• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 09:10
CEST 15:10
KST 22:10
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End9Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2915Serral wins Maestros of the Game 244
Community News
Weekly Cups (Aug 30-Sep 7): herO thrives amid growing schism10Official StarCraft website teases new content ahead of BlizzCon?131Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20)9Weekly Cups (August 24-30): Patches' balance mod takes over3New 3v3 BGH Ladder (and more) on ShieldBattery!46
StarCraft 2
General
Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners Weekly Cups (Aug 30-Sep 7): herO thrives amid growing schism SC4ALL: II Winner will earn a spot at HSC 30! SC4ALL II: StarCraft 2 Player Announcement 7/8
Tourneys
RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22 KSL Week #92 IntoTheTV X SOOP SC2 League : Weekly & Monthly 2026 GSTL Announcement Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
Mutation # 542 The Ascended Mutation # 541 Binary Choice The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 540 Dodge This
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Practice Partners (Official) Broodwar Prediction Market Official StarCraft website teases new content ahead of BlizzCon? [D] Brainstorming a balance patch for Brood war
Tourneys
[ASL22] Ro16 Group A [ASL22] Ro16 Group B Escore Tournament - Season 3 Small VOD Thread 2.0
Strategy
Replay Review Process - What do you do? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation Game Theory for Starcraft
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread EVE Corporation Diablo IV [Maplestory Hardcore] Let's Play~!! General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish TSM pausing esports and CLG Dead
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Trading/Investing Thread
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The Creator Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion!
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Northern Ireland Global Starcraft
Blogs
Virtual Romance, Real-Life C…
TrAiDoS
Regacy Esports:Our Goa…
regacyesports
Dreaming of BW patches (mod…
c3rberUs
LOCKPICKING NOOB
LUCKY_NOOB
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 6326 users

Who were/are the best foreign sc1 players?

Forum Index > BW General
Post a Reply
1 2 3 4 5 10 11 12 Next All
Rasky
Profile Joined July 2010
United States406 Posts
December 16 2010 21:54 GMT
#1
I'm not too familiar with the sc1 scene I know a bit about sc2 and I who a bit about the foreign sc2 players and where they are from.. Now my question is who were/are the best sc1 players outside South Korea?
MisteR
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Netherlands595 Posts
December 16 2010 21:57 GMT
#2
So... You want the best sc1 players who never played in Korea? So no Grrrr but yes Whitera?
Nal_Ra/Much/Horang2/Flying fighting!~
Rasky
Profile Joined July 2010
United States406 Posts
December 16 2010 22:02 GMT
#3
o come on there has to be more than that I know Idra played he's pretty good.
Simplistik
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
2171 Posts
December 16 2010 22:02 GMT
#4
Mondragon was pretty good.
Dear BW Gods, it IS now autumn, so...
SubtleArt
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
2710 Posts
December 16 2010 22:03 GMT
#5
Well relative to Koreans they were all horrible, and 99% of WCG games between Koreans and non koreas were total blowouts, so keep in mind this is all relative.

PJ was perhaps the most skilled non-korean. He's retired now, but he was the best chinese player and even took games off players like Bisu and Savior at WCG.

Idra has been regarded as the best foreigner in the west, if you will. He spent 3 years on the CJ Entus team but didn't get any televised games. Won a lot of foreigner tourneys and even knocked out Tossgirl in qualifiers once.

Nony was on Estro for a bit, and he's also seen as a really talented foreigner and rival to Idra.

Ret, same thing as nony. Ret joined Estro but it didn't really work out too well. Won quite a few foreigner tourneys also and almost always placed fairly high.

