The Hanaro OSL took place in 2000 following the Tooniverse Progamer Korea Open. It had 16 players face off in group stages till the end of Ro8. After the Ro8 was finished, the top player of one group played the second top of the other and vice-versa in a bo5 series. By the end, two players emerged, H.O.T.-Forever and Grrrr... who would play a bo5 to determine the winner. At the time, race picking was just fine so Grrrr... would go on to play Protoss/Terran in the finals while H.O.T.-Forever stuck to Zerg.
Fog of war!
Maps: Blaze -> Narrow chokes all around, can siege main from back as well Dark Stone -> Bigger chokes than other maps, map needs to be bigger. Deep Purple -> Semi-island blizzard map with island bases at 3/9, similar to The Hunters Glacial Epoch -> Easy to take natural, small chokes, might need drops, opponent can be separated depending on spawn Space Odyssey -> Island map, lots of bases with small resources (1gas or 6 mineral)
Metagame: Please note that most assumptions are made on available vods. The finals gave us a glimpse of the TvZ and PvZ metagame from back then. The maps still needed a lot of work like bigger chokes, more expansions to take etc... The quality of the games has also gone up quite considerably from Tooniverse PKO.
Macro styles were still not in play though it was slowly becoming a bigger part of the game. For example, in Grrr...'s game on Glacial Epoch, he would go for the greediest opening known to man as he went nexus first into gas then pylon before any gates were wrapped in.
Micro does seem to be improving. Pulling back injured hydras, target firing units, a failed marine split against lurkers etc... the execution needed work but the idea was there and should develop in the next couple of years.
TvZ: Only game available was played on Blaze. It was a 2 rax opening in anticipation of zergling aggression from an early pool. Lurkers seemed like a common followup due to chokes and can help defend the expansion. Addition of a factory and starport for tanks and drops (also likely for vessels) on one base was common as well.
Did I ever tell you son about how I survived the burrow ambush of 2000?
PvZ: Island maps like Space Odyssey produced some entertaining games with a lot of air battles. Corsair/Carrier against mutalisk/devourer/scourge were common. Games usually opened with the protoss going for 2 stargates on one base to control the air and try to expand while Zerg sat back and defended with hydras before eventually getting a spire and starting to push out to take more expansions. Hydra drops were also used.
Air battles!
In general, for Zerg players, it seems adding an inbase hatchery then pool was the opening build though pool into expansion was also common on some maps. If the Protoss player was scouted to be going for a 2 gate, another inbase hatchery was added going up to 3 for more ling production in order to counter the zealot count (pic). Protoss players would go for a 2 gate in close spawn positions or add a 2 gate right after going for nexus first to defend ling aggression. Cannons were used a lot on some maps.
2 gate defense!
Notables: - Grrrr... is the only foreigner to win the OSL. - Pillars, another foreigner also plays though he loses in the Round of 16 (his bio on LP is amazing for background!) - ChRh makes an appearance and finishes third overall after defeating Byun. - Byun was considered the first "poor zerg" playing a low eco style. - H.O.T.-Forever would write *-* and Grrrr... would rambling in one of his games at the end (convos was allowed). - No one seems to know what the prize pool is!
Ah yes, I remember opening up with an inbase hatchery as Zerg back in the SC1 pre-BW days. Then when SC2 came out I tried to make that build work and it didn't go so well. (although can be surprisingly effective in 3v3 and 4v4 games for gaining map control and punishing early expos with a fast ~20 speedlings)
Macro styles were still not in play though it was slowly becoming a bigger part of the game. For example, in Grrr...'s game on Glacial Epoch, he would go for the greediest opening known to man as he went nexus First into Gas then pylon before any gates were wrapped in.
Pretty greedy, but is it as greedy as this build by HerO Hero_V_ + Show Spoiler +
TvZ: Only game available was played on Blaze. It was a 2 rax opening in anticipation of aergling aggression from an early pool. Lurkers seemed like a common followup due to chokes and can help defend the expansion. Addition of a factory and starport for tanks and drops (also likely for vessels) on one base was common as well.
