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United States37500 Posts
Travian
10 months ago, FakeSteve introduced TeamLiquid.net to the massively multiplayer online real-time browser game: Travian. A large number of TL.net members showed interested in the game as it was another opportunity for our community to game together. Within a day or two, we all became denizens of the NorthWest quadrant of Server 4. TeamLiquid started out 3 alliances strong with over 80 players from our home forum.
Brief background
Each player starts off as one of the three tribes: Gauls, Romans, or Teutons. The game is very much like Civilization, in which players building up their villages, produce units to attack and defend, and gather resources. Like with other MMOGs, group cooperation and communication is a must.
One of the great things about playing a MMOG with a community like TeamLiquid is the innate sense of trust we have with each other. Other alliances in this game suffer from espionage and corruption within their own ranks. -TL- was able to bypass such issues for a good 4 months into the game.
Over the course of the game, we found two strong allies. First was Youth Climbers (YC) in the NorthWest, a group of rock climbing enthusiasts from Hong Kong. Our mid and late server ally was Player Killers (PKs) from the NorthEast. PKs was formed from the most aggressive players in the NE.
-TL- history
Early on, we were dividied into 3 alliances based on where in the NW we spawned. As it was our first time playing this browser based game together, we were a rather rag-tag bunch. Steve started a thread and listed all the players and their coordinates. But after a while, Steve disappeared and people started asking on the forums about what our goals should be and how we should continue. This is when I took it upon myself to coordinate things for TL.net. I created a new thread and updated it with a new roster and a few maps/guides.
Winning our Server
To win a Travian Server, a player/alliance must build their World Wonder to level 100. At level 1, the WW takes 5 hours to build. Each level there after, there is proportional time increase. All the way up to level 100, this takes over 30 hours to build.
The first 6 months of the game, players and their respective alliances play for territorial dominance. -TL- and our allies, YC, ended up being the strongest in the NorthWest.
About the start of month 7, artifacts are released. Artifacts spawn in NPC villages and possess immense defense. Alliance coordination is required to time all the attacks one after another and ensure that the person who sends the last attack is able to pick up the artifact and secure it in one of their villages.
After all the artifacts are secured, the last portion of the game begins. World Wonder Plans are released. WW plans are just like Artifacts. Only difference is that the player holding the WW plan will be able to construct a World Wonder “building”. Each player with a WW plan can build their Wonder from level 1 to level 50. To build the Wonder to level 51 and beyond, another player in the same alliance must also hold a plan. Another words, 2 players in the same alliance must each have a World Wonder Plan in order to build their respective alliance World Wonder to level 100.
Metas
At the end of the server, it no longer becomes players fighting players or alliances fighting alliances. Like all other Travian servers, two metas (think an alliance of alliances) form and two factions of the server fight in the end. -TL-, YC and PKs ended up belonging to a meta named Vendetta. Our opposing meta was Genesis, a conglomeration of two multi winged alliances, RoB and ABC.
Extending appreciation
There are a few people who made this Travian experience a success for TeamLiquid and to them, I would like to give them my thanks.
Kazansky (TeamLiquid.net handle: Anihc)
Kaz was the other main coordinator for -TL-. He essentially kept things running smoothly when wars arise and when I got rather busy in real life. For the first five months, Kaz was the most aggressive player on Server 4. He single-handedly put our alliance on the map for other to notice.
PaKe_LiKa (b_unnies)
Probably one of our more newbie of players.  But given how he started Travian a good two months after the rest of us, he’s got a good excuse. PaKe was persistent in trying to make himself useful in our alliance. He took over Petachu’s account after Peta went inactive. The last two months of the game, I made him my co-player and he covered tasks while I was busy sleeping or studying.
thedeadhaji (thedeadhaji)
One of our key players who stayed until the very end of the game. haji was responsible for building up the largest single army in Travian. This meant constantly raiding for at least a good three months in advance to build up his army and make sure it didn’t starve. Using his badass army, haji killed Genesis’s World Wonder and essentially seal the victory for our side.
OgreChild (Legionnaire)
TeamLiquid’s resident celebrity... WINKTOSS! I was rather surprised to learn that Leg was playing Travian with us when this all started. He was our strategic commander. What Kaz had in terms of brute force, Leg executed with great finesse. I would say that over 5 enemy players lost a total of about 60 villages in a period of a month, all due to Leg’s planning. Giving me insight on not only who to hit but also when and with how big of a force, Leg filled in the gap left by Kaz after Kaz retired.
2BoNg! (2BoNg)
darkmage (Frenchguy)
ROM (NoName)
psylo (psylo)
BG1 (BG1)
HappyCat (MightyAtom)
To our core players who stayed the entire 10 months with me, you all ensure the win for TeamLiquid.net
KingFalladir (KingFalladir)
Ceril (Ceril/Arkmee)
thedeadhaji
To our script writers, you guys saved us time galore.
JohnJuanda (tenbagger)
fatlittlepig (AK-Nemesis)
Empyrean (Empyrean)
Aether. (requiem)
Bawheed (FBS1)
SoMuchBetter (dcmsm)
Cloud_Strife (Enrique)
Omgbnetsux (omgbnetsux)
rpf289 (rpf289)
Shaolin Bongo (Sfydjklm)
-LiNk- (Death-Link)
OverTheUnder (OverTheUnder)
intrigue (intrigue)
Locked (Locked)
decafchicken (decafchicken)
MuShu-Pork (MuShu)
JackBoy-POSER (POSER)
Dreamtime (oneiro)
Eti307 (Eti307)
Meta (Meta)
TheNug (Spike)
Kyubi (Telemako]JLS[)
petachu (petachu)
IntoTheW0w (IntoTheWow)
StealthBlue ({CC}StealthBlue)
nitram (nitram)
chunwon (pgshock)
lil.sis (lil.sis)
A3i (A3iL3r0n)
trance04 (z7-TranCe)
UNGG (mahnini)
uiCk (uiCk)
EAGER-beaver (EAGER-beaver)
uhjoo (uhjoo)
Pink Ferrari (Mascherano)
Psyren (Psyren)
XDawn (XDawn)
Unforgiven_ve (unforgiven_ve)
To all our TeamLiquid.net members who played with us. I hope Travian was a fun experience for you while we all gamed together.
Ascelon (oneofthem)
garandou (garandou)
Ascelon and garandou, I acknowledge you two as probably the better players on our forum. If only you guys actually stayed on Server 4 with the rest of us. 
veronicamars
brunomgs
Though you two are not from TL.net, you two probably provided the most direct support for me late game. And veronica, an added thanks for being for forum maker the first time around. <3
To Monsen:
While you did not game with the rest of us, you gave us helpful advice that some of us did not entirely heed. I’m man enough to admit when I’m wrong. 10 months ago when you posted tips for the rest of us to follow, I went “wtf”. Now I realize what you said made complete sense. ^^;
Last but not least...
To FakeSteve, the person who introduced all of us to Travian, only to quit 2 weeks later. 
Screenshots
Top 20 players at the end of Server 4
Top 20 alliances
Top 20 most aggressive players
Top 20 most defensive players
-TL- roster
Vendetta roster
Highest built World Wonders
List of Artifacts and their owners
Set 1: makes buildings 5 times more durable = harder for catapults to take down buildings
Set 2: makes merchants move 2 times faster
Set 3: makes offensive/defensive units move 2 times faster
Set 4: makes scouting units 5 times more effective
Set 5: artifact owner's crop upkeep is reduced by 1/2.
Set 6: prerequisite to building a World Wonder
TeamLiquid’s shared victory
It was a good run.
For the Glory that is TeamLiquid.
TL Neo // NeoIllusions
Final thanks to our beloved forum administrators: Liquid`Nazgul, Liquid`Meat, Saro, Manifesto7.
Our community is here today because of you guys. Tyvm~~
Disclaimer: This entire thing took me about 2 hours to write, including print screening, image cropping, and uploading. If there are specific people/events that I fail to mention, please let me know. ^_^
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Osaka27131 Posts
TEAM LIQUID OWNS THE INTERNET AGAIN!
You guys fucking rule.
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is awesome32269 Posts
Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay
I had to quit when this started ruining my sleep habits hahahah
But it was good fun, it was nice hanging in irc to waste time with other stuff (like "singing" songs on irc real time, playing any flash game that we came across, making TL threads) while we did our travian work 
Good job
ps: monkeynurse is a guy who told everyone "she" was a 40/50ish year old girl and sent shirtless pics of "her". hahahah
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thats fucking cool, i need to try this
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United States37500 Posts
Wowwwww... We missed you! T_T
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is awesome32269 Posts
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Hong Kong20321 Posts
wow tf sounds liek a cool game. are all the TL.netters gonna continue this shit, and how can i join in the fun? :O
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United States37500 Posts
On January 02 2007 04:57 alffla wrote:
wow tf sounds liek a cool game. are all the TL.netters gonna continue this shit, and how can i join in the fun? :O
Most likely not...
Each server takes 10-11 months to finish. Early on, it's not that hard to manage. But as the game progresses, you have more and more villages/units to control. At the end, I had 57 villages to look after.
And like Wow said before, this game really puts a damper on each individual person's schedule. I know I ended up sleeping a lot less and had to wake up in the middle of the night a number of times for this game. -_-;;
In all the sense of the word, Travian is truly a committment if you want to play successfully.
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Germany / USA16648 Posts
i don'T know this game, but enjoyed the read.
OWNED
gw guys
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Netherlands19129 Posts
On January 02 2007 05:02 Carnac wrote:
i don'T know this game, but enjoyed the read.
OWNED
gw guys
Indd! You beat the internet! TL Fighting!
You made us all proud <3.
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very nice guys =]
On January 02 2007 05:01 NeoIllusions wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2007 04:57 alffla wrote:
wow tf sounds liek a cool game. are all the TL.netters gonna continue this shit, and how can i join in the fun? :O Most likely not... Each server takes 10-11 months to finish. Early on, it's not that hard to manage. But as the game progresses, you have more and more villages/units to control. At the end, I had 57 villages to look after. And like Wow said before, this game really puts a damper on each individual person's schedule. I know I ended up sleeping a lot less and had to wake up in the middle of the night a number of times for this game. -_-;; In all the sense of the word, Travian is truly a committment if you want to play successfully.
one thing i came to realize during the 2 months or so that i played travian is that every minute of every day is valuable. if you cant devote a good chunk of your time to it then you just wont last
oh and btw guys, thanks for letting that guy farm me, leading to me deleting my village. you guys saved me a lot of time by doing that haha
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United States37500 Posts
On January 02 2007 05:33 SoMuchBetter wrote:very nice guys =] Show nested quote +On January 02 2007 05:01 NeoIllusions wrote:On January 02 2007 04:57 alffla wrote:
wow tf sounds liek a cool game. are all the TL.netters gonna continue this shit, and how can i join in the fun? :O Most likely not... Each server takes 10-11 months to finish. Early on, it's not that hard to manage. But as the game progresses, you have more and more villages/units to control. At the end, I had 57 villages to look after. And like Wow said before, this game really puts a damper on each individual person's schedule. I know I ended up sleeping a lot less and had to wake up in the middle of the night a number of times for this game. -_-;; In all the sense of the word, Travian is truly a committment if you want to play successfully. one thing i came to realize during the 2 months or so that i played travian is that every minute of every day is valuable. if you cant devote a good chunk of your time to it then you just wont last oh and btw guys, thanks for letting that guy farm me, leading to me deleting my village. you guys saved me a lot of time by doing that haha
You were the one guy that ended up not starting in the NorthWest like the rest of us. It's not like we purposely let you get farmed. >_<
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hey i wasnt that far NW. i was practically NE
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maybe TL should start playing in the lottery.
if we own there half as much as we did in Travian, we could be millionaires by next month~
thanks, good read, i totally missed that.
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
You should have restarted when we told you to! :O
but yea, life was hell while this game went on, but honestly, this game is the sole reason I got closer to many people on TL.net like Neo, intrigue, locked, geometryb, anihc, Leg, decaf, Wow, etcetc. That alone makes the 10 month commitment worthwhile for me.
Thank you for "making" TL for me Travian. (but otherwise you succckkkk)
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Hong Kong20321 Posts
wow that's crazy. damn i dont think i'd have too much commitment to text based online games o_O
it's sorta like utopia then right? :o
anyhow... more power to TL. good job guys.
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Wow, nice writeup, and congrats for winning the server and actually staying for the whole 11 months. I can still remember in september when you were like... ah I'm going to quit now, and everyone else (me haji leg etc.) were like ok we're all quitting too now. But I turned out to be the only one serious -_-
The game was fun for the first few months, and then it became all work and no fun. Your schedule revolved around this game, and if you are unable to access your account every few hours, you get screwed over. So yea it might sound like a nice game, but I doubt any of us will play it again. Again, congrats to all of you who stayed and made TL proud
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Physician
United States4146 Posts
Entropy smells trouble, he realizes a foreign game (i.e. not StarCraft) stole StrarCraft players and shouts, Strategy game or not this is almost sacrilegious!, while he muses about our demise.
"Oh quiet down man, remember how you end all your posts with "Enjoy ~" , replies Physician as he wonders about the fickle interest of gamers, while at the same time he wishes he were younger and had even more time for more games, than just the one.
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its like utopia.. anyone played that online txt game b4?
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Woah, congrats O_O
This makes me regret quitting (just a bit though, keeping the level at which I played would have destroyed my real life ^^; )
Funny that monkeynurse ended up as highest pop, what happened to haploid? He was the best Sim City player out there
What's happening on the other servers? How's the hero thing in T3 working out?
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i might play this 
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infinity21
Canada6683 Posts
wow that looks awesome
good job guys 
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Haploid quit and deleted 
And again, everyone, you DON'T want to play this game if you want/have any semblance of a life.
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United States20661 Posts
It's really too bad GiYom didn't stay. Remember when he was like "stop this guy from farming me and I'll be your friend and teach you SC!"
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yeah i quit this game early on, when neo had 1k pop i think? was around the time we started to get those guys that capture villages, forget the name. i remmeber kaz was stealing resources from my farms so i had to wake up earlier (6am wtf) to raid them first
haji's scripts were godly tho :O but this game took more time than wow, and that's saying something (this was when we all had 2-4 villages, i can't imagine what you do with 57 wow.. do you just not keep any force in em and actually have positive crop income?)
i remember panicking a couple of times, watching my swingers die (many per second) because there's no food, and begging neo to gimme some crop ><; so stressful lol
ah yeah one hell of a game, but any game that's a bigger time commitment than wow is .. not for me.
