing among the guys at TL Strategy.


Thanks for the offer. You are hired :D

I'm currently writing a list of very simple rules as recommended by GeckoXp. I will send them to you as soon as they're ready for proof-reading or in case you want to add something.

It would be great if you could be an admin when the tournament is going on.

Finally are there any reasons against using http://challonge.com/ for the bracket?

On September 18 2016 09:36 LML wrote:
regarding the maps it's probably a better idea to use maps that the players have played on.
With every new map or map that nobody has played in years there is the problem of having to learn walls, strategies, etc., which can be very time consuming. A lot of time that you cannot expect from players for a small tournament in this scene. If you want decent and fair matches, you should stick to something known.

Regarding rules: you may look at rules from old tours, here are the basic rules I've used several years ago:
+ Show Spoiler +
The usual rules.
The loser of a match reports his loss here on this page. The report loss button will appear right where the "Register"-button is placed.

- If any of the games should be shoutcasted via Internet radio or such, neither one of the teams are allowed to listen to the shoutcast.
- If this game should to be shoutcasted, both teams have to agree on this.
- Observers are allowed in the game if both players agree to it. The administrator of the tournament is always allowed to observe a game.

WALKOVERS
A walkover will be given if your opponent has not shown up within 15 minutes of the tournament start.

You may leave your computer for a very short while when you are in the middle of the tournament to go to the bathroom or something similar. But be careful, if it takes too long (more than ten minutes or so) you may face a disqualification when you get back. Do not leave the computer during a game! Your opponent is not forced to keep the game paused if you pause it.

LAG
-If you are having lag problems in a match you may try another server or hamachi for that match. You must inform an admin before doing so however.
-If the lag problems are unsolvable an admin will try to determine which one of the players has the problem. If it cannot be determined, there will be a coinflip as a last resort.
-If you have continuous problems in the tournament you will be kicked out of it. It's your responsibility to ensure that your internet is working fine at the given time.

DISCONNECTIONS
- If the disconnection occurs within 3 minutes of the beginning of a game, the match should be restarted.
- If the disconnection occurs after 3 minutes, the players can agree to restart the match. If one of the competitors claims that they had a huge advantage and was going to win, the administrator will take a look at the replay and give his decision. The decision of the administrator is absolute and cannot be overruled. If the decision is that a rematch should be played and a player refuses to play it - he loses instantly.

BUGS AND TRICKS
Allowed
- Lurker hold
- Observer hold on turrets.

Prohibited
- Ally mines
- Sliding CC
- SCV / Dropship bug causing the game to crash
- Any hack or exploit that's normally considered cheating


I understand. I hope this won't be too big of a problem by inviting C-A players meaning it shouldn't take them too much time to prepare. However, I will take the necessary steps such that it is manageable:

1. If I end up choosing 5 maps for the tournament, 2 or 3 of them will be standard or familiar maps.
2. During the time between the official announcement and the actual tournament, I can possibly with the help of some others create a thread talking about the most common wall-ins, building placements and perhaps even strategies for these special maps.

Furthermore the goal of the tournament is definitely to have fun so it's not necessary to extensively prepare. The people that want to however, are free to do so and will have a bigger chance for winning the prize pool.
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-18 02:14:09
September 18 2016 02:03 GMT
#19
I previously said I would take suggestions in regards to maps and if you find an absolute gem, I will definitely consider it. However, I realize now I already have quite a few maps to choose from so I think the next step is to listen to the potential players.

Here are some polls about which map you would like to see/play during the CrispyCup.

Poll: Which "standard" 4-player map would you like to see in the CrispyCup?

(Vote): Luna (the final)
(Vote): Icarus
(Vote): Avlon
(Vote): Heartbeat
(Vote): Everflow



Map images + Show Spoiler +
Luna the final
[image loading]

Icarus
[image loading]

Avalon
[image loading]

Heartbeat
[image loading]

Everflow
[image loading]



Poll: Which "nonstandard" maps would you like to see?

