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Canada11310 Posts
Introduction
The Force Awakens has arrived, and I am filled with a mix of trepidation and hope- I will see it in the IMAX on Tuesday. Unfortunately, this new round of films has meant wiping out the old Expanded Universe canon. I understand why they did it, as although there are many gems, it was a deeply flawed series of books and would be a big mess to try and follow.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/34eSmfR.png)
Missing this and the X-wing series are the true tragedies... everything else could keep.
But it got me thinking... so much has been talked about the Prequels' flaws. And some have even suggest how to tinker with the existing Prequel premises to make better stories (Red Letter Media, but Belated Media especially).
However, what if, as a thought experiment, we started over with the prequels as they are doing with Episode VII. Give it a fresh start and re-examine the Original Trilogy and project backwards. What sort of universe would we get? What is the backstory and connections that the Originals naturally suggest?
I think there are a lot of ideas from the Prequels that can be salvaged. However, when I went back to the Originals for the thought experiment, I found the two trilogies do not match very well, even though by the end of Revenge, we have Luke on Tatooine, Leia on Alderaan, Anakin as Darth Vader, etc.
As a baseline, I would like to suggest good prequels ought to expand upon our knowledge of the original story. It is not simply a matter of connecting the dots- where the original hints at a giant backstory, the prequel creates that depth and hints at even more backstory. Connect the dot prequels, while adequate, can kill the power of the original if the suggested depth is revealed to be merely a thin veneer. Furthermore, where there are potential contradictions in the originals, subsequent additions to the series ought to iron out the contradictions to make them work.
Hopefully you find this “close reading” of the Original Trilogy interesting as I take the small hints given in the Original as the facts to extrapolate backwards, and find interesting story ideas. This is not an attempt to create and outline the three movies, but rather to develop the world that Original suggest that the story would be embedded within. I will also take some ideas from the Prequels that I think have a lot of potential in the Reimagined Star Wars Prequels.
Background Worldbuilding: Position of the Jedi
Here we immediately run into troubles based on how the Jedi are talked about in the Original. Listen how dismissive people are of the Force in A New Hope: “Don't try to frighten us with your sorcerer's ways, Lord Vader. Your sad devotion to that ancient religion has not helped you conjure
up the stolen data tapes, or given you clairvoyance enough to find the Rebel's hidden base...” Motti.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/3OPcJZ7.jpg)
Bad memory and misplaced confidence is strong with this one, but mostly a bad memory
Or Han Solo's attitude towards the Force: “Hokey religions and ancient weapons... Kid, I've flown from one side of this galaxy to the other. I've seen a lot of strange stuff, but I've never seen anything to make me believe there's one all-powerful force controlling everything. There's no mystical energy field that controls my destiny.”
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/z4XxF9p.jpg)
They were only the police force during my teen years and were the generals of the clone armies... but never mind that. Hokey religion 'n stuff.
Even if they aren't spoken of dismissively, they are spoken about as though they are the ancient past. Tarkin says, “The Jedi are extinct, their fire has gone out of the universe. You, my friend, are all that's left of their religion.”
What we get from this is the Force is not very well known, and memories of the Jedi are already faded. The Prequels portray the Jedi as a powerful elite cadre, with direct connections to and influence in the central government. The Jedi are the army, the police force, and the FBI (investigators), and yet somehow the entire galaxy forgets about them 18 years later? There isn't simply enough time, particularly given their central role in the Clone Wars.
I understand the desire to show the Jedi at their height, but it makes more sense that the Jedi's political power has already waned. It seems more likely, that the Jedi have fallen out of political favour over the years, but still negotiate/ keep the peace in the backwater worlds. I rather like the idea that there is a faction trying to regain influence, the men of action, looking to re-engage (the Mace Windu faction), whereas the Yoda faction see answers in a further withdrawal and meditation. Significant splits within the Jedi and with a great number operating independently and with many splinter groups, some quite extreme shows very clearly the Jedi are in decline. Most importantly, the Jedi must be in a position where they can be forgotten about after two decades years.
Yoda in particular does not work well as political power broker or general of armies. Even ignoring acrobatic Yoda of the Prequels, he is really a very inconsistent character from Originals to Prequels. “Wars do not make one great” “Excitement. Adventure. Heh. A Jedi craves not these things.” But apparently they do crave political power... Yoda needs to stay a mystic, perhaps on a mountain, where the best of the best go to train. The most wise, the most patient learn the true power of the Force- Obi Wan becomes one of Yoda's disciples, but Anakin either does not have the patience and Yoda refuses to teach him (leading to humiliation and flared up pride because Anakin is aware of his power) or else Anakin does not complete his training (this was a major sticking point for Yoda when considering training Luke) and runs off, likely because of Padme.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/VwVH9Li.jpg)
On Mount Yoda lives the Mystic
A maverick like Qui Gon still works- one that doesn't fit easily in either Mace's camp (who is wise, but tends towards aggression, but is leading a lot of hot-headed Jedi) or Yoda's camp. However, if push came to shove, he would likely side with Yoda. The death of Qui Gon, could really shake the Council up, giving strength to Windu's faction over the Yoda aligned faction.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/L1VIzfD.jpg)
Hard to go wrong with Neeson... but a minor role would suffice
And then some Jedi that are frustrated with the entire Jedi Order and leave for politics itself... I really like the idea that Count Dooku was not a Sith, but really and truly believed that the Republic had become too corrupt and that the Jedi Order was either too passive or not gaining influence fast enough. He quit the Jedi Order and formed the Separatist movement with good intentions and was actually a very charismatic leader.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Ic8LTpB.jpg)
A non-Sith Dooku is a far more interesting character
The schools of thought give a lot of room for Anakin Skywalker to struggle with a fractious Order, making him all the more vulnerable to another way. Both Kenobi and Skywalker tend towards the aggressive methods of Mace... who might even hover on the edge of the Dark Side, but eventually Kenobi is convinced of Yoda's way.
The Clone Wars
The Clone Wars actually meaning that the Republic has the clones, presents a problem with how the story is told as it doesn't match the Originals very well. In the Originals, the Clone Wars is an old war, vaguely hinted at, but with little repercussions for contemporary considerations- there is no talk of Stormtroopers being clones, nor do the Rebels concern themselves with blowing up cloning facilities to stop an endless production clones that would be presumably continuing to this day. (And no, I don't consider whatever the TV show to be of much relevance because the theatrical films ought to stand more or less on their own.)
Furthermore, naming conventions would suggest the clones in the Clone Wars would be on the other side, or at minimum on both sides. Korean War, Vietnam War, Napoleonic War, Boer War are all named by the English-speaking side, referring to either where their opponents lived or to their opponents specifically. The other two naming conventions give both (Anglo-Boer War, Sino-Russo War) or generically sums up in World Wars. This isn't a direct conflict, but rather a suggested direction, which in extrapolating backwards, is what the sort of thing I am looking for. It neatly solves the problem “what happened to the cloning machines” (they were destroyed when they were defeated by the Republic/ Empire). I am also biased because I like the EU's older idea of the Republic facing down the clone masters.
If the series begins in the middle of an ongoing Clone Wars or at least the start of it in Episode I, I think there is far more story fodder than taxation and blockades. It also shows very explicitly how the Republic is blowing a part... clone masters threatening on one front, while other start systems break away from the Republic to join Dooku's Separatist movement. The Separatists can keep droid armies, but also have a significant number of aliens in their combined military. It gives the Separatists a good distinction and links very well with the distrust of droids in the Originals.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Rs1BIUb.jpg)
Droid armies are fine... if they are less chatty and more dangerous
Importantly, neither of these sides are run by Palpatine/ Sidious. Lucas rightly wanted to show Palpatine as a mastermind, but to be a mastermind, it is unnecessary to run both sides of the chessboard. He does not need to be in control of every major event in the galaxy. The grander and more all encompassing Sidious' plan was, the smaller the galaxy felt. It felt small because no one else in the entire galaxy had any agency. Sidious was the only one that wanted anything, planned anything, directed anything (the worst of this Xanatos Gambit is in Force Unleashed, where it turned out even the Rebel Alliance could not get started without the help of Palpatine  ). Palpatine does not need to be a puppet master in every plot in every corner of the galaxy to be seen as cunning... he needs to be a combination of mastermind and an incredible opportunist. Other people also have plans, but he is the best at taking those plans and corrupting them for his own use.
