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Useless Friends(contains ranting)

Blogs > Praetorial
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Praetorial
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States4241 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-28 03:37:21
June 27 2012 18:17 GMT
#1
...are fucking idiotic.
HEY GUYS THIS HAS BEEN RESOLVED YAY
Over the past three weeks, I have seen the worst parts of my friends come out when they think that they are doing good.

Just three weeks ago, I told one of my best friends that I had a crush on a girl and asked him for advice, as they are in a number of the same classes together. What happens? The next day, apparently he tells her that I like her, embellishing this with a number of other entirely false details that I never said. Compounding this, he also tells every single person in that class.

Today, one of my other good friends decides that now is the time for him to tell another member of my school's speech and debate team that I dislike their personality and ability to make sound decisions. While indeed I did say this, I told my friend to please not tell anyone else. And when I asked him his justification, he said "I'm just trying to make things more peaceful" MORE PEACEFUL?! How the fuck did he figure that? I had never made my feelings against this team member public, and my friend thinks that it is a brilliant idea for him to "broker peace" between us by telling this team member how much I "hate" them.

What the fuck motivates people that I've known for years to do something as fucking idiotic as making other people hate my and think that I am weird with not clear benefit?

Is it because they think they are doing the right thing? Or is it because they want to share this very sensitive information that I shared with them in confidence, just so they can do something with it and get personal closure?

Goddamnit, I'm not talking to them ever again. TL is literally the only place that I can talk about my personal life and feeling and not have people talking about it behind my back very single fucking day.

/rant

**
FOR GREAT JUSTICE! Bans for the ban gods!
Feartheguru
Profile Joined August 2011
Canada1334 Posts
June 27 2012 18:23 GMT
#2
Find better friends.
Don't sweat the petty stuff, don't pet the sweaty stuff.
Haze.884
Profile Joined July 2011
New Zealand192 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-27 18:25:37
June 27 2012 18:24 GMT
#3
I got back stabbed so many times in my life by 'friends'.
Saddest being my childhood friend leading the charge in bullying me at a summer camp that I used to go every year... and I invited him to it ..
Now, I never say anything that can be potentially bad to anyone... ( I once praised a guy, and somehow someone told him I was shittalking him -.-;; )

I think I have better friends now, but I still feel a bit paranoid about talking too much.
a
Praetorial
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States4241 Posts
June 27 2012 18:25 GMT
#4
On June 28 2012 03:23 Feartheguru wrote:
Find better friends.


Yeah, well these are the type that are normally awesome, so this was a huge what the fuck moment for me.
FOR GREAT JUSTICE! Bans for the ban gods!
micronesia
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States24768 Posts
June 27 2012 18:25 GMT
#5
If people have proven they can't keep things you tell them to themselves, then don't tell them anything. Whatever effect that has on your relationship with them, so be it.
ModeratorThere are animal crackers for people and there are people crackers for animals.
Praetorial
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States4241 Posts
June 27 2012 18:27 GMT
#6
On June 28 2012 03:25 micronesia wrote:
If people have proven they can't keep things you tell them to themselves, then don't tell them anything. Whatever effect that has on your relationship with them, so be it.


Normally they are good about it, though.
FOR GREAT JUSTICE! Bans for the ban gods!
Zvenn3n
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Sweden1196 Posts
June 27 2012 18:38 GMT
#7
That's low. Screw friends, who needs them anyway when we've got StarCraft?

Seriously though, as fear said, find better friends. Not everyone can keep secrets, so don't tell yours to too many.
itsjustatank
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Hong Kong9172 Posts
June 27 2012 18:39 GMT
#8
On June 28 2012 03:17 Praetorial wrote:
Today, one of my other good friends decides that now is the time for him to tell another member of my school's speech and debate team that I dislike their personality and ability to make sound decisions. While indeed I did say this, I told my friend to please not tell anyone else. And when I asked him his justification, he said "I'm just trying to make things more peaceful" MORE PEACEFUL?! How the fuck did he figure that? I had never made my feelings against this team member public, and my friend thinks that it is a brilliant idea for him to "broker peace" between us by telling this team member how much I "hate" them.


