• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 14:44
CET 20:44
KST 04:44
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12
Community News
Weekly Cups (Jan 5-11): Clem wins big offline, Trigger upsets0$21,000 Rongyi Cup Season 3 announced (Jan 22-Feb 7)12Weekly Cups (Dec 29-Jan 4): Protoss rolls, 2v2 returns7[BSL21] Non-Korean Championship - Starts Jan 103SC2 All-Star Invitational: Jan 17-1822
StarCraft 2
General
When will we find out if there are more tournament SC2 Spotted on the EWC 2026 list? Weekly Cups (Jan 5-11): Clem wins big offline, Trigger upsets Weekly Cups (Dec 29-Jan 4): Protoss rolls, 2v2 returns Spontaneous hotkey change zerg
Tourneys
$25,000 Streamerzone StarCraft Pro Series announced $21,000 Rongyi Cup Season 3 announced (Jan 22-Feb 7) WardiTV Winter Cup WardiTV Mondays SC2 AI Tournament 2026
Strategy
Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 508 Violent Night Mutation # 507 Well Trained Mutation # 506 Warp Zone Mutation # 505 Rise From Ashes
Brood War
General
[ASL21] Potential Map Candidates Potential ASL qualifier breakthroughs? A cwal.gg Extension - Easily keep track of anyone BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] Grand Finals - Sunday 21:00 CET [BSL21] Non-Korean Championship - Starts Jan 10 SLON Grand Finals – Season 2
Strategy
Game Theory for Starcraft Simple Questions, Simple Answers Current Meta [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Beyond All Reason Nintendo Switch Thread Awesome Games Done Quick 2026! Mechabellum Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Trading/Investing Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List TL+ Announced
Blogs
My 2025 Magic: The Gathering…
DARKING
Physical Exercise (HIIT) Bef…
TrAiDoS
Life Update and thoughts.
FuDDx
How do archons sleep?
8882
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2159 users

US/S.Korean FTA

Blogs > Tadzio00
Post a Reply
Tadzio
Profile Blog Joined October 2006
3340 Posts
Last Edited: 2007-06-28 23:50:58
June 28 2007 21:50 GMT
#1
[image loading]

FTA Protesters in Seoul, South Korea. I don't know why they're stepping on cardboard boxes.

South Korea and the US have concluded negotiations on their free trade agreement (FTA) and they're scheduled to sign it tomorrow (30 June).

South Korea and the US already have a healthy trade relationship. S.Korea is the US' 7th largest trading partner, and the US is S.Korea's 2nd largest (after China). There are more than 3,000 US companies that operate within S.Korea and Hyundai Motor's has a automotive factory in the US. This may seem a little lopsided, but it's somewhat expected considering relative GDP-- The US' GDP is nearly 11 times that of S.Korea. I think it's natural to assume that the country with more economic clout, if granted market access, would have an easier time penetrating the markets of the economically weaker country. The important question to answer, I think, isn't why does this lopsided condition exist? but why should the smaller country allow the penetration? It's a good question. S.Korea doesn't have to allow US businesses access to their markets. Trade can exist without it... ironically, an FTA just sets up ground-rules-- extra bureaucracy-- for trade. So... why enter into an FTA?

The Heritage Foundation (a US neo-conservative think tank) has this to say about the FTA with South Korea: "An FTA with South Korea would advance the interests of U.S. businesses and consumers, expand trade and investment opportunities with a close ally, and reaffirm America’s leadership on trade." Notice they're not too concerned with whether the FTA will benefit S.Korea as well as it does the United States. In fact, S.Korea's main incentive to sign this agreement is because "steadily growing economic ties have become one of the most important pillars supporting its dynamic and comprehensive alliance with the U.S." So their main reason to sign-on is not economic, but political. It'll make the US happy, so S.Korea should agree. No other incentive is necessary, at least as far as the Heritage Foundation cares to consider. And this strikes me as being perfectly correct.

