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I am bored and restless, but I do not wish to take too unskilled of an action. So I will remedy the situation by taking a skilled action.
This blog post is an attempt to create discussion. The topic is life. Your life, my life, the lives of humans and animals and anything living.
What do we go through. Why do we experience what we experience. Is there a point? Is there a god?
Questions, comments, suggestions, insults, anything is fine. Just say what you believe to be a contribution of some sort. Questions are probably the most fun(for me), though.
Here are some words to get people's brains working:
religion
consciousness
emotion
sensation
morality
death
birth
sleeping
dreaming
just say what is on your mind, question or statement. don't be afraid!
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Starcraft. To elaborate I think the meaning of existence is to be yourself, don't let other people define you just like Nintu; he tried to tell everybody valks can be viable they laughed in his face. But know because Valks are really just hydralisks in halloween costumes why? because overlords are fucking scared of them so on halloween they go to the hive cluster and are like:
*Knock knock*
Trick or treat - hydralisk valk
AAAAAHH VALKS RUNNNNNN MASS BUILD OVERLORDS! ALL OF OUR MINERALS! - Zergling
Nigga it's me - Hydralisk Valk
TAKE OFF TEH COSTUMEZ I DUN BELIEVE YOU! - Ultralisk
what the fuck man settle down it's halloween remember? - hydralisk valk
Valkyrie preparedx12 - medic valk
What the hell was that? - mutalisk
eaueaueau - mutalisks dieing
what the fuck man?! - hydralisk valk
build some fucking hydras to kill these nigs - kerrigan
We can't they killed all of our overlords - drone
WHAT THE FUCK?! - Zerg race
Do you understand now?
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I used to love playing starcraft when I had enough time to be great at it. I really enjoy competition.
But these days I just get destroyed by decent players and that isn't fun for me at all.
I still watch it from time to time, though.
It's funny, since I started playing starcraft, my entire life has largely been shaped by it. That's almost half of my life !
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You don't exist. This thread doesn't exist. Wake up travis, wake up.
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I believe in christianity, but its pretty hard defending it with the following questions:
1: If God is so good, why is the world suffering
2: God's actions to completely screw Job up was pretty interesting...
First, it ruins Job's entire life by killing family members, losing merchandise and goods
Then it ruins Job's body by giving sores, just for what?
To prove a point to Satan that hes righteous
Now that sounds illogical yes?
For the second opinion, I believe that we use Logic..
Logic is basically in example : I play starcraft because it is fun
Religion in a way ( well for christianity it is.. ) requires illogical things, and you need to get rid of logic to believe in that way
Flame me if you wish, but bring reasoning,
Because I just want to know the truth
"There is no greater satisfaction than a clearer mind" Chad Docterman
:edit:
I obviously have more questions than those,
they were the ones that just poped out of the top of my head
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On October 06 2008 07:25 decafchicken wrote:
You don't exist. This thread doesn't exist. Wake up travis, wake up.
How can I wake up if I don't exist?
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There is a god.
That god is called Lim Yo Hwan! Join my religion, the Boxer religion! The year 1980 (which was in fact year 0 but the cristians has made up things that like some imaginary god created earth 2000 years ago. LOL!) Lim Yo Hwan created the earth. He created peoples to live there and he made himself a human to live there together with his creations.
When Lim Yo Hwan had grown to 18 years old he was really really bored. So he created a new game, and he called it Starcraft. It was made to be the ultimate game. Since he made the game he dominated everything for a while. Then suddenly, an enemy appeared. It was YellOw. Boxer saw YellOw play and saw that he was almost as good as he was. YellOw later called Boxer. "Hello, Lim Yo Hwan, this is Satan, the devil himself. I've taken the form of a human to destroy you in SC and after that dominate the world!" Lim Yo Hwan had to defend the world. He practiced relentlessly, Boxer and YellOw met in the OSL finals 2002, and YellOw was defeated. The world was safe.
Boxer continued to dominate, but that became boring, so he created a human, his son, to revolutionize Starcraft and dominate like no one had done before. He named his son Iloveoov.
A few years later he Lim Yo Hwan suddenly had to go to the army service, "why not?" he thought. "It might be fun."
It wasn't. Lim Yo Hwan really wanted to play SC 24/7 again. He was a god, but he didn't want to blow his cover as a human so he waited.... Soon Lim Yo Hwan will be back to dominate SC! We must pray to him!
LIM YO HWAN!!! LIM YO HWAN!!!
The religion has three rules which you must follow:
- Pray to Lim Yo Hwan and his son Iloveoov
- Play SC 24/7 unless you are praying
- Never EVER play wc3
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On October 06 2008 07:29 Folca wrote:
I believe in christianity, but its pretty hard defending it with the following questions:
1: If God is so good, why is the world suffering
Not that I believe in "god" (actually, I have yet to see a good definition of him from a christian/muslim/jew), but I will attempt to give viable answers to your questions anyways.
a.) because god gave us free will and we have put our selves in whatever situation we are in.
b.) because it's necessary
2: God's actions to completely screw Job up was pretty interesting...
First, it ruins Job's entire life by killing family members, losing merchandise and goods
Then it ruins Job's body by giving sores, just for what?
It was a test, Job passed.
To prove a point to Satan that hes righteous
Now that sounds illogical yes?
Well, in the end, Job is rewarded. It is a story and I think it is conveying a message.
For the second opinion, I believe that we use Logic..
Logic is basically in example : I play starcraft because it is fun
Religion in a way ( well for christianity it is.. ) requires illogical things, and you need to get rid of logic to believe in that way
logic is based upon criteria. These criteria change with one's understanding of nature.
(by nature i mean: the way things are)
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On October 06 2008 07:29 Folca wrote:
I believe in christianity, but its pretty hard defending it with the following questions:
1: If God is so good, why is the world suffering
2: God's actions to completely screw Job up was pretty interesting...
First, it ruins Job's entire life by killing family members, losing merchandise and goods
Then it ruins Job's body by giving sores, just for what?
To prove a point to Satan that hes righteous
Now that sounds illogical yes?
For the second opinion, I believe that we use Logic..
Logic is basically in example : I play starcraft because it is fun
Religion in a way ( well for christianity it is.. ) requires illogical things, and you need to get rid of logic to believe in that way
Flame me if you wish, but bring reasoning,
Because I just want to know the truth
"There is no greater satisfaction than a clearer mind" Chad Docterman
:edit:
I obviously have more questions than those,
they were the ones that just poped out of the top of my head
You mentioned Satan, If God is all powerful and all good, why is there Satan?
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A middle aged woman is in a persistive vegetative state. She has some higher brain activity, but not a lot. Her family wants the hospital to keep her on a ventilator because they believe God will intervene and save her. The doctors diagnose that the prospects of her recovery are bleak. They want to remove her from the ventilator to make bed space for another patient. What should the course of action be?
This scenario includes: Religion (God), consciousness, morality, death, emotion, sensation, maybe more...
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On October 06 2008 07:41 Rotodyne wrote:
You mentioned Satan, If God is all powerful and all good, why is there Satan?
because you can't come to understand god without understanding satan.
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On October 06 2008 07:43 GrayArea wrote:
A middle aged woman is in a persistive vegetative state. She has some higher brain activity, but not a lot. Her family wants the hospital to keep her on a ventilator because they believe God will intervene and save her. The doctors diagnose that the prospects of her recovery are bleak. They want to remove her from the ventilator to make bed space for another patient. What should the course of action be?
This scenario includes: Religion (God), consciousness, morality, death, emotion, sensation, maybe more...
1.) Did the woman express prior wishes that would push the decision in either direction? If so, this should take priority.
2.) Is the woman known to be in torment as a result of her state? If so, she should be taken off of the ventilator.
3.) If neither of these 2 conditions are met, the woman should be kept on the ventilator. People in this state still experience things.
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i will claim sancturary under travis's thread, which don't seemed to get as closed as often as other ppl's topics about religion or other controvorsial stuff.
a great book presenting the christian side thru philosophy quite logically is C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity. he starts out assuming nothing about god, or religion. he goes thru a lot of fundamental existence, the rationalism, the implications of the existence of a thing called conscience, and then finally steps into whether the supernatural could exist or not. Recommended for all those who say Christianity is illogical, irrational, and the only logic relies in evolution.
another eye openning bit of info:
http://amazingdiscoveries.org/media-Video-TotalOnslaught.html
learn about Revelation, the occult throughout history, and where their bastion is now.
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On October 06 2008 07:56 babypo0 wrote:i will claim sancturary under travis's thread, which don't seemed to get as closed as often as other ppl's topics about religion or other controvorsial stuff. a great book presenting the christian side thru philosophy quite logically is C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity. he starts out assuming nothing about god, or religion. he goes thru a lot of fundamental existence, the rationalism, the implications of the existence of a thing called conscience, and then finally steps into whether the supernatural could exist or not. Recommended for all those who say Christianity is illogical, irrational, and the only logic relies in evolution. another eye openning bit of info: http://amazingdiscoveries.org/media-Video-TotalOnslaught.htmllearn about Revelation, the occult throughout history, and where their bastion is now.