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16953 Posts
Good job to everyone. I quit after a while (when top TL players started getting in the couple thousands of population) because I just didn't have the time.
Once again, TL.net rapes everyone else. Congrats to TL.net and our multi-penis power!
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All i have to say is...
SPIRIT TEUTON FIGHTING~
edit: way to forget me in the list
edit2: Sorry i had to quit, my shit was getting wrecked and this game consumes you ~.~ Going into school early to use the library and going early to computer class to use travian was a bit of a strain :p Those of you that didnt play wont realize was a fucking accomplishment and sign of determination it is that they stuck through the whole 11 months and WON. TL win
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omg! I didn't know you guys still played that game. I stopped a couple of months ago
Congratulations! that's ownage
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I'm proud of you guys, f-cking up the competition as usual.
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man i was in ABC too lol its kinda funny they made it to the end
it was a fun game though until i woke up at 3am to check my village and realized i was taking it way too seriously.
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On January 02 2007 11:48 Ghin wrote:
man i was in ABC too lol its kinda funny they made it to the end
it was a fun game though until i woke up at 3am to check my village and realized i was taking it way too seriously.
It was a fun game until I stayed up until 3 am repeatedly to check my villages.
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is awesome32269 Posts
Singing in irc was fun though
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I played for like the first 2 weeks or so and was going to be the official map maker for server 5, but then I realized how much free time this game took and quit. Congrats on sticking to it and winning!
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Oh god why did i quit. I was top 12 in the tl alliance before i quit. What a mistake T.T
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On January 02 2007 04:33 Manifesto7 wrote:
TEAM LIQUID OWNS THE INTERNET AGAIN!
You guys fucking rule.
ggnore
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United States37500 Posts
@ garandou: Haploid and Seal Life both quit early on. Haploid gave up his villages to Seal, nurse and a few other and deleted. A month later, Seal gave up a crapload of villages to nurse and deleted too.
In retrospect, FC was sim-city as heck but nurse did play a big role in blocking RoB/ABC from getting artifacts in the SouthEast.
Other servers are still going on. S5, FWU seems to be winning. T3 is damn lame, they made so many changes to Trav that it seems even more dumbed down than before. Heroes help out noobs a lot since for their cost, they are 10x stronger than the regular unit equivalent. I'll let ascelon tell you more about heroes. He's passionately against them.
@ Pressure: The server is over and I doubt the original TL guys will want to continue.
@ decaf: My bad >_< Added you. SPIRIT TEUTON INDEED!
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I can't believe I missed out T_T
any chance of winning another round? I just made an account two days ago to check out the game
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United States37500 Posts
On January 02 2007 14:50 azndsh wrote:
I can't believe I missed out T_T
any chance of winning another round? I just made an account two days ago to check out the game
Heh, for the third time, my magic 8 ball says it doesn't look good. :O
Feel free to make a thread in Sports & Games and see if anyone else is interested. If you gather enough people, I'm willing to walk you new guys through the game and teach you how to play successfully.
But take what other Travian players say with a grain of salt. When people are saying it's a huge time committment to play this browser game optimally, they aren't kidding. Expect to put over 3 hours a day into this game, and even more as the months go on.
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intrigue
Washington, D.C9933 Posts
what?!?!! haploid quit and deleted?! ugh my crowning achievement was playing his account when he was on vacation and keeping everything alive for a little more than a week when he was rank 1 on the server =(
it was fun, but i can't believe that anyone here would play it again X_X the irc channel was very, very fun though. between checking villages it would be starcraft and then more starcraft =) i even met up with haji 'irl' at stanford because of travian, missed neo by a day =P
being under the "nil volentibus arduum" section of the vendetta alliance page makes me feel all warm and fuzzy =)
glad to hear you guys face trounced the genesis newbs!
you guys rock, way to represent tl
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MURICA15980 Posts
Dang, all this time I was wondering what the hell this Travian was... I still don't have a clue but this makes it make a lot more sense ;o
Good job guys. We rule ;D
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There are loads of web based games out there like this. You should try another :D I used to play StarKingdoms and Dominion.
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Bosnia-Herzegovina1381 Posts
Seriously, someone names a poll on a random website, and StarCraft is winning it by 70% by the next day.
Give us an onlien game, and we will win it. Give us 11 months, but we WILL win it.
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Kennigit
Canada19447 Posts
Some of my friends played SpaceMiners in highschool....it was ridiculous where they were receiving long distance phone calls on their cell-phones from austrailia telling them that their colonys were being attacked....they really enjoy'd it though if your looking for another on to start
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Lol, I stopped playing a while back, didn't know there were still people playing. I still remember Kazansky though, he was #1 agressor when I left.
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Fuck me, i'm hooked, and i am also the founder of my alliance :/. The game is taking more than 3 hours a day, believe me. I slept 5 hours yesterday because of it...
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did any of you guys use travian plus? i remember those 10 glorious days of free trial where i could line up buildings and raiding was easier and what not :D
How do you guys do so much raiding in the end? i used tabs in firefox, idk if you guys ever found a more efficient way?
and how much did the WoW lvl 100 cost? must've been fucking ridiculous
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HonestTea
5007 Posts
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On January 02 2007 17:11 thedeadhaji wrote:ender -____- trust me, in 3-6 months you'll realize how poorly this game is designed and how shitty its admis are
At least i'm sharing the account with another hooked guy, so it's just half the normal load. We've been doing over 100 attacks a day (over 200 scoutings). We currently have over 11k axes, 3k clubs (left from the beginning, the fuckers never die) and 6.7k teuton knights. Usually my friend wakes up earlier than i do and sends scouts, and i make the attacks later on. Still, it's over 3 hours... and the admins really do suck, ours doesn't even speak spanish properly.
I don't know if i'll last until the wonder...
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Meh, why bother with scouting? You can afford a few losses, and it'll save you a lot of time. I think haji had over 200 farms, raiding them 3 or 4 times a day, which means like over 750 attacks a day.
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wow, thats awesome;D
I quit after the top 500 or so had their 2nd town. Took to much time and i was busy playing starkingdoms( another real-time game that consumes you) at the time:O Tl owns face^^
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OMFG Neo you are amazing!
I'm sorry that I had to quit. BTW, who ended up taking over my account?
That attack by haji is so ridiculously huge. I remember thinking my 50 Equ Imps were a huge army. It must've been orgasmic when you saw that battle report. I can't even fathom how time consuming it must have been at the end.
Great job representing the TL.net community!
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United States37500 Posts
On January 02 2007 17:18 decafchicken wrote:
did any of you guys use travian plus? i remember those 10 glorious days of free trial where i could line up buildings and raiding was easier and what not :D
How do you guys do so much raiding in the end? i used tabs in firefox, idk if you guys ever found a more efficient way?
and how much did the WoW lvl 100 cost? must've been fucking ridiculous
monkeynurse ended up giving free PLUS to a number of our guys. I was able to use PLUS for at least 4-5 months, thanks to her and veronicamars.
I used Excel spreadsheet for the first 3-4 months, then when I had to sit for Kaz to help manage his beastly army, I changed over to FireFox bookmarks/tabs. I think FF is the best way to go. Though if you utilize haji's/Fall's script, it's even more imba. XD
WW 100 costed 310K [wood] 295K [clay] 320K [iron] 85K [crop]
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United States37500 Posts
On January 02 2007 19:00 tenbagger wrote:
OMFG Neo you are amazing!
I'm sorry that I had to quit. BTW, who ended up taking over my account?
That attack by haji is so ridiculously huge. I remember thinking my 50 Equ Imps were a huge army. It must've been orgasmic when you saw that battle report. I can't even fathom how time consuming it must have been at the end.
Great job representing the TL.net community!
2BoNg and Legionnaire ended up splitting your villages in half and conquered them. None of us had the time to manage two accounts and we didn't find anyone we could trust to take over your account.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On January 02 2007 09:57 JeeJee wrote:
yeah i quit this game early on, when neo had 1k pop i think? was around the time we started to get those guys that capture villages, forget the name. i remmeber kaz was stealing resources from my farms so i had to wake up earlier (6am wtf) to raid them first
haji's scripts were godly tho :O but this game took more time than wow, and that's saying something (this was when we all had 2-4 villages, i can't imagine what you do with 57 wow.. do you just not keep any force in em and actually have positive crop income?)
i remember panicking a couple of times, watching my swingers die (many per second) because there's no food, and begging neo to gimme some crop ><; so stressful lol
ah yeah one hell of a game, but any game that's a bigger time commitment than wow is .. not for me. Heh travian sucked the life out of me for a while, but it was really a fun time on irc with everyone. At the peak we had 20 people on the channel bullshitting about nothing in particular. Nice memories everyone!
The game itself is not hard, devote 10+ hours to it and you can be #1 on the server fairly easily. The way the game is run is not only unprofessional but not even having the appearance of being professional. I wont mention teh specifics but right now they basically allow people pay money to cheat. Nothing worth getting into imo unless you want to play with several people on one account.
For a lot of the teamliquid players though the game was played on a different level. haji had his raiding script thing and basically every player had a farming list that's 20+ villages long. Anyway travian is totally pwned by teamliquid, since every server since s4 saw teamliquid players as the best on the server for a time. Even though I wasn't that involved in s4, it wasn't that i didn't want to get involved, but honestly managing a roman account while situated next to a big raiding teuton is too much stress...obviously i would have stayed and put time into s4 if I felt i could make something out of the situation.
Anyway, nice game everyone.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
The teamliquid s4 cluster was originally concentrated in two places. one is near neo/haji/bong another around kaz. I was near the kaz group. So in the end our group kinda all quit and the northeastern portion was made the main focus of tl presence, so i think the guys that play on s4 had more attachment to their immediate neighbors. But really while it was up our area was a lot of fun and loads of action early on. Anyway for s4 neo did a really good job lifting the morale of the community and making it survive.
I think the s5 server at the beginning was not talked about very much here, but it was heavily teamliquid as well. We just didn't have the community to continue, since only about 10 or so teamliquid players were on there. Of the teamliquid players on s5 in the beginning, and s6, s1, also, over 50% were at the very top of the offensive and army rankings, because we were into the monsen/kazansky way of doing things then and were active as well.
Getting more villages in this game isn't really the problem, the crop management is, that and making 1000 attacks a day (on s3 i made 1000 attacks in 14 hours each day...with literally no casualties for high farming efficiency). if you are not a pussy like certain players, (monkeynurse etc) you'd want a fucking huge army to kill and stuff. Otherwise the game is nonsense. I think we have made a name for tl being a bunch of badass killers.
some pictures i saved...showing T3 for those who would like to waste time on this
+ Show Spoiler +100 troop movements...highest was around 150 for one village Scripting ftw..
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Wow, that's nuts, congrats guys!
I ended up quitting months ago just because of the time investment required. Managing 2 villages and a tiny army was enough of a headache, yet some of you guys guys handled 50 villages? WTF?!?!?
I'll help out again for next season but I'm playing 1 hour tops per day
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Kudos TL!. Next ------> World Domination!
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HonestTea
5007 Posts
Haha, that read alone made me wish I played it
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16953 Posts
Let's all pick a well developed MMOBG and completely rape a new season of it.
Let's get our scouting goggles on
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I'm totally up for the next one ^^
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Server 2 was still the best one. After 2 and 3, most parties already had their organization and plan set; little of that excitement remains.
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United States37500 Posts
On January 03 2007 03:33 useless wrote:
Server 2 was still the best one. After 2 and 3, most parties already had their organization and plan set; little of that excitement remains.
Who were you on old S2?
And it's rather easy for you to say that after S2 and S3, that there's no more excitement for S4 onwards. S4 was still the first server for a number of us.
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On January 03 2007 04:24 NeoIllusions wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2007 03:33 useless wrote:
Server 2 was still the best one. After 2 and 3, most parties already had their organization and plan set; little of that excitement remains. Who were you on old S2? And it's rather easy for you to say that after S2 and S3, that there's no more excitement for S4 onwards. S4 was still the first server for a number of us.
Thats true. I was godfrey, diplomat for one of the Hellas branch in UNIFORCE. I was around for Syndicate, but weve already built up a lot of momentum by the time Genesis formed, so I let someone else handle my account. I tried a new account on s6 and new s1, but ten months in s2 was enough; I just didnt have the time or devotion to continue anymore.
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Congratulations in winning Travian to all TL.net members. I used to play Travian for a while, but I quit simply because it was too annoying to manage.
If you guys are looking for some Travian-style fun, go to mediwar.com or kingsofchaos.com (they're basically the same thing, but I like medi's simplicity).
Basically you have four races, Humans, Orcs, Elves, and Dwarves, and you form alliances with players and you buy weapons, armor, and spies to raise your rankings (strike action, defensive action, covert action) and the person with the highest ratings wins the round. The round only lasts for a month, much unlike Travian.
Note: I don't play Medi or KoC anymore, if anybody's wondering. I'll gladly give hints, though.
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Belgium6766 Posts
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On January 03 2007 11:49 Xeofreestyler wrote:
TEAMLIQUID FIGHTING!
and owning
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On January 02 2007 14:28 NeoIllusions wrote:
Other servers are still going on. S5, FWU seems to be winning. T3 is damn lame, they made so many changes to Trav that it seems even more dumbed down than before. Heroes help out noobs a lot since for their cost, they are 10x stronger than the regular unit equivalent. I'll let ascelon tell you more about heroes. He's passionately against them.
Wow. When I left Travian back then I was kinda hoping T3 would be a change for the better. I did not realize Travians creators were that retarded. "Let's strengthen defense a bit!" Great idea... It's one thing to help new/less dedicated players survive and another to make coordinated attacking so god damn difficult compared to defending. Bah.
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Lots of good memories though, especially irc chats. Wish i had at least kept around in the irc channel Oh well. Top 80 or so offensive with less than 300 clubs the whole time was fun ^_^;
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United States37500 Posts
On January 03 2007 11:59 Monsen wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2007 14:28 NeoIllusions wrote:
Other servers are still going on. S5, FWU seems to be winning. T3 is damn lame, they made so many changes to Trav that it seems even more dumbed down than before. Heroes help out noobs a lot since for their cost, they are 10x stronger than the regular unit equivalent. I'll let ascelon tell you more about heroes. He's passionately against them.
Wow. When I left Travian back then I was kinda hoping T3 would be a change for the better. I did not realize Travians creators were that retarded. "Let's strengthen defense a bit!" Great idea... It's one thing to help new/less dedicated players survive and another to make coordinated attacking so god damn difficult compared to defending. Bah.
Since ascelon hasn't been reading this thread, I guess I'll speak for him.
