• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 02:25
CEST 08:25
KST 15:25
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team TLMC #5 - Finalists & Open Tournaments0[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt2: Turbulence10Classic Games #3: Rogue vs Serral at BlizzCon9[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Ascent10Maestros of the Game: Week 1/Play-in Preview12
Community News
BSL 2025 Warsaw LAN + Legends Showmatch0Weekly Cups (Sept 8-14): herO & MaxPax split cups4WardiTV TL Team Map Contest #5 Tournaments1SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia8Weekly Cups (Sept 1-7): MaxPax rebounds & Clem saga continues29
StarCraft 2
General
#1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time Weekly Cups (Sept 8-14): herO & MaxPax split cups Team Liquid Map Contest #21 - Presented by Monster Energy SpeCial on The Tasteless Podcast Team TLMC #5 - Finalists & Open Tournaments
Tourneys
Maestros of The Game—$20k event w/ live finals in Paris Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia WardiTV TL Team Map Contest #5 Tournaments RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 491 Night Drive Mutation # 490 Masters of Midnight Mutation # 489 Bannable Offense Mutation # 488 What Goes Around
Brood War
General
NaDa's Body Soulkey on ASL S20 BW General Discussion A cwal.gg Extension - Easily keep track of anyone BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[ASL20] Ro16 Group C [ASL20] Ro16 Group D [Megathread] Daily Proleagues BSL 2025 Warsaw LAN + Legends Showmatch
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Muta micro map competition Fighting Spirit mining rates [G] Mineral Boosting
Other Games
General Games
Path of Exile Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Borderlands 3 General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread UK Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The Happy Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread High temperatures on bridge(s)
TL Community
BarCraft in Tokyo Japan for ASL Season5 Final The Automated Ban List
Blogs
I <=> 9
KrillinFromwales
The Personality of a Spender…
TrAiDoS
A very expensive lesson on ma…
Garnet
hello world
radishsoup
Lemme tell you a thing o…
JoinTheRain
RTS Design in Hypercoven
a11
Evil Gacha Games and the…
ffswowsucks
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2296 users

[H] How to teach a newbie SC

Blogs > Holgerius
Post a Reply
1 2 Next All
Holgerius
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Sweden16951 Posts
March 25 2009 02:07 GMT
#1
Ok. Background story:

I've been an avid fan of SC for 8 months (or something like that). Up until recently I mostly just watched other people play for entertainment, but as my knowledge about the game increased dramatically I've decided to become an active player myself.

None of my friends are SC-fans, despite me raving and ranting about how great, deep and entertaining the game is. But last Sunday (after I had just finished talking about the MSL finals) a friend of mine said ''Ok, let's play a Bo5''. It made me really happy; I'm finally going to play SC with a friend (which will make practising a lot funnier than getting raped by some random dude on Iccup). He mentioned that he had played some Starcraft with another friend many years ago, but once he refered to Carriers as ''Those bananas that spew out a billion small things'' (or something similar), I realized practising with him would not improve me in any way what so ever (IMO it's basically neccesary to lose in order to learn). I would like to point out that I'm really bad myself. Due to inexperience my micro sucks, my macro sucks, my APM sucks, my timing sucks, my mechanics sucks. The only thing I'm remotely good at is knowledge of strategies and (mostly Terran) BO's and stuff (the type of things you can learn by simply watching others play).

We played a practise game later the same day. I'm Terran, he's Protoss. Since I didn't want to rape him too hard and therefore scare him off so that he would never play again I decided not to try very hard. It didn't matter. I absolutely raped him to death like Jaedong would rape me. I mean, he got a shuttle that he tried to attack me with (''It doesn't do anything!''). That's how bad he is.

So before we play our super epic Bo5 he needs a lot of practise to at least put up a fight. To motivate him and to spice things up I said ''You can have as much practise time as you want to, and I'll help you improve. We'll play all 5 games and I'll pay you 2,46 dollars for every game you win. If you win the majority of them (at least 3) I'll give you an additional 12,29 dollars.'' I will not lose a single dime of course, but it makes it a lot more interesting and hopefully it will motivate him to reach a level where he doesn't have 20 APM, attack me with empty shuttles and I won't have twice his population 5 minutes into the game.

