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On July 09 2011 10:48 Bibbit wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2011 10:46 n.DieJokes wrote:
Can someone tell me about who the dominate players are and were and where some of the non grubby war3 players rising to prominence in sc2 came from? How good they were relatively and the korea/world balance Yes that is a nice question as well! I am interested. :D:D Also huge thanks to everyone who has answered questions so far. 
The Chinese player Li "Sky" XiaoFeng is/was one of the most successful wc3 player. He was elected in to the WCG Official Hall Of Fame by winning the wc3 championship 2005 and 2006.
The Korean players Moon, Lyn, Soccer all members of WMF was also quite good.
Lyn's earnings in WC3
Moon's earnings in WC3
Soccer's earnings in WC3
Arguably one of the best undead players was/is WE.TeD.
For people who havn't cheaked it out, go watch WCG 2009 WC3 Finals between Fly and Infi commentated by Rotterdam
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On July 09 2011 11:18 DemiSe wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2011 10:48 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 10:46 n.DieJokes wrote:
Can someone tell me about who the dominate players are and were and where some of the non grubby war3 players rising to prominence in sc2 came from? How good they were relatively and the korea/world balance Yes that is a nice question as well! I am interested. :D:D Also huge thanks to everyone who has answered questions so far. The Chinese player Li "Sky" XiaoFeng is/was one of the most successful wc3 player. He was elected in to the WCG Official Hall Of Fame by winning the wc3 championship 2005 and 2006. The Korean players Moon, Lyn, Soccer all members of WMF was also quite good. Lyn's earnings in WC3Moon's earnings in WC3Soccer's earnings in WC3Arguably one of the best undead players was/is WE.TeD. For people who havn't cheaked it out, go watch WCG 2009 WC3 Finals between Fly and Infi commentated by Rotterdam
Ooh that sk-gaming site you linked for the earnings has a pretty good player database! I can see what races my sc2 homeboys played in War 3!
Edit: I failed at quoting. All fixed now ^^
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+ Show Spoiler +On July 09 2011 11:23 Bibbit wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2011 11:18 DemiSe wrote:On July 09 2011 10:48 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 10:46 n.DieJokes wrote:
Can someone tell me about who the dominate players are and were and where some of the non grubby war3 players rising to prominence in sc2 came from? How good they were relatively and the korea/world balance Yes that is a nice question as well! I am interested. :D:D Also huge thanks to everyone who has answered questions so far. The Chinese player Li "Sky" XiaoFeng is/was one of the most successful wc3 player. He was elected in to the WCG Official Hall Of Fame by winning the wc3 championship 2005 and 2006. The Korean players Moon, Lyn, Soccer all members of WMF was also quite good. Lyn's earnings in WC3Moon's earnings in WC3Soccer's earnings in WC3Arguably one of the best undead players was/is WE.TeD. For people who havn't cheaked it out, go watch WCG 2009 WC3 Finals between Fly and Infi commentated by Rotterdam
Ooh that sk-gaming site you linked for the earnings has a pretty good player database! I can see what races my sc2 homeboys played in War 3!
Edit: I failed at quoting. All fixed now ^^
I have no idea how up-to-date the SK-gaming site is though. Every player profile I have looked at is outdated with "Current Team" and some other information. I hope the earnings is somewhat accurate.
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On July 09 2011 11:26 DemiSe wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On July 09 2011 11:23 Bibbit wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2011 11:18 DemiSe wrote:On July 09 2011 10:48 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 10:46 n.DieJokes wrote:
Can someone tell me about who the dominate players are and were and where some of the non grubby war3 players rising to prominence in sc2 came from? How good they were relatively and the korea/world balance Yes that is a nice question as well! I am interested. :D:D Also huge thanks to everyone who has answered questions so far. The Chinese player Li "Sky" XiaoFeng is/was one of the most successful wc3 player. He was elected in to the WCG Official Hall Of Fame by winning the wc3 championship 2005 and 2006. The Korean players Moon, Lyn, Soccer all members of WMF was also quite good. Lyn's earnings in WC3Moon's earnings in WC3Soccer's earnings in WC3Arguably one of the best undead players was/is WE.TeD. For people who havn't cheaked it out, go watch WCG 2009 WC3 Finals between Fly and Infi commentated by Rotterdam Ooh that sk-gaming site you linked for the earnings has a pretty good player database! I can see what races my sc2 homeboys played in War 3! Edit: I failed at quoting. All fixed now ^^ I have no idea how up-to-date the SK-gaming site is though. Every player profile I have looked at is outdated with "Current Team" and some other information. I hope the earnings is somewhat accurate.