Ahh debate team drama... how nostalgic.

Just general advice: choose friends wisely, adhere to information security. Basically, keep your thoughts to yourself and don't confide in anyone if at all possible because gossip mills are ubiquitous.

In terms of impact though, as long as the person in question that you dislike isn't your partner it doesnt matter that much.
Photographer"nosotros estamos backamos" - setsuko
MrZemus
Profile Joined April 2011
United States3 Posts
June 27 2012 18:41 GMT
#9
I believe it was Benjamin Franklin that said, "Three can keep a secret, if two of them are dead".

Never tell anyone anything that you do not want broadcasted on the news. This is unfortunate, but it prevents little surprises like what you experienced from happening down the road.
Chill
Profile Blog Joined January 2005
Calgary25998 Posts
June 27 2012 18:41 GMT
#10
I think he likes her too and used that to embarass you to make himself look better by comparision. I wouldn't overreact, but I also wouldn't easily forget this if I was sharing information or thinking about helping him out in the future.
Moderator
Incze
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
Romania2058 Posts
June 27 2012 18:49 GMT
#11
Never tell anything too personal or accusative to anyone but the closest friends, this is a lesson you should've learned earlier in life.
Religion: Buckethead
Praetorial
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States4241 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-27 18:50:21
June 27 2012 18:49 GMT
#12
On June 28 2012 03:41 Chill wrote:
I think he likes her too and used that to embarass you to make himself look better by comparision. I wouldn't overreact, but I also wouldn't easily forget this if I was sharing information or thinking about helping him out in the future.


He's asexual.

See, that was shared in confidence, but because nobody knows my identity without digging, I can share it.
FOR GREAT JUSTICE! Bans for the ban gods!
Praetorial
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States4241 Posts
June 27 2012 18:50 GMT
#13
On June 28 2012 03:49 Incze wrote:
Never tell anything too personal or accusative to anyone but the closest friends, this is a lesson you should've learned earlier in life.


They are my closest friends.
FOR GREAT JUSTICE! Bans for the ban gods!
Thrill
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
2599 Posts
June 27 2012 18:54 GMT
#14
Your friends are weird.

Take a step back and reflect on whether you're weird too.

If yes, accept their shortcomings and embrace reality.

If no, find new friends.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-27 19:00:53
June 27 2012 19:00 GMT
#15
On June 28 2012 03:17 Praetorial wrote:


Goddamnit, I'm not talking to them ever again. TL is literally the only place that I can talk about my personal life and feeling and not have people talking about it behind my back very single fucking day.

/rant



Oh my god, I didn't even know this was here until GMarshal told me how bad you were talking shit about me before you edited it out! I can't believe you would talk about me like that in a blog!

j/k. <3
Praetorial
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States4241 Posts
June 27 2012 19:28 GMT
#16
On June 28 2012 03:38 Zvenn3n wrote:
That's low. Screw friends, who needs them anyway when we've got StarCraft?

Seriously though, as fear said, find better friends. Not everyone can keep secrets, so don't tell yours to too many.


I don't play Starcraft anymore.

I told them one each, and only two best friends.
FOR GREAT JUSTICE! Bans for the ban gods!
iamperfection
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9645 Posts
June 27 2012 19:30 GMT
#17
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?id=335358

Is it the same girl? If not im dissapointed you didnt come to us first.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=406168&currentpage=78#1551
Apom
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
France656 Posts
June 27 2012 19:36 GMT
#18
High school drama blogs never disappoint.
Praetorial
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States4241 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-27 19:37:21
June 27 2012 19:36 GMT
#19
On June 28 2012 04:30 iamperfection wrote:
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?id=335358

Is it the same girl? If not im dissapointed you didnt come to us first.


Yes. And do note that I was sorta about to act on the advice I got there a few weeks ago, but I asked my friend for some last minute advice, and then he proceeded to fuck things up.

