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The darker side of Japan - Page 2

Blogs > futility
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Kommatiazo
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States579 Posts
February 26 2013 15:37 GMT
#21
I feel like despite all that you have gone through OP, that you would still recommend traveling/spending time there correct? I think that's the most important point of all this.

I have spent time there, on a scale of weeks however, and I loved it and consider the people I met there life-long friends. BUT, even in my short stay there the heavily ingrained discrimination is apparent, whether it is in the older generation holding grudges for old wars/deaths and asking awkward questions about my own grandparents, or the younger generation simply being unaccustomed to the way a white person looks, small children giggling and asking you why your nose is so big and your hair so blonde and your eyes so blue seems cute and adorable at first, but I can easily see it becoming depressing and sad after years and years of fruitless efforts to fit in (sort of like how a scene of children laughing and playing with happy music will make you smile, and the same scene with horror movie music is terrifying).

Good read OP, and glad to have you headed stateside again! Where no one will ever discriminate against you for anything ever!
"You must enemy don't know, and very good micro" - Bosstoss #Wet4Ret
HardlyNever
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States1258 Posts
February 26 2013 15:53 GMT
#22
I think if you went to the most rural/disconnected part of any nation or culture, your experience would be similar. That is just the way things go. You might have a little better luck in some places as opposed to others, but every extremely rural place I've ever been to is very conservative and does not like outsiders of any kind, for any reason.

There might be something about where you are at or Japanese culture in general that make it especially true, but I think you'd have this problem anywhere. I've heard rural Korea is about the way you describe rural Japan.
Out there, the Kid learned to fend for himself. Learned to build. Learned to break.
futility
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Japan134 Posts
February 26 2013 15:58 GMT
#23
On February 27 2013 00:32 Myrtroll wrote:
You might be lacking a female connection. A girlfriend would make you "connected" in a way that your single status doesn't do. Subconsciously you might even be a threat to some japanese men since you are single. Girls are better at making social connections as well, so it's a pretty huge disadvantage being single or without a female companion.

Also, isn't the average married age around your age in Japan? That would make it more natural for couple friendships/dinners etc. I guess.
Show nested quote +

Despite all this I have really enjoyed my time here, and I do have friends and a girlfriend, but none of them live near me so I do a lot of driving on weekends.


Edit: Noticed this. Guess you aren't "connected" to the town at all then. That's the main problem. That nobody renews is a pretty big sign of a bad environment too. Probably just unlucky with the place then.


I don't really have any human connection to my town. I'm a member of a couple of clubs so there's that, but I wouldn't consider any of the other people in them friends and never see them outside of a club setting. I actually had a girlfriend in town for about a year (Japanese but an outcast for other reasons) but she broke up with me about a year ago in search of a normal life. I can guess what that means but at any rate given that foreigner gossip is the best kind of gossip here I doubt that's done me any favors in winning over the locals either.

On February 27 2013 00:37 Kommatiazo wrote:
I feel like despite all that you have gone through OP, that you would still recommend traveling/spending time there correct? I think that's the most important point of all this.

I have spent time there, on a scale of weeks however, and I loved it and consider the people I met there life-long friends. BUT, even in my short stay there the heavily ingrained discrimination is apparent, whether it is in the older generation holding grudges for old wars/deaths and asking awkward questions about my own grandparents, or the younger generation simply being unaccustomed to the way a white person looks, small children giggling and asking you why your nose is so big and your hair so blonde and your eyes so blue seems cute and adorable at first, but I can easily see it becoming depressing and sad after years and years of fruitless efforts to fit in (sort of like how a scene of children laughing and playing with happy music will make you smile, and the same scene with horror movie music is terrifying).

Good read OP, and glad to have you headed stateside again! Where no one will ever discriminate against you for anything ever!