Meh, I'm not particularly looking for super up-to-date info. I used it to check what races some people used and take guesses on how good someone was based on prize money. ^^
Thanks for showing it to me.
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On July 09 2011 11:18 DemiSe wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2011 10:48 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 10:46 n.DieJokes wrote:
Can someone tell me about who the dominate players are and were and where some of the non grubby war3 players rising to prominence in sc2 came from? How good they were relatively and the korea/world balance Yes that is a nice question as well! I am interested. :D:D Also huge thanks to everyone who has answered questions so far. The Chinese player Li "Sky" XiaoFeng is/was one of the most successful wc3 player. He was elected in to the WCG Official Hall Of Fame by winning the wc3 championship 2005 and 2006. The Korean players Moon, Lyn, Soccer all members of WMF was also quite good. Lyn's earnings in WC3Moon's earnings in WC3Soccer's earnings in WC3Arguably one of the best undead players was/is WE.TeD. For people who havn't cheaked it out, go watch WCG 2009 WC3 Finals between Fly and Infi commentated by Rotterdam
Haha, thank goodness someone posted some real WC3 pros. XD
Was getting worried that no one knew anybody, and I was gonna be the lone WC3 watcher. Granted everyone argues whether Lyn, Moon, Grubby, Sky are the best player, but basically those four were the kings. Think the TBLS of WC3
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On July 09 2011 10:02 Bibbit wrote:
1) This one I'm afraid to ask: Is it generally considered well-balanced? Or is there a race that a ton of people play or nobody really plays?
2) Is there some sort of community for the game? Of course not expecting anything on the level of the wonderful site that is TL but is there anything?
3) Do people still play this game? I don't necessarily mean a pro-scene as I'm not aspiring to be high level. Just wondering if I were to go on a War 3 server, if anyone would be there. >_>
4) How would I go about learning how the game works? For the time being I'm naturally not concerned about complex strategies or anything. I just genuinely dont know a thing about the game and have no clue what a "typical" game looks like.
Thank you very much for any help I can get. Forgive me if this was just a huge search function fail from me. :D:D:D
1) undead were pretty much shit. humans were fine. orcs blademaster was op but rest was fine. night elf was very hard to play but pretty fine. the MU that was the most balanced was probably NE vs orc but the game was generally extremely unbalanced.
2) some small, wasn't too involved with that when i played, only hung out in a couple chats really
3) you can still ladder but you meet a wide range of skill due too how few play
4) watching and analyzing pro replays worked for me to learn how to respond to certain builds
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On July 09 2011 11:38 Torenhire wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2011 11:18 DemiSe wrote:On July 09 2011 10:48 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 10:46 n.DieJokes wrote:
Can someone tell me about who the dominate players are and were and where some of the non grubby war3 players rising to prominence in sc2 came from? How good they were relatively and the korea/world balance Yes that is a nice question as well! I am interested. :D:D Also huge thanks to everyone who has answered questions so far. The Chinese player Li "Sky" XiaoFeng is/was one of the most successful wc3 player. He was elected in to the WCG Official Hall Of Fame by winning the wc3 championship 2005 and 2006. The Korean players Moon, Lyn, Soccer all members of WMF was also quite good. Lyn's earnings in WC3Moon's earnings in WC3Soccer's earnings in WC3Arguably one of the best undead players was/is WE.TeD. For people who havn't cheaked it out, go watch WCG 2009 WC3 Finals between Fly and Infi commentated by Rotterdam Haha, thank goodness someone posted some real WC3 pros. XD Was getting worried that no one knew anybody, and I was gonna be the lone WC3 watcher. Granted everyone argues whether Lyn, Moon, Grubby, Sky are the best player, but basically those four were the kings. Think the TBLS of WC3
I'm actually not even vaguely familiar with Sky. Is he the slightly worse one out of their TBLS? ^^
+ Show Spoiler + Like Stork 
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1) The game is decently balanced but there is some stuff that players on every level find quite shitty:
orc vs undead favors the orc significantly
as a human you will face problems against undead (but there aren't many anyway )
also a while ago orcs were complaining about night elf (Grubby's most famous quote: "playing NE vs Orcs is like shooting handicapped ducks in a barrel"), but I don't think that's the case anymore...
other than racial imbalance there is another issue with wc3. it's the items that creeps drop. On some maps the items dropped significantly favor blademaster and demon hunter play. Those two heroes become ridiculously strong very early (espicially the blademaster...) Also, there is that item some people refer to as "GG tome" (tome of experience). If your opponent lucks out and gets 2 "gg tomes" his heroes will be much stronger than yours...
