Yeah, the D- players were really bad. The Terran in the first video had a terrible build order and then got ran over. In the second D- video, the Protoss put no pressure on the bot and then got ran over. Based on the replays, I would say the bot is currently around 800 (D-) on ICCup. Not quite D level, but capable of beating D- players.

Alur

Denmark3900 Posts

December 13 2009 18:42 GMT

#63

On December 14 2009 02:21 Zoler wrote:

Show nested quote +

lol did he say "HACK" ? XD

Well, that actually wouldn't be untrue.

Traveler

United States451 Posts

December 14 2009 16:13 GMT

#64

I feel like you could start adding multiple build orders for different AI's, and then make it so that upon scouting certain tech choices the build would change in order to accommodate something like lurkers in PvZ where you need to get obs out in order to deal with them...

However when you add in the micro part of the AI I believe it becomes unfair to deal with as a human so some sort of micro APM cap could be placed on them and then they would become a sufficient training tool to get better against.

Anyways on the comment that the Bot is about 800 or so, I'd say that's a fairly accurate statement, I mean sure we would find D- players that could beat it, but no D player 1500 or so is ever going to get beaten by this thing. I mean the D- toss in the second video has like pure zealot no tech against M+V+T which just destroys all those zeals...

Plus anyone that knows they are playing against a bot can beat it... I would just tech straight to DT's after pressuring with goons... also the AI freaks out when your choke is blocked and they can't see up it.

spinesheath

Germany8679 Posts

December 14 2009 16:35 GMT

#65

On December 15 2009 01:13 Traveler wrote:
I feel like you could start adding multiple build orders for different AI's, and then make it so that upon scouting certain tech choices the build would change in order to accommodate something like lurkers in PvZ where you need to get obs out in order to deal with them...

However when you add in the micro part of the AI I believe it becomes unfair to deal with as a human so some sort of micro APM cap could be placed on them and then they would become a sufficient training tool to get better against.

Anyways on the comment that the Bot is about 800 or so, I'd say that's a fairly accurate statement, I mean sure we would find D- players that could beat it, but no D player 1500 or so is ever going to get beaten by this thing. I mean the D- toss in the second video has like pure zealot no tech against M+V+T which just destroys all those zeals...

Plus anyone that knows they are playing against a bot can beat it... I would just tech straight to DT's after pressuring with goons... also the AI freaks out when your choke is blocked and they can't see up it.

An APM cap would inevitably lead to very weak AIs. Current AIs aren't extremely good at strategy, especially with limited information and a very rigid time constraint. Having to decide how to use a limited APM effectively would be another hard task to accomplish.
Anyways, the whole point of those AIs is to create one that is better than humans and/or other AIs. It wouldn't make sense to intentionally make it weaker. You can always do that afterwards if you really need to.

oisin

Canada6 Posts

December 15 2009 00:32 GMT

#66

On December 13 2009 18:30 SWPIGWANG wrote:
I think the best way to build a strong game AI in starcraft is to first divide the game up into sub problems (eg. muta vs marines), attempt to figure out which ones can be solved and design AI build orders in things that is good in while avoiding those that it can not cope with.

That results in some very rigid behaviour, though. And for larger problems it may become extremely difficult to map out all the possibilities. I disagree with the idea that bots should be programmed with build orders - it would be far more useful to find generic methods that allow the bot to adapt in a wide range of situations.

On a different topic, djsherman, do you think you would recognize flaws faster if you told the player they were playing against a bot?

Traveler

United States451 Posts

January 12 2010 06:56 GMT

#67

Thread Resurrect.

Anyways are there any more recent videos? I mean this stuff is great and it can't have just disappeared.

Glaucus

479 Posts

January 12 2010 07:13 GMT

#68

I think that T bot in that vs C- zerg video plays very odd. It can't even macro off one base it seems. It just has to not try doing a good strategy and then exploit superhuman mechanics.

Ive played against another BWAPI bot and that bot just kept making depots and units and just runs your over with perfect macro.

I guess you are just less far than that bot. The bot I played could get good building placement on any map. And if an SCV would get stuck it would realize that and use a new SCV. It could also somehow break down any map in pathways.

love1another

United States1844 Posts

January 12 2010 07:37 GMT

#69

Search BWAPI on youtube. There are a lot of new ones, namely better muta vs. scourge patrol micro, and smart muta/scourge vs. muta/scourge.

djsherman

United States140 Posts

January 19 2010 22:29 GMT

#70

Here's some of the debugging tools for my bot:
http://users.soe.ucsc.edu/~bweber/eisbotdebugmode/eisbotdebugmode.html

Low-res Youtube version:

Shield

Bulgaria4824 Posts

January 19 2010 22:53 GMT

#71

The bot lacks a lot, but it's good at micro.

scwizard

United States1195 Posts

January 23 2010 07:06 GMT

#72

On January 12 2010 16:13 Glaucus wrote:
Ive played against another BWAPI bot and that bot just kept making depots and units and just runs your over with perfect macro.

Could you please upload the replay for us?

Game

3191 Posts

January 24 2010 05:26 GMT

#73

-holy shit- I would love to train with some of this stuff.