Projecting backwards from the Originals, we have the humans entirely in power and all aliens completely out of power in the Empire. An interesting explanation for this is if the aliens had gathered their sector fleets (we can keep the idea that the Republic has no unified army/fleet) to fight against the clones. Whereas the more numerous human systems stockpiled their fleets in defence of the clones, but refused to assist on the frontlines. Thus, the aliens' (and likely Jedi) were weakened to the verge of defeat against the clones (and Separatists) until Palpatine and the horded human fleets come in to rescue the Republic- the past failures are blamed on the aliens (and maybe a little on the Jedi... for starting the Separatist movement). The humans' victories are lauded. In addition the humans are the only ones with a giant fleet at the end of the war/ whenever the Empire comes into being.
The Owen Lars Connection
One of the most intriguing missed opportunities is the character of Owen Lars: what does he actually know? From the Prequels, we would say not very much. Anakin appears and disappears like a whirlwind, stopping only long enough to return his mother's dead body and have a short funeral. This minimally meets the requirements of linking the Prequels to the Originals, but so much more is suggested in the Originals.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/KqaKlyA.jpg)
IV Owen wanted nothing to do with Obi Wan
Consider this intriguing dialogue piece:
Owen: That wizard's just a crazy old man. Tomorrow I want you to take that R2 unit into Anchorhead and have its memory erased. That'll be the end of it. It belongs to us now.
Luke: But what if this Obi-Wan comes looking for him
Owen: He won't, I don't think he exists anymore. He died about the same time as your father.
Luke: He knew my father?
Owen: I told you to forget it. Your only concern is to prepare the droids for tomorrow. In the morning I want them on the south ridge working out those condensers.
Now, it could be argued that Owen is simply all business and wants Luke to shut up and just do his work. But there's emotion behind that and hints that he knows far more than the Prequels show. Owen genuinely does not wish to talk about Obi Wan because he wants nothing to do with the hermit. There's a knowing look passed between Owen and Beru when Luke first mentions the hermits name that suggests a 'here it finally comes.' And yet he denies knowing Obi Wan and immediately follows up with wanting to have the memory erased, thus quickly purging the unwanted reminders of Obi Wan. (The implication is that he is lying to stop further inquiries.) Everything in the conversation implies that Owen wants the topic of Obi Wan to be dropped, but Luke obliviously presses on. Why the reticence?
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/LIejAZk.jpg)
So much potential backstory
Following talks about the Academy we get this:
Aunt Beru: Luke's just not a farmer, Owen. He has too much of his father in him.
Owen: That's what I'm afraid of.
This piece is rich with implied backstory, but we get nothing from the Prequels. Beru knew so little that the Prequels make Beru's comment unwarranted in IV.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Nsk0gb8.jpg)
She sure is basing a lot on one introduction and a funeral... because she sure wasn't twinkling her eyes, thinking about how that one time Anakin slaughtered all those Sand People.
The final piece to extrapolate from is Obi Wan talking about Owen Lars:
Luke: No, my father didn't fight in the wars. He was a navigator on a spice freighter.
Ben: That's what your uncle told you. He didn't hold with your father's ideal. Thought he should have stayed here and not gotten involved.
And
BEN: I have something here for you. Your father wanted you to have this when you were old enough, but your uncle wouldn't allow it. He feared you might follow old Obi-Wan on some damned-fool idealistic crusade like your father did.
So this is difficult because the most natural reading is that both Owen and Anakin comes from Tatooine, but that leaves us with Luke being hidden on his father's home planet- an Original problem caused when Lucas decided to combine the characters of Anakin and Vader for Episode V. Part of a prequel's job (I think) is to massage these facts to make them fit even better, making the internal logic work better.
The first question is whether they truly are Luke's uncle and aunt, and if so who is the connection. Lars and Skywalker makes it difficult for Owen and Anakin to be brothers without fake names, but Beru doesn't suggest much of a connection with Anakin's past. I would likely go with either Owen and Anakin as brothers or else an old theory: Kenobi and Owen Lars are brothers (or half brothers or Lars changed his name when he goes to ground.)
Then, have Owen and Anakin actual spice traders at the beginning of the series, Obi Wan hears of this hot shot pilot in the Outer Rim from his estranged brother or half-brother, who works as a navigator or mechanic on the same ship. Finding Anakin as a cocky hot shot pilot, whom Obi Wan recruits into the Jedi in the middle (or the beginning) of the Clone Wars, allows the different subplots to start so much quicker. Particularly the romance can start quicker, which in Episode I was wasted time as in Episode II, Lucas basically had to reboot the relationship. If Obi Wan and Anakin drag a reluctant Owen into the Clone Wars, then you have a gruffer Sam Gamgee type character- the trio's conscience, and the one who grows disillusioned first and recognizes the dangerous changes in Anakin first. This allows for a confrontation between Owen and Obi Wan, where Obi Wan refuses to see the change in Anakin.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/HwzavIj.png)
An idealistic crusade (at least at the beginning) that Owen would not join
The final break would come when the Republic declares war on the Separatists- a campaign near Tatooine bringing the trio on to Tatooine- Anakin in particular is idealistic about keeping the Republic together. Owen was always reluctant, but believes war against the Separatists is too much. He sees Obi Wan as intractable, but tells Anakin he should stay here and not get involved. The last time they see him is alone in one of the Tatooine spaceports with Beru (not sure when those two should meet, but she needs enough contact with Anakin to warrant her conversation in Episode IV.)
As a side note, having Owen with some military experience works well enough with a deleted scene where Biggs says, “Come on Luke, your uncle could hold off a whole colony of sand people with one blaster.” A legitimate and natural interpretation of this is that Owen is simply a tough son of a gun, but Clone Wars experience fits just as well.
Anakin and Obi Wan
Jumping straight to the Clone Wars gives lots of space to SHOW the tense relationship between the two. I think it's necessary to show their closeness in order to show a bit of Obi Wan's blindness and a bit of his hubris regarding Anakin. In addition, the viewer needs to see what is lost to really warrant any sort of “you were like my brother” lines.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Tc1dQyi.jpg)
Ewan really was a strong point in the Prequels
Obi Wan: “When I first knew him, your father was already a great pilot. But I was amazed how
strongly the Force was with him. I took it upon myself to train him as a Jedi. I thought that I could instruct him just as well as Yoda. I was wrong. My pride has had terrible consequences for the galaxy.”
Owen is a perfect candidate for the one that sounds the first unheeded warning bell, particularly as there is clearly some history between Owen and Obi Wan based on Episode IV. But we really need Obi Wan as the Jedi who discovers Anakin's talent.
Princess Leia or Daddy's Princess?
One thing that the Prequels never properly established is why Leia is a princess. The closest we get is that her mother was voted a 'queen' for a bit. But as Leia is supposed to be hiding in plain sight, it makes little sense give her real mother's former title (that was also temporary and not inheritable)... unless she's just daddy's princess.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/ODr6Wq1.jpg)
The dots did not connect on this one, except in the most disappointingly character undermining way possible
But it would be fine if Bail Organa was part of an old aristocracy that still maintains power in Alderaan's democracy- that there are a number of great houses in existence, similar to Dune series- Palpatine and Tarkin could easily come from other old houses. Having undemocratic power (the great houses) defend democracy is actually an interesting tension.
Bail Organa and Obi Wan
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/vpWuWkX.jpg)
Bail liked to tell big stories to little Leia about how HE was really the leader, and definitely NOT a tag along to the Jedi.
