EPTFaith in Blizzard - Page 2
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Kurr
Canada2338 Posts
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imre
France9263 Posts
On August 01 2012 08:20 Kurr wrote: I still feel like if I played Diablo 2 right now I would enjoy it. Diablo 3... well, let's just say Blizzard is permanently off my "easy buy" list. just reinstall d2  best thing d3 has done for me :D | ||
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MtlGuitarist97
United States1539 Posts
Thanks for the run Blizz, but I have lost faith in you and Starcraft II for the time being. | ||
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Telcontar
United Kingdom16710 Posts
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radscorpion9
Canada2252 Posts
It looks like a lot of thought has been put into understanding the influence activision has had and I'm not going to comment on that; but I think the fact that the previous designers of Diablo 2 have gone on to make Torchlight, which is one of the most successful Diablo 2 clones out there that is loved by the community speaks volumes about how important they were to Blizzard (I think the team was commonly known as Blizzard North). And then there's James Phinney who went on to make Guild Wars (also very successful). To me nothing "bad" has happened to Blizzard, their talent just moved on. Its amazing when you compare the differences in the quality of dialogue from Starcraft 1 & Brood war to SC2. (the originals were much, much better  ). Although Chris Metzen is still doing Sc2 it looks like his role is reduced significantly - he's just the writer. I guess his talent for game design did not transfer over to that department | ||
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Murlox
France1699 Posts
On August 01 2012 10:27 radscorpion9 wrote: I know a lot of the vets probably know this, but I didn't see it mentioned and am a bit surprised. Isn't the main factor that most of the game designers for the new games aren't the ones who designed the old ones? Diablo 2, Starcraft and its expansion Brood war were all done by different people. It looks like a lot of thought has been put into understanding the influence activision has had and I'm not going to comment on that; but I think the fact that the previous designers of Diablo 2 have gone on to make Torchlight, which is one of the most successful Diablo 2 clones out there that is loved by the community speaks volumes about how important they were to Blizzard (I think the team was commonly known as Blizzard North). And then there's James Phinney who went on to make Guild Wars (also very successful). To me nothing "bad" has happened to Blizzard, their talent just moved on. Its amazing when you compare the differences in the quality of dialogue from Starcraft 1 & Brood war to SC2. (the originals were much, much better ). Although Chris Metzen is still doing Sc2 it looks like his role is reduced significantly - he's just the writer. I guess his talent for game design did not transfer over to that departmentThat's a very good point and could be "the soul" I was thinking about. Those guys. Also, totally agreed on the dialogues - and the ambiance in general, much deeper, more mature tbh. Today, it feels like Blizzard is adressing us like we're 7 years old, everything being so explicit, politically correct and cliché. Boring. Edit : probably not the most relevant example but do you remember the "nightmare" levels of Max Payne 1? Where he would go, over and over, on the family house and it was more and more twisted every time. Not sure why I think about that, but this was soul, this was balls.... this was something that made me love the game. Not saying this kind of strong decisions would make more cash than the Blizzard current ones (certainly wouldn't, actually), but from a gamer, and not a consumer, point of view... wow. | ||
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Lord_J
Kenya1085 Posts
In contrast, both SC2 and Diablo 3 seem designed to funnel players into narrow gameplay experiences. The one-account restriction is devastating to SC2 because it punishes players for playing around or trying different things. Want to try a different race? Enjoy dozens of frustrating games against players who badly overmatch your offrace while your MMR stabilizes. Want to goof around a little and try some proxy nexus mothership rushes? Well, you're going to get smashed because the system will only match you up with people appropriate for your usual level of play. As far as I can tell, the restriction was designed to combat smurfing, yet it fails to even achieve that goal because players simply downrank -- a practice generally less fun for smurfs and smurfees alike than in WC3 or SC1 because it basically lets you choose exactly how difficult of an opponent you'd like to play against, whereas starting a new account in previous games was always a pandora's box -- it was always far from a guarantee that your early opponents would be real newbies. Couple that with Bnet 2.0's poor interface and lack of social tools, which combined to create a much more limited custom game scene, and unless your mindset is about playing competitively and trying to move up the ranks every time you log on, you're going to be met with obstacles to your gameplay experience. Diablo III is even worse. With the new skill system there's basically never a reason to level more than one character of a class, at least in softcore play (and with bnet's instability and the lack of an offline option, hardcore is a not so appealing option IMO). Since the game is designed around the auction house, drop rates for gear worth using are horrible. I can't even remember the last time I got an item I actually wanted to use; I'm just happy if I get a single item worth putting on the AH for 1/100th the price of an item that'd be an actual upgrade. In D2, most of my characters