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never die_Jaedong - Page 4

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Ramsing
Profile Joined July 2007
Canada233 Posts
August 28 2009 13:53 GMT
#61
Supported. Hopefully, in a year or so when sc2 comes out Blizz will completetly take over from Kespa and leave them in the dark.
Tien
Profile Joined January 2003
Russian Federation4447 Posts
August 28 2009 13:56 GMT
#62
On August 28 2009 18:03 Foucault wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 28 2009 16:23 GTR wrote:
Am I the only one here who thinks that Jaedong leaving Starcraft won't be as detrimental as everyone thinks it will?


no I agree lol

People should take a step back and realize that Jaedong isn't progaming. In my view he is nothing special at all, then again I'm an old timer and look back at the 4 kings for inspiration.

Anyways, this thread is dumb. How is Jaedong being treated like shit btw, the guy just won another Starleague and god knows how much money he has made from Starcraft already. It's also funny how no one EVER tries to look for anything good in Kespa. People hop on the "Kespa sucks" bandwagon but I'm not sure if everyone understands why. Do you have any idea how much Kespa has done for Esports??



You're the idiot that thinks 4pool / 9pool rushes is zerg imbalance. Crying about it when Fantasy got his ass handed to him.


GTFO you noob. Your D level iccup oppinion means nothing.
We decide our own destiny
Mortician
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Bulgaria2332 Posts
August 28 2009 14:05 GMT
#63
On August 28 2009 22:56 Tien wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 28 2009 18:03 Foucault wrote:
On August 28 2009 16:23 GTR wrote:
Am I the only one here who thinks that Jaedong leaving Starcraft won't be as detrimental as everyone thinks it will?


no I agree lol

People should take a step back and realize that Jaedong isn't progaming. In my view he is nothing special at all, then again I'm an old timer and look back at the 4 kings for inspiration.

Anyways, this thread is dumb. How is Jaedong being treated like shit btw, the guy just won another Starleague and god knows how much money he has made from Starcraft already. It's also funny how no one EVER tries to look for anything good in Kespa. People hop on the "Kespa sucks" bandwagon but I'm not sure if everyone understands why. Do you have any idea how much Kespa has done for Esports??



You're the idiot that thinks 4pool / 9pool rushes is zerg imbalance. Crying about it when Fantasy got his ass handed to him.


GTFO you noob. Your D level iccup oppinion means nothing.


Now, now, baby, don't get upset
"If anything, the skill cap in sc2 is higher [than sc1] because there are a lot more things you can do at one given time. " darmousseh
Seiuchi
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States931 Posts
August 28 2009 14:06 GMT
#64
On August 28 2009 20:08 dcberkeley wrote:
KeSPA, their rules are really messing up the financial potential of players. Obviously there are negative aspects but if you consider the plus side, it prevents a situation where very few players control massive amounts of money on the scene. Since PL can be won by a player like Jaedong alone, it would result in a situation where only a few players ever make money and teams could potentially lose depth and there wouldn't be teams anymore, just star players with enormous salaries plus some great players who end up being paid very little.

Also, consider that these teams brought in Jae Dong and trained, fed, gave him a place to sleep and develop. It seems natural that KeSPA wants teams to hold on to players they developed and prevent players from switching teams and being loyal to only money. Or else you end up with a different kind of progaming culture where money is king and coaches rotate players in and out all the time, never developing, just buying potential.



Uh...have you missed the fact that we're already in that situation? It's been widely accepted so far, that only a few players command large amounts of money and most play for slave wages or for nothing more than food and board. The reason everyone is upset now is that even the best players are getting abused in the same way.

KeSPA doesn't care about switching teams or being loyal to money, just keeping down costs so they can run a league without spending much money. Which leads to an ethical dilemma as a fan where one might love watching SC and ESPORTS, but hate the fact hundreds of children are being basically abused with nothing in return for our entertainment.
Raidy
Profile Joined March 2009
Japan87 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-08-28 14:44:51
August 28 2009 14:43 GMT
#65
(1) 20 years old may be considered adulthood in the West, but in Korea it isn't. If he were 17 years old and an American nobody would be saying anything about his parents having to sign off on his decision. Don't be ethnocentric.

(2) His parents want what's best for him. Honestly, it's a little insulting for him to be paid 140,000 won while he's better than the guys pulling 300,000 won. I don't think he does it for the money. Every time I've ever seen him play or talk about playing Starcraft I could tell that he does it out of sheer passion. However, his parents have a point that his team is being incredibly cheap. I think his mom stated that he should at least get paid 180,000 won/year, and is that really so ridiculous? He carried a team that's probably overall worse than ACE to the finals.

(3) As far as I can see, a lot of what happened was on Jaedong. He showed no desire to go to any other team, so every other team was probably deathly afraid of picking him up. Think about it. Would you drop THAT MUCH MONEY on a player unless you could expect some significant results? Furthermore, would you expect significant results from a player that just wants to be back on his old team?

(4) KeSPA sucks. KeSPA sucks. KeSPA sucks.