So, on to the thing I wanna get some help with. He's probably gonna come over to my place tomorrow for a Starcraft Lesson. Since Starcraft is soooo deep, there is so much I want to bring up. What I want help with is; where should I begin? What should I teach him? How deep should I go? Gimme tips. I figure it would be good to start by teaching him really basic things such as his tech tree and the units he has to his disposal (he plays Protoss) as well as general stuff like always produce probes, don't save up minerals in the bank, etc. Agreed? If so, where do I go from there?

Also, I'm not a Protoss player myself. This makes it difficult when it comes to BO's. Could some Protoss player write down like a universal, super standard BO for Protoss and how to adapt that to what I (the Terran) am doing? Is 8 Pylon, 10 Gate, 12 Gas, 14 Core, 15 Pylon or something like that a good start, or am I way off? If it is, how do you go from there into different directions (IMO there are more or less three branches of BO's, they can be designed for three different initial directions; attack/rush (Proxy Gates, 3 Rax Sunken Break etc), economy (14 CC, 1 Fac Expo etc) and tech (DT rush, Cloaked Wraiths etc)).

Should I dive deeper into the vast ocean of SC knowledge? Should I introduce him to the concept of timing pushes and such things, or will they do him no good on the really low level on which we are? What (if any) VOD'S would you recomend I show him?

Any help about what/how to teach him to make him as good (mostly at PvT) as possible in a short period of time would be appreciated.

I believe in the almighty Grötslev! -- I am never serious and you should never believe a thing I say. Including the previous sentence.
ketomai
Profile Joined June 2007
United States2789 Posts
March 25 2009 02:12 GMT
#2
Tell him to play through campaign and then after that start playing some casual games with you. He won't strive to become better until he enjoys the game. Starting off with straight up build orders is detrimental to the starcraft experience IMO.
omninmo
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
2349 Posts
March 25 2009 02:16 GMT
#3
On March 25 2009 11:12 nevake wrote:
Tell him to play through campaign and then after that start playing some casual games with you. He won't strive to become better until he enjoys the game. Starting off with straight up build orders is detrimental to the starcraft experience IMO.

well said. he needs to dream about SC before he will improve. show him pro games of your favorite players to get him interested and also to see just how huge SC is in korea.
nbtnbt5
Profile Joined March 2009
232 Posts
March 25 2009 02:32 GMT
#4
^What he said.
My friend really got me into SC by showing me pro SC on youtube from VioleTAK.
Show him vids of pro SC with english commentary, otherwise he won't know whats going on.
Yellow: "Well boxer's kind of a tool like that, wanting to bunker rush me all the time but hiding it behind all that deception."
Holgerius
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Sweden16951 Posts
March 25 2009 02:37 GMT
#5
On March 25 2009 11:16 omninmo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 25 2009 11:12 nevake wrote:
Tell him to play through campaign and then after that start playing some casual games with you. He won't strive to become better until he enjoys the game. Starting off with straight up build orders is detrimental to the starcraft experience IMO.

well said. he needs to dream about SC before he will improve. show him pro games of your favorite players to get him interested and also to see just how huge SC is in korea.

The first thing I did was telling him to play through the campaign, but it seemed like he didn't want to do it that way. I got into SC by watching 1vs1, and that's also the way I started playing. The competitive aspect of the game was what attracted me so immensly to it. I never really enjoyed playing the campaign myself to be honest. I guess it's a good way to learn the basics, but I do not see it as essential. Thanks for the advice, though!