2) The community has shrunk over the past few years but there are still some sites like http://www.wcreplays.com/
Also waaaghtv used to be a great tool to watch pro games live (often with some awesome commentary) but I don't know how many games are still being shown there.
3) There are still some people playing wc3, so you should be able to find opponents of all skill levels on bnet.
4) To get started, I'd recommend watching a 2-3 replays of every match up involving the race you want to play. This should be enough to learn the basic build orders and strategies.
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On July 09 2011 12:10 Bibbit wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2011 11:38 Torenhire wrote:On July 09 2011 11:18 DemiSe wrote:On July 09 2011 10:48 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 10:46 n.DieJokes wrote:
Can someone tell me about who the dominate players are and were and where some of the non grubby war3 players rising to prominence in sc2 came from? How good they were relatively and the korea/world balance Yes that is a nice question as well! I am interested. :D:D Also huge thanks to everyone who has answered questions so far. The Chinese player Li "Sky" XiaoFeng is/was one of the most successful wc3 player. He was elected in to the WCG Official Hall Of Fame by winning the wc3 championship 2005 and 2006. The Korean players Moon, Lyn, Soccer all members of WMF was also quite good. Lyn's earnings in WC3Moon's earnings in WC3Soccer's earnings in WC3Arguably one of the best undead players was/is WE.TeD. For people who havn't cheaked it out, go watch WCG 2009 WC3 Finals between Fly and Infi commentated by Rotterdam Haha, thank goodness someone posted some real WC3 pros. XD Was getting worried that no one knew anybody, and I was gonna be the lone WC3 watcher. Granted everyone argues whether Lyn, Moon, Grubby, Sky are the best player, but basically those four were the kings. Think the TBLS of WC3 I'm actually not even vaguely familiar with Sky. Is he the slightly worse one out of their TBLS? ^^ + Show Spoiler + Like Stork
it's probably because he's the only one who still plays wc3 and not sc2.
professional wc3 pretty much survives only in china now.
i played wc3 and on WCReplays from 2006-2009ish and i can tell you that naniwa and thorzain were not that well known (at least outside of europe). i remember thorzain starting to really shine once all the big name pros started retiring tho. he had an exciting human style and didn't rely as much on mass towering iirc.
moon was one of the revolutionary figures (aow creeping, dotts vs orcs) and was called the 5th race. grubby was around since the beginning of roc i believe. sky burst into the scene with a timing push(sky push) with towers, casters that was op for a while (bisu-esque i suppose?)
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I just have to say their latest patch gave Human towers "Fortified" armor again... basically means nothing can kill them... even a Blade Master can't chop through that *****. That being said, We put the BM through a dps generator in a short game, it did about 50% of the dps for the orc army. lol
WCR for communication.
most people still play the game for DotA. Hackers kinda wrecked the ladder  that and the terrible terrible bad manner.