On June 28 2012 04:36 Apom wrote:
High school drama blogs never disappoint.


Yes, well, thank you. I actually do care about this. How so very encouraging and helpful.
FOR GREAT JUSTICE! Bans for the ban gods!
Ahzz
Profile Joined May 2007
Finland780 Posts
June 27 2012 20:53 GMT
#20
I've found that it's quite typical for people to try to boost their own status at the expense of others. In the first case there's a decent chance that he, like chill said, likes the girl too. Or that deep down he doesn't like you at all. Or that he's extremely simple minded and stupid (quite probable, especially in high school). For the second dude he just wanted to get points in the eyes of other people at your expense.

These sort of people are all around us, especially at a younger age but even after that too. The best you can do is ignore them/not trust them anymore
Vul
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States685 Posts
June 27 2012 21:07 GMT
#21
On June 28 2012 03:39 itsjustatank wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 28 2012 03:17 Praetorial wrote:
Today, one of my other good friends decides that now is the time for him to tell another member of my school's speech and debate team that I dislike their personality and ability to make sound decisions. While indeed I did say this, I told my friend to please not tell anyone else. And when I asked him his justification, he said "I'm just trying to make things more peaceful" MORE PEACEFUL?! How the fuck did he figure that? I had never made my feelings against this team member public, and my friend thinks that it is a brilliant idea for him to "broker peace" between us by telling this team member how much I "hate" them.


Ahh debate team drama... how nostalgic.

Just general advice: choose friends wisely, adhere to information security. Basically, keep your thoughts to yourself and don't confide in anyone if at all possible because gossip mills are ubiquitous.

In terms of impact though, as long as the person in question that you dislike isn't your partner it doesnt matter that much.


IMO, even though this advice may have been given sincerely in order to help you, it would probably harm you more than it would help.

The idea of keeping everything to yourself has a certain appeal that I understand, especially when it's something as inconsequential as a crush. In fact, I'm often guilty of not sharing problems with people that are close to me even when I should, for some of us that's just a product of our personalities, for different reasons.

But when you're going through something more difficult, especially later in life, you'll definitely regret not having people to talk to. You might feel like it's not worth it, but at some point you'll want to get advice or encouragement from people who have a different, less skewed perspective.

If you feel negative emotions--anxiety, guilt, frustration, anger, etc. your friends can help redirect your thoughts more positively by providing insights that you may not have thought of. They can help break patterns in thought or perspectives on events that lead to further negative emotions.

A really straight forward example; let's say you're inexperienced with women--not assuming that you are in real life, but as a hypothetical. Seeing or interacting with this girl you have a crush on could be a cue for anxiety, because you may feel like you'd be awkward in conversation, etc. If you keep it to yourself, you're likely to stagnate and not talk to the girl because it's difficult to reassure yourself about something with which you have little experience. Unexamined feelings of anxiety lead to not talking to the girl, which leads to guilt for not doing so.

Again, the more serious the problem, the more serious the potential impact of not expressing it to anyone. My advice is that you shouldn't aspire to keeping everything to yourself, you just need to develop friendships with people who are mature and trustworthy. That may not happen right now, but college will be different than high school. Don't listen to advice which tells you it isn't possible or even probable to have friends who won't betray your trust.
Chill
Profile Blog Joined January 2005
Calgary25998 Posts
June 27 2012 21:24 GMT
#22
On June 28 2012 03:49 Praetorial wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 28 2012 03:41 Chill wrote:
I think he likes her too and used that to embarass you to make himself look better by comparision. I wouldn't overreact, but I also wouldn't easily forget this if I was sharing information or thinking about helping him out in the future.


He's asexual.