I have already shown him a couple of pro games earlier (I showed him and explained the brilliance in Leta vs Luxury on Destination (Leta's super build) for instance) and as I said, I rave and rant about SC and it's pro gaming scene quite often so he's very aware of how big it is in Korea. I have already gotten him interested, but how do I make him not suck extremely hard? Imagine this being a real school. I'm a teacher and he's a student in a classroom. What should be taught in the first lesson?
I believe in the almighty Grötslev! -- I am never serious and you should never believe a thing I say. Including the previous sentence.
Boblion
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
France8043 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-25 02:52:40
March 25 2009 02:52 GMT
#6
He is protoss. He will win anyway. No need for training.
fuck all those elitists brb watching streams of elite players.
Zozma
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States1626 Posts
March 25 2009 03:02 GMT
#7
Start him with something that's commentated... be it the GOM casts, or an SC2GG caster. That's a good way to get people started, because even less knowledgeable casters usually do a good job outlining the action that's going on.
dragonmax
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States131 Posts
March 25 2009 03:10 GMT
#8
teach him hotkeys and build orders that can really help noobs the most
pyrogenetix
Profile Blog Joined March 2006
China5097 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-25 03:27:45
March 25 2009 03:23 GMT
#9
the campaign and then vs computer(s) i guess to know what unit does what and the counters etc. just play vs comps for now so he gets the rhythm and basic units down like zlot goon, vult tank, ling hydra etc etc.

but if he tried to attack with a shuttle then he has a looooooong way to go.

get him to use hotkeys, i cannot stress this enough. newbs will ALWAYS try and get out of using hotkeys. once he starts using hotkeys his speed will pick up immensely.
Yea that looks just like Kang Min... amazing game sense... and uses mind games well, but has the micro of a washed up progamer.
HeavOnEarth
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States7087 Posts
March 25 2009 03:27 GMT
#10
teach him how to deflect cheese while playing standard
then macro/micro
then tactics? idk...
.. find someone else to help your friend, it's much much funner to play sc with someone on your skill level, or slightly better.
getting face smashed won't help him <_<
"come korea next time... FXO house... 10 korean, 10 korean"
rushz0rz
Profile Blog Joined February 2006
Canada5300 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-25 03:30:27
March 25 2009 03:28 GMT
#11
You're going to need a lot of patience, that's the only advice I can give. He won't understand the simple concepts that most of us who have been playing for years will have, even little things like spamming apm or why certain units work and some don't in different situations.

Teach him one BO and tell him to sit there playing against computer, spamming and making as many units as possible. Macro, macro, macro should be the main lesson, and his micro will develop in time.

Basic Protoss (versus Terran):
9 pylon
10 gate
11 assimilator
13 cyber
17 goon
range
goon
23 pylon

IntoTheRainBOw fan~
YPang
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
United States4024 Posts
March 25 2009 03:47 GMT
#12
On March 25 2009 11:52 Boblion wrote:
He is protoss. He will win anyway. No need for training.

sMi.Gladstone | BW: B high| SC2: gold T_T
Grobyc
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Canada18410 Posts
March 25 2009 03:51 GMT
#13
I don't feel like re-typing everything so have a look at the thread I made.
If you watch Godzilla backwards it's about a benevolent lizard who helps rebuild a city and then moonwalks into the ocean.
kdog3683
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
United States916 Posts
March 25 2009 04:14 GMT
#14
For a sec I thought this said [H] How to tea...bag
Multiply your efforts.
liger13
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States1060 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-25 04:27:25
March 25 2009 04:26 GMT
#15
On March 25 2009 11:52 Boblion wrote:
He is protoss. He will win anyway. No need for training.

lol, it took like 5 posts before it came out ...

but yah... let them enjoy the game....
then if they really wanna get good start teaching stuffs

Giant FFAs are always fun with newer players, cause they can all team up on you then back-stab each other
I feel like pwning noobs
Tom Phoenix
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
1114 Posts
March 25 2009 05:07 GMT
#16
As a relative newbie myself who has been trying to improve for some time now, I warmly recommend that you start with macromanagement. The biggest problem beginners (like me) have is that they leave their resources to pile up and thus end up lacking enough economy/tech/units to put up much of a fight. While it is good to have some sort of standard Build Order to follow, it is currently the most important that he spends his resources on something rather then nothing. In order to do that, he must learn to use hotkeys. For starters, concentrate on binding Control hotkeys and learning the default hotkeys of some of the basic units and structures (P for Probe/Pylon, Z for Zealot, G for Gateway etc.).

