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![[image loading]](http://cdn.blizzardwatch.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/starcraft-terran-liberator-unit-header.jpg)
A thematic overview:
The liberator is an expensive terran air unit that can be built on a naked starport. It has 'siege' mode similar to a tank but you must target a region. That region gets a circle painted on it. When using multiple liberators, any sieged liberator can fire at any circle within range (15) from any other friendly liberator. The cast range for the circle is about 9, which means 1 or liberators can form the frontline and paint the most forward circles while the rest back off and support a bit farther away. The upgrade for the air to ground siege mode ability requires an armory and a hefty 200/200 investment meaning that liberators out of the gate don't see much use. Generally liberators are most effective at the 2 or 3 base mark and beyond as at that point you have enough extra resources to afford the upgrade.
By the numbers:
Because LoTV uses real time instead of weird blizzard time, all time related numbers are slightly off from expected values and cannot be compared directly to HoTS values. Movement speed and weapon speed are affected.
cost: 150/150
HP 180
Armor 0
Movement Speed 4.72 (faster than a banshee, slower than a phoenix.)
Damage vs Air 7x2 damage per volley (splash), 1.29 period, 5 range. Damage feels a bit lower than that of a phoenix for single target, but does AoE.
Damage vs Ground 85 per shot, 1.14 period, 15 range
vs. Ground mode only enabled via 200/200 upgrade that requires an armory.
TvZ
The liberator's most common use in TvZ is to fight against mutalisks. They slightly out range mutalisks but not by enough to easily fire and get away without taking damage. Their air to ground attack is largely useless against ling/bling due to their high movement speed and low hitpoints per unit. The air to ground attack sees a lot of use vs ultralisk, roach, hydras, lurkers, and ravagers as those units are slow enough that you can re-position as needed and have enough health to justify the incredible single target damage output of the liberator. Late game, the liberator count should remain relatively low due to the threat of vipers. The viper's new AoE air only spell tends to deal well with liberators.
These screenshots illustrate how the liberator can be used to keep medivacs alive and secure a retreat against mutalisks.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Qx2qFZM.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/wXgALEJ.jpg)
In the links below are some gifs showing the liberators in action killing puny zerg.
Click for some action shots
More action shots
TvT
The liberator sees the least amount of use in this matchup and virtually no use in bio tank vs bio tank. This may be due to a lack of creativity on terrans' part, but marine tank vs marine tank has been such an aggressive and punishing matchup since HoTS that there is rarely room to transition to anything else. There appear to be opportunities to use the liberator against mech as part of timings or as mech as an additional zoning mechanism against your opponent. The main issue with liberators in this matchup come from vikings which outrange them easily and can kite them without much trouble. If air control can be reliably established then liberators may see a place here. If not, then it's unlikely to see much use in this matchup.
Liberator in Action
TvP
The liberator has the most obvious use in TvP as protoss has a lot of high hitpoint, slow moving units. By using widow mines and bio medivac to zone the liberators can set up and take a strong position. Once the liberators are in position, bio medivac can take care of other objectives are simply assist in the defense. As mentioned previously, liberators, despite their strength, will not see much use until full 2 base saturation or even 3 base due to their heavy gas investment in the upgrade and armory. They need a large investment to get running, but similar to colossus of old and other 'power' units, just 1 or 2 can make a huge difference in the fight.
The screenshots below show how the liberator can be used as an effective zoning mechanism. As a flying unit with massive range it can fire with relative impunity against your enemy so long as they stay within a circle.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/QlMioBN.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/l2dznuP.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/827IdjU.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/elLwrO2.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/E7zol6M.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Z0TaJRa.jpg)
This final screenshot shows how I use the liberators to control my opponent's ramp while I bust in with my bio to take down the nexus.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/OZAlZm5.jpg)
*** I'm experimenting with formatting here between gifs and imgs (dno how to embed gifs, didn't work when I tried).
 
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So.... When are you going to bring back your nuke rush?
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Thanks for the review ! Quick questions : when you used the Liberator in actual play did it feel hard to estimate the zone to activate ? When I used it in defensive situations mainly they seem to be useless because unless I targeted something specific like a ramp they didn't zone enough...