(5) I don't know if leaving Starcraft at this point in time would be a terrible idea for him in the end. If he went to America to study, he could open up a lot of doors. Don't forget that these guys are all incredibly smart; I could easily see him as the world's best surgeon. 450 APM surgery FTW.
NiTenIchiRyu
Profile Joined February 2009
United Kingdom273 Posts
August 28 2009 14:51 GMT
#66
On August 28 2009 23:05 Mortician wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 28 2009 22:56 Tien wrote:
On August 28 2009 18:03 Foucault wrote:
On August 28 2009 16:23 GTR wrote:
Am I the only one here who thinks that Jaedong leaving Starcraft won't be as detrimental as everyone thinks it will?


no I agree lol

People should take a step back and realize that Jaedong isn't progaming. In my view he is nothing special at all, then again I'm an old timer and look back at the 4 kings for inspiration.

Anyways, this thread is dumb. How is Jaedong being treated like shit btw, the guy just won another Starleague and god knows how much money he has made from Starcraft already. It's also funny how no one EVER tries to look for anything good in Kespa. People hop on the "Kespa sucks" bandwagon but I'm not sure if everyone understands why. Do you have any idea how much Kespa has done for Esports??



You're the idiot that thinks 4pool / 9pool rushes is zerg imbalance. Crying about it when Fantasy got his ass handed to him.


GTFO you noob. Your D level iccup oppinion means nothing.


Now, now, baby, don't get upset

If you don't have anything constructive to add to this thread, I suggest you stop posting. Oh wait is that the SKT1 logo ? That explains it lol
toopham
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
United States551 Posts
August 28 2009 14:52 GMT
#67
Is there for TL.net admins to find out who voted "I Disagree"
and ban them all?

DIE!!!
DivinO
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States4796 Posts
August 28 2009 14:54 GMT
#68
I don't think it matters whether Jaedong is leaving or not. I think it's more important that he decides what he wants, including what team he wants to be. He should be given more rights as a player in general, regardless of what team he's on/going to/ what his parents are mad about.
LiquipediaBrain in my filth.
WWJDD
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
India342 Posts
August 28 2009 14:57 GMT
#69
On August 28 2009 16:45 Mortician wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 28 2009 16:36 Harem wrote:
On August 28 2009 16:23 GTR wrote:
Am I the only one here who thinks that Jaedong leaving Starcraft won't be as detrimental as everyone thinks it will?

You also think kpop is a good thing.


pwned

Show nested quote +
On August 28 2009 16:45 Sinedd wrote:
Jaedong cant leave like this , one of the bonjwas leaving like this ? its just seem ... not right .


except...Jaedong is not a bonjwa



You are right. None of the bonjwa's at their peak could even take a game off of jaedong.
WWJDD??
zeppelin
Profile Joined December 2007
United States565 Posts
August 28 2009 15:17 GMT
#70
Without a way to quantify the revenue that starcraft players generate for their sponsors it's hard to say what fair compensation for them is. However, the ownership should not be the primary benefit of the player's work, they should be well-compensated for the value they bring to their team (whatever that is). Without the merchandising, luxury seats, concessions, boost to regional tourism, and all sorts of other benefits major sport athletes get in the US/Europe, it's much more difficult to determine how much the players can actually get paid for esports to be sustainable. Is the replacement of *huge* sponsors like coca-cola and proctor & gamble (pringles) with the likes of bacchus and incruit indicative of a decline in esports? If other players are getting 300M it's entirely possible that the sponsors are willing to take a financial loss in the short term in the hopes that such a salary becomes undervalued by the time the contract ends.
oneofthem
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
August 28 2009 15:29 GMT
#71
On August 28 2009 16:36 Harem wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 28 2009 16:23 GTR wrote:
Am I the only one here who thinks that Jaedong leaving Starcraft won't be as detrimental as everyone thinks it will?

You also think kpop is a good thing.

hahahahaaa
We have fed the heart on fantasies, the heart's grown brutal from the fare, more substance in our enmities than in our love
Xiphos
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Canada7507 Posts
August 28 2009 15:36 GMT
#72
Am I the only one that think JD retiring is good for his future in the long run? If Jaedong comes to america, he might actually influence the american community to start their own StarCraft team.
2014 - ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ Raise your bows brood warriors! ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ
AlTheCake
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Canada1071 Posts
August 28 2009 15:38 GMT
#73
On August 29 2009 00:36 Xiphos wrote:
Am I the only one that think JD retiring is good for his future in the long run? If Jaedong comes to america, he might actually influence the american community to start their own StarCraft team.

No you aren't the only one, as others stated before you the same thing.

I, however, doubt that Jaedong will 'influence' an ameircan company to sponsor a professional Starcraft team.
DamageControL
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States4222 Posts
August 28 2009 16:12 GMT
#74
On August 28 2009 23:57 WWJDD wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 28 2009 16:45 Mortician wrote:
On August 28 2009 16:36 Harem wrote:
On August 28 2009 16:23 GTR wrote:
Am I the only one here who thinks that Jaedong leaving Starcraft won't be as detrimental as everyone thinks it will?