Check this post in a year.
Moderator
PanN
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States2828 Posts
June 27 2012 21:27 GMT
#23
One really useful piece of advice I've gotten is, don't say something about somebody unless you would say it to their face. If you kept the comment you originally said to yourself, you wouldn't be in the situation. Yes your friend sucks, hes not a friend. But definitely be prepared if you say shit about somebody, its possible that they'll find out.
We have multiple brackets generated in advance. Relax . (Kennigit) I just simply do not understand how it can be the time to play can be 22nd at 9:30 pm PST / midnight the 23rd at the same time. (GGzerg)
docvoc
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States5491 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-27 21:39:52
June 27 2012 21:39 GMT
#24
I feel like we all go through this at some point, our friends fuck up so hard you can't even understand why you were friends in the first place, but eventually everything returns to normal. If you can, voice why what they did annoyed you and that might help.

HOLY FUCKING 1000'th post LOL.
User was warned for too many mimes.
Alpino
Profile Joined June 2011
Brazil4390 Posts
June 27 2012 21:41 GMT
#25
Gotta weed them out asap, my friends never did this kind of thing, but I was always VERY selective with my friends(many times I don't go out with my real friends because one person I don't think is any good is going), nowadays I can say I have 7ish good buddies I could trust anything with,
20/11/2015 - never forget EE's Ember
P7GAB
Profile Joined June 2012
Canada486 Posts
June 27 2012 21:58 GMT
#26
that actually sucks, bitch them out
bibilisk
Profile Joined May 2011
France44 Posts
June 27 2012 22:10 GMT
#27
looks like you are not friend with the right people
iTzSnypah
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States1738 Posts
June 27 2012 23:25 GMT
#28
The solution to all your problems: Apathy.

If you care soo much about this to make a blog about friends on Teamliquid then this girl is out of your league. I've had the same EXACT thing happen to me. In 9th grade my bestfriend (a girl) told my crush that I liked her (I'm thinking because my bestfriends bestfriend had a huge crush on me) and then I found out at lunch. I didn't freak the fuck out. I played it off as no big deal and guess what? Two weeks later she's my girlfriend.

TL:DR: Don't give a fuck, it will get you far.
Team Liquid needs more Terrans.
Yoshi Kirishima
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States10366 Posts
June 27 2012 23:28 GMT
#29
On June 28 2012 03:38 Zvenn3n wrote:
That's low. Screw friends, who needs them anyway when we've got StarCraft?

Seriously though, as fear said, find better friends. Not everyone can keep secrets, so don't tell yours to too many.


Who needs them anyway when we've got TL? :D
Mid-master streaming MECH ONLY + commentary www.twitch.tv/yoshikirishima +++ "If all-in fails, all-in again."
Iranon
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States983 Posts
June 27 2012 23:47 GMT
#30
See, here's the thing. Your high school friends are just that. High school friends. You'll keep in touch with a few of them once you all go your separate collegiate ways, and probably beyond, at your discretion. Everyone else, you'll never see or hear from again. So if it bothers you enough right now that you don't mind losing the friendship, bitch them out about it and see how it goes. Maybe they'll see it your way and you'll smooth things over, and maybe they won't and you'll walk away minus one dick-ish friend. If that's not something you want to risk right now, sit tight, and when you graduate, you'll either have gotten over it, or you can silently wipe them off your social calendar.

People about to graduate from high school always imagine it's this big emotionally taxing ordeal where their wonderful lives are being torn apart by the big bad world, but then three months later everyone gets to college and realizes that leaving high school behind and not looking back is fucking awesome, because now you're free to find better shit to do and find better friends to hang out with.

Also, LOL at Chill's second post in this blog.
OhThatDang
Profile Joined August 2004
United States4685 Posts
June 27 2012 23:48 GMT
#31
wtf this is highschool right T___T I've never heard of such betrayels sheesh
troi oi thang map nai!!!
Cyber_Cheese
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Australia3615 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-28 00:51:12
June 28 2012 00:41 GMT
#32
Maybe he can tell she's into you, but you can't see that, so he reassured her that you are in fact interested?
Resolve your standing with the lady, and then see how you feel about the first friend.
As for the second, do you really care about that random guy? The chances are he doesn't care what you think of him.