Second question : as far as build order go how do you integrate your liberator ?
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do you feel the power of initial positioning is too overemphasized with this unit outside of tvt and too difficult to overcome with control alone?
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On June 04 2015 11:03 qxc wrote:
When using multiple liberators, any sieged liberator can fire at any circle within range (15) from any other friendly liberator.
You should probably mention that this is a bug.
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On June 04 2015 11:03 qxc wrote:
*** I'm experimenting with formatting here between gifs and imgs (dno how to embed gifs, didn't work when I tried).
Just use the img tag but use the .gif extension for the image at imgur
If you are Curious, here is an example
+ Show Spoiler +
Or, one of your own:
+ Show Spoiler +
What's your overall feel with the unit? Do you like it? It seems useful enough 
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Interesting read. These pink circles are soooo ugly.
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Does anybody else think the liberator feels to heavy? As in acceleration, turning speed etc? I think it is important for it to be very agile so you can quickly turn turn turn and defend vs the fast mutas that run around them and pick off stuff.
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On June 04 2015 15:52 dust7 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2015 11:03 qxc wrote:
When using multiple liberators, any sieged liberator can fire at any circle within range (15) from any other friendly liberator. You should probably mention that this is a bug.
Wtf? How could this be a bug? Liberators deploys at range 7 maximum so what is the point in having 15 attack range in the first place if it can't shoot into other circles?
The mechanic of the liberator is one of the most interesting unit blizz have ever made and now they claim it's a bug and want to "fix" it? Come on... this must be a joke.
Now the unit is going to be butchered and i'm sad
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I was not aware the targeting thing was a bug.
The liberator is an interesting unit that fulfills a new role in the team arsenal arsenal with a unique mechanic without being excessively difficult to use. The liberator requires your brain more than your hands.
When youre at full two base saturation you can start transitioning to liberator sign a second port.
Overall the unit zones well but needs support to ensure that the units don't just go around. Although now that I know that being able to target units in other circles is a bug it will be interesting to see how effective it is after the fix.
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Well I just think it's really OP with the current bug, might be a nice unit when that's fixed thogh. You can still control chokes really well with them, but not entire big areas.
If i's too weak afterwards, they could make it a bit more agile imo. Faster turn and accelartion speed.
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United Kingdom20326 Posts
Wtf? How could this be a bug? Liberators deploys at range 7 maximum so what is the point in having 15 attack range in the first place if it can't shoot into other circles?
I was not aware the targeting thing was a bug.
Yea, that sounds silly. Why would they put it at range 15 but not allow you to shoot further than ~9 range under any circumstance?
Faster turn and accelartion speed.
sc2 units don't have a turn speed, that's only one of the acceleration numbers AFAIK
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I really wish that blizzard would get this MOBA bullshit out of my starcraft game. The Liberator, Ravager, and Disruptor all have abilities that feel like they would fit better as DotA hero skills than they do in a competitive RTS game.
Just add more simple units that, when used in the right hands, become something amazing. The Adept is a step in the right direction, and the lurker (with correct numbers) has that potential, too. The liberator just doesn't feel that way to me.
Starcraft is a beautiful game; it doesn't need flashy skills or gimmicky unit design to hinder that beauty.
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Am I the only one to think that the indicator is ugly and overloads the screen far too much ?
First the cyclone, now that... A mech player will have more indicators than units on his screen.
On June 04 2015 22:23 Jonas wrote:I really wish that blizzard would get this MOBA bullshit out of my starcraft game. The Liberator, Ravager, and Disruptor all have abilities that feel like they would fit better as DotA hero skills than they do in a competitive RTS game. Just add more simple units that, when used in the right hands, become something amazing. The Adept is a step in the right direction, and the lurker (with correct numbers) has that potential, too. The liberator just doesn't feel that way to me. Starcraft is a beautiful game; it doesn't need flashy skills or gimmicky unit design to hinder that beauty.
Too late. HotS was a solid game, stale and flawed in some ways but solid. LotV will be gimmicky, coinflippy, hectic, just to please the spectators and add flashy things that will make casuals eyes bulge in awe -bullshit, utter bullshit. I'll just enjoy the last months of HotS and make up my mind when LotV will be nearing release, but in its current state LotV release will probably be the time for me to stop video games for some time (I can't stand MOBAs).
