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My employer treats us like shit.
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LambtrOn
United States671 Posts
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Rad
United States935 Posts
I don't know what legal moves you can make on the business but I would guess there are none. I've never heard of yelling at someone being against the law. Leave on a positive note and go get another job. Don't make the mistake of telling them to F off because your future employers may contact them. Just do yourself a favor and move on quietly. If everyone did that, they wouldn't have a business because no one would work for them. | ||
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LambtrOn
United States671 Posts
On December 10 2011 17:09 Rad wrote: I won't say "just find another job" because that suggests it's easy. I will say "find another job" because that's what you need to do in this case. If you NEED the job, then start applying everywhere. McDonalds, Target, Walmart, the gas station, etc. If those jobs seem less appealing than getting verbally abused at work, then reconsider your stance on how bad it is. I don't know what legal moves you can make on the business but I would guess there are none. I've never heard of yelling at someone being against the law. Leave on a positive note and go get another job. Don't make the mistake of telling them to F off because your future employers may contact them. Just do yourself a favor and move on quietly. If everyone did that, they wouldn't have a business because no one would work for them. Perhaps not yelling, but swearing at employees is a serious no no. There are labor laws that should protect us. We have rights as employees. And normally I would just move on, but I feel so strongly about this. I can't let it go. | ||
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Rad
United States935 Posts
On December 10 2011 17:11 LambtrOn wrote: Perhaps not yelling, but swearing at employees is a serious no no. There are labor laws that should protect us. We have rights as employees. And normally I would just move on, but I feel so strongly about this. I can't let it go. Like I said, I'm no expert on the law so maybe there is something there to protect you from this. However, I doubt it, unless it dips into something serious like sexual harassment or racism. With that said, I still recommend that what's best for you is to just move on and better yourself with a new job. Try not to waste time on people who are worthless and just worry about bettering yourself. | ||
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Trowabarton756
United States870 Posts
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Rad
United States935 Posts
On December 10 2011 17:19 Trowabarton756 wrote: Hostile Work Environment Doesn't appear to match this description: http://www.fcc.gov/encyclopedia/understanding-workplace-harassment-fcc-staff Hostile work environment harassment occurs when unwelcome comments or conduct based on sex, race or other legally protected characteristics unreasonably interferes with an employee’s work performance or creates an intimidating, hostile or offensive work environment. Not sure what falls under "other legally protected characteristics" though. Also, this... What is Not Harassment? The anti-discrimination statutes are not a general civility code. Thus, federal law does not prohibit simple teasing, offhand comments, or isolated incidents that are not extremely serious. Rather, the conduct must be so objectively offensive as to alter the conditions of the individual’s employment. The conditions of employment are altered only if the harassment culminates in a tangible employment action or is sufficiently severe or pervasive to create a hostile work environment. Report any incident of harassment immediately to your supervisor, any member of management and/or to the Director of the Office of Workplace Diversity. ...suggests that as described, the situation would have to be deemed "sufficiently severe or pervasive", which would probably take some high level lawyer work. | ||
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LambtrOn
United States671 Posts
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Rad
United States935 Posts
Just realize if you do something like that, if they go hire a bunch of other people, you're out of a job and out of a reference. Your choice though, could be fun/rewarding XD | ||
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LambtrOn
United States671 Posts
On December 10 2011 17:31 Rad wrote: You'd be surprised how quickly people will change when you put their business at jeopardy Just realize if you do something like that, if they go hire a bunch of other people, you're out of a job and out of a reference. Your choice though, could be fun/rewarding XD Yep. I'm fully aware of the consequences. I'd line something up first. Trust me. It's worth it. The turn over rate is so high. They would struggle to fill those jobs in a timely manner. Only problem is I don't really want to hurt the people that can't afford to quit and just need to job. Tricky little scenario. | ||
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TheAntZ
Israel6248 Posts
On December 10 2011 17:29 LambtrOn wrote: This is unfortunate. I guess we'll just have to plan a mass walk out Be careful the others dont backstab you and decide to just stick it out! It sucks what some people can get away with, but what he is doing is technically not illegal, afaik | ||