I am watching this video, and at the very beginning the guy mentions that "jesus said that there is no way to god, except through him".
I have heard this is Christianity before. What does this mean?
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On October 06 2008 07:53 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 07:43 GrayArea wrote:
A middle aged woman is in a persistive vegetative state. She has some higher brain activity, but not a lot. Her family wants the hospital to keep her on a ventilator because they believe God will intervene and save her. The doctors diagnose that the prospects of her recovery are bleak. They want to remove her from the ventilator to make bed space for another patient. What should the course of action be?
This scenario includes: Religion (God), consciousness, morality, death, emotion, sensation, maybe more... 1.) Did the woman express prior wishes that would push the decision in either direction? If so, this should take priority. 2.) Is the woman known to be in torment as a result of her state? If so, she should be taken off of the ventilator. 3.) If neither of these 2 conditions are met, the woman should be kept on the ventilator. People in this state still experience things.
No advanced directive exists.
Look up persistant vegetative state. It is a condition, nobody knows whether the person is suffering while they are in that state or not.
How do you know she is experiencing things in that state? She cannot talk or express anything.
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For some reason or other, you are down in a coal mine together with 9 other people. There has just been an earthquake and the mine threatens to collapse on top of you all. The main elevator is broken. There is only a small one-person elevator that still works and it is very slow. So slow that there is a high likelyhood that the mine will collapse and kill you all before you are all lifted out. The group has for some reason decided that you, travis, will decide the order which you are lifted out of the mine. The people in the mine are as follows:
- Escaped convict (You don't know what he was in for, all you know is that he has the orange jump suit on)
- Cancer patient with 3 more months to live
- Father of 4 kids
- Pregnant lady
- 4 year old girl
- Your best friend
- A lady who suffers from severe claustrophobia and is possibly not able to get up without freaking out (meaning she might end up spending a lot of time getting into the elevator and may be unable to get off the elevator at the top, therefore ending up coming down again. And she will absolutely not be able to get on by herself at the end.)
- Yourself
- Slayers Boxer
- A man with a suit and tie that offers you $100,000 to let him out 1st or $25,000 for the 2nd spot.
What order do they ascend?
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Is existence a state of being, or an attribute?
----
I still cannot understand existence.
Existence almost seems faith based - I am, because.
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On October 06 2008 08:01 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 07:56 babypo0 wrote:i will claim sancturary under travis's thread, which don't seemed to get as closed as often as other ppl's topics about religion or other controvorsial stuff. a great book presenting the christian side thru philosophy quite logically is C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity. he starts out assuming nothing about god, or religion. he goes thru a lot of fundamental existence, the rationalism, the implications of the existence of a thing called conscience, and then finally steps into whether the supernatural could exist or not. Recommended for all those who say Christianity is illogical, irrational, and the only logic relies in evolution. another eye openning bit of info: http://amazingdiscoveries.org/media-Video-TotalOnslaught.htmllearn about Revelation, the occult throughout history, and where their bastion is now. I am watching this video, and at the very beginning the guy mentions that "jesus said that there is no way to god, except through him". I have heard this is Christianity before. What does this mean?
I think it means to be a "Christian" you must accept that Jesus is son of god and the messiah.
the rest is just follow what he said since hes the son of god.
so if you dont believe in Jesus, youre not a Christian by definition.
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I'm writing an essay on some similarities between Hesiod's Theogony and the first few chapters of Genesis. I guess it says some interesting stuff that could prompt discussion, so would you guys mind if i posted it here when i'm done?
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On October 06 2008 08:01 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 07:56 babypo0 wrote:i will claim sancturary under travis's thread, which don't seemed to get as closed as often as other ppl's topics about religion or other controvorsial stuff. a great book presenting the christian side thru philosophy quite logically is C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity. he starts out assuming nothing about god, or religion. he goes thru a lot of fundamental existence, the rationalism, the implications of the existence of a thing called conscience, and then finally steps into whether the supernatural could exist or not. Recommended for all those who say Christianity is illogical, irrational, and the only logic relies in evolution. another eye openning bit of info: http://amazingdiscoveries.org/media-Video-TotalOnslaught.htmllearn about Revelation, the occult throughout history, and where their bastion is now. I am watching this video, and at the very beginning the guy mentions that "jesus said that there is no way to god, except through him". I have heard this is Christianity before. What does this mean?
You cannot understand God without understanding Christ.
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On October 06 2008 08:07 stenole wrote:
For some reason or other, you are down in a coal mine together with 9 other people. There has just been an earthquake and the mine threatens to collapse on top of you all. The main elevator is broken. There is only a small one-person elevator that still works and it is very slow. So slow that there is a high likelyhood that the mine will collapse and kill you all before you are all lifted out. The group has for some reason decided that you, travis, will decide the order which you are lifted out of the mine. The people in the mine are as follows:
- Escaped convict (You don't know what he was in for, all you know is that he has the orange jump suit on)
- Cancer patient with 3 more months to live
- Father of 4 kids
- Pregnant lady
- 4 year old girl
- Your best friend
- A lady who suffers from severe claustrophobia and is possibly not able to get up without freaking out (meaning she might end up spending a lot of time getting into the elevator and may be unable to get off the elevator at the top, therefore ending up coming down again. And she will absolutely not be able to get on by herself at the end.)
- Yourself
- Slayers Boxer
- A man with a suit and tie that offers you $100,000 to let him out 1st or $25,000 for the 2nd spot.
What order do they ascend?
Wtf, ahahah rofl..
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On October 06 2008 08:07 stenole wrote:
For some reason or other, you are down in a coal mine together with 9 other people. There has just been an earthquake and the mine threatens to collapse on top of you all. The main elevator is broken. There is only a small one-person elevator that still works and it is very slow. So slow that there is a high likelyhood that the mine will collapse and kill you all before you are all lifted out. The group has for some reason decided that you, travis, will decide the order which you are lifted out of the mine. The people in the mine are as follows:
- Escaped convict (You don't know what he was in for, all you know is that he has the orange jump suit on)
- Cancer patient with 3 more months to live
- Father of 4 kids
- Pregnant lady
- 4 year old girl
- Your best friend
- A lady who suffers from severe claustrophobia and is possibly not able to get up without freaking out (meaning she might end up spending a lot of time getting into the elevator and may be unable to get off the elevator at the top, therefore ending up coming down again. And she will absolutely not be able to get on by herself at the end.)
- Yourself
- Slayers Boxer
- A man with a suit and tie that offers you $100,000 to let him out 1st or $25,000 for the 2nd spot.
What order do they ascend?
Well, the lady with claustrophobia should really not be in there in the first place so her fault she can stay. Same goes for the 4 year old girl what the fuck is she doing in a mine? Cancer patient also shouldn't be in the mine.
1. Pregnant Lady - Saves 2 lives
2. SlayerS Boxer - Are you kidding me?
3. father of 4 kids - He needs to support his wife
4. Best friend - he's my friend he deserves it.
5. Myself - come on
6. convict - if it's akon he needs to keep up with his konvict music
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On October 06 2008 08:04 GrayArea wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 07:53 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 07:43 GrayArea wrote:
A middle aged woman is in a persistive vegetative state. She has some higher brain activity, but not a lot. Her family wants the hospital to keep her on a ventilator because they believe God will intervene and save her. The doctors diagnose that the prospects of her recovery are bleak. They want to remove her from the ventilator to make bed space for another patient. What should the course of action be?
This scenario includes: Religion (God), consciousness, morality, death, emotion, sensation, maybe more... 1.) Did the woman express prior wishes that would push the decision in either direction? If so, this should take priority. 2.) Is the woman known to be in torment as a result of her state? If so, she should be taken off of the ventilator. 3.) If neither of these 2 conditions are met, the woman should be kept on the ventilator. People in this state still experience things. No advanced directive exists. Look up persistant vegetative state. It is a condition, nobody knows whether the person is suffering while they are in that state or not. How do you know she is experiencing things in that state? She cannot talk or express anything.
Using fMRIs
http://www.mrc.ac.uk/OurResearch/Impact/ReecentAdvances/2006-2007/MRC004277
http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2007/10/15/071015fa_fact_groopman
http://www.salon.com/mwt/feature/2007/09/25/is_she_conscious/
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On October 06 2008 08:07 stenole wrote:
For some reason or other, you are down in a coal mine together with 9 other people. There has just been an earthquake and the mine threatens to collapse on top of you all. The main elevator is broken. There is only a small one-person elevator that still works and it is very slow. So slow that there is a high likelyhood that the mine will collapse and kill you all before you are all lifted out. The group has for some reason decided that you, travis, will decide the order which you are lifted out of the mine. The people in the mine are as follows:
- Escaped convict (You don't know what he was in for, all you know is that he has the orange jump suit on)
- Cancer patient with 3 more months to live
- Father of 4 kids
- Pregnant lady
- 4 year old girl
- Your best friend
- A lady who suffers from severe claustrophobia and is possibly not able to get up without freaking out (meaning she might end up spending a lot of time getting into the elevator and may be unable to get off the elevator at the top, therefore ending up coming down again. And she will absolutely not be able to get on by herself at the end.)