On September 11 2014 01:55 Netto. wrote: Damn, I was just 5 years old back then, I wish I could enjoy those times of BW :<
Well, you can still watch now and enjoy the games. BW section is always there for fun discussions
On September 11 2014 03:19 Josh_Video wrote: As someone who got into Starcraft with the SC2 beta, this is really cool! I hope you continue with this and do more for other BW tournaments. 5/5
that's the plan though the other tournaments all have their vods so it won't be as quick (as short lol) as the last two I did
On September 11 2014 03:23 TheFish7 wrote: Ah yes, I remember opening up with an inbase hatchery as Zerg back in the SC1 pre-BW days. Then when SC2 came out I tried to make that build work and it didn't go so well. (although can be surprisingly effective in 3v3 and 4v4 games for gaining map control and punishing early expos with a fast ~20 speedlings)
I used to get my hatchery near the entrance, get several sunken with an OL on top for detection then just take my time lol. Given, this was fastest map possible etc...
On September 11 2014 03:58 Stratos wrote: Thanks for another blog! Enjoyed the micro descriptions, helps imagine how the games looked
I need to get rich and make my appartment look like that epic stage.
lol, it's a pretty good stage. I think I like this one more than the tooniverse one :D
On September 11 2014 04:09 zulu_nation8 wrote: chrh goodlooking mofo
Macro styles were still not in play though it was slowly becoming a bigger part of the game. For example, in Grrr...'s game on Glacial Epoch, he would go for the greediest opening known to man as he went nexus First into Gas then pylon before any gates were wrapped in.
Pretty greedy, but is it as greedy as this build by HerO Hero_V_ + Show Spoiler +
TvZ: Only game available was played on Blaze. It was a 2 rax opening in anticipation of aergling aggression from an early pool. Lurkers seemed like a common followup due to chokes and can help defend the expansion. Addition of a factory and starport for tanks and drops (also likely for vessels) on one base was common as well.
Watched one game...
Knew what was common.
Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahh
Such a troll You also missed this:
Please note that most assumptions are made on available vods.
TvZ: Only game available was played on Blaze. It was a 2 rax opening in anticipation of aergling aggression from an early pool. Lurkers seemed like a common followup due to chokes and can help defend the expansion. Addition of a factory and starport for tanks and drops (also likely for vessels) on one base was common as well.
Please note that most assumptions are made on available vods.
come again?
Just because you have a disclaimer it doesn't mean you can state something so obviously fallacious. If there's one VOD available, you can't extrapolate that to mean that that game is the way things are played out all the time.
eg If you fell down and your face landed in the butt of some sunbathing girl the first time I met you an we never meet again, am I not fallacious in telling the whole world that it's common that BigFan falls down due to his bad balance in anticipation of meeting a fellow TLer, and a common followup is to have his face in between the chokes of girls' legs --- Just because I have a disclaimer that most assumptions were made on available data?
No. The right thing to do is the accept that it's one observed case and leave it as it is.
TvZ: Only game available was played on Blaze. It was a 2 rax opening in anticipation of aergling aggression from an early pool. Lurkers seemed like a common followup due to chokes and can help defend the expansion. Addition of a factory and starport for tanks and drops (also likely for vessels) on one base was common as well.
Watched one game...
Knew what was common.
Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahh
Such a troll You also missed this:
Please note that most assumptions are made on available vods.
come again?
Just because you have a disclaimer it doesn't mean you can state something so obviously fallacious. If there's one VOD available, you can't extrapolate that to mean that that game is the way things are played out all the time.
eg If you fell down and your face landed in the butt of some sunbathing girl the first time I met you an we never meet again, am I not fallacious in telling the whole world that it's common that BigFan falls down due to his bad balance in anticipation of meeting a fellow TLer, and a common followup is to have his face in between the chokes of girls' legs --- Just because I have a disclaimer that most assumptions were made on available data?
No. The right thing to do is the accept that it's one observed case and leave it as it is.
LOL at that example. It's obvious to anyone that I'm assuming that Grrr... (or H.O.T.-forever) are playing the same strat in those matchups as the rest of the players and not their own strat (or personal style). A stretch? no doubt but it's all I have to work with. If you can find me more vods to analyze from Hanaro OSL, then I'll glady change what I wrote if I need to do so.