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Frozenhelfire
United States420 Posts
On December 10 2011 17:11 LambtrOn wrote: Perhaps not yelling, but swearing at employees is a serious no no. There are labor laws that should protect us. We have rights as employees. And normally I would just move on, but I feel so strongly about this. I can't let it go. I don't think I would want to work in a place where I couldn't throw out the occasional fuck or shit. People take swear words way to seriously. Maybe my work is a lot more laid back than most. During Veteran's Day my co-workers had beers during lunch. One of them took out a gun and we had a lot of fun taking it apart and talking about different kinds of bullets. Afterwards we left early and my boss took some circular pieces of cardboard on which to test the choke of his new shotgun. I personally just went home for the day, but I find that kind of an environment a lot of fun. I guess it would be different in a more hostile environment, but saying fuck and bitch doesn't make the workplace hostile. The context and meaning behind the words makes the place hostile. | ||
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LambtrOn
United States671 Posts
On December 10 2011 17:48 Frozenhelfire wrote: I don't think I would want to work in a place where I couldn't throw out the occasional fuck or shit. People take swear words way to seriously. Maybe my work is a lot more laid back than most. During Veteran's Day my co-workers had beers during lunch. One of them took out a gun and we had a lot of fun taking it apart and talking about different kinds of bullets. Afterwards we left early and my boss took some circular pieces of cardboard on which to test the choke of his new shotgun. I personally just went home for the day, but I find that kind of an environment a lot of fun. I guess it would be different in a more hostile environment, but saying fuck and bitch doesn't make the workplace hostile. The context and meaning behind the words makes the place hostile. There's lot of caual swearing which I have no problem with. It's the, "Get your fucking head in the game!" "How many fucking things are we going to fuck up tonight?" That's the stuff I have a problem with. | ||
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Pawsom
United States928 Posts
On December 10 2011 17:48 Frozenhelfire wrote: I don't think I would want to work in a place where I couldn't throw out the occasional fuck or shit. People take swear words way to seriously. Maybe my work is a lot more laid back than most. During Veteran's Day my co-workers had beers during lunch. One of them took out a gun and we had a lot of fun taking it apart and talking about different kinds of bullets. Afterwards we left early and my boss took some circular pieces of cardboard on which to test the choke of his new shotgun. I personally just went home for the day, but I find that kind of an environment a lot of fun. I guess it would be different in a more hostile environment, but saying fuck and bitch doesn't make the workplace hostile. The context and meaning behind the words makes the place hostile. You realize there's a huge difference between searing, and swearing at someone? | ||
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Excomm
United States152 Posts
I don't know your particular situation, but I'll say what works for me in these situations. If you don't feel you are performing up to the bosses' standards, then you probably aren't confident enough to confront him and you might lose your job because of it. In this case if you can't stand the job, then try to find a new job while showing up to work. As long as you show up and do something, then you should feel secure about your job. If you feel you have been contributing more than the other employees then I would confront the boss and ask him if he would consider talking to you about a pay raise or a promotion. You will immediately be able to tell how much your work is valued by his/her reaction. If they go off on you then you will never get anything out of your job anyway, so best to look for another one. If the boss values you as an employee then they might be willing to negotiate with you. Keep in mind that an employer can pretty much do whatever they want to you at your job because they are paying you money to be there and do what they want (as long as it is not illegal). If they want to yell at you they can because they are paying you to be yelled at and wasting their own money by doing so (I find it to be hilarious). What you are describing is not an unusual situation in the workplace. If you really need the money and have no other options, you should suck it up and hope that it gets better. If it doesn't and you can't stand your job, then look for another one. Protesting or walking out is unlikely to change anything. Keep in mind that there are plenty of other people that are willing to pay for your time and you should use it you see fit. | ||
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LambtrOn
United States671 Posts