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All these idiots spouting "dernt merk it a moba ermergerd" should also have to post their sc2 account. We know your silver, bro. Your feedback doesn't matter.
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ty for the informative review but it's too short :p i want more to understand this weird unit.
[PkF] Wire, come play broodwar :p
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My biggest complaint is the indicator spam. SC2 has more than enough UI clutter. =\
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On June 05 2015 01:18 purakushi wrote:
My biggest complaint is the indicator spam. SC2 has more than enough UI clutter. =\
If people can stand the crappy UI's in many MOBAS, I'm sure they can deal with new indicators. Although, maybe toning down the thickness of the lines used in the targeting circle would be a good idea.
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On June 04 2015 22:24 [PkF] Wire wrote:Am I the only one to think that the indicator is ugly and overloads the screen far too much ? First the cyclone, now that... A mech player will have more indicators than units on his screen. Show nested quote +On June 04 2015 22:23 Jonas wrote:I really wish that blizzard would get this MOBA bullshit out of my starcraft game. The Liberator, Ravager, and Disruptor all have abilities that feel like they would fit better as DotA hero skills than they do in a competitive RTS game. Just add more simple units that, when used in the right hands, become something amazing. The Adept is a step in the right direction, and the lurker (with correct numbers) has that potential, too. The liberator just doesn't feel that way to me. Starcraft is a beautiful game; it doesn't need flashy skills or gimmicky unit design to hinder that beauty. Too late. HotS was a solid game, stale and flawed in some ways but solid. LotV will be gimmicky, coinflippy, hectic, just to please the spectators and add flashy things that will make casuals eyes bulge in awe -bullshit, utter bullshit. I'll just enjoy the last months of HotS and make up my mind when LotV will be nearing release, but in its current state LotV release will probably be the time for me to stop video games for some time (I can't stand MOBAs).
100% agree. LotV in its current state is so incredibly bad. It blows my mind that blizzard wants to change starcraft into that shit.
I will probably continue playing HotS. I just like sc to much to leave it completely but not being able to watch pro starcraft anymore will be sad.
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On June 05 2015 02:22 looknohands119 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2015 01:18 purakushi wrote:
My biggest complaint is the indicator spam. SC2 has more than enough UI clutter. =\ If people can stand the crappy UI's in many MOBAS, I'm sure they can deal with new indicators. Although, maybe toning down the thickness of the lines used in the targeting circle would be a good idea.
The indicator itself is fine (could use a thinning, though). It just gets obnoxious when there are 4+ taking up 60% of the screen. And I thought the sieged tank/tempest range indicator was terrible.
Way too much clutter, even if it is "useful". SC2 suffers overall from too much crap on the screen.
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On June 05 2015 01:18 purakushi wrote:
My biggest complaint is the indicator spam. SC2 has more than enough UI clutter. =\
On June 05 2015 02:22 looknohands119 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2015 01:18 purakushi wrote:
My biggest complaint is the indicator spam. SC2 has more than enough UI clutter. =\ If people can stand the crappy UI's in many MOBAS, I'm sure they can deal with new indicators. Although, maybe toning down the thickness of the lines used in the targeting circle would be a good idea.
Agree with purakushi concern. After playing a bit on the beta today the indicator does not look that bad in game, but I agree with the previous answer ; making the lines less thick and agressive would be a good beginning. I didn't have to play against many liberators so maybe indicators everywhere are indeed really annoying (the screenshots suggest so). I hope they hear this concern about both the liberator and the cyclone (the range indicator for the T is fine, but for his opponent ? wtf ?).
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On June 04 2015 19:29 qxc wrote:
I was not aware the targeting thing was a bug.
It was confirmed a bug on blizz forums. I quoted the source in the patch thread.
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On June 05 2015 01:00 TronJovolta wrote:
All these idiots spouting "dernt merk it a moba ermergerd" should also have to post their sc2 account. We know your silver, bro. Your feedback doesn't matter.