That's all I can think of, the rest are pretty unremarkable. Theres Grrr and Elky of course, but I didn't watch sc back then so I cant comment
Morrow on ZvP: "I'm not very confident in general vs Protoss because of the imbalance (Yes its imbalanced, get over it)."
qwaykee
Profile Joined February 2010
Norway268 Posts
December 16 2010 22:04 GMT
#6
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/2009_Pokerstrategy.com_TSL
zobz
Profile Joined November 2005
Canada2175 Posts
December 16 2010 22:58 GMT
#7
There were a few non-Korean players who were pretty much equal with or better than your average pro b-teamer, when they were in proper shape. Players like mondragon from Germany, testie from Canada, androide from Russia. There were some foreigners with really impressive mechanics/strategic ability. Guys who when they met one of the progamers in the WCG finals had good reason to believe they could win, and often did put up a really good fight.
"That's not gonna be good for business." "That's not gonna be good for anybody."
TRAP[yoo]
Profile Joined December 2009
Hungary6026 Posts
December 16 2010 23:05 GMT
#8
mondragon was pretty good. he won against savior once...i think
FTD
mustaju
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Estonia4505 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-16 23:11:58
December 16 2010 23:11 GMT
#9
(T)Androide was pretty good.
WriterBrows somewhat high. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndFysO2JunE
lungo
Profile Joined October 2005
Denmark276 Posts
December 16 2010 23:14 GMT
#10
Grrr for winning OSL
Elky for being the latest foreigner to be on the kespa top30list
Mondi for his many year domination
PJ for his godly pvt
LX was good
SEn also dominated for a while
Legionaire from AUS, probaly being the latest foreigner top play a kespa television match?
Idra was probably the best player in the end of the SC era (since sc2 came out)
Ret and nony were / are good
i liked JF as well
as Arnold said: you have been erased! but dont worry!
SkelA
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
Macedonia13086 Posts
December 16 2010 23:20 GMT
#11
Mondragon, Testie, Draco, Sen, Androide, PJ, Legend, F91 are ppl that are poping right now on my mind as the players in the "golden" years of BW.

White-ra, Nony, Ret, Idra as the dominant players in the last active year of BW.

And my favorite player when i started with SC was Brat_Tsunami. Man that guy was damn impressive for like 80-100 apm zerg. His SC guide and his reppack was the first thing I read and watched for some basic BW knowledge.
Stork and KHAN fan till 2012 ...
Shiragaku
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Hong Kong4308 Posts
December 16 2010 23:28 GMT
#12
PJ is the best foreigner of all time in my opinion. He knocked out Savior, took a game off a Bisu, and his play was similar to an A team player.
PH
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
United States6173 Posts
December 16 2010 23:38 GMT
#13
I'm not too familiar with players in the earlier stages of BW.

Personally, though, I think Nony had the most potential out of all the foreign players by far. When in form he was utterly amazing. I think if he'd stuck to it he could have easily been very successful in BW. I think he made the smarter decision in leaving Korea for his life overall, though.

Further, I think Ret had more potential than Idra, and Idra was, to me, a huge disappointment after having been in Korea for so long. His play really started becoming solid towards the end of his BW career but it still saddens me we never even saw him take Courage. I find it very sad how Ret's first stay in Korea ended up and am embarrassed for Korea because of it if what I've gathered is correct.

Koll (everyone seems to have completely forgotten him lol) really surprised the scene when he took games off of progamers at a WCG with some pretty solid play. If he really was the more solid mechanically-based player he was hyped to be, then he would've had quite a bit of potential as well.

Aside from that, there were a ton of good players. White-Ra was always one of my favorites, as well as the foreign hero Mondragon, a lot of the Chinese players, I always really liked Brat_ok's play as well, for whatever reason.

The biggest thing missing from most foreigners in their play was that base mechanical foundation. This is something that can only come from lots and lots of dedicated practice and the beating out of some bad habits. Beyond that, though, some simply flat out do have more potential than others. That said, I'll go out on a limb and once again say Nony had the most potential by far and very nearly was the best.
Hello
Assuton
Profile Joined November 2010
United States28 Posts
December 16 2010 23:47 GMT
#14
Most of the best foreigners from sc1 switched to sc2.
ssregi-
Profile Joined December 2010
Korea (South)146 Posts
December 16 2010 23:52 GMT
#15
Idra
The best
NeVeR GiVeUp !~~
Xxio
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Canada5565 Posts
December 16 2010 23:54 GMT
#16
Don't forget about Fenix!
KTY
chenchen
Profile Joined November 2010
United States1136 Posts
December 16 2010 23:57 GMT
#17
As far as I know, China was the only country outside of Korea that had a full fledge pro Starcraft scene with progamer houses, sponsors, etc (at least according to Ret and Incontrol)

PJ, possibly the strongest Chinese player, beat savior during savior's reign as bonjwa. I think that's something only a handful of top Koreans could do at that time.