I would absolutely recommend coming to Japan! My experience is unfortunate but definitely not representative of the whole country. Japan has a LOT to offer, whether you're just travelling or planning to make it your home. I would probably recommend against making where I live your home though
TriO
Profile Joined July 2011
United States421 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-02-26 20:07:27
February 26 2013 20:03 GMT
#24
I'm 27 years old. I'm a white American male. For the past three years I have been a victim of racial discrimination every single day of my life, and I am tired of it.


Try living in America as an Asian-American where everyone thinks you're a foreigner and not an American. I get a lot of where are you from? Bro I'm from Mass, oh I thought you were from China. This is just one example with the many shit I deal with everyday. Do this for 25 years then come back to me. It still continues till this day and I still get treated like an outsider when I was born here.
My dream is to tear up your dream.
Kraznaya
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States3711 Posts
February 26 2013 20:14 GMT
#25
On February 27 2013 05:03 TriO wrote:
Show nested quote +
I'm 27 years old. I'm a white American male. For the past three years I have been a victim of racial discrimination every single day of my life, and I am tired of it.


Try living in America as an Asian-American where everyone thinks you're a foreigner and not an American. I get a lot of where are you from? Bro I'm from Mass, oh I thought you were from China. This is just one example with the many shit I deal with everyday. Do this for 25 years then come back to me. It still continues till this day and I still get treated like an outsider when I was born here.


yeah how dare people treat white american males with racial discrimination
do you have enough resolve, hero of justice?
Caller
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
Poland8075 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-02-26 20:24:39
February 26 2013 20:21 GMT
#26
I'm 27 years old. I'm an Asian-American male. For the past 27 years I have been a victim of racial discrimination every single day, and I am tired of it. This summer I am packing all my belongings and turning my back on the place I've called home since 1986.

I am a Chinese teacher in rural America. Not the America with the bright lights, the big robots, and the beautiful girls. Not the "rural" America you might have seen if you've been outside of New York to see monuments or Mt. Rushmore or the damage in New Orleans. No, not even the rural America that turns the most stalwart of Americaphiles into bitter shells of humanity. I live in the rural America beyond all of that, the America that has never heard of things like highways or public transportation, central heating or Windows 7. E-mail and the internet are as foreign to the people here as their language is to most Asians. I live in a small town of about 10,000 that survives (I initially typed 'thrives' but that word would be sorely inappropriate here) on government subsidized agriculture and a dying fishing industry. I am one of three Asians living in town, the others being a doctor and his engineer wife. After 17 years they remain the only friends I have here.

It honestly isn't that I haven't tried to make friends. I'm involved in sports clubs, English clubs and classes for all ages, and countless events throughout the year. I have studied English nearly every day for the last twenty years to improve my ability to communicate. But despite being fluent in the language, attending all the events, taking part in the clubs, I still haven't made a single American friend. To put it quite simply, I am not wanted here.

And now I sit here writing this because I'm tired, confused, and utterly depressed. I certainly don't have a shining personality and it would not be fair to say that none of the blame for this rests on me. What I truly wonder though is how much of it is me. I've tried and tried to adapt, to be understanding, to accept cultural differences and barriers, but ultimately the only thing that matters is the one thing that I cannot change. The fact that I am not one of them. I've slowly come to the painful realization that it does not matter how different or similar we may be, or how hard I try to prove I am just another guy trying to make a living like anyone else. To these people I will always be an outsider. In that respect it doesn't even matter whether I'm from Japan, China, or Korea. I am different in a society that values homogeneity over all else. Discrimination is so deep rooted into the culture and education here that trying to convince a single person that I'm really not that different is about as useful as trying to post this message with an etch-a-sketch. Leaving then, I feel, is the only chance I have to live a normal life.