Now I haven't read the agreement myself, so if anyone's closer to this issue, please correct me, but it strikes me that the best way to predict the effects of this FTA would be to look at the effects of NAFTA.

It's true that NAFTA has increased trade in North America, at least on paper, but most of that trade is pretty one-sided. For example, in the US, where consumers aren't starving and have a choice what to eat, white chicken and turkey meat is preferred over dark chicken/turkey meat for some bizarre and probably subconsciously racist reason. As a result, US agri-businesses compete with one another to provide the best white chicken/turkey meat to consumers that they can. However, this has the consequence of producing vast quantities of dark meat that US consumers don't really want. Very wasteful. In order to minimize waste/maximize profits, US companies that market chicken use the NAFTA in order to dump this waste on other countries. Most notably, Haiti, which has minimal tariff protection (by treaty, 1/5th of Canada's protection). And since US agri-business receives 40% of its profits from government subsidies (some free trade there....) and Haitians aren't as picky eaters as US citizens, Haitian chicken/turkey agri-business gets undercut tremendously (source), to the point where it suffers a collapse. So that's one strike against an FTA.

The vast majority of increased trade within NAFTA is the direct result of inter-corporate trade. I.e., a US corporation owns a widget manufacturing plant in Mexico, and a widget store in the US. When that corporation transfers raw materials from the US to their Mexico manufacturing plant and then back to the US in order to sell its widgets, it's considered international trade, although it's not really trade, but a couple of relocations of inventory. These factories are common enough to have a name: Maquiladoras So the real trade that's going on is for labor. US corporations enter a foreign country because they have access to that country due to NAFTA, and exploit the local labor practices to shave production and other costs. This creates jobs so proponents of NAFTA and similar trade agreements hail it as a good thing. However, there's a dark side to this good news, wherever maquiladoras pop-up there tends to be a steep increase human rights abuses, including murder, rape, disappearances and torture. It is thought that the human rights abuses are part of an effort to limit public organization and unionization to increase productivity. Terrorism for economic rather than political benefit, essentially.

William C. Gruben, Senior Economist at the Federal Reserve Bank of Dallas believes that the enactment of NAFTA and the subsequent increase of maquiladoras is a coincidence, and he might be right, I'm no expert... but Mexico's GDP is comparable to S.Korea's so it's sketchy enough for me, at least, to count it as a strike against an FTA. (Edit: Apologies, Mexico's GDP is comparable to S.Korea, but it's GDP per capita is less than half of S.Korea's, so I doubt maquiladoras are realistic to worry about. If farmers can't support themselves there may be an influx of new workers into other industry, which would lower wages. It's hard to speculate, though, especially for an outsider like me...)

A third strike against the FTA is public sentiment by those that will be most affected. Although general public polls show that roughly 60% of S.Koreans support the idea of an FTA. Chong Hye-won, director of the international department of the Korean Metal Workers' Union (KMWU) said that 110,000 members of the KMWU walked off the job in opposition to the FTA. Not a small number considering that KMWU only has 150,000 members. And the majority of the 23.4% of S.Korean National Assembly lawmakers that opposed the FTA in april (41.5% were undecided) are supported by farmers who expect strong negative repercussions despite the fact that President Roh has promised to use government resources to assist the industries that are hardest hit.

So what incentive is there to enter into an FTA? Personally, I think the Heritage Foundation was correct. The biggest incentive for the average S.Korean is it'll keep the US happy. I don't think thats a minor consideration. Countries that protect their markets from foreign competition, and especially countries that nationalize their resources, do not get treated well by the US government. Often, that maltreatment goes beyond rhetoric into minor punishment like withholding of military and humanitarian aid, to major punishment like economic strangulation through sanctions (though I imagine China would ignore sanctions imposed on S.Korea by the US, and it's not a likely punishment for an ally anyway).