“General Kenobi, years ago you served my father in the Clone Wars.”
This idea would need to be fleshed out- Prequel Organa served the Jedi, not the other way around. (He wasn't much more than a glorified taxi driver.) Perhaps Organa is a George C Marshall or Dwight Eisenhower during the Clone Wars, which allows Kenobi to serve under him. Then, when war is declared against the Separatists he resigns to become the leader of the pacifist moderate reformers in the Senate, refusing to take part in the Separatist War. Like the EU's idea- Alderaan could disarm in protest of the war with the Separatists as well protesting the increasingly apparent power grab by the unified human fleet. (It's interesting that the cause of Alderaan being peaceful was never brought up in the Prequels.)
Romance: A Decent Prequel Idea
Beyond extrapolation, I actually quite like the idea that Anakin falls for a senator in the Galactic Senate. One thing that I never really bought was that attachment was a such a bad thing for Jedi- likely because my worldview is not that of a Buddhist monk. If it actually is the case that attachment is bad for the Jedi in this fictional universe, the prequels needed to SHOW this- outside a Buddhist perspective, it is a rather counter-intuitive idea, so the internal logic needs to be established with a significant example (or else show that the Council's rules are out to lunch.) Count Dooku would be a great candidate for a Jedi who became too concerned with worldly affairs because of a woman. If the woman he marries is also a politician, the clear parallel to Anakin is very easily established- the big warning sign.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Vg8IcpV.jpg)
A radical and a gadfly
But I think it'd be rather interesting to skip the whole queen of Naboo thing and go straight to have Padme as a rising star in the Senate. Have her and Mon Mothma as two young radical reformer senators- perhaps Padme as the orator- the one that can distill the big picture ideas and Mon Mothma as the details and behind the scenes planning politician. When they are radical reformers, Anakin takes notice of the firebrand Padme. As they slowly rise the ranks in their respective worlds, they become more and more involved with each other, despite both being forbidden to do so. (The Senate is suspicious of the Jedi regaining political power (particularly because of Mace Windu and that Kenobi and Skywalker tend to subscribe to Windu's philosophy at the beginning) and so could also frown on a Senator becoming close to a Jedi.)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/rECXh9y.jpg)
Partner in crime
It strikes me then, that Bail Organa brings the two firebrands and their faction into the moderate reformer fold, but Padme quickly becomes the leader of the moderate reformers: fighting to clean up the power of the bureaucrats, fighting to prevent consolidation of power during the Clone Wars, and fighting to avoid war with the Separatists. This might be too much politics for Star Wars, but if part of the prequels is the rise of the Empire, I think it is a great battleground for Padme (who really has little do in Episode II and III- she is very quickly sidelined from her role as opposition leader.) I'd like to see her actually in charge of her faction, making moves.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/cNcs1BE.jpg)
Leader of Opposition
In that case, I think making Tarkin her opposite number in the Senate, would be great. He also could be a younger politician and a rising star. Palpatine can continue to give lip service to wanting to maintain democracy and clean out the corrupt bureaucracy (he voices the reformer rhetoric, while consolidating power behind the scenes.) Meanwhile, Tarkin is the leader of Palpatine's faction and vocally and openly defends the need to consolidate power for the defence of the Republic from the clonemasters and the Separatists. This lends itself very well to an inherent internal tension in Anakin while courting Padme. He loves Tarkin's ideas, but he loves Padme, who is actively working against Tarkin. There's a tiny sense of it in Episode II, but giving more space to flesh it that tension is a very interesting route. It also gives reason for Tarkin's prominence in IV. He was the Emperor's unofficial attack dog on the Senate floor for years and years.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/fxtvs3G.jpg)
The government's rising star: defender of militarism and unified state power.
The attempted assassination is also great to bring Anakin and Padme together... the problem in the actual Prequels was that the assassination plot gets dropped, giving them exactly nothing to do or plan.
If their romance is developed faster (no reboot in Episode II- romantic tensions already existing in the first) then I suspect she could leave him faster- that after Owen, she also recognizes the change in Anakin before Obi Wan, who is still holding out. “Obi Wan once believed as you did.” In that case, she leaves when she is pregnant, but before Anakin knows so there is a less likely chance for him to hunt down his children.
I actually like the deleted scene idea that Padme begins confiding in Obi Wan her fears, but Anakin discovers this (or else is led part way there by Palpatine) and interprets it as unfaithfulness.
Sith vs Jedi: Seduction of the Dark Side
There are some ideas to play with regarding the fall of Anakin. Vader clearly had some anger issues, but Prequel Anakin tends to go from 0 to 100 and back down again. Starting him as a cocky pilot with a somewhat hot-temper is a great beginning point. But the more he gives into the Dark Side, I would think he is just barely containing his anger- he genuinely tries to reign it in, but he lives more and more on the edge, scaring himself, but finally his wife. (Think Sykes from the 1968 Oliver! film.)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/mQjyurW.jpg)
Perpetually on the edge of exploding
His descent does need human and alien combatants. Clones and droids eliminate the prisoner dilemma in war and gives no emotional weight to hacking through droids like match wood. If the Separatists also have large alien armies, a clearer distinction can be made between Obi Wan's mercy and Anakin's loss of control, bordering on war crimes (pushing Owen away.)
A very visual distinction between the Jedi and the Sith that was lost between the Originals and the Prequels is the notion that Jedi ignite their lightsabers last. This may have been an unintentional distinction (we always assumed when Luke attacked first, he was doing it wrong- the Prequels killed that idea pretty handily as Jedi pretty much exclusively attack first- and it is never commented that something is wrong with this.) Intentional or not, it works powerfully with the value that Jedi defend, but are never the aggressors. Regaining the distinction, better shows a philosophical difference between Jedi and Sith and creates some interesting story ideas. Mace Windu's faction could be blurring the line, particularly as the war progresses. Palpatine suggests to Anakin that there are serious limitations to waiting for the enemy to attack first- a Jedi might be able to react to defend themselves, but what if the enemy attacks bystanders as an opening move? The two wars allows boots on the ground application of the differing philosophies as Anakin either grows to dislike the limitation or at least fails to see the difference between what Windu does and what the Dark Side does.
For that matter, Anakin needs to be shown the actual power of the Dark Side of the Force. Palpatine promises the ability to stop people from dying, but it wrings hollow to me as we have seen little of the Force that would suggest that is possible. Anakin certainly has no onscreen evidence that Palpatine knows what he is talking about. Anakin needs an experimental stage (likely in the war), where he fights opening himself up to the Dark Side gives him quick bursts of power.
For our extrapolation piece: Luke asks “Is the dark side more powerful?”
Yoda: “No, no, no. Quicker, easier, more seductive.”
We need to see this onscreen- that Anakin increases his power in sudden leaps and bounds- this gives him more incentive to follow Palpatine further, and he might start using little Dark Side trick (ends justifying the means.) Also... I suspect Palpatine ought to be talking about the Dark Side as the natural shadow of the Force, the fullness of the Force, that the Jedi are purposefully limiting themselves to the entirety of the Force (hence the denial of all emotions and attachment- it would be fairly easy to argue that the Jedi's teachings are unnatural and wrongheaded.) “The Emperor will show you the true nature of the Force.” This needs to be one of the Emperor's lines of persuasion.
If both the film and Palpatine shows several failings of the Jedi, Anakins fall becomes all the more believable... the whole mind-influence thing that Qui Gon and many others are constantly trying, can't be too hard for Palpatine to twist around to seem a pretty evil action by the Jedi. Rogue Jedi elements make for some very easy scapegoats as well.
To actually get Anakin wanting to hand off his lightsaber to his future children, I think we need a scene close to when Anakin takes the final plunge to the Dark Side, where he opens up to Obi Wan- maybe a little fear on where he is heading, but then perhaps as a premonition regarding his own mortality, he asks that if he (Anakin) has children, but dies soon after, that his light saber be passed on... something to that effect.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/6AqmOlA.jpg)
Obi Wan's memory is REALLY quite poor... or he has really bought into the whole 'different point of view' thing as a great cover to tell the story however the hell he wants to.
