• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 13:49
CEST 19:49
KST 02:49
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team TLMC #5 - Finalists & Open Tournaments0[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt2: Turbulence7Classic Games #3: Rogue vs Serral at BlizzCon9[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Ascent10Maestros of the Game: Week 1/Play-in Preview12
Community News
Weekly Cups (Sept 8-14): herO & MaxPax split cups3WardiTV TL Team Map Contest #5 Tournaments1SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia8Weekly Cups (Sept 1-7): MaxPax rebounds & Clem saga continues29LiuLi Cup - September 2025 Tournaments3
StarCraft 2
General
#1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time Team Liquid Map Contest #21 - Presented by Monster Energy Weekly Cups (Sept 8-14): herO & MaxPax split cups SpeCial on The Tasteless Podcast Team TLMC #5 - Finalists & Open Tournaments
Tourneys
SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament WardiTV TL Team Map Contest #5 Tournaments Maestros of The Game—$20k event w/ live finals in Paris RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 491 Night Drive Mutation # 490 Masters of Midnight Mutation # 489 Bannable Offense Mutation # 488 What Goes Around
Brood War
General
[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt2: Turbulence Diplomacy, Cosmonarchy Edition BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion ASL20 General Discussion
Tourneys
[ASL20] Ro16 Group D [ASL20] Ro16 Group C [Megathread] Daily Proleagues SC4ALL $1,500 Open Bracket LAN
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Muta micro map competition Fighting Spirit mining rates [G] Mineral Boosting
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread Borderlands 3
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Big Programming Thread
Fan Clubs
The Happy Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread High temperatures on bridge(s)
TL Community
BarCraft in Tokyo Japan for ASL Season5 Final The Automated Ban List
Blogs
The Personality of a Spender…
TrAiDoS
A very expensive lesson on ma…
Garnet
hello world
radishsoup
Lemme tell you a thing o…
JoinTheRain
RTS Design in Hypercoven
a11
Evil Gacha Games and the…
ffswowsucks
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1813 users

Felons

Blogs > DamageControL
Post a Reply
DamageControL
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States4222 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-10-15 20:09:00
October 15 2008 20:07 GMT
#1
Dearest Teamliquid,
Our new debate topic came out: "Resolved: In a Democratic society felons ought to retain the right to vote"

What do you think about it?

My preliminary thoughts are:
What is a felon?
What is a democratic society?
Why felons, and NOT misdemeanors?

I have a few arguments on both sides but I think I need more, or rather, could use more. So, since I know this site is full of intelligent people, what do you think?
AFF:
Marketplace of ideas (Theory by Mills that in order for society to advance everyone needs to have a say)
There's little moral difference between some misdemeanors and some felonies

Neg:
They breached the social contract

Liquid | SKT
jello_biafra
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
United Kingdom6638 Posts
October 15 2008 20:11 GMT
#2
If you're convicted of a felony does that mean you've lost your right to vote for life or just for the duration of your sentence? Because in Britain you can't vote while in jail but once you're released you can.
The road to hell is paved with good intentions | aka Probert[PaiN] @ iccup / godlikeparagon @ twitch | my BW stream: http://www.teamliquid.net/video/streams/jello_biafra
Mastermind
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Canada7096 Posts
October 15 2008 20:12 GMT
#3
people in jail are members of society and thus should be allowed to vote.
Equinox_kr
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States7395 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-10-15 20:21:14
October 15 2008 20:17 GMT
#4
On October 16 2008 05:11 jello_biafra wrote:
If you're convicted of a felony does that mean you've lost your right to vote for life or just for the duration of your sentence? Because in Britain you can't vote while in jail but once you're released you can.


AFAIK you permanently lose your right to vote, even if you are released from prison. However, I don't understand what society tries to achieve by revoking such rights. Taking away their opportunity to get high level jobs (by high level I mean anything that's not manual labor) is fine but .. I see no reason to take away their right to vote. It's basically saying if you commit a crime (which can be a mistake, I know a friend who visited a prison and found out many of the people there made a "mistake", like a spur of the moment thing) you are literally a zombie if they haven't decided to kill you.