What I'm curious about is what the S.Koreans on TL.net think about all this. When this agreement is signed tomorrow, will you be celebrating, lamenting, or ignoring? As a middle-class US citizen with a job that's not in danger of being outsourced, the FTA w/S.Korea will probably not affect my life one iota. But as a union member, and a conscientious human being, I sympathize with workers from other countries and would like to hear thoughts from the country the FTA will affect the most. Have any of you taken political action, and if so, what do you see your options as being? Are any of you wealthy and are looking forward to taking advantage of the new trade rules? Have any of you seen the agreement yet, and do you know of a link to an english-language copy of it?

Regardless, best wishes to you all. I truly hope the US/S.Korea FTA doesn't turn out the way NAFTA did with regard to Mexico/Haiti.

....lol. I have a feeling this blog gets 0 comments. ^^

Edit: 30 minute Google Video: Interview With Alexander Vershbow, US Ambassador to the Republic of Korea, about the US relationship with South Korea, economic cooperation between North and South Korea, the military threat of the North, and the potential for a Free Trade Agreement between the US and South Korea. It's old, but should give you a cursory glance at the US perspective on things.

Edit: Much more recent news on the FTA. The report is about more of the specifics of the FTA. It sounds like agricultural tariffs will be reduced or removed, etc.

Edit: Violent S.Korean Protest of the FTA. Wild.

**
geometryb
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
United States1249 Posts
June 28 2007 23:16 GMT
#2
i always thought free trade was ideal.

Americans produce good X better and more efficiently than S. Korea.
S. Korea produces good Y better and more efficiently than Americans

Americans Produce more good X and South Koreans produce more good Y. and we trade for it so the total production/consumption increases.

tariffs and trade barriers lead to inefficient resource allocations...no?

----------------------------------------
free trade, however, could be bad for small underdeveloped countries. where the country's industry can't compete with the world price for goods. and the citizens buy cheaper food from outside rather than its own people and so their businesses collapse.

i am curious as to whether or not this problem would be fixed by changes in the exchange rate or something like that. as the country's citzens demand more and more cheap foreign goods would the foreign currency become more expensive and lessen or even reverse the blow?
-----------------------------------------

having an industry undercut isn't necessarily a bad thing. it means that they can use the resources for something else that they are more efficient at making and trade that with us.

it's not really "exploiting" lower laber costs. the people there are willing to work for less. they actually want/need those jobs. just because their pay is lower there, doesn't mean they're being exploited. they'll probably be making more than what they used to. hmm...and they'll be taking our jobs! i dont know about this i'm kind of in between on this issue.


btw, comparing mexico's gdp to S.korea's is kind of weird because mexico is a much larger country so it should produce more.
gdp/capita united states 44190
gdp/capita s.korea 18392
gdp/capita mexico 8066

Tadzio
Profile Blog Joined October 2006
3340 Posts
Last Edited: 2007-06-28 23:36:46
June 28 2007 23:32 GMT
#3
On June 29 2007 08:16 geometryb wrote:
i always thought free trade was ideal.


It might be, it might not be. We've never had a free market to test on free trade. If Government A is richer than Government B, and Government A subsidizes one of their industries, and that industry has free-trade access with Government B, Government B's industry will not be in an ideal position to compete with Government A's industry.

tariffs and trade barriers lead to inefficient resource allocations...no?


In a perfect free market, I think that's the theory, yeah. But we don't have a free market. Not even close.

i am curious as to whether or not this problem would be fixed by changes in the exchange rate or something like that. as the country's citzens demand more and more cheap foreign goods would the foreign currency become more expensive and lessen or even reverse the blow?


I wouldn't expect currency valuations to flux too much as a result of an FTA, I think factors outside of trade affect that. However, as national industries collapse in the face of foreign competition and the unemployment rate rises, you can expect employee wages to drop.

having an industry undercut isn't necessarily a bad thing. it means that they can use the resources for something else that they are more efficient at making and trade that with us.