(Vote): Vårens Töväder
(Vote): Silvery waves
(Vote): Quintessence
(Vote): Battle Royal
(Vote): Overwatch (iCCup version)
(Vote): other (please specify in thread)



Map images + Show Spoiler +

Vårens Töväder
[image loading]

Silvery waves
[image loading]

Quintessence
[image loading]

Battle Royal
[image loading]

Overwatch
[image loading]



edit: I failed the polls, they're not multiple choice. I think it's still ok, but does anyone know how to make multiple choice polls?
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
BisuDagger
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Bisutopia19249 Posts
September 18 2016 02:56 GMT
#20
Send me replays and they will get casted sunday or tuesday nights EDT. Those are my available hours for foreign sc casting.
ModeratorFormer Afreeca Starleague Caster: http://afreeca.tv/ASL2ENG2
idegelchik
Profile Joined September 2012
Russian Federation382 Posts
September 18 2016 05:23 GMT
#21
C-A ranks, sorry Eon, u olimpic
Ty2
Profile Blog Joined March 2013
United States1434 Posts
September 18 2016 06:03 GMT
#22
--- Nuked ---
Writer
Bakuryu
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Germany1065 Posts
September 18 2016 07:47 GMT
#23
why not use defiler.ru?
LML
Profile Blog Joined March 2007
Germany1768 Posts
September 18 2016 10:14 GMT
#24
The "standard" maps are all pretty old / imbalanced (like Luna is so heavily positionally imbalanced that the map is a joke, just like lost temple).
Why not use something players have actually played on within the last 12 months?

Also, wasn't Battle Royal removed from ProLeague because it was so imbalanced?
LML
mca64Launcher_
Profile Joined June 2015
Poland629 Posts
September 18 2016 10:37 GMT
#25
Best maps pool ever:

Python
Jade
Neo Aztec
Neo Legacy of Char
Luna the Final
Hall of Valhalla
trutaCz
Profile Joined October 2011
Poland686 Posts
September 18 2016 13:11 GMT
#26
If i had to pick 5 maps for tournament i would choose:
Fighting Spirit
Circuit Breakers
Heartbeat
Bloody Ridge
Blue Storm
yo~.~
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-18 13:52:08
September 18 2016 13:49 GMT
#27
On September 18 2016 16:47 Bakuryu wrote:
why not use defiler.ru?


I'm not familiar with defiler.ru and it adds an extra step of communication to organize the bracket. But if players prefer it because they are familiar with it, then yes I will use it.


On September 18 2016 19:14 LML wrote:
The "standard" maps are all pretty old / imbalanced (like Luna is so heavily positionally imbalanced that the map is a joke, just like lost temple).
Why not use something players have actually played on within the last 12 months?

Also, wasn't Battle Royal removed from ProLeague because it was so imbalanced?


Well the only maps most players have played on within the last 12 months are Python, Fighting Spirit and Circuit breaker. And Fighting spirit probably takes a commanding position even within that list.

I will include two familiar maps, but not FS or CB so please suggest away!

To summarize:

I think I will start by taking the winning map from both polls. Then I will add 2 standard maps again suggested/chosen by the players, and finally one mystery map from both polls that I would love to see/deserves a chance.

And to ease your mind, I will not force in Battle Royal as explained before.

On September 18 2016 11:56 BisuDagger wrote:
Send me replays and they will get casted sunday or tuesday nights EDT. Those are my available hours for foreign sc casting.


Thank you for the offer BisuDagger. I will get back to you.
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
ortseam
Profile Joined April 2015
996 Posts
September 18 2016 13:49 GMT
#28
One of Triathlon/Outsider would be nice if the players don't mind it
idegelchik
Profile Joined September 2012
Russian Federation382 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-18 17:43:28
September 18 2016 17:39 GMT
#29
tour author hate protoss race, why u pick Avalon, Luna, Icarus?
On avalon any dropship play terran//zerg >>> protoss. Luna.... if protoss born on 11 or 1 - u cant win vs zerg, Icarus bad for P too www.teamliquid.net. verysad, but new tour its good
all last foreign tours won zergs(truta, eon), mb tour author give little chance(help) to p users?
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
September 18 2016 18:59 GMT
#30
On September 19 2016 02:39 idegelchik wrote:
tour author hate protoss race, why u pick Avalon, Luna, Icarus?
On avalon any dropship play terran//zerg >>> protoss. Luna.... if protoss born on 11 or 1 - u cant win vs zerg, Icarus bad for P too www.teamliquid.net. verysad, but new tour its good
all last foreign tours won zergs(truta, eon), mb tour author give little chance(help) to p users?


Yes. Give me some map examples that are better for protoss and I will add them.