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On July 09 2011 12:48 ToFu. wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2011 12:10 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 11:38 Torenhire wrote:On July 09 2011 11:18 DemiSe wrote:On July 09 2011 10:48 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 10:46 n.DieJokes wrote:
Can someone tell me about who the dominate players are and were and where some of the non grubby war3 players rising to prominence in sc2 came from? How good they were relatively and the korea/world balance Yes that is a nice question as well! I am interested. :D:D Also huge thanks to everyone who has answered questions so far. The Chinese player Li "Sky" XiaoFeng is/was one of the most successful wc3 player. He was elected in to the WCG Official Hall Of Fame by winning the wc3 championship 2005 and 2006. The Korean players Moon, Lyn, Soccer all members of WMF was also quite good. Lyn's earnings in WC3Moon's earnings in WC3Soccer's earnings in WC3Arguably one of the best undead players was/is WE.TeD. For people who havn't cheaked it out, go watch WCG 2009 WC3 Finals between Fly and Infi commentated by Rotterdam Haha, thank goodness someone posted some real WC3 pros. XD Was getting worried that no one knew anybody, and I was gonna be the lone WC3 watcher. Granted everyone argues whether Lyn, Moon, Grubby, Sky are the best player, but basically those four were the kings. Think the TBLS of WC3 I'm actually not even vaguely familiar with Sky. Is he the slightly worse one out of their TBLS? ^^ + Show Spoiler + Like Stork it's probably because he's the only one who still plays wc3 and not sc2. professional wc3 pretty much survives only in china now. i played wc3 and on WCReplays from 2006-2009ish and i can tell you that naniwa and thorzain were not that well known (at least outside of europe). i remember thorzain starting to really shine once all the big name pros started retiring tho. he had an exciting human style and didn't rely as much on mass towering iirc. moon was one of the revolutionary figures (aow creeping, dotts vs orcs) and was called the 5th race. grubby was around since the beginning of roc i believe. sky burst into the scene with a timing push(sky push) with towers, casters that was op for a while (bisu-esque i suppose?)
Yeah that had a lot to do with it I'm sure. :D Really I mostly just knew of Moon because he was on Wemade heh.
Thanks for telling me a bit about the players too! I of course knew Moon was really good but I didn't know he was super revolutionary.
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On July 09 2011 12:53 Bibbit wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2011 12:48 ToFu. wrote:On July 09 2011 12:10 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 11:38 Torenhire wrote:On July 09 2011 11:18 DemiSe wrote:On July 09 2011 10:48 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 10:46 n.DieJokes wrote:
Can someone tell me about who the dominate players are and were and where some of the non grubby war3 players rising to prominence in sc2 came from? How good they were relatively and the korea/world balance Yes that is a nice question as well! I am interested. :D:D Also huge thanks to everyone who has answered questions so far. The Chinese player Li "Sky" XiaoFeng is/was one of the most successful wc3 player. He was elected in to the WCG Official Hall Of Fame by winning the wc3 championship 2005 and 2006. The Korean players Moon, Lyn, Soccer all members of WMF was also quite good. Lyn's earnings in WC3Moon's earnings in WC3Soccer's earnings in WC3Arguably one of the best undead players was/is WE.TeD. For people who havn't cheaked it out, go watch WCG 2009 WC3 Finals between Fly and Infi commentated by Rotterdam Haha, thank goodness someone posted some real WC3 pros. XD Was getting worried that no one knew anybody, and I was gonna be the lone WC3 watcher. Granted everyone argues whether Lyn, Moon, Grubby, Sky are the best player, but basically those four were the kings. Think the TBLS of WC3 I'm actually not even vaguely familiar with Sky. Is he the slightly worse one out of their TBLS? ^^ + Show Spoiler + Like Stork it's probably because he's the only one who still plays wc3 and not sc2. professional wc3 pretty much survives only in china now. i played wc3 and on WCReplays from 2006-2009ish and i can tell you that naniwa and thorzain were not that well known (at least outside of europe). i remember thorzain starting to really shine once all the big name pros started retiring tho. he had an exciting human style and didn't rely as much on mass towering iirc. moon was one of the revolutionary figures (aow creeping, dotts vs orcs) and was called the 5th race. grubby was around since the beginning of roc i believe. sky burst into the scene with a timing push(sky push) with towers, casters that was op for a while (bisu-esque i suppose?) Yeah that had a lot to do with it I'm sure. :D Really I mostly just knew of Moon because he was on Wemade heh. Thanks for telling me a bit about the players too! I of course knew Moon was really good but I didn't know he was super revolutionary.