You also think kpop is a good thing.


pwned

On August 28 2009 16:45 Sinedd wrote:
Jaedong cant leave like this , one of the bonjwas leaving like this ? its just seem ... not right .


except...Jaedong is not a bonjwa



You are right. None of the bonjwa's at their peak could even take a game off of jaedong.

First: Bonjwa is a title of dominance, not absolute skill.
Second: Jaedong is a bonjwa. From a Bisu fan. A hardcore bisu fan.

While the competition as to who would emerge the next dominant player was far greater now than it ever was before, Jaedong has truly become the greatest player of his time. Think about his 3 OSL's, and how he didn't have to cross into an era that didn't belong to him to get them. Think about GOM, and how he defeated Bisu in the cross GOM match. Think about his most wins in proleague, and think about where Oz would be without him. And think about this: Would he be a favorite against anyone in the world? Yes.

One can point out that he doesn't "feel" like a bonjwa, or that a bonjwa would have won proleague, or some other half baked response, but the fact is he single handedly pushes his team and Zerg to new levels.

Moreover, even if you agree with nothing else I say, there is not progamer who deserves your respect more than Jaedong does. The work he is willing to put into this to be the Greatest of All Time, when his talent would be enough to make him good is extraordinary, and if anyone deserves a higher salary, it's him.
Liquid | SKT
DamageControL
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States4222 Posts
August 28 2009 16:20 GMT
#75
Also who is pulling 300millwon?
Liquid | SKT
gumbum8
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States721 Posts
August 28 2009 16:37 GMT
#76
I'm a little pissed that 12 people arent supporting this.
No one hates kespa; kespa virtually made E-Sports.
We hate the dumbass decisions they have made regarding this free agency policy, and we all want to change that decision. If kespa can be replaced with something better, so be it.
+ Show Spoiler +
basic example: you are the best horse and buggy maker in the world, but then Henry Ford makes the car. Everyone loves cars, they're the best thing ever, but you keep making horse & buggies. No one wants a horse or buggy anymore, and you dont catch up to the times... and you go out of business. and Ford motors takes over. thats the way it all works.

thats my example of this concept (if you even need it, it's dumb.)
but really, has anyone REALLY been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like?
Sharp-eYe
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Canada642 Posts
August 28 2009 16:43 GMT
#77
On August 28 2009 16:23 GTR wrote:
Am I the only one here who thinks that Jaedong leaving Starcraft won't be as detrimental as everyone thinks it will?

Its not, he is at his prime and sometimes its cool to just leave with such a huge mark on the scene. The thing that worries everyone is that its not his choice. If he was getting paid resonably, and his parents did not intervene, and he decided its enough, then we would all be happy for him. however, nothing is his hands
Are you truly so blinded by your vaunted religion, that you can't see the fall ahead of you? - Zeratul III AKA WikidSik ingame (anygame)
7mk
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Germany10157 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-08-28 16:44:39
August 28 2009 16:43 GMT
#78
On August 28 2009 23:51 NiTenIchiRyu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 28 2009 23:05 Mortician wrote:
On August 28 2009 22:56 Tien wrote:
On August 28 2009 18:03 Foucault wrote:
On August 28 2009 16:23 GTR wrote:
Am I the only one here who thinks that Jaedong leaving Starcraft won't be as detrimental as everyone thinks it will?


no I agree lol

People should take a step back and realize that Jaedong isn't progaming. In my view he is nothing special at all, then again I'm an old timer and look back at the 4 kings for inspiration.

Anyways, this thread is dumb. How is Jaedong being treated like shit btw, the guy just won another Starleague and god knows how much money he has made from Starcraft already. It's also funny how no one EVER tries to look for anything good in Kespa. People hop on the "Kespa sucks" bandwagon but I'm not sure if everyone understands why. Do you have any idea how much Kespa has done for Esports??



You're the idiot that thinks 4pool / 9pool rushes is zerg imbalance. Crying about it when Fantasy got his ass handed to him.


GTFO you noob. Your D level iccup oppinion means nothing.


Now, now, baby, don't get upset

If you don't have anything constructive to add to this thread, I suggest you stop posting. Oh wait is that the SKT1 logo ? That explains it lol



If you don't have anything constructive to add to this thread, I suggest you stop posting. Oh wait is that the CJ logo ? Damn, now I'm ashamed


+ Show Spoiler +

argh fuck, what a waste for post #1000, didn't see that coming...
beep boop
NovaTheFeared
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
United States7232 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-08-28 16:44:44
August 28 2009 16:43 GMT
#79
Those complaining about the age of majority in Korea being too high must not understand how age is counted there. Age 20 in Korea is at most 1 year longer than 18 in the U.S.A. and can be as short as 1 day. It's the equivalent of 18.5
日本語が分かりますか
1984
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Ukraine115 Posts
August 28 2009 16:53 GMT
#80
Imo one thing many of you guys missing is that Asian society is sometimes significantly different from Western, so it's not always a good thing to judge them from the outside perspective. Though anyway I hope Blizzard won't allow Kespa too much in SC2.
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