When he was playing on S3, the Travian 3 speed server, he got utterly pissed when newbies would defend with a hero only and ascelon would end up losing 10 clubs. ascelon ended up posting in his profile that any farms that defended with hero only would get cata'ed. ^^;
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
lol i didnt realize he actually went thru with the s3 speedserver.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On January 03 2007 12:52 NeoIllusions wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2007 11:59 Monsen wrote:On January 02 2007 14:28 NeoIllusions wrote:
Other servers are still going on. S5, FWU seems to be winning. T3 is damn lame, they made so many changes to Trav that it seems even more dumbed down than before. Heroes help out noobs a lot since for their cost, they are 10x stronger than the regular unit equivalent. I'll let ascelon tell you more about heroes. He's passionately against them.
Wow. When I left Travian back then I was kinda hoping T3 would be a change for the better. I did not realize Travians creators were that retarded. "Let's strengthen defense a bit!" Great idea... It's one thing to help new/less dedicated players survive and another to make coordinated attacking so god damn difficult compared to defending. Bah. Since ascelon hasn't been reading this thread, I guess I'll speak for him. When he was playing on S3, the Travian 3 speed server, he got utterly pissed when newbies would defend with a hero only and ascelon would end up losing 10 clubs. ascelon ended up posting in his profile that any farms that defended with hero only would get cata'ed. ^^; erm i posted a bit back neo. ^_^;;
The hero thing is very annoying early game when you are trying to farm people. Basically a hero is worth 20+ units, and cost the saem as one. This may not seem like much when everyone has ks of troops, but in the early goings farming is considerably tougher, especially when you are trying to farm a lot of these noobs who log on one time a day and builds a hero.
For other T3 tweaks, there was the reduction in the supremacy exponent so that a superior army would lose a greater percentage of guys. I suppose this makes suicide attacks easier but small to medium defenses tougher.
From my experience, there is no way the "mass defense > offense" can be solved without allowing for pooling of offensive armies, at least by one single player from all of his villages.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On January 03 2007 13:16 thedeadhaji wrote:
lol i didnt realize he actually went thru with the s3 speedserver. yeah the alliance i created actually ended up "winning" that server. rofl
anyway I certainly had one of the top 2 accounts by far(not only top pop but also 2 to 3 times more troops than anyone else) on that server for a considerable period of time, but it took too much time dealing not only with the account but with the diplomatic crap as well. If there is one thing in travian that impressed me, it is the noobness of a vast majority of players.
edit: happy birthday haji
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On January 03 2007 15:16 oneofthem wrote:
If there is one thing in travian that impressed me, it is the noobness of a vast majority of players.
Yeah, all the noobs in the (meta)alliance made being a leader a pain in the ass. You'd think that someone who plays 1-2h hours every day, would understand the few strategic concepts of the game...
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United States37500 Posts
On January 03 2007 15:06 oneofthem wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2007 12:52 NeoIllusions wrote:On January 03 2007 11:59 Monsen wrote:On January 02 2007 14:28 NeoIllusions wrote:
Other servers are still going on. S5, FWU seems to be winning. T3 is damn lame, they made so many changes to Trav that it seems even more dumbed down than before. Heroes help out noobs a lot since for their cost, they are 10x stronger than the regular unit equivalent. I'll let ascelon tell you more about heroes. He's passionately against them.
Wow. When I left Travian back then I was kinda hoping T3 would be a change for the better. I did not realize Travians creators were that retarded. "Let's strengthen defense a bit!" Great idea... It's one thing to help new/less dedicated players survive and another to make coordinated attacking so god damn difficult compared to defending. Bah. Since ascelon hasn't been reading this thread, I guess I'll speak for him. When he was playing on S3, the Travian 3 speed server, he got utterly pissed when newbies would defend with a hero only and ascelon would end up losing 10 clubs. ascelon ended up posting in his profile that any farms that defended with hero only would get cata'ed. ^^; erm i posted a bit back neo. ^_^;; The hero thing is very annoying early game when you are trying to farm people. Basically a hero is worth 20+ units, and cost the saem as one. This may not seem like much when everyone has ks of troops, but in the early goings farming is considerably tougher, especially when you are trying to farm a lot of these noobs who log on one time a day and builds a hero. For other T3 tweaks, there was the reduction in the supremacy exponent so that a superior army would lose a greater percentage of guys. I suppose this makes suicide attacks easier but small to medium defenses tougher. From my experience, there is no way the "mass defense > offense" can be solved without allowing for pooling of offensive armies, at least by one single player from all of his villages.
Didn't see you post about heroes in particular. :O If you did, my bad.
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United States37500 Posts
On January 03 2007 15:38 garandou wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2007 15:16 oneofthem wrote:
If there is one thing in travian that impressed me, it is the noobness of a vast majority of players. Yeah, all the noobs in the (meta)alliance made being a leader a pain in the ass. You'd think that someone who plays 1-2h hours every day, would understand the few strategic concepts of the game...
oh great garandou! how do I [insert daily S5 question here]?!
XD
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
I think most of them are either not familiar with teh internet or are plain kids. There are some decent people with a brain though, although for most you can't tell whether you've been farming a person or a monkey.
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United States37500 Posts
On January 03 2007 16:05 oneofthem wrote:
I think most of them are either not familiar with teh internet or are plain kids. There are some decent people with a brain though, although for most you can't tell whether you've been farming a person or a monkey.
Then again, there are only a few select alliances that could compare with -TL-. Hell, we're a community that has to break down a f'ing flash Tower Defense game using Excel spreadsheets, to see if it's possible to reach level 100... >_>
TL 1 - 0 intarweb kidz
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I haven't read the whole thing but congrats.
I was TheNug. I remember bailing out when I just conquered a village; the game takes up too much time
Did romans come out on top at the end? I remember Kaz hailing the teutons as the best race(it was early on).
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United States37500 Posts
Romans came out on top in terms of population. But Teutons were still filling up the top 20 Offensive rankings more than Romans or Gauls.
Then there's haji... who's the biggest outlier of them out.
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United States42185 Posts
I want in on this. Gonna sign up.
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hey neo, what happened to the guy named d9ou or somthing like that. He was #1 before i left and alot ahead of every1 else.
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On January 03 2007 17:04 Kwark wrote:
I want in on this. Gonna sign up.
Might want to rethink that; trust me, it's a lot of work.
Keeping your own troops alive is a nightmare. I only had 3k troops but it took so much time to trade for crops and to continually send out raids. I would intentionally suicide troops to lessen the work.
I wonder how Neo and Haji kept their troops alive.
edit
The first war was fun though. We just destroyed another alliance and conquering just entered the picture. Forgot who it was...
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
romans suck, never ever choose roman unless you are into the simcity thing. If you just want to play for fun, be a teuton and be active for a while, rape some noobs, then call it quits.
Then again, there are only a few select alliances that could compare with -TL-. Hell, we're a community that has to break down a f'ing flash Tower Defense game using Excel spreadsheets, to see if it's possible to reach level 100... >_>
TL 1 - 0 intarweb kidz
For alliance organization tl kicks major ass indeed. The effort put into the adnoctvm war was phenomenal. They didn't know wtf hit them.
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United States42185 Posts
On January 03 2007 17:23 Spike wrote:Might want to rethink that; trust me, it's a lot of work. Keeping your own troops alive is a nightmare. I only had 3k troops but it took so much time to trade for crops and to continually send out raids. I would intentionally suicide troops to lessen the work. I wonder how Neo and Haji kept their troops alive. edit The first war was fun though. We just destroyed another alliance and conquering just entered the picture. Forgot who it was...
Ever heard of runescape. A few years ago I put like 500 hours into that just because I knew someone with a high level. I got a higher one. I have a shitload of free time and the drive to waste it in the most inane things. PM me when the time comes and teach me to play. I'll serve the cause.
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intrigue
Washington, D.C9933 Posts
ROM did the first conquer i think =P
and diu9you was the high-ranking hong kong guy
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On January 03 2007 18:00 Kwark wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2007 17:23 Spike wrote:On January 03 2007 17:04 Kwark wrote:
I want in on this. Gonna sign up. Might want to rethink that; trust me, it's a lot of work. Keeping your own troops alive is a nightmare. I only had 3k troops but it took so much time to trade for crops and to continually send out raids. I would intentionally suicide troops to lessen the work. I wonder how Neo and Haji kept their troops alive. edit The first war was fun though. We just destroyed another alliance and conquering just entered the picture. Forgot who it was... Ever heard of runescape. A few years ago I put like 500 hours into that just because I knew someone with a high level. I got a higher one. I have a shitload of free time and the drive to waste it in the most inane things. PM me when the time comes and teach me to play. I'll serve the cause. This is a different kind of activity, where the game defines your schedule. You can't go offline for more than 3 or 4 hours if you play with a big army, especially late game -100k crop armies. It is not worth it.
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United States42185 Posts
I have what it takes. One of the players please PM me when the time comes.
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United States37500 Posts
On January 03 2007 17:10 nitram wrote:
hey neo, what happened to the guy named d9ou or somthing like that. He was #1 before i left and alot ahead of every1 else.
diu9you? TL and PKs took out his 3 Kaz sized armies. He eventually quit S4 and let another Romanian player take over. We continued to keep that player in check as well and he was never much of a threat afterwards. The account "diu9you" was deleted probably 3-4 weeks before the server ended.
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United States37500 Posts
On January 03 2007 17:23 Spike wrote:Might want to rethink that; trust me, it's a lot of work. Keeping your own troops alive is a nightmare. I only had 3k troops but it took so much time to trade for crops and to continually send out raids. I would intentionally suicide troops to lessen the work. I wonder how Neo and Haji kept their troops alive. edit The first war was fun though. We just destroyed another alliance and conquering just entered the picture. Forgot who it was...
I was literally at my computer every 5-6 hours. :O Constantly raiding and merchant'ing.
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United States37500 Posts
On January 03 2007 18:18 intrigue wrote:
ROM did the first conquer i think =P
and diu9you was the high-ranking hong kong guy
Actually, I think the first guy to conquer a village in the NorthWest was Chinezu. The fag was conquering our TL inactive guys. Chinezu, piratuxxx and ROM were the 3 Big Gauls during the first 4-5 months.
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United States37500 Posts
On January 03 2007 18:54 Kwark wrote:
I have what it takes. One of the players please PM me when the time comes.
I'd be willing to teach if enough people show interest. But so far, all the old players aren't interested in starting again.
I know Darkmage (Frenchguy) is still playing Server 2 under the name "PlayerKillers". You could try registering on S2 NorthEast and talk to him. If you like the game, PM me and I'll write you up a guide.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On January 03 2007 18:57 NeoIllusions wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2007 18:18 intrigue wrote:
ROM did the first conquer i think =P
and diu9you was the high-ranking hong kong guy Actually, I think the first guy to conquer a village in the NorthWest was Chinezu. The fag was conquering our TL inactive guys. Chinezu, piratuxxx and ROM were the 3 Big Gauls during the first 4-5 months. piratuxxx begged to join my alliance on s3 for a while, lol, they are active but stupid.
To play thse games you really need a good script/tools and coplayers who are on the same level.
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United States37500 Posts
piratu's on S2 too. Romanians are on every server. ;o
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
For the new players, absolutely avoid all official travian "advice" from the site itself, especially the "roman economic powerhouse" guide (which reminds me, this should have been one of hte ww names). Romans are not for new players, play gaul, or teuton if you wish to be serious about the game(you are not good enough to play gaul seriously on a high level yet). if you are decently active and raid a bit then you should not worry about being attacked and such, and you do not have to deal with retarded small alliances. Find some good friends in the game and have fun.
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United States37500 Posts
Monsen either laughed at us or shook his head in disbelief when we followed the economic powerhouse guide. XD
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
But once you have your first raid, you'll be instantly hooked by raiding.
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
On January 03 2007 18:57 NeoIllusions wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2007 18:18 intrigue wrote:
ROM did the first conquer i think =P
and diu9you was the high-ranking hong kong guy Actually, I think the first guy to conquer a village in the NorthWest was Chinezu. The fag was conquering our TL inactive guys. Chinezu, piratuxxx and ROM were the 3 Big Gauls during the first 4-5 months.
lol I had both chinezu and piratuxxx near me~~~
they were both huge fags.
and multis
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On January 03 2007 17:46 oneofthem wrote:
The effort put into the adnoctvm war was phenomenal. They didn't know wtf hit them.
adnoctvm - thats who they were.
I remember many catapult attacks and Kaz's big suicide attack (did we ever figure out who supplied the defense troops? RoB?).
Anyway the game needs to be...
Less time intensive.
Shorten, 11 months 
Allow for troops from one player's village to combine.
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
change the fucking crop rule =X
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
lol haji is still in trauma recovery
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United States42185 Posts
This game is so slow. Makes me want to multi already.
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On January 03 2007 22:48 Spike wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2007 17:46 oneofthem wrote:
The effort put into the adnoctvm war was phenomenal. They didn't know wtf hit them. adnoctvm - thats who they were. I remember many catapult attacks and Kaz's big suicide attack (did we ever figure out who supplied the defense troops? RoB?). Anyway the game needs to be... Less time intensive. Shorten, 11 months Allow for troops from one player's village to combine.
if troops can combine together in 1 village and use them, that would make travian totally fucked(not like it already is fucked up)
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+ each village upgrades its own units produced, armour + offensive power. So that makes it impossible to combine.
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I didn't mean to combine or merge; I meant a short way (some kind of option) to be able to attack with all your troops at the same time. Unfair or not, trying to time everything was annoying as hell.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On January 03 2007 23:58 nitram wrote:
+ each village upgrades its own units produced, armour + offensive power. So that makes it impossible to combine. eh, that'll just be accounted for by making a more complicated combat system, like separate divisions or something. But the game is too simple for that.
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
i dont think the single army single village things needs a change, since a dedicaed player will make a huge ass army from one village anywyas. My beef is this:
FIX THE FUCKING GLITCHED ASS CROP ARTIFACT DAMN IT!!!!!!!!!!
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intrigue
Washington, D.C9933 Posts
On January 04 2007 04:32 SoMuchBetter wrote:
its over haji, let go
try telling that to a soldier back from a long war
an eleven-month war
haji you have made our country proud
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
*lost his manhood in the war*
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im not really into text based games, but that all sounds pretty hectic. big props to all involved in doing TLnet proud! made it sound interesting but i'll take the warnings and not play
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On January 04 2007 06:54 thedeadhaji wrote:
*lost his manhood in the war* dont worry man, i'm sure the magical land of japan will cure you of travian in no time.