Cheak out this revolutionary micro-play by the fifth race himself. Moon Zeppelin Micro
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On July 09 2011 12:59 DemiSe wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2011 12:53 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 12:48 ToFu. wrote:On July 09 2011 12:10 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 11:38 Torenhire wrote:On July 09 2011 11:18 DemiSe wrote:On July 09 2011 10:48 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 10:46 n.DieJokes wrote:
Can someone tell me about who the dominate players are and were and where some of the non grubby war3 players rising to prominence in sc2 came from? How good they were relatively and the korea/world balance Yes that is a nice question as well! I am interested. :D:D Also huge thanks to everyone who has answered questions so far. The Chinese player Li "Sky" XiaoFeng is/was one of the most successful wc3 player. He was elected in to the WCG Official Hall Of Fame by winning the wc3 championship 2005 and 2006. The Korean players Moon, Lyn, Soccer all members of WMF was also quite good. Lyn's earnings in WC3Moon's earnings in WC3Soccer's earnings in WC3Arguably one of the best undead players was/is WE.TeD. For people who havn't cheaked it out, go watch WCG 2009 WC3 Finals between Fly and Infi commentated by Rotterdam Haha, thank goodness someone posted some real WC3 pros. XD Was getting worried that no one knew anybody, and I was gonna be the lone WC3 watcher. Granted everyone argues whether Lyn, Moon, Grubby, Sky are the best player, but basically those four were the kings. Think the TBLS of WC3 I'm actually not even vaguely familiar with Sky. Is he the slightly worse one out of their TBLS? ^^ + Show Spoiler + Like Stork it's probably because he's the only one who still plays wc3 and not sc2. professional wc3 pretty much survives only in china now. i played wc3 and on WCReplays from 2006-2009ish and i can tell you that naniwa and thorzain were not that well known (at least outside of europe). i remember thorzain starting to really shine once all the big name pros started retiring tho. he had an exciting human style and didn't rely as much on mass towering iirc. moon was one of the revolutionary figures (aow creeping, dotts vs orcs) and was called the 5th race. grubby was around since the beginning of roc i believe. sky burst into the scene with a timing push(sky push) with towers, casters that was op for a while (bisu-esque i suppose?) Yeah that had a lot to do with it I'm sure. :D Really I mostly just knew of Moon because he was on Wemade heh. Thanks for telling me a bit about the players too! I of course knew Moon was really good but I didn't know he was super revolutionary. Cheak out this revolutionary micro-play by the fifth race himself. Moon Zeppelin Micro
Ok Im sorry to be this derpy but I dont completely understand what is happening.
The zeppelin thing is like a Shuttle I guess? And he's microing the guys in and out to minimize damage? It also looked like maybe the shuttle was faster than some of his guys and he used the shuttle to move them forward faster but idk. >_>
Again, me super nooby,
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On July 09 2011 13:04 Bibbit wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2011 12:59 DemiSe wrote:On July 09 2011 12:53 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 12:48 ToFu. wrote:On July 09 2011 12:10 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 11:38 Torenhire wrote:On July 09 2011 11:18 DemiSe wrote:On July 09 2011 10:48 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 10:46 n.DieJokes wrote:
Can someone tell me about who the dominate players are and were and where some of the non grubby war3 players rising to prominence in sc2 came from? How good they were relatively and the korea/world balance Yes that is a nice question as well! I am interested. :D:D Also huge thanks to everyone who has answered questions so far. The Chinese player Li "Sky" XiaoFeng is/was one of the most successful wc3 player. He was elected in to the WCG Official Hall Of Fame by winning the wc3 championship 2005 and 2006. The Korean players Moon, Lyn, Soccer all members of WMF was also quite good. Lyn's earnings in WC3Moon's earnings in WC3Soccer's earnings in WC3Arguably one of the best undead players was/is WE.TeD. For people who havn't cheaked it out, go watch WCG 2009 WC3 Finals between Fly and Infi commentated by Rotterdam Haha, thank goodness someone posted some real WC3 pros. XD Was getting worried that no one knew anybody, and I was gonna be the lone WC3 watcher. Granted everyone argues whether Lyn, Moon, Grubby, Sky are the best player, but basically those four were the kings. Think the TBLS of WC3 I'm actually not even vaguely familiar with Sky. Is he the slightly worse one out of their TBLS? ^^ + Show Spoiler + Like Stork it's probably because he's the only one who still plays wc3 and not sc2. professional wc3 pretty much survives only in china now. i played wc3 and on WCReplays from 2006-2009ish and i can tell you that naniwa and thorzain were not that well known (at least outside of europe). i remember thorzain starting to really shine once all the big name pros started retiring tho. he had an exciting human style and didn't rely as much on mass towering iirc. moon was one of the revolutionary figures (aow creeping, dotts vs orcs) and was called the 5th race. grubby was around since the beginning of roc i believe. sky burst into the scene with a timing push(sky push) with towers, casters that was op for a while (bisu-esque i suppose?) Yeah that had a lot to do with it I'm sure. :D Really I mostly just knew of Moon because he was on Wemade heh. Thanks for telling me a bit about the players too! I of course knew Moon was really good but I didn't know he was super revolutionary. Cheak out this revolutionary micro-play by the fifth race himself. Moon Zeppelin Micro Ok Im sorry to be this derpy but I dont completely understand what is happening. The zeppelin thing is like a Shuttle I guess? And he's microing the guys in and out to minimize damage? It also looked like maybe the shuttle was faster than some of his guys and he used the shuttle to move them forward faster but idk. >_> Again, me super nooby,
It's basically very, very brilliant pick-and-drop micro to not only keep his own units alive but also to block the path of his opponent's units to keep them from escaping. Maximizing damage output while minimizing the damage he receives, essentially.