wore exclusively gear that they found themselves, with minimal trading. Could you even play D3 that way? I have to think it'd be dreadful. Unless you enjoy hours of mindless farming just to play the loot lottery over and over again, there's basically nothing to do. Starting new characters isn't even very appealing because you have to sink about 30 hours of gameplay in before the games starts to reach a baseline level of challenge where it's actually fun. Classic Blizzard games aren't so much an experience as a platform from which you could create whatever experience you are looking for, but modern Blizzard games are all about funneling players into one "pure" style of play, regardless of whether or not that's what they actually want or like. Oh well, the sad thing is that they're still one of the better PC game developers despite having fallen so far. I'll probably keep buying their non-MMO content, at least for now. But it's clear to me that their games aren't what they used to be, and I don't think they'll be going back. | ||
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ParkwayDrive
United States328 Posts
great post. great perspective i dont tend to be overly dramatic but i think HotS will be make or break got blizz. theyve had 2+ years to listen to what we want. i think either sc2 will blow up even more or will shudder back into more of a niche community than it already is | ||
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HeeroFX
United States2704 Posts
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Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/6080179368?page=1 It's a VERY legitimate concern that should be at the top of their priorities because it's a big problem that requires very little effort to fix. Yet Blizzard never addresses those concerns, ever - because having a safe trade window doesn't increase their RMAH profits. Many of the problems about D3 make me think that Blizzard is greedy and they think they can get away with screwing their customers with a bad product. That's bad but it happens. This particular problem with the trade window makes me think that Blizzard is actual vile and fucking despicable. I'm ashamed to have bought the CE of Diablo 3. Blizzard was always a business, but it used to be good to its fans. Now it went full out corporate bullshit and it's riding the wave of old-blizzard's fantastic products and the brand-loyalty that they earned in the past. They no longer feel like they need to earn that brand loyalty, or at the very least they don't work for it at this point. Blizzard used to take you out on nice dates - romantic dinner and all. You always knew that Blizzard only ever was nice to you to get in your pants, but at least it was pleasant, and you put out for it. It was a mutually enjoyable relationship. But now Blizzard takes you for granted, so it's putting on weight and won't take you out. Blizzard barely showers, and when he feels romantic he orders a pizza. He knows you'll put out regardless, because you've been together for a long time and you've forgotten how nice it was at first. And you can just feel Blizzard ramming your bottom as you eat that disgusting pizza from Pizza Hut - it's okay though. It's Blizzard's favorite. | ||
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Murlox
France1699 Posts
I skimmed through your BN thread, nice dedication there. Reminded me how sad of a story Diablo 3 has been. Also, I feel what you're after is not the actual fix (since you say in OP you don't play anymore), but some form of recognition, acknowledgement from Blizzard. There are 7 millions D3 customers (right?), so I feel they kind of can afford to ignore you. Yeah well, not too sure where I'm going with this post. Maybe there : is it worth your time/concern? | ||
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Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
On August 01 2012 14:15 Murlox wrote: ^ lol at the old couple story. I skimmed through your BN thread, nice dedication there. Reminded me how sad of a story Diablo 3 has been. Also, I feel what you're after is not the actual fix (since you say in OP you don't play anymore), but some form of recognition, acknowledgement from Blizzard. There are 7 millions D3 customers (right?), so I feel they kind of can afford to ignore you. Yeah well, not too sure where I'm going with this post. Maybe there : is it worth your time/concern? You're absolutely right, I'm actually looking for recognition or something like that, I don't know what I would call it. I wouldn't personally benefit at all if they were to apply this fix because I'm not going to play Diablo 3 ever again - but I would be happy if Blizzard started doing the "right" thing once in a while, rather than the "immediately profitable" thing. If Blizzard manages to get back some of its humanity, maybe I won't have to puke in my mouth when I'll buy HotS. And you ask me if it's worth my time, and it definitely isn't. But that's my emotional response to seeing the father of Starcraft Brood War turning into a wife-beating alcoholic. Oh how the mighty have fallen. It's truly gut wrenching to witness that fall. | ||
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Murlox
France1699 Posts
What I'm saying is blizzard didn't turn into a wife-beating alcoholic. Blizzard is gone. The wife-beating alcoholic is another dude who is simply using the same name. And no don't even bring up the fact that some people probably have stayed, this is not a rational reasoning here. Blizzard is gone and this is another dude. No fall, only -arguably- well executed impersonation. | ||
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Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
