EPTTank was always (except when big daddy bc arrived) the core power-unit in the terran arsenal.
In Defence of Mech - Page 6
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Boundz(DarKo)
5311 Posts
Tank was always (except when big daddy bc arrived) the core power-unit in the terran arsenal. | ||
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AzureD
United States320 Posts
As for the Warhound. I hate this unit. Right now it is totally overpowered and I just hate how the unit fits in the army. I would not mind if it was completely removed. It is too effective against too many things and lacks weaknesses as well. | ||
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Jaaaaasper
United States10225 Posts
I cant say much due to terribadness at terran, but vulture run by's were one of my favorite things to watch in bw (not to play against). | ||
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Deleted User 135096
3624 Posts
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Sapphire.lux
Romania2620 Posts
Sadly though, i think the mech playstyle is on Dustin B. black list ever since making WOL. The man just doesn't like Tanks. The entire Protoss race looks like it was made to kill tanks as easy as posible. Now we get Worhounds to kill them in TvT and so on. I still hope that there will be some big buff to tanks so you can at least choose to go all tanks/ hellion without those ugly and brainless robots. Not gona happen though. + Show Spoiler + By the next expansion i would not be surprised if they thought about removing them and replace them with some caster unit that does AOE. Mechanical fire bat, mechanical marauder and some mechanical infestor/ HT is what i see in the future to be presented as mech. | ||
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Corvi
Germany1406 Posts
why is tvp mech terrible? because of chargelots and most importantly immortals. so if you add something to be able to deal with those (obviously requiring warhound to be light armored, which as an anti-tank it ironically should be) this might be just what terran needed. | ||
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FATJESUSONABIKE
184 Posts
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winthrop
Hong Kong956 Posts
warhound doesn't belong to mech | ||
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Nizes
Finland27 Posts
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fire_brand
Canada1123 Posts
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-UMADIMSTYLIN-
Cuba292 Posts
On August 14 2012 22:55 fire_brand wrote: Mind blown. Got some great points. Marines either shouldn't be able to kill tanks or tanks should always 1 shot marines. They did, every tvt was tank/viking stalemate back in the day | ||
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Mobius_1
United Kingdom2763 Posts
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nixis
United States42 Posts
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VGhost
United States3608 Posts
Blizzard didn't design Brood War, as far as I can tell, so that mech would win. Tanks are - as you mentioned - basically trebuchets (except they fire while moving) - they were supposed to be supplementary. As far as I can tell, every Terran matchup was "supposed" to look like TvZ, more or less, on the Terran side. Even so, there does seem to be more diversity in BW unit design than in SC2 unit design, with the focus going more to differentiating the spells and "Tier 3" units. But mech wasn't, I don't think, a Blizzard idea at any point. | ||
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Cele
Germany4016 Posts
a) MMM play is to strong: Why would you bother building up a slow, position based army that is hugely position in TvP dependent if 90% of the time being a mm army is more effective and easier to control aswell? Yes MMM play is hurting in the lategame under the sheer abundance of high tech protoss units. Collossi, storm and HT. However i argue, that Protoss is equipped even better to deal with mech play. Blink adds great mobility to flank, Collossi provide constant longe ranged dps to snipe isolated tanks at the front line. Immortals are anti tank at it´s best. b) mech relies on flanking protection and buffer as mentioned, furthermore map control by positional spider mines to counteract or slow down runbys was essential. the hellion/bhellion may be able to provide buffering protection to the tankline, but the widowmine is unsuited to fill the role of the spidermine whatsoever. It's to costly, eats up supply... well the OP explained it in detail! c) Air control: what may fill the air control role for Terran in sc2? thors and turrets naturally don't suffice as they are either to slow or to positional. So it´s vikings or marines to me, but the marine appears superior in dps, mobility and overall usefulnesses. Yes vikings handle Colossi. Marines deal absurd dps, shut