Although people who do commit felons deserved to be punished for the severity of their crime, they shouldn't be denied their right to vote.

edit: I'm not knowledgeable in this field at all, BTW.
^-^
DamageControL
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States4222 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-10-15 20:25:15
October 15 2008 20:23 GMT
#5
On October 16 2008 05:11 jello_biafra wrote:
If you're convicted of a felony does that mean you've lost your right to vote for life or just for the duration of your sentence? Because in Britain you can't vote while in jail but once you're released you can.

Life
@ Mastermind
They violatd the social contract knowingly, and while they may not have been thinking about the consequences at the time they certainly could have been made aware of them.
Thus have no right to vote as they inflicted harm on to society
Liquid | SKT
Killy
Profile Joined September 2008
United States39 Posts
October 15 2008 20:38 GMT
#6
I'm a felon and I vote o_O

It's only for the duration of your sentencing
Money is your army, every dollar is a soldier
CFDragon
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States304 Posts
October 15 2008 20:41 GMT
#7
On October 16 2008 05:23 DamageControL wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 16 2008 05:11 jello_biafra wrote:
If you're convicted of a felony does that mean you've lost your right to vote for life or just for the duration of your sentence? Because in Britain you can't vote while in jail but once you're released you can.

Life
@ Mastermind
They violatd the social contract knowingly, and while they may not have been thinking about the consequences at the time they certainly could have been made aware of them.
Thus have no right to vote as they inflicted harm on to society

I agree with this a lot. I think it should just be for the duration of the sentence, but when you do a crime and turn your back on the law of the land, you're also turning away from the democratic process as a whole.
DamageControL
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States4222 Posts
October 15 2008 20:49 GMT
#8
On October 16 2008 05:38 Killy wrote:
I'm a felon and I vote o_O

It's only for the duration of your sentencing

state to state. Some states bar misdemeanors too actually
Liquid | SKT
Mindcrime
Profile Joined July 2004
United States6899 Posts
October 15 2008 20:50 GMT
#9
In recent years, the states have loosened restrictions on felons' voting rights by quite a bit. Only a few states still permanently disenfranchise felons.
That wasn't any act of God. That was an act of pure human fuckery.
Raithed
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
China7078 Posts
October 15 2008 21:41 GMT
#10
we need felons to create chaos in society.
LastWish
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
2013 Posts
October 15 2008 22:04 GMT
#11
Felons vote power(in % global) is by any means insignificant.
The only important thing is the moral dilemma that society faces.
- It's all just treason - They bring me down with their lies - Don't know the reason - My life is fire and ice -
Mindcrime
Profile Joined July 2004
United States6899 Posts
October 15 2008 22:20 GMT
#12
On October 16 2008 07:04 LastWish wrote:
Felons vote power(in % global) is by any means insignificant.


Even by conservative estimates, it would have completely changed the outcome of the 2000 presidential election if former felons in Florida were able to vote. :|
That wasn't any act of God. That was an act of pure human fuckery.
DamageControL
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States4222 Posts
October 15 2008 22:49 GMT
#13
On October 16 2008 07:04 LastWish wrote:
Felons vote power(in % global) is by any means insignificant.
The only important thing is the moral dilemma that society faces.

about 5,000,000 in the US, a good chunk of the population
Liquid | SKT
DamageControL
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States4222 Posts
October 15 2008 22:59 GMT
#14
On October 16 2008 05:50 Mindcrime wrote:
In recent years, the states have loosened restrictions on felons' voting rights by quite a bit. Only a few states still permanently disenfranchise felons.

Really? I read it was more than a 'few' but perhaps you are right
Liquid | SKT
Mastermind
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Canada7096 Posts
October 16 2008 00:06 GMT
#15
On October 16 2008 05:23 DamageControL wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 16 2008 05:11 jello_biafra wrote:
If you're convicted of a felony does that mean you've lost your right to vote for life or just for the duration of your sentence? Because in Britain you can't vote while in jail but once you're released you can.

Life
@ Mastermind
They violatd the social contract knowingly, and while they may not have been thinking about the consequences at the time they certainly could have been made aware of them.
Thus have no right to vote as they inflicted harm on to society

I have to strongly disagree with you there. What is legal or illegal is a political issue. If someone commits a crime they do not believe should be a crime, by throwing them in jail and not allowing them to vote you are restricting their political freedom, and their ability to change the law through democratic measures.