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On July 09 2011 10:02 Bibbit wrote:Okay hi. I know a lot of TL'ers nowadays come from a War 3 background. I, however, am rooted in sc1. Not super deeply rooted, only started watching in late 2008 and was D+ max on a good day, but that's what I come from. Anyways, more to the point. I played a tiny tiny bit of War 3 about a year ago. Nothing serious, just some games with a real life friend. I find the game kinda cool and for some reason just became interested in it. So I have some questions. ^_^ 1) This one I'm afraid to ask: Is it generally considered well-balanced? Or is there a race that a ton of people play or nobody really plays? 2) Is there some sort of community for the game? Of course not expecting anything on the level of the wonderful site that is TL but is there anything? 3) Do people still play this game? I don't necessarily mean a pro-scene as I'm not aspiring to be high level. Just wondering if I were to go on a War 3 server, if anyone would be there. >_> 4) How would I go about learning how the game works? For the time being I'm naturally not concerned about complex strategies or anything. I just genuinely dont know a thing about the game and have no clue what a "typical" game looks like. Thank you very much for any help I can get. Forgive me if this was just a huge search function fail from me. :D:D:D
i was quite involved into the wc3 community for awhile, i played and watched a ton of games for a good year or so.
anyways
1) balance. well it always switches around. for like 4 years orc was seen as shit. then suddenly they abused blademaster and it's all good. NE is always good. undead seems to have gotten the shaft lately. humans were super strong for a period of time. things change and i'd consider the game pretty balanced. you don't worry about balance cuz at a low level better player wins no ifs ands or buts.
2) community is decent. it's died since sc2 for sure. people like nanina cruncher came from a wc3 background if you didn't know. wc3replays is okay.
3) as i said people quit it for sc2, doesnt' mean noone plays. i'm sure a ton of chinese still play on garena.
4) wc3 is all about execution. no build orders or anything like that, executing your build microing your guys and picking fights. macro is a non-factor. you don't worry about when you take ur 3rd, you worry about what units to make when to fight and precise timings. typical game is 1 base vs 1 base and fast paced micro. whoever slips first loses a lot. if they don't slip up battle is decided in a big micro battle. who gets more creeps, who's got better items, more hero levels, if you get that invul pot used in time or if you get 1 more shockwave. it's very micro intensive with minute details. it's pretty much brood war without expansions and everything is magnified. if you lose a zergling(ghoul) to a marine(footman) it's much worse in wc3.
tl;dr the game is based on quick decision making and micro. timing execution, not macro/defense etc. there are no all ins except for like tower rushes. it's very strict and i can't stress how much execution is involved. there isn't any economy or macro and defense isn't really a known term.
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Undeads been considered pretty weak for a while now.