If you don't like avalon, luna or icarus, it's important to vote for heartbeat or everflow that might be better for protoss.
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
TelecoM
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States10675 Posts
September 18 2016 22:41 GMT
#31
Sounds fun, would love to participate or help, best of luck!
AKA: TelecoM[WHITE] Protoss fighting
idegelchik
Profile Joined September 2012
Russian Federation382 Posts
September 19 2016 09:11 GMT
#32
B-royal: if u dont like FS, or CB we have popular maps like Blue Stormwww.teamliquid.net, Tau Cross www.teamliquid.net, duel map Polaris Rhapsody www.teamliquid.net, colloseum www.teamliquid.net, Gladiator www.teamliquid.net, Longinus www.teamliquid.net, Outsider www.teamliquid.net.
Glioburd
Profile Joined April 2008
France1911 Posts
September 19 2016 09:21 GMT
#33
Big +1 for Outsider. This map always brings good games.
"You should hate loosing, but you should never fear defeat." NaDa.
Cryoc
Profile Joined July 2011
Germany909 Posts
September 19 2016 10:21 GMT
#34
On September 19 2016 03:59 B-royal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 19 2016 02:39 idegelchik wrote:
tour author hate protoss race, why u pick Avalon, Luna, Icarus?
On avalon any dropship play terran//zerg >>> protoss. Luna.... if protoss born on 11 or 1 - u cant win vs zerg, Icarus bad for P too www.teamliquid.net. verysad, but new tour its good
all last foreign tours won zergs(truta, eon), mb tour author give little chance(help) to p users?


Yes. Give me some map examples that are better for protoss and I will add them.

If you don't like avalon, luna or icarus, it's important to vote for heartbeat or everflow that might be better for protoss.

Central Plains
Katrina
Alternative
http://www.twitch.tv/cryoc
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-19 12:16:47
September 19 2016 12:05 GMT
#35
I will consider outsider and Katrina (SE).



remaining for the map polls. Then I'll make my decisions.
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-19 13:45:46
September 19 2016 13:42 GMT
#36
Also, I'm still looking for admins to help with checking and supervising score reporting, acting as a contact point for questions, hosting games if necessary,...

Please provide your iCCup ID if you're interested.

Most likely the tournament will go through this sunday 25.09.16 or the next sunday 02.10.16.
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
Cele
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Germany4016 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-19 15:20:58
September 19 2016 15:20 GMT
#37
On September 19 2016 22:42 B-royal wrote:
Also, I'm still looking for admins to help with checking and supervising score reporting, acting as a contact point for questions, hosting games if necessary,...

Please provide your iCCup ID if you're interested.

Most likely the tournament will go through this sunday 25.09.16 or the next sunday 02.10.16.


if your date is the 02.10 i can be your tour admin. my credentials:

- Tour Admin experience in 10 tours+

- admin in charge for ICCup Nation League regarding Casts, Sponsors, News

I'd use ICCup Admin powers to (if necessary) moderate, smurf check, announce a Stream on the server.
Broodwar for life!
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
September 19 2016 15:53 GMT
#38
On September 20 2016 00:20 Cele wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 19 2016 22:42 B-royal wrote:
Also, I'm still looking for admins to help with checking and supervising score reporting, acting as a contact point for questions, hosting games if necessary,...

Please provide your iCCup ID if you're interested.

Most likely the tournament will go through this sunday 25.09.16 or the next sunday 02.10.16.


if your date is the 02.10 i can be your tour admin. my credentials:

- Tour Admin experience in 10 tours+

- admin in charge for ICCup Nation League regarding Casts, Sponsors, News

I'd use ICCup Admin powers to (if necessary) moderate, smurf check, announce a Stream on the server.


Thanks for the offer. You're hired :D if it goes through on 02.10.
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
FyRe_DragOn
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
Canada2056 Posts
September 19 2016 19:27 GMT
#39
I wont be able to play a big tour on a sunday but GLHF to all who play, and nice initiative crispy Looking forward to reps/cast
aka DragOn[NaS]
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
September 19 2016 19:53 GMT
#40
On September 20 2016 04:27 FyRe_DragOn wrote:
I wont be able to play a big tour on a sunday but GLHF to all who play, and nice initiative crispy Looking forward to reps/cast


Ah that's unfortunate

Update: great news for the tournament!