- Yourself
- Slayers Boxer
- A man with a suit and tie that offers you $100,000 to let him out 1st or $25,000 for the 2nd spot.
What order do they ascend?
I would just sit there and not say anything.
Sorry I know it isn't a fun answer.
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On October 06 2008 08:17 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 08:07 stenole wrote:
For some reason or other, you are down in a coal mine together with 9 other people. There has just been an earthquake and the mine threatens to collapse on top of you all. The main elevator is broken. There is only a small one-person elevator that still works and it is very slow. So slow that there is a high likelyhood that the mine will collapse and kill you all before you are all lifted out. The group has for some reason decided that you, travis, will decide the order which you are lifted out of the mine. The people in the mine are as follows:
- Escaped convict (You don't know what he was in for, all you know is that he has the orange jump suit on)
- Cancer patient with 3 more months to live
- Father of 4 kids
- Pregnant lady
- 4 year old girl
- Your best friend
- A lady who suffers from severe claustrophobia and is possibly not able to get up without freaking out (meaning she might end up spending a lot of time getting into the elevator and may be unable to get off the elevator at the top, therefore ending up coming down again. And she will absolutely not be able to get on by herself at the end.)
- Yourself
- Slayers Boxer
- A man with a suit and tie that offers you $100,000 to let him out 1st or $25,000 for the 2nd spot.
What order do they ascend? I would just sit there and not say anything. Sorry I know it isn't a fun answer.
I grant you a 'Borrow my answer' Card.
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On October 06 2008 08:07 KH1031 wrote:
Is existence a state of being, or an attribute?
Neither. It is a thing. It is everything.
Or it is the state of being
depends on how many assumptions you are willing to make, I guess.
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On October 06 2008 08:08 XCetron wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 08:01 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 07:56 babypo0 wrote:i will claim sancturary under travis's thread, which don't seemed to get as closed as often as other ppl's topics about religion or other controvorsial stuff. a great book presenting the christian side thru philosophy quite logically is C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity. he starts out assuming nothing about god, or religion. he goes thru a lot of fundamental existence, the rationalism, the implications of the existence of a thing called conscience, and then finally steps into whether the supernatural could exist or not. Recommended for all those who say Christianity is illogical, irrational, and the only logic relies in evolution. another eye openning bit of info: http://amazingdiscoveries.org/media-Video-TotalOnslaught.htmllearn about Revelation, the occult throughout history, and where their bastion is now. I am watching this video, and at the very beginning the guy mentions that "jesus said that there is no way to god, except through him". I have heard this is Christianity before. What does this mean? I think it means to be a "Christian" you must accept that Jesus is son of god and the messiah. the rest is just follow what he said since hes the son of god. so if you dont believe in Jesus, youre not a Christian by definition.
are you sure? because that seems retarded.
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On October 06 2008 08:09 conCentrate9 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 08:01 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 07:56 babypo0 wrote:i will claim sancturary under travis's thread, which don't seemed to get as closed as often as other ppl's topics about religion or other controvorsial stuff. a great book presenting the christian side thru philosophy quite logically is C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity. he starts out assuming nothing about god, or religion. he goes thru a lot of fundamental existence, the rationalism, the implications of the existence of a thing called conscience, and then finally steps into whether the supernatural could exist or not. Recommended for all those who say Christianity is illogical, irrational, and the only logic relies in evolution. another eye openning bit of info: http://amazingdiscoveries.org/media-Video-TotalOnslaught.htmllearn about Revelation, the occult throughout history, and where their bastion is now. I am watching this video, and at the very beginning the guy mentions that "jesus said that there is no way to god, except through him". I have heard this is Christianity before. What does this mean? You cannot understand God without understanding Christ.
Could you elaborate?
Does it mean that you can't understand god, without understanding god as a man?
Or does it mean that you can't understand god without understanding the life of christ?
Really, please elaborate.
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On October 06 2008 08:09 Meta wrote:
I'm writing an essay on some similarities between Hesiod's Theogony and the first few chapters of Genesis. I guess it says some interesting stuff that could prompt discussion, so would you guys mind if i posted it here when i'm done?
I look forward to it.
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On October 06 2008 08:21 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 08:09 conCentrate9 wrote:On October 06 2008 08:01 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 07:56 babypo0 wrote:i will claim sancturary under travis's thread, which don't seemed to get as closed as often as other ppl's topics about religion or other controvorsial stuff. a great book presenting the christian side thru philosophy quite logically is C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity. he starts out assuming nothing about god, or religion. he goes thru a lot of fundamental existence, the rationalism, the implications of the existence of a thing called conscience, and then finally steps into whether the supernatural could exist or not. Recommended for all those who say Christianity is illogical, irrational, and the only logic relies in evolution. another eye openning bit of info: http://amazingdiscoveries.org/media-Video-TotalOnslaught.htmllearn about Revelation, the occult throughout history, and where their bastion is now. I am watching this video, and at the very beginning the guy mentions that "jesus said that there is no way to god, except through him". I have heard this is Christianity before. What does this mean? You cannot understand God without understanding Christ. Could you elaborate? Does it mean that you can't understand god, without understanding god as a man? Or does it mean that you can't understand god without understanding the life of christ? Really, please elaborate.
imo just tech science vessels they'll give you the answers you need.
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On October 06 2008 08:22 d(O.o)a wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 08:21 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 08:09 conCentrate9 wrote:On October 06 2008 08:01 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 07:56 babypo0 wrote:i will claim sancturary under travis's thread, which don't seemed to get as closed as often as other ppl's topics about religion or other controvorsial stuff. a great book presenting the christian side thru philosophy quite logically is C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity. he starts out assuming nothing about god, or religion. he goes thru a lot of fundamental existence, the rationalism, the implications of the existence of a thing called conscience, and then finally steps into whether the supernatural could exist or not. Recommended for all those who say Christianity is illogical, irrational, and the only logic relies in evolution. another eye openning bit of info: http://amazingdiscoveries.org/media-Video-TotalOnslaught.htmllearn about Revelation, the occult throughout history, and where their bastion is now. I am watching this video, and at the very beginning the guy mentions that "jesus said that there is no way to god, except through him". I have heard this is Christianity before. What does this mean? You cannot understand God without understanding Christ. Could you elaborate? Does it mean that you can't understand god, without understanding god as a man? Or does it mean that you can't understand god without understanding the life of christ? Really, please elaborate. imo just tech science vessels they'll give you the answers you need.
why, is jesus cloaked?
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On October 06 2008 08:24 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 08:22 d(O.o)a wrote:On October 06 2008 08:21 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 08:09 conCentrate9 wrote:On October 06 2008 08:01 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 07:56 babypo0 wrote:i will claim sancturary under travis's thread, which don't seemed to get as closed as often as other ppl's topics about religion or other controvorsial stuff. a great book presenting the christian side thru philosophy quite logically is C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity. he starts out assuming nothing about god, or religion. he goes thru a lot of fundamental existence, the rationalism, the implications of the existence of a thing called conscience, and then finally steps into whether the supernatural could exist or not. Recommended for all those who say Christianity is illogical, irrational, and the only logic relies in evolution. another eye openning bit of info: http://amazingdiscoveries.org/media-Video-TotalOnslaught.htmllearn about Revelation, the occult throughout history, and where their bastion is now. I am watching this video, and at the very beginning the guy mentions that "jesus said that there is no way to god, except through him". I have heard this is Christianity before. What does this mean? You cannot understand God without understanding Christ. Could you elaborate? Does it mean that you can't understand god, without understanding god as a man? Or does it mean that you can't understand god without understanding the life of christ? Really, please elaborate. imo just tech science vessels they'll give you the answers you need. why, is jesus cloaked?
ALL ghosts are cloaked bud.
Edit: provided they have the research but it's only 200mins/vespene shouldn't be too hard.
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On October 06 2008 08:17 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 08:07 stenole wrote:
For some reason or other, you are down in a coal mine together with 9 other people. There has just been an earthquake and the mine threatens to collapse on top of you all. The main elevator is broken. There is only a small one-person elevator that still works and it is very slow. So slow that there is a high likelyhood that the mine will collapse and kill you all before you are all lifted out. The group has for some reason decided that you, travis, will decide the order which you are lifted out of the mine. The people in the mine are as follows:
- Escaped convict (You don't know what he was in for, all you know is that he has the orange jump suit on)
- Cancer patient with 3 more months to live
- Father of 4 kids
- Pregnant lady
- 4 year old girl
- Your best friend
- A lady who suffers from severe claustrophobia and is possibly not able to get up without freaking out (meaning she might end up spending a lot of time getting into the elevator and may be unable to get off the elevator at the top, therefore ending up coming down again. And she will absolutely not be able to get on by herself at the end.)