On June 28 2012 06:24 Chill wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 28 2012 03:49 Praetorial wrote:
On June 28 2012 03:41 Chill wrote:
I think he likes her too and used that to embarass you to make himself look better by comparision. I wouldn't overreact, but I also wouldn't easily forget this if I was sharing information or thinking about helping him out in the future.


He's asexual.

Check this post in a year.

He's most definitely not asexual, he just hasn't found any girls he's into, isn't out of the closet, or a combination of both.
The moment you lose confidence in yourself, is the moment the world loses it's confidence in you.
Praetorial
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States4241 Posts
June 28 2012 01:42 GMT
#33
On June 28 2012 09:41 Cyber_Cheese wrote:
Maybe he can tell she's into you, but you can't see that, so he reassured her that you are in fact interested?
Resolve your standing with the lady, and then see how you feel about the first friend.
As for the second, do you really care about that random guy? The chances are he doesn't care what you think of him.

Show nested quote +
On June 28 2012 06:24 Chill wrote:
On June 28 2012 03:49 Praetorial wrote:
On June 28 2012 03:41 Chill wrote:
I think he likes her too and used that to embarass you to make himself look better by comparision. I wouldn't overreact, but I also wouldn't easily forget this if I was sharing information or thinking about helping him out in the future.


He's asexual.

Check this post in a year.

He's most definitely not asexual, he just hasn't found any girls he's into, isn't out of the closet, or a combination of both.


Oh no he's asexual, I've known him my entire life.

It's pretty darn obvious.
FOR GREAT JUSTICE! Bans for the ban gods!
Anacletus
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
United States733 Posts
June 28 2012 01:46 GMT
#34
5/5 because I like you and hope you get through this.
http://talk-to-stimey-please.1324083.n2.nabble.com/
Praetorial
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States4241 Posts
June 28 2012 02:16 GMT
#35
On June 28 2012 10:46 Anacletus wrote:
5/5 because I like you and hope you get through this.


Thanks, friend.
FOR GREAT JUSTICE! Bans for the ban gods!
Mstring
Profile Joined September 2011
Australia510 Posts
June 28 2012 02:22 GMT
#36
On June 28 2012 03:17 Praetorial wrote:
What the fuck motivates people that I've known for years to do something as fucking idiotic as making other people hate my and think that I am weird with not clear benefit?

Is it because they think they are doing the right thing? Or is it because they want to share this very sensitive information that I shared with them in confidence, just so they can do something with it and get personal closure?


If you truly want the answers, ask your friends the above questions directly.

Regardless; would you really miss the company of someone who 'hates' via mere hearsay?

On June 28 2012 03:17 Praetorial wrote:
Goddamnit, I'm not talking to them ever again. TL is literally the only place that I can talk about my personal life and feeling and not have people talking about it behind my back very single fucking day.

Yet here you are talking about your friends behind their backs, and telling us how you talk about other people behind their backs ("I dislike their personality and ability to make sound decisions"). Poetic justice I say

You know the solution: never say anything about anyone you wouldn't say to their face. That, and telling THEM everything you wrote here. If, when people do things you don't like, you don't reflect back to them your honest feelings, you'll keep getting what you're getting. Honesty never costs you anything worthwhile.
Kh0rne
Profile Joined June 2011
Australia85 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-28 03:34:04
June 28 2012 03:31 GMT
#37
ok, i'm "abrasive" i believe the word is. so dont get all hurt or whatever, i dont really care anyways.


get the fuck over it, it doesn't matter. everyone (you and your friends included) has stupid days where they screw things up

your friend telling the girl that you like her was doing you a favour anyways. dont be such a pussy next time and tell the girl instead of your stupid friend.

your friend telling the debate person that you "dislike" them. so fucking what? cry more.
Either apologise and try to get along with this person, or tell them they are an assclown but you will make an effort to be civil if they will too. or get in a fistfight i guess (punch him first, the person who punches the other dude first usually wins)

basically stop being such a pussy & tell people to their face. or keep those thoughts to yourself.
dont go bitching about people to your friends.
Praetorial
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States4241 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-28 03:40:43
June 28 2012 03:37 GMT
#38
HEY GUYS THIS HAS BEEN RESOLVED YAY


