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Torpedo.Vegas
United States1890 Posts
On November 27 2011 19:03 _Quasar_ wrote: ROFL. Where is your SC2 now.  *TROLLFACE* Proleague FTW! I saw the games yesterday - and all is right with the world! SC2 good, but when I see SCBW, SC2 seems sooooooo irrelevant.  All over the world...*pityface*.... | ||
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ShadeR
Australia7535 Posts
On November 27 2011 19:03 _Quasar_ wrote: ROFL. Where is your SC2 now. *TROLLFACE* Proleague FTW! I saw the games yesterday - and all is right with the world! SC2 good, but when I see SCBW, SC2 seems sooooooo irrelevant. BW is like eating at a nice restaurant as opposed to fast food =] | ||
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Ribbon
United States5278 Posts
It didn't happen, and it was never going to. It was a fake-out to make people happy that they were getting rid of the Ace Match, because at least it's all BW. | ||
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xBillehx
United States1289 Posts
On November 28 2011 11:33 Ribbon wrote: Can OP edit the first post to simply say "no"? It didn't happen, and it was never going to. It was a fake-out to make people happy that they were getting rid of the Ace Match, because at least it's all BW. Why? OP says mid-season if it does happen and PL just started. (Coincidentally also split in half.) From the OP: If Starcraft 2 does happen to be introduced into the Proleague, it may be introduced towards the middle of the 2011-2012 season. Terrible bump though since there's nothing new on the subject. | ||
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Ribbon
United States5278 Posts
On November 28 2011 12:00 xBillehx wrote: Why? OP says mid-season if it does happen and PL just started. (Coincidentally also split in half.) Because, if the BW teams (which pay way better) are switching to SC2, even on the side, why would any BW pro, even one who wanted to switch, join an SC2 team where they all live in a trashcan like a communal Oscar the Grouch? If the BW teams take on SC2 divisions, they'll destroy the current Korean SC2 teams, so any time a BW player joins an SC2 team, it means they think the switch isn't happening, right? I know MBCHero disbanded, but if Hyun believed the pro BW teams would switch to SC2 or take on SC2 divisions, I'm pretty sure he could join another BW team and play BW while that happened. He might not get paid what he made on MBC, but he'd get paid, which Korean SC2 players generally don't. He's Top 30 KeSPA rank as of last month, he could find a team. Instead, he joined TSL, which makes zero sense unless you assume that BW teams are playing BW for the foreseeable future (or Hyun believes SKT1 etc would fail at SC2, which is a strange thing to believe). If KeSPA is interested in an "SC2 proleague", then I'm pretty sure it's just "running/broadcasting GSTL", and not converting the BW teams into SC2 teams which would make 18 SC2 teams in Korea, and that's fucking silly. It can barely support the 10 it has. | ||
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Ryo
8787 Posts
On November 28 2011 13:41 Ribbon wrote: Because, if the BW teams (which pay way better) are switching to SC2, even on the side, why would any BW pro, even one who wanted to switch, join an SC2 team where they all live in a trashcan like a communal Oscar the Grouch? If the BW teams take on SC2 divisions, they'll destroy the current Korean SC2 teams, so any time a BW player joins an SC2 team, it means they think the switch isn't happening, right? I know MBCHero disbanded, but if Hyun believed the pro BW teams would switch to SC2 or take on SC2 divisions, I'm pretty sure he could join another BW team and play BW while that happened. He might not get paid what he made on MBC, but he'd get paid, which Korean SC2 players generally don't. He's Top 30 KeSPA rank as of last month, he could find a team. Instead, he joined TSL, which makes zero sense unless you assume that BW teams are playing BW for the foreseeable future (or Hyun believes SKT1 etc would fail at SC2, which is a strange thing to believe). If KeSPA is interested in an "SC2 proleague", then I'm pretty sure it's just "running/broadcasting GSTL", and not converting the BW teams into SC2 teams which would make 18 SC2 teams in Korea, and that's fucking silly. It can barely support the 10 it has. Hyun is not a good example. Edit: In any case, it's hard to tell what KeSPA will do. There's been no new information on this since the OP was created so everyone pls just let this discussion rest. | ||
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Golgotha
Korea (South)8418 Posts
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Ribbon
United States5278 Posts
I feel like we're getting close to off-topic, but may I ask why not? I'm of the opinion that, why lame, every time a BW players joins an SC2 team, it means that the BW teams are that much less likely to switch or play both. | ||
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Torpedo.Vegas
United States1890 Posts
On November 28 2011 13:52 Ribbon wrote: I feel like we're getting close to off-topic, but may I ask why not? I'm of the opinion that, why lame, every time a BW players joins an SC2 team, it means that the BW teams are that much less likely to switch or play both. That doesn't make sense to me. The teams would probably go where the money is rather then let the team die for some fan biased reason. If SC2 proved stable enough financially and in a metagame sense, they would at least host a branch team. | ||
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Ryo
8787 Posts
On November 28 2011 13:52 Ribbon wrote: I feel like we're getting close to off-topic, but may I ask why not? I'm of the opinion that, why lame, every time a BW players joins an SC2 team, it means that the BW teams are that much less likely to switch or play both. Hyun is not a good example because you were making the assumption that ANY team wanted him at all, even at a reduced salary. He's a veteran who had a poor last season and a reputation for being inconsistent. Why pay 10-20k for him when you can get any one of the promising young zerg rookies almost for free. Edit: The only team that really needed experienced zergs was Khan. And they picked up Roro and Shine. STX picked up the MBC rookie Check, whom imo, given some time will be a much better player than Hyun. This is my last post in this thread. I don't want to keep bumping it up. | ||
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gds
Iceland1391 Posts
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StarStruck