As for westerners, I think IdrA-Ret-Nony were considered to be the best.
powerade = dragoon blood
IAttackYou
Profile Joined August 2010
United States330 Posts
December 16 2010 23:58 GMT
#18
there were plenty of really strong foreigners in WCG before the whole money thing korea took over. Mondragon, Grrrr really really strong players.
I'm not a nub, I'm gosu of tomorrow
blahman3344
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States2015 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-17 00:08:04
December 17 2010 00:06 GMT
#19
I'd say that people who went to play in Korea are all pretty good, like Grrrr, Idra, Nony, ret, etc.

though If I had to limit it to skill level prior to release of SC2 per race, I'd say:
Terran: Grack
Toss: NonY
Zerg: Mondragon
I like haikus and / I can not lie. You other / brothers can't deny
blahman3344
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States2015 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-17 00:07:43
December 17 2010 00:07 GMT
#20
meant to edit, not quote >.<
I like haikus and / I can not lie. You other / brothers can't deny
1 2 3 4 5 10 11 12 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
WardiTV Invitational
11:00
Pre Blizzcon Cup
Cure vs Zoun
SHIN vs TBD
ByuN vs MaxPax
Percival vs YoungYakovLIVE!
WardiTV1042
IntoTheiNu 1023
IndyStarCraft 168
Rex123
Liquipedia
CranKy Ducklings
10:00
Sea Duckling Open #149
CranKy Ducklings98
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Lowko440
IndyStarCraft 168
Rex 123
BRAT_OK 80
SHIN 26
MindelVK 22
Railgan 22
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 39336
Calm 12250
Leta 896
Pusan 574
Mini 364
Soma 247
Stork 213
firebathero 210
EffOrt 167
Last 141
[ Show more ]
Barracks 106
Rush 102
910 77
ZerO 70
Killer 64
sorry 57
Mong 56
Yoon 54
Free 28
soO 25
Hm[arnc] 18
SilentControl 15
yabsab 10
scan(afreeca) 6
Noble 4
Icarus 3
Dota 2
qojqva1892
Dendi1558
ODPixel296
syndereN282
LuMiX0
Other Games
singsing1930
Pyrionflax390
crisheroes341
DeMusliM269
mouzStarbuck244
Hui .235
KnowMe112
XaKoH 19
ZerO(Twitch)17
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 17
lovetv 10
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP8
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• FirePhoenix5
• Michael_bg 5
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 2501
League of Legends
• Jankos1679
• Nemesis1148
Upcoming Events
AI Arena Tournament
3h 50m
OSC
7h 20m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
20h 50m
WardiTV Invitational
21h 50m
Shopify Rebellion Sundays
1d 1h
Spirit vs Mixu
Clem vs TBD
RSL Revival
1d 2h
Serral vs Rogue
BlizzCon
1d 5h
IdrA vs MC
Replay Cast
1d 10h
Afreeca Starleague
1d 20h
Light vs JyJ
Soulkey vs hero
WardiTV Weekly
1d 21h
[ Show More ]
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Snow vs Shinee
Shine vs EffOrt
GSL
2 days
PiGosaur Cup
3 days
The PondCast
3 days
Kung Fu Cup
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
KCM Race Survival
4 days
IntoTheTV X SOOP
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
IntoTheTV X SOOP
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
GSL
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #5 - TRS
PiG Sty Festival 8.0
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
K-JUNGMAN
ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
RSL Revival: Season 6
Calamity Invitational
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026

Upcoming

Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Acropolis #5 - GSA
Acropolis #5 - GSB
Acropolis #5 - GSC
SC4ALL II: Brood War
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.