I have nothing to hide behind
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/291937/1/Jonas/
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Doesn't seem like it would be useful without the bug. You'd have to stack circles in order to do enough damage to be useful and to protect the unit. You'd be sacrificing area for damage. Or you'd be forced to spread them which would dilute the power of the unit and make them easier to kill. Just rush within the individual circles and kill the units one by one.
What would be the point? It'd be all things the Cyclone does anyway, besides splash, and you don't need the ground attack upgrade for the liberator to deter mass light air. The only difference would be the burst damage and the fact the Cyclone moves.
Guess I'll hold judgement until we see the patched version. Just thought that was a good way to distinguish it from the siege tank and Cyclone.
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On June 04 2015 20:09 Cyro wrote:Show nested quote +Wtf? How could this be a bug? Liberators deploys at range 7 maximum so what is the point in having 15 attack range in the first place if it can't shoot into other circles? Yea, that sounds silly. Why would they put it at range 15 but not allow you to shoot further than ~9 range under any circumstance? sc2 units don't have a turn speed, that's only one of the acceleration numbers AFAIK
Obvoiusly you don't mod a lot. There is static turning speed and movement turning speed.
In general, air units in SC2 are programmed to feel really, really clunky and not responsive. Simple changes like scan range, damage point, adding deceleration to a unit, removing delays, adding angular shot to a weapon can make units much more responsive.
Once I started a discussion about values that made movement clunky with some mod, but it got buried. Maybe I have to finish it.
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United Kingdom20326 Posts
On June 05 2015 18:24 JCoto wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2015 20:09 Cyro wrote:Wtf? How could this be a bug? Liberators deploys at range 7 maximum so what is the point in having 15 attack range in the first place if it can't shoot into other circles? I was not aware the targeting thing was a bug. Yea, that sounds silly. Why would they put it at range 15 but not allow you to shoot further than ~9 range under any circumstance? Faster turn and accelartion speed. sc2 units don't have a turn speed, that's only one of the acceleration numbers AFAIK Obvoiusly you don't mod a lot. There is static turning speed and movement turning speed. In general, air units in SC2 are programmed to feel really, really clunky and not responsive. Simple changes like scan range, damage point, adding deceleration to a unit, removing delays, adding angular shot to a weapon can make units much more responsive. Once I started a discussion about values that made movement clunky with some mod, but it got buried. Maybe I have to finish it.
Which units have turn rate and which don't? I can't really recall any, yet stuff like the delay before firing is really obvious
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We know we have a good unit when the only thing people whine about is "the ugly circles" on the ground. LOL.
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On June 05 2015 18:56 Pr0wler wrote:
We know we have a good unit when the only thing people whine about is "the ugly circles" on the ground. LOL.
Broken DPS is also a thing I think. A bad move, GG.
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On June 05 2015 19:29 JCoto wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2015 18:56 Pr0wler wrote:
We know we have a good unit when the only thing people whine about is "the ugly circles" on the ground. LOL. Broken DPS is also a thing I think. A bad move, GG.
Lol, what the... ?
As far as I know the "broken" DPS is a result of an already known bug that will be fixed.
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Looks like a flying vulture but fatter
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This unit is super fun to play with or against. It adds some micro and some positional gameplay, and complements both bio and mech. Of course it needs some tweaking (maybe the air attack should be buffed), but it is a fun unit, which is really what matters.
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On June 05 2015 19:29 JCoto wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2015 18:56 Pr0wler wrote:
We know we have a good unit when the only thing people whine about is "the ugly circles" on the ground. LOL. Broken DPS is also a thing I think. A bad move, GG.
Let me explain you the process of balancing a unit :
- Overtune its stats
- This way, players are encouraged to use the unit
- Slowly tune down the unit until you reach the right point
Here was your lesson, my preasure.
On June 05 2015 18:56 Pr0wler wrote:
We know we have a good unit when the only thing people whine about is "the ugly circles" on the ground. LOL.
You got it totally right sir
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On June 05 2015 18:56 Pr0wler wrote:
We know we have a good unit when the only thing people whine about is "the ugly circles" on the ground. LOL.