down air play, execute drops. But tanks and rines is seen today in tvt, not very interesting though. d) raids: hellions do great raids, the kill a ton of econ and are pretty fast. However they don't kill key buildings. The marine does the aforementioned nearly as well and the second too. It's as easy as that to me. e) Interface: When playing vs a setup tank line or jockeying for positions in BW, the interface was actually a pretty grim task for Protoss. While it was for terran too, i argue concerning mech play, easy maneuverability benefits the mobile army that wants to flank, engage or bypass the meching player. Lets look at the ability to use storms via smartcast in sc2: Remember this? i could execute this in Sc2. Im Diamond and have ~100 Apm. While one can argue, that improved control benefits the defender aswell in the abaility to snipe ht and such i think it's more beneficient to that player, who actually has to engage a setup properly that is static for a large part. In conclusion: i highly doubt mech play will ever be viable again in Sc2. Adding units in Hots won't cut it, some basic unit designs that either counter mech to hard or are just better than mech would have to occur. And i don't believe Blizzard will ever take up such a task. €: forgot to mention it before and couldn't fit it in anywhere else: The 22 range absurdity blizzard is going to introduce makes mech unviable on it's own. Nice to have a static army if toss rains down on you without even engaging. | ||
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BobMcJohnson
France2916 Posts
On August 14 2012 23:07 -UMADIMSTYLIN- wrote: They did, every tvt was tank/viking stalemate back in the day Yeah, but it was not the only reason, the maps were also a lot smaller which means less space to go around the tanks, and shorter (and therefore thicker) siege lines. On today's bigger maps, you have a lot more space to out-maneuver a mech player since he can't just lock down a line across the map and push it slowly. | ||
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NormandyBoy
France200 Posts
They probably looked at BW PvT for instance and said : "Man, protoss can never engage directly a terran army, gogo immortals and gogo nerf tanks !" and it killed mech. Then, they were like : "Goliaths are so clunky, they need to be more mobile, gogo flying goliaths !" and it killed all micro because they failed to realize the clunkiness of the goliath was part of the unit, and led to cool micro = skill = fun. | ||
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meteorskunk
Canada546 Posts
terran's main goal is to keep distance between the tanks and the zealots. The dragoons kill the vultures, the vultures kill the zealots. If mines do not cover for the tanks and vultures, and tanks for vultures and mines, protoss wins the battle. One can see how a great balance must be found. the map terrain must be used to keep the protoss from getting an engagement that is too horizantal, that takes too little tank fire, that has too few mines. this means the terran must move slowly across the map because if the tanks are overly aggressive and unsiege too much, the goons will get too close for the terran to win the battle. The terran covers enough territory to secure bases to support enough factories to be able to replenish the losses the protoss inflicts during the final push. The protoss has a lot of time to macro up because the terran is slow, but he mustnot be too greedy either because the vultures are fast and they can slow you down with their mines. the protoss also has time to look for leaks in terran's defence. it is quite a fun and difficult battle. It is also the product of nearly a decade of paid competitive play! When Koreans first showed the rest of the world that terran does not suck, were they whining to blizzard? i doubt it. So i ask, has terran explored all her options? -use of high ground advantage to hold with few tanks and turrets. yes the misfire chance has been removed but it can offer a vision advantage with floated buildings and turrets and walls at the ramp. -bunkers in the middle of the map. what about those bunker with extra HP? - ABUSE of Planetary fortresses to just choke up areas and allow scvs to mass repair -abusing ravens to snipe observers and allow banshees to pick off those annoying immortals? -the new speed of the raven t go spam so point defence drones whenever the hell they feel like it? are any of those points viable with warp gates costing only 150 minerals, zealots being super fast and robust and being warped in fucking anywhere? amazing gas sinks like high templar, dark templar and archons?? | ||
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ArcticRaven
France1406 Posts
But you're not and I i know it D: | ||
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TheSun
Germany57 Posts
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