Toastus has offered to add 20€ to the prize pool putting the total at 50€!
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
LML
Profile Blog Joined March 2007
Germany1768 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-20 10:55:10
September 20 2016 10:53 GMT
#41
I think 25.09. is on pretty short notice.
I can help most weekends, but 02.10. is a rare exception where I can't. If you don't choose the weekend of 02.10. (for whatever reason) I will be glad to help you out.
As credentials, I've organized and administrated several smaller and bigger tournaments for GosuGamers a couple of years ago.
LML
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
September 20 2016 11:29 GMT
#42
Extra thanks to DiMiaN for making this lovely banner!! Looks fantastic and much more professional

[image loading]

new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
September 20 2016 11:33 GMT
#43
On September 20 2016 19:53 LML wrote:
I think 25.09. is on pretty short notice.
I can help most weekends, but 02.10. is a rare exception where I can't. If you don't choose the weekend of 02.10. (for whatever reason) I will be glad to help you out.
As credentials, I've organized and administrated several smaller and bigger tournaments for GosuGamers a couple of years ago.


Thank you for the offer. Unfortunately the tournament will most likely go through 02.10. But with some luck this can become somewhat of a regular occurrence and in that case you are most welcome to help if you wish to do so!
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
outscar
Profile Joined September 2014
2832 Posts
September 20 2016 11:35 GMT
#44
Aw, another lovely banner! Looks like Avalon and Overwatch are favourites. Hope seeing exciting games. Have fun guys, unfortunately I suck to be part of this
sunbeams are never made like me...
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
September 20 2016 12:25 GMT
#45
On September 20 2016 20:35 outscar wrote:
Aw, another lovely banner! Looks like Avalon and Overwatch are favourites. Hope seeing exciting games. Have fun guys, unfortunately I suck to be part of this


What rank are you currently? Maybe I can help you get C-/C before 02.10
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
Wrath
Profile Blog Joined July 2014
3174 Posts
September 20 2016 12:41 GMT
#46
Man it has been ages since I last played you man.
outscar
Profile Joined September 2014
2832 Posts
September 20 2016 13:04 GMT
#47
On September 20 2016 21:25 B-royal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 20 2016 20:35 outscar wrote:
Aw, another lovely banner! Looks like Avalon and Overwatch are favourites. Hope seeing exciting games. Have fun guys, unfortunately I suck to be part of this


What rank are you currently? Maybe I can help you get C-/C before 02.10


Thanks for offer. I will contact you for some games when I'll get ladder to my hands. GLHF
sunbeams are never made like me...
Atom[Bomb]
Profile Joined July 2015
Sweden108 Posts
September 20 2016 13:31 GMT
#48
Do we have a final verdict on the map selection?
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-20 14:15:27
September 20 2016 14:08 GMT
#49
Yes.

The winners of the polls were:

- Avalon
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


- Overwatch (foreigner)
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


2 "standard" maps:

- outsider (as suggested by idelgechik and others)
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


- colosseum
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


2 mystery maps:

- Hearbeat
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


- Silvery waves
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


This gives a nice variety of 2-, 3- and 4-player maps.

The map order in Bests of is currently:

avalon -> overwatch -> silvery waves -> Heartbeat -> outsider -> colosseum

I hope players will enjoy playing on these maps. And I hope the viewers will enjoy seeing this "weird" map pool in action.

Finally, I urge everyone to voice their concerns in case the map pool or order is blatantly in favor of a specific race to allow me to make changes if deemed necessary.
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
ArmadA[NaS]
Profile Joined January 2014
United States347 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-20 14:43:16
September 20 2016 14:42 GMT
#50
So is it just like first 32 ppl to join or highest ranked 32? I'd gladly join if there weren't enough slots, but don't want to take a spot from someone actually good
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
September 20 2016 14:55 GMT
#51
First 32 so if you get all of your friends, you can fill up the league before trutacz, eon,.. join :D
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-20 16:49:11
September 20 2016 15:19 GMT
#52
Update: More awesome news.

Atom[Bomb] has offered to add 45€ to the prize pool!

new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
LML
Profile Blog Joined March 2007
Germany1768 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-20 15:22:51
September 20 2016 15:21 GMT
#53
Maybe only set the starting map for each round. and in a best of simply have the loser choose the next map (from the map pool of course) with no map being allowed to be played twice
LML
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-20 15:40:02
September 20 2016 15:39 GMT
#54
On September 21 2016 00:21 LML wrote:
Maybe only set the starting map for each round. and in a best of simply have the loser choose the next map (from the map pool of course) with no map being allowed to be played twice


Good suggestion.

I had intended on one more rule but forgot to add it. Each round starts with the corresponding map in the sequence f.e.

avalon => round 1
overwatch => round 2
silvery waves => round 3
...