Concerns with graphics are the most annoying ones because once they're there, you have to deal with them forever. So yeah I don't like how the range indicator looks, the range indicators for cyclones annoy me too, the minimap bothers me even after the fix and I hate skins/decals and would pay to be able to disable them.
As for the unit, I don't think T needed another ground control/zoning unit at all. Like everything else added in LotV, this unit is superfluous "fun" and "flash" instead of elegance.
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id rather have them change the way liberators fire into other circles. (for example really just limited to 9 range, not 15 with another liberators circle.
Example , you have two liberators A and B (shootable area)
(AB)----(AB)----- A ---- B bad (current design), B gets extra range due to the bug
(A) ------(AB)-- A ---- B actually interesting design
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On June 04 2015 22:23 Jonas wrote:I really wish that blizzard would get this MOBA bullshit out of my starcraft game. The Liberator, Ravager, and Disruptor all have abilities that feel like they would fit better as DotA hero skills than they do in a competitive RTS game. Just add more simple units that, when used in the right hands, become something amazing. The Adept is a step in the right direction, and the lurker (with correct numbers) has that potential, too. The liberator just doesn't feel that way to me. Starcraft is a beautiful game; it doesn't need flashy skills or gimmicky unit design to hinder that beauty.
How the heck is the Liberator a Moba mechanic? How many zoning, immobile siege units do you see in MoBAs? The Liberator is basically a combination of a Valkyrie and a Siege Tank. It's entirely a RTS thing.
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On June 06 2015 10:32 Captain Peabody wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2015 22:23 Jonas wrote:I really wish that blizzard would get this MOBA bullshit out of my starcraft game. The Liberator, Ravager, and Disruptor all have abilities that feel like they would fit better as DotA hero skills than they do in a competitive RTS game. Just add more simple units that, when used in the right hands, become something amazing. The Adept is a step in the right direction, and the lurker (with correct numbers) has that potential, too. The liberator just doesn't feel that way to me. Starcraft is a beautiful game; it doesn't need flashy skills or gimmicky unit design to hinder that beauty. How the heck is the Liberator a Moba mechanic? How many zoning, immobile siege units do you see in MoBAs? The Liberator is basically a combination of a Valkyrie and a Siege Tank. It's entirely a RTS thing.
there is some weird logic going on that more abilities = Moba designed.
I wonder who started it.
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I tested this unit a bit and it seemed to overkill targets. For example, 2 liberators will both fire on 1 zergling, wasting dps. I'm not sure though.
Can someone confirm or deny?
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On June 06 2015 11:33 ETisME wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 10:32 Captain Peabody wrote:On June 04 2015 22:23 Jonas wrote:I really wish that blizzard would get this MOBA bullshit out of my starcraft game. The Liberator, Ravager, and Disruptor all have abilities that feel like they would fit better as DotA hero skills than they do in a competitive RTS game. Just add more simple units that, when used in the right hands, become something amazing. The Adept is a step in the right direction, and the lurker (with correct numbers) has that potential, too. The liberator just doesn't feel that way to me. Starcraft is a beautiful game; it doesn't need flashy skills or gimmicky unit design to hinder that beauty. How the heck is the Liberator a Moba mechanic? How many zoning, immobile siege units do you see in MoBAs? The Liberator is basically a combination of a Valkyrie and a Siege Tank. It's entirely a RTS thing. there is some weird logic going on that more abilities = Moba designed. I wonder who started it.
I dunno anything about dota clones, but a lot of LotV abilities are like World of Warcraft raid boss abilites. The bad guy puts a circle around you, and if you don't move out of it fast enough, you explode and your raid party loses the fight.
I'm sure people would like them better if they didn't telegraph your intentions in such an obnoxious fashion to your opponents. Ravagers would be really neat if your opponent didn't know whether you were targeting him directly, or leading your shot to anticipate his dodge...this would REALLY be great against air units.
