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The SC2 MMR is slowly ruining my experience of the game... here is why:
(I've never heard much about this on TL or Reddit, (even after checking the different posts on these sites) so perhaps some of you could give me a little insight to my problem. On another note, perhaps I just want to rant and some of you are okay to read it and feel my pain with me XD.)
My issue is that, despite MMR Decay (which I find hard to believe in), I have worked my MMR to the point where I ONLY play top 8 Masters and GM and I don't have fun playing anymore.
Let me explain further:
After years of playing SC2 and trying my hardest to achieve well on ladder, I have worked my MMR up pretty high. If I play consistently throughout each week, I'll easily finish a season in top 8 masters. If I play only 1 or 2 days a week I usually finish around 15th - 9th.
These days, because of my busy work/life schedule, I only have Saturday's to commit to playing (if that). And guess what!? Dispite my lack of playing, the MMR STILL puts me against top 8 Masters or GM (EVERY FUCKIN GAME).
Guess what, my friends, my skill is not top 8 Masters or GM at the moment! For example, on any given Saturday, I'll sit down to play the game for a few hours. I'll usually play 20-25 games in total. For the 1st few games I'll usually get my ass kicked as I start to warm up. Once I've played about 5 games (and haven't had much fun doing it) I finally start to get my form back, and I start to win some. Ultimately, even now on a Saturday, I struggle to win and games take A LOT OF ENERGY OUT OF ME.
If you've played this game to the point where you're 50% in your win/lose rate, then you know that you probably have to be in your best form in order to win.
From personal experience, if I don't play my goddamn hardest, I'm probably guna get my ass handed to me.
Some days, I come home from work and I just want to play a casual game of SC2 - and I want to work on my ladder (without playing the VERY best) but if I'm not playing my best then I will almost certainly lose.
Some of you are probably thinking, "Dude, just play unranked"...
Yeah, perhaps this is my best option, but still, I'm sure you can see my frustration with the MMR dispute the option of non ranked. On top of that, the non-ranked ranking system can be pretty bunk...
In the end, I'd like to play ladder games. And IF I have 200 bonus pool and I'm at rank 20 Master, I'd rather not be placed against rank 1 Master or GM every game... I'd like to play people with similar rank and/or bonus pool and not MMR.
What are you guy's thoughts?
 
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My thoughts:
If you were significantly worse than the people you are currently playing against, even with 20 games/week you would not be matched against them in the long run.
Essentially what you are asking for is easy wins. You have to understand that the ladder system is designed to achieve a 50% winrate for everyone below the very top GM ranks in the long run. Meaning unless you are the very best, you will loose a lot of games independent of being in top masters or low silver. So perhaps you are not loosing as much as you think, perhaps bit more than 50% with bonus pool. The solution to your problem is to loose enough games for your rating to drop significantly at which point your games become easier. Once they are easier you will win more and once again move up to a higher rating. Not really the answer you are looking for i know )=.
Also, you have to understand that for every easy game you get, your opponent gets stomped. He/she is then in exactly the same situation you are now and could have written this post.
However, consider this. The fact that you are still being matched against GM players means that despite playing very little you are still very good and should be proud of yourself. Through the ladder you simply cannot have games that are not challenging. Also, why is loosing such a bad thing?
maybe this is useful
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Couldn't agree more. My MMR has been fucked for a few months at least. I ran into the same exact problem: games became too taxing and I wasn't enjoying it, even after a win, just felt like I was always in "tournament" mode.
So I decided to play unranked. Well, now, my unranked is FUCKED. Same problem, little differences, such as, once in a while you play someone WAY below your MMR and once in a while WAY above your MMR. Otherwise, it's a pretty close resemblance to "ladder MMR". So no, choosing unranked is stupid. Unless you wanna join/quit 5 games every 10 wins or so, you will have the same problem.
I've been playing since WoL beta. That's a long time. I've played LOTS too. The past couple months, I've been avoiding ladder, and it's got to the point where I haven't even bothered ranking this season.
You know, after all this time playing , watching, and learning about everything starcraft, overall blizzard has really let me down. In WoL beta, I posted on this site (diff accnt) many times claiming blizz was not even close to releasing a finished product, and we will suffer for a year through WoL because of that; becuase blizz wanted to get on the market asap. My prediction came true, obviously, as we saw so many broken units, builds, glitches, bugs, battle.net issues, layout issues, you fucking name it.