On December 10 2011 18:02 Excomm wrote: I've had 2 or 3 bosses that think they can run a business through intimidation. Some people do it because they think they are paying their workers too much for what they do. Other people do it because they think it makes it easy for them to keep the employees down and so that they will not ask for raises. I don't know your particular situation, but I'll say what works for me in these situations. If you don't feel you are performing up to the bosses' standards, then you probably aren't confident enough to confront him and you might lose your job because of it. In this case if you can't stand the job, then try to find a new job while showing up to work. As long as you show up and do something, then you should feel secure about your job. If you feel you have been contributing more than the other employees then I would confront the boss and ask him if he would consider talking to you about a pay raise or a promotion. You will immediately be able to tell how much your work is valued by his/her reaction. If they go off on you then you will never get anything out of your job anyway, so best to look for another one. If the boss values you as an employee then they might be willing to negotiate with you. Keep in mind that an employer can pretty much do whatever they want to you at your job because they are paying you money to be there and do what they want (as long as it is not illegal). If they want to yell at you they can because they are paying you to be yelled at and wasting their own money by doing so (I find it to be hilarious). What you are describing is not an unusual situation in the workplace. If you really need the money and have no other options, you should suck it up and hope that it gets better. If it doesn't and you can't stand your job, then look for another one. Protesting or walking out is unlikely to change anything. Keep in mind that there are plenty of other people that are willing to pay for your time and you should use it you see fit. This is some damn good advice. Thank you. I'm personally treated really, really well. The GM really likes me. I'm kind of his go to guy for my position. I actually can't get any more raises. I'm at the cap. He actually raised the cap 2 months ago. Didn't even think that was possible. But it really, really, really bothers me to hear someone else get yelled it. We increase our sales dramatically in the summer and that means more employees which means more managers. They usually look for good employees to hire as summer managers. I could always ask. I think I do a really good job (swt brg bro). But seriously, I have put a lot of time and effort into this job. If I do something, I want to do it right. So I think I'll see how things go for a bit and then ask. Maybe not for an answer, but as you said, just to see the reaction. This has also got me thinking about me talking to him about his anger. That is definitely just an idea right now. Not sure my standing with him is good enough. The man scares me, to be honest. I would definitely need some help on how to approach that. The manager of my position and I have a very strong relationship. She is actually not part of the family. I've talked to her before about this and she completely understands. Pretty sure she needs the job though. I could ask her if she thinks that a good idea. I also wanna say I really appreciate all the response! thank you! | ||
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Frozenhelfire
United States420 Posts
On December 10 2011 18:02 Pawsom wrote: You realize there's a huge difference between searing, and swearing at someone? From my post, no. The difference really depends on the context and meaning of what is being said. "Swear" words are merely different words. The actual message is what is important. You can say nice things with swear words and incredibly mean things without swear words. | ||
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nttea
Sweden4353 Posts
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LambtrOn
United States671 Posts
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Terranist
United States2496 Posts
On December 10 2011 18:27 nttea wrote: I would tell him to stop being a fucking ass, if not for my sake then for his shitty restaurant's. Then keep talking back to him whenever he's a dick until he either gets it or fires me. Don't do what i do though im unemployed. it's not that simple. being fired means you can't even use your former employer as a reference. there isn't much of a choice for the OP. either search for another job while toughing it out in that shithole or take it. unskilled workers are easily replaced and hence don't have much power in those matters. | ||
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LambtrOn
United States671 Posts
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munchmunch
Canada789 Posts
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Myrtroll
139 Posts
Going behind their backs like you are thinking about will probably just make them more angry at you, and have a huge chance of backfiring on yourself depending on circumstances. You really should try to open up a dialogue or something first, maybe they are under a lot of stress and just aren't thinking right. (as you mentioned times are tough, not just for jobs, for restaurants as well) I get that you probably want some sort of payback after being yelled at, but stuff like this needs to be sorted with reason, or you just end up in a yelling match that nobody wins. So calming down and discussing it first is probably your best option. If that doesn't work I would look for other opportunities instead, it's generally not worth the trouble going all the way looking for law breaking stuff and making a fuss. | ||