25339 Posts
BW salaries for players are still much, much better than that of the SC2 Korean teams. Now, it's not so straightforward with all the mergers between the International teams. Before, it came down to giving the player's accommodations, food, team uniforms and the equipment to play now this line is a bit more gray because those teams affected by the mergers are getting salary too. | ||
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dartoo
India2889 Posts
On November 29 2011 03:19 gds wrote: Is that true that sc2 teams are living in a trash-like environment and are not generally getting paid? or it's just Ribbon exaggerating the situation? I dont know about the thrash can environments, but EG certainly has a nice house.SlayerS is quite okay too, the lesser teams obviously have smaller environments. And yeah not all of them get a salary. You can see for yourself + Show Spoiler + IM EG OgS SlayerS | ||
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babylon
8765 Posts
On November 29 2011 03:19 gds wrote: Is that true that sc2 teams are living in a trash-like environment and are not generally getting paid? or it's just Ribbon exaggerating the situation? He's exaggerating. It's not "trash-like" for every single team like he's implying, especially those involved with foreign teams. And even for those who aren't involved, it's hardly terrible. For instance, TSL is one of the few teams that actually does give out salaries despite not being in a partnership. I mean, if you're a B-teamer on a SC2 team, you're probably not making much, if anything, at all, but that's hardly different compared to B-teamers in BW. Put it this way: top players in BW make more than top players in SC2, but underneath that top tier, I doubt it's much different. Insofar as salaries go for top Korean players in SC2, they don't break six figures unless you're on a foreign team, but a few of them do have individual sponsorships in addition to whatever they get paid by their teams (e.g. MVP, NesTea, & Bomber as the confirmed ones, wouldn't be surprised to see someone sponsor Leenock if he wins this GSL). For teams, off the top of my head, and the notable players who've shown results in individual leagues and/or have star power: - IM: partnered with Quantic, plenty of sponsors. (MVP, NesTea, LosirA, Happy.) - MVP: partnered with coL. (The GSTL King himself, DRG, and sC.) - oGs: partnered with TL, plenty of sponsors. (MC, NaDa, fOrGG, Supernova.) - SlayerS: plenty of sponsors, partnership with EG atm. (So many Terrans. And Boxer.) - ST: plenty of sponsors -- so much so that I think they have a LoL team now too? (Bomber, Curious, July, Rainbow. Some of their B-teamers are starting to show good results lately too.) - TSL: decent number of sponsors, small team makes it so that the players do get salaries. If I remember correctly, they paid ~30k a year to their top players. (Polt, aLive, Hyun.) - fOu (now FXO): swallowed by FXO, which is rich. (Leenock, Oz.) - NSHS: sponsored by a university. (Sage, Jjakji, Tassadar.) - Prime: partnered with WE, has a hard time keeping sponsors, bleeding players. (MKP.) - ZeNEX: bleeding players. (Line ...?) The last two (bolded) are the ones I expect to fold soon if they don't show some amazing results and/or pick up someone with serious star power. The others are fine, IMO, and are well-off enough to give their top players salaries, with maybe the exception of NSHS, but I have no idea how their university sponsorship works. | ||
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ppshchik
United States862 Posts
On November 27 2011 17:17 MountainDewJunkie wrote: SC2 fans should pray that proleague does well and stays with BW for at least this full year (both seasons), because I'm putting money down that the inflow of S-class and A-class players switching to SC2 will not only destroy today's SC2 top players (former BW scrubs such as MVP, Iron(aka MC), ZERGBONG (Nestea), the fallen Nada and Boxer), but could bridge the gap significantly between foreigners and koreans, much like in brood war. It's not like the A / S class BW progamers will dominate RIGHT AWAY as you imply. Took MVP quite a while, not to mention that his TvP is atrocious since TvP in SC2 is bio based whilst BW TvP is mech based so MVP needed time to adapt. It will probably take Flash 3 months of SC2 practice to take games off Incontrol about 1 year to take games off IdrA. and probably about 1 year and a half to take games off IMMVP. Just my 2 cents... | ||
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hydrogg
United States377 Posts
That doesn't make sense to me. The teams would probably go where the money is rather then let the team die for some fan biased reason. If SC2 proved stable enough financially and in a metagame sense, they would at least host a branch team. Having a branch team isn't the same as SC2 proleague. WeMade Fox had a counter strike team. A lot of the other teams had Warcraft 3 players. That didn't mean that there was a counter strike or warcraft 3 proleague. However the proleague site has Special Forces, Brood War, and another game which is still unknown. http://www.e-sports.or.kr/ | ||
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N.geNuity
United States5111 Posts
On November 29 2011 05:47 ppshchik wrote: It's not like the A / S class BW progamers will dominate RIGHT AWAY as you imply. Took MVP quite a while, not to mention that his TvP is atrocious since TvP in SC2 is bio based whilst BW TvP is mech based so MVP needed time to adapt. It will probably take Flash 3 months of SC2 practice to take games off Incontrol about 1 year to take games off IdrA. and probably about 1 year and a half to take games off IMMVP. Just my 2 cents... you're cute. also, mvp won season 1 of code S so I feel that's a pretty good result pretty quickly. hardly "quite a while". | ||
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Megaliskuu
United States5123 Posts
Should be closed. | ||
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StarStruck
25339 Posts
1 year to take a game off IdrA? He cannot be serious. | ||
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babylon
8765 Posts
On November 29 2011 06:17 N.geNuity wrote: you're cute. also, mvp won season 1 of code S so I feel that's a pretty good result pretty quickly. hardly "quite a while". To be fair, everyone was godawful back then. But yeah, one year to take games off IdrA? Hahahaha. And Flash could probably beat Incontrol (bless his soul) in one month if he really sat down and practiced SC2. | ||
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