The arrest of Palpatine by Windu that is interrupted by Anakin is perfectly serviceable though some adjustment is needed- Anakin really and truly seeing Mace Windu as a danger to the Republic, given that Windu wants to kill Palpatine on the spot. Again, a few more good intentions paving the road to hell is great for Anakin's story arc. Also- if there really are that many Jedi coming in to arrest Palpatine- why not have the Imperial Guards take out the red shirt Jedi, before Mace can take them out in turn. Else, we have zero examples of them being at all useful.
The Fall
The fight between Anakin and Obi Wan is iconic- it might be worth putting it at the end of the Second to free up space for Vader the “betrayer and killer of Jedi”... leave the children killing for Palpatine and his stormies. (Another terrible example of Anakin's 0 to 100 anger.)
The third would mostly focus on Obi Wan, Bail Organa, Yoda, etc surviving the true rise of the Empire and the mass wiping out of the Jedi (rather than a montage.) To make Obi Wan seem less of a tool- Obi Wan needs to defeat Anakin, and think he is dead, rather than leaving him for dead.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/L1kEqoV.jpg)
...and then left him for dead, neither tending to the wounds nor putting him out of his misery
If the volcano planet had a bunch of Sith minion types for some Sith ceremony creating Darth Vader from Anakin (rather than the underwhelming knighting). Then Obi Wan could interrupt the ritual, driving off the minions and leading to the final fight and disavowal- and burning, Anakin disappears from view, but before Obi Wan can investigate further, he is driven off by a wrath filled Palpatine- perhaps mass earthquakes or something (if it was previously established that Palpatine was arriving soon, perhaps being delayed by Yoda.) This would allow Anakin to appear dead, but allow Palpatine arrive in time and keep him alive with the Force until medical help can stabilize. Obi Wan can have Anakin's lightsaber and muse to himself, that he would keep Anakin's last wish before the Anakin he knew was no more. After this point, he would exclusively use 'Ben' as an alias as he tries to hide from the Jedi hunters. (Episode IV says he has heard the name of Obi Wan since “before you (Luke) were born.”)
Once Anakin is truly outfitted as Darth Vader, we would likely cease to get his interior perspective- he becomes the enigmatic man in the mask of the 4th film as he hunts down the scattered Jedi. Tarkin is appointed to a regional governor and begins working with Vader to hunt down the Jedi.
Alderaan and Leia's Memories
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/UUxW3jk.jpg)
After the whole 'oops, I guess I trained a monster,' you're on a need to know basis.
Padme hides with Bail Organa on Alderaan and eventually marries him. This should likely be Yoda's plan and Yoda's plan alone. He gives Luke to Obi Wan to hide allowing some redemption. However, Yoda still does not wholly trust Obi Wan's judgement and keeps Leia as an ace up his sleeve, hiding her existence from even Obi Wan. (Presumably between V and VI Obi Wan finds out from Yoda as he seems to not know in V, but knows all about Leia in VI.) After searching, Obi Wan discovers that Owen has settled on Tatooine (taking on the name Lars?) Owen agrees to take Luke, but only on the condition that Obi Wan never returns.
On Alderaan, Padme hears her friend Mon Mothma has begun forming a Rebel Alliance with a Corellian Senator (I have a hard time abandoning the idea of Garm Bel Iblis from the EU.) But to really bring home the loss of Alderaan in IV, the Prequels should devote some time to Alderaan so we know what was lost- that is what good prequels can do.
It is then a turn-around. Bail has bought into non-interference and pacifism, while Padme tries to convince Bail to join the nascent rebellion. She lives in hiding until Leia is 3 or 4- this allows Leia to have her memory of her mother in Episode VI.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/iClhpgr.jpg)
Turns out VI's Leia simply had false memories
Climax
It's hard to know what the set piece end for III would be if Anakin and Kenobi have already duked it out, but take the betrayal idea. It might be that the Jedi try to put together a last ditch attempt to overthrow the Emperor that is discovered by the Empire. A message is sent out by Darth Vader as Anakin Skywalker giving a meeting place (not a lot knew of Anakin's fall, and few if any know who this Darth Vader is.) Ben Kenobi hears of this, realizes it is a trap, but cannot arrive in time because of Imperial agents/ Jedi hunters. The final fights would go between the stalled Ben and Darth Vader springing the trap and destroying the Jedi. Then, Kenobi arriving too late (he can't fight Vader until IV.) This final betrayal is certainly when Obi Wan is convinced that Vader is “more machine than man.”
Alternatively, perhaps a large group of remaining Jedi join with Dooku as the only hope of overthrowing the Empire... but the betrayal and trap by Vader remains the same, only this time Dooku and the Separatists are knocked out in the same fell swoop.
It might be revealed that until people with Force potential begin using the Force, they will be impossible to detect, but if training begins, it might be like a beacon if the Sith are searching. (Cue Padme's death bed scene and Bail forming a rebel group.) Then Ben lands on Tatooine to try and give the light saber:
Your father wanted you to have this when you were old enough, but your uncle wouldn't allow it. He
feared you might follow old Obi-Wan on some damned-fool idealistic crusade like your father did.
However, when Kenobi tries to contact Luke, Owen drives him away with a blaster rifle, blaming Obi Wan for ever teaching Anakin about the Force, thus leading to Anakin's corruption. End with Kenobi beginning his hermitage to keep a watchful eye on Luke until the time comes.
Misc
C-3PO and R2D2 need only be introduced at the end of the third film. There is no reason to include them in the first two, except as connection to the Originals, but that can happen in the third- this frees up space for more new characters.
Assassins and Bounty Hunters
Theoretically, there could be a character called Jango Fett heading up the assassination plot against Padme. But it's not necessary to deal with Boba's origin story in the Prequels- he's a neat character in the Originals, but he can simply have an unremarkable ancestry and have some other bounty hunter with cool weapons for the Prequels. It would be interesting if the bounty hunters were picking off lone Jedi through out the galaxy long before Anakin is sent out to hunt down the Jedi. This could be an ongoing conversation whenever the Jedi meet- who else has disappeared.
It might be that Palpatine sends Anakin out for a similar sort of Jedi killing mission, but at the start only against a rogue element that are truly bad apples (again, showing the decline of the Jedi- but an easy first step for Anakin to following Palpatine.
Concluding Thoughts
Once again, brevity is not my strength. Perhaps my reverse engineer projections/ extrapolations were mildly interesting or at least got your own mind working at possibilities. One of the fun things with Secondary Worlds is wondering what came before, and I particularly enjoy when a Secondary World remains coherent after the story's own premises are tested against each other.
What do you think a Reimagined Star War prequels would look like based on what the Original Trilogy suggested?
Credit:
Belated Media got me thinking along the lines of rebooting the Prequels, but many ideas were refined from discussing with housemates eScapegoat100 and LordBryon.
 
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Canada11310 Posts
One thing I forgot when thinking about the hiding of Luke and Leia. When on Dagobah in Episode V Luke says, "Still...there's something familiar about this place. I feel like...I don't know..."
From there, I initially thought Luke (and perhaps Leia) were hidden on Dagobah, else would Dagobah seem familiar? (Or perhaps he had dreams about it, but this is less satisfactory as we are not privy to his dreams.) This opens a problem of once they had hidden away Luke and maybe Leia on such a backwater world, why in the world would they bring them back out to Anakin's home world and an important Coreworld? However, I think a better reading naturally follows. Luke is clearly struggling to identify what he finds familiar. Not knowing, he vaguely grasps at the place "something familiar about this place." But this isn't sufficient and tries again "I feel like... I don't know..."
Here, we unfortunately do not know what he would have said next as he is interrupted by Luke and he snaps a reply:
YODA: Feel like what?
LUKE: (looking at the creature) Like we're being watched!