On June 28 2012 12:31 Kh0rne wrote:
ok, i'm "abrasive" i believe the word is. so dont get all hurt or whatever, i dont really care anyways.


get the fuck over it, it doesn't matter. everyone (you and your friends included) has stupid days where they screw things up

your friend telling the girl that you like her was doing you a favour anyways. dont be such a pussy next time and tell the girl instead of your stupid friend.

your friend telling the debate person that you "dislike" them. so fucking what? cry more.
Either apologise and try to get along with this person, or tell them they are an assclown but you will make an effort to be civil if they will too. or get in a fistfight i guess (punch him first, the person who punches the other dude first usually wins)

basically stop being such a pussy & tell people to their face. or keep those thoughts to yourself.
dont go bitching about people to your friends.


Okay. You're abrasive, and honest. But I'm also going to sorta kinda warn you about that.

Not because your advice isn't good, it's most b/c the highlighted bits show that you kinda didn't read the whole thing.

Next time I write a crying blog, I'll remember to let you know.
FOR GREAT JUSTICE! Bans for the ban gods!
Kh0rne
Profile Joined June 2011
Australia85 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-28 04:01:33
June 28 2012 04:00 GMT
#39
so, how was it all resolved?


i'm kinda hoping it was the fistfight
Praetorial
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States4241 Posts
June 28 2012 05:03 GMT
#40
On June 28 2012 13:00 Kh0rne wrote:
so, how was it all resolved?


i'm kinda hoping it was the fistfight


nah
FOR GREAT JUSTICE! Bans for the ban gods!
The_LiNk
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Canada863 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-28 05:07:48
June 28 2012 05:07 GMT
#41
Didn't have many friends in HS, most people too stupid. Didn't have to deal with first world problems.

Although I did watch people have first world problems in 1st year university. First year first few months are great as you watch people try to find friends. This stuff happens a lot during that period as people talk about other people they've met at the school. You'll have this sort of fun all over again.
QuanticHawk
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States32132 Posts
June 28 2012 14:53 GMT
#42
On June 28 2012 06:24 Chill wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 28 2012 03:49 Praetorial wrote:
On June 28 2012 03:41 Chill wrote:
I think he likes her too and used that to embarass you to make himself look better by comparision. I wouldn't overreact, but I also wouldn't easily forget this if I was sharing information or thinking about helping him out in the future.


He's asexual.

Check this post in a year.

loooool, beaten to the punch. Dude's trying to get it in!
PROFESSIONAL GAMER - SEND ME OFFERS TO JOIN YOUR TEAM - USA USA USA
Zorkmid
Profile Joined November 2008
4410 Posts
June 28 2012 15:24 GMT
#43
Those dudes aren't your friends. Sorry man.
Aerisky
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
United States12129 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-29 04:26:04
June 29 2012 04:24 GMT
#44
On June 28 2012 23:53 Hawk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 28 2012 06:24 Chill wrote:
On June 28 2012 03:49 Praetorial wrote:
On June 28 2012 03:41 Chill wrote:
I think he likes her too and used that to embarass you to make himself look better by comparision. I wouldn't overreact, but I also wouldn't easily forget this if I was sharing information or thinking about helping him out in the future.


He's asexual.

Check this post in a year.

loooool, beaten to the punch. Dude's trying to get it in!

Hahaha Chill is amazing.

I forgot you were actually only a rising sophomore in high school because you write somewhat pretentiously (sophomorically? ), no offense. To be fair, you're in high school...where some of the shit kids pull makes absolutely no sense. Call it hormones (seriously, check that post in a year) or just human stupidity, but in general high schoolers are total idiots--more or less so than adults is actually debatable but really. It sucks though, I know the feeling of being backstabbed by people you thought were very close to you.

Basically don't forget this; you say it has never happened before but trust is something built over a long time yet takes only a moment to destroy. Forgive but don't forget imho.
Jim while Johnny had had had had had had had; had had had had the better effect on the teacher.
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