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MrBitter
United States2940 Posts
You're looking for some sort of legal measure to take against your employer because you feel like he's too much of a hardass? Are you kidding? Is this your first job, or something? If you don't like the work environment, then leave. If you don't want to leave, then man up and talk to your boss. He'll either say a.) Go fuck yourself (which is probably what I would say. His house, his rules) b.) Or that he'll try to be nicer But no matter what you do, you're going to be putting yourself on his radar, which is not going to make your working life any easier than it is right now. | ||
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HeavOnEarth
United States7087 Posts
I make a decent wage that I wouldn't make anywhere else Yeah, it sounds like he treats you like shit.... also +1 to everything mrbitter said , couldn't' have put it better myself, wtf? | ||
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bellweather
United States404 Posts
OR you can go the alternative that most people take: keep it bottled up until you find another job/get fired and tell your boss to go fuck himself with some large object. | ||
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Servius_Fulvius
United States947 Posts
On December 10 2011 21:15 MrBitter wrote: Dude, wtf? You're looking for some sort of legal measure to take against your employer because you feel like he's too much of a hardass? Are you kidding? Is this your first job, or something? If you don't like the work environment, then leave. If you don't want to leave, then man up and talk to your boss. He'll either say a.) Go fuck yourself (which is probably what I would say. His house, his rules) b.) Or that he'll try to be nicer But no matter what you do, you're going to be putting yourself on his radar, which is not going to make your working life any easier than it is right now. Yes, yes and YES! Welcome to the real world. Not every boss is a golden piece of sunshine, uplifting, or even nice. I'm a grad student and my boss is a total jerk. Never received a compliment, get yelled at once or twice a week, constantly made to feel like I know nothing or made a bad choice, he says bad things about other students to us/other faculty, trash talks other faculty in the department in front of us, is incredibly arrogant, and, all around, not a good or nice person at work. Want to know the funny thing? This is NOTHING compared to how things were 30-40 years ago before the bosses started getting sued. Just because they're "the boss" doesn't mean they have to be nice, mature, or even give a crap that you exist. He's there to manage all of you to make money most efficiently. Another example: my ex-girlfriend was working at an Arby's as a low level manager. The store manager was an ex-marine who was profiled as a serial killer. I guess he was proud about that and talked about it a lot. He constantly verbally harassed employees and at one point dragged one of them out of the stock freezer by her ankle. Ok, now we have assault. When my ex decided to quit she called upper management and reported all his actions. Interestingly, he was fired a week later. But it wasn't because he was a bully who treated his employees like garbage, it's because he was deleting their overtime hours, something that could have gotten him sued by the company. You said yourself that your manager created an atmosphere of fear. Sadly, this is a very effective tool to get the productivity they desire. If you don't like it then quit. | ||
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lantz
United States762 Posts
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THE_DOMINATOR
United States309 Posts
On December 11 2011 00:48 needcomputer wrote: be happy you have a job! No. This is what you can do. Start searching for another job on the side. If that looks like its going nowhere then you can get all the employees together(I assume they all feel like this) and have a sit down with the boss man. If that fails you can try and get your customers involved and make it known to your boss that your customers don't like it when he verbally abuses his employees. Of course you could also hire a lawyer and go after him for harassment which at best will get you a couple thousand, and probably fired? | ||
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Enki
United States2548 Posts
On December 11 2011 00:48 needcomputer wrote: be happy you have a job! He is supposed to be happy he is being verbally abused all day at work? are you shitting me? Sadly you have no recourse I think. Only option is the either talk to the manager and convince him to stop being a prick to his employees, or leave | ||
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jamesr12
United States1549 Posts
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Snuggles
United States1865 Posts
For some reason there's a lot of employees who are like, when they don't like something they do whatever they can to find some legal issue in the way the business is run and attack it relentlessly. These people never hold a job for too long. | ||
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Golden Ghost
Netherlands1041 Posts