- Yourself
- Slayers Boxer
- A man with a suit and tie that offers you $100,000 to let him out 1st or $25,000 for the 2nd spot.
What order do they ascend? I would just sit there and not say anything. Sorry I know it isn't a fun answer.
Any answer that is out of the box is good. Anyway someone else answered it and seemed to decide that all the people that didn't belong in the mine should stay there. I didn't quite get the logic behind that.
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On October 06 2008 08:30 stenole wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 08:17 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 08:07 stenole wrote:
For some reason or other, you are down in a coal mine together with 9 other people. There has just been an earthquake and the mine threatens to collapse on top of you all. The main elevator is broken. There is only a small one-person elevator that still works and it is very slow. So slow that there is a high likelyhood that the mine will collapse and kill you all before you are all lifted out. The group has for some reason decided that you, travis, will decide the order which you are lifted out of the mine. The people in the mine are as follows:
- Escaped convict (You don't know what he was in for, all you know is that he has the orange jump suit on)
- Cancer patient with 3 more months to live
- Father of 4 kids
- Pregnant lady
- 4 year old girl
- Your best friend
- A lady who suffers from severe claustrophobia and is possibly not able to get up without freaking out (meaning she might end up spending a lot of time getting into the elevator and may be unable to get off the elevator at the top, therefore ending up coming down again. And she will absolutely not be able to get on by herself at the end.)
- Yourself
- Slayers Boxer
- A man with a suit and tie that offers you $100,000 to let him out 1st or $25,000 for the 2nd spot.
What order do they ascend? I would just sit there and not say anything. Sorry I know it isn't a fun answer. Any answer that is out of the box is good. Anyway someone else answered it and seemed to decide that all the people that didn't belong in the mine should stay there. I didn't quite get the logic behind that.
If you were in the mine for no reason at all than you might as well stay there. They had no business going down there so therefor it's there fault they are going to die.
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On October 06 2008 08:30 Not_Computer wrote:discuss.
quite clearly it is a problem revolving around the use of Valkyries in TvZ, as we all know corsairs destroy overlords well, now it's valkyrie's turn.
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On October 06 2008 07:56 babypo0 wrote:i will claim sancturary under travis's thread, which don't seemed to get as closed as often as other ppl's topics about religion or other controvorsial stuff. a great book presenting the christian side thru philosophy quite logically is C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity. he starts out assuming nothing about god, or religion. he goes thru a lot of fundamental existence, the rationalism, the implications of the existence of a thing called conscience, and then finally steps into whether the supernatural could exist or not. Recommended for all those who say Christianity is illogical, irrational, and the only logic relies in evolution. another eye openning bit of info: http://amazingdiscoveries.org/media-Video-TotalOnslaught.htmllearn about Revelation, the occult throughout history, and where their bastion is now.
Amen!
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On October 06 2008 08:30 Not_Computer wrote:discuss.
well if pi was rational then circles wouldn't be so slick
and i just don't plain understand imaginary numbers
awesome pic tho
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[On October 06 2008 08:07 stenole wrote:+ Show Spoiler +
For some reason or other, you are down in a coal mine together with 9 other people. There has just been an earthquake and the mine threatens to collapse on top of you all. The main elevator is broken. There is only a small one-person elevator that still works and it is very slow. So slow that there is a high likelyhood that the mine will collapse and kill you all before you are all lifted out. The group has for some reason decided that you, travis, will decide the order which you are lifted out of the mine. The people in the mine are as follows:
- Escaped convict (You don't know what he was in for, all you know is that he has the orange jump suit on)
- Cancer patient with 3 more months to live
- Father of 4 kids
- Pregnant lady
- 4 year old girl
- Your best friend
- A lady who suffers from severe claustrophobia and is possibly not able to get up without freaking out (meaning she might end up spending a lot of time getting into the elevator and may be unable to get off the elevator at the top, therefore ending up coming down again. And she will absolutely not be able to get on by herself at the end.)
- Yourself
- Slayers Boxer
- A man with a suit and tie that offers you $100,000 to let him out 1st or $25,000 for the 2nd spot.
What order do they ascend?
1. myself
2. convict
3. money man
4. cancer
5. father
6. 4
-myself because that's what they get for being stupid enough to let me choose
-convict next cause
-money man on 3rd just to spite him for offering me money
-my best friend would somehow get out of there unscathed after the mine collapsed
-slayers boxer would just mine all the minerals in there, macro up, and dropship micro his way out
-claustrolady would probably complain and freak out until the very last moment then in a burst of willpower claw her way to the surface killing anyone along the way.
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On October 06 2008 08:40 travis wrote:well if pi was rational then circles wouldn't be so slick and i just don't plain understand imaginary numbers awesome pic tho
The problem with imaginary numbers is their name. They arent imaginary at all. They are as real as 'real numbers'. Thats the first think you must accept before you can understand the beauty of complex numbers.
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Q: Can God make a rock so big that even he can't move it?
A: Yes
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I don't even understand what they are, like the definition of them. I was just confused. But I didnt try very hard, TBH.
There are more than one of them? But they are all called i? Is that the case?
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God exist because the idea of god exist, just like anything else, its the idea that counts
for example: "Excuse me kind sir, but may you please move that chair out of the way"
Now, we all have a common idea on what a chair is, how it looks like and what is its purpose (for sitting), it's the idea that is the chair, without the common idea of what a chair is people would have no clue
"But, sir, there is no chair there, there is nothing at all that is in the way!"
Even if there is no chair there, he/her knew exactly what he/her was supposed to be looking for and moving, therefore chairs exist, we sit on chairs, and chairs come in handy for everyday life.
The same can be done for god now
"Excuse me sir, but next time, it would be a great idea to pray to god before going all in with pocket fives"
WRONG
"Oh, I'm sorry, but god doesn't exist, therefore he couldn't have helped me win the pot"
RIGHT
"Oh, well, I'm not very accustomed to pray to god, nor do I believe god would of helped me, but thanks for the advice"
Therefore God exist, we use God everyday, and God comes in handy in everyday life.
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On October 06 2008 08:49 Savio wrote:
Q: Can God make a rock so big that even he can't move it?
A: Yes
[atheist] But isn't he all powerful????? [/atheist]
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On October 06 2008 08:56 greatmeh wrote:
God exist because the idea of god exist, just like anything else, its the idea that counts
for example: "Excuse me kind sir, but may you please move that chair out of the way"
Now, we all have a common idea on what a chair is, how it looks like and what is its purpose (for sitting), it's the idea that is the chair, without the common idea of what a chair is people would have no clue
"But, sir, there is no chair there, there is nothing at all that is in the way!"
Even if there is no chair there, he/her knew exactly what he/her was supposed to be looking for and moving, therefore chairs exist, we sit on chairs, and chairs come in handy for everyday life.
The same can be done for god now
"Excuse me sir, but next time, it would be a great idea to pray to god before going all in with pocket fives"
WRONG
"Oh, I'm sorry, but god doesn't exist, therefore he couldn't have helped me win the pot"
RIGHT
"Oh, well, I'm not very accustomed to pray to god, nor do I believe god would of helped me, but thanks for the advice"
Therefore God exist, we use God everyday, and God comes in handy in everyday life.
So, what are you trying to say? There are multiple meanings I could take from your post.
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On October 06 2008 08:57 ilj.psa wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 08:49 Savio wrote:
Q: Can God make a rock so big that even he can't move it?
A: Yes [atheist] But isn't he all powerful????? [/atheist]
that's precisely why he can make it.
The question is asking for a contradiction with our silly ways of looking at the world.
Our definitions of words do not perfectly fit all meanings, because there are some situations that we don't have to deal with in everyday life.
Plenty of paradoxes exist in what we know as "the real world", so I see no reason why this paradox couldn't really exist either.
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On October 06 2008 08:57 ilj.psa wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 08:49 Savio wrote:
Q: Can God make a rock so big that even he can't move it?
A: Yes [atheist] But isn't he all powerful????? [/atheist]
He obeys his own rules and can't break them. If he makes this rule, then he can't break it. There are lots of things he can't do...like save us in our sins (rather than from our sins).
He can't sin or lie either.
He is all powerful in that he can accomplish his purposes. Not that he can do anything.
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On October 06 2008 08:56 greatmeh wrote:
God exist because the idea of god exist, just like anything else, its the idea that counts
for example: "Excuse me kind sir, but may you please move that chair out of the way"
Now, we all have a common idea on what a chair is, how it looks like and what is its purpose (for sitting), it's the idea that is the chair, without the common idea of what a chair is people would have no clue
"But, sir, there is no chair there, there is nothing at all that is in the way!"