And then in bests of they have to follow the set sequence of maps. I'm a bit afraid that in case we let people decide the maps in series we might not even see particular maps unless we get lucky with a long series.
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
trutaCz
Profile Joined October 2011
Poland686 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-20 15:53:14
September 20 2016 15:39 GMT
#55
Make it unlimitied! (rank,number of players), there is no point to limit the players and as we have more its always better. Why we need to make limits while BW scene is so small anyway

Once everything with setting up is done i recommend to either re edit OP and make it clear or just make new topic in tournaments, cause its starts to be a bit unclearly
yo~.~
LML
Profile Blog Joined March 2007
Germany1768 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-20 17:49:07
September 20 2016 16:00 GMT
#56
with more players (more rounds) the amount of time spent in the tournament for the top players + administrators rises
LML
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
September 20 2016 16:15 GMT
#57
In an ideal world I would indeed make a D-A tournament with an unlimited amount of players but:

- it's double elimination

- and with 32 players

For 32 players this means 6 rounds of (2*Bo1, 2*Bo3, 1*Bo5, 1*Bo7), which might already take 3-4 hours.

For now I'll keep it at 32 players, but depending on the size of the waiting list I could try to change the size limit if that's still possible then.

And I'm in the process of making the official announcement post and registration.
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
trutaCz
Profile Joined October 2011
Poland686 Posts
September 20 2016 16:28 GMT
#58
Ah its double elimiaton, didnt see that, nvm then.
yo~.~
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-20 17:42:14
September 20 2016 17:18 GMT
#59
Official announcement here:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/bw-tournaments/514148-c-a-foreigner-tournament-crispy-cup#1

Can anyone help me with making a thread on reddit? When I try to make a link thread I can only choose between the banner or a link to the teamliquid thread. However, I see plenty of threads on the front page that have an image and link directly to a different website or thread.

edit: We have currently 4 admins myself included. If anyone else is still interested and is free on sunday 02.10 starting from 17.00 CEST, please contact me.

If anyone is interested in making a liquipedia page or helping me make one afterwards please contact me as well.
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
DarkNetHunter
Profile Joined October 2012
1224 Posts
September 20 2016 17:40 GMT
#60
Tournament looks neat, love the banner haha

I'm glad Overwatch got included as a map.
Avalon has cool features, I just wish someone would remake it without snow tileset for the eyes :p

Outsider as standard map.. is kind of a joke, unless Draw/Dragon play I predict 0 PvZ wins on it (from equal level opponents of course)

Colo and Heartbeat are good choices.

Silvery Waves looks very cool, but not being part of ICCup Mappack may make practicing it difficult.






Learn from the mistakes of others. You can't live long enough to make them all yourself.
FlaShFTW
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States10184 Posts
September 20 2016 17:47 GMT
#61
On September 18 2016 11:56 BisuDagger wrote:
Send me replays and they will get casted sunday or tuesday nights EDT. Those are my available hours for foreign sc casting.

m-me too senpai?
Writer#1 KT and FlaSh Fanboy || Woo Jung Ho Never Forget || Teamliquid Political Decision Desk
TL+ Member
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-09-20 17:49:17
September 20 2016 17:48 GMT
#62
@DarkNetHunter Thanks! A protoss player requested outsider though.
Maybe idegelchik will surprise you
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
BisuDagger
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Bisutopia19249 Posts
September 21 2016 14:45 GMT
#63
On September 21 2016 02:47 FlaShFTW wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 18 2016 11:56 BisuDagger wrote:
Send me replays and they will get casted sunday or tuesday nights EDT. Those are my available hours for foreign sc casting.

m-me too senpai?

I'll give you a heads up and we can cast together if you're available when I am. xD
ModeratorFormer Afreeca Starleague Caster: http://afreeca.tv/ASL2ENG2
B-royal
Profile Joined May 2015
Belgium1330 Posts
September 27 2016 00:28 GMT
#64
Public announcement: We're getting closer to the tournament date. None of the tournament favourites are practicing the new maps so it is definitely possible to cause an upset

Still room for 6 more people as well so sign up!!

More information see the official Crispy Cup thread.


I'll also be using this thread to gather feedback after the tournament and to listen to suggestions. If you already want to share something, please do so.
new BW-player (~E rank fish) twitch.tv/crispydrone || What plays 500 games a season but can't get better? => http://imgur.com/a/pLzf9 <= ||
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