A good way to practise macromanagement is by making a multiplayer game with a computer, removing the computer just before the countdown ends and then pressing "Continue playing" when prompted. This allows the player to practice a build without the pressure of a regular game.
You and your "5 years of competitive RTS experience" can take a hike. - FrozenArbiter
FoBuLouS
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States570 Posts
March 25 2009 05:32 GMT
#17
Play single player with cheats. It's a pretty interesting way to learn all the units and the tech tree. You can let him explore the tech and do random stuff while you explain how each unit is used. I suggest you use protoss to mind control a zerg and terran computer so you can show all 3 races at once. Don't forget power overwhelming!
Don't go straight into timing attacks and build orders. If he doesn't know a shuttle can't attack he won't understand what timing attacks and the other stuff are. The first thing you need to learn in any real time strategy game is all the units and spells and their purposes. Of course, you also need motivation/interest. That can be achieved in many ways, campaign and progaming for instance.
After explaining units, explain the concepts of competitive SC, such as macro and micro, what to do im a standard game, etc.
FirstBorn
Profile Blog Joined March 2007
Romania3955 Posts
March 25 2009 05:35 GMT
#18
Well, if he's protoss, just show him some fpvods from battle.net attack or intothemsl. Seing a fpvod of nada had a really big impact on me when I was newbie and really motivated me to play harder and improve my actions and multitasking. That might apply for him aswell.
SonuvBob: Yes, the majority of TL is college-aged, and thus clearly stupid.
stenole
Profile Blog Joined April 2004
Norway868 Posts
March 25 2009 05:42 GMT
#19
The only way a true newbie can improve is by fostering a rivalry with another newbie. Both newbies will strive to be better than the other. This is the best motivation you can get out of starcraft at that level. Playing repeatedly against a computer or against nothing will feel pointless after a couple times. Losing against a vastly stronger player won't give him anything back for his efforts.

So teaching someone the ropes is more a problem of matchmaking than about what things you should teach him. It should become pretty obvious what kind of knowledge he is ready to absorb when you see him play. Learning unit counters and some basic macro is probably the most important things early. If he is even able to use hotkeys or vaguely follow build orders, he is not really a newbie.

At some point you must have been a newbie too. We all supress memories of those dark, horrible days. We were massing tier 1 units with 4 workers mining mouse only. And we were hoping that it would be enough to hold off those first twelve waves of attacks. And maybe, just maybe we would have time to get up 1 or 2 capital ships so we could win the game.
extracheez
Profile Joined January 2009
Australia151 Posts
March 25 2009 05:53 GMT
#20
A friend of mine who said he was ok at starcraft after I was ranting and raving about how great it was challenged me. He said he knew he wouldn't win because he hasn't played in a while but he thought he would put up a pretty decent fight...

The game was a TvZ me T him Z. I finished it in about 5 mins without losing a unit, not even my scout, with the first push from a 2 rax build lol.
1 2 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 3h 35m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ProTech75
StarCraft: Brood War
GuemChi 429
JulyZerg 52
Nal_rA 45
Bale 20
ajuk12(nOOB) 13
SilentControl 12
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm144
League of Legends
JimRising 614
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K647
Other Games
summit1g7039
C9.Mang0380
XaKoH 149
Trikslyr20
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick683
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 13
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• practicex 64
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 2
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Lourlo1140
• Stunt459
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
3h 35m
Maru vs Reynor
Cure vs TriGGeR
Map Test Tournament
4h 35m
The PondCast
6h 35m
RSL Revival
1d 3h
Zoun vs Classic
Korean StarCraft League
1d 20h
BSL Open LAN 2025 - War…
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
BSL Open LAN 2025 - War…
3 days
RSL Revival
3 days
Online Event
3 days
[ Show More ]
Wardi Open
4 days
Monday Night Weeklies
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
LiuLi Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-09-10
Chzzk MurlocKing SC1 vs SC2 Cup #2
HCC Europe

Ongoing

BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Points
ASL Season 20
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
LASL Season 20
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1

Upcoming

2025 Chongqing Offline CUP
BSL World Championship of Poland 2025
IPSL Winter 2025-26
BSL Season 21
SC4ALL: Brood War
BSL 21 Team A
Stellar Fest
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
EC S1
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters Fall
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.