Fast forward today, and I'm deeply ashamed and disappointed at the progress blizz has done, and more importantly, the way they went about doing it. Every fix it feels like blizz puts a virtual band-aid over top of the issue and prays time itself just fixes the problem. When finally the problem becomes unbearable and absolutely necessary to deal with, they pull off a band-aid to find a big gross seeping wound, throw some sand in it, and put the band-aid back on. Or, even worse, the band-aid becomes an "expansion pack". Shudder.
Happened with Diablo 3, arguably WoW too. It's so depressing, the fact that such amazing games, fantastic ideas, creative and talented people working on them, always gets raped and beaten by blizz during production, and then crammed into a box for a xx.99 profit.
Anyway, derailed a bit there, but TL;DR I agree 100% and I am "let down" on blizz overall performance as a company the last 3-5 years.
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All you have to do is lose some games and your mmr drops. Not a big deal. You can even just leave games and drop your mmr. Really I feel the problem is that you care too much about your ladder rank, and so you don't want to ladder. There's an unranked mode for you to enjoy too.
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On October 26 2013 05:43 Mojito99 wrote:
My thoughts:
If you were significantly worse than the people you are currently playing against, even with 20 games/week you would not be matched against them in the long run.
....
Dude, you have some valid points and I appreciate your thoughts. Especially the ones about changing my mentality on losing and enjoy the state of "expertise" that I have achieved.
Now that I reflect a little more on the broad picture, I realize that playing 1v1 in SC2 is perhaps more of a competitive game than it is a relaxing, "fun" game. Perhaps I just need to come to terms that IF I'm guna play SC2 I gota put on my competition hat on and just get down to playing full tilt... I suppose this could limit the amount of fun I'd have playing... Hard to say right now.
On October 26 2013 05:49 MrRicewife wrote:
Couldn't agree more. My MMR has been fucked for a few months at least. I ran into the same exact problem: games became too taxing and I wasn't enjoying it, even after a win, just felt like I was always in "tournament" mode.
...
I'm glad someone else has experienced this and understands the STRESS of playing 100% ALL. THE. TIME. It does take away from the fun of the game, and I am trying to understand the best way to address this...
I can see how you take this as a personal let down by Blizzard - as a fan and as someone who (once) respected the company and the games they make. I hope you can either over come your frustrations or learn to love the game/company again.
Personally, I have not come to the point where I hate SC2 or Blizzard (yet). I am still hopeful and I think I will continue to play. I do see, and understand your pain tho.
Keep on keepin on...
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On October 26 2013 06:01 CecilSunkure wrote:
All you have to do is lose some games and your mmr drops. Not a big deal. You can even just leave games and drop your mmr. Really I feel the problem is that you care too much about your ladder rank, and so you don't want to ladder. There's an unranked mode for you to enjoy too.
Honestly, I suppose I should just queue up a few games and simply leave to drop my MMR - do to the high chance of me winning my online stats don't really look that great right now, and I just dont give a fuck about how many wins per losses I have anymore.
Yes, I do care about my ladder rank as I feel it does reflect my hard work in this game. I suppose an individual could care "too much"... I think that Blizzard, and the online community, have encouraged us to care about our ladder rank because a lot of pros practice on ladder and use it as a primary means to gain popularity and status. For us little guys, its also a way to dream big and to think that maybe one day we can achieve greatness like them too. Initially these were some of my thoughts when I would ladder months back. However, now that my mentality has changed, and I don't care so much to play my hardest, It is still rough when MMR kicks in.
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What I personally do is force myself to play random. If I stick with one race I get too high on the ladder, and suddenly I find myself playing to win instead of playing to have fun.
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On October 26 2013 06:01 ComebackKid wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2013 05:43 Mojito99 wrote:
My thoughts:
If you were significantly worse than the people you are currently playing against, even with 20 games/week you would not be matched against them in the long run.
....
Dude, you have some valid points and I appreciate your thoughts. Especially the ones about changing my mentality on losing and enjoy the state of "expertise" that I have achieved. Now that I reflect a little more on the broad picture, I realize that playing 1v1 in SC2 is perhaps more of a competitive game than it is a relaxing, "fun" game. Perhaps I just need to come to terms that IF I'm guna play SC2 I gota put on my competition hat on and just get down to playing full tilt... I suppose this could limit the amount of fun I'd have playing... Hard to say right now. Show nested quote +On October 26 2013 05:49 MrRicewife wrote:
Couldn't agree more. My MMR has been fucked for a few months at least. I ran into the same exact problem: games became too taxing and I wasn't enjoying it, even after a win, just felt like I was always in "tournament" mode.