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United States37500 Posts
PM'ed question which I'll just answer publically. :O
~~~
Combat has a formula which I never bothered enough to look into. Just know the attack/defense units for each race and you'll be pretty safe.
Roman:
Early game: Leg (Off), Prae (Def)
Mid game: Imp (Off), Equ Imps (raiding), Prae (Def)
Late game: Imp (Off), Equ Cae (Off), Prae (Def)
Gaul:
Early: Phal (Off/Def)
Mid game: Swords (Off), TTs (raiding), Phal (Def)
Late game: Swords (Off), Hads (Off), Phal (Def)
Teuton:
Early: Clubs (Off/raiding)
Mid: Clubs (Off/raiding), Palas (Def/raiding), Spears (Def)
Late: Axes (Off), TKs (Off), Spears (Def)
Off and Def are self-explanatory. "raiding" means that these units are fast and are good for raiding purposes only. Try not to attack villages with "raiding" units if there are defense. The cost of losing raiding cavalry units will set you back immensely if you lose too many.
Offense is standard over all. Defense, you want to notice what tribe is attacking you and what units they could be using. If you get yourself in a good alliance, try to have an ally near you to help out with defense. If you are Roman, you use Praes to defend against attacking infantry. Praes have the best anti-infantry defense. But if someone is attacking you with cavalry, as Roman, you're rather fucked. So your options are to either dodge the attack (use up or merchant away resources so that crannies can cover the rest) or defend. Your best hope is that you have a Gaul or Teuton near by so they can reinforce you with Phal or Spears, respectively.
Over time, you'll start to realize what size army can handle what size defense. But for the most part, scout regularly and use the simulator.
Neo
-----------------------------------------
Original Message:
hey, i just started the game, playing casually, don't know if i'll actually continue or anything
i have a question about the combat system, like how does it work? how does the combat simulator actually get those results... the only thing i've been able to discern so far is that attacking has a huge advantage over defending
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On January 03 2007 23:05 Kwark wrote:
This game is so slow. Makes me want to multi already.
be patient, after 2 weeks I got tired of managing the non stop raids.
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On January 03 2007 21:56 NeoIllusions wrote:
Monsen either laughed at us or shook his head in disbelief when we followed the economic powerhouse guide. XD
Disbelief.
It was quite tough when I was failing to deliver my points even though I was coming from where you were going to and really trying hard. Your success proves me wrong in a way though. It seems you can actually be dedicated enough to endure all those game mechanics that turn the fun early game travian into that hellhole of mindless boredom work.
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I so owned in that game until I abandoned the game.
ERM that is, forgot about it lol
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United States37500 Posts
On January 04 2007 20:47 Monsen wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2007 21:56 NeoIllusions wrote:
Monsen either laughed at us or shook his head in disbelief when we followed the economic powerhouse guide. XD Disbelief. It was quite tough when I was failing to deliver my points even though I was coming from where you were going to and really trying hard. Your success proves me wrong in a way though. It seems you can actually be dedicated enough to endure all those game mechanics that turn the fun early game travian into that hellhole of mindless boredom work.
Meh, I personally would have quit the game months ago if it was just me. I even made a resignation post on our alliance forum. It's just other people didn't quit so I didn't want to leave them hanging leaderless. So I went the extra mile and won the server.
Trust me, we certainly did not prove you wrong. Our most aggressive player, Anihc, was the very first one to realize how wrong and stupid that guide was. Raiding is everything. Fields are only good for crop. Our tenacity as a whole is a totally different issue. Call us stubborn even.
Your suggestion that players should conquer for the first time with 3 villages only, may have been a bit premature. But you were certainly right in all the other key aspects. ^^;
In retrospect, I'm glad you did give advice, even if we didn't heed it. It is too bad you didn't actually play with the rest of us. I'm almost positive we could have an even stronger start if you did.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
the combat formula is basically atk power/def power of the two armies involved raised to a certain exponent. this is hte casualty percentage for the side that loses less than 100%
For conquests, wait until you have 5 or 6 chiefs and then do it over and over again. On the 3x speed server the rate of CP was about 1 village a day, on normal servers you should be getting a new village every 2 or 3 days.
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That looks like a sweet game. Congratulations. MonkeyNurse: lol
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United States37500 Posts
On January 04 2007 23:03 oneofthem wrote:
For conquests, wait until you have 5 or 6 chiefs and then do it over and over again. On the 3x speed server the rate of CP was about 1 village a day, on normal servers you should be getting a new village every 2 or 3 days.
You forgot to mention that you would have to throw small parties in ALL your villages to match the linear CP growth.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
great parties on speed...in 10 out of 12 villages xD
btw, this monkeynurse person is nothing to lol about. Reminds me of the freedom of human action...that people can actually be that messed up for innocent reasons. o.O
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
how'd we find out about nurse anyways? at that point i could honestly care less, since 100% of my in-game attention went into feeding units.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
amo was made her sitter and i still have the msgs from her acc on a zip file somewhere.
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United States37500 Posts
On January 05 2007 01:27 oneofthem wrote:
amo was made her sitter and i still have the msgs from her acc on a zip file somewhere.
I kept the zip file until the end of the server. But by that time, we won and nothing else really matter. Spy or not, I can't really tell. She proved her worth with her en masse Praes though.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
I was talking about her obsession with sexing up everyone she can talk with. some of the stuff in her inbox were of the WTF variety, but did not have relevance to alliance matters, so we didn't keep them, but they were wild and shit. her "husband" must either be cheating on her or losing sleep.
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
remember when she went thru the whole "my husband left me" thing? ahaha
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is awesome32269 Posts
She added me to msn one day and started to talk "dirty" and show me some pics of 50 yr old naked women (supposed to be herself) hahaha it was so funny, then she told me how she would fuck me over and over.
edit: maybe it was Zia.
edit2: Kaz first attack in our first war was awesome. I remember everyone posting battle report of armies of 500 axes. And suddenly Kaz appeared with a 2k/2.5k army or more i cant remember. hahah that guy deleted right?
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Well I can't remember that strategy exactly as it's been a year for me since I quit Travian, but aren't villages in general quite ineffecctive compared to raiding as long as you have enough targets and time on your hands (which I assume is both correct for early game) ? Founding a 2nd and 3rd village for crop is trading effectiveness for time you don't have to put in raiding/merchanting as far as I remember so you could even stay at 1 village all the time theoretically. The biggest downside is that ppl around you will take such a long time to offer attractive targets for conquering so you might as well found villages of your own.
And I doubt you would have enjoyed me on the team. Most certainly I would have spoiled your fun with constant complaints about the game mechanics (imagine travian without scripts oO) :D .
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On January 04 2007 21:41 NeoIllusions wrote:
Your suggestion that players should conquer for the first time with 3 villages only, may have been a bit premature.
No, it wasn't. That's what I did on s5. You need a good target and it's a bit risky, but in the end it payed off. Elite (the #1 alliance at that time) was a bit surprised to be the victim of the first conquest on the server xD
It also led to a very funny 250 pally attack conducted by zerg ^^
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
lol zerg was ascelon right? (oneofthem)
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
Ah I'm pretty bad at timing attacks, too many distractions plus the travian clock doesn't run right. :/ I was overly obsessed with efficiency of CP also, meaning that i tried to get as much crop per cp as possible, a mistake. Conquering early is just a trophy, like making a 2nd village asap, it doesn't necessarily translate into more growth. More on this later.
As for the villages being effective, on s5 garandou and i were both feeding a lot of troops, but he had more villages, which not only meant that he could have crop production but also resources and merchants with which to trade with other players for crop. My crop situation on s5 would be much easier to manage if I used up my cultural points as soon as i got them. Plus, later on most farms would be gone, and having to constantly find farms or make new ones makes the game much too hard to manage.
On T3 the crop problem is solved somewhat by the main village and also by crop oases. It is just that the main village takes time to build up, with a lv15 or 16 field taking up to a day or two to upgrade. (even on the 3x speed server lv16 fields took a day...although I did have a village with over 60k crop production ^_^)
For a regular server, the most important thing is to identify your farms. Do not attack people who have defense and waste troops, that is not good. Your army is your account in the early goings, try to keep it alive. It doesn't take too much time to build up a sufficient army to cover a large radius if you raid well and do not lose troops, then whatever army that you build will be military not economic, and it is best to invest in other methods of production like fields or CP.
Having to raid all the crop to feed army is downright horrible and takes way too much time. All the late game accounts I had a chance to manage were way easier my s5, since I just have to send crop from villages with crop to the consumption village.
Another misconception about hte game is that it is all about resources, when it is really all about time. The best strategy is not one that which makes income cheapest (troops and raids) but one which expands income the most during a set period of time. In this way building high level fields is more effective time wise for income generation than simply raiding troops. Plus, you'll be overflowing with resources when your raiding income reach a certain level (this is the "flying" stage in which all methods of production are in full boom, troops, buildings, chiefs, parties, all building) you will pretty much ignore marginal cost/income analysis in favor of net income generation. But then again some factors of production depends on your activity level and luck, so one must be careful to not rely too much on those. The general rule is this, build as much cheap cp as possible, and get villages asap. Try to get 5 or 6 chiefs ready, and by that time (shouldn't take a very long time, I think it took Cina all but a month on 3x speed T3 with a gaul) just go on conquering, your account is going to be unholy powerful compared to pretty much anyone else at that point anyways, assuming you raid diligently and smartly
So for me I measure the abilty of a travian player to do two things, kill and make money. Some players, (cina for example) value only high pop, and say the purpose of an army is to get higher pop easier, and the purpose of alliances is for bullying and protection, that's just so womanish. bleh. If you are going to invest time and energy into a game with the ability to kick someone else's ass, by all means, try to kick as much ass as possible. Running a highly offensive account is where the fun is, but late game travian doesn't allow for this.
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is awesome32269 Posts
I think TL basically owned travian because everyone got behind a tag and played sim city. One player alone cannot bully an entire alliance, but we had lots of aggressive people willing to take on any alliance that wasnt a problem anymore. <:·3
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
yeah if all tl players play again I think we can pretty much rape the entire server more completely than it has ever been done in travian history.
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On January 05 2007 10:06 oneofthem wrote:
yeah if all tl players play again I think we can pretty much rape the entire server more completely than it has ever been done in travian history.
We were some pretty badass mother fuckers :D Such bullies too, but thats where the fun is
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
a travian player's worth changes a lot during the various stages of the game. Oneofthem, you didnt cover lategame, where a player's worth is defined by one of two factors. One is the brains and organization to lead coordinated offensives and defensives, a trait that is required from the alliance leader and senate members.
The other is diligence and persistence in buliding an army for months while never using it, and laying low so as not to get attacked. In s4 if you remember, Genesis knew that DeanSmith, Neo, etc had an anti-WorldWonder army since in general, their armies would show up on their attack reports fairly frequently. The value of my army was that they did not know about its existence.
It is a real pain in the ass doing the same things over and over every 6 hours for over 100 days in order to build a 100,000+ crop/hour army, maintaining it with crop, never using it to attack EVER, and at the same time never talking about even its mere existence on even your own alliance forums for fear of information leaks.
Until about 2 weeks until the final attack, only Neo knew about the army I had (and whoever he trusted enough to disclose it to) and I think I only let 4-5 people even know about it.
And it is VERY hard to ask for crop support without letting other pple know what you have that you have to feed
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United States37500 Posts
On January 05 2007 07:38 IntoTheWow wrote:
edit2: Kaz first attack in our first war was awesome. I remember everyone posting battle report of armies of 500 axes. And suddenly Kaz appeared with a 2k/2.5k army or more i cant remember. hahah that guy deleted right?
With AdNoctvm? Kaz was f'ing beastly and most of our own TL guys didn't know how big his army was. He just stole the most aggessive player slot and kept it for a good 5 months.
That army was quite beastly for 2-3 into the server. :D Not to mention the rest of TL brought that village down with a shitload of catas after Kaz cleared. arch deleted about five days later.
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United States37500 Posts
On January 05 2007 08:58 garandou wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2007 21:41 NeoIllusions wrote:
Your suggestion that players should conquer for the first time with 3 villages only, may have been a bit premature. No, it wasn't. That's what I did on s5. You need a good target and it's a bit risky, but in the end it payed off. Elite (the #1 alliance at that time) was a bit surprised to be the victim of the first conquest on the server xD It also led to a very funny 250 pally attack conducted by zerg ^^
You're an outlier though, garandou mini-diu. You had no technical allies around you for squares and sqaures. So everything within your 100x100 was a farm or conquest target. xD
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Remember when I was playing....*sigh*...We all were like "OMG RoB AND ABC ARE FIGHTING...who do we side with!??!" because RoB was famous for bsing their own alliances, and ABC had been with us forever. Turned out ABC and RoB both attacked us....and once my village got catapulted (ty for the troops anyway Leg, got there far too late sadly...dudes near me came after me before then too.) I quit. Was fun until my village got destroyed.
Congrats Neo.
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United States37500 Posts
On January 05 2007 10:06 oneofthem wrote:
yeah if all tl players play again I think we can pretty much rape the entire server more completely than it has ever been done in travian history.
Well, that's because our TL guys are a shitload more competent than your average intarweb kid. I rarely had to repeat myself with TL members. It wasn't always true with non-TL members. >_>
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United States37500 Posts
On January 05 2007 14:37 thedeadhaji wrote:a travian player's worth changes a lot during the various stages of the game. Oneofthem, you didnt cover lategame, where a player's worth is defined by one of two factors. One is the brains and organization to lead coordinated offensives and defensives, a trait that is required from the alliance leader and senate members. The other is diligence and persistence in buliding an army for months while never using it, and laying low so as not to get attacked. In s4 if you remember, Genesis knew that DeanSmith, Neo, etc had an anti-WorldWonder army since in general, their armies would show up on their attack reports fairly frequently. The value of my army was that they did not know about its existence. It is a real pain in the ass doing the same things over and over every 6 hours for over 100 days in order to build a 100,000+ crop/hour army, maintaining it with crop, never using it to attack EVER, and at the same time never talking about even its mere existence on even your own alliance forums for fear of information leaks. Until about 2 weeks until the final attack, only Neo knew about the army I had (and whoever he trusted enough to disclose it to) and I think I only let 4-5 people even know about it. And it is VERY hard to ask for crop support without letting other pple know what you have that you have to feed
oneofthem didn't cover late game because he always quits/deletes/passes account down before he reaches it. XD
But what haji says is completely true. The fact that he layed under the radar for so damn long was one of the main reasons he was able to build the largest .com army. The only point that I can think of that could give it away was that haji held the 1/2 crop artifact for over 2 months, probably even a few weeks longer than I had my 1/2 crop.
