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Schrodinger's Oracle

Blogs > iHirO
Post a Reply
iHirO
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United Kingdom1381 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-23 12:52:50
October 23 2012 12:26 GMT
#1
While thinking about HoTS the other day, I came up with an interesting new game mechanic.

[image loading]


Basically the Oracle is given a new spell called Entangle. This is an AOE spell that when casted on a friendly group of units, causes them to turn translucent and split in two. The superposition only lasts a finite period of time (e.g. 1 minute) before they collapse back into their normal state, also any observation by enemy units also causes their state to collapse.

Constraints:
  • Entangle cannot be casted on units that are currently entangled, otherwise you could potentially create infinite numbers of units and break the game.
  • Any units that are damaged cause their state to collapse, allowing players to decide which units become 'real' instead of randoming decaying.
  • Workers cannot be entangled OR they return resources at half their current rate to prevent it being completely imbalanced.
  • Cloaked units do not collapse until they are either detected or start attacking.

Strategy:
  • If you suspect your about to be dropped, you could entangle and then split up your units to either side of the base; the incoming medivac then causes the units to collapse and you can defend the drop.
  • Scout the map twice as quickly.
  • Send in entangled DTs and decide which is the better target to begin attacking.
  • Get better concaves by being able to position vs two attack paths.
  • If superposition suddenly collapses then its a sign that that a cloaked or burrowed unit is nearby.

Counters:
  • Using single units to cause collapse while attacking the other position.

Summary:

Although I don't think this spell is viable as it stands due to it overlapping too much with hallucination and not dealing actual damage (making it difficult for players to justify using compared with other spells), I thought it was worth writing up for people to discuss.

So what do you think?

*****
GraphicsThis is for all you new people: I only have one rule. Everyone fights. No one quits. You don't do your job, I'll shoot you myself. You get me?
Grovbolle
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Denmark3815 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-23 12:51:23
October 23 2012 12:45 GMT
#2
This could potentially be both cool and gamebreaking.

I assume the Schrodinger reference is because of the "not sure if dead or alive" status that the ending unit will end up in .

Also: Duplicate is prolly a better word since entangle sounds like it roots units in place like fungal
Lies, damned lies and statistics: http://aligulac.com
opisska
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Poland8852 Posts
October 23 2012 13:12 GMT
#3
No, entangle is the right word - quantum entanglement

Anyway, as a particle physicist, I approve your suggestion but I think it is too contrived to be considered viable by Blizzard.
"Jeez, that's far from ideal." - Serral, the king of mild trashtalk
TL+ Member
Perfi
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Poland349 Posts
October 23 2012 13:13 GMT
#4
Wow. That's pretty freaking cool, to be honest. I'm pretty sure nobody has ever based any gameplay principles on quantum phenomena before (take that, LoL! ). I'd love to see it
EtherealDeath
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States8366 Posts
October 23 2012 13:21 GMT
#5
Hahaha when I read Schrodinger's Oracle I was like hmmm then I read the description and was like lol, fucking awesome. So now, let's add in weak measurement as well ;D
divito
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Canada1213 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-23 13:23:07
October 23 2012 13:22 GMT
#6
Isn't this like hallucination?

Edit - nevermind, saw you claimed as much at the end.
Skype: divito7
Grovbolle
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Denmark3815 Posts
October 23 2012 13:24 GMT
#7
On October 23 2012 22:12 opisska wrote:
No, entangle is the right word - quantum entanglement

Anyway, as a particle physicist, I approve your suggestion but I think it is too contrived to be considered viable by Blizzard.


First: I have no knowledge of quantum physics

Second: I have a hunch that a larger percentile of the Starcraft playing base haven't got this knowledge either

However, I am know going to educate myself on this subject, but my point still stands, entangle does sound like something that roots shit in the ground :-P
Lies, damned lies and statistics: http://aligulac.com
Rannasha
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Netherlands2398 Posts
October 23 2012 15:05 GMT
#8
It doesn't have much to do with quantum entanglement, as that process allows for the synchronization of quantum states between two existing particles.