Even if there is no chair there, he/her knew exactly what he/her was supposed to be looking for and moving, therefore chairs exist, we sit on chairs, and chairs come in handy for everyday life.
The same can be done for god now
"Excuse me sir, but next time, it would be a great idea to pray to god before going all in with pocket fives"
WRONG
"Oh, I'm sorry, but god doesn't exist, therefore he couldn't have helped me win the pot"
RIGHT
"Oh, well, I'm not very accustomed to pray to god, nor do I believe god would of helped me, but thanks for the advice"
Therefore God exist, we use God everyday, and God comes in handy in everyday life.
This is Plato right?
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On October 06 2008 08:07 stenole wrote:
For some reason or other, you are down in a coal mine together with 9 other people. There has just been an earthquake and the mine threatens to collapse on top of you all. The main elevator is broken. There is only a small one-person elevator that still works and it is very slow. So slow that there is a high likelyhood that the mine will collapse and kill you all before you are all lifted out. The group has for some reason decided that you, travis, will decide the order which you are lifted out of the mine. The people in the mine are as follows:
- Escaped convict (You don't know what he was in for, all you know is that he has the orange jump suit on)
- Cancer patient with 3 more months to live
- Father of 4 kids
- Pregnant lady
- 4 year old girl
- Your best friend
- A lady who suffers from severe claustrophobia and is possibly not able to get up without freaking out (meaning she might end up spending a lot of time getting into the elevator and may be unable to get off the elevator at the top, therefore ending up coming down again. And she will absolutely not be able to get on by herself at the end.)
- Yourself
- Slayers Boxer
- A man with a suit and tie that offers you $100,000 to let him out 1st or $25,000 for the 2nd spot.
What order do they ascend?
-Best friend
-Boxer
-Me (life would be very depressing without either of the above)
The rest can fight for their turns.
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United States22883 Posts
On October 06 2008 08:49 Savio wrote:
Q: Can God make a rock so big that even he can't move it?
A: Yes
Mavrodes' argument fails but what you logically come to is the fact that rules do not apply to God, much like a dream.
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On October 06 2008 09:13 Jibba wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 08:49 Savio wrote:
Q: Can God make a rock so big that even he can't move it?
A: Yes Mavrodes' argument fails but what you logically come to is the fact that rules do not apply to God, much like a dream.
Jibba, nice to see you in a another thread. 
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United States22883 Posts
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On October 06 2008 09:17 Jibba wrote:
You too, sweet pea.
fun.
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United States24753 Posts
Jeez Travis your level of boredom seems to exceed anything I have ever experienced for you to make this thread.
conCentrate9 I assume it goes without saying that you can add 'according to my religion' to your statement.
edit: oh it's interesting how people explain that God's supposed all-powerful nature doesn't actually mean that he can do anything, but rather that he can't do everything... which is not unreasonable imo.
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Hey travis, I get occasional moods where I feel like discussing existence or similar topics and I rarely have anyone with which to indulge this impulse. Do you have msn or something?
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On October 06 2008 08:56 greatmeh wrote:
God exist because the idea of god exist, just like anything else, its the idea that counts
for example: "Excuse me kind sir, but may you please move that chair out of the way"
Now, we all have a common idea on what a chair is, how it looks like and what is its purpose (for sitting), it's the idea that is the chair, without the common idea of what a chair is people would have no clue
"But, sir, there is no chair there, there is nothing at all that is in the way!"
Even if there is no chair there, he/her knew exactly what he/her was supposed to be looking for and moving, therefore chairs exist, we sit on chairs, and chairs come in handy for everyday life.
The same can be done for god now
"Excuse me sir, but next time, it would be a great idea to pray to god before going all in with pocket fives"
WRONG
"Oh, I'm sorry, but god doesn't exist, therefore he couldn't have helped me win the pot"
RIGHT
"Oh, well, I'm not very accustomed to pray to god, nor do I believe god would of helped me, but thanks for the advice"
Therefore God exist, we use God everyday, and God comes in handy in everyday life.
That's all very nice, but this doesn't explain anything. Let me show you why:
"Excuse me sir, but next time, it would be a good idea to keep your unicorn in the stable"
WRONG
"Oh, I'm sorry, but unicorns don't exist, therefore I can't keep him in the stable"
RIGHT
"Oh, well, I'm not very accustomed to keep unicorns in stables, nor do I believe that unicorns should be kept in stables, but thanks for the advice"
Or for that matter, substitute the words unicorn, with just about anything, say santa claus, fairies, leprechauns etc.
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United States22883 Posts
On October 06 2008 10:41 sigma_x wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 08:56 greatmeh wrote:
God exist because the idea of god exist, just like anything else, its the idea that counts
for example: "Excuse me kind sir, but may you please move that chair out of the way"
Now, we all have a common idea on what a chair is, how it looks like and what is its purpose (for sitting), it's the idea that is the chair, without the common idea of what a chair is people would have no clue
"But, sir, there is no chair there, there is nothing at all that is in the way!"
Even if there is no chair there, he/her knew exactly what he/her was supposed to be looking for and moving, therefore chairs exist, we sit on chairs, and chairs come in handy for everyday life.
The same can be done for god now
"Excuse me sir, but next time, it would be a great idea to pray to god before going all in with pocket fives"
WRONG
"Oh, I'm sorry, but god doesn't exist, therefore he couldn't have helped me win the pot"
RIGHT
"Oh, well, I'm not very accustomed to pray to god, nor do I believe god would of helped me, but thanks for the advice"
Therefore God exist, we use God everyday, and God comes in handy in everyday life.
That's all very nice, but this doesn't explain anything. Let me show you why: "Excuse me sir, but next time, it would be a good idea to keep your unicorn in the stable" WRONG "Oh, I'm sorry, but unicorns don't exist, therefore I can't keep him in the stable" RIGHT "Oh, well, I'm not very accustomed to keep unicorns in stables, nor do I believe that unicorns should be kept in stables, but thanks for the advice" Or for that matter, substitute the words unicorn, with just about anything, say santa claus, fairies, leprechauns etc. I think he meant to prove God's existence in linguistic terms, not in actuality.
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On October 06 2008 10:31 rgfdxm wrote:
Hey travis, I get occasional moods where I feel like discussing existence or similar topics and I rarely have anyone with which to indulge this impulse. Do you have msn or something?
yes, it's asdf2100asd at hotmail dot com
i am very often busy, though
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United States22883 Posts
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On October 06 2008 11:20 travis wrote:
i am very often busy, though
Which is why you are so bored all the time.
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United States24753 Posts
On October 06 2008 11:35 Mooga wrote:Which is why you are so bored all the time.
This idea doesn't make sense to me if it isn't sarcastic.
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Bookmarked. I'll read and contribute to this thread tomorrow probably.
I haven't read this thread yet, but here's a question:
What do you define as yourself? Lay your hands out on the table in front of you and look at them. Do you define those fingers you see as yourself? Or just flesh attached to yourself? So what constitutes your being? Your body as a whole? Your consciousness/brain?
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On October 06 2008 11:35 Mooga wrote:Which is why you are so bored all the time.
a 1.5 hour period is "all the time" ?
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I'm saying God exist just as much as a chair exist
therefore follow God, read the Holy Bible
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On October 06 2008 10:41 sigma_x wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 08:56 greatmeh wrote:
God exist because the idea of god exist, just like anything else, its the idea that counts
for example: "Excuse me kind sir, but may you please move that chair out of the way"
Now, we all have a common idea on what a chair is, how it looks like and what is its purpose (for sitting), it's the idea that is the chair, without the common idea of what a chair is people would have no clue
"But, sir, there is no chair there, there is nothing at all that is in the way!"
Even if there is no chair there, he/her knew exactly what he/her was supposed to be looking for and moving, therefore chairs exist, we sit on chairs, and chairs come in handy for everyday life.
The same can be done for god now
"Excuse me sir, but next time, it would be a great idea to pray to god before going all in with pocket fives"
WRONG
"Oh, I'm sorry, but god doesn't exist, therefore he couldn't have helped me win the pot"
RIGHT
"Oh, well, I'm not very accustomed to pray to god, nor do I believe god would of helped me, but thanks for the advice"
Therefore God exist, we use God everyday, and God comes in handy in everyday life.
That's all very nice, but this doesn't explain anything. Let me show you why: "Excuse me sir, but next time, it would be a good idea to keep your unicorn in the stable" WRONG "Oh, I'm sorry, but unicorns don't exist, therefore I can't keep him in the stable" RIGHT "Oh, well, I'm not very accustomed to keep unicorns in stables, nor do I believe that unicorns should be kept in stables, but thanks for the advice" Or for that matter, substitute the words unicorn, with just about anything, say santa claus, fairies, leprechauns etc.