Either way, haji was the best candidate, hands down, to build to that anti-WW army. He was as active as I was and raided the most efficiently. Plus he had some of our own players to support him with crop on a semi-regular basis.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On January 05 2007 15:47 NeoIllusions wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2007 08:58 garandou wrote:On January 04 2007 21:41 NeoIllusions wrote:
Your suggestion that players should conquer for the first time with 3 villages only, may have been a bit premature. No, it wasn't. That's what I did on s5. You need a good target and it's a bit risky, but in the end it payed off. Elite (the #1 alliance at that time) was a bit surprised to be the victim of the first conquest on the server xD It also led to a very funny 250 pally attack conducted by zerg ^^ You're an outlier though, garandou mini-diu. You had no technical allies around you for squares and sqaures. So everything within your 100x100 was a farm or conquest target. xD er no, i stole his farms alot. his area is better than mine though. I killed all the little pricks too early. I was raiding 4 hour out with around a 80 field radius at one point just to stay alive.
I dont think diu is all that, Cina is the most impressive player i've seen, while diu just seems to be aggressive and doesn't have as much of a grasp on the mathematical part of the game as some of us do. His s5 account for example would totally get obliterated by either me or garandou.
oneofthem didn't cover late game because he always quits/deletes/passes account down before he reaches it. XD
nah, i was just talking about game mechanics for growth.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On January 05 2007 14:37 thedeadhaji wrote:a travian player's worth changes a lot during the various stages of the game. Oneofthem, you didnt cover lategame, where a player's worth is defined by one of two factors. One is the brains and organization to lead coordinated offensives and defensives, a trait that is required from the alliance leader and senate members. The other is diligence and persistence in buliding an army for months while never using it, and laying low so as not to get attacked. In s4 if you remember, Genesis knew that DeanSmith, Neo, etc had an anti-WorldWonder army since in general, their armies would show up on their attack reports fairly frequently. The value of my army was that they did not know about its existence. It is a real pain in the ass doing the same things over and over every 6 hours for over 100 days in order to build a 100,000+ crop/hour army, maintaining it with crop, never using it to attack EVER, and at the same time never talking about even its mere existence on even your own alliance forums for fear of information leaks. Until about 2 weeks until the final attack, only Neo knew about the army I had (and whoever he trusted enough to disclose it to) and I think I only let 4-5 people even know about it. And it is VERY hard to ask for crop support without letting other pple know what you have that you have to feed I'm only talking about individual playing ability to grow, it was not meant as a statement of worthiness. Maybe i should have used a different word.
For late game, the leaders are everything. A competent leader wins the game with a certain cooperative players/resources, since late game initiatives are few and macro.
The adnoctvm war was really a real war for TL, pretty much everyone active participated. I remember cataing one of adnoctvm's ally's diplomat. The guy sent "please stop" like 10 times, reminded me of some poor robot dying. Before then we kinda were afraid of ranked alliances, I remember a discussion on "SOJ" when they were ranked up there and some of our more dovish members were afraid of attacking them and making too many enemies, but really their entire shit dissolved in less than a few weeks. Travian alliances are only as impressive as their leadership and core members.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On January 05 2007 15:50 NeoIllusions wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2007 10:06 oneofthem wrote:
yeah if all tl players play again I think we can pretty much rape the entire server more completely than it has ever been done in travian history. Well, that's because our TL guys are a shitload more competent than your average intarweb kid. I rarely had to repeat myself with TL members. It wasn't always true with non-TL members. >_> well yeah, TL bans most idiots. Pick your average travian kid and unleash the poor fellow on TL i doubt he'll live one day. Take conqueror15 for example, i'd like to see him take a boot to the face.
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United States37500 Posts
On January 05 2007 20:21 oneofthem wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2007 14:37 thedeadhaji wrote:a travian player's worth changes a lot during the various stages of the game. Oneofthem, you didnt cover lategame, where a player's worth is defined by one of two factors. One is the brains and organization to lead coordinated offensives and defensives, a trait that is required from the alliance leader and senate members. The other is diligence and persistence in buliding an army for months while never using it, and laying low so as not to get attacked. In s4 if you remember, Genesis knew that DeanSmith, Neo, etc had an anti-WorldWonder army since in general, their armies would show up on their attack reports fairly frequently. The value of my army was that they did not know about its existence. It is a real pain in the ass doing the same things over and over every 6 hours for over 100 days in order to build a 100,000+ crop/hour army, maintaining it with crop, never using it to attack EVER, and at the same time never talking about even its mere existence on even your own alliance forums for fear of information leaks. Until about 2 weeks until the final attack, only Neo knew about the army I had (and whoever he trusted enough to disclose it to) and I think I only let 4-5 people even know about it. And it is VERY hard to ask for crop support without letting other pple know what you have that you have to feed I'm only talking about individual playing ability to grow, it was not meant as a statement of worthiness. Maybe i should have used a different word. For late game, the leaders are everything. A competent leader wins the game with a certain cooperative players/resources, since late game initiatives are few and macro. The adnoctvm war was really a real war for TL, pretty much everyone active participated. I remember cataing one of adnoctvm's ally's diplomat. The guy sent "please stop" like 10 times, reminded me of some poor robot dying. Before then we kinda were afraid of ranked alliances, I remember a discussion on "SOJ" when they were ranked up there and some of our more dovish members were afraid of attacking them and making too many enemies, but really their entire shit dissolved in less than a few weeks. Travian alliances are only as impressive as their leadership and core members.
The dove says hi. Not quite about SOJ, but about ~SL~. >_>
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Pfft, one of my farms joined SOJ for protection.
that lasted all of a week till i wrecked his ass
edit: yea adnoctvm war was fun, it was great to read kaz's badass cleaner attacks and then waves and waves of catas after that
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On January 05 2007 21:46 NeoIllusions wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2007 20:21 oneofthem wrote:On January 05 2007 14:37 thedeadhaji wrote:a travian player's worth changes a lot during the various stages of the game. Oneofthem, you didnt cover lategame, where a player's worth is defined by one of two factors. One is the brains and organization to lead coordinated offensives and defensives, a trait that is required from the alliance leader and senate members. The other is diligence and persistence in buliding an army for months while never using it, and laying low so as not to get attacked. In s4 if you remember, Genesis knew that DeanSmith, Neo, etc had an anti-WorldWonder army since in general, their armies would show up on their attack reports fairly frequently. The value of my army was that they did not know about its existence. It is a real pain in the ass doing the same things over and over every 6 hours for over 100 days in order to build a 100,000+ crop/hour army, maintaining it with crop, never using it to attack EVER, and at the same time never talking about even its mere existence on even your own alliance forums for fear of information leaks. Until about 2 weeks until the final attack, only Neo knew about the army I had (and whoever he trusted enough to disclose it to) and I think I only let 4-5 people even know about it. And it is VERY hard to ask for crop support without letting other pple know what you have that you have to feed I'm only talking about individual playing ability to grow, it was not meant as a statement of worthiness. Maybe i should have used a different word. For late game, the leaders are everything. A competent leader wins the game with a certain cooperative players/resources, since late game initiatives are few and macro. The adnoctvm war was really a real war for TL, pretty much everyone active participated. I remember cataing one of adnoctvm's ally's diplomat. The guy sent "please stop" like 10 times, reminded me of some poor robot dying. Before then we kinda were afraid of ranked alliances, I remember a discussion on "SOJ" when they were ranked up there and some of our more dovish members were afraid of attacking them and making too many enemies, but really their entire shit dissolved in less than a few weeks. Travian alliances are only as impressive as their leadership and core members. The dove says hi. Not quite about SOJ, but about ~SL~. >_> oh shit, SL was among the faggest alliances ever devised. I'm glad they were wiped out.
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On January 03 2007 18:59 NeoIllusions wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2007 18:54 Kwark wrote:
I have what it takes. One of the players please PM me when the time comes. I'd be willing to teach if enough people show interest. But so far, all the old players aren't interested in starting again. I know Darkmage (Frenchguy) is still playing Server 2 under the name "PlayerKillers". You could try registering on S2 NorthEast and talk to him. If you like the game, PM me and I'll write you up a guide.
Hi, I'm playin on server 3(the one with 3x speed), using gauls, and just started for like 30 hours
I'd appreciate a guide, and please, whoever else is playing on serv 3 or 7, post here so we all know and possibly make an alliance
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On January 05 2007 09:50 oneofthem wrote:
Ah I'm pretty bad at timing attacks, too many distractions plus the travian clock doesn't run right. :/ I was overly obsessed with efficiency of CP also, meaning that i tried to get as much crop per cp as possible, a mistake. Conquering early is just a trophy, like making a 2nd village asap, it doesn't necessarily translate into more growth. More on this later.
As for the villages being effective, on s5 garandou and i were both feeding a lot of troops, but he had more villages, which not only meant that he could have crop production but also resources and merchants with which to trade with other players for crop. My crop situation on s5 would be much easier to manage if I used up my cultural points as soon as i got them. Plus, later on most farms would be gone, and having to constantly find farms or make new ones makes the game much too hard to manage.
On T3 the crop problem is solved somewhat by the main village and also by crop oases. It is just that the main village takes time to build up, with a lv15 or 16 field taking up to a day or two to upgrade. (even on the 3x speed server lv16 fields took a day...although I did have a village with over 60k crop production ^_^)
Having to raid all the crop to feed army is downright horrible and takes way too much time. All the late game accounts I had a chance to manage were way easier my s5, since I just have to send crop from villages with crop to the consumption village.
Another misconception about hte game is that it is all about resources, when it is really all about time. The best strategy is not one that which makes income cheapest (troops and raids) but one which expands income the most during a set period of time. In this way building high level fields is more effective time wise for income generation than simply raiding troops. Plus, you'll be overflowing with resources when your raiding income reach a certain level (this is the "flying" stage in which all methods of production are in full boom, troops, buildings, chiefs, parties, all building) you will pretty much ignore marginal cost/income analysis in favor of net income generation. But then again some factors of production depends on your activity level and luck, so one must be careful to not rely too much on those. The general rule is this, build as much cheap cp as possible, and get villages asap. Try to get 5 or 6 chiefs ready, and by that time (shouldn't take a very long time, I think it took Cina all but a month on 3x speed T3 with a gaul) just go on conquering, your account is going to be unholy powerful compared to pretty much anyone else at that point anyways, assuming you raid diligently and smartly
So for me I measure the abilty of a travian player to do two things, kill and make money. Some players, (cina for example) value only high pop, and say the purpose of an army is to get higher pop easier, and the purpose of alliances is for bullying and protection, that's just so womanish. bleh. If you are going to invest time and energy into a game with the ability to kick someone else's ass, by all means, try to kick as much ass as possible. Running a highly offensive account is where the fun is, but late game travian doesn't allow for this.
I can only assume that you misunderstood/ did not quite get the context of that strategy. As it refers to how to grow fastest early game (while 90% of your post refer to late game) where everything is about ressources. Also noone was talking about conquering fast. The point was made that conquering is more effective than founding a 2nd or 3rd village.
Yes that means supplying your growing army exclusively with raiding and merchanting (and crop from your main village). Still more effective than founding if you do the math.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
umm, it was definitely not more effective, since first there are very few targets around when I had 2 or 3 villages, and also I had only one or two chief. Then to conquer I'd have to use my army, which must be fed by raiding. If I have only one chief, i'll have to send 5 cleaners, which absolutely is not acceptable. Even when there are 2 or 3 villages, I was pumping TK clubs 24/7, even though making chiefs are still very expensive because of teh cost of residences.
Definitely settle a few more villages before conquering, unless there is a 600 pop towne 1 or 2 squares away from your army. get at least 4 or 5 villages (shouldn't take very long to do so, by this time most players will only have their first little expansion at 100 pop) so you'll have an easier time finding targets and have the chiefs to take the village in less time. Founding a new village doesn't mean you want the resources or crop, but have one more production spot where you can hold parties.
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Do the math. You don't need a 2nd village- founding it only takes resources away from a way more profitable source of income- your army. Thus staying with your main village until there ARE these 600 pop targets is more profitable even tough more stressful too due to crop.
5 cleanerwaves is no problem at all at these close distances. (not even mentioning that you'll ofc pick some simcity player...)
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
sometimes the numbers dont tell the whole story.
the reason ascelon/oneofthem and other players that employed a similar playstyle couldnt conquer early was the massive crop issues that would come with commiitting their army for an extended period of time
I remember quite a few kaz attacks where other pple had to feed his army while they were on their way, and I had to do the same thing when doing my final attack. (i was actually given the speed artifact to reduce this crop burden because it was just SO bad)
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
perhaps my time playing speed server has distorted my opinion on this, but villages are so easy to get, and CP pile up too fast to be waiting for conquering opportunities. Unless you get your villages set up very slowly, just make a new village. It isn't that big of a deal whether you conquer the same village one week earlier or later.
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
so what happened on the speed server?
is it over?
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
yeah it is over. The alliance I made actually "won" by being the biggest, but meh.
My achievement on the speedserver is basically getting 100k army by november 8th or something like that. I dont' recall the time when the server started though.
Then i gave my acc away to a noob.
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
haha classic.
*goes back to reading haruhi volume 1*
this shit is weird.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
looool! enjoy your load of japan stuff. >_> (I want the shana novel!!)
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
lol i can give you the scans if you want. I think i dl'ed them a year ago or so (but I bought it anywyas b/c scans just dont do it for me for text. it's okay for manga i've found)
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is awesome32269 Posts
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
lol agu you're like the last person i would have expected to have seen the show
edit: finished reading it. original. very.
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is awesome32269 Posts
I seen the anime only though. Dronebabo showed me.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
Haruhi is very accessible really. btw this is seriously off topic now. maybe we'll discuss the pokemon fad...locky you there?
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
yea sry for driving it offtopic.
does locked even have internet?
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is awesome32269 Posts
I havent seen him in a long time.
This is like Travian irc
Anyone remember the beg msg's thread? can someone bring some funny ones here? :D
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
edit: server hasn't reset yet, so access to the original tl board is still possible.
If you want to see the old tl board, pm me for a log in and use this address http://s4.travian.com/allianz.php?s=2
+ Show Spoiler +
(If neo oks this then I can release an account in tl alliance)
The other tl board is here
http://makephpbb.com/phpbb/index.php?mforum=tlalliances
The whining messages:
+ Show Spoiler +
Jimmy_Igel 27.02.06
RE^4: no topic 22:07:11
it's mayby not hard but its a work, which is not necessery.