However, this challenge might actually be what he intended to say next because much later, Yoda says, "This one a long time have I watched. All his life has he looked away... to the future, to the horizon." I think this is the best reading: that Luke is suddenly recognizing that he is near the presence that has been watching for many years- the familiarity he feels is Yoda watching him from afar. We thus avoid the weird hiding in Dagobah and then hiding in plain sight issue.
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I wish they hired you to write the prequels. I hope you didn't blast yourself after seeing the new one lol.
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So...what about Jar-Jar? Does he stay or does he go?
Nice write-up btw. 5/5. 
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Some really good ideas. It's a nice mental exercise. A futile one, as the movies are what they are, but a cool idea nonetheless. I got to say, I really like your ideas regarding the Jedis, Anakin's fall, the Separatists and all that conflict. I also like the idea of having Anakin's fall not in ep3, as this leaves more time to put everything in place afterwards.
Great post, thanks for sharing your ideas mate ! :-)
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5/5 I would definitely kickstart this movie. We just have to wait until George Lucas dies.
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I actually shared this on facebook :D
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I dont even... do you... what...#unnecessarypassion-... wow
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Canada11310 Posts
On December 23 2015 14:36 Rathwirt wrote:So...what about Jar-Jar? Does he stay or does he go? Nice write-up btw. 5/5.
Jar Jar is just gone. I think he gets a worse rap than he ought to- he is a bit of a lightning rod for people trying to identify what they don't like about the prequels. However, he is completely unnecessary to Episode I's plot (and I would skip the Naboo-Federation plot anyways) and so he is nixed on that alone, but the silliness doesn't help his case.
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I sort of like the idea of kid-friendly silliness brought by the droids and Jar Jar in Episode I. In execution is where it failed. The droid's dialog humor fell mostly flat due to it happening amidst action where it has no place. Similarly out of place is Jar Jar's character in the storytelling.
But there should be some sort of comic character, as well as some silliness. In the originals, this role was filled by C3P0.
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Canada11310 Posts
Oh, I have no problem with comedy- the new Episode VII has lots of great comedy. And the bickering peasants of C3PO and R2D2 are great. That's why, to me, the fundamental problem with Jar Jar is he is an unnecessary character... if the Trade Federation didn't land on the opposite side of the planet from the city they intended to invade.
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I like a lot of these ideas, and the depth of thought behind them.
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I honestly like the prequels more than this idea.
I find the trilogies to work very well together, considering the way they are composed and put together.
The fact that there was politics, in addition to finding the boy allows one to initiate the "points" which show that the sith have finally showed their faces, the chosen one has appeared, and that politics are dirty in space. The politics part allows one to understand relationships well between factions. Killing Darth Maul opened the spot for Dooku, which understood that he would be replaced, and tried to turn Anakin before the emperor did. This could have been more apparent.
The second movie showed that the republic was corrupt, etc, and that they had been blindsided totally with the creation of a clone war. They literally got a perfectly timed army for the first conflict on Geonosis, which was exceptionally fishy. The biggest gripe with the second movie was execution and the villains being boring. Dooku was written poorly, while he did shine in clone wars animated show, for example. Grievous could have been way better, but served his purpose. Dooku countered Obi-Wan's lightsaber style, while Anakin played right to his hands.
In the third movie:
Grievous was the perfect distraction for Obi-Wan, so Sidious could have Anakin for himself. Anakin, during a war, considering his attitude, would easily be frustrated with the avolition of the Jedi Council, which wasn't done badly, save for a few lines.
By the way: I also found that the "wtf is the force" shit more reasonable as the number of force sensitive beings wouldn't have to be so many that every living being had seen one. I agree it is weird tho, but it's easier to build a movie without overexplanation. Han probably thought it was mumbo jumbo, like a lot of others, while Obi-wan and Owen wanted to keep Luke from his destiny.
This doesn't echo the same way. They seem like 3 prequels rather than a connected hexalogy which was the point, in my opinion. They showed Initiation, escalation and payoff, and led to the new initiation, escalation and payoff in OT.
This way, I would say that for example: starting in the middle of a war is way to in-medias-res for a medium like a movie, and requires a lull in action after the first few scenes, which can lead to a disconnected movie. In addition, it would literally stride against the way Jedis were trained pre-purge, since they were usually taken out of their families at extremely small ages. One of Yoda's arguments was that Anakin was too old. It would also be like a tension-filled mirror (War contra peace-like times) of Luke, which could feel more cliche, as well as cheapen the thought that the samurai-like life takes a lifetime.
It's a good plan, but I think smaller changes to the prequel trilogy would work better. And I think taking more into consideration that clone wars animated show exists is better, since you see more sides of the characters and can flesh them out accordingly.
I also think that the Leia memory thing is just what she was told before, just like how Owen tried to make Luke his hoe.
I don't know, I am rambling.
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Canada11310 Posts
The second movie showed that the republic was corrupt, etc, and that they had been blindsided totally with the creation of a clone war.
In what way was the Republic shown to be corrupt? Every problem I can think of has its origin in Palpatine. Subtract what he is doing and you have a red tape institution, but everything is going along pretty fine.
They literally got a perfectly timed army for the first conflict on Geonosis, which was exceptionally fishy. The biggest gripe with the second movie was execution and the villains being boring. Dooku was written poorly, while he did shine in clone wars animated show, for example. Grievous could have been way better, but served his purpose. Dooku countered Obi-Wan's lightsaber style, while Anakin played right to his hands.
This is actually a really big problem in Episode II. I can't figure out why the Jedi would go along with Clone Army idea, except that they are Lawful Stupid and the plot compels them.
What they know
1) A clone army was created without their knowledge.
2) Someone was posing a Jedi Council member that made the order- the Jedi Council did NOT order that army. The clone masters was led to believe the the Jedi Master was still alive, but the Jedi Master could not have physically placed the order as he died earlier.
3) The clone masters are sympathetic to the Republic and likely would not have made the clone army for enemies of the Republic (ramping up the probability that the fellow who placed the order is an enemy of the Republic)
4) The clone masters' planet was deliberately erased from the Republic's archives, making it unlikely that the Republic would be the one's to find the army.
5) The clone's gene belongs to the bounty hunter who has been trying to kill the Leader of Opposition of the Senate... and currently lives on the planet with a son.
6) The bounty hunter doesn't even think he was hired by the Jedi Master, but instead someone called Tyrannous. Obi Wan knows this information and no alarm bells are rung??!!!
7) The bounty hunter tries to kill Obi Wan on Kamino. Seems like a Jedi friendly operation. (Although to be fair to Fett, Obi Wan, like all Prequel Jedi, attacks first. So much for aggression being of the Dark Side. So little coherency.)
8) "They are totally obedient. Taking any order without question." ...and they don't know who made the order and they still think it's a good idea to use these clones?
9) Last piece and should have shut down the program after one time test-drive on Geonosis: the bounty hunter, whose genes were used is a henchman of Count Dooku... another enemy of the Republic. I think the Kaminoans would be rather horrified of their mistake and actually agree to a halted program, maybe with some financial compensation.
How is the correct move not to halt the program and proceed with a massive investigation in order to figure out who is impersonating the Jedi and who does not want to be discovered by the Jedi, and to discover who is creating a totally obedient personal army in the name of the Republic without the Republic's knowledge? Based on all the information they know, actually using the army is the worst idea ever. Blithely using the clone army, no questions asked, is idiot plotting at its worst. And that's a major hinge of the entire clone wars- the internal story is incoherent never mind how it really does not connect to the Original Trilogy.
In media res is perfectly fine for films like Star Wars considering that is exactly how Episode IV started- in the middle of the Rebellion. It just saves a lot of build up time and leaves the viewer wanting to know more- exactly what Episode I does not do. How many significant questions are raised about what went on before Episode I? Not very many as the Republic seems pretty static pre-Sidious. Compared to all the intriguing hints in Episode IV with clone wars, Luke's father and his adventures with Obi Wan, the fall of Darth Vader, the rise of the Empire, the start of the Rebellion, etc, etc.
