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Active: 5960 users

Breaking up the deathball

Blogs > Hryul
Post a Reply
Hryul
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Austria2609 Posts
September 02 2012 01:23 GMT
#1
Warning: OSL Spoilers ahead.

Watching OSL


I hate (Wiki)Daybreak. This is kind of surprising because it's one of the most well wanted maps and one week ago even I was happy playing on it on the ladder. Now I think it has to go.

[image loading]
I was one of them



I was watching the OSL and to be more precise Team Liquid Fantasy vs Nestea (part

2
) where Fantasy took out Nestea with multipronged harassment and drops. I was entertained and happy, although Nestea was quite slow. It reminded me of glorious games of MMA droping on 2

different locations while pushing through the middle on Metalopolis back in the days when Idra was still winning the foreigners hope. I really enjoyed those games and thought Zergs would

find a way to handle this playstyle without shutting it down completely, maybe with clever counterattacks forcing Terrans to defend. And I hoped that PvT would also evolve into something more

like MVP vs Flying, where Protoss is constantly attacking and harassing, forcing Terrans to keep units back at the main base and

defending while (hopefully) dropping at the same base. Now I know the games I linked aren't top tier Code S quality but I'm more entertained by these games than most of Code S because the

idea
was there.

Instead we are seeing dull boring games, where almost nothing happens up to the 10 minute mark. What happened? I

found the answer (before I even had the question) in the Lessons from OSL Kespa thread:

On August 29 2012 23:13 bo1b wrote:
That style stopped because zergs learned how to deal with it. Mma did it far better then what fantasy displayed yesterday.



Now it was true. And it felt completely wrong. If Zergs were able to completely shut down dropping like this how was there ever a chance of multipronged attack (read: splitting up the

deathball)? And how comes this is true? My answer was amazingly simple: The bases are too easy to defend. Daybreak, the best map on the planet, enters the stage.


Daybreak


[image loading]
This whole photoshop thing is harder than it looks


The numbers depict the order expansions are taken and once the third expansion is taken there are two attackpaths (the red arrows) on the ground. But if we put our army around the green circle

we are able to reach both attackpaths in a fair amount of time and defend both expansions. Furthermore there is only one flank to drop into which i'm not bother much because we learned how

to defend that
(read: it's near to our army so that stimmed marines/speedlings/stalker reach it in a reasonable fast time.) So we are able to put our army (read:deathball) at one place to

defend alle three bases considerable fast. So we are good set up for the lategame.

[image loading]
The X surely doesn't mark treasure


Once a foothold at the watchtower is gained, it immediately shuts down the upper two attack paths which secures both the fourth base and the main. Funny enough we also secure our fifth base

through this because once more then a fistful of lings is seperated from the army to attack the fifth (read: the deathball is split up) we simply waltz through the remainder of the army at the

opposite watchtower, kill his fourth and have opened a path to the second/main. We win every baserace because we just crushed half of his army and reach his production earlier. This leads to

two deathballs dancing around each other in the middle of the map.

I think the reason why this map is so popular is easy to spot: It is easy to play "safe" and "standard" on it. But this also shuts down any form of multipronged aggression.

P.S.: You can also apply the same logic to almost all (ladder) maps: Ohana, Antiga, Condemned Ridge, Entombed Valley, and even TDA

A new hope


Now this train of thought is not really new. There were a few clever guys who figured this out way before I did it and

they even took action to change something. In short: In BW people were all over the map, because the map forced them to. Let's make more expansions each with less ressources. This will

force people to spread out more and also force more (small) engagements.

I also think that this is the right direction. The reason for this Blog lays in the relatively small impact they had but I think they deserve more attention. Furthermore there is the unique opportunity to really change the maps Starcraft II is played. OSL (and their mapmakers) hopefully is able to change the way Starcraft II is played together with the upcoming expansion where balance will be in shambles.

Furthermore the BW players seem to want to drop all over the place (warpprism!), so let's give them the maps where they can shine.



TL,DR: Maps like Daybreak favour deathballs far too much. We need maps that allow easier attacks on bases which encourage the breakup of deathballs. Maybe the OSL guys can make it.

P.S.: I know protoss had a hard time taking expansions before maps like daybreak emerged. Oddly enough I think rocks might solve the problem, because they alter the terrain in the favour of P until P is able to set up their defence.


*
Countdown to victory: 1 200!
Survivor61316
Profile Joined July 2012
United States470 Posts
September 02 2012 02:50 GMT
#2
Dude you should watch the TLO v Taeja VOD on TeamLiquidPro, he does a great job of attacking on multiple attack paths with just a handful of zerglings, and actually ends up winning the game.
Liquid Fighting
docvoc
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States5491 Posts
September 02 2012 04:13 GMT
#3
I don't think we need to force this, we should just let it happen. It will happen, nothing forces any pro to clump, it just means that there has to be a BETTER reason to not clump.
User was warned for too many mimes.
Hryul
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Austria2609 Posts
September 02 2012 11:39 GMT
#4
On September 02 2012 11:50 Survivor61316 wrote:
Dude you should watch the TLO v Taeja VOD on TeamLiquidPro, he does a great job of attacking on multiple attack paths with just a handful of zerglings, and actually ends up winning the game.


just this! But at the moment it's rather the exception. I also saw Leenock@mlg who managed to pull off a twopronged attack on Antiga. But imo we don't see it often enough.


On September 02 2012 13:13 docvoc wrote:
I don't think we need to force this, we should just let it happen. It will happen, nothing forces any pro to clump, it just means that there has to be a BETTER reason to not clump.


Yeah, but the best reason not to clump up is that the map favors multiple small forces. In other words pros are keeping their deathballs because it's the best way to play and they want money to win. If we keep all maps like entombed valley, nothing is going to change.
+ Show Spoiler +
Since entombed is a more obvious example of a deathball map.
Countdown to victory: 1 200!
ArcticRaven
Profile Joined August 2011
France1406 Posts
September 02 2012 12:05 GMT
#5
I think community maps (read TL maps) do a great job at this. Shame that they never see play in tournaments.

Hoping for TLMC #2, so we can get another batch of Cloud Kingdoms.
[Govie] Wierd shit, on a 6 game AP winning streak with KOTL in the trench. I searched gandalf quotes and spammed them all game long, trenchwarfare247, whateva it takes!
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