Well, first of all, the Holy Bible is the most popular book of all time by far
Second of all, you're being ignorant, perhaps thousands of years ago or somewhere on another planet (the more than 50,000 planets that might contain life in this galaxy) there is such thing as unicorns or leprechauns, you're acting like human beings are the all knowing creature, which is exactly how one should not act.
although in this age it's hard not to
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On October 06 2008 11:40 micronesia wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 11:35 Mooga wrote:On October 06 2008 11:20 travis wrote:
i am very often busy, though Which is why you are so bored all the time. This idea doesn't make sense to me if it isn't sarcastic.
On October 06 2008 11:56 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 11:35 Mooga wrote:On October 06 2008 11:20 travis wrote:
i am very often busy, though Which is why you are so bored all the time. a 1.5 hour period is "all the time" ?
It's pretty clear from the responses that sarcasm and exaggeration fail horribly on the internets.
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United States24753 Posts
On October 06 2008 12:27 Mooga wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 11:40 micronesia wrote:On October 06 2008 11:35 Mooga wrote:On October 06 2008 11:20 travis wrote:
i am very often busy, though Which is why you are so bored all the time. This idea doesn't make sense to me if it isn't sarcastic. Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 11:56 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 11:35 Mooga wrote:On October 06 2008 11:20 travis wrote:
i am very often busy, though Which is why you are so bored all the time. a 1.5 hour period is "all the time" ? It's pretty clear from the responses that sarcasm and exaggeration fail horribly on the internets.
Which is why you have to use a different approach most of the time. Also, to be fair I was prepared for it to be sarcasm :p
However, I don't think everyone would agree with the stance that we seem to share.
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On October 06 2008 12:19 greatmeh wrote:
I'm saying God exist just as much as a chair exist
therefore follow God, read the Holy Bible
god being a figment of one's mind would not meet the definition of god in most religions.
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On October 06 2008 12:27 greatmeh wrote:
Well, first of all, the Holy Bible is the most popular book of all time by far
Second of all, you're being ignorant, perhaps thousands of years ago or somewhere on another planet (the more than 50,000 planets that might contain life in this galaxy) there is such thing as unicorns or leprechauns, you're acting like human beings are the all knowing creature, which is exactly how one should not act.
although in this age it's hard not to
The point that is being made is that if your argument is correct, then you apparently verify the existence of everything. This is a very standard counter to certain religious ontological arguments. But regardless, i think travis says it better than i can.
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the only thing about existence i don't understand is where it's heading
what's the purpose of some superbrains in 3098928792984798274928924792847 years, which still is not the end to it
why does the universe.. or let's say 'this reality', in which we are floating, profit from "our existence", our evolution to who-knows-what-ends?
it seems to be natural - if the prerequirements are given - that "life" always strives for something higher, maybe this is only a coincidence in "our" universe, maybe not
but if life once has sparked, it seeks to lengthen, to adapt, to improve
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are we here to solve a greater riddle? something we cannot grasp at the moment but maybe in x^x years? or is our existence just not as special as we think, a mere and short blossom in a universe that will devour us sooner or later without caring for our meddling?
you wanted to discuss existence in a more "worldly" sense i guess but still: that's what came to my mind. it's a different approach but also wants to express how little we know about existence. i mean, you mentioned dreams and we do not even know how to interpret these correctly, why they show us sometimes such seemingly extrasensory pictures that go beyond our normal consciousness
.
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On October 06 2008 08:19 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 08:08 XCetron wrote:On October 06 2008 08:01 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 07:56 babypo0 wrote:i will claim sancturary under travis's thread, which don't seemed to get as closed as often as other ppl's topics about religion or other controvorsial stuff. a great book presenting the christian side thru philosophy quite logically is C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity. he starts out assuming nothing about god, or religion. he goes thru a lot of fundamental existence, the rationalism, the implications of the existence of a thing called conscience, and then finally steps into whether the supernatural could exist or not. Recommended for all those who say Christianity is illogical, irrational, and the only logic relies in evolution. another eye openning bit of info: http://amazingdiscoveries.org/media-Video-TotalOnslaught.htmllearn about Revelation, the occult throughout history, and where their bastion is now. I am watching this video, and at the very beginning the guy mentions that "jesus said that there is no way to god, except through him". I have heard this is Christianity before. What does this mean? I think it means to be a "Christian" you must accept that Jesus is son of god and the messiah. the rest is just follow what he said since hes the son of god. so if you dont believe in Jesus, youre not a Christian by definition. are you sure? because that seems retarded.
why? Its like saying if you're a real TLnetter you must have an account on here and visit the site, thats just by definition.
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On October 06 2008 13:08 XCetron wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 08:19 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 08:08 XCetron wrote:On October 06 2008 08:01 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 07:56 babypo0 wrote:i will claim sancturary under travis's thread, which don't seemed to get as closed as often as other ppl's topics about religion or other controvorsial stuff. a great book presenting the christian side thru philosophy quite logically is C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity. he starts out assuming nothing about god, or religion. he goes thru a lot of fundamental existence, the rationalism, the implications of the existence of a thing called conscience, and then finally steps into whether the supernatural could exist or not. Recommended for all those who say Christianity is illogical, irrational, and the only logic relies in evolution. another eye openning bit of info: http://amazingdiscoveries.org/media-Video-TotalOnslaught.htmllearn about Revelation, the occult throughout history, and where their bastion is now. I am watching this video, and at the very beginning the guy mentions that "jesus said that there is no way to god, except through him". I have heard this is Christianity before. What does this mean? I think it means to be a "Christian" you must accept that Jesus is son of god and the messiah. the rest is just follow what he said since hes the son of god. so if you dont believe in Jesus, youre not a Christian by definition. are you sure? because that seems retarded. why? Its like saying if you're a real TLnetter you must have an account on here and visit the site, thats just by definition.
Because it's too arbitrary. It should be required that I have faith in an idea, not a man. Having faith in a dead man means absolutely nothing. I didn't know jesus, I don't know if he really existed. The only things I even know about him comes 2nd-hand, the bible wasn't written by Jesus.
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On October 06 2008 12:27 greatmeh wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 10:41 sigma_x wrote:On October 06 2008 08:56 greatmeh wrote:
God exist because the idea of god exist, just like anything else, its the idea that counts
for example: "Excuse me kind sir, but may you please move that chair out of the way"
Now, we all have a common idea on what a chair is, how it looks like and what is its purpose (for sitting), it's the idea that is the chair, without the common idea of what a chair is people would have no clue
"But, sir, there is no chair there, there is nothing at all that is in the way!"
Even if there is no chair there, he/her knew exactly what he/her was supposed to be looking for and moving, therefore chairs exist, we sit on chairs, and chairs come in handy for everyday life.
The same can be done for god now
"Excuse me sir, but next time, it would be a great idea to pray to god before going all in with pocket fives"
WRONG
"Oh, I'm sorry, but god doesn't exist, therefore he couldn't have helped me win the pot"
RIGHT
"Oh, well, I'm not very accustomed to pray to god, nor do I believe god would of helped me, but thanks for the advice"
Therefore God exist, we use God everyday, and God comes in handy in everyday life.
That's all very nice, but this doesn't explain anything. Let me show you why: "Excuse me sir, but next time, it would be a good idea to keep your unicorn in the stable" WRONG "Oh, I'm sorry, but unicorns don't exist, therefore I can't keep him in the stable" RIGHT "Oh, well, I'm not very accustomed to keep unicorns in stables, nor do I believe that unicorns should be kept in stables, but thanks for the advice" Or for that matter, substitute the words unicorn, with just about anything, say santa claus, fairies, leprechauns etc. Well, first of all, the Holy Bible is the most popular book of all time by far Second of all, you're being ignorant, perhaps thousands of years ago or somewhere on another planet (the more than 50,000 planets that might contain life in this galaxy) there is such thing as unicorns or leprechauns, you're acting like human beings are the all knowing creature, which is exactly how one should not act. although in this age it's hard not to
That's funny considering Christianity is the most egocentric and humanistic thing to ever be conceived.
Isn't athiesm the ultimate acceptance of the weakness and the unimportance of the human race?
Isn't it absurd that the Holy Bible wouldn't contain any account of god's creation of life on other planets, or the other planets?