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the replies are in the quote lol, sorry weird formatting.
On December 24 2015 10:30 Falling wrote:Show nested quote +The second movie showed that the republic was corrupt, etc, and that they had been blindsided totally with the creation of a clone war. + Show Spoiler +In what way was the Republic shown to be corrupt? Every problem I can think of has its origin in Palpatine. Subtract what he is doing and you have a red tape institution, but everything is going along pretty fine. --- The whole point of the story is about the trade federation maintaining a blockade on a Republic planet, and I find it quite easy to point out what Lucas meant with it. It is "kinda" explained that Valorum and a lot of other senators are downplaying the situation since they are getting bribed. I don't know what else could lead Senator Amidala to the decision that the vote of no confidence is the only option. This point might be just my weird view of it since this was what I got from politics in the Clone Wars animated show. It kinda looks more like Palpatine is just nudging the two sides to conflict and presenting them with "viable" options which will reward him more greatly than they can imagine. --- Show nested quote +They literally got a perfectly timed army for the first conflict on Geonosis, which was exceptionally fishy. The biggest gripe with the second movie was execution and the villains being boring. Dooku was written poorly, while he did shine in clone wars animated show, for example. Grievous could have been way better, but served his purpose. Dooku countered Obi-Wan's lightsaber style, while Anakin played right to his hands. + Show Spoiler +This is actually a really big problem in Episode II. I can't figure out why the Jedi would go along with Clone Army idea, except that they are Lawful Stupid and the plot compels them.
What they know
1) A clone army was created without their knowledge.
2) Someone was posing a Jedi Council member that made the order- the Jedi Council did NOT order that army. The clone masters was led to believe the the Jedi Master was still alive, but the Jedi Master could physically not placed the order as he died earlier.
3) The clone masters are sympathetic to the Republic and likely would not have made the clone army for enemies of the Republic (ramping up the probability that the fellow who placed the order is an enemy of the Republic)
4) The clone masters' planet was deliberately erased from the Republic's archives, making it unlikely that the Republic would be the one's to find the army.
5) The clone's gene belongs to the bounty hunter who has been trying to kill the Leader of Opposition of the Senate... and currently lives on the planet with a son.
6) The bounty hunter doesn't even think he was hired by the Jedi Master, but instead someone called Tyrannous. Obi Wan knows this information and no alarm bells are rung??!!!
7) The bounty hunter tries to kill Obi Wan on Kamino. Seems like a Jedi friendly operation. (Although to be fair to Fett, Obi Wan, like all Prequel Jedi, attacks first. So much for aggression being of the Dark Side. So little coherency.)
8) "They are totally obedient. Taking any order without question." ...and they don't know who made the order and they still think it's a good idea to use these clones?
9) Last piece and should have shut down the program after one time test-drive on Geonosis: the bounty hunter, whose genes were used is a henchman of Count Dooku... another enemy of the Republic. I think the Kaminoans would be rather horrified of their mistake and actually agree to a halted program, maybe with some financial compensation.
How is the correct move not to halt the program and proceed with a massive investigation in order to figure out who is impersonating the Jedi and who does not want to be discovered by the Jedi, and to discover who is creating a totally obedient personal army in the name of the Republic without the Republic's knowledge? Based on all the information they know, actually using the army is the worst idea ever. Blithely using the clone army, no questions asked, is idiot plotting at its worst. And that's a major hinge of the entire clone wars- the internal story is incoherent never mind how it really does not connect to the Original Trilogy. --- The battle of geonosis is the first battle in the Clone Wars, and they would have been extremely hardpressed to counter the droid army which had been prepared. Palpatine wanted a war to start so he could take over when people were more unlikely to stop him, as well as the people being more alright with a leadership switch. Using a weapon once kind of unleashes pandoras box, and i think that was the biggest problem for Republic. After they had used them and seen the effectiveness, and gotten a read on the situation (since they would have lost without them on Geonosis), it got harder to not rely on them again. I think the Clone Wars were lost without them. The Jedi kinda lost their ground towards the end since their seat of power had made them forget how to uphold peace when it's not all politics. One thing I can argue against their use of clones, is HOW THE HELL didn't they read some kind of order manual to find Order 66. Jesus christ. I am sure the Kaminoans would tell you if you asked for what actions they were programmed for. The Jedi literally just unwillingly accepted the use since it was easier than remembering how they did lead the republic to victory ages ago. --- + Show Spoiler +In media res is perfectly fine for films like Star Wars considering that is exactly how Episode IV started- in the middle of the Rebellion. It just saves a lot of build up time and leaves the viewer wanting to know more- exactly what Episode I does not do. How many significant questions are raised about what went on before Episode I? Not very many as the Republic seems pretty static pre-Sidious. Compared to all the intriguing hints in Episode IV with clone wars, Luke's father and his adventures with Obi Wan, the fall of Darth Vader, the rise of the Empire, the start of the Rebellion, etc, etc. --- I think the buildup time is exactly what was needed in an Episode I, though. It's not supposed to awaken questions about what happened before, as that was a time of lull, and this was where the story started to take shape. One is supposed to be explained abit about what made people react this way, and then carry on from there. It had been years since the Sith had been seen, the Republic had a shit ton of years of peace and more. This is what probably allowed the senate to stop upholding morally good actions, but allow for money and the Trade federation to boss around. The whole story, in one way, can also be interpreted as the fall of the complacent Jedi Order and how it was given a new hope through Luke, and Anakin's redemption. If you think of the ignorance part of the Jedi Code, it seems that they had forgotten that it could bite them in the ass. ---
I like your post and will say that my opinion might be weird, but it doesn't fit with my view of Star Wars, I guess. Discussion is nice though. thanks.
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I dont think theres enough pull really even with your changes. The prequels are so alien in nature to the originals. I think the politics would have to be even more dialed down.
The biggest focal point should be Anakin failing and Obiwan as well. If anyone redid the prequels they could play up the contrast between the good times and bad.
The prequels were so f*cking bland. Its like George r r martin made another asoiaf now and started with a more bloated A Feast For Crows
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Canada11310 Posts
On December 24 2015 11:40 Wintex wrote:
I like your post and will say that my opinion might be weird, but it doesn't fit with my view of Star Wars, I guess. Discussion is nice though. thanks.
For sure, I like hashing out this sort of thing as I'm always interested in what makes a story and if it isn't good, what made it not work?
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The whole point of the story is about the trade federation maintaining a blockade on a Republic planet, and I find it quite easy to point out what Lucas meant with it. It is "kinda" explained that Valorum and a lot of other senators are downplaying the situation since they are getting bribed. I don't know what else could lead Senator Amidala to the decision that the vote of no confidence is the only option. This point might be just my weird view of it since this was what I got from politics in the Clone Wars animated show.
I guess there's a little bit about bureaucrats being in the pay of the Trade Federation. But my feeling was Amidala's no confidence had more to do with inaction- corruption or lack thereof was pretty incidental in her view. However, given how Palpatine runs absolutely everything in the galaxy, I imagine the corruption was also the result of his own planning. (In fact Wookepdia figures as much, but I have no idea what is canon anymore after the Great Canon Schism, but regardless little of it is in the films.) But what we do have is the bureaucrats are in the pay of the Trade Federation, the Trade Federation that Palpatine controls. So once again, the Republic is basically not corrupt, except when Palpatine makes it corrupt.
The battle of geonosis is the first battle in the Clone Wars, and they would have been extremely hardpressed to counter the droid army which had been prepared. Palpatine wanted a war to start so he could take over when people were more unlikely to stop him, as well as the people being more alright with a leadership switch. Using a weapon once kind of unleashes pandoras box, and i think that was the biggest problem for Republic. After they had used them and seen the effectiveness, and gotten a read on the situation (since they would have lost without them on Geonosis), it got harder to not rely on them again. I think the Clone Wars were lost without them. The Jedi kinda lost their ground towards the end since their seat of power had made them forget how to uphold peace when it's not all politics.