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On June 06 2015 21:59 PineapplePizza wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 11:33 ETisME wrote:On June 06 2015 10:32 Captain Peabody wrote:On June 04 2015 22:23 Jonas wrote:I really wish that blizzard would get this MOBA bullshit out of my starcraft game. The Liberator, Ravager, and Disruptor all have abilities that feel like they would fit better as DotA hero skills than they do in a competitive RTS game. Just add more simple units that, when used in the right hands, become something amazing. The Adept is a step in the right direction, and the lurker (with correct numbers) has that potential, too. The liberator just doesn't feel that way to me. Starcraft is a beautiful game; it doesn't need flashy skills or gimmicky unit design to hinder that beauty. How the heck is the Liberator a Moba mechanic? How many zoning, immobile siege units do you see in MoBAs? The Liberator is basically a combination of a Valkyrie and a Siege Tank. It's entirely a RTS thing. there is some weird logic going on that more abilities = Moba designed. I wonder who started it. I dunno anything about dota clones, but a lot of LotV abilities are like World of Warcraft raid boss abilites. The bad guy puts a circle around you, and if you don't move out of it fast enough, you explode and your raid party loses the fight. I'm sure people would like them better if they didn't telegraph your intentions in such an obnoxious fashion to your opponents. Ravagers would be really neat if your opponent didn't know whether you were targeting him directly, or leading your shot to anticipate his dodge...this would REALLY be great against air units.
A brood war siege tank had an invisible circle around it, if you step in you get shot.
Same thing as every other unit you described.
You think maybe world of warcraft or moba borrow some "rts" mechanics from brood war?
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Many years later SC2-creators creativity continues to disappoint me.
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On June 07 2015 05:36 fabiano wrote:
Many years later SC2-creators creativity continues to disappoint me.
It's more the fact that they're trying too hard to be creative, only to fail in producing interesting concepts. If they were just making simple units that filled identified holes, they would do far better and the game would be infinitely more elegant.
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I don't hate the liberator but I agree that these indicator regions for both ravagers and liberators don't make much sense. Not only do they severely reduce the aesthetic appeal and clutter up the screen, in case of ravagers it is way too easy to dodge their attacks. This makes ravagers a very coin-flippy unit at the moment because of the severe nerf to their base stats.
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On June 05 2015 01:00 TronJovolta wrote:
All these idiots spouting "dernt merk it a moba ermergerd" should also have to post their sc2 account. We know your silver, bro. Your feedback doesn't matter.
Maybe off topic, but why shouldn't a Silver's feedback matter? Bronze-Gold make up roughly 50% of the player base. Ignoring them because of their league is unwise to say the least.
(That's not to say I agree with his point)
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Is there a gif versus an a-move protoss ball?
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On June 07 2015 00:45 ShambhalaWar wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2015 21:59 PineapplePizza wrote:On June 06 2015 11:33 ETisME wrote:On June 06 2015 10:32 Captain Peabody wrote:On June 04 2015 22:23 Jonas wrote:I really wish that blizzard would get this MOBA bullshit out of my starcraft game. The Liberator, Ravager, and Disruptor all have abilities that feel like they would fit better as DotA hero skills than they do in a competitive RTS game. Just add more simple units that, when used in the right hands, become something amazing. The Adept is a step in the right direction, and the lurker (with correct numbers) has that potential, too. The liberator just doesn't feel that way to me. Starcraft is a beautiful game; it doesn't need flashy skills or gimmicky unit design to hinder that beauty. How the heck is the Liberator a Moba mechanic? How many zoning, immobile siege units do you see in MoBAs? The Liberator is basically a combination of a Valkyrie and a Siege Tank. It's entirely a RTS thing. there is some weird logic going on that more abilities = Moba designed. I wonder who started it. I dunno anything about dota clones, but a lot of LotV abilities are like World of Warcraft raid boss abilites. The bad guy puts a circle around you, and if you don't move out of it fast enough, you explode and your raid party loses the fight. I'm sure people would like them better if they didn't telegraph your intentions in such an obnoxious fashion to your opponents. Ravagers would be really neat if your opponent didn't know whether you were targeting him directly, or leading your shot to anticipate his dodge...this would REALLY be great against air units. A brood war siege tank had an invisible circle around it, if you step in you get shot. Same thing as every other unit you described. You think maybe world of warcraft or moba borrow some "rts" mechanics from brood war?
hes saying why not keep the 'invisible' circle, why paint the map in where the attack is coming
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/XE1Di.gif)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/ubtlicl.gif)
