• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 21:20
CEST 03:20
KST 10:20
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists14[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Fresh Flow9[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash10[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy21
Community News
2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers11Maestros of the Game 2 announced32026 GSL Tour plans announced13Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail1MaNa leaves Team Liquid22
StarCraft 2
General
Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool 2026 GSL Tour plans announced MaNa leaves Team Liquid Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament GSL CK: More events planned pending crowdfunding 2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) SEL Doubles (SC Evo Bimonthly)
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 522 Flip My Base The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 521 Memorable Boss Mutation # 520 Moving Fees
Brood War
General
Data needed RepMastered™: replay sharing and analyzer site Gypsy to Korea ASL21 General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [ASL21] Ro16 Group A [ASL21] Ro16 Group B
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Any training maps people recommend? Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Starcraft Tabletop Miniature Game
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
[G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Reappraising The Situation T…
TrAiDoS
lurker extra damage testi…
StaticNine
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1779 users

Returning to Starcraft. Balance Soviet.

Blogs > -_-
Post a Reply
-_-
Profile Blog Joined November 2003
United States7081 Posts
September 15 2023 06:30 GMT
#1
After a break of many years, I've started playing and watching Starcraft 2 again. I'm surprised how much joy it still gives me. It truly remains my favorite hobby.

The procedure for balancing the game now came to me as quite the shock. I felt the need to write down a few thoughts about it.

First, I've seen Harstem, Catz, and others draw attention to the fact that those participating are not paid. I do not feel this is an effective rhetorical move. If you were not participating, and volunteers materially damaged the game, would you care that those causing harm were not paid? And, if participating in the Council does not add benefit to your life, can you not simply stop?

Second, while I don't disagree that certain changes affect professional play more drastically, I think some comments, specifically regarding the Viper, are overstated. A professional never lets a Viper kill his buildings because he pays attention to it. If less attention needs to be paid, the professional will be direct that surplus elsewhere. I.e., it is a slight buff to professional Zergs. And more generally, I do not believe pros are "playing a different game" than those in lower leagues.

Third, I feel like some commentators are unnecessarily harsh about the state Blizzard left the game in when development ended. I am watching those games now. People certainly were complaining, e.g., about Void Rays. But I'm watching those games now. It was most certainly not a disaster. Demeaning a prior version of the game doesn't make this version any better.

A few minor thoughts on the current changes: The Immortal change is quite elegant.

I am somewhat worried about the strength of late-game Zerg versus Protoss. Fundamentally, because of Zerg's inherent map control (creep, overlords, mobility) vis-a-vis Protoss, I think a Protoss late-game army must be able to trade at better than even against Zerg's. If Protoss can't, Zerg players leverage the fact that they "lead the dance" in ZVP and stall. Alternatively, Protoss will need to have two- and three-base timing that win 50% of the time even when scouted. I actually think the current changes--Lurker nerf; Infestor late-game "nerf"; Tempest acceleration buff-- may solve this. And, further, I think Protoss players can utilize mass shield batteries and cannons more effectively.

...Perhaps my age is showing, though? I left during the Brood Lord-Infestor Era. I fear that again.

I think the EMP radius nerf is too drastic. TVP strikes me as being in a good state.

I think the Council has taken the right tact on Widow Mines. I hope the visibility change can be made good--I've read that it is not working as intended. Also, I do wonder if the cracked earth effect can be enhanced. Or perhaps map makers can choose a tileset which makes it stand out?

Overall, I am pleased. Long live Starcraft 2!

***
BisuDagger
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Bisutopia19333 Posts
September 15 2023 18:13 GMT
#2
The game is fantastic and if you come back to it now, you'd see no problems. But if you've lived and casted the balance issues for the past 5-7 years, you'd get to a point where you are bitter with the way certain things were left. I think that's where the commentary is coming from.
ModeratorFormer Afreeca Starleague Caster: http://afreeca.tv/ASL2ENG2
WombaT
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Northern Ireland26621 Posts
September 17 2023 00:32 GMT
#3
Yeah I think the stare of the game is better than people give credit. Tbh it seems to be a trend on most games I see where really regular players are never fully satisfied, there’s always one more change to be made, or some nostalgic era that never really was as good as the goggles hint at

Taking a step back and returning, especially a long one and it really does hit how much the game has generally changed for the better

Happy hunting!
'You'll always be the cuddly marsupial of my heart, despite the inherent flaws of your ancestry' - Squat
Ilikestarcraft
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Korea (South)17734 Posts
September 20 2023 18:29 GMT
#4
This is off topic but I think you have the best username
ils
"Nana is a goddess. Or at very least, Nana is my goddess." - KazeHydra
Greatablemen
Profile Joined September 2023
2 Posts
September 21 2023 06:40 GMT
#5
--- Nuked ---
-_-
Profile Blog Joined November 2003
United States7081 Posts
September 21 2023 21:38 GMT
#6
On September 21 2023 03:29 Ilikestarcraft wrote:
This is off topic but I think you have the best username


Hah! You're not wrong. Got in pretty close to the ground floor back in '03!
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
00:00
Code For Giants Cup #29
CranKy Ducklings105
Liquipedia
BSL
19:00
RO32 Group D
StRyKeR vs rasowy
Artosis vs Aether
JDConan vs OyAji
Hawk vs izu
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ProTech167
RuFF_SC2 134
StarCraft: Brood War
GuemChi 5831
Artosis 786
Britney 633
ggaemo 62
NaDa 28
Dota 2
monkeys_forever743
NeuroSwarm107
League of Legends
JimRising 740
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox615
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor168
Other Games
gofns23638
summit1g16130
tarik_tv16113
C9.Mang0352
sgares208
Maynarde142
ViBE95
SpeCial52
Mew2King35
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick676
BasetradeTV257
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 113
• Mapu4
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP4
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Other Games
• Scarra1141
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
7h 41m
Wardi Open
8h 41m
Afreeca Starleague
8h 41m
Bisu vs Ample
Jaedong vs Flash
Monday Night Weeklies
14h 41m
RSL Revival
1d
GSL
1d 6h
Afreeca Starleague
1d 8h
Barracks vs Leta
Royal vs Light
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
1d 9h
RSL Revival
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
[ Show More ]
The PondCast
3 days
KCM Race Survival
3 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
3 days
CranKy Ducklings
3 days
Escore
4 days
RSL Revival
4 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
5 days
Universe Titan Cup
5 days
Rogue vs Percival
Ladder Legends
5 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
5 days
BSL
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
6 days
Ladder Legends
6 days
BSL
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: W3
RSL Revival: Season 4
NationLESS Cup

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
StarCraft2 Community Team League 2026 Spring
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: W4
Acropolis #4
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.