I get Palpatine's motivation to use the clone troopers. That's easy. It's the Jedi that make no sense as it really seems like these clone troopers would exactly the last army you would want to use. At least until they figured out who placed the order.
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I think the buildup time is exactly what was needed in an Episode I, though. It's not supposed to awaken questions about what happened before, as that was a time of lull, and this was where the story started to take shape.
My thinking on this wasn't fully fleshed out, but it has a lot to do with what I think a prequel should do. Most of the time, I think there is a temptation to create a prequel and it shouldn't be done. A good Secondary World ought to make you feel like the world existed long before the particular story you are telling and will continue after the particular story ends. This gives a facsimile of realness in a fictional universe. Thus a good story will feel like there is an amazing story leading up to that story... but usually it's better to leave it to the reader or viewer's imagination. If you do go back to create it, then I think have to do the same thing again... create the feeling that an amazing story took place before your story, thus creating sense of depth in world building, even if it isn't actually created. Just connecting the dots and hinting at nothing further in the past is not a good prequel imo and one would be better off leaving it to the imagination.
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Bot edit.
User was banned for this post.
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typo: + Show Spoiler +Then Obi Wan could interrupt the ritual could be interrupted by Obi Wan, driving off the minions and leading to the final fight and disavowal- and burning, Anakin disappears from view, but before Obi Wan can investigate further, he is driven off by a wrath filled Palpatine- perhaps mass earthquakes or something (if it was previously established that Palpatine was arriving soon, perhaps being delayed by Yoda.)
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I appreciate this post a lot! I'm writing a big blog post on a very unrelated topic and its taking forever, so it's encouraging to see others write and post long thought pieces.
I especially enjoy the emphasis on the politics in your imagined prequels. It keeps with a lot of the style of 4-7, where many of the action scenes aren't just action for the sake of action. I also really enjoy the idea of so many different forces wearing Anakin down (padme vs. political ideals, different jedi factions).
However one thing I really enjoyed in the prequels was the sense of loftiness the Jedi had. Seeing the way Jedi trained, the way they cared about their ideals, and how much it took for them to serve made the fall so much more significant, and made order 66 so much more heartbreaking. It made palatine more evil in cleansing the galaxy of the Jedi, and makes the situation in 4-7 even more dire with Luke as the only thing left in the legacy. Especially with the Old Republic, and Jedi/Sith wars in EU, where there we so many of them, the dichotomy from all the Jedi -> no Jedi is, I think, central to Star Wars.
If you're portraying the Jedi as weaker than they were in the films, there has to be something to show their heyday. Maybe politicians that recognize the Jedi from when they were in positions of power, and give them an old guard sort of respect. Show off some of the old temples (which makes sense in the context of 7, where Luke is searching for one), and show their desperation - that they're willing to train an older Anakin when their padawan are normally young. It would strengthen Obi-Wan's brotherhood with Anakin if he believes that Anakin can help the Jedi re-gain influence. Maybe scenes where the Jedi, who aren't as revered, get to show off for the audience. Even if it's futile in the grand scheme of things, the Jedi become more human for us in their attempt to cope with their lack of prominence.
The issue might be that showing the Jedi from the middle of their descent down to the bottom isn't as impactful as the PT's attempt to go from their height (as generals, as peacekeepers, and universally respected) because we can't see what we're hoping for in 6-7. With the PT, we can see what we're hoping for: a galaxy full of heroic/good Jedi that have been heart-breakingly destroyed. I suppose "hope that isn't seen is not hope," but if we start in the middle the situation remains more hopeless, even with Luke's rise.
I really enjoy all this Star Wars hype :D
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What about Obi-Wan's "If you strike me down I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine" line.
The only thing that makes sense to me is he'll become a martyr, powerful meaning he'll become a symbol for the righteous fight, an umbrella to unite and coerce idle bystanders to join the resistance under; which pretty much came to being with the joint coordinated strike force, even though it hasn't specifically been linked to Kenobi's death.
This line probably sparked the emotional conflict which lead to Anakin's absolution, I'm guessing because the power-playboy got reminded that while the dark side's maximum power, however alluring for a single or a couple of individuals, is limited by the wielder's lifetime, the light side is infinitely stronger as the sum of the small doses in each and every individual working together for the common good and thus is of a higher dimension.
A prequel would have to explain the dark side as a failed attempt to philosophically overarch still the light side's limitations, portray the adepts of the dark side as pioneers of force-research who's short-circuited psyche has been left to rot in disconnection to the light side's grace.
Then any sequels would be galvanized to debate whether the problem with the dark side experiment has been the incompetence of its adepts, a lack of support and understanding by the light side, an inopportune time for this aspect of the force to be accessed as a general immaturity or what...
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I have many things to say in regards to the OP, but it is Christmas Eve and I simply haven't the time to do my thoughts or your wonderfully thorough blog justice. So I'll just say Merry Christmas, ya nerd.
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I feel that the force was shown to be little understood so it was viewed more as a religion than a source of power. The symbol of the Jedi was the lightsaber and not the force. Luke seemed to know what a lightsaber was unless i remember incorrectly and people always seemed to underestimate the jedi, except the sith. which seems funny considering how formidable the jedi's powers were. Also i think we should mention the fact that the jedi temple was built over an old sit shrine and that their powers and strength in the force had been waning which plays into the thought that their power was waning and that maybe their force powers weakened enough for people to doubt their powers.
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FREEAGLELAND26781 Posts
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TLDR prequels plot is weak and incoherent.
I appreciate the effort, but you could have just linked the plinkett reviews instead.
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Canada11310 Posts
On December 28 2015 23:31 TwiggyWan wrote:
TLDR prequels plot is weak and incoherent.
I appreciate the effort, but you could have just linked the plinkett reviews instead.
Only if you think nothing new was said. Think of the Prequels as the Thesis, Plinkett as the Antithesis and this as the Synthesis.
On December 25 2015 00:52 AllHailHydraGod wrote:
What about Obi-Wan's "If you strike me down I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine" line.
The only thing that makes sense to me is he'll become a martyr, powerful meaning he'll become a symbol for the righteous fight, an umbrella to unite and coerce idle bystanders to join the resistance under; which pretty much came to being with the joint coordinated strike force, even though it hasn't specifically been linked to Kenobi's death.
This line probably sparked the emotional conflict which lead to Anakin's absolution, I'm guessing because the power-playboy got reminded that while the dark side's maximum power, however alluring for a single or a couple of individuals, is limited by the wielder's lifetime, the light side is infinitely stronger as the sum of the small doses in each and every individual working together for the common good and thus is of a higher dimension.
A prequel would have to explain the dark side as a failed attempt to philosophically overarch still the light side's limitations, portray the adepts of the dark side as pioneers of force-research who's short-circuited psyche has been left to rot in disconnection to the light side's grace.
Then any sequels would be galvanized to debate whether the problem with the dark side experiment has been the incompetence of its adepts, a lack of support and understanding by the light side, an inopportune time for this aspect of the force to be accessed as a general immaturity or what...
That's some good thoughts. I honestly haven't thought that much about the 'strike me down' but that idea plus force ghosts did need to be dealt with in the prequels- I personally found the 'Qui Gon just discovered a new trick' idea rather underwhelming. It would be more interesting if IV's Obi Wan is highlighting a fundamental lack of understanding that Anakin had in regards to the Force in the prequels. I didn't like the whole 'stop people from dying' execution. But it is interesting that the Sith hang on to their physical life (becoming half man/ half machine) rather than embracing death. Whereas Original Prequel Jedi see death as 'becoming more powerful' or Yoda saying "luminous beings are we, not this crude matter." Fundamentally it seems the Jedi are the strongest surrendering their life rather than clinging to crude matter... but how does that play out in a visual medium where the biggest demonstration of Force power is Force flips and lighting bolts? I have no idea.