...
I'm glad someone else has experienced this and understands the STRESS of playing 100% ALL. THE. TIME. It does take away from the fun of the game, and I am trying to understand the best way to address this... I can see how you take this as a personal let down by Blizzard - as a fan and as someone who (once) respected the company and the games they make. I hope you can either over come your frustrations or learn to love the game/company again. Personally, I have not come to the point where I hate SC2 or Blizzard (yet). I am still hopeful and I think I will continue to play. I do see, and understand your pain tho. Keep on keepin on...
Let me clarify, I don't hate the game. I still play sc2 quite a bit, just not ladder, or MMR activities. I have been disappointed with the game from the beginning, but I definitely never hated sc2 (ok maybe a bit when toss abused the amulet, terran player here come on! ha).
I don't hate blizzard as a company either. I still paid them money for HOTS, and I will probably buy LV when it arrives, even though I have no doubt in mind blizzy will release it incomplete, and at least two major patches will come out after its release. I am just.... so disappointed in the direction blizzard took since WoW really landed them a spot on the map. From that point on, blizz turned from an innovative, creative, and classic gaming company, to a corporate cash cow.
I don't need to learn how to love the company again. I may be easy, cheap, and have low standards, but I demand a little respect and a morsel of fine dining, before I let blizz fuck me again.
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United States12279 Posts
On October 26 2013 05:01 ComebackKid wrote:
The SC2 MMR is slowly ruining my experience of the game... here is why:
(I've never heard much about this on TL or Reddit, (even after checking the different posts on these sites) so perhaps some of you could give me a little insight to my problem. On another note, perhaps I just want to rant and some of you are okay to read it and feel my pain with me XD.)
My issue is that, despite MMR Decay (which I find hard to believe in), I have worked my MMR to the point where I ONLY play top 8 Masters and GM and I don't have fun playing anymore.
Let me explain further:
After years of playing SC2 and trying my hardest to achieve well on ladder, I have worked my MMR up pretty high. If I play consistently throughout each week, I'll easily finish a season in top 8 masters. If I play only 1 or 2 days a week I usually finish around 15th - 9th.
These days, because of my busy work/life schedule, I only have Saturday's to commit to playing (if that). And guess what!? Dispite my lack of playing, the MMR STILL puts me against top 8 Masters or GM (EVERY FUCKIN GAME).
Guess what, my friends, my skill is not top 8 Masters or GM at the moment! For example, on any given Saturday, I'll sit down to play the game for a few hours. I'll usually play 20-25 games in total. For the 1st few games I'll usually get my ass kicked as I start to warm up. Once I've played about 5 games (and haven't had much fun doing it) I finally start to get my form back, and I start to win some. Ultimately, even now on a Saturday, I struggle to win and games take A LOT OF ENERGY OUT OF ME.
If you've played this game to the point where you're 50% in your win/lose rate, then you know that you probably have to be in your best form in order to win.
From personal experience, if I don't play my goddamn hardest, I'm probably guna get my ass handed to me.
Some days, I come home from work and I just want to play a casual game of SC2 - and I want to work on my ladder (without playing the VERY best) but if I'm not playing my best then I will almost certainly lose.
Some of you are probably thinking, "Dude, just play unranked"...
Yeah, perhaps this is my best option, but still, I'm sure you can see my frustration with the MMR dispute the option of non ranked. On top of that, the non-ranked ranking system can be pretty bunk...
In the end, I'd like to play ladder games. And IF I have 200 bonus pool and I'm at rank 20 Master, I'd rather not be placed against rank 1 Master or GM every game... I'd like to play people with similar rank and/or bonus pool and not MMR.
What are you guy's thoughts?
Couple of things. First, one week of inactivity isn't enough for decay to kick in because it's not enough to make you "rusty" as far as the system is concerned. Second, you're probably matched with high-point Master players because they play more often and therefore it's more likely that they'll be in the queue at the same time as you.
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On October 26 2013 05:01 ComebackKid wrote:
Couple of things. First, one week of inactivity isn't enough for decay to kick in because it's not enough to make you "rusty" as far as the system is concerned. Second, you're probably matched with high-point Master players because they play more often and therefore it's more likely that they'll be in the queue at the same time as you.
Thanks for that clarification.