I am proud to say I live in a country that does not act in a barbaric fashion by restricting people's rights when ever possible(yes, thats right, in Canada everyone can vote). Taking away someone's responsibilities(i see voting as being a responsibility as much as a right) you cant train them to be more responsible. That just doesnt work.
DamageControL
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States4222 Posts
October 16 2008 00:19 GMT
#16
On October 16 2008 09:06 Mastermind wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 16 2008 05:23 DamageControL wrote:
On October 16 2008 05:11 jello_biafra wrote:
If you're convicted of a felony does that mean you've lost your right to vote for life or just for the duration of your sentence? Because in Britain you can't vote while in jail but once you're released you can.

Life
@ Mastermind
They violatd the social contract knowingly, and while they may not have been thinking about the consequences at the time they certainly could have been made aware of them.
Thus have no right to vote as they inflicted harm on to society

I have to strongly disagree with you there. What is legal or illegal is a political issue. If someone commits a crime they do not believe should be a crime, by throwing them in jail and not allowing them to vote you are restricting their political freedom, and their ability to change the law through democratic measures.

I am proud to say I live in a country that does not act in a barbaric fashion by restricting people's rights when ever possible(yes, thats right, in Canada everyone can vote). Taking away someone's responsibilities(i see voting as being a responsibility as much as a right) you cant train them to be more responsible. That just doesnt work.
your saying civil disobedience is justified then
Liquid | SKT
Mindcrime
Profile Joined July 2004
United States6899 Posts
October 16 2008 01:07 GMT
#17
On October 16 2008 07:59 DamageControL wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 16 2008 05:50 Mindcrime wrote:
In recent years, the states have loosened restrictions on felons' voting rights by quite a bit. Only a few states still permanently disenfranchise felons.

Really? I read it was more than a 'few' but perhaps you are right


It is more than a few. According to this only 2 states permanently disenfranchise all felons, but another 8 permanently disenfranchise some felons.
That wasn't any act of God. That was an act of pure human fuckery.
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 5h 11m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
mouzHeroMarine 548
ProTech87
UpATreeSC 73
JuggernautJason24
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 4556
Bisu 2593
Flash 2367
EffOrt 706
Shuttle 608
PianO 513
Mini 459
BeSt 328
ZerO 215
Soulkey 187
[ Show more ]
hero 132
Dewaltoss 115
Backho 82
Rush 74
soO 31
sorry 26
Aegong 22
Noble 9
Terrorterran 8
Sacsri 8
ajuk12(nOOB) 6
Hm[arnc] 5
SilentControl 4
Dota 2
Gorgc7436
qojqva3449
Fuzer 288
XcaliburYe144
capcasts38
Counter-Strike
fl0m759
Stewie2K227
oskar102
Other Games
ceh9628
FrodaN563
Beastyqt465
Lowko356
Hui .346
QueenE95
Trikslyr63
FunKaTv 53
NeuroSwarm42
MindelVK22
ZerO(Twitch)17
fpsfer 4
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 19 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Reevou 1
• intothetv
• sooper7s
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• IndyKCrew
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• FirePhoenix9
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 4329
• masondota2776
• WagamamaTV540
League of Legends
• Nemesis4397
• TFBlade761
Other Games
• imaqtpie612
• Shiphtur255
Upcoming Events
OSC
5h 11m
PiGosaur Monday
6h 11m
LiuLi Cup
17h 11m
OSC
1d 1h
RSL Revival
1d 16h
Maru vs Reynor
Cure vs TriGGeR
The PondCast
1d 19h
RSL Revival
2 days
Zoun vs Classic
Korean StarCraft League
3 days
BSL Open LAN 2025 - War…
3 days
RSL Revival
3 days
[ Show More ]
BSL Open LAN 2025 - War…
4 days
RSL Revival
4 days
Online Event
4 days
Wardi Open
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-09-10
Chzzk MurlocKing SC1 vs SC2 Cup #2
HCC Europe

Ongoing

BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Points
ASL Season 20
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
LASL Season 20
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1

Upcoming

2025 Chongqing Offline CUP
BSL World Championship of Poland 2025
IPSL Winter 2025-26
BSL Season 21
SC4ALL: Brood War
BSL 21 Team A
Stellar Fest
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
EC S1
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters Fall
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.