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Kazansky wrote:
What do you mean? Anyway, it's not hard to upgrade your cranny to a point where when I raid you I steal nothing, so I stop attacking you.
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Jimmy_Igel wrote:
i hope there will be someone who makes this with you
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Kazansky wrote:
You are too attractive of a target. If you don't want me to attack you make some crannies or something.
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Jimmy_Igel wrote:
don't attack me anymore pls!
Igel
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Alexieus XII 05.03.06
no topic 05:00:07
Decafchicken of the your alliance attacked me, unprevoked, I request that you please help restrain him from attacking again.
Thanks.
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Khazad 07.03.06
no topic 22:43:30
a member of your alliance(bongo something) has attacked a member of my alliance for no reason, could you please send him a message not to attack him anymore-my friend didn't do any harm to him or your alliance.
Baruk Khazad
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Dear theDeadHaji,
I find that you need clay.
Do you think will you accept a gift of 200 clay from me, so that you sign NAP with our alliance, PS ??
Thanks for reading the message and looking forward for your kind reply.
regards, jj
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blasterd 12.03.06
no topic 00:51:25
Fuck You, you little fucker get a god damn life instead of attacking someone fucking 8 times within 24 hours. Go get get a fuck budy or something but what i predict is that you will go fuck your mom and never leave your house again you fucking loser. so fuck you fuck this game and most of all fuck your mom!.... so you have a big army that is like being the smartest kid with down syndrome! get a fucking life you fucking douche.
love,
blasterd.
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bmwz4 wrote:
What are you doing? You are making such a big mistake as the terrorists with their bombing on London!
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hi, you are attacking me way too often, can u at least give me a 24hrs break before you raid me again? If u keep this up, i will have to demolish my warehouse, so you wont get anything.
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losethefaith 27.03.06
no topic 16:31:09
why do you still atack me ? i have 4 cranny lvl 10 .. u dont have a fucking chance
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Fairlady z is my name. i am only a very very small country.
U always attacked on me. pls let me free. i am from HK. Pls
Check your attacking history, you have already taken out
Kindly reminder you stop your action on me.
Y u always attacking me
Or you are only a very very small potato
U better see on the first character on each line!
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Kazansky
-TL-
I have no clue who this guy is lol he's pretty far from me. He stopped talking after my last message ^^
Would you like me to cata you or get you banned for insulting me with profane language?
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apoelistas wrote:
I don't care just send me the recources before i attack u
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Kazansky wrote:
Are you sure you have the right person? I have no clue who you are.
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apoelistas wrote:
U learn something today from me. I AM TEACHING U MANY THINGS so pay me some recources
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Kazansky wrote:
Uh... no I did not know that. Who are you?
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apoelistas wrote:
You are idiot u know that mother fucker?
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Argh- is it really so hard to comprehend what I'm saying?  Is my english that bad or non coherent? Or is it just that ppl read so superficially?
Noone is talking about mid or lategame, "maintaining large armies" and crop problems are not the issue. The point is that settling in general -is- -teh- -crap0r- It's ineffective ressourcewise when compared to raiding. PERIOD.
And thus (and this is just the second step of the argument, see ?) it is more effective to not fucking settle and even not waste ressources on building up your fields but just build up storage, barrack, and teh lil swingerclubs, clubs, clubs until you can eventually conquer. Ah yeah, it's ok to build crop fields. Barely.
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United States37500 Posts
On January 06 2007 13:44 oneofthem wrote:
Haruhi is very accessible really. btw this is seriously off topic now. maybe we'll discuss the pokemon fad...locky you there?
Locked is still on vacation. Kyari said he'll be back in 4-5 days.
Snorlax is cute. Slaking is imba.
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United States37500 Posts
I don't mind ascelon. I'll even offer my own account. I trust TL doesn't have asshole who will attempt to change the password. >_> Granted, I can just email myself password recovery and there's nothing in the account that you can change since the entire server is locked.
s4.travian.com
TL Neo // nike4TL
P.S.: To those of you who do log into my account, look at the village "02~ Kazansky". Look at how fast crop goes down and calculate the crop upkeep I have to maintain on a regular basis. XD
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United States37500 Posts
On January 06 2007 16:50 Monsen wrote:Argh- is it really so hard to comprehend what I'm saying? Is my english that bad or non coherent? Or is it just that ppl read so superficially? Noone is talking about mid or lategame, "maintaining large armies" and crop problems are not the issue. The point is that settling in general -is- -teh- -crap0r- It's ineffective ressourcewise when compared to raiding. PERIOD. And thus (and this is just the second step of the argument, see ?) it is more effective to not fucking settle and even not waste ressources on building up your fields but just build up storage, barrack, and teh lil swingerclubs, clubs, clubs until you can eventually conquer. Ah yeah, it's ok to build crop fields. Barely.
What you're saying is probably most optimal in a "play 24/7" setting. But the fact that most people will have a certain window in each day where they can't log on, fields prove to be rather necessary.
On top of that, most people don't have developed villages on 9/15 crop settlements. So when you conquer, you can only conquer some guy's main village, granted that he didn't build a palace first and that he expanded already. Otherwise, it's better to settle in a 15 crop as your first expansion, no?
And isn't it better to settle in a 15 crop farther away (about 20 squares out) and build up a rax immediately and pump clubs and have another raiding village? 20 squares out, your two villages wouldn't overlap farms too much and you can easily expand your raiding radii more effectively. If you conquer your 2nd village first, instead of settling, I think most people would choose a village close by, and that in effect would add pop, save time, increase CP, but wouldn't do too much to help you raid faster/more effectively.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On January 06 2007 16:50 Monsen wrote:Argh- is it really so hard to comprehend what I'm saying? Is my english that bad or non coherent? Or is it just that ppl read so superficially? Noone is talking about mid or lategame, "maintaining large armies" and crop problems are not the issue. The point is that settling in general -is- -teh- -crap0r- It's ineffective ressourcewise when compared to raiding. PERIOD. And thus (and this is just the second step of the argument, see ?) it is more effective to not fucking settle and even not waste ressources on building up your fields but just build up storage, barrack, and teh lil swingerclubs, clubs, clubs until you can eventually conquer. Ah yeah, it's ok to build crop fields. Barely.
You said conquest is the most resource efficient, implying resources are still a concern, and that there are other projects requiring investment. Then, given the fairly high initial investment for chief as a percentage of your account's production, it is fair to say that these resources devoted to chiefs wont be producing anything productive soon. Also, it takes time to build academy and residences, why not build a lv10 townhall during the same time and upgrade market and mb, while at the same time a new village can be built up reasonably quickly. Another concern is that CP will definitely build up very quickly, and if you were to conquer with 2 or 3 villages, there is no way you can avoid wasting CP. I have experienced this first hand. On s5 I think I conquered my third village while having enough CP for 5 or 6 villages, that is totally not acceptable.
Yes, conquest is the fastest way to grow when taken as an instantaneous event compared to founding a village, but there are various real game situations that make conquering too early inefficient. At the very least, do not conquer unless you have 3 chiefs. There is no need to conquer just to save some resources when you are wasting serious time doing it.
I know what you are saying, and you are wrong. It may be more resource efficient, but not more time efficient and management efficient. On regular server T2, the top players will do this: get 2nd village in 10 or 12 days, get 15 crop, get 3rd village 9 crop in another week, get a village near potential conquest target or get another 9 or 15 crop in another week. On regular server T3, you can get 4 villages in 5 weeks, plus the -10% conquering rule (when you conquer a village, all of its buildings are reduced by 1 level, i know, sucks) and the capital rule, there is no way in hell you can conquer another village during that time.
Here is the situation of me village on speed T3 when I had 2 villages (rank top 2)
+ Show Spoiler +As you can see, I still had major problems with resources, and the fields aren't even built up yet. There is no way I can manage a chief without delaying growth significantly. This is when I started conquering chains on the same account. It was still difficult getting enough resources to queue residences, trust me.
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
omg when i saw those screen shots my body gave me some kind of allergic reaction TT_TT
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United States37500 Posts
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my god my maximun number of villages was 13 or something like that...and that sucked! time consuming as hell,. i kinda abadoned the game when my sleep time was being reduced :p
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On January 06 2007 17:22 NeoIllusions wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2007 16:50 Monsen wrote:Argh- is it really so hard to comprehend what I'm saying? Is my english that bad or non coherent? Or is it just that ppl read so superficially? Noone is talking about mid or lategame, "maintaining large armies" and crop problems are not the issue. The point is that settling in general -is- -teh- -crap0r- It's ineffective ressourcewise when compared to raiding. PERIOD. And thus (and this is just the second step of the argument, see ?) it is more effective to not fucking settle and even not waste ressources on building up your fields but just build up storage, barrack, and teh lil swingerclubs, clubs, clubs until you can eventually conquer. Ah yeah, it's ok to build crop fields. Barely. What you're saying is probably most optimal in a "play 24/7" setting. But the fact that most people will have a certain window in each day where they can't log on, fields prove to be rather necessary. On top of that, most people don't have developed villages on 9/15 crop settlements. So when you conquer, you can only conquer some guy's main village, granted that he didn't build a palace first and that he expanded already. Otherwise, it's better to settle in a 15 crop as your first expansion, no? And isn't it better to settle in a 15 crop farther away (about 20 squares out) and build up a rax immediately and pump clubs and have another raiding village? 20 squares out, your two villages wouldn't overlap farms too much and you can easily expand your raiding radii more effectively. If you conquer your 2nd village first, instead of settling, I think most people would choose a village close by, and that in effect would add pop, save time, increase CP, but wouldn't do too much to help you raid faster/more effectively.
Exactly. And that was all I was saying. It IS the most effective, even if most time consuming way to play early on. A 2nd farming village comes in handy, will however not be as nessesary for gauls for example. Can you please explain the issue to oneofthem, I seem to utterly fail there.
Edit: You won't believe how many ppl fall for the "hey a residence is cheaper than a palace and can do the same" argument. The will be plenty of nice targets.
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On January 06 2007 18:23 oneofthem wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2007 16:50 Monsen wrote:Argh- is it really so hard to comprehend what I'm saying? Is my english that bad or non coherent? Or is it just that ppl read so superficially? Noone is talking about mid or lategame, "maintaining large armies" and crop problems are not the issue. The point is that settling in general -is- -teh- -crap0r- It's ineffective ressourcewise when compared to raiding. PERIOD. And thus (and this is just the second step of the argument, see ?) it is more effective to not fucking settle and even not waste ressources on building up your fields but just build up storage, barrack, and teh lil swingerclubs, clubs, clubs until you can eventually conquer. Ah yeah, it's ok to build crop fields. Barely. You said conquest is the most resource efficient, implying resources are still a concern, and that there are other projects requiring investment. Then, given the fairly high initial investment for chief as a percentage of your account's production, it is fair to say that these resources devoted to chiefs wont be producing anything productive soon. Also, it takes time to build academy and residences, why not build a lv10 townhall during the same time and upgrade market and mb, while at the same time a new village can be built up reasonably quickly. Another concern is that CP will definitely build up very quickly, and if you were to conquer with 2 or 3 villages, there is no way you can avoid wasting CP. I have experienced this first hand. On s5 I think I conquered my third village while having enough CP for 5 or 6 villages, that is totally not acceptable. Yes, conquest is the fastest way to grow when taken as an instantaneous event compared to founding a village, but there are various real game situations that make conquering too early inefficient. At the very least, do not conquer unless you have 3 chiefs. There is no need to conquer just to save some resources when you are wasting serious time doing it. I know what you are saying, and you are wrong. It may be more resource efficient, but not more time efficient and management efficient. On regular server T2, the top players will do this: get 2nd village in 10 or 12 days, get 15 crop, get 3rd village 9 crop in another week, get a village near potential conquest target or get another 9 or 15 crop in another week. On regular server T3, you can get 4 villages in 5 weeks, plus the -10% conquering rule (when you conquer a village, all of its buildings are reduced by 1 level, i know, sucks) and the capital rule, there is no way in hell you can conquer another village during that time. Here is the situation of me village on speed T3 when I had 2 villages (rank top 2) + Show Spoiler +As you can see, I still had major problems with resources, and the fields aren't even built up yet. There is no way I can manage a chief without delaying growth significantly. This is when I started conquering chains on the same account. It was still difficult getting enough resources to queue residences, trust me.
Sorry dude, you don't even get the initial point that army/raiding > villages. Please ask Neo to explain it to you, I can't.
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This thread makes me sad that I quit (I was right in the middle of it) but at the same time if I hadn't then I would probably wouldn't have had the time for school so.
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wow, i got my login right on the first try and it still works after so long :D
EDIT: WTF MY VILLAGE AND EXPO ARE STILL UP hahahahaah
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Wow, TL wins the internet once more... Congrats people!
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On January 07 2007 11:39 Monsen wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2007 18:23 oneofthem wrote:On January 06 2007 16:50 Monsen wrote:Argh- is it really so hard to comprehend what I'm saying? Is my english that bad or non coherent? Or is it just that ppl read so superficially? Noone is talking about mid or lategame, "maintaining large armies" and crop problems are not the issue. The point is that settling in general -is- -teh- -crap0r- It's ineffective ressourcewise when compared to raiding. PERIOD. And thus (and this is just the second step of the argument, see ?) it is more effective to not fucking settle and even not waste ressources on building up your fields but just build up storage, barrack, and teh lil swingerclubs, clubs, clubs until you can eventually conquer. Ah yeah, it's ok to build crop fields. Barely. You said conquest is the most resource efficient, implying resources are still a concern, and that there are other projects requiring investment. Then, given the fairly high initial investment for chief as a percentage of your account's production, it is fair to say that these resources devoted to chiefs wont be producing anything productive soon. Also, it takes time to build academy and residences, why not build a lv10 townhall during the same time and upgrade market and mb, while at the same time a new village can be built up reasonably quickly. Another concern is that CP will definitely build up very quickly, and if you were to conquer with 2 or 3 villages, there is no way you can avoid wasting CP. I have experienced this first hand. On s5 I think I conquered my third village while having enough CP for 5 or 6 villages, that is totally not acceptable. Yes, conquest is the fastest way to grow when taken as an instantaneous event compared to founding a village, but there are various real game situations that make conquering too early inefficient. At the very least, do not conquer unless you have 3 chiefs. There is no need to conquer just to save some resources when you are wasting serious time doing it. I know what you are saying, and you are wrong. It may be more resource efficient, but not more time efficient and management efficient. On regular server T2, the top players will do this: get 2nd village in 10 or 12 days, get 15 crop, get 3rd village 9 crop in another week, get a village near potential conquest target or get another 9 or 15 crop in another week. On regular server T3, you can get 4 villages in 5 weeks, plus the -10% conquering rule (when you conquer a village, all of its buildings are reduced by 1 level, i know, sucks) and the capital rule, there is no way in hell you can conquer another village during that time. Here is the situation of me village on speed T3 when I had 2 villages (rank top 2) + Show Spoiler +As you can see, I still had major problems with resources, and the fields aren't even built up yet. There is no way I can manage a chief without delaying growth significantly. This is when I started conquering chains on the same account. It was still difficult getting enough resources to queue residences, trust me. Sorry dude, you don't even get the initial point that army/raiding > villages. Please ask Neo to explain it to you, I can't. er, no. I > you in travian. Keep in mind that I am assuming 24/7 production of troops.