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On October 26 2013 05:49 MrRicewife wrote:
Couldn't agree more. My MMR has been fucked for a few months at least. I ran into the same exact problem: games became too taxing and I wasn't enjoying it, even after a win, just felt like I was always in "tournament" mode.
So I decided to play unranked. Well, now, my unranked is FUCKED. Same problem, little differences, such as, once in a while you play someone WAY below your MMR and once in a while WAY above your MMR. Otherwise, it's a pretty close resemblance to "ladder MMR". So no, choosing unranked is stupid. Unless you wanna join/quit 5 games every 10 wins or so, you will have the same problem.
I've been playing since WoL beta. That's a long time. I've played LOTS too. The past couple months, I've been avoiding ladder, and it's got to the point where I haven't even bothered ranking this season.
You know, after all this time playing , watching, and learning about everything starcraft, overall blizzard has really let me down. In WoL beta, I posted on this site (diff accnt) many times claiming blizz was not even close to releasing a finished product, and we will suffer for a year through WoL because of that; becuase blizz wanted to get on the market asap. My prediction came true, obviously, as we saw so many broken units, builds, glitches, bugs, battle.net issues, layout issues, you fucking name it.
Fast forward today, and I'm deeply ashamed and disappointed at the progress blizz has done, and more importantly, the way they went about doing it. Every fix it feels like blizz puts a virtual band-aid over top of the issue and prays time itself just fixes the problem. When finally the problem becomes unbearable and absolutely necessary to deal with, they pull off a band-aid to find a big gross seeping wound, throw some sand in it, and put the band-aid back on. Or, even worse, the band-aid becomes an "expansion pack". Shudder.
Happened with Diablo 3, arguably WoW too. It's so depressing, the fact that such amazing games, fantastic ideas, creative and talented people working on them, always gets raped and beaten by blizz during production, and then crammed into a box for a xx.99 profit.
Anyway, derailed a bit there, but TL;DR I agree 100% and I am "let down" on blizz overall performance as a company the last 3-5 years.
Why is it that anytime someone has a concern about something some whiners come along and extrapolate that into how SC2 is a horribly balanced and designed game and their whole model is awful and Blizzard is run by Satan? This whole post is one unsupported claim after another.
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Changes I would like to happen (but that never will obviously):
1. Abolish the division system and display MMRs. The division system as I see it is a psychological tool (that means nothing in terms of skill) that tries to incentivize you to play more to raise your rank but really only punishes you for practicing or playing for fun.
2. Add option to match with greater range of MMRs that you experience outmatching opponents and being outmatched, which is part of the competitive experience.
3. As long as MMR is hidden, unranked MMR should always be the same as your ranked MMR but does not count as a win or a loss. I find it confusing to have 2 different MMRs when both are hidden. What I want unranked to do is be an ordinary game that I can leave without being punished.
But I generally like the efficiency of the current system in finding people your skill level.
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Wow.
If you dont want to play competitively, stop playing as hard as you can. play in "casual" mode and your MMR will drop to compensate your drop in skill (read: concentration)
SC2 is a competitive 1v1 game, if you dont want to tryhard and be the best you can be, dont do it and you'll eventually be placed against people you can casual mode against and go 50/50. If you cant wait, abuse the system.
I actually find it atrocious that you would "complain" about such a thing. thinly veiled brag blog at its worst. veiled with whine.
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your easiest solution is to have a second account where you "don't try" and one where you "try"
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nowadays, you can just log on to another server and have 2 additional MMRs to toy arround with. I really don't think what you describe is a problem of sc2&MMR rather than one of your mentality.
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Canada11607 Posts
Now that I reflect a little more on the broad picture, I realize that playing 1v1 in SC2 is perhaps more of a competitive game than it is a relaxing, "fun" game. Perhaps I just need to come to terms that IF I'm guna play SC2 I gota put on my competition hat on and just get down to playing full tilt... I suppose this could limit the amount of fun I'd have playing... Hard to say right now.
That's why you need something like 2v2v2v2 BGH's. Or race wars on BGH or really any sort of multifront war map, where you still want to win, but there are so many factors beyond your control that it winds up being a silly, fun game. (Attack one team and get pounced upon from another side. Nothing you can do about that.)
Besides, 50% isn't too bad. I average 30% on iccup these days. That's a lot more losses per wins. On the other hand, if a D- joins my game, I have won a game with my first harassing zealot... I guess with MMR it's less likely to those random spikes vs lower players which make you realize how far you've come. Alternatively, you also don't get rolled by smurfs.
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EPT