The spell described is an example of the indeterminancy of the wave function, just like the Schrodinger's Cat thought experiment. Units affected exist as the superposition of two states and their final state is determined when an enemy comes within sightrange of the unit, drawing a parallel with the collapse of the wave function upon making an observation.

I quite like the concept of it. You would push out with your main army, use the spell on a small group, which you would park at the usual drop-location in your main. If you encounter the enemy army mid-map, the drop-defending units disappear and if you are dropped before you reach the enemy, the units disappear from the army and the drop-defense is still there.

It has a nice Protossy feel to it, but I fear it would be very hard to balance. The cost to use it is easily too high, as a single scan, burrowed unit or enemy unit at a watchtower can break the effect. But if you make the cost too low, Protoss can have units setup almost everywhere without weakening their main force until it's actually needed.
Such flammable little insects!
Irrelevant Label
Profile Joined January 2012
United States596 Posts
October 23 2012 17:41 GMT
#9
That, or something very like it, would be really cool.

Question though, why not simplify the spell to be broken whenever one of the entangled units performed an 'action' or was 'acted' upon rather than this iffy-sounding manual/when seen by an enemy version described? I.e. if one of the units attacks, is attacked, harvests, repairs, builds, loads, is loaded, etc. then that member of the 'entangled' pair is the 'real' one and the other poofs. The seen by an enemy part in particular seems too limiting while the manual deactivation provides a level of control over the effect that might lend to overpowered strategies.

Very protoss and it also seems like something a good player could really shine with. In the right hands it might be a license to be in two places at once for enough intents and purposes to be overpowered though, but damn it'd be cool.

Should be called indeterminate or something like that rather than what sounds more like a snare debuff.
EatThePath
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
United States3943 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-23 18:02:46
October 23 2012 17:59 GMT
#10
This is really cool!

However it's not that effective in the general scheme of things. As you say under counters: send one unit to collapse their troops to the wrong place. It's a huge liability if you're depending on it. For the cost of an oracle you could have a couple stalkers to block a medivac or another sentry to commit to holding a certain chokepoint.

How could it be expanded to have a clear role that is always effective while maintaining this very interesting behavior?

For example: Void Journey -- Small AoE. Splits units into two entangled copies that collapse when observed. (So far the exactly the same.) The double units each replenish energy and shield at the normal rate, combining them additively when collapsed. They can be "overcharged" and surpass the normal maximum, at which point they lose shield and energy at the normal rates inverted until they reach the normal maximum.

This way the spell is always something useful, it has the potential to be hugely beneficial, and it can be used in multiple ways.

Overcharged archons!!!! XD

[edit] Above suggestion good idea, make it "attacks or is attacked" -- this is a lot more interactive than just vision, and is a lot more solid to play with / see it happen.
Comprehensive strategic intention: DNE
Shadowslayer
Profile Joined April 2012
United States9 Posts
October 23 2012 22:30 GMT
#11
On October 23 2012 22:24 Grovbolle wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2012 22:12 opisska wrote:
No, entangle is the right word - quantum entanglement

Anyway, as a particle physicist, I approve your suggestion but I think it is too contrived to be considered viable by Blizzard.


First: I have no knowledge of quantum physics

Second: I have a hunch that a larger percentile of the Starcraft playing base haven't got this knowledge either

However, I am know going to educate myself on this subject, but my point still stands, entangle does sound like something that roots shit in the ground :-P


I get it and I'm not a particle physicist.

Well it would be a lot more fun than saying "wave spell".
Carson
Profile Joined September 2010
Canada820 Posts
October 23 2012 23:07 GMT
#12
This sounds like a C & C type upgrade. (which means I approve )
"You have to remember something: Everybody pities the weak; jealousy you have to earn." Arnold Schwarzenegger
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