That's not always an option. Haiti is the poorest country in the hemisphere for a reason.

btw, comparing mexico's gdp to S.korea's is kind of weird because mexico is a much larger country so it should produce more.


Yeah, I used an edit to correct that a few minutes ago. Thanks for pointing out the error in reasoning, though.
IntoTheWow
Profile Blog Joined May 2004
is awesome32277 Posts
June 29 2007 05:40 GMT
#4
USA wants to do this too with all South America (ALCA). I agree with you on most points.
Moderator<:3-/-<
geometryb
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
United States1249 Posts
Last Edited: 2007-06-29 06:45:25
June 29 2007 06:42 GMT
#5
i have a feeling that both countries are going to bitch about losing when actually they're both better off.


to major punishment like economic strangulation through sanctions


i like how you see that blocking free trade even more is a punishment for countries that don't want free trade.
just think of all the jobs it will create in that country! and all the people that aren't going to be exploited!
we're really doing them a favor.
Tadzio
Profile Blog Joined October 2006
3340 Posts
June 29 2007 14:03 GMT
#6
On June 29 2007 15:42 geometryb wrote:
i like how you see that blocking free trade even more is a punishment for countries that don't want free trade.
just think of all the jobs it will create in that country! and all the people that aren't going to be exploited!
we're really doing them a favor.


Please don't act like there's no middle ground between tariff-less trade and forced isolation.
crazyjew
Profile Joined July 2004
Canada44 Posts
July 01 2007 01:05 GMT
#7
On June 29 2007 06:50 Tadzio00 wrote:
[image loading]

FTA Protesters in Seoul, South Korea. I don't know why they're stepping on cardboard boxes.

So what incentive is there to enter into an FTA? Personally, I think the Heritage Foundation was correct. The biggest incentive for the average S.Korean is it'll keep the US happy. I don't think thats a minor consideration. Countries that protect their markets from foreign competition, and especially countries that nationalize their resources, do not get treated well by the US government. Often, that maltreatment goes beyond rhetoric into minor punishment like withholding of military and humanitarian aid, to major punishment like economic strangulation through sanctions (though I imagine China would ignore sanctions imposed on S.Korea by the US, and it's not a likely punishment for an ally anyway).



sometimes they will even bomb the country or assassinate the leader, though I doubt S. Korea has to worry about that
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 5h 17m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
UpATreeSC 267
JuggernautJason161
BRAT_OK 107
MindelVK 33
StarCraft: Brood War
Shuttle 588
White-Ra 153
Dewaltoss 136
Mong 89
scan(afreeca) 24
Dota 2
qojqva3588
League of Legends
C9.Mang072
Counter-Strike
apEX2313
FalleN 2096
fl0m866
shoxiejesuss693
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu422
Other Games
Grubby4728
Gorgc2687
Liquid`RaSZi2271
FrodaN1088
Beastyqt778
ceh9561
B2W.Neo525
Fuzer 325
ArmadaUGS247
mouzStarbuck217
QueenE91
XaKoH 25
Mew2King22
OptimusSC27
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick3500
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 19 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 59
• IndyKCrew
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• intothetv
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• HerbMon 26
• FirePhoenix10
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV575
• Noizen37
League of Legends
• Nemesis4146
• TFBlade843
• Shiphtur500
Other Games
• imaqtpie1700
Upcoming Events
PiGosaur Cup
5h 17m
WardiTV Invitational
16h 17m
The PondCast
1d 14h
OSC
1d 16h
OSC
2 days
All Star Teams
3 days
INnoVation vs soO
sOs vs Scarlett
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3 days
All Star Teams
4 days
MMA vs DongRaeGu
Rogue vs Oliveira
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
OSC
4 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
5 days
Wardi Open
5 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-01-12
Big Gabe Cup #3
NA Kuram Kup

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
OSC Championship Season 13
Underdog Cup #3
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S1: W4
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Rongyi Cup S3
Thunderfire SC2 All-star 2025
Nations Cup 2026
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.