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On July 09 2011 13:21 babylon wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2011 13:04 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 12:59 DemiSe wrote:On July 09 2011 12:53 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 12:48 ToFu. wrote:On July 09 2011 12:10 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 11:38 Torenhire wrote:On July 09 2011 11:18 DemiSe wrote:On July 09 2011 10:48 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 10:46 n.DieJokes wrote:
Can someone tell me about who the dominate players are and were and where some of the non grubby war3 players rising to prominence in sc2 came from? How good they were relatively and the korea/world balance Yes that is a nice question as well! I am interested. :D:D Also huge thanks to everyone who has answered questions so far. The Chinese player Li "Sky" XiaoFeng is/was one of the most successful wc3 player. He was elected in to the WCG Official Hall Of Fame by winning the wc3 championship 2005 and 2006. The Korean players Moon, Lyn, Soccer all members of WMF was also quite good. Lyn's earnings in WC3Moon's earnings in WC3Soccer's earnings in WC3Arguably one of the best undead players was/is WE.TeD. For people who havn't cheaked it out, go watch WCG 2009 WC3 Finals between Fly and Infi commentated by Rotterdam Haha, thank goodness someone posted some real WC3 pros. XD Was getting worried that no one knew anybody, and I was gonna be the lone WC3 watcher. Granted everyone argues whether Lyn, Moon, Grubby, Sky are the best player, but basically those four were the kings. Think the TBLS of WC3 I'm actually not even vaguely familiar with Sky. Is he the slightly worse one out of their TBLS? ^^ + Show Spoiler + Like Stork it's probably because he's the only one who still plays wc3 and not sc2. professional wc3 pretty much survives only in china now. i played wc3 and on WCReplays from 2006-2009ish and i can tell you that naniwa and thorzain were not that well known (at least outside of europe). i remember thorzain starting to really shine once all the big name pros started retiring tho. he had an exciting human style and didn't rely as much on mass towering iirc. moon was one of the revolutionary figures (aow creeping, dotts vs orcs) and was called the 5th race. grubby was around since the beginning of roc i believe. sky burst into the scene with a timing push(sky push) with towers, casters that was op for a while (bisu-esque i suppose?) Yeah that had a lot to do with it I'm sure. :D Really I mostly just knew of Moon because he was on Wemade heh. Thanks for telling me a bit about the players too! I of course knew Moon was really good but I didn't know he was super revolutionary. Cheak out this revolutionary micro-play by the fifth race himself. Moon Zeppelin Micro Ok Im sorry to be this derpy but I dont completely understand what is happening. The zeppelin thing is like a Shuttle I guess? And he's microing the guys in and out to minimize damage? It also looked like maybe the shuttle was faster than some of his guys and he used the shuttle to move them forward faster but idk. >_> Again, me super nooby, It's basically very, very brilliant pick-and-drop micro to not only keep his own units alive but also to block the path of his opponent's units to keep them from escaping. Maximizing damage output while minimizing the damage he receives, essentially.
Oh okay I didnt catch the blocking of the escape route. I'll have to look again.
And thanks to everyone who's been helping. I'm getting an idea whats up now. <3
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Wrote that in the Warcraft 3 scene thread 1 1/2 days ago:
On July 08 2011 01:27 Lucumo wrote:Hm, SoJu is still playing regularly, even streaming. You can watch him if you want: http://justin.tv/ddim3822Soccer is still playing as well, and a lot of Chinese players of course. (At ~1am KST he had around 800 viewers on afreeca and I was told that at peak times he gets ~1500. So I guess there are still some people interested.)
On July 09 2011 11:38 Torenhire wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2011 11:18 DemiSe wrote:On July 09 2011 10:48 Bibbit wrote:On July 09 2011 10:46 n.DieJokes wrote:
Can someone tell me about who the dominate players are and were and where some of the non grubby war3 players rising to prominence in sc2 came from? How good they were relatively and the korea/world balance Yes that is a nice question as well! I am interested. :D:D Also huge thanks to everyone who has answered questions so far. The Chinese player Li "Sky" XiaoFeng is/was one of the most successful wc3 player. He was elected in to the WCG Official Hall Of Fame by winning the wc3 championship 2005 and 2006. The Korean players Moon, Lyn, Soccer all members of WMF was also quite good. Lyn's earnings in WC3Moon's earnings in WC3Soccer's earnings in WC3Arguably one of the best undead players was/is WE.TeD. For people who havn't cheaked it out, go watch WCG 2009 WC3 Finals between Fly and Infi commentated by Rotterdam Was getting worried that no one knew anybody, and I was gonna be the lone WC3 watcher. Granted everyone argues whether Lyn, Moon, Grubby, Sky are the best player, but basically those four were the kings. Think the TBLS of WC3
Moon was the best player, imo Still remember how he 3-0'ed Grubby in the battle of gods or whatever they called it. And he wasn't called the fifth race for nothing
TaKe needs to answer in this thread considering he switched to SC2 and is fairly active here. He used to be a player/commentator.