Infact, let's consider some other points to make for a fun argument. This is back in 2000 where most players (I played several games of 1v1 at the time so I can use my own experience) played games sticking to 1 (or 2 bases). Obviously, maps played a big role as well but is it really surprising that a Terran would chose to go 2 rax to get some marines early out to counter possible zergling aggression? Heck, we have terrans go 2 rax in TvZ sometimes because they know a certain player they are up against plays aggressive and seeing how played weren't into the macro mindset as much as back, not surprising to me.
edit: you're being very nitpicky lol. Keep in mind that I watched the previous OSL finals and tried to see if there was some similarities in the playstyle. Plus, I mentioned it was one game when I wrote that so people realize what I have to work with. Could've probably took out common but it was also common to f/u zerglings with lurker in Tooniverse as well and it makes sense seeing the chokes as well (I chose to believe players studied the map).
On September 06 2014 12:52 BigFan wrote: Due to poor micro, mutalisks battles came down to who had the more mutalisks and who did the better job of targeting with scourge.
> Due to lack of advanced micro techniques? Maybe? Sounds better and perhaps even more accurate..
TvZ: Only game available was played on Blaze. It was a 2 rax opening in anticipation of aergling aggression from an early pool. Lurkers seemed like a common followup due to chokes and can help defend the expansion. Addition of a factory and starport for tanks and drops (also likely for vessels) on one base was common as well.
Watched one game...
Knew what was common.
Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahh
Such a troll You also missed this:
Please note that most assumptions are made on available vods.
come again?
Just because you have a disclaimer it doesn't mean you can state something so obviously fallacious. If there's one VOD available, you can't extrapolate that to mean that that game is the way things are played out all the time.
eg If you fell down and your face landed in the butt of some sunbathing girl the first time I met you an we never meet again, am I not fallacious in telling the whole world that it's common that BigFan falls down due to his bad balance in anticipation of meeting a fellow TLer, and a common followup is to have his face in between the chokes of girls' legs --- Just because I have a disclaimer that most assumptions were made on available data?
No. The right thing to do is the accept that it's one observed case and leave it as it is.
LOL at that example. It's obvious to anyone that I'm assuming that Grrr... (or H.O.T.-forever) are playing the same strat in those matchups as the rest of the players and not their own strat (or personal style). A stretch? no doubt but it's all I have to work with. If you can find me more vods to analyze from Hanaro OSL, then I'll glady change what I wrote if I need to do so.
Infact, let's consider some other points to make for a fun argument. This is back in 2000 where most players (I played several games of 1v1 at the time so I can use my own experience) played games sticking to 1 (or 2 bases). Obviously, maps played a big role as well but is it really surprising that a Terran would chose to go 2 rax to get some marines early out to counter possible zergling aggression? Heck, we have terrans go 2 rax in TvZ sometimes because they know a certain player they are up against plays aggressive and seeing how played weren't into the macro mindset as much as back, not surprising to me.
edit: you're being very nitpicky lol. Keep in mind that I watched the previous OSL finals and tried to see if there was some similarities in the playstyle. Plus, I mentioned it was one game when I wrote that so people realize what I have to work with. Could've probably took out common but it was also common to f/u zerglings with lurker in Tooniverse as well and it makes sense seeing the chokes as well (I chose to believe players studied the map).
On September 06 2014 12:52 BigFan wrote: Due to poor micro, mutalisks battles came down to who had the more mutalisks and who did the better job of targeting with scourge.
> Due to lack of advanced micro techniques? Maybe? Sounds better and perhaps even more accurate..
Oh come on you're nitpicking man -.-
yada yada "I extrapolated from 1 data point to deduce all data points because that's all I have." I already know it, and I told you why it's wrong, no need to repeat yourself, just admit that it's wrong You could've said from watching that 1 game that upgrading burrow was common but you didn't
Your noob games are irrelevant to the OSL metagame lol.
Yes I'm poking fun at the contradiction and you can call it nitpicking because you were caught :D Real nipicking would be like "LOL you spelt it as aergling"
My point is, if you only have one game (nothing wrong about it), why not do a short BR instead?
TvZ: Only game available was played on Blaze. It was a 2 rax opening in anticipation of aergling aggression from an early pool. Lurkers seemed like a common followup due to chokes and can help defend the expansion. Addition of a factory and starport for tanks and drops (also likely for vessels) on one base was common as well.
Watched one game...
Knew what was common.
Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahh
Such a troll You also missed this:
Please note that most assumptions are made on available vods.
come again?