In the last three years I've had to deal with an entire spectrum of discrimination. The "why is your eyes so slanted?" and "why is your skin yellow?" questions from kids, to outright verbal abuse and ridiculous accusations from the senile elderly (some here will have you believe that I personally was behind the bombings in Pearl Harbor and 9/11). From the endless stares to being endlessly ignored when I have the misfortune to need help with something. From being denied basic rights (apartments, cell phone contracts, etc.) despite holding valid residency, to being rejected by society because the color of my skin is too great a barrier to see past. This is what I live with day after day. This is the truth about America that no one ever wanted you to know.

I am not the first to write about racism or discrimination in America, nor do I make any claim to be. I simply wanted to share my own experiences with anyone who's willing to listen. I think people should know about this.
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________

Honestly, you think this is bad? How about being a person who's part Chinese and Japanese who has spent their entire life in America? I routinely get compared to Chinese hackers and asked why I eat rice all day, or why I bombed Pearl Harbor and want to destroy America. When applying for jobs, my application is thrown into a pile with all the foreign applicants because of my last name. And if I go to Japan or China, they see me as being not only a foreigner but the worst kind, despite having the same heritage. Japanese people see me as a Chinese American, and Chinese people see me as a Japanese American. And Americans of course see me as Asian.

shit even when I was in Japan the other day the only people I could relate to were British students on holiday. Fuck me, right?
Watch me fail at Paradox: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=397564
alQahira
Profile Joined June 2011
United States511 Posts
February 26 2013 20:41 GMT
#27
As a pakistani-american, visiting japan was really an eye opener. In the cities things were fine. I was traveling with two half-japanese friends. On the rural trains we would take between some of the smaller cities we visited if there was a single seat available, they would send me in, and almost all the time the two people sitting next to me would stand up, and voila, seats for all three of us!
guN-viCe
Profile Joined March 2010
United States687 Posts
February 26 2013 20:45 GMT
#28
Racism exists in every country, in every corner of the world.

It's a shame.
Never give up, never surrender!!! ~~ Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence -Sagan
lantz
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States762 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-02-26 21:06:05
February 26 2013 21:05 GMT
#29
Are you saying the "azn women love white men" montra does not exist?

Or maybe they discriminate because the montra is correct!?
B.I.G.
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
3251 Posts
February 26 2013 21:39 GMT
#30
I'm from the Netherlands and if you would be an american fluent in dutch trying to teach english in the town where my family is from, you'd pretty much be an outsider too I think..
nomyx
Profile Joined June 2012
United States2205 Posts
February 26 2013 21:44 GMT
#31
Racism occurs against every possible person. It doesn't matter if your white, black, asian, martian, whatever, you can be discriminated against. No need to be "but you're white, you haven't experienced true racism like I've felt!"
Caller
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
Poland8075 Posts
February 26 2013 21:57 GMT
#32
On February 27 2013 06:44 nomyx wrote:
Racism occurs against every possible person. It doesn't matter if your white, black, asian, martian, whatever, you can be discriminated against. No need to be "but you're white, you haven't experienced true racism like I've felt!"

no, but complaining about it certainly isn't going to improve your situation.
Watch me fail at Paradox: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=397564
nomyx
Profile Joined June 2012
United States2205 Posts
February 26 2013 22:04 GMT
#33
On February 27 2013 06:57 Caller wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2013 06:44 nomyx wrote:
Racism occurs against every possible person. It doesn't matter if your white, black, asian, martian, whatever, you can be discriminated against. No need to be "but you're white, you haven't experienced true racism like I've felt!"

no, but complaining about it certainly isn't going to improve your situation.


This is a blog post after all. Most people use them to vent their frustation and get input from the community. Judging by the OP he is improving his situation.
Burrfoot
Profile Blog Joined July 2012
United States1176 Posts
February 26 2013 23:48 GMT
#34
To go along with this post randomness:

I am chinese, born overseas, suck at mandarin , get called the Walking-Dead-Korean's-name at work, and have to put up with guys at the gym hitting on my wife right next to me at the gym. The lone asian grocery in town is owned by an old guy that has ordered two young wives from china only to have both leave him after a few months (He's 3rd order is processing).