Balance also depends on the map. Health fountain favors Orc because they have units with a lot of hitpoints and mana fountain favours Undead. Unlike in Broodwar, they don't really include new maps in their games, so it always stays the same.
Ah, and Humans have ways to lame it out. Build 384434 towers or send siege tanks into your opponents base.
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On July 09 2011 13:22 shawster wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2011 10:02 Bibbit wrote:Okay hi. I know a lot of TL'ers nowadays come from a War 3 background. I, however, am rooted in sc1. Not super deeply rooted, only started watching in late 2008 and was D+ max on a good day, but that's what I come from. Anyways, more to the point. I played a tiny tiny bit of War 3 about a year ago. Nothing serious, just some games with a real life friend. I find the game kinda cool and for some reason just became interested in it. So I have some questions. ^_^ 1) This one I'm afraid to ask: Is it generally considered well-balanced? Or is there a race that a ton of people play or nobody really plays? 2) Is there some sort of community for the game? Of course not expecting anything on the level of the wonderful site that is TL but is there anything? 3) Do people still play this game? I don't necessarily mean a pro-scene as I'm not aspiring to be high level. Just wondering if I were to go on a War 3 server, if anyone would be there. >_> 4) How would I go about learning how the game works? For the time being I'm naturally not concerned about complex strategies or anything. I just genuinely dont know a thing about the game and have no clue what a "typical" game looks like. Thank you very much for any help I can get. Forgive me if this was just a huge search function fail from me. :D:D:D i was quite involved into the wc3 community for awhile, i played and watched a ton of games for a good year or so. anyways 1) balance. well it always switches around. for like 4 years orc was seen as shit. then suddenly they abused blademaster and it's all good. NE is always good. undead seems to have gotten the shaft lately. humans were super strong for a period of time. things change and i'd consider the game pretty balanced. you don't worry about balance cuz at a low level better player wins no ifs ands or buts. 2) community is decent. it's died since sc2 for sure. people like nanina cruncher came from a wc3 background if you didn't know. wc3replays is okay. 3) as i said people quit it for sc2, doesnt' mean noone plays. i'm sure a ton of chinese still play on garena. 4) wc3 is all about execution. no build orders or anything like that, executing your build microing your guys and picking fights. macro is a non-factor. you don't worry about when you take ur 3rd, you worry about what units to make when to fight and precise timings. typical game is 1 base vs 1 base and fast paced micro. whoever slips first loses a lot. if they don't slip up battle is decided in a big micro battle. who gets more creeps, who's got better items, more hero levels, if you get that invul pot used in time or if you get 1 more shockwave. it's very micro intensive with minute details. it's pretty much brood war without expansions and everything is magnified. if you lose a zergling(ghoul) to a marine(footman) it's much worse in wc3. tl;dr the game is based on quick decision making and micro. timing execution, not macro/defense etc. there are no all ins except for like tower rushes. it's very strict and i can't stress how much execution is involved. there isn't any economy or macro and defense isn't really a known term.
Good post. But I don't agree with macro and economy.
#1. Economy takes the form of upkeep. There is a trade-off and it is actually very important.
#2. While WC is not a "macro game", macro is definitely not a non-factor. Even though there are usually just 2-3 buildings you build out of, the timing of each unit is different, meaning you can't just pump marines out of 5 rax every half a minute. And when you are fighting or creeping it's actually quite easy to slip on macro.
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Moon was extraordinary to watch. Too bad he didn't win any WCG (Is that correct? I think when I quit wc3, one of his short coming is not winning the WCG).
War3 is definitely a Micro and unit combo game with scrolls and items to make this killer combo. Kinda RPG in a sense but when you put enough games in you know the most effective combination to use to counter another's players combo.
There were never a well organised community like the TL, but for some reason this game got big in China and for a time is where the money and tournaments are.
Personally I find it very stressful to play and require a lot of APM to keep up with every thing else but I do suggest everyone to play it if only for a little while, I've find that it helps your micro in Starcraft a lot, teaches you a lot about positioning, surrounds and executing your build.
The game was unattractive to me as it all boils down to an endgame with two armies. It wasn't really strategy.
4Kings which is the team that Grubby was in got really really famous during this time but 4Kings was a pretty old gaming Clan if anyone can remember the earlier CS / Quake days.
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EPT