Just because you have a disclaimer it doesn't mean you can state something so obviously fallacious. If there's one VOD available, you can't extrapolate that to mean that that game is the way things are played out all the time.
eg If you fell down and your face landed in the butt of some sunbathing girl the first time I met you an we never meet again, am I not fallacious in telling the whole world that it's common that BigFan falls down due to his bad balance in anticipation of meeting a fellow TLer, and a common followup is to have his face in between the chokes of girls' legs --- Just because I have a disclaimer that most assumptions were made on available data?
No. The right thing to do is the accept that it's one observed case and leave it as it is.
LOL at that example. It's obvious to anyone that I'm assuming that Grrr... (or H.O.T.-forever) are playing the same strat in those matchups as the rest of the players and not their own strat (or personal style). A stretch? no doubt but it's all I have to work with. If you can find me more vods to analyze from Hanaro OSL, then I'll glady change what I wrote if I need to do so.
Infact, let's consider some other points to make for a fun argument. This is back in 2000 where most players (I played several games of 1v1 at the time so I can use my own experience) played games sticking to 1 (or 2 bases). Obviously, maps played a big role as well but is it really surprising that a Terran would chose to go 2 rax to get some marines early out to counter possible zergling aggression? Heck, we have terrans go 2 rax in TvZ sometimes because they know a certain player they are up against plays aggressive and seeing how played weren't into the macro mindset as much as back, not surprising to me.
edit: you're being very nitpicky lol. Keep in mind that I watched the previous OSL finals and tried to see if there was some similarities in the playstyle. Plus, I mentioned it was one game when I wrote that so people realize what I have to work with. Could've probably took out common but it was also common to f/u zerglings with lurker in Tooniverse as well and it makes sense seeing the chokes as well (I chose to believe players studied the map).
ps the irony
On September 07 2014 02:46 JieXian wrote:
On September 06 2014 16:14 Stratos wrote:
On September 06 2014 12:52 BigFan wrote: Due to poor micro, mutalisks battles came down to who had the more mutalisks and who did the better job of targeting with scourge.
> Due to lack of advanced micro techniques? Maybe? Sounds better and perhaps even more accurate..
Oh come on you're nitpicking man -.-
yada yada "I extrapolated from 1 data point to deduce all data points because that's all I have." I already know it, and I told you why it's wrong, no need to repeat yourself, just admit that it's wrong You could've said from watching that 1 game that upgrading burrow was common but you didn't
Your noob games are irrelevant to the OSL metagame lol.
Yes I'm poking fun at the contradiction and you can call it nitpicking because you were caught :D Real nipicking would be like "LOL you spelt it as aergling"
My point is, if you only have one game (nothing wrong about it), why not do a short BR instead?
guess you missed the bold part, try again You're right, I was going to put burrow but figured a picture of it was enough Also, compared to opening 2 rax or going 1 hatch zergling into lurker, burrow was an upgrade while the others were more builds which meant there was a higher chance of the right call. I'm pretty sure that if we were to play on those maps, we'll end up doing similar strat just due to the map layout.
lol but my noob games were also 1-2 base noob games lol.
aergling, where do you see that? lol. Need to get your eyes checked It wasn't a contradiction, just different wording would've worked better, that's all.
As for why not a short BR, the game wasn't all that exciting. 2 rax vs early zerglings -> defend with depot/SCV -> lose some marines to burrowed zerglings -> attack into zerg's exp but pull back due to lurkers then defend against a lurker attack with 2 tanks on high ground (dropped there due to seeing lurker) followed by a drop in the main to win. Pretty 'simple' stuff though the lurker defense was nice and made me wonder if its gif worthy lol
EPT
![[image loading]](http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj236/BigFan_2008/Cropped_zpsf39cf981.jpg)
H.O.T.-Forever and 
Grrrr... who would play a bo5 to determine the winner. At the time, race picking was just fine so ![[image loading]](http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj236/BigFan_2008/Opening_zps0ae7db95.jpg)
Blaze -> Narrow chokes all around, can siege main from back as well![[image loading]](http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj236/BigFan_2008/Game5_zpsa3b100c8.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj236/BigFan_2008/Game1_zps6e26346b.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj236/BigFan_2008/Game2_zpsdcd3cf39.jpg)
ChRh makes an appearance and finishes third overall after defeating 