But its all good, since I'm listening to Frou Frou
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Davlok-1847/career
Disregard
Profile Blog Joined March 2007
China10252 Posts
February 27 2013 01:04 GMT
#35
Well, considering the environment you're living in extreme xenophobia would be pretty much a given.
"If I had to take a drug in order to be free, I'm screwed. Freedom exists in the mind, otherwise it doesn't exist."
FromShouri
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
United States862 Posts
February 27 2013 01:45 GMT
#36
On February 27 2013 05:03 TriO wrote:
Show nested quote +
I'm 27 years old. I'm a white American male. For the past three years I have been a victim of racial discrimination every single day of my life, and I am tired of it.


Try living in America as an Asian-American where everyone thinks you're a foreigner and not an American. I get a lot of where are you from? Bro I'm from Mass, oh I thought you were from China. This is just one example with the many shit I deal with everyday. Do this for 25 years then come back to me. It still continues till this day and I still get treated like an outsider when I was born here.


Honestly all this made me think of was the scene from the new karate kid remake where will smith's son is forced to talk to the guy next to him in broken Chinese only to find out and I quote, "Dude, I'm from Detroit.."

And about this: Tough break, try living as a white american male that doesn't fit the standard stereotype of a white american male. No matter where I go in this country I get asked whats wrong with me(my boss even asked me one time because I spilt some ice cream on my face and licked it off instead of wiping it), we all have shit that sucks, get over it.
Limited Edition, lets do some simple addition, $50 for a T-Shirt is just some ignorant bitch shit.
koreasilver
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
9109 Posts
February 27 2013 02:52 GMT
#37
I think one of the biggest problems that have plagued the TL forums is that they have this image of Asia (for us, South Korea in particular) that is a little naive. It has to be remembered that much of the social-ethnic conflicts and collective learning that NA has gone through in the 20th century just never happened in the Asian nations because they generally have all been very ethnically homogeneous. We don't learn, from childhood, either theoretically, historically, or personal experience, that we share this world with very different looking people among a myriad of different cultures and etc. Of course both America and Canada still possesses within itself various racial conflicts, but it is through these conflicts that both societies have learned and are continuing to learn. This classical liberal tradition permeates the NA nations and passes through both ends of the political spectrum, albeit tenuously at times. With East Asia this simply does not exist.
Rekrul
Profile Blog Joined November 2002
Korea (South)17174 Posts
February 27 2013 04:03 GMT
#38
thats really weird, in korea they love people who speak the language (or even know bits and peices), and even if you don't as long as you make effort to respect and learn their cultural values they are always happy

i would have assumed the same for japan. to just give up and leave the country with bitter feelings is pretty stupid though

try and get a job in a more urban area, and get better at the language

if you do that then feel the same way still then something is seriously wrong with you lol
why so 진지해?
futility
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Japan134 Posts
February 27 2013 07:21 GMT
#39
Thank you everyone for the replies. Sorry for the long post but I'd like to respond to each person individually

Just to be clear about one thing; I did not make this post with the intention of creating some "who's got it the worst" competition. I welcome you to share your stories, as I have, to get them out there and encourage people to talk about these issues. Whatever the case may be, discrimination is a huge issue and the only way we're going to make any progress towards ending it, whether on a global level or even for just one person, is to have an open dialogue about what is going on. TriO and Caller I feel for you, but I don't feel "stop complaining because my situation is worse than yours" is a useful road to go down. On the other hand, I would like to hear more about your experiences and how you've dealt with them if you don't mind sharing.

Caller:

Again, I am sorry to hear about how you've been treated but if you've actually been refused apartments and cell phone contracts in America and have at least some grounds to believe the reason was your ethnicity then I strongly suggest you pursue legal action. If you can't find help at a local level then go higher, contact news agencies, etc. Regardless of where you live in America this type of thing is very volatile and absolutely against the law. There are a number of organizations that can assist you, if you want to pursue this feel free to PM me.