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On October 06 2008 13:22 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 13:08 XCetron wrote:On October 06 2008 08:19 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 08:08 XCetron wrote:On October 06 2008 08:01 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 07:56 babypo0 wrote:i will claim sancturary under travis's thread, which don't seemed to get as closed as often as other ppl's topics about religion or other controvorsial stuff. a great book presenting the christian side thru philosophy quite logically is C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity. he starts out assuming nothing about god, or religion. he goes thru a lot of fundamental existence, the rationalism, the implications of the existence of a thing called conscience, and then finally steps into whether the supernatural could exist or not. Recommended for all those who say Christianity is illogical, irrational, and the only logic relies in evolution. another eye openning bit of info: http://amazingdiscoveries.org/media-Video-TotalOnslaught.htmllearn about Revelation, the occult throughout history, and where their bastion is now. I am watching this video, and at the very beginning the guy mentions that "jesus said that there is no way to god, except through him". I have heard this is Christianity before. What does this mean? I think it means to be a "Christian" you must accept that Jesus is son of god and the messiah. the rest is just follow what he said since hes the son of god. so if you dont believe in Jesus, youre not a Christian by definition. are you sure? because that seems retarded. why? Its like saying if you're a real TLnetter you must have an account on here and visit the site, thats just by definition. Because it's too arbitrary. It should be required that I have faith in an idea, not a man. Having faith in a dead man means absolutely nothing. I didn't know jesus, I don't know if he really existed. The only things I even know about him comes 2nd-hand, the bible wasn't written by Jesus.
so youre religious, but not a by-definition Christian. Notice the Christ in Christian.
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If I die and hit the floor
will mahnini still be angrily debating monetary theory here on TL?
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Honestly, without my belief in God, I would be such a different person. I would also feel more empty and purposeless. Who knows, but atheists might realize what they lack if they became believers. That's why I always encourage people to go to a church, which is where arguments/debating/facts all fall short, experience.
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i think therefore i am
MOTHERFUCKER
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United States24753 Posts
On October 06 2008 14:37 BanZu wrote:
Honestly, without my belief in God, I would be such a different person. I would also feel more empty and purposeless. Who knows, but atheists might realize what they lack if they became believers. That's why I always encourage people to go to a church, which is where arguments/debating/facts all fall short, experience.
How do you know you would feel empty and purposeless? That is mere speculation... the same way you acknowledge that there's merely a chance that atheists would feel better from being believers. Also, experience in religion doesn't necessarily do squat :-/
edit: I became rather knowledgeable and experienced in my religion before I allowed myself to draw the conclusions that I had been thinking for many years.
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On October 06 2008 14:54 micronesia wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 14:37 BanZu wrote:
Honestly, without my belief in God, I would be such a different person. I would also feel more empty and purposeless. Who knows, but atheists might realize what they lack if they became believers. That's why I always encourage people to go to a church, which is where arguments/debating/facts all fall short, experience. How do you know you would feel empty and purposeless? That is mere speculation... the same way you acknowledge that there's merely a chance that atheists would feel better from being believers. Also, experience in religion doesn't necessarily do squat :-/ edit: I became rather knowledgeable and experienced in my religion before I allowed myself to draw the conclusions that I had been thinking for many years.
Not mere speculation. Often times school and other things draw me away from going to church, reading the bible, etc. Even last year I would often eat with my church friends during lunch at school. I felt, in a way, more sheltered from worldly things during that time than I would with my school friends. When I look back I realize that after I stopped doing that I had more troubles, anxieties, no peace. Just in my spirit I could sense a difference (now whether you believe humans have a spirit or not is your choice).
When I say experience I mean going to church, praying, reading the bible, reading books written by other believers, singing, psalming, fellowshipping, etc. not just being there.
Also, whereas experience doesn't necessarily do squat, when have arguing and debating ever caused a believer or an atheist to change beliefs? As far as I know all it ever leads to is bashing, yelling, criticizing, and more bashing.
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United States22883 Posts
How do you know you're not missing something even more special by not meditating in a Zen Buddhist temple or attending a Mosque? Far more people convert to Islam than to Christianity.
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Why hasn't religion been classed as a mental illness yet? Invisible being, talking to him (praying), thinking a book of fiction is real etc.
I like the meaning of life discussions, personally I think we have no purpose, we was just a total fluke that happened under the most perfect of conditions. Unfortunately the human mind is very flawed and fragile, it needs a reason for everything.
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how can anyone prove anything?
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On October 06 2008 13:07 Ghardo wrote:
the only thing about existence i don't understand is where it's heading
what's the purpose of some superbrains in 3098928792984798274928924792847 years, which still is not the end to it
why does the universe.. or let's say 'this reality', in which we are floating, profit from "our existence", our evolution to who-knows-what-ends?
it seems to be natural - if the prerequirements are given - that "life" always strives for something higher, maybe this is only a coincidence in "our" universe, maybe not
but if life once has sparked, it seeks to lengthen, to adapt, to improve
-
are we here to solve a greater riddle? something we cannot grasp at the moment but maybe in x^x years? or is our existence just not as special as we think, a mere and short blossom in a universe that will devour us sooner or later without caring for our meddling?
you wanted to discuss existence in a more "worldly" sense i guess but still: that's what came to my mind. it's a different approach but also wants to express how little we know about existence. i mean, you mentioned dreams and we do not even know how to interpret these correctly, why they show us sometimes such seemingly extrasensory pictures that go beyond our normal consciousness
.
maybe it's not heading anywhere in particular?
maybe existence just is, and it tends to(or always does) follow certain rules, and these rules lead to cause and effect. maybe there is no beginning and there is no end. We tend to put beginnings and ends on things because we have a beginning and an end, but there is no reason that existence would.
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On October 06 2008 13:51 XCetron wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 13:22 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 13:08 XCetron wrote:On October 06 2008 08:19 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 08:08 XCetron wrote:On October 06 2008 08:01 travis wrote:On October 06 2008 07:56 babypo0 wrote:i will claim sancturary under travis's thread, which don't seemed to get as closed as often as other ppl's topics about religion or other controvorsial stuff. a great book presenting the christian side thru philosophy quite logically is C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity. he starts out assuming nothing about god, or religion. he goes thru a lot of fundamental existence, the rationalism, the implications of the existence of a thing called conscience, and then finally steps into whether the supernatural could exist or not. Recommended for all those who say Christianity is illogical, irrational, and the only logic relies in evolution. another eye openning bit of info: http://amazingdiscoveries.org/media-Video-TotalOnslaught.htmllearn about Revelation, the occult throughout history, and where their bastion is now. I am watching this video, and at the very beginning the guy mentions that "jesus said that there is no way to god, except through him". I have heard this is Christianity before. What does this mean? I think it means to be a "Christian" you must accept that Jesus is son of god and the messiah. the rest is just follow what he said since hes the son of god. so if you dont believe in Jesus, youre not a Christian by definition. are you sure? because that seems retarded. why? Its like saying if you're a real TLnetter you must have an account on here and visit the site, thats just by definition. Because it's too arbitrary. It should be required that I have faith in an idea, not a man. Having faith in a dead man means absolutely nothing. I didn't know jesus, I don't know if he really existed. The only things I even know about him comes 2nd-hand, the bible wasn't written by Jesus. so youre religious, but not a by-definition Christian. Notice the Christ in Christian.
ok, so does that at all change or counter my point? or are you not attempting to?
and if not, why not.
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On October 06 2008 15:51 BanZu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 14:54 micronesia wrote:On October 06 2008 14:37 BanZu wrote:
Honestly, without my belief in God, I would be such a different person. I would also feel more empty and purposeless. Who knows, but atheists might realize what they lack if they became believers. That's why I always encourage people to go to a church, which is where arguments/debating/facts all fall short, experience. How do you know you would feel empty and purposeless? That is mere speculation... the same way you acknowledge that there's merely a chance that atheists would feel better from being believers. Also, experience in religion doesn't necessarily do squat :-/ edit: I became rather knowledgeable and experienced in my religion before I allowed myself to draw the conclusions that I had been thinking for many years. Not mere speculation. Often times school and other things draw me away from going to church, reading the bible, etc. Even last year I would often eat with my church friends during lunch at school. I felt, in a way, more sheltered from worldly things during that time than I would with my school friends. When I look back I realize that after I stopped doing that I had more troubles, anxieties, no peace. Just in my spirit I could sense a difference (now whether you believe humans have a spirit or not is your choice). When I say experience I mean going to church, praying, reading the bible, reading books written by other believers, singing, psalming, fellowshipping, etc. not just being there.
That's called conditioning. For better or for worse you are conditioning your brain/mind to think in a different way. It certainly isn't magical god-power.
(not trying to bash your beliefs, at all. you may also already know this)
Also, whereas experience doesn't necessarily do squat, when have arguing and debating ever caused a believer or an atheist to change beliefs? As far as I know all it ever leads to is bashing, yelling, criticizing, and more bashing.
You have probably only seen arguing, debating, and discussion between closeminded people.
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On October 06 2008 13:27 DoctorHelvetica wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 12:27 greatmeh wrote:On October 06 2008 10:41 sigma_x wrote:On October 06 2008 08:56 greatmeh wrote:
God exist because the idea of god exist, just like anything else, its the idea that counts
for example: "Excuse me kind sir, but may you please move that chair out of the way"
Now, we all have a common idea on what a chair is, how it looks like and what is its purpose (for sitting), it's the idea that is the chair, without the common idea of what a chair is people would have no clue
"But, sir, there is no chair there, there is nothing at all that is in the way!"