An interesting alternative to Owen's backstory proposed by escapegoat100:
What if Tatooine was originally a savannah planet, but in the beginning of Episode I, it is hit by the clone masters by devastating new weapons (bombed to hell with radiation) or destroyed with chemical weapons or something. The story would start from the perspective of Anakin and Owen surviving the early clone master attacks and the apocalyptic devastation. When Obi Wan comes with the Republic to drive off the clones, he finds Anakin leading a cobbled together squadron of fighters- Anakin decides to join the Republic forces (idealistic crusade) to defeat the clones (bordering on vengeance.) Whereas Owen simply wants to survive and remake their life on Tatooine. Over the course of the prequels, out of the fall out zones that was completely unapproachable appear the Sand People- survivors of the initial blast, but still too close to the blast site of whatever got dropped on Tatooine.
This moves towards to why are there people living on Tatooine and why are there herds of Banthas wandering around? In Dune, people came to that planet for the spice, but in Star Wars, the spice is on Kessel- Tatooine is just a market for spice. It also very quickly establishes the clones without needing a super weapon- the goal for the first film could be to destroy the facilities that make this deadly ordinances and haul off the scientists that made it. Then save defeating the clones for the second film when the Separatists get going.
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Ever known pattern: to became a Jedi knight you have to be a scrap-selling beggar from desert planet without close family.
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I saw the movie yesterday Walked away completely disappointed that they created a completely alternate storyline compared to ALL the great books that follow the fall of the empire.....
Grand admiral Thrawn, the Yuuzhan Vong invasion, the creation of the new jedi school in yavin 4 (i believe, my knowledge is a bit rusty), han and lea actually had 2 kids here that were both gifted in the force....and the movie is like nah we are gonna not follow this at all.
I am very sad that all of these stories will most likely never see the movie screen
I personally would have loved to see the yuuzhan vong invasion, it was I would say almost the most brutal thing to shake the galaxy, we would see a lot more jedis, han solo and lea and luke would all be an appropriate age as well....so much potential all lost now...
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This is Great! Ill reda This in more detail soon. Just one ting to keep in mind. In The prequel trilogy there appear to be at most 1000 jedis, This would suggest that a great majority do not know of The force or jedi ways. Which would explain The later attitude and why Solo doesnt believe.
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Canada11310 Posts
There are numbers and then there is prominence. For instance, there is only one Superman, but he is so prominent that he'd be difficult to forget in 18 years. Same thing with the Jedi- I'm not convinced there are only 1000 Jedis, but given their high ranking position as a parallel power structure in Republic, that they are the reason a Republic Army was considered unnecessary and that they pretty much all were generals in the Clone War (the WWII analog), it's difficult for me to think that they'd be forgotten so soon. (By 1963, we'd already forgotten Eisenhower, Patton, MacArthur Montgomery, etc.)
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On January 03 2016 07:18 Falling wrote:
There are numbers and then there is prominence. For instance, there is only one Superman, but he is so prominent that he'd be difficult to forget in 18 years. Same thing with the Jedi- I'm not convinced there are only 1000 Jedis, but given their high ranking position as a parallel power structure in Republic, that they are the reason a Republic Army was considered unnecessary and that they pretty much all were generals in the Clone War (the WWII analog), it's difficult for me to think that they'd be forgotten so soon. (By 1963, we'd already forgotten Eisenhower, Patton, MacArthur Montgomery, etc.)
I know the EU isn't canon any more, but it seems like the current status of the galaxy we are introduced to in the original trilogy is that the jedi are extinct. The way I read this is that even during the time of the prequel trilogy, the Jedi were in decline. We're far removed from the old age where there was a galactic conflict between the Sith and Jedi. It seems like thousands of years ago, Jedi were the prominent force in the galaxy, and for generations they've been on the decline, and Vader obviously destroyed what was left of them.
It's unclear and not explained what precipitated this decline.
If I were making the prequels, I'd have the Jedi Council as basically an advisory committee to the Republic, there probably aren't many of them, a handful of masters on the Council, and each of them probably has a few apprentices - so maybe there are ~100 jedi total or something, but they're probably spread across the galaxy mostly practicing diplomacy. Ironically, the VERY BEGINNING premise of Episode 1 matches that description -- Qui Gon/Obi Wan are on a diplomatic mission to negotiate the blockade with the trade federation. That's how I view the role of the Jedi during that time... but then as the prequels progress it just becomes like Diablo 3, slashers.
This way you can make Episode 1 the setting of the stage of the current galactic situation, discovery of Anakin and the beginning of his training... Episode 2 is the height of the galactic struggle, Anakin's downfall... Episode 3 would be Anakin becoming Darth Vader, the Empire taking control, and the hunting down of the remaining Jedi // disappearance of Yoda and Obi Wan.
It's actually tough to say where Darth Vader should go. It seems like Anakin and Obi Wan knew each other and were friends for many years, so if Episode 1 is the discovery of Anakin and Episode 2 is where he becomes Vader, that seems too soon. However, it's awkward from a story perspective if he becomes Vader sometime at the beginning of Episode 3.
In the originals (and prequels), each successive film is years after the previous, so if Anakin becomes Darth Vader in Episode 3 it would make more sense temporally.
I really hope that Disney will opt to remake the prequels at some point -- and actually they could do it concurrently with filming current Star Wars movies because it's not like any of the same characters/actors would be used.
If Spider Man can reboot 3 times, I don't see why the prequels couldn't be rebooted. I'm sure every single Star Wars fan ever would be more than hyped for that.
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Nice reimagining, Falling! Seeing people so passionate and excited through text is funny to see and makes living a joy! lol
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Agree with a lot of this. Thinking about a longer response, but here are the bullet points.
Tarkin should obviously be a major character. I was imagining him more as the Admiral of the Republic Fleet, as well as your role of political supporter of militarization. The idea is he would be the Saul Karath to Anakin's Darth Revan.
Owen should also have a backstory, probably as Obi-Wan's reticent brother.
Sex as the sin of the Jedi makes no sense in the prequels... it's dropped as a theme and never mentioned in the OT. Vader's desire is to "End this destructive conflict, and rule the galaxy as father and son. His fall to the dark side should reflect the loneliness and the desire to end violence/disorder that is implied there.
All the prequel villains must go. Maybe Maul's design can stay, he didn't really have any characterization worth mentioning. The villains in the Clone Wars are supposed to be the Mandalorians. The final bit of the war should be Anakin deciding that a war-based culture like the Mandos is only defeated when it is exterminated. So he anihilates them to the last man. Boba Fett survives somehow, perhaps as a traitor, maybe as a child Anakin spares when he begs at his feet, but sends away: "Go." "Where? What will I do?" "Survive. Any way you can."
More to say, will say later.
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Really nice write-up. I especially liked your take on Padme and her rise through the senate. I personally would've liked it if she showed a similar kind of snarkiness with Anakin that Leia had with Han. I found the Padme / Anakin relationship to be very vanilla and really bogged down episode II.
I noticed after reading your take on Anakin that that was something that really bothered me in the prequels. In the OT, Vader showed a great penchant for cruelty, but he always held himself in such a composed manner. He very rarely showed great flashes of anger. His constant attitude towards the dark side as "underestimated" I think underlies his real reason for turning to the dark side: he truly believes it is more powerful than the light. Yoda's notion that the dark side is "quicker, easier, more seductive" could be the crux for this decision; maybe a timing-window event that requires Anakin to wield the Force quickly in order to consolidate power (something which the light side was too slow to provide), or maybe some critical encounter with Palpatine. I think a vastly different portrayal of Anakin as a brilliant mind that turns to the dark not based purely on emotion, but on cold calculation, would have been a much more intriguing storyline. (Kylo Ren would be the antithesis to this, which would be just as intriguing)
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Perhaps someday Disney will make reboot prequels and they will hire you as a lead writer. One can only hope!
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EPT