Disregard:

That's probably true and coming here xenophobia was definitely something I expected to encounter, but I did not expect it to be as pervasive and accepted as it is. I understand there are cultural barriers, sometimes very great ones, to overcome but being denied certain rights solely because of my skin color goes beyond typical xenophobia.

FromShouri:

I'm sorry for your situation but there's a fundamental difference between our experiences. You are perceived as different because you are unwilling to, or are unable to (that's a debate I am not going to get into right now), conform to social norms. Conversely, I have tried my absolute best to adapt and integrate into society here, but have been rejected because I do not look the same as everyone else. The difference is that your own actions are the source of discrimination and that's at least perceived as something you could change, whether you actually can or not. A more accurate analogy to your situation (although admittedly an extreme one) would be if I came to Japan and proceeded to defecate on all the local shrines. That would certainly be spitting in the face of social norms and what is culturally acceptable, and I'm sure I'd face a barrage of "what's wrong with you?" questions as well. I could tell people I'm different, or this is my culture, or maybe I just have an uncontrollable urge to drop a deuce when I see that donation box in front of me, but ultimately I'm going to be "that guy who keeps crapping on our shrines" to everybody in town and I will face discrimination as such (and I'm sure some would argue rightfully so in this case). A more realistic analogy of course would be the hikkikomori phenomenon happening in Japan now. An extreme analogy to my situation on the other hand would simply be me getting sent back home at the airport because white people aren't allowed visas. My actions, personality, chemistry, even the content of my character is entirely irrelevant as long as I look different. An opportunity to improve or tarnish my social standing is not something that has been afforded to me.

That is certainly not to say my situation is better or worse than yours, or that the discrimination I face is worse or more real than the discrimination you face. At the end of the day we are both fighting against discrimination, and that should unite us rather than put us at odds with each other.

koreasilver:

You make a very good point. Racial conflicts in the west have very much been out in the open for the world to see and criticize. To some extent that is true of Japan as well (the Korean comfort women issue, etc.) but not nearly to the same extent, and the way Japan has, or hasn't, dealt with those issues says quite a bit about the situation already. Originally I wanted to title this blog "the elephant in the room" but after some thought I realized that title would be sorely innappropriate. Discrimination is not the elephant in the room in Japan. It is not an issue that's even in the room. It isn't something that people ignore or overlook, it is something that is not even on the radar of the Japanese people. This makes it an extremely difficult issue to have an open dialogue about. People don't just want to ignore the fact that it exists and it's a problem; they don't want to acknowledge that it exists at all. This is an issue that has strong roots starting in elementary education and is reinforced through a child's entire development. The "us vs. them" mentality is one instilled at a very young age, with racism being the final product of that mentality applied to the global stage.

The problem is far worse than racism in Japan; it is extreme discrimination and prejudice against anyone who does not fit into carefully sculpted social norms. This is a huge issue and now we're getting into the whole hikkikomori phenomenon and such as well. This is getting outside of the scope of my own experiences which I write about here so I'll stop now, but it's definitely important to look at the big picture and understand that there are very basic differences between Eastern and Western cultures, and those differences play a big role in the way we look at and understand issues like discrimination.

Rekrul:

The same is definitely true of Japan in many regions as that's essentially the experience I had in Tokyo, but my current situation is a bit of an outlier. As for giving up, this blog has become quite long so I don't fault you for not reading it all. To summarize I'm going back to a job in America dealing with Japanese business relations because I want to move on with my career. Japan and Japanese will remain a big part of my life and career so I wouldn't say I'm giving up just yet

Thanks again for the replies.
Nazza
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Australia1654 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-02-27 07:28:05
February 27 2013 07:23 GMT
#40
OP if you don't mind me asking, why did you choose to go to/work in such a rural area in the first place?

EDIT: NVM, the program put you there.
No one ever remembers second place, eh? eh? GIVE ME COMMAND
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