Even if there is no chair there, he/her knew exactly what he/her was supposed to be looking for and moving, therefore chairs exist, we sit on chairs, and chairs come in handy for everyday life.
The same can be done for god now
"Excuse me sir, but next time, it would be a great idea to pray to god before going all in with pocket fives"
WRONG
"Oh, I'm sorry, but god doesn't exist, therefore he couldn't have helped me win the pot"
RIGHT
"Oh, well, I'm not very accustomed to pray to god, nor do I believe god would of helped me, but thanks for the advice"
Therefore God exist, we use God everyday, and God comes in handy in everyday life.
That's all very nice, but this doesn't explain anything. Let me show you why: "Excuse me sir, but next time, it would be a good idea to keep your unicorn in the stable" WRONG "Oh, I'm sorry, but unicorns don't exist, therefore I can't keep him in the stable" RIGHT "Oh, well, I'm not very accustomed to keep unicorns in stables, nor do I believe that unicorns should be kept in stables, but thanks for the advice" Or for that matter, substitute the words unicorn, with just about anything, say santa claus, fairies, leprechauns etc. Well, first of all, the Holy Bible is the most popular book of all time by far Second of all, you're being ignorant, perhaps thousands of years ago or somewhere on another planet (the more than 50,000 planets that might contain life in this galaxy) there is such thing as unicorns or leprechauns, you're acting like human beings are the all knowing creature, which is exactly how one should not act. although in this age it's hard not to That's funny considering Christianity is the most egocentric and humanistic thing to ever be conceived. Isn't athiesm the ultimate acceptance of the weakness and the unimportance of the human race? Isn't it absurd that the Holy Bible wouldn't contain any account of god's creation of life on other planets, or the other planets?
acceptance of what weakness?
From what I can tell, compared to other sentient beings we are pretty much at the top.
Unimportance?
What is more important than us?
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On October 06 2008 23:37 Ki_Do wrote:
how can anyone prove anything?
I can prove I can walk by walking.
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On October 06 2008 23:32 inb4RUSH wrote:
Why hasn't religion been classed as a mental illness yet? Invisible being, talking to him (praying), thinking a book of fiction is real etc.
So you think that the majority of the people on earth have a mental illness?
I like the meaning of life discussions, personally I think we have no purpose, we was just a total fluke that happened under the most perfect of conditions.
The most perfect of what conditions?
Scientists don't understand the cause of consciousness, so how can you claim it's a fluke when you don't even know the base that makes up the conditions.
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So you think that the majority of the people on earth have a mental illness?
Yes.
The most perfect of what conditions?
Scientists don't understand the cause of consciousness, so how can you claim it's a fluke when you don't even know the base that makes up the conditions.
Err, I mean as in, life exists completely by the fact that by luck our planet was so and so long away from the sun giving the right chemistry for life.
I'm no scientist or anything so I can't explain consciousness and so I won't ,but I don't think it means that we have a purpose in this universe because of it though. The meaning of life is just a flaw in the human psyche, IMO.
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On October 07 2008 02:07 inb4RUSH wrote:Show nested quote +So you think that the majority of the people on earth have a mental illness? Yes. Show nested quote +The most perfect of what conditions?
Scientists don't understand the cause of consciousness, so how can you claim it's a fluke when you don't even know the base that makes up the conditions.
Err, I mean as in, life exists completely by the fact that by luck our planet was so and so long away from the sun giving the right chemistry for life. I'm no scientist or anything so I can't explain consciousness and so I won't ,but I don't think it means that we have a purpose in this universe because of it though. The meaning of life is just a flaw in the human psyche, IMO.
should i repeat myself?
Scientists don't understand the cause of consciousness, so how can you claim it's a fluke when you don't even know the base that makes up the conditions.
what is your life without consciousness ?
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On October 06 2008 23:50 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2008 13:07 Ghardo wrote:
the only thing about existence i don't understand is where it's heading
what's the purpose of some superbrains in 3098928792984798274928924792847 years, which still is not the end to it
why does the universe.. or let's say 'this reality', in which we are floating, profit from "our existence", our evolution to who-knows-what-ends?
it seems to be natural - if the prerequirements are given - that "life" always strives for something higher, maybe this is only a coincidence in "our" universe, maybe not
but if life once has sparked, it seeks to lengthen, to adapt, to improve
-
are we here to solve a greater riddle? something we cannot grasp at the moment but maybe in x^x years? or is our existence just not as special as we think, a mere and short blossom in a universe that will devour us sooner or later without caring for our meddling?
you wanted to discuss existence in a more "worldly" sense i guess but still: that's what came to my mind. it's a different approach but also wants to express how little we know about existence. i mean, you mentioned dreams and we do not even know how to interpret these correctly, why they show us sometimes such seemingly extrasensory pictures that go beyond our normal consciousness
. maybe it's not heading anywhere in particular? maybe existence just is, and it tends to(or always does) follow certain rules, and these rules lead to cause and effect. maybe there is no beginning and there is no end. We tend to put beginnings and ends on things because we have a beginning and an end, but there is no reason that existence would.
good point.
i'm not quite satisfied with the reply i wrote so i put it in spoilers.. it's all a bit wishy-washy + Show Spoiler +so for you existence is "the whole" and not necessarily human existence. a state; which is precious at the moment and will be precious at another moment somewhen else. this leaves time to be debatable.. maybe it is just ... is is is is is is is is is is is ... and it doesn't matter where on the arrow of time you are atm, it's all the same. one big package of existence with no clear end and no clear beginning.
scientifically it looks a bit different. there seems to be a physical start of the universe and a direction where it's heading - as it expands and collapses again somewhen in the future. even tho this might be only significant for our universe.
if we can comprehend and express with our set of vocabularies what existence really means and if there isn't much much more to it we can't grasp with our tiny brains, i do not know.
to conclude. i don't see the end of existence apart from the scientifically announced collaps of our universe. there seems to be a beginning and if what was before it can also be called existence i cannot tell.
so my major question is still not answered: why do we (why does life) become more complex? why is it there in the first place, why isn't there only planets, dead materia, an expanding universe and a collaps (and all this again or whatev).
the only answer i know is: things just happen.
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On October 07 2008 02:22 Ghardo wrote:
so for you existence is "the whole" and not necessarily human existence. a state; which is precious at the moment and will be precious at another moment somewhen else. this leaves time to be debatable.. maybe it is just ... is is is is is is is is is is is ... and it doesn't matter where on the arrow of time you are atm, it's all the same. one big package of existence with no clear end and no clear beginning.
scientifically it looks a bit different. there seems to be a physical start of the universe and a direction where it's heading - as it expands and collapses again somewhen in the future. even tho this might be only significant for our universe.
Science doesn't do much to speculate what happened pre-Big Bang. The big bang could be the result of something else that just is.
also
what evidence is there of a collapse in the future? last I heard the universe looked as though it was expanding more rapidly each moment. it doesn't mean much to me either way though 
if we can comprehend and express with our set of vocabularies what existence really means and if there isn't much much more to it we can't grasp with our tiny brains, i do not know.
I am a buddhist, and I believe that things can only be understood through one's own experience. I believe that vernacular can be used to help guide one to this understanding, but it is up for them to have the "revelation".
Our brains are pretty huge btw
It's a common theme for intellectuals to underestimate the ability of mankind in the face of the vast scope of the universe, but really our brains are more complex than anything we know.
to conclude. i don't see the end of existence apart from the scientifically announced collaps of our universe. there seems to be a beginning and if what was before it can also be called existence i cannot tell.
do not fall nto the trap of science's labels and rules. science is good at analyzing cause and effects over various scales, scales which can be tested. However, when it comes to ultimate understandings, science fails miserably. It really does.
so my major question is still not answered: why do we (why does life) become more complex?
A scientific answer would be that certain requisites were met, and as a result a chain of chemical reactions occurred that led to a wider and wider array of other chemical reactions, and this chain is now referred to as Evolution and so we are here. But silly scientists just assume this somehow explains consciousness. (most)Silly scientists also define this "evolution" to be a biological process, which is laughable since it clearly began from non-biological processes - it began at the beginning.
But I believe all of that is irrelevant. This universe is just a vessel and we are here filling it for the time being.
why is it there in the first place, why isn't there only planets, dead materia, an expanding universe and a collaps (and all this again or whatev).
the only answer i know is: things just happen.
The places that are like that, nothing is experiencing.
I hope I don't come off as condescending. These are just my beliefs and I enjoyed responding to your post.
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no problem. i view it differently but i can understand your stance and respect it.
nothing really left to say. my post wasn't about arguing but rather exchanging thoughts. so yeah, now we know what the other thinks ; )
cheers
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