On August 01 2012 14:48 Murlox wrote: I understand and you know, after reading the thread linked in the OP and considering what Lord_J pertinently reminded few posts above (about the crew), I think one cannot call current Blizzard the father of SC:BW. It simply isn't. Only the name remains. And that can fool people only for so long... What I'm saying is blizzard didn't turn into a wife-beating alcoholic. Blizzard is gone. The wife-beating alcoholic is another dude who is simply using the same name. And no don't even bring up the fact that some people probably have stayed, this is not a rational reasoning here. Blizzard is gone and this is another dude. No fall, only -arguably- well executed impersonation. That's absolutely true, but it's hard to accept that. As a gamer, I'm forced to look at the video game industry right now with deep and uncomfortable pessimism. Blizzard was like this beacon of hope, and while I probably should give up and come to terms with the fact that it's never going to be the same, there's this part of me that wonders why "New-Blizzard" won't even try to emulate Blizzard. Is there even the slightest chance that Morhaime wasn't full of shit when he said that Blizzard cares about what we have to say? What if the feedback made them realize that the big money is in taking care of their fans? I realize that I'm making it sound a bit overly dramatic, but it's a really big deal to me. I love Starcraft Brood War so much, and SC2 leaves me so indifferent - and Diablo 3 leaves me outright fucking pissed off. Blizzard died and I never knew... I don't know all that much about business, so maybe I'm just wrong on some levels, but Blizzard's name is seen in such high regard, the company's name has so much status, they can release all kinds of crap and treat their customers like subhumans, they're still benefiting from their good name. But what happens when the fans realize what's going on and start refusing to put out for a mushy pizza? [Sorry about all the analogies] + Show Spoiler + Blizzard may be a bit big for that, but Activision's done similar things in the past. 1- Produce sequels that people will buy by brand loyalty. 2- Cut all possible corners, produce bad game that people will buy anyway because it's a sequel developed under a reputable name 3- Juice customers, who are not satisfied 4- -> ![[image loading]](http://i48.tinypic.com/1eqoi9.jpg) 5- Profit Off to bed I go. Will have nightmares. | ||
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AssyrianKing
Australia2116 Posts
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OpticalShot
Canada6330 Posts
I love the older Blizzard titles - SC/D2/WC3 have been the core of my gaming hours for over a decade. I still play those games, especially WC3 UMS when we can get a good ih crowd going. Of course, Blizzard makes more money from selling new titles to new gamers instead of pleasing the older generation who's satisfied already with the older, already-sold titles. | ||
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Chef
10810 Posts
On August 01 2012 13:33 Djzapz wrote: I loved Blizzard so much, but the old Blizzard is dead. I still bought SC2's CE, I bought D3's CE - now I need them to do a few things right. It's no secret that D3 was built around the RMAH - but now it's time to see them change their philosophy and they need to actually give the people what they want. I made this thread over 2 weeks ago and I've been bumping it pretty frequently. It's about the unprotected trade window which is incredibly susceptible to scamming. http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/6080179368?page=1 It's a VERY legitimate concern that should be at the top of their priorities because it's a big problem that requires very little effort to fix. Yet Blizzard never addresses those concerns, ever - because having a safe trade window doesn't increase their RMAH profits. Many of the problems about D3 make me think that Blizzard is greedy and they think they can get away with screwing their customers with a bad product. That's bad but it happens. This particular problem with the trade window makes me think that Blizzard is actual vile and fucking despicable. I'm ashamed to have bought the CE of Diablo 3. Blizzard was always a business, but it used to be good to its fans. Now it went full out corporate bullshit and it's riding the wave of old-blizzard's fantastic products and the brand-loyalty that they earned in the past. They no longer feel like they need to earn that brand loyalty, or at the very least they don't work for it at this point. Blizzard used to take you out on nice dates - romantic dinner and all. You always knew that Blizzard only ever was nice to you to get in your pants, but at least it was pleasant, and you put out for it. It was a mutually enjoyable relationship. But now Blizzard takes you for granted, so it's putting on weight and won't take you out. Blizzard barely showers, and when he feels romantic he orders a pizza. He knows you'll put out regardless, because you've been together for a long time and you've forgotten how nice it was at first. And you can just feel Blizzard ramming your bottom as you eat that disgusting pizza from Pizza Hut - it's okay though. It's Blizzard's favorite. I broke up with Blizzard after (not because of) WC3 and D2, stop wasting your life. So little sympathy for the abused harem of housewives Blizzard has that support his nasty lifestyle~ BW might even become abandonware if Blizzard starts having to live on the streets. Although I really don't want to attribute BW to the current Blizzard. It is more like some filthy cockroach killed Blizzard and wore its skin as a suit. | ||
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Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
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jpak
United States5045 Posts
Men in Black? God I wish I had a neuralizer so I can forget all about SC2 and D3 | ||
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Randomaccount#77123
United States5003 Posts
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