Don't attack him on his behavior but on how it negatively influences the rest and most importantly the business. For example, I can't imagine that if the 16 year old was really shaken by the yelling he got he could do a decent job for some time that day. Try to have him see how that isn't good for business and how if he does that to everybody it creates a negative spiral in which nobody wants to go the extra mile or comes to work smiling. A yelling now and again isn't such a bad thing and can really shake things up and keep everybody on their toes, but a yelling every hour isn't effective anymore. How to specifically approach him I can't say as I don't know your boss personally so that's something you have to decide for yourself. Perhaps a few subtle hints might work better but that's for you to decide. But whatever you do always stay respectful and polite. If he's a reasonable guy he might even set up a team meeting to talk about it but if not there's not much else you can do about it. Setting up a strike or something in this kind of family owned business is imo one of the worst things you can do. Confronted with that he will probably not back down and rather fire you all. There's always a chance (although very unlikely, I'll admit) he doesn't even realize the impact of his behavior or just can't help himself. If he can't help himself it might help the personnel to know he doesn't mean it as harsh as it sounds. | ||
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Golden Ghost
Netherlands1041 Posts
On December 11 2011 00:44 Servius_Fulvius wrote: You said yourself that your manager created an atmosphere of fear. Sadly, this is a very effective tool to get the productivity they desire. If you don't like it then quit. This is such crap. Bosses like to think this is true but in reality it simply doesn't work like that. The more scared you are the less your productivity is. A bit scared might help the productivity but there is a threshold. If you cross that and you employees don't like coming to their job anymore the productivity plummets. No matter how badly they need their job. This isn't even something the employees might do on purpose or even realize themselves but the simple fact is that if you have to think all the time about what terrible things will happen if you make even the tiniest mistake you just work slower and without any initiative. | ||
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blah_blah
346 Posts
I'm not blaming you, or saying that the owner and his son are not in the wrong, but you should realize that trying to discuss this with your owner or the owner's son like a rational, decent human being is very likely to have negative repercussions with regards to your continued employment. If you seriously want to escalate this and pursue damages for a hostile work environment or something similar you will want to contact a lawyer who works in labor law. This will certainly damage beyond repair the working relationship you have with the owner and with his son. Your best course of action, if you need the money and cannot afford to quit, is to keep your head down and to look for alternate employment in the meantime. I am not a lawyer. I am not your lawyer. | ||
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Diamond
United States10796 Posts
I'm 99.9999999999999999% sure there is nothing illegal about this, and you just need to find a new job or possibly realize in stressful work environments sometimes people get mad........ Seriously like Bitter said, is this your first job? I'm totally baffled by this whole thread.... | ||
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buickskylark
Canada664 Posts
If you want to talk about employers with an anger problem then we should talk about mine. He's constantly talking shit about one of the guy's wife saying stuff like she's no good, basically calling her a whore, and trickling down to her kid (his step son). And everyday he's talking shit about everyone. | ||
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NewbieOne
Poland560 Posts
On December 11 2011 09:29 Diamond wrote: If I sued every employer that got mad at me and swore, I'd have to had to sue every employer I have ever had. I'm 99.9999999999999999% sure there is nothing illegal about this, and you just need to find a new job or possibly realize in stressful work environments sometimes people get mad........ Seriously like Bitter said, is this your first job? I'm totally baffled by this whole thread.... Actually, yelling abuse at someone is illegal regardless whether you're his employer or not. Employee abuse is perfectly illegal, it's just that some business owners and managers don't care or don't know or they think they're above the system (and business does tend to promote psychos into management positions because they make good slave drivers). Workers don't know, hence they don't do anything about it. | ||
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Hynda
Sweden2226 Posts
On December 11 2011 00:44 Servius_Fulvius wrote: Actually that is completly wrong if you run around afraid you'll never come close to the productivity of someone that has confident in what they are doing. If you use fear things will get done, but they will get done slowly and usually pretty damn poorly. Anyone whos been on the internet should be able to deal with these kinds of persons, they are weak small men that need to act big to hide the fact that they hate their life. . You said yourself that your manager created an atmosphere of fear. Sadly, this is a very effective tool to get the productivity they desire. If you don't like it then quit. | ||
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