That you do not even get the initial point of "effective = time effective" makes you unqualified to dispute my opinions on travian. Did you even bother to read?
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Ask Neo- I won't bother anymore.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
yeah ok, seems you fail to understand that there are different usages of "effective." -__-
I dont see anything in neo's post that would contradict what I've said.
army/raiding > villages
er, no shit. What part of this is related to how quickly you use up your expansion slot for a chief that probably wont be used in a week while your CP piles up into high heavens? If you play your way, and I play my way, I guarantee you that I'll have more army and more villages by the end of it.
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calm down.
Noone is talking about mid or lategame, "maintaining large armies" and crop problems are not the issue. The point is that settling in general -is- -teh- -crap0r- It's ineffective ressourcewise when compared to raiding. PERIOD.
And thus (and this is just the second step of the argument, see ?) it is more effective to not fucking settle and even not waste ressources on building up your fields but just build up storage, barrack, and teh lil swingerclubs, clubs, clubs until you can eventually conquer. Ah yeah, it's ok to build crop fields. Barely.
when you stated that "settling in general -is- -teh- -crap0r- It's ineffective ressourcewise when compared to raiding. PERIOD." you leave out important factors (time and management) that should be included.
oneofthem is arguing practicality and gives compelling reasons why settling isn't -teh crapzorss- :D
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No. I stated about 7 billion times that it is the most time/management consuming way to play.
CPs piling up don't change the fact that army > villages. Which you appearantly don't get since "I'm assuming 24/7 production" means 24/7 production out of a level 20 barracs. Which means about 720 swingerclub/day (not to mention the stables) and you wont ever be able to produce that at the point of the game where you could start settling a 2nd village.
You don't see anything in Neos post that contradics you because you simply don't get the theory behind this stategy. So I suggest you either let him explain it to you or do some serious rethinking of your own, Mr.Iownyouattravian.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
I stated about 7 billion times that it is the most time/management consuming way to play.
Which is irrelevant to the issue of whether it is the fastest way to grow as constrained by game mechanics.
Which you appearantly don't get since "I'm talking about 24/7 production" means 24/7 production out of a level 20 barracs. Which is also irrelevant to the choice of method of first or second expansion. The discussion is about whether settling sucks without redemption, not whether building troops > villages. Learn to read. By the time your income level is high enough to build chiefs WHILE building troops at full capacity, a player who also grew so that he could pump 700 clubs a day but settled at first opportunity would already be running on 2 more villages while also nearly finishing chief tech. Is this clearer now, Mr. Idontgetit?
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for something completely different
say you started near garandou, only he was like RO-garandou the romanian speaking evil version of garandou, sworn to kill you and your family. what strategy is there to defeat him?
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
For the first few days, raid well, build clubs, upgrade rax, build nothing else. Send occasional fakes against him while making sure you have some crannies. Then when you have about 100 clubs go provoke a fight.
Just time kill garandou's clubs and he's done, raid him every couple of hours or something and make sure to get cata soon to cata him down. But I have to say garandou raids very well early game, and we have about the same number of clubs early. Early game struggles is about game theory and timing/luck, so zvz.
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Wow, you're really retarded.
"Expanding" is just another way of getting more ressources. So is building more troops to raid.
Putting money into 2nd village -> less money into troops.
Since army > village -> 2nd village < more troops.
Thus you play without second village until you reach the limit of your production capabilities/or/ conquering overtakes raiding in effectiveness/or/ your farming efficiency decreases so much due to range that getting a 2nd farming village is more effective (which is the only valid point for a second village, the point that Neo makes AND the point that you never brought up, because you simply suck at travian).
I can't make it any simpler than that. If you don't get it by now, you'll have to die dumb.
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United States37500 Posts
Monsen, ascelon, stop with the flames please...
It's just two different playing styles and a lot of misunderstanding here. Talk civilly or go along your merry way.
Thanks.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
"Expanding" is just another way of getting more ressources. No, it is also another way to get more infrastructure/expansion slots/production base. The game is not about how much resources is in your warehouse, but how much stuff you can build. A second village is not only about the resource fields, what is it about? Maybe you should think about that!
Thus you play without second village until you reach the limit of your production capabilities/or/ conquering overtakes raiding in effectiveness/or/ your farming efficiency decreases so much due to range that getting a 2nd farming village is more effective
Did you bother analysing whether a second village will enlarge your production capabilities and thus generate MORE income than you've invested in it?
Are you assuming that the income you get from raiding is balanced such that you can build stuff in this manner without encountering situations in which either resource imbalance or lack of crop prevents you from upgrading your production building and/or queuing troops?
CPs piling up don't change the fact that army > villages.
Army > villages doesn't change the fact that villages > army when it comes to building new army and new villages.
Putting money into 2nd village -> less money into troops. That is only valid if one were to continuously build troops while upgrading barracks and other production facilities continuously while only making warehouse/granaries. Then, let me see the analysis that spending time building lv19/20 rax is more effective than setting a new village and building a new rax at MAKING troops in a period of time. Then, what happens if you have surplus income while also proceeding along the maximizing troop production build order? Will you waste the resources and get 0 return or spending a little time to get a new village and production center? Then, how much time does it to build tech for a chief from the basic infrastructure, compared to time used in building the infrastructure? What happens if you can found a new village and then get a chief from that new village in about the same time that you build a chief from one village?
In any case, you have already, by acknowledging that troops income is constrained by various factors, made your argument pertinent to only situations where these constraints are satisfied. Needlessly to say you play in a highly idealized game that has never been tried in practice so the various questions important to the effectiveness of your strategy cannot be answered. For example, when you reach production capacity ceiling, are there already profitable enough conquest targets, and if not, is the time waiting for them to grow up long enough for you to build up a second settled village and then get conquering tech, since right now there is absolutely no way for you to spend your money except queuing troops that wont come out in a week? Given the highly idealized state of play in which you operate on, and that there are still questions left unanswered in such a state, I do not see why you would insist that "settling is teh crapzors" with such absolute confidence. Of course, in all other situations we can freely discard your rants as irrelevant, and "settling in general -is- -teh- -crap0r-" as bullshit. I already stated that my argument is that settling, in certain situations, in fact, most if not all situations that occur in normal play, is superior to waiting for chiefs, and there are no instances in which your argument even touched me. Sorry.
There are blatant contradictions in your posts, but since the idea of framing your arguments clearly does not occur to you, I'm not sure if these are just contradictions or separate arguments.
Noone is talking about mid or lategame, "maintaining large armies" and crop problems are not the issue. The point is that settling in general -is- -teh- -crap0r- It's ineffective ressourcewise when compared to raiding. PERIOD.
CPs piling up don't change the fact that army > villages. Which you appearantly don't get since "I'm assuming 24/7 production" means 24/7 production out of a level 20 barracs. Which means about 720 swingerclub/day (not to mention the stables) and you wont ever be able to produce that at the point of the game where you could start settling a 2nd village.
So, what the fuck are you arguing about really? 720 clubs a day plus several hundred pallies a day for the 20 or so days to upgrade everything to lv20 will give you insane crop problems, and there is no way these two quotes are talking about the same situation.
The point is that settling in general -is- -teh- -crap0r- It's ineffective ressourcewise when compared to raiding. PERIOD. I'll explain your own argument to you. You should declare your POINT after your ARGUMENT. if your argument is "settling is ineffective resourcewise" then there are about a billion arguments against drawing the conclusion "settling in general is the crapzor" from that argument.
But of course, since you are arguing from an idealizd state of the game while not bothering to limit your conclusions to this idealized state, there is no way you can even play in the real game. Stop wasting our time if what you say is just "if you play 24/7 and find perfect farms then maybe in select situations it is better to conquer than to settle."
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Raiding is by far the most important source of income in the early game, but this importance becomes smaller as the game progresses. In theory, you maybe can create and sustain a giant army in very few villages, but -- apart from the practical limitations -- there's not really a need to do this. I haven't done the math, but I think with all the raiding income, you can afford to go Sim City to a certain extent. The investment in troops becomes less efficient over time, and may even hit a plateau.
Ascelon/Zerg relied heavily on army on s5, and was ahead of me in military strength for the first weeks of the server. I relied mostly on army, too, but gradually increased my "Sim-City-ness" over time, still devoting 70-80% of my resources to troops, but filling up the plus queues in as many villages as possible, and, more importantly, settling/conquering as soon as I had the CPs. With the triple income from raiding, trading, and fields, I was able to maintain a larger army than Ascelon, while having less negative crop consumption.
Ideal world: Army only. Real world: Balance of army and Sim City.
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Osaka27131 Posts
this is going downhill, I am moving it to the HoF where it belongs.
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United States37500 Posts
le sigh... thanks for having your online cock battling contest in this thread. -_-
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Ideal assumtions? By no means. Do the math and be astonished about the cost/profit ratios you get when calculating troops vs villages. Even with only 1 successful (!) attack/day raiding is so endlessly superior to fields in early game.
1. Who said it has never been tried or tested? My roommate played exactly that way while I got a second village- it showed that this was a waste of ressources.
Since you, on the contrary, seem to have no idea of the points in the game when certain levels of production/tech are achieved with this way of playing, you utterly fail to get what it's driving at.
You will never, ever reach a production of 700ish clubs und whatnot pallies before conquering becomes viable. Raiding will easily supply all the crop you need if you're using merchants. It is only when you start getting vast killing armies that raiding might fail to provide sufficient crop. Since we're talking about early game your point with crop is nonsense.
2. "Expanding is only another way of getting ressources." It is. The only point of having a second village is to increase raiding efficiency by reducing range. However the point where your raiding efficiency decreases so much that settling becomes viable lies in most cases (unless there are several other "Biggies" around you reducing your farming extremely) way later than the point where conquest is viable. It's funny how you point out the cost of 19->20 barracs and in the next sentence ask what to do with the spare ressources once you use it's capacity to the fullest. Do you have any idea about the amount of ressources you're talking about? You'll have conquered your 5th village before that happens.
I like to remind you, that it was you that was "assuming 24/7 production". With the 19/20 barracs I was merely pointing out that you could never reach real 24/7 production at this stage of the game. Nevertheless just fyi: 2 level 10 barracs- club output/day: 492 - 1 level 17(!) barracs- club output/day: 505 (costs including settlers are 131360 to 170860, CP are 12 to 22).
Yes, the profits of getting another production base will sometime surpass the costs. It will however never surpass the profit of not settling, investing in raiding troops instead, and keeping the slot for a chieftain rather than settlers.
The higher level of your infrastructure will easily make up for the CPs a 2nd village would generate.
3. Conquering: A point that has not been made yet as I thought it was obvious: a successful conquest (and at the stage of the game it is like a 99% percent chance) will gain you several 100.000 ressources in infrastructure as opposed to having to invest in a settled 2nd village. PLUS you will most likely gain 1 chief slot since your victim is certain to delete after losing everything. The advantage of this can not be measured- getting chief first instead of settlers means saving vast amount of ressources (for building palace up to 15/20) and in the end always having 1 chieftain more than you'd have if you had settled.
Last and least- From the start of the discussion I said that plenty of time/management is a precondition for this early game strategy. All other points are based on that. So if you have plenty of time then settling is always inferior to raiding (and conquering). I guess I did not stress that point enough.
I'm sorry Neo that it has come to this. Even though the thread was not that much visited anymore I am sad that I for once am part of fulfilling one of the more disgusting laws of the internet: that you can't have a celebration without someone spoiling it with arguments or flames.
I seem to lack a strength you possess as I could not take shit from someone who had no clue about even the existence of Travian while I was already done with it after hardcore playing it for one and a half season. Even if it's too late now I'll end this here. Congratulations again.
Edit: The 10% reduce rule is new to travian so take away some % of the gains you'll have by conquering.
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is awesome32269 Posts
blasterd 12.03.06
no topic 00:51:25
Fuck You, you little fucker get a god damn life instead of attacking someone fucking 8 times within 24 hours. Go get get a fuck budy or something but what i predict is that you will go fuck your mom and never leave your house again you fucking loser. so fuck you fuck this game and most of all fuck your mom!.... so you have a big army that is like being the smartest kid with down syndrome! get a fucking life you fucking douche.
love,
blasterd.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
bmwz4 wrote:
What are you doing? You are making such a big mistake as the terrorists with their bombing on London!
ROFL
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Just found this thread! Read most of it, nice write up Neo.
Kudos to everyone from TL that stuck around for 10 months with me, you know who you are.
I would suggest that anyone reading this not play this game if they would like a social life. It definitely has it's moments but in the end the time commitment is insane.
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The hatemail was the only thing that keep me going in the last months. Post some more plz
I kept a particular fine one, it's in german however so no use to most of you.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
Based on how you ignore addressing my points directly, I have to say it seems some of them went over your head. If you bother to point to a specific example of playing this way instead of declaring obvious points that are not even being discussed then maybe I can do a better job of illustrating the flaws of your strategy.
On January 08 2007 05:21 Monsen wrote:
Ideal assumtions? By no means. Do the math and be astonished about the cost/profit ratios you get when calculating troops vs villages. Even with only 1 successful (!) attack/day raiding is so endlessly superior to fields in early game. Obviously, if I did not get this point, I would not be writing here. But I do not get a second village to get fields. For a second village that is founded say 14 days after the game starts, the important objectives are : secure a good location, get 2nd army, get more expansion slots and CP. In another 2 weeks that village would be at the same basic level of infrastructure to be ready to conquer, and I can get a chief from main village too. That's a free village, another raiding center, and more expansion slots compared to someone who conquers in a month. That you even bother to argue that settling is a waste of expansion slot shows that you have not exactly appreciated how a new village means new slots, and that the entire point of conquest over settling is not because it gives more slots but that it is the fastest way to grow.
1. Who said it has never been tried or tested? My roommate played exactly that way while I got a second village- it showed that this was a waste of ressources.
The point is, you have made a point that "settling sucks in general," and the argument you proposed is not sufficient to support this point without huge assumptions. Further, the "ideal state" of the game is one that you seemed to suggest in which tropo production should be maximized before getting a new village, at which point conquest is superior to settling. Since you managed to repudiate that claim in teh very next paragraph I'll let that go.
Since you, on the contrary, seem to have no idea of the points in the game when certain levels of production/tech are achieved with this way of playing, you utterly fail to get what it's driving at. Erm, are you so superior at farming early game to be able to say that to me? Do you know how I play early game?
You will never, ever reach a production of 700ish clubs und whatnot pallies before conquering becomes viable. Raiding will easily supply all the crop you need if you're using merchants. It is only when you start getting vast killing armies that raiding might fail to provide sufficient crop. Since we're talking about early game your point with crop is nonsense. hahhaa, so your framing of the exact instance of the game to which you refer is so unclear that my attempt at clarifying what you are talking about went over your head. Congratulations.
2. "Expanding is only another way of getting ressources." It is. The only point of having a second village is to increase raiding efficiency by reducing range. However the point where your raiding efficiency decreases so much that settling becomes viable lies in most cases (unless there are several other "Biggies" around you reducing your farming extremely) way later than the point where conquest is viable. It's funny how you point out the cost of 19->20 barracs and in the next sentence ask what to do with the spare ressources once you use it's capacity to the fullest. Do you have any idea about the amount of ressources you're talking about? You'll have conquered your 5th village before that happens.
That is only a hypothetical branch consideration made only because you failed to frame your argument cleanly. Thanks for clarifying that now.
I like to remind you, that it was you that was "assuming 24/7 production". With the 19/20 barracs I was merely pointing out that you could never reach real 24/7 production at this stage of the game. Nevertheless just fyi: 2 level 10 barracs- club output/day: 492 - 1 level 17(!) barracs- club output/day: 505 (costs including settlers are 131360 to 170860, CP are 12 to 22).
Yes, the profits of getting another production base will sometime surpass the costs. It will however never surpass the profit of not settling, investing in raiding troops instead, and keeping the slot for a chieftain rather than settlers. So what is the point of saving the slot? Resources? Time? CP? Founding a new village and then getting 2 slots out of that plus a new village is much more profitable from all fronts except end game CP considerations.
When i said building troops 24/7 i of course meant that troop production was not sacrificed for "simcity," it is you who made an argumetn against that and suggested that my 24/7 production was not worthy enough of a good account, the inference being that settling sucks if it prevents higher level pf troop production. That argument has been demolished a numbe of times already from different angles.
The higher level of your infrastructure will easily make up for the CPs a 2nd village would generate.
Imagine your strategy of conquest, it takes time A to successfully conquer. Would it not b ereasonable to expect that someone could found a new village during interval A and still be able to conquer by A? Not to say one village, 2 or 3 villages even! A new village typically does this: build storage/main building lv10, build townhall, party. The 500 cp a day from a 100 pop village is very helpful, and the only cost is resources. Resources that will only go toward overflowing your warehouse or lengthening your troop queue. Or are you still suggesting that we should expand production capacity to maximum before seeking alternative methods of investing resources?
3. Conquering: A point that has not been made yet as I thought it was obvious: a successful conquest (and at the stage of the game it is like a 99% percent chance) will gain you several 100.000 ressources in infrastructure as opposed to having to invest in a settled 2nd village. Doubtful. It is difficult to conquer without losing too much army if the potential target is in an alliance, especially one of the nationalistic clans. You cannot say 99% chance of success for conquest if nearly everyone who played travian for tl has had bad conquest experiences.
PLUS you will most likely gain 1 chief slot since your victim is certain to delete after losing everything. The advantage of this can not be measured- getting chief first instead of settlers means saving vast amount of ressources (for building palace up to 15/20) and in the end always having 1 chieftain more than you'd have if you had settled. Not if the guy who settled has 5 more villages than you. Furthermore, not all people delete immediately. It takes 3 days. CP piles up so fast that waiting for an uncertain deletion when you have only a few slots is a great risk. Trust me, there are people who do not delete immediately when they only have a 20 pop village. it happened to me.
Last and least- From the start of the discussion I said that plenty of time/management is a precondition for this early game strategy. All other points are based on that. So if you have plenty of time then settling is always inferior to raiding (and conquering). I guess I did not stress that point enough. The basic point is that conquering is different from settling not by the instantenous moment of village acquisition but the whole build order. It takes very little marginal investment in settling while conquest is a huge investment. One could found a new village just by careful raiding management. Given the option of conquering a new village or founding one, if you had a chief and 3 settlers ready, of course I will conquer every time, but that is not the issue.
I'm sorry Neo that it has come to this. Even though the thread was not that much visited anymore I am sad that I for once am part of fulfilling one of the more disgusting laws of the internet: that you can't have a celebration without someone spoiling it with arguments or flames.
Sorry that you started the flaming, I only said that there should not be a stigma on founding villages. Why do you feel that your "one and a half season's experience" makes you enough of an authority to call me a retard and noob in travian? I know for a fact that I play better than all but a handful of players on .com servers. On s3 .com because it was the first T3 speed server there were .org players playing, such as the guys who won the .org server, or the WEG people. I can honestly say that I played better than all of them by far. There is another player Hunter (dual account) who made the first conquest on the server when he had 3 villages (by that time I had 5 or 6 and a superior army), but did that profit him very much? Not really. The new village does not have troops in it, and it had only 300 or 400 more CP production than a founded village, plus it was not in a location that is chosen optimally because of the freedom fo having more locations to settle than to conquer. I think overall that account was played by a strategy that is very similar to yours at a very high level, maybe you can ask him about how other players on that server played.
Maybe you think building troops out of one village, maybe two later on, and have 3 or 4 villages fewer than the top pop players is sufficiently powerful an account, but I have seen better. I can honestly tell you that I believed you word for word when I played s5, building army and not caring about villages. But I realized that garandou, who founded villages instead of waited for conquering (no, I did not build chiefs too early, i was overflowing warehouses) did much better than me with a bit more activity. The mechanics of the game is not that complicated, and it is not vey hard to figure out that investing 30k resources to build a 2nd village while keeping troop production relatively high is a worthwhile thing to do.
Anyway, I was only making the point that settling is ok sometimes, something I feel we have learned from actual playing. I don’t exactly remember how thing got out of hand. Sorry for being an idiot again, ^^; I’m sure Monsen has better grasp on the game than 99% of the players, and was instrumental in teaching tl the game.
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On January 07 2007 16:28 oneofthem wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2007 11:39 Monsen wrote:On January 06 2007 18:23 oneofthem wrote:On January 06 2007 16:50 Monsen wrote:Argh- is it really so hard to comprehend what I'm saying? Is my english that bad or non coherent? Or is it just that ppl read so superficially? Noone is talking about mid or lategame, "maintaining large armies" and crop problems are not the issue. The point is that settling in general -is- -teh- -crap0r- It's ineffective ressourcewise when compared to raiding. PERIOD. And thus (and this is just the second step of the argument, see ?) it is more effective to not fucking settle and even not waste ressources on building up your fields but just build up storage, barrack, and teh lil swingerclubs, clubs, clubs until you can eventually conquer. Ah yeah, it's ok to build crop fields. Barely. You said conquest is the most resource efficient, implying resources are still a concern, and that there are other projects requiring investment. Then, given the fairly high initial investment for chief as a percentage of your account's production, it is fair to say that these resources devoted to chiefs wont be producing anything productive soon. Also, it takes time to build academy and residences, why not build a lv10 townhall during the same time and upgrade market and mb, while at the same time a new village can be built up reasonably quickly. Another concern is that CP will definitely build up very quickly, and if you were to conquer with 2 or 3 villages, there is no way you can avoid wasting CP. I have experienced this first hand. On s5 I think I conquered my third village while having enough CP for 5 or 6 villages, that is totally not acceptable. Yes, conquest is the fastest way to grow when taken as an instantaneous event compared to founding a village, but there are various real game situations that make conquering too early inefficient. At the very least, do not conquer unless you have 3 chiefs. There is no need to conquer just to save some resources when you are wasting serious time doing it. I know what you are saying, and you are wrong. It may be more resource efficient, but not more time efficient and management efficient. On regular server T2, the top players will do this: get 2nd village in 10 or 12 days, get 15 crop, get 3rd village 9 crop in another week, get a village near potential conquest target or get another 9 or 15 crop in another week. On regular server T3, you can get 4 villages in 5 weeks, plus the -10% conquering rule (when you conquer a village, all of its buildings are reduced by 1 level, i know, sucks) and the capital rule, there is no way in hell you can conquer another village during that time. Here is the situation of me village on speed T3 when I had 2 villages (rank top 2) + Show Spoiler +As you can see, I still had major problems with resources, and the fields aren't even built up yet. There is no way I can manage a chief without delaying growth significantly. This is when I started conquering chains on the same account. It was still difficult getting enough resources to queue residences, trust me. Sorry dude, you don't even get the initial point that army/raiding > villages. Please ask Neo to explain it to you, I can't. er, no. I > you in travian. Keep in mind that I am assuming 24/7 production of troops. That you do not even get the initial point of "effective = time effective" makes you unqualified to dispute my opinions on travian. Did you even bother to read?
For one so strict about making 100% exact, elaborated points, I don't think you clarified your points enough. While I thought it was obvious that I was talking about settling being shit in the context of playing extensively/aggressively you never pointed out what you meant by 24/7 production or "investing in villages". I was mislead into thinking you would settle to be able to "invest" in fields. Which led to a misperception of your point. I consider your "I > you" the first flame in the thread.
Also I still think that your estimate of the point where you conquer with this strat is wrong. When the largest sim city players get their 2nd village you only have to check for one with residence rather than palace. Players like that have neither a strong army nor an alliance that poses a threat to someone playing the game aggresively. Plus the way he could get help, so could you.
You will gain a ~500 pop village (the new 10% might make you lose some of the merits I grant you that) whose position will not be as perfect as a settled one, but really- how much does this matter? You'll drain the area dry whereever it is.
Furthermore I doubt that staying with your initial village longer puts you behind on Cp. The fact that you'll be increasing your production facilities further than you would while settling makes up for quite some low lvl buildings in the second village.
Since the point of conquest is way sooner than you calculate, the merit of freeing a slot for a chieftain (rather than settlers) is way bigger than you think, as you practically have to get way less Cp for each following conquest.
Last but not least, from the calculation given in my previous post, you can see that there is a lot of room for expanding your production capactity in your main village at basically the same costs as if you settled and raised new production there. With a third village you might sometime surpass the troop production from one village but a) that takes more time which means it'll be closer to the point of conquest and b) you'll have wasted another slot for settlers.
It all comes down to when you actually conquer. Conquest will pay itself at around 400-450 pop. Loses might be a factor there, however since someone raiding will have such an army advantage over a simcity player plus the point of conquest will be extremely early and thus unexpected I think you can disregard them as insignificant for the big picture.
As raiding range efficiency varies for the different races, this will be most effective for gauls as they'll have least problems with covering a large area with 1 village plus the advantage of faster chieftains comes in handy when conquering with your first.
In the end all of this is just pointless theory and debate- travian is essentially flawed and noone in their right mind would want to play it with an aggressive mindset over a longer period of time anyway. Have a nice day, I rest my case.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
Sorry dude, you don't even get the initial point that army/raiding > villages. Please ask Neo to explain it to you, I can't.
felt very sharp and disrespectful there...I wonder how did i give off the impression of a simcity player if my reputation is a crazy army guy..
It was never my intention to rouse up a fight in a celebratory thread, and I rank this as another painful thing that I did that will become my dark dark suppressed memory. It would be great if this thread can be moved back. 
Since the point of conquest is way sooner than you calculate, the merit of freeing a slot for a chieftain (rather than settlers) is way bigger than you think, as you practically have to get way less Cp for each following conquest.
From my experience, and I have experience for very high income accounts, by the time conquest targets are ready (simply by the fact that by the time an above average albeit simcity player builds a 2nd vllage you should already have your 3rd or 4th if you follow the CP/income maximization build) you should have time enough to build up small villages to be able to conquer from them.
Furthermore I doubt that staying with your initial village longer puts you behind on Cp. The fact that you'll be increasing your production facilities further than you would while settling makes up for quite some low lvl buildings in the second village. It is relatively easy to build up a small village, and by the time the income level for conquest is ready your settled village should be fairly built up,. Also, the time required to settle is just 10 residence levels, nothing terribly time consuming (this is T3 specific, since you'd want to settle a capital village, but for T2 whether you build a palace first or not is up to debate). It takes relatively little investment to build up the 2nd village, and the time, as already stated, is covered by the amount of time to get conquest tech simultaneously. So it is a free village basically, just raising the CP tier once more, an issue that ultimately will not delay your acquisition of villages, just means that you did not conquer this particular one.
Another consideration is that playing aggressively will make it harder for others around you to grow, and by the time of ocnquest thos ewho have sufficiently big villages will have big villages precisely because they are hard targets to farm, or maybe you left some targets to grow and ply into a false sense of security. But that is a big project, and given how early income is so important it is difficult to stay off of fat farms. This incidentally is why I think gauls are better mid/late game than teutons, because they do not kill too many people early game, and have targets around them to conquer.
In any case, I consider the goal of early game to reach a situation where you can conquer fairly rapidly along a high CP route(basically all villages big parties and giving a fair number of production CP themselves) while also raising army production to as much as you can support by your activity. It is far too risky to allow other players to determine the growth of your account than taking some fairly low cost measures to help yourself along the way.
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Hey hey hey.. somehow I missed this thread over the holidays.
I'm only reading Neo's excellent writeup and report for now. Lots of interesting end-game stuff I didn't know about, or involved with. Which is fine, I had cut my play down to simcity about halfway through the game. Hard to believe I actually broke top 10 pop at one point -- feels a lifetime ago. I'm glad I was able to balance my time on Travian, and still stay around and play a part in seeing things through to ultimate victory.
Great win for everyone, great job by leadership to see things through to the end.
- ROM @ s4
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
OMG it's ROM.
I didnt know you even had a real acct here <3
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United States37500 Posts
On January 13 2007 12:29 thedeadhaji wrote:
OMG it's ROM.
I didnt know you even had a real acct here <3
You noop. I listed everyone's TL.net handle in the first post.
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i play Travian on Cro server and im doing baaaaad.....
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United States37500 Posts
haha, I play on com5. >_>
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Osaka27131 Posts
You are going to send Haji into a seizure by bumping this I think.
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hey ho blast from the past